Speeding Ticket Help / Story UPDATE

Basically, back in February I wrote a story asking for help etc on a speeding ticket I got for doing 70kmph in a 50kmph zone. The ticket was reduced from $295.00 to $95.00 at the discretion of the police officer, but the demerit points were not going to be reduced, and thus stayed at 3. The original story is here: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=112015

OK so basically, I decided to try to negotitate a plea deal, in which I would try to get the demerit points reduced, which includes writing out a form and sending it to the prosecutor. I assumed that I would go in and talk to him/her and explain myself, and then they would mail me what they thought etc. Instead, all they do is look over your case and then offer you a plea deal. So I get the mail today, and it it says:

Speed Charged: 70 km/h
Posted Speed: 50 km/h
Speed Recorded: 90 km/h

Then it says:

The Prosecutor Intends To Proceed:
At the speed indicated on the ticket.
Will seek to amend the ticket to the original speed of 90/50 km/h at trial.

Now all of a fucking sudden it says that it recorded me at 90 km/h, which is total bullshit because there is no way I was going that fast. I don't even speed in 80 km/h zones because 80 is pretty fast overall and I don't like going faster than that, which is why I usually avoid the high way. So my problem is that if the officer comes to trial saying he clocked me at 90 km/h, and the prosecutor tries to amend this original decision, my demerit points and fine will go up, past the original 3 demerit points and every thing!

I have no idea what to do, because you can't just go in and say, "Officer is lying." That would never fly in court, and that's hardly compelling evidence. Any advice or anything on what to do? I was angry earlier and called up the Prosecutor to ask him WTF (nicely OFC), but he's out of town until the 18th, so I have until then to find out WTF is going on here.

Help?

FURTHERMORE:

The fines for speeding are as follows :
1-19 - $3/km - So if you were going 10 over, it's $30.00 ticket.
20-29 - $4.50/km - So if you were going 22, it's $99.00 ticket.
30-49 - $7/km - So if you were going 40, it's $280.00 ticket.

I remember the officer telling me that he was reducing it from 275 - 290 (I don't remember the exact amount) down to $95.00. So a few things could have happened here:

The Officer wasn't very clear when he pulled me over, and was pulling me over for 90 km/h in a 50 km/h, but reduced the ticket to a 70 km/h, which in turn reduced the fine from $280.00 to $95.00, and from 4 demerit points to 3 demerit points. When I was pulled over, he never told me how fast I was going, he just came back with the ticket and said he reduced the ticket from $280.00 to $95.00. I looked at the ticket to see that it said I was going 70 km/h.
The Officer or Prosecutor fucked something up.

Now because I vividly remember him saying he was reducing it from the high 200's to $95.00, that would have to mean that he pulled me over originally for doing more than 30 km/h over the limit, that's the only way the fine numbers make sense, however I really, really, really don't think that it was possible that I was going that fast. That is insanely fast, and like I said, I don't even go 90 km/h in a 80 km/h zone, I go 80 km/h in those areas because that's fast enough. So I have no fucking idea how I would fight this.

Last edit: 2010-06-16 10:31:57

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kiykiy June 16 2010 10:52. Posts 229

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Check to see if your ticket has a "R" on it. If it does, they you are screwed because the police probably booked you at 90 and reduced it to 70. If you take it to court, then they have the right to raise it back to 90. If it doesn't, I can't help you.

What you should have done, is not mail it in and go talk to a justice in person at the office that has jurisdiction(usually only during specific times in the morning). If it is your first offense(and you beg =]) They may drop it so you don't even get dermit points(can never fully get rid of it).
What you "think" happened doesn't matter. If it is your word vs the officer's. You NEVER win. Ever.

For court procedures. Hire a lawyer or go research on REAL Canadian traffic ticket fighting forums.

My story: my first ticket, I was on holiday with a couple of friends and I really had to go the washroom and was speeding 53 over on the highway. The police officer (after some begging) reduced it to 30 over. I then went to talk to a justice and they dropped it to 10 over, no points lost. I dont know any of the theoretical law stuff or correct court procedures, but this is what I did and the result I got so take it with a grain of salt. Good luck.

Edit:I have read of cases where people get it reduced to zero but... I wouldn't be that optimistic. Also, if your letter came something like 11 months after the ticket. The court will "likely" just throw the case because it has been so long. So my suggestion would actually be research, THEN talk to a justice.

Last edit: 2010-06-16 10:56:18

lalala

Salv Canada. June 16 2010 11:01. Posts 2958

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@KiyKiy, there is no R on the letter. I did talk to the justice, and she is the one who told me to mail the prosecutor, she said she had no authority to do any thing, even though all research I did said that she definitely could.

Furthermore, the officer when he came up to me, never told me what speed I was clocked at. Also, the only speed given was what was written on the ticket, which was 70 km/h. All he told me was that he reduced the ticket's fined from near $300.00 to $95.00. He never said he reduced the speed, he never said he reduced the demerit points. So then when I file the papers to talk to the prosecutor, then they come at me with, "Not only will we not give you a plea deal, BUT we are going to increase your ticket speed to the original speed of 90 km/h!" There has to be something wrong with that, I cannot believe the Canadian system is so fucked up that they can withhold information like that, then just pull it out and say, "Well now you're really fucked!"

I think I have to been told this, or it must've been written on the ticket or paperwork or something. It's bullshit that they can withhold the actual speed, and then the Prosecutor can amend it months, months after the actual event.

http://www.twitch.tv/Lucas_Salv_Salvatore / https://twitter.com/SWBKSalv

kiykiy June 16 2010 11:12. Posts 229

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The R is supposed to be on the ticket. I also think you are supposed to talk to the justice before you file the papers for court. If you did it the other-way around, I think that is what she meant by no longer able to do anything.

When I did it. They offered a deal ON THE SPOT and I paid it right there and then.

edit: paid outside the justice's office of course.

Last edit: 2010-06-16 11:12:32

lalala

lazz Australia. June 16 2010 11:13. Posts 3109

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when i read title i saw "speedling ticket"

kind of disappointed ;(

top 5 diamond = D/D+ on iccup

Salv Canada. June 16 2010 11:17. Posts 2958

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On June 16 2010 11:12 kiykiy wrote:
The R is supposed to be on the ticket. I also think you are supposed to talk to the justice before you file the papers for court. If you did it the other-way around, I think that is what she meant by no longer able to do anything.

When I did it. They offered a deal ON THE SPOT and I paid it right there and then.

edit: paid outside the justice's office of course.

There isn't an 'R', if that is required to be there, I may have a point to make to the case. I did talk to her first, I went in to talk to her and asked if she reduced it, she said no, I cannot do anything, only the prosecutor can, and then she helped me find and fill out the plea deal form.

http://www.twitch.tv/Lucas_Salv_Salvatore / https://twitter.com/SWBKSalv

kiykiy June 16 2010 11:45. Posts 229

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I guess the only thing now is to request disclosure and see if the officer wrote down 90km/h. If he did, I have no idea what to do other than to fight it in court. If you don't have a G and you get 4 points, it wouldn't be pretty because you only have 6.

I am sorry that I do not have any more advice. Here is the site I used and bookmarked. http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/

but mostly, this page http://www.ontariohighwaytrafficact.com/courts-and-procedure-f56.html

lalala

eLiE Canada. June 16 2010 14:35. Posts 1039

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Well, if that's what's on your ticket, then there's not much you can do. If 70 is on the ticket, then just show it to them. Idk, maybe you can go for a mischarge for putting down the wrong stuff and have everything dropped. I don't know that they can amend what they charged you with.

Don't give up though. I have an anecdote that my dad is so proud of, where he beat the system. He was speeding on his motorcycle, and was charged with reckless driving, so he went to court to fight it. He argued that he races dirtbikes and was in total control of the bike and was only speeding, and the court was forced to drop the charges and he got away scot free. He never lets that go. I guess the moral of the story is look for technicalities Good luck.

How's the weather down there?

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