On November 03 2011 02:39 Egyptian_Head wrote:But because most people keep them self in reasonable shape which is all I require in that department your ranking system means nothing to me. My 10 might be your 1.
General beauty is actually a standard scale across most civilized societies now, countless psy and marketing studies have proven this. A hot girl would be considered hot by surveys across all societies and walks of life, this is not debatable.
A 10 will be a 9/10 to EVERYONE. The only way it's not a 9 or 10 is due to your own clouded perception of what is a 10 to yourself. You may devalue a 10 to a 6 just for your own ego and make you feel better that you can only get with girls that are truly a 6 to the rest of the world.
If a 10 makes me want to punch her in the face I am not going to want anything to do with her. What attracts us to each other is not only looks. Your scaling on looks alone means nothing to me, we might find the same girls attractive, however you may love her and I might want to punch her. Whether I like someone is far more important than looks. Looks is something that causes initial attraction, it cannot sustain long term interest, I am sure it can help but not alone, you need to actually like the person as well. My one may be a ten in looks. It really doesn't matter if I want to punch her.
didnt like shit about these books, only buddies of mine who read them and enjoyed were cheese dicks at best if you know what i mean, mother fuckers care more about how theyre hair looks jelled then being able to knock out the muther fucker who calls you a fag for having a more intense ensemble and hair due then the girl your with. also the exerpts that i read sounded highly fictionalized or just straight bullshit.
On November 03 2011 02:39 Egyptian_Head wrote:But because most people keep them self in reasonable shape which is all I require in that department your ranking system means nothing to me. My 10 might be your 1.
General beauty is actually a standard scale across most civilized societies now, countless psy and marketing studies have proven this. A hot girl would be considered hot by surveys across all societies and walks of life, this is not debatable.
A 10 will be a 9/10 to EVERYONE. The only way it's not a 9 or 10 is due to your own clouded perception of what is a 10 to yourself. You may devalue a 10 to a 6 just for your own ego and make you feel better that you can only get with girls that are truly a 6 to the rest of the world.
If a 10 makes me want to punch her in the face I am not going to want anything to do with her. What attracts us to each other is not only looks. Your scaling on looks alone means nothing to me, we might find the same girls attractive, however you may love her and I might want to punch her. Whether I like someone is far more important than looks. Looks is something that causes initial attraction, it cannot sustain long term interest, I am sure it can help but not alone, you need to actually like the person as well. My one may be a ten in looks. It really doesn't matter if I want to punch her.
people have time and time again been proven to lye in surveys for things such as sexual attraction even in if they were promised anonymity, your surveys are at the behest of the honesty of those surveyed
On October 23 2011 21:17 squattincassanova wrote: Okay, here is the scoop. Blizzcon was fun. But the guy to girl ratio was like 5 to 1. And most of the chicks are fat, ugly, had yellow teeth and bad posture. BUT. There are the occasional super hot chicks. They unfortunately composed of the following:
1. Chicks representing vendors / companies / hired guns. 2. Chicks who who do 6 months of cardio to look sexy for their cosplay costume. 3. The Mexican chicks working the icecream booths lol. 4. Girlfriends of Blizzard and other video game employees.
I wore my fancy pants and going out shoes. My fucking god they hurt like a bitch. But the typical dude at Blizzcon are the epitome of never getting laid. Its like one look and the girls would put them in a category of AFC.
One of my friend is a Blizzard Employee, who actually hooked me up with a ticket. But the thing is, they have a HUGE social status advantage at Blizzcon. It is ridiculous how much social proof they get. Keep in mind, a lot of guys who work at Blizzard are successful young guys in their 20s and 30's who also are actually quite decent at game (the pickup kind). I went to dinner with one that actually brought a girl back.
Okay, nobody cares about that, we just wanna see pictures right? LOL
Caught this girl taking notes and asking ppl questions on the cosplay effects in different cultures. Pretty easy to banter with.
Then I stumble across this girl who is a hired gun at the Razer booth. LOL this girl was so hooked, she ignored the other customers and talked to me for 30 minutes. Then later that day, I went to the Steelseries booth and bought their Sensai mouse. I'm such a traitor lol! Anyways, it turns out she lives out near San Diego so I am going to try and Day 2 her later. I told her there was a party that night at the Hiltons and that she should come and I asked her whats a good way to get a hold of her. She gives me her business card. I give her a weird look. And I am like "so yeah... you want me a to fax you later?" in a smirk manner. I do a body rock and go, here, just give me your number. I look for a pen to write it down and she just tells me to put it in the phone. I tried to find her in the party later but she had to stay with her Razer crew to film some stupid Starcraft match the guy was MMA? Fuck you Starcraft you fucking cock blocked me!!!
The rest of the night was pretty gay. Fucking hotel was filled with Blizzard employees gaming the rest of the girls. Can't really do much against crazy social status and social proof there. But still the girls ratio was so crap that even if they weren't there, it still would have been a crappy night.
Do you have to do anything different to pick up a gamer girl? Any special tips or audio from there?
No need to buy books, dvds, a video camera/a tape recorder to practice day game, hire a 'mentor', or go to PUA/Seduction Community conferences.
Works like a charm if you commit. The plus side is you don't have to lie or "neg" to make other people feel bad about themselves in order to get laid. Builds yourself up instead of relying on breaking others down. Gives you confidence that is based on your own strengths and personality. Anyone with their head too far up their own ass to see you as someone worth getting to know isn't worth your time in the first place.
I think what squatin' and the other pro-PUA guys get out of this is the same thing the Tao will give you: Confidence in themselves and a certain level of comfort in conversing with members of the opposite sex. Nothing wrong with that.
But, there are ways to do that positively without resorting to the "women are targets, not people" pitfall that I've seen a lot of PUA guys fall into. Not saying that is the case with squatin' or anyone on these forums, just saying I've seen it in the clubs and bars and its a sad sight to behold. Well, sad and funny if you happen to watch a peacock crash-n-burn up close.
On October 23 2011 21:17 squattincassanova wrote: Okay, here is the scoop. Blizzcon was fun. But the guy to girl ratio was like 5 to 1. And most of the chicks are fat, ugly, had yellow teeth and bad posture. BUT. There are the occasional super hot chicks. They unfortunately composed of the following:
1. Chicks representing vendors / companies / hired guns. 2. Chicks who who do 6 months of cardio to look sexy for their cosplay costume. 3. The Mexican chicks working the icecream booths lol. 4. Girlfriends of Blizzard and other video game employees.
I wore my fancy pants and going out shoes. My fucking god they hurt like a bitch. But the typical dude at Blizzcon are the epitome of never getting laid. Its like one look and the girls would put them in a category of AFC.
One of my friend is a Blizzard Employee, who actually hooked me up with a ticket. But the thing is, they have a HUGE social status advantage at Blizzcon. It is ridiculous how much social proof they get. Keep in mind, a lot of guys who work at Blizzard are successful young guys in their 20s and 30's who also are actually quite decent at game (the pickup kind). I went to dinner with one that actually brought a girl back.
Okay, nobody cares about that, we just wanna see pictures right? LOL
Caught this girl taking notes and asking ppl questions on the cosplay effects in different cultures. Pretty easy to banter with.
Then I stumble across this girl who is a hired gun at the Razer booth. LOL this girl was so hooked, she ignored the other customers and talked to me for 30 minutes. Then later that day, I went to the Steelseries booth and bought their Sensai mouse. I'm such a traitor lol! Anyways, it turns out she lives out near San Diego so I am going to try and Day 2 her later. I told her there was a party that night at the Hiltons and that she should come and I asked her whats a good way to get a hold of her. She gives me her business card. I give her a weird look. And I am like "so yeah... you want me a to fax you later?" in a smirk manner. I do a body rock and go, here, just give me your number. I look for a pen to write it down and she just tells me to put it in the phone. I tried to find her in the party later but she had to stay with her Razer crew to film some stupid Starcraft match the guy was MMA? Fuck you Starcraft you fucking cock blocked me!!!
The rest of the night was pretty gay. Fucking hotel was filled with Blizzard employees gaming the rest of the girls. Can't really do much against crazy social status and social proof there. But still the girls ratio was so crap that even if they weren't there, it still would have been a crappy night.
Do you have to do anything different to pick up a gamer girl? Any special tips or audio from there?
Not really, they are typically more shy. You might want to escalate a bit more slowly and do more comfort building. Plus most gamer girls don't club as much (although some might) so you probably meet them in an environment where you can't go sexual direct like that.
Even the girl that works for Razer in Blizzcon, I didn't talk sexual at all. I was just being cool and funny. And remember, how you act towards a girl depends on your perceived value vs. the perceived value of the girl.
If you are a Brad Pitt look alike and you are successful and well dressed and the girl is a shy book nerd, being cocky comes across as arrogant and assholish. But if you are a short, beta guy starting out and you are talking to a hot model in the club, your only option of hooking her is being overly cocky funny. Otherwise you are just a nobody and you will lose her attention.
For example, take a look at this video. This guy can pull off what he says because hes short, pudgy, and the girls are okay with what he says because hes non threatening. If I said the same shit as this guy, I would come across as a sexual predator lol!
On November 03 2011 00:59 Grumbels wrote:*shrug*, that's exactly what I meant. You're just saying: "you are wrong, not going to tell you why" two times.
I didn't say you were wrong about there being bad apples in the seduction community. I actually agree with that. What I disagree with is the notion that the seduction community thinks it's perfect. I don't think you can find a whole lot of assertions by seduction community members to the contrary, especially since the community is fairly diverse and many don't get along with each other, as might be expected with a bunch of Type A personalities. As for the two questions you brought up, allow me to elaborate since I have a little more time right now:
Negs: Contrary to popular belief, the concept of a neg isn't that lowering a girl's self esteem will make her want to sleep with you. A neg is a tool to be used specifically (and only) against a bitch shield. When a girl shows you disrespect by default, then there's no way that seduction can take place. So instead, you respond to her disrespect/disinterest by showing disrespect/disinterest right back, only in a subtle, pleasant, and casual way. Either she'll lower the bitch shield immediately, or she'll keep firing at you (i.e. negging you back), at which point if you keep up the same you'll quickly find that you're flirting with each other in a belligerent sexual tension sort of way. The main idea is that a girl with a bitch shield is sitting on a pedestal where she thinks she's better than you. Negs are meant to break that down, both by lowering her pedestal and by raising your own, but it's actually critical not to go too far and hurt her feelings. Once you're in a place of mutual respect, then you can proceed.
Ranking Women: Who gave you the impression that the seduction community obssesses over ranking women? The seduction community rates women, but doesn't rank them. Ranking implies comparing them with each other and establishing a hierarchy. By contrast, rating serves only to categorize them. We certainly didn't invent the concept of rating women, nor is precise rating of any importance. The primary purpose it serves is to work as a shorthand descriptive term, which is useful when different approaches are probabilistically more effective on certain levels of attractiveness (i.e. a teasing approach that works well with 9s and 10s is more likely to hurt the self-esteem of a 6 or 7, while a gentler nice guy approach that appeals to 6s and 7s is more likely to seem pathetic to a 9 or 10).
On November 03 2011 00:44 Egyptian_Head wrote:I have a question. Why not just be yourself? Most people are quiet interesting once you get to know them, that will include most of you. Surely you should learn how to show what makes you interesting and different not just put on an act. The act might be easier but what good is it? You are going to have to stop acting at some point. And yeah being nice is not a personality, that is pretty much suppressing anything that could be called a personality. Just say whatever you want to say and if you click with the girl awesome, if you don't it wasn't going to go anywhere past sex anyway and there are only so many ways to have sex before it gets old.
"Be yourself" is obviously redundant and useless advice. People already are themselves, and if that works for them, they wouldn't go looking for advice with women.
It's also not about 'acting'. It's about changing who you are so that you adopt more attractive traits. For example, if you're not a funny guy, but you take improv comedy classes and learn how to be funny, does that mean you're not being yourself? Wouldn't it be more reasonable to say that you have instead become funny?
On November 03 2011 00:44 Egyptian_Head wrote:From what I can see the main benefit of this kind of thing is it encourages you to try, which is good. Getting the confidence to approach people is great, if you are having fun doing this that is amazing for you. But if you are just going to be "cocky and funny" (or whatever it is meant to be) that may be great if you are just looking for a lay, but that cannot be the best way to go if you want anything more than just in the now.
How can being a confident, funny guy possibly hurt you regardless of what you're looking for?
You're playing semantics, as usual. If you try and take "be yourself" literally it becomes utterly nonsensical and the debate will devolve into arguing philosophical questions about the nature of self. The advice is simply to not try and become someone you are not, merely for attracting a girl. My interpretation of it is that people have particular personalities and you shouldn't try to become a fundamentally different person, as love has to be based on sustainable attraction. Putting up an act just leads to eventual misery. I would say that's very sound advice, but obviously you can also interpret it as being about class: you are not good enough for her, so don't bother trying to improve yourself. That's not a message I would ever support, obviously. I think in the end it's merely a badly worded cliche, that can mean whatever you want it to mean; so I I suppose there's a lot of rhetorical value in attacking it, even if it's a bit intellectually dishonest.
I guess some people think there's an underlying assumption that people can't change, which is blatantly ridiculous. There are lots of examples about shy, nerdy kids becoming outward and confident as they get older. But is that real change? I've become more outward as I've gotten older, but that's just part of growing up. I still have the same basic mentality about life, the same type of humor. I'm not sure you can achieve fundamental changes in those areas, except for more rare cases. (which makes it useless as generic advice)
To pretend as if pick-up artistry is precisely about becoming a better person through rigorous self-improvement is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Yeah, it's preached as the most effective way to improve your game, I guess, but it's still part of an overall strategy of scoring women. A strategy very much rife with objectification. I honestly don't see how you can spend so much time rating women and then deny you're ranking them. That doesn't line up with what your average PUA-community member would think. Of course, every member of that community you ever ask anything is a special snowflake only focused on self-improvement in no one associated with any of the 'few bad apples that exist in all communities'. It's so bizarre that a community whose central goal is to learning techniques to get women in bed can feel so offended if anyone ever associates there's an extraordinary amount of creepiness and objectification exuding from its member.
Again, if you want to follow your favorite pick-up artist guru on his path through life's mysteries or whatever, be my guest. I'm sure you and lots of others are benefiting a lot from it, but at least don't engage in these silly wordgames where everything ever said about PUA by someone not in the know is met with some rhetorical slight of hand to divert actual discussion.
On November 03 2011 08:46 Grumbels wrote: You're playing semantics, as usual. If you try and take "be yourself" literally it becomes utterly nonsensical and the debate will devolve into arguing philosophical questions about the nature of self. The advice is simply to not try and become someone you are not, merely for attracting a girl. My interpretation of it is that people have particular personalities and you shouldn't try to become a fundamentally different person, as love has to be based on sustainable attraction. Putting up an act just leads to eventual misery. I would say that's very sound advice, but obviously you can also interpret it as being about class: you are not good enough for her, so don't bother trying to improve yourself. That's not a message I would ever support, obviously. I think in the end it's merely a badly worded cliche, that can mean whatever you want it to mean; so I I suppose there's a lot of rhetorical value in attacking it, even if it's a bit intellectually dishonest.
I guess some people think there's an underlying assumption that people can't change, which is blatantly ridiculous. There are lots of examples about shy, nerdy kids becoming outward and confident as they get older. But is that real change? I've become more outward as I've gotten older, but that's just part of growing up. I still have the same basic mentality about life, the same type of humor. I'm not sure you can achieve fundamental changes in those areas, except for more rare cases. (which makes it useless as generic advice)
To pretend as if pick-up artistry is precisely about becoming a better person through rigorous self-improvement is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Yeah, it's preached as the most effective way to improve your game, I guess, but it's still part of an overall strategy of scoring women. A strategy very much rife with objectification. I honestly don't see how you can spend so much time rating women and then deny you're ranking them. That doesn't line up with what your average PUA-community member would think. Of course, every member of that community you ever ask anything is a special snowflake only focused on self-improvement in no one associated with any of the 'few bad apples that exist in all communities'. It's so bizarre that a community whose central goal is to learning techniques to get women in bed can feel so offended if anyone ever associates there's an extraordinary amount of creepiness and objectification exuding from its member.
Again, if you want to follow your favorite pick-up artist guru on his path through life's mysteries or whatever, be my guest. I'm sure you and lots of others are benefiting a lot from it, but at least don't engage in these silly wordgames where everything ever said about PUA by someone not in the know is met with some rhetorical slight of hand to divert actual discussion.
How many pick up guys have you actually met in real life for more than 5 hours? My point exactly. You are just reading posts on the internet where trolls and garbage posts run rampant and where objectification of women are widespread everywhere.
On the contrary, I find my self judging women a lot less after almost one year into pickup. Back in the day when I saw a girl have kids and not married, I used to think they were uneducated and slutty. But now, just note to myself that a lot of times they are just a byproduct of their environment.
Well, imo the whole “Just be yourself” advice actually works with a bit of frame control. I am almost 100% sure that EVERYONE on this forum has done something interesting in their lives. It could be traveling to an exotic location, experiencing a special event, or simply making a big accomplishment. As long as you can convey these in a cool, comfortable manner, the girl will see how adventurous you are, she will fall for you. Telling an anecdotal experience is always DHV.
Remember that list you made of the qualities that girls look for, and that you are trying to master them and whatnot.
what would all these girls think about you if they knew you video taped all your attempts, and that you studied them for hours afterwards? and how your whole purpose in life is currently to get better at wooing them so you can notch your bedpost? i would bet most of them would have a negative reaction to such a behavior.
if you like it then fine whatever, but dont say that these girls are liking you for who you are because you have given yourself some very negative characteristics behind your veil of characteristics that women want.
The truth is you are trying to justify your behavior as some kind of self improvement method, when in reality you are just forcefully trying to change yourself to gain more approval and sex from women.
Remember that list you made of the qualities that girls look for, and that you are trying to master them and whatnot.
what would all these girls think about you if they knew you video taped all your attempts, and that you studied them for hours afterwards? and how your whole purpose in life is currently to get better at wooing them so you can notch your bedpost? i would bet most of them would have a negative reaction to such a behavior.
if you like it then fine whatever, but dont say that these girls are liking you for who you are because you have given yourself some very negative characteristics behind your veil of characteristics that women want.
The truth is you are trying to justify your behavior as some kind of self improvement method, when in reality you are just forcefully trying to change yourself to gain more approval and sex from women.
If he's built enough attraction and cred, I'm sure they don't give a shit. In fact most girls are intrigued by guys who are good at handling women, and frankly it doesn't scare them away unless you go way too over the top with your sets.
Remember that list you made of the qualities that girls look for, and that you are trying to master them and whatnot.
what would all these girls think about you if they knew you video taped all your attempts, and that you studied them for hours afterwards? and how your whole purpose in life is currently to get better at wooing them so you can notch your bedpost? i would bet most of them would have a negative reaction to such a behavior.
if you like it then fine whatever, but dont say that these girls are liking you for who you are because you have given yourself some very negative characteristics behind your veil of characteristics that women want.
The truth is you are trying to justify your behavior as some kind of self improvement method, when in reality you are just forcefully trying to change yourself to gain more approval and sex from women.
You are right, they probably will get disgusted. But you know what? Recording it allows me to write detailed field reports so I get good feedback on what I did right and wrong. I talk to like 20 girls a night, I cant remember everything. The videos I make is just for fun to keep me motivated. The act of doing this has drastically accelerated my growth.
I enjoy my interactions with these women but they are not the one I want to marry. If they find out and never talk to me again, so be it. I am on my path. When I find the true woman I love, I will quit this for good.
You don't have to show everything about yourself to a woman. If you have to fart in a job interview, do you hold it? Why won't you be yourself and just let it go? Why do you think girls spend hours putting on make up? If they have pimples, why do you think they try to cover it up? There is no reason to reveal everything and expose everything to people.
On November 03 2011 00:44 Egyptian_Head wrote:I have a question. Why not just be yourself? Most people are quiet interesting once you get to know them, that will include most of you. Surely you should learn how to show what makes you interesting and different not just put on an act. The act might be easier but what good is it? You are going to have to stop acting at some point. And yeah being nice is not a personality, that is pretty much suppressing anything that could be called a personality. Just say whatever you want to say and if you click with the girl awesome, if you don't it wasn't going to go anywhere past sex anyway and there are only so many ways to have sex before it gets old.
"Be yourself" is obviously redundant and useless advice. People already are themselves, and if that works for them, they wouldn't go looking for advice with women.
It's also not about 'acting'. It's about changing who you are so that you adopt more attractive traits. For example, if you're not a funny guy, but you take improv comedy classes and learn how to be funny, does that mean you're not being yourself? Wouldn't it be more reasonable to say that you have instead become funny?
On November 03 2011 00:44 Egyptian_Head wrote:From what I can see the main benefit of this kind of thing is it encourages you to try, which is good. Getting the confidence to approach people is great, if you are having fun doing this that is amazing for you. But if you are just going to be "cocky and funny" (or whatever it is meant to be) that may be great if you are just looking for a lay, but that cannot be the best way to go if you want anything more than just in the now.
How can being a confident, funny guy possibly hurt you regardless of what you're looking for?
You see I have no problem with this becoming more funny business, completely fine. Gaining confidence, perfect. You will not see me say a bad thing about it. Really that's all you need, not all the extra garbage that gets added on top.
I use that cocky and funny thing as an example, people say be cocky and funny that's what the girl wants. Yes some girls will want that. Others won't , and unless you are prepared to become that person, I don't think there is a point to this beyond looking to hook up. But even if you are just looking to hook up this is unnecessary.
On November 03 2011 00:44 Egyptian_Head wrote:I have a question. Why not just be yourself? Most people are quiet interesting once you get to know them, that will include most of you. Surely you should learn how to show what makes you interesting and different not just put on an act. The act might be easier but what good is it? You are going to have to stop acting at some point. And yeah being nice is not a personality, that is pretty much suppressing anything that could be called a personality. Just say whatever you want to say and if you click with the girl awesome, if you don't it wasn't going to go anywhere past sex anyway and there are only so many ways to have sex before it gets old.
"Be yourself" is obviously redundant and useless advice. People already are themselves, and if that works for them, they wouldn't go looking for advice with women.
It's also not about 'acting'. It's about changing who you are so that you adopt more attractive traits. For example, if you're not a funny guy, but you take improv comedy classes and learn how to be funny, does that mean you're not being yourself? Wouldn't it be more reasonable to say that you have instead become funny?
On November 03 2011 00:44 Egyptian_Head wrote:From what I can see the main benefit of this kind of thing is it encourages you to try, which is good. Getting the confidence to approach people is great, if you are having fun doing this that is amazing for you. But if you are just going to be "cocky and funny" (or whatever it is meant to be) that may be great if you are just looking for a lay, but that cannot be the best way to go if you want anything more than just in the now.
How can being a confident, funny guy possibly hurt you regardless of what you're looking for?
You see I have no problem with this becoming more funny business, completely fine. Gaining confidence, perfect. You will not see me say a bad thing about it. Really that's all you need, not all the extra garbage that gets added on top.
I use that cocky and funny thing as an example, people say be cocky and funny that's what the girl wants. Yes some girls will want that. Others won't , and unless you are prepared to become that person, I don't think there is a point to this beyond looking to hook up. But even if you are just looking to hook up this is unnecessary.
You are right. Cocky Funny doesn't work on everyone. If I use extreme cocky funny on an Asian girl, or a girl who already likes me, I am most likely going to get blown out because it comes across as an arrogant asshole. I will end up losing the girl.
Cocky funny is a tool, nothing else. There is a right time and place to use it and a wrong time and place to use it.
How I talk to my boss is different than how I talk to my friends. How I talk to my friends is different than how I talk to my lover and my parents and so forth. When I am at work, the way I talk to an engineer is different than the way I talk to an assembler. We communicate differently to different people. That's not changing who we are, that's simply adapting to our audience. That's a valuable skill set to have.
Acting the same way all the time to everyone the same is called being predictable and uncalibrated. Surely, you wouldn't touch a girl you just met like the way you touch a long term girlfriend. The notion of being one dimensional at all times is retarded.[
We met over some Italian food. I just acted like myself and shared my interests like a normal person. She'd been going on dates with lots of guys with way more game than me. Guys more traveled, funnier, confident, better at conversation, etc. I felt like our first date was really awkward. Didn't matter, she liked me anyway. She paid for my dinner. I don't know why she did, and I really don't care. I've never been more comfortable in a relationship.
On November 03 2011 11:03 squattincassanova wrote: Acting the same way all the time to everyone the same is called being predictable and uncalibrated. Surely, you wouldn't touch a girl you just met like the way you touch a long term girlfriend. The notion of being one dimensional at all times is retarded.
Since when did being yourself mean inappropriately touching women you just met?