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On September 10 2017 20:05 Jae Zedong wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2017 19:30 Raelcun wrote:Too High:Bisu [#3] as much as it hurts to say it, I want him to be number three, but he just hasn't put the performance out there at all. He shows flashes of brilliance but nothing worthy of putting him at number 3 Last [#2] This is a holdover from when Brood War was still starting to return and Flash had come back and started showing Terrans how to play again. He hasn't put forth an impressive finish in quite a long time but everyone still insists he's solidly #2 behind Flash. So this means you think Soulkey is the second best BW player alive? It's so so easy to cherry pick individual players you think "deserve" to be higher without taking into consideration how the list would turn out if you actually implemented your changes. Sometimes a player gets a "high" ranking not because he is dominating, but because no one else besides Flash is dominating either. I commend you for at least naming a few players you think deserve to be lower, but putting Last and Bisu behind Soulkey is bizarre.
You're thinking about this wrong. I didn't list Soulkey as being too low because I think putting him at 4 is fair. I just don't think Bisu and Last are the #2 and #3 players right now. If anything, I'd probably push soulkey down to 5 or 6 but I'm not going to mention that for pushing him down 2 places and you could make an argument for him being as high as 4.
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I don't even want to argue with the ranking of Stork but with the content of his description. He mentioned chilling out and trying to be more entertaining in January or so. Since then, especially in the past month, he's been the last man streaming numerous times. Just yesterday I watched him play with Firebathero around 21-22 CEST. That's like 3-4 am in Korea.
He's still not back at where I think he should be (and whatever, who am I) so he'll be something of a black horse tomorrow, I think but writing what has been written here doesn't do justice to current Stork, I think.
Disclaimer: Fanboy, I am, of course, still hoping to keep it objective.
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On September 10 2017 20:07 Aylear wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2017 20:05 Jae Zedong wrote:On September 10 2017 19:30 Raelcun wrote:Too High:Bisu [#3] as much as it hurts to say it, I want him to be number three, but he just hasn't put the performance out there at all. He shows flashes of brilliance but nothing worthy of putting him at number 3 Last [#2] This is a holdover from when Brood War was still starting to return and Flash had come back and started showing Terrans how to play again. He hasn't put forth an impressive finish in quite a long time but everyone still insists he's solidly #2 behind Flash. So this means you think Soulkey is the second best BW player alive? It's so so easy to cherry pick individual players you think "deserve" to be higher without taking into consideration how the list would turn out if you actually implemented your changes. Sometimes a player gets a "high" ranking not because he is dominating, but because no one else besides Flash is dominating either. I commend you for at least naming a few players you think deserve to be lower, but putting Last and Bisu behind Soulkey is bizarre. Jesus Christ stop taking it so seriously. Power Ranks are for fun, arguing about Power Ranks is for fun. You're an old man yelling at everyone to stop having fun.
What's your fucking problem? I am discussing the power ranks, I'm not telling anyone to stop having fun.
I was having fun until you decided to call me a "jerk" on the previous page. I didn't reply because I didn't want to stoop that low, but here you are again derailing the discussion.
I am of the opinion that the power rank is generally correct. I have every right to question criticism of it.
On September 10 2017 20:09 Raelcun wrote: You're thinking about this wrong. I didn't list Soulkey as being too low because I think putting him at 4 is fair. I just don't think Bisu and Last are the #2 and #3 players right now. If anything, I'd probably push soulkey down to 5 or 6 but I'm not going to mention that for pushing him down 2 places and you could make an argument for him being as high as 4.
Alright, fair enough.
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Japan11285 Posts
On September 10 2017 20:07 Aylear wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2017 20:05 Jae Zedong wrote:On September 10 2017 19:30 Raelcun wrote:Too High:Bisu [#3] as much as it hurts to say it, I want him to be number three, but he just hasn't put the performance out there at all. He shows flashes of brilliance but nothing worthy of putting him at number 3 Last [#2] This is a holdover from when Brood War was still starting to return and Flash had come back and started showing Terrans how to play again. He hasn't put forth an impressive finish in quite a long time but everyone still insists he's solidly #2 behind Flash. So this means you think Soulkey is the second best BW player alive? It's so so easy to cherry pick individual players you think "deserve" to be higher without taking into consideration how the list would turn out if you actually implemented your changes. Sometimes a player gets a "high" ranking not because he is dominating, but because no one else besides Flash is dominating either. I commend you for at least naming a few players you think deserve to be lower, but putting Last and Bisu behind Soulkey is bizarre. Jesus Christ stop taking it so seriously. Power Ranks are for fun, arguing about Power Ranks is for fun. You're an old man yelling at everyone to stop having fun. Idk man, it feels like you need to stop taking him seriously and eh, do this thing called "arguing about Power Ranks" ^_^
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On September 10 2017 20:34 Jae Zedong wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2017 20:07 Aylear wrote:On September 10 2017 20:05 Jae Zedong wrote:On September 10 2017 19:30 Raelcun wrote:Too High:Bisu [#3] as much as it hurts to say it, I want him to be number three, but he just hasn't put the performance out there at all. He shows flashes of brilliance but nothing worthy of putting him at number 3 Last [#2] This is a holdover from when Brood War was still starting to return and Flash had come back and started showing Terrans how to play again. He hasn't put forth an impressive finish in quite a long time but everyone still insists he's solidly #2 behind Flash. So this means you think Soulkey is the second best BW player alive? It's so so easy to cherry pick individual players you think "deserve" to be higher without taking into consideration how the list would turn out if you actually implemented your changes. Sometimes a player gets a "high" ranking not because he is dominating, but because no one else besides Flash is dominating either. I commend you for at least naming a few players you think deserve to be lower, but putting Last and Bisu behind Soulkey is bizarre. Jesus Christ stop taking it so seriously. Power Ranks are for fun, arguing about Power Ranks is for fun. You're an old man yelling at everyone to stop having fun. What's your fucking problem?
On September 10 2017 15:51 Jae Zedong wrote: Anyone who says some players deserve to be higher should list an equal number of players that deserve to be be lower. Not like that guy who listed 5 players that should be higher and only 1 player who should be lower. Anything else is just intellectually dishonest.
It's just like ahead of every World Cup in soccer where at least 10 teams say they "deserve" to reach the semis, which only 4 teams can reach. Reaching the quarter-finals is seen as a complete failure even though that means you are one of the top 8 teams in the world. National coaches get fired all the time over such basic lack of math.
People should stop being so entitled, especially on behalf of others. This. If you can't see this as being needlessly aggressive and hateful then I don't know what to tell you.
Do me a favor: Don't be a jerk your whole life.
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United States4883 Posts
On September 10 2017 20:38 Aylear wrote:Show nested quote +On September 10 2017 20:34 Jae Zedong wrote:On September 10 2017 20:07 Aylear wrote:On September 10 2017 20:05 Jae Zedong wrote:On September 10 2017 19:30 Raelcun wrote:Too High:Bisu [#3] as much as it hurts to say it, I want him to be number three, but he just hasn't put the performance out there at all. He shows flashes of brilliance but nothing worthy of putting him at number 3 Last [#2] This is a holdover from when Brood War was still starting to return and Flash had come back and started showing Terrans how to play again. He hasn't put forth an impressive finish in quite a long time but everyone still insists he's solidly #2 behind Flash. So this means you think Soulkey is the second best BW player alive? It's so so easy to cherry pick individual players you think "deserve" to be higher without taking into consideration how the list would turn out if you actually implemented your changes. Sometimes a player gets a "high" ranking not because he is dominating, but because no one else besides Flash is dominating either. I commend you for at least naming a few players you think deserve to be lower, but putting Last and Bisu behind Soulkey is bizarre. Jesus Christ stop taking it so seriously. Power Ranks are for fun, arguing about Power Ranks is for fun. You're an old man yelling at everyone to stop having fun. What's your fucking problem? Show nested quote +On September 10 2017 15:51 Jae Zedong wrote: Anyone who says some players deserve to be higher should list an equal number of players that deserve to be be lower. Not like that guy who listed 5 players that should be higher and only 1 player who should be lower. Anything else is just intellectually dishonest.
It's just like ahead of every World Cup in soccer where at least 10 teams say they "deserve" to reach the semis, which only 4 teams can reach. Reaching the quarter-finals is seen as a complete failure even though that means you are one of the top 8 teams in the world. National coaches get fired all the time over such basic lack of math.
People should stop being so entitled, especially on behalf of others. This. If you can't see this as being needlessly aggressive and hateful then I don't know what to tell you. Do me a favor: Don't be a jerk your whole life.
Power Ranks sometimes bring out the worst in people. Everyone needs to remember that these are just opinions and are open to debate; it is 100% completely fair to debate whether someone "deserves" to be higher or lower. There's no reason to make any of this personal.
Also, stop feeding the troll.
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United States9652 Posts
On September 10 2017 19:30 Raelcun wrote:I have been watching basically any StarCraft I can find with Aylear over the last year and a half and I have to say this powerrank feels very steeped in very old performances and biased by the histories of these players as opposed to their performance in the last year or so. Too Low:MisO [#28] This is criminal. He has been on a very large upswing in all of the things he's been playing in recently and taking out very solid players and putting together large winstreaks in winner stays on format events. He definitely needs to be above Stork and Shuttle at the very least. He should be up at around 15 ideally. Sky [#19] He's been destroying everyone on the ladder. sSak [#14] I still think he's an idiot for admitting on stream he was planning to evade mandatory military service, but still one of the scarier terrans around. firebathero [#26] He has shown a lot of impressive games on his stream, he plays long hours of grinding out practice with barely any screwing around when he plays. Shine [#10] This feels like the new Shuttle from ASL 1. He's been playing well in a lot of events since the last ASL and everyone seems to be writing off his performance from the last one. He had a hard time getting practice for the last tournament and is currently ranked high enough on the ladder he's playing with all the top players regularly. Mong [#16] I feel like he should be up around in the 13 range. He's been very solid recently. Too High:Bisu [#3] as much as it hurts to say it, I want him to be number three, but he just hasn't put the performance out there at all. He shows flashes of brilliance but nothing worthy of putting him at number 3 Last [#2] This is a holdover from when Brood War was still starting to return and Flash had come back and started showing Terrans how to play again. He hasn't put forth an impressive finish in quite a long time but everyone still insists he's solidly #2 behind Flash. Larva [#6] He has been improving A LOT but he has a history of dropping the ball in ASL, so especially if players are going to get ranked low despite one high finish, I don't understand why he's at #6 Mind [#7]Seriously, I don't understand this at all. He hasn't done anything recently. Light [#11] Completely failed to impress me in the last few months. Strange:Snow [#13] Snow is a gigantic X factor. His playstyle is difficult to predict at times and he does things that are frankly insane and somehow makes them work. He should be above a lot of the people that are higher than him, but he probably still deserves to be in the 11-15 range. Shuttle [#20] Criminally underrated in ASL1 and then he just stopped practicing. He seemed to switch to just being a BJ for several tournaments as he basically never played on stream. Recently, he's been playing hard again and it's hard to place him as he's taking out good players, but still seems inconsistent. Much better than he was last ASL but probably wouldn't put him above 18 That all being said, compiling these types of lists is very difficult and much respect to the staff who had to make a lot of difficult decisions. sky destroying everyone on ladder doesnt mean anything when you go into tournaments when he cant win. im glad to prove a lot of people wrong with our power ranks. also you clearly havent looked at tournament results with mind and light. you say you've watched a lot of starcraft, we'll just see how good that knowledge of yours is when the games are actually played out. Larva impressive as ever in that group so im always happy to prove people wrong.
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Either Flash will win a third consecutive ASL or we'll have a lame ZvZ finals. History dictates it.
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Real Power rankings:
1. Snow 2. Bisu 3. Rain 4. I guess Flash... 5. Everyone else. 31. Shine. Since hydra busts will be banned in ASL 4
Ya'll are biased and I see right through you.
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Great ranking :-)
I think Mind and Soulkey are too high (especially Mind) while Shuttle and Mong are too low (especially Shuttle).
And Last... + Show Spoiler +deserved his #2 spot, even though he's already out of the ASL. He's an incredible beast that's been taking out all top pros left and right on streams, and it's shocking he's out so early.
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United States9652 Posts
On September 11 2017 14:58 rackdude wrote:Real Power rankings: 1. Snow2. Bisu3. Rain4. I guess Flash... 5. Everyone else. 31. Shine. Since hydra busts will be banned in ASL 4 Ya'll are biased and I see right through you. sorry to break your bubble but Killer already did a hydra bust vs Sky day 1 xD
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On September 12 2017 10:10 FlaShFTW wrote:Show nested quote +On September 11 2017 14:58 rackdude wrote:Real Power rankings: 1. Snow2. Bisu3. Rain4. I guess Flash... 5. Everyone else. 31. Shine. Since hydra busts will be banned in ASL 4 Ya'll are biased and I see right through you. sorry to break your bubble but Killer already did a hydra bust vs Sky day 1 xD Finals is going to be Shine vs Killer.
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Completely missed this. Thanks for the awesome write up!
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Awesome power rank, I'm so hyped for this tournament!~
As much as I like seeing Bisu ranked all the way at #3, I'm not certain the spot is deserved... Hoping he will prove that he deserves a top three spot!
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Haha nobody has yet mentioned what it is Rain does on stream :p
First rule of fight club?
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ALLEYCAT BLUES48991 Posts
oh no, I was referencing shuttle's comments and the fact that almost half the time its actually true when I tune into rain's stream
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=26646231
On August 02 2017 12:54 Letmelose wrote: Shuttle's thoughts translated.
6. On Rain
"In my opinion, Rain is superior to both SnOw and Mini. I haven't checked his ELO, or overall records in sponsored games, but I can just tell by watching him play. The way he uses his units, his multi-tasking, and overall gaming abilities are all superior. He is truly Bisu's successor. The only thing that's stopping him is the fact that he wastes all his time staring at boobies. He's the kind of player who can do great things if he practices hard."
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all you need to do is watch his stream. he just loves watching female africans!!
very frustrating because i always want to see him play but i always catch him giving commentary and analysis on various women...
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And just when I thought you couldn't get more ridiculous than calling people BJs...
On September 13 2017 13:53 CHEONSOYUN wrote: all you need to do is watch his stream. he just loves watching female africans!!
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Rain is severely underrated here. Do people forget that he was on his way to being #2 to bisu before he left to dominate the sc2 scene? Then he came back and his still at the top.
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