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I decided to start with the easiest and simplest to translate so I translated a post containing tips for zerg beginners. This author claimed to be a noob but he said he was noob compared to PGR members. I saw some comments that appreciated this post on PGR so I wish this translation helps some of you. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Name The Greatest Hits
Subject [Z vs T] Tips for Zerg Noobs
1. Hatchery Fate of Zerg lies on “lava”. The fact that Zerg has more flexibility compared to other races is due to its 3 ‘fixed’ lavas. 10 Hatcheries produce 60 zerglings at a time, but given that Zerg usually has at most 3 hatcheries in early stage vs Terran, even one “forgotten lava” is very self-destructive. Especially after mid stage of game, the zerg ends up with excessive unused resources even with very few missed lavas. So it is essential to produce “constantly” using all lavas. In addition, placing hatchery in twin position will increase mining efficiency. Hatcheries for army production is advised to be placed close together. This allows Ctrl+lava and prevents unused lava frequently seen in remote hatcheries around the map.
2. About # of drones One thing good about Zerg compared to Protoss and Terran is that “A lot at once” is possible. The reason Terran and Protoss have to produce scvs and probes endlessly is not to mine resources better, but to quickly utilize resources from new expo. However, Zerg seldom overproduces its workers. All Zerg needs to do is produce drones from three hatches once and fill the new expo. Since drones build buildings, you will often find your expo filled with more drones and your main base lacking them. Try to produce limited number of drones when producing your army to prevent this.
3. Placement of Overlords One thing that makes Zerg better than Terran is the fact that Overlords can fly around (although it’s turtle speed). In case of Python, as the version upgraded to 1.03, there are now walls. Overlord placed over it will stress Terran. Important thing is to send one ov over the wall and one near mineral. After early stage, place them where it is easy for your opponent to drop attack. Placing an ov near mineral becomes handy especially when you need your drones to click on remote mineral and attack against your opponent attempting cheese or bunker. 4. Always try to build minimum sunkens When your opponent is one rax double, you can easily defend with zerglings and drones. Two sunkens equal one hatchery equals 6 drones. Two sunkens not built to produce drones instead will make it very hard to lose economic battle against Terran. The bravery in front of marines ~! This will brighten the future of Zerg.
5. The focus of zergling+lurker control is zergling, not lurkers. Charging 1a2a lurker zergling accomplishes nothing but making marines retreat a small distance. It is better to divide zergling and lurkers to make lurkers run in front while zerglings surround marines from behind and move attack. This deals more damage. Remember the main part of July’s ling+lurk control was zergling, not lurkers.
6. Lurker control Tip Burrowing lurker group altogether as if sieging a group of tanks will make you lose. When charging with lurker group, it is important to shift click on each lurker to burrow those in appropriate position. If you got a slow hand, ctrl+lurker will select lurkers in screen. Pressing U after that will make lurkers that are not on screen to run forward. Press U again on these running lurkers. This will prevent lurkers to stand still when intense battle takes place. Place two lurkers in expos in starting points. I advise against stop lurkers for beginners since you will have to pay too much attention to it.
7. Killing opponent's army with mutal is not an easy thing People are used to seeing Jaedong’s mutal control but it is better for beginners to just scout around enemy base and pick off isolated units. It is already a pressure for terran just to see mutals flying around their base.
8. Fast Hive build is a build with many weaknesses. Hive tech can be achieved quickly to produce defiler as early as on 9 minute into the game. Even 8 minute is possible if expo is given up. However, this is highly vulnerable to tanks coming out from two facts rushing with a vessel. Existence of defiler means very little without supporting army. Therefore, I suggest grasping your opponent’s intention before going fast Hive build. First build your army and give Terran an impression that you will attack their base if they dare to progress their army.
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Will do more translation of longer and more complex ones later.
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Good Stuff, keep it up!
P.S. I think you should translate the replies as well. When they debate, they get into details wayyyy more than the topic itself sometimes, posting their replays and all. Great job nevertheless!!
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Aww. So you decided not to do my request? jk. Thanks for translating though because I'm beginning to learn how to play zerg.
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I got a pm from somebody to do zerg although I doubt this beginner tip will satisfy him. I'll eventually translate others too, including yours. BTW wut race did u want?
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OMFG I LOVE YOU SOO MUCH!!! Because I really wanted to get that flash build to a perfect science as well as the using more dropships against toss.
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Argh, I need advanced chogu tips...
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On December 25 2008 01:46 AloneInDaBunker wrote: The bravery in front of marines ~! This will brighten the future of Zerg. haha, cute~
thanks!
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Katowice25012 Posts
I love all these translations, this is great
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Heh cool, I been a protoss user forever and starting to learn zerg now, this helps a bit thx for the post.
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
Awesome thanks alot
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Protoss translations would be great! This bit opened up a new perspective for me, so it was really great, thanks!
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Very nice translation. Thanks for this!
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i'm not a zerg user but that guide was ridiculousy helpful. i feel like i can go kick some A korean ass on iccup.
just feel like it. not saying i'll be able to. in fact i'm not even going to try.
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These are the noob tips? The gosu tips must be awesome, pls translate more
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This is really nice; big thanks for translating. We all appreciate it!
Shouldn't this be in strat. though?
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The Korean level of discourse of SC strategy seems so much higher than the foreign one, I hope to see more awesome translations in the future. ;D
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really cool
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Braavos36362 Posts
On December 25 2008 01:46 AloneInDaBunker wrote: ... 4. Always try to build minimum sunkens When your opponent is one rax double, you can easily defend with zerglings and drones. Two sunkens equal one hatchery equals 6 drones. Two sunkens not built to produce drones instead will make it very hard to lose economic battle against Terran. The bravery in front of marines ~! This will brighten the future of Zerg. ... I 100% disagree with this, two sunkens = 20 drones.
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ive read the lurker control part about 7 times now and i still have no idea what it means
can anyone explain?
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I think the lurker part basically means, use your zerglings to cut off the retreat path of the M&M, this ensures that the lurker can do their part. When he says that July's zerglings is what made his ZvT good, he means he made sure that the M&M could never get away.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
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On December 25 2008 06:56 Salv wrote: I think the lurker part basically means, use your zerglings to cut off the retreat path of the M&M, this ensures that the lurker can do their part. When he says that July's zerglings is what made his ZvT good, he means he made sure that the M&M could never get away.
Na, hes definitely saying something different here.
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Thanks for the translations. it is appreciated
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Good work, very good work.
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Great. Greeeeeeat.
AloneInDaBunker please give us some translation of TvT strategies. It is so very complex would like to know some korean views of that matchup! <3
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On December 25 2008 01:46 AloneInDaBunker wrote: 5. The focus of zergling+lurker control is zergling, not lurkers. Charging 1a2a lurker zergling accomplishes nothing but making marines retreat a small distance. It is better to divide zergling and lurkers to make lurkers run in front while zerglings surround marines from behind and move attack. This deals more damage. Remember the main part of July’s ling+lurk control was zergling, not lurkers.
6. Lurker control Tip Burrowing lurker group altogether as if sieging a group of tanks will make you lose. When charging with lurker group, it is important to shift click on each lurker to burrow those in appropriate position. If you got a slow hand, ctrl+lurker will select lurkers in screen. Pressing U after that will make lurkers that are not on screen to run forward. Press U again on these running lurkers. This will prevent lurkers to stand still when intense battle takes place. Place two lurkers in expos in starting points. I advise against stop lurkers for beginners since you will have to pay too much attention to it.
I kinda disagree with these 2 points.
With the first one, while the flanking with zerglings is indeed the most important part, that is usually done prior to battle. The toughest and most micro intensive part is actually the handling of the lurkers. Even the running past the marines and attacking them with zerglings requires about 2 mouse clicks for each group of zerglings you have and not even precise clicks. However for lurkers, burrowing/unburrowing to catch up with the running terran or burrowing only the front lurkers to place all of them in range of his stationary army is a whole different story. Defilers and scourges may also not as important as the zerglings but are harder. You need to focus more on these units.
Also, while yes, the ideal way to attack with lurkerling is to have zerglings which completely surround the marines, you never want to leave your lurkers without any lings close to them or the marines will actually kill the lurkers and escape through there rather easily.
With the second point, i dont even understand what youre trying to say with the shift click but using ctrl + left click on the lurker itself right from the start is a bad idea, youre better off just using the hotkey and pressing "u" since if you want the former way to work, you actually need to have your screen set up so that you cant see at least half of your lurkers, which also means you will not see half of the rest of your army which usually includes scourges and defilers.
So im gonna try to explain as best as i can the way i think its best to handle lurkers.
Your lurkers are coming close to the terran, you use your mouse to drag select (with a box) the front lurkers, you will most likely select some zerglings too, so to be able to burrow.those lurkers you have to ctrl-left click on any lurker drawing on the lower part of the screen, which i will call the "selected group box" for clarity.
The rest of the lurkers will keep moving, and if you want to move them even farther, you can use the hotkey + your usual right click while the burrow animation is still going, however if you keep ordering your whole group to move (even the burrowed ones) you will actually prevent the burrowed ones from attacking, so then you may need to do some more of the action i described in the previous paragraph, especially if your lurkers start splitting in 2 groups and surrounding the terran, which sometimes happens.
If you are fast, you can spam right click on a marine who is in a sweet spot while having the burrowing lurkers selected, if you click right when the animation finishes, the luker will actually fire a little fast than usual.
Now, some of the lurkers are fully burrowed your ctrl+left clicks on a burrowed lurker will select only all the burrowed lurkers you can see, same goes for the unburrowed lurks if you click on one, so rinse and repeat those last steps with the still running lurkers.
If the already burrowed lurkers are suddenly out of range then you will repeat the same technique i just described. You drag-select the lurkers you wanna unburrow or just ctrl-left click on one of them if you wanna unburrow all, ctrl+left click one of them in the "selected group box" to remove any other unwanted units unburrow and then you can start moving them asap since the animation to unburrow is like instantaneous.
Thats basically it, takes a lot of practice and some speed, the scourges come somwhere between where most of your lurkers are burrowed and all of them are burrowed. The defilers and zerglings are used when the lurkers are still running.
If you have trouble cloning scourges because you are slow, then just spread them somewhat before the fight, just not too much since you want them to keep their formation when they move, then you will move them past the vessels but they have to pass over them and when they are over them you can just attack move wherever.
If you are fighting lots of tanks with few vessels, you want your lurkers to burrow as close to the tanks as possible, since they are the most dangerous, if you kill them, you usually nulify the terrans attack even if most of the marines are still alive.
If you are fighting lots of vessels with few tanks(1-3), forget about the tanks since the terran will usually just use them to soak up damage if you burrow lurkers next to them (defensive matrix and all that), you want to kill marines with those lurkers, also if the terran retreats and leaves his tanks behind, they will die easily to your zerglings.
A bit confusing i know, but i hope it helps.
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Thank you very much for this thread.
Please continue to do these.
God, there are so many people that contribute so much on tl.net lately.
I need to do something =(.
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Oh and about the whole make as little sunkens as possible thing. Thats only really important at the beginning of the game, its much cheaper to maka 4 lings when your spawning pool is done than a sunken asap.
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On December 25 2008 06:56 Salv wrote: I think the lurker part basically means, use your zerglings to cut off the retreat path of the M&M, this ensures that the lurker can do their part. When he says that July's zerglings is what made his ZvT good, he means he made sure that the M&M could never get away.
no. he meant with a lurkling army, the lurks are meat sheilds while the lings are the ones that actually kill stuff.
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The lurkers are NEVER meatshields its completely the other way around. and zerglings are only the main source of damage if you have very few lurkers, like 3.
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On December 25 2008 05:06 Jyvblamo wrote: The Korean level of discourse of SC strategy seems so much higher than the foreign one, I hope to see more awesome translations in the future. ;D
Agreed, can't wait for more!
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this gave me alot of good advice. thanks alot!
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very kewl down to earth basic tips.
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These are awesome.
It's amazing how much strategy never makes it to here from korean sites.
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Well, its not neatly compiled in a series of points, of which some are pretty obvious and others are wrong. However if you read our threads a little closer you would notice that this is not something only koreans know. Oh and btw, supply depot push to take a 3rd in tvp? come on lol. Their guides are sometimes even crappier than ours.
Of the guides translated here, only the pvz one can compare to one of ours in the recommended threads post.
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Cloud,
I think the players who actually benifit from this are in need of very basic fundemental concepts so small things seem better then more comprehensve guides.
I agree with you I recommend our forum to everybody on iccup who has questions. If there zerg I know if I don't post you will and they will get good help ^^.
Merry Christmas
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On December 25 2008 18:07 AnOth3rDAy wrote: Great. Greeeeeeat.
AloneInDaBunker please give us some translation of TvT strategies. It is so very complex would like to know some korean views of that matchup! <3
Yeah I agree! TvT is so damn complex in strategies
Plz help!
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On December 26 2008 10:32 CommanderFluffy wrote: MOOOAAR
ZvP Please!!! Watch Jaedong vs Bisu.
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Cloud, I don't know what you have to gain from arguing with the OP. He's just providing a translation. If you want to make a Zerg versus Terran guide then put it in a separate thread. Anyway great job on the translation OP. Some solid advice there for Zerg beginners.
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I wasnt really arguing with the OP, i was pointing the mistakes the article he translated had, But dont worry, maybe ill write a guide, which will take much more time that the post i made however. After all, 8 paragraphs of obvious and sometimes wrong advice doesnt cut it in this forum does it?
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i like these translations alot. thank you
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how i wish we have VODs fort these tips,in this way we know how the situation works.
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hey cloud some points you pointed out to be obvious might be helpful to less experienced zerg players since the original poster specifically wrote this for beginners to have more competency in game without serious training. I chose to begin with the easiest to translate to get me some momentum into translating more extensive ones. I appreciate all your comments. I'll get started on another one asap. Admins please tell me if I should post next one on strategy forum. Thanks.
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You dont need permission from anyone to start a new thread dude, just make one if you think its useful, and yes its best if you place it in this forum.
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Ah very nice. Good post.
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Zerg LAVA lol :p
Good tips I like these kind of threads, thx alot man
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