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QuietIdiot   November 27 2008 09:43. Posts 6999 | Profile Blog |
![[image loading]](http://img399.imageshack.us/img399/9061/10962403xs6.jpg)
![[image loading]](/userpoll/draw.php?poll_id=4685) Poll: What does it favor the most? (Vote): Protoss (Vote): Terran (Vote): Zerg (Vote): T > Z > P > T (Vote): None (Vote): P > Z > T > P
Melee DL
Observer DL
Obviously RoV inspired with a twist of tau cross and some of my sadistic attempts to make most of the bases vulnerable to attack. Kudos to Jmave for sparking some creativity.
Map Features: -Nat gas is 3000. -Mineral blockades are a mere 16 minerals, same as RoV iirc. -Wide "Fly-zones" for the main to make harassment with mutas+loading units more effective. -Islands are tankable for the bottom mineral portion although will leave the cc/hatch/nexus unscathed. -Minerals are placed to allow scarabs to "sink" into the workers and none of the Much bullshit, as well as prevent strong manner pylons. They are subject to change, but they seemed to hit the sweet spots vs comp workers. -All the bases except the 3rd gas next to the main is susceptible to storm/lurker/vult raids the level below the mineral field, making it more stressful for both sides and to prevent a formulaic macro game.
+ Show Spoiler [racial theory] + Terran Perspective:Walling: ![[image loading]](http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/6595/scscrnshot112608172759ir7.jpg) -I tried to make it less awkward, but the ice tile does not allow any other formation where its just 1 supply + rax, which I find the best on 1v1 maps in tvp. It does stop the zeals, but in the event of a proxy where each second matters, a rine has to run up through from the rax below and a zeal can easily just camp outside its spawn point and trap it. Perhaps not walling at all would be the best option. -On the subject of TvP, terran can easy fe into the nat below due to its tight nature, however, he has to decide between getting the safer mineral only below or the 3rd gas on the other side. Going for the vertical progression would make for a very passive game, but taking the dangerous 3rd gas early on makes for some aggressive scenarios, and perhaps even a slow progression through the center would perhaps make a timing push even stronger with 3 gas pumping and the center in control. Up to the terran's style to manuever. TvZ would be pretty standard although there is the danger of mutas being a total bitch to handle in the nat. However once that's been taken care of, hunting the 3rd gas down would provide some intensive micro moments depending on the location of the hatch. There is an abusable spot for the lower expoes, making for some proficient scatters and a zerg taking the closest 3rd gas would be near suicidal anyways. -Mech may be possible ala Flash's Katrina build, fe-->nat-->another fast cc for the 3rd gas-->camp with lith/tank to 1-1/2-2. So I'm hoping it would make for some unique games there. Zerg PerspectiveI personally think ZvP would be pretty fun on this map, although there may be some problems early game with +1 zeal rushes, due to the distance between the nat and other bases. However once they've been stabilized, they can make for some brutal July vs Rock scenarios. However if they lose that momentum, many zergs tend to use sunk/spore/lurker and play defensively, harassing with lings until they attain hive tech. Camping would be difficult on this map, so mild-severe macro deficits may be difficult for zergs to recover from. -in ZvT, mech may be a hassle, a careless zerg could end up with a factory landing in his main or even a proxy fact + m+m push into the main. -Probably the favorite 3rd gas expo spot would be the lower left/right corners because they are tight enough for two lurkers to hold. A zerg could probably deviate for a fourth by taking the closer gas up on the higher cliff closer to the nat once that gets rolling, it may seem too difficult to hold for a 3rd early on because they are so close to the edge and can get raped easily by a tank/m+m push. -The closed spots around the nat are a big concern for me, I'm afraid the zerg might get clumped up in the event a forgg-esque timing attack, however he may be able to circle around that main army coming towards him and hit him from his own nat or the long way behind. protoss perspectivePvZ: standard shit, although I think Sair/reaver would be weak,distance between the island is too far to camp and wide. Although the long distances may make aggressive play difficult, 3rd gas will almost always be the cliffed closer one. Pvt:Formulaic and easy, shouldn't be a problem, unless toss is passive and lets the terran take up those center expoes. mmmmm pylon walls here and there, shit's fine. Don't think I need to discuss mirrors Concerns: -Kind of fugly. -Some parts may be far too tight, considering opening up nat but not sure how. -Island may be too hard to take for any side, good or bad, not sure.
Everything is subject to change, but I'm out for some player input before putting it on, as well as some exposure for some games on it. I'd love to see some games, and if you hate it, tell me why, Thanks.
Last edit: 2008-11-27 09:48:03
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Not_Computer   Canada. November 27 2008 09:52. Posts 1462 | Profile Blog |
And haha, there's a sudden flux of maps now.
Okay, let's see... first off, it looks a lot better than mine !! (obviously) Good standard play concept, I like it and it seems very RoV-styled, which I like too. Heavy macro-oriented game with plenty of resources around the map and lots of space for epic battles. Good attention to detail such as cliffable, but not too easily cliffable, expansions. Many routes to take, varying distances, so flanking is quite possible.
Seems pretty balanced to me. How did the testing go?
And lol at the Much-scarab-friendly minerals. |
| | I like pants more than shirts. - sAviOr |
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CDRdude   United States. November 27 2008 09:53. Posts 4347 | Profile Blog |
It looks like a cool map. I think it would look better with more snow, and less dirt. Maybe I'm just being a pessimistic zerg, but I think Z would have a hard time with vT and vP. vT because the push distance looks really short, and it would be hard to get sunks up in time. Also, the natural mineral line looks kind of vulnerable to seige. In theory, that would be balanced out by the terrans nat minerals being vulnerable to lurkers, but I'm not positive it'll work out like that. Terran is really very defensive, and I think the only opening to try to attack the natural would be when Z has already won, or during a great muta harass. It's kind of disappointing how the gas base near the mains looks pretty much unusable; too easily scouted, and a real bitch to defend. Very good map, and I'd like to play a game or two on it sometime.
edit: more thoughts I'm still pretty worried about the really close push distance. It seems like it would strongly favor terran. Against protoss, a slow push with turrets could cross from T's nat to P's nat in minutes. ZvT, I think defending your natural against a terran push would be slightly comparable to doing so in Tiamat. The push would arrive really, really fast, with hardly any time to delay it. The minerals being exposed seems like it wouldn't help much of anything either, but I guess that goes both ways. I can see terran needing 2 bunkers to defend a FE. ZvP, I'm worried that the 3rd gas will be quite hard to defend, and it'll wind up similar to Byzantium 2.
In spite of my rantings about balance, this is a really cool map. I'm impressed. 5/5Last edit: 2008-11-27 10:04:03 |
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Chef   Canada. November 27 2008 09:56. Posts 4712 | Profile Blog |
It favours MY DICK.
It's not really possible to determine balance without extensive play and ladder seasons IMO. All pro-maps go thru phases where in the beginning people think they're imba one way, and then at the end, views are completely changed. It's just silly to judge a map's balance based on a jpeg, especially if they're nothing super out of the ordinary lame about it.Last edit: 2008-11-27 09:56:35 |
| | Even though you go to the other world, please don't blame me... (don't) |
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Lucktar   United States. November 27 2008 10:01. Posts 291 | Profile |
| The wall-in you show is zergling-tight, so it wouldn't be usable in TvP. |
| | Loyal Fan of Starcraft to you! |
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QuietIdiot   November 27 2008 10:02. Posts 6999 | Profile Blog |
On November 27 2008 09:52 Not_Computer wrote: And haha, there's a sudden flux of maps now.
Okay, let's see... first off, it looks a lot better than mine !! (obviously) Good standard play concept, I like it and it seems very RoV-styled, which I like too. Heavy macro-oriented game with plenty of resources around the map and lots of space for epic battles. Good attention to detail such as cliffable, but not too easily cliffable, expansions. Many routes to take, varying distances, so flanking is quite possible.
Seems pretty balanced to me. How did the testing go?
And lol at the Much-scarab-friendly minerals.
Thanks. Haven't had player to player testing yet, purely comp smashing and theory.
On November 27 2008 09:53 CDRdude wrote: It looks like a cool map. I think it would look better with more snow, and less dirt. Maybe I'm just being a pessimistic zerg, but I think Z would have a hard time with vT and vP. vT because the push distance looks really short, and it would be hard to get sunks up in time. Also, the natural mineral line looks kind of vulnerable to seige. In theory, that would be balanced out by the terrans nat minerals being vulnerable to lurkers, but I'm not positive it'll work out like that. Terran is really very defensive, and I think the only opening to try to attack the natural would be when Z has already won, or during a great muta harass. It's kind of disappointing how the gas base near the mains looks pretty much unusable; too easily scouted, and a real bitch to defend. Very good map, and I'd like to play a game or two on it sometime.
Yes that was a concern when I was making this map, zerg has to be VERY aggressive and that could pay off cause of open-ness of the bases, and I really love aggressive zerg styles. Thing about snow tileset is that it blinds the eyes. I try to use it minimally, no matter how tempting it looks aesthetically.
On November 27 2008 09:56 Chef wrote: It favours MY DICK.
It's not really possible to determine balance without extensive play and ladder seasons IMO. All pro-maps go thru phases where in the beginning people think they're imba one way, and then at the end, views are completely changed. It's just silly to judge a map's balance based on a jpeg, especially if they're nothing super out of the ordinary lame about it.
Good point but players tend to have some decent grasp of experience and play styles on varied maps and its always interesting to see the responses. Hoping to draw some games for it. Maybe a better question to be asked was whether it would be inventive and fun.
I wish foreign mapmakers could get some more exposure in general, but I don't see it happening anyways :| So I'm just hoping for a handful of reps to see here..Last edit: 2008-11-27 10:05:31 |
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CDRdude   United States. November 27 2008 10:05. Posts 4347 | Profile Blog |
On November 27 2008 09:56 Chef wrote: It favours MY DICK.
What race does your dick play? |
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Not_Computer   Canada. November 27 2008 10:16. Posts 1462 | Profile Blog |
On November 27 2008 10:05 CDRdude wrote:What race does your dick play?
I bet it's random 
special edit: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/4793/fucknewideaspy8.jpg) ![[image loading]](/userpoll/draw.php?poll_id=4686) Poll: What race is favoured most?( Vote): Terran Siege Dat ( Vote): Protoss 1a2a3a ( Vote): Zerg 4 Pool ( Vote): Wait... what size map is that? o_O ( Vote): It favours my DICK Last edit: 2008-11-27 10:38:19 |
| | I like pants more than shirts. - sAviOr |
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Archaic   Taiwan. November 27 2008 10:39. Posts 3028 | Profile Blog |
| This seems to have a strange resemblance to Blitz X... Probably terran favored imo, or at least anti zerg. |
| | It isn't a good post until it has been quoted. |
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Dazed_Spy   Canada. November 27 2008 11:30. Posts 1443 | Profile Blog |
| I don't like the tileset to be honest, but its a really good map. If it was put on ICCUP I would definitely play it. It might be slightly imbalanced here and there, but all maps are. |
| | Savior shall destroy us all in 2009|| Idra fighting! #1 backho hater |
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SpiritoftheTunA   United States. November 27 2008 11:59. Posts 4736 | Profile Blog |
| it reminds me pretty strongly of rov, but inverted Last edit: 2008-11-27 11:59:55 |
| | I REALLY LOVE COCK OH YES I DO YES SIR COCK COCK COCK COCK COCK ALL ABOUT THE COCK |
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