As a fine Canadian gentleman (don't remember the name) pointed I didn't get 2nd gas until very late, but the explanation for that is that I was following Cryoc's guide on how to siege expand an follow up with a 5 fact:
Edit: the reason I'm making this thread is that I'm really lost in TvP. I've had many instances where I go 5 fact, the guy takes a 3rd and goes for arbiter and I still get crushed. Also when I try playing the flash style 180 supply I'm not getting the greatest results either. I wonder if I'm missing something like target firing goons with tanks or something, and if so how should I proceed about it. Thanks
Basically when opening a help thread, add a [H] tag, and post some of your own analysis for what went wrong. I'll add the tag for you, but if you could edit your OP with some of your own thoughts that'd be helpful.
You can't just go for a 5 fact and expect to win. It's only a good thing to do if the situation calls for it. Just like you can't always take a third base with just 2 factories.
On July 26 2015 04:06 vOdToasT wrote: You can't just go for a 5 fact and expect to win. It's only a good thing to do if the situation calls for it. Just like you can't always take a third base with just 2 factories.
Ofc, but if I can't punish guys going for 3rd base and arbiter consistently then something must be wrong. I also don't have the best lategame vs P
I don't really see any analysis in your original post. You should really help us help you by telling us what you think you did pretty well, what you think you did wrong, what you think you should definitely improve in, mistakes that were made, why you lost and not just "my opponent was good and I suck."
There's no secret to it. Your mechanics aren't as good as they could be or insufficient for whatever you need to do and no matter what fancy playstyle or theorycrafting you do won't solve the underlying problem of poor mechanics. If you do a search of the teamliquid strategy section there will be lotsa threads of people asking pretty much the same thing you ask here. I feel as though your question is too general to answer in a focused way. By the way the download is really hard....I have to download some installer just to download the replay which not normal.
The easiest way to learn matchup is watch a progamer whose playstyle you like, watch 20 VOD's of the progamer playing on the same map in the same matchup. They do virtually the same thing every game and always have common patterns you can follow too and ascertain the meaning behind their actions. It will take a lot of patience.
In a medium saute pan over medium heat, add 1-ounce olive oil and all raw vegetables except beans. Saute until translucent. Remove and cool.
Add veggies to beans and mix thoroughly. Add all dry ingredients along with the egg. Thoroughly mix all ingredients and form into 4 patties, cover and refrigerate for 30 minutes.
In saute pan add 1-ounce olive oil, and cook patties 2 to 3 minutes per side.
if youre going to follow cyrocs, build, follow cryocs build. The build you did in your game isnt what cryoc did, cryoc didnt float money and add a 3rd cc before pushing out. granted the video is not very long and after that you started falling apart way more.
Im not going to claim I know more about tvp than cryoc since I dont actually play it, but I will put it out there that perhaps his build was a counter to something specific the toss did in his game. I played pvt when I was active and the most common variety of 5fact ive faced before was the one I described in the other thread, where you dont stop tank production.
But I second what Ty2 said, find a progamer to base your play off of, and study their replays and vods. the "replays..." thread contains a ton of good TvP games you can study and check out which variety of 5fact push is used and how they followup in other situations etc
The 5fac in the video cuts a tank or two in order to avoid having to get a 2nd gas for the additional factories and therefore hits faster. 2 Gate Expand into obs and 3rd is an edge case. It can work if you have better micro and equal macro, but it is no sure thing. You should work for sure on the execution (my push starts at 8:50min with 6 tanks and 17 vultures, you have 6 tanks and 4 vultures at 8:50min), but judging the game at hand I would say you had better macro than your opponent and a 15 supply lead when your push was rolling, while his gateways were still building. So you had a good timing but wasting a control group of vultures to goons and not clearing mines beneath tanks is not part of the timing push. Keep the vultures close to your tanks with hold position so he can't lure them away.
Also, a 5 Fac follow-up will almost never work vs 1 Gate FE into 3base arbiter, unless you skip ebay and academy until you built the facs which is very risky. That is why in a standard game Terran goes for 3CC.
@Ty2 googling shows you how to download from 4shared without installer/account.
I would recommend finding some LighT[aLive] TvP replays if you can; he's bar far the easiest to emulate and his style works on most of the common maps. He spams a lot of turrets and a lot of mines with minimal tanks while using the leftover gas to crank out factories and upgrades; you will see high level players balancing their gas between factory+upgrades and tank counts a lot.
LighT also secures the half way point between the third and the natural (which is an extremely important spot in TvP--secure it as safely and as quickly as you can) with 4 tanks, 4 turrets, and a shitton of mines while keeping tabs on the toss army and expos with vultures and mines. Technically, this is way too early, but if you do it properly, the protoss shouldn't be able to figure out you have 4 tanks cause his observers cant get close to the turrets. "Way too early" is also relative because most of the timings you're going to hit will be way too late, so it kinda balances itself out anyways.
From here, you can leapfrog to his base with these little outposts of 4 turrets and 4 tanks + mines, or you can secure your 3rd and just crank out more units. Scout and adjust accordingly
This will easily work all the way to C level, which, by then, you should have a decent grasp on the matchup. .
Work on keeping your money low first, then work on switching between micro and macro consistently (i recommend having a timer going off every 5-10 seconds), then worry about build orders. Too much gas and not enough minerals? You need more SCVs. Too much minerals not enough gas? You probably need more expansions. Too much of both? You macro fell behind. More than 50% of the games you will lose are going to be because of your mechanics, not because your build doesn't work.