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Currently the WCS season finals is played in the middle of the night from a European perspective. This means that WCS Season finals loses almost all European viewers. So I was thinking on how to solve this so that both Korea, Europe and the US can watch at a reasonable time.
Premise Korea is 7 currently 7 hours ahead of Europe (using Central European Summer time) Europe is currently 7 hours ahead of USA (using Central Standard Time). The season finale in South Korea should not be played at a time that is in the middle of the night in Korea, Europe or the US. The most important matches: quarter-finals, semi-finals and finals should be prioritized.
Solution The most important matches should be played between 9 PM to 1 AM Korean time. That would be 7 AM to 11 AM in the US, and 2 PM to 6 PM in Europe.
This is obviously not ideal, but is much better then the current solution where Europe missed the whole WCS season final.
It would be a bit ironic if WCS Europe had more viewers the WCS season final.
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since OGN is producing and this is going on TV, I doubt there can be any last minute changes. They must have considered this.
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It just seems like whoever made this timetable screwed up. WCS AM finals had half the audience of WCS EU, yet it looks like they are going to just ignore EU viewers. Come on, if GSL can be remotely watchable for EU, why it is not a case with something so grand and well thought as WCS finals + Show Spoiler +?
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You will never have matches so late in evening in Korea. I am not sure how young viewers there are, but obviously the trend is to have finals on afternoons. The reason might be age of viewers and also time schedule patterns on TV.
I think you can be darn sure that Blizz and other related agencies solved this issue a lot and came up with most suitable sollution for all business parties. Viewers from EU have to adapt..
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United States23455 Posts
Europeans will always want the times best for them.
Americans will always want the times best for them.
Koreans will always want the times best for them.
Australians will always want the times best for them.
Every region gets a season final. While the KR final will suck for EU, the EU final will suck for Americans, and the America final will suck for Koreans and so on. There is no need to change anything. Also the idea of having the matches starting at 9:00 PM in Korea is hilarious. There would literally be 3 people in the crowd.
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I have to work tomorrow (currently its thursday 2013/6/6, 9:35AM) and I'll get up at 3AM to watch... :D
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On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Koreans will always want the times best for them.
Australians will always want the times best for them.
These are almost the same thing to be honest, There is barely a time difference which is great for watching the gsl! Also does the wcs website display the timetable in your own time?
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I always just all-nighter for the GSLs that I care about. If people care, they can always go to sleep a bit earlier and wake up at 3,4,5 AM. Or whatever. The least ideal times for me are actually 7-11 AM. Europeans definitely have it best in this position, though. If anything, I'd like them to have the tournament a bit earlier, that way it isn't 5 AM. 3 AM is perfectly fine.
(American speaking)
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guys, this time around it's gonna suck for us because it's in Korea, in season 2 it's gonna suck for americans and be great for us because it's in Europe, and in season 3 it's gonna kinda suck for us and Koreans again but will be great for Americans cause it's in NA. that's just how it is.
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On June 06 2013 16:37 A Wild Sosd wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Koreans will always want the times best for them.
Australians will always want the times best for them.
These are almost the same thing to be honest, There is barely a time difference which is great for watching the gsl! Also does the wcs website display the timetable in your own time?
Yes the website does!
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All paid for and organised, no changes are going to take place now.
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On June 06 2013 16:17 MockHamill wrote: Solution The most important matches should be played between 9 PM to 1 AM Korean time. That would be 7 AM to 11 AM in the US, and 2 PM to 6 PM in Europe.
IIRC, I remember the Code-A caster mentionning the 'under-aged-rule' that means that in Korea, player below 18 are not allowed to play 'online' between midnight and 8am
Furthermore the Law of the land state:
Law No. 5309, Mar. 13, 1997.- Labor Standards Act Chapter V "Female and Minor"
Article 68 (Prohibition of Night Work)
Neither female nor minor under the age of 18 shall not be forced to work during a time period from 10 p.m. to 6 a.m. or on holidays. However, if the consent of the worker concerned and the approval of the Ministry of labor has been obtained, this shall not apply.
So GomTV would need a special approval to get many of the player to compete if the schedule was 9pm to 1am I somehow doubt they would be granted such waiver on the sole justification of making the schedule 'more convenient' for European viewer...
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I expected since GSL is always in a reasonable time for EU the same would be true for the WCS global finals, too bad it isn't. Apparently the finals are quite early for Koreans, is that to make it better for NA viewers?
guys, this time around it's gonna suck for us because it's in Korea, in season 2 it's gonna suck for americans and be great for us because it's in Europe, and in season 3 it's gonna kinda suck for us and Koreans again but will be great for Americans cause it's in NA. that's just how it is. Tbh if they do the finals (/semi-finals) in the evening, which is what I would generally expect, than season 2 will be fine for Americans, and season 3 will be also fine for Americans and suck again for Europe. What you say is only true if they do it always in the early afternoon, which quite frankly would surprise me.
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On June 06 2013 16:45 Schelim wrote: guys, this time around it's gonna suck for us because it's in Korea, in season 2 it's gonna suck for americans and be great for us because it's in Europe, and in season 3 it's gonna kinda suck for us and Koreans again but will be great for Americans cause it's in NA. that's just how it is.
I dont get why everyone say that EU is bad for NA. I suppose its sort of bad for people on the west coast but for the rest it is not a problem in my eyes. I mean if goes on a weekend, which it will, and goes between ~16:00-24:00 CET it will air between 10:00-18:00 US East coast. Again it is on a weekend day.
How is that a "horrible" time? Even if you are lazy and cannot bother to wake up before 09~10 the only thing you are going to miss is like the first group/quarterfinal or something along those line.
To touch on the topic, yes it is a bad time for EU and most likely the EU finals will have greater number than this because of it. Personally I will try to wake up early to catch the ending Saturday and Sunday. As for the ideal time zone, I think events starting in early day in EU is the best time zone for EU/NA, not for Asia though. The peak number of viewers are usually achieved around weekends ~20-01:30 CET.
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On June 06 2013 17:28 4ZakeN87 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:45 Schelim wrote: guys, this time around it's gonna suck for us because it's in Korea, in season 2 it's gonna suck for americans and be great for us because it's in Europe, and in season 3 it's gonna kinda suck for us and Koreans again but will be great for Americans cause it's in NA. that's just how it is. I dont get why everyone say that EU is bad for NA. I suppose its sort of bad for people on the west coast but for the rest it is not a problem in my eyes. I mean if goes on a weekend, which it will, and goes between ~16:00-24:00 CET it will air between 10:00-18:00 US East coast. Again it is on a weekend day. How is that a "horrible" time? Even if you are lazy and cannot bother to wake up before 09~10 the only thing you are going to miss is like the first group/quarterfinal or something along those line. To touch on the topic, yes it is a bad time for EU and most likely the EU finals will have greater number than this because of it. Personally I will try to wake up early to catch the ending Saturday and Sunday. As for the ideal time zone, I think events starting in early day in EU is the best time zone for EU/NA, not for Asia though. The peak number of viewers are usually achieved around weekends ~20-01:30 CET. i guess that's subjective. i don't usually sit at home on a weekend day unless i have something important to do for uni. or if i'm hungover i guess
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For NA, regular GSL starts at 2am PT or 5am ET. EU can live with one event being in the middle of the night...
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bullshit making a final where the region with double amount of viewers then US had cant watch ... whats that shit ? how can blizzard allow OGN doing that ?
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On June 06 2013 17:28 4ZakeN87 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:45 Schelim wrote: guys, this time around it's gonna suck for us because it's in Korea, in season 2 it's gonna suck for americans and be great for us because it's in Europe, and in season 3 it's gonna kinda suck for us and Koreans again but will be great for Americans cause it's in NA. that's just how it is. I dont get why everyone say that EU is bad for NA. I suppose its sort of bad for people on the west coast but for the rest it is not a problem in my eyes. I mean if goes on a weekend, which it will, and goes between ~16:00-24:00 CET it will air between 10:00-18:00 US East coast. Again it is on a weekend day. How is that a "horrible" time? Even if you are lazy and cannot bother to wake up before 09~10 the only thing you are going to miss is like the first group/quarterfinal or something along those line. To touch on the topic, yes it is a bad time for EU and most likely the EU finals will have greater number than this because of it. Personally I will try to wake up early to catch the ending Saturday and Sunday. As for the ideal time zone, I think events starting in early day in EU is the best time zone for EU/NA, not for Asia though. The peak number of viewers are usually achieved around weekends ~20-01:30 CET.
its starting 10am in korea and tahts 3am in europe, dont know whats night for you but 3am is for me
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opterown
Australia54649 Posts
On June 06 2013 18:09 CoR wrote: bullshit making a final where the region with double amount of viewers then US had cant watch ... whats that shit ? how can blizzard allow OGN doing that ? and exactly how else are you going to schedule a day with four dual tournament BO3 groups? lol think about the logistics
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On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Every region gets a season final. While the KR final will suck for EU, the EU final will suck for Americans, and the America final will suck for Koreans and so on. There is no need to change anything. Also the idea of having the matches starting at 9:00 PM in Korea is hilarious. There would literally be 3 people in the crowd.
Wrong. European events are in pretty good times for Americans. Dreamhack finals rounds are even a lot better times for Americans than Europeans.
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On June 06 2013 18:18 Relaaja wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Every region gets a season final. While the KR final will suck for EU, the EU final will suck for Americans, and the America final will suck for Koreans and so on. There is no need to change anything. Also the idea of having the matches starting at 9:00 PM in Korea is hilarious. There would literally be 3 people in the crowd. Wrong. European events are in pretty good times for Americans. Dreamhack finals rounds are even a lot better times for Americans than Europeans.
So would be korean finals, if they end at 11 PM KST
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On June 06 2013 16:37 A Wild Sosd wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Koreans will always want the times best for them.
Australians will always want the times best for them.
These are almost the same thing to be honest, There is barely a time difference which is great for watching the gsl! Also does the wcs website display the timetable in your own time?
A bit different I think? Most of us here are on the way home from work while GSL is on.
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On June 06 2013 17:55 Schelim wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 17:28 4ZakeN87 wrote:On June 06 2013 16:45 Schelim wrote: guys, this time around it's gonna suck for us because it's in Korea, in season 2 it's gonna suck for americans and be great for us because it's in Europe, and in season 3 it's gonna kinda suck for us and Koreans again but will be great for Americans cause it's in NA. that's just how it is. I dont get why everyone say that EU is bad for NA. I suppose its sort of bad for people on the west coast but for the rest it is not a problem in my eyes. I mean if goes on a weekend, which it will, and goes between ~16:00-24:00 CET it will air between 10:00-18:00 US East coast. Again it is on a weekend day. How is that a "horrible" time? Even if you are lazy and cannot bother to wake up before 09~10 the only thing you are going to miss is like the first group/quarterfinal or something along those line. To touch on the topic, yes it is a bad time for EU and most likely the EU finals will have greater number than this because of it. Personally I will try to wake up early to catch the ending Saturday and Sunday. As for the ideal time zone, I think events starting in early day in EU is the best time zone for EU/NA, not for Asia though. The peak number of viewers are usually achieved around weekends ~20-01:30 CET. i guess that's subjective. i don't usually sit at home on a weekend day unless i have something important to do for uni. or if i'm hungover i guess
So you don't actually have a problem with timezones, only with your personal priorities?
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I think the time fucking ridiculous for us, but I understand it. They have to play 4 Groups tomorrow, so they have to start early.
For NA, regular GSL starts at 2am PT or 5am ET. EU can live with one event being in the middle of the night...
1100 isn't that much better.
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Seeing that Europe and Korea usually get the most viewers, I'm kind of surprised about how bad the time is for Europe. Starting at 2AM going up until maybe 10AM. We're going to miss out on Both the Winner and runner-up of WCS EU (along with TLO)... The second set of matches is just about OK for time..
The final is 6AM though. For GSL that was 7AM...
This is all UK times btw.
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I guess I'll be staying up all night.
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On June 06 2013 18:18 Relaaja wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Every region gets a season final. While the KR final will suck for EU, the EU final will suck for Americans, and the America final will suck for Koreans and so on. There is no need to change anything. Also the idea of having the matches starting at 9:00 PM in Korea is hilarious. There would literally be 3 people in the crowd. Wrong. European events are in pretty good times for Americans. Dreamhack finals rounds are even a lot better times for Americans than Europeans. Yeah it's gonna be bad for korea. At what KST does it start. Because GSL and Proleague are pretty watcheble most of the time.
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I'm 33. I can't stay up all night anymore unfortunately, for many reasons. WCS can go suck it.
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opterown
Australia54649 Posts
On June 06 2013 18:33 Sjokola wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 18:18 Relaaja wrote:On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Every region gets a season final. While the KR final will suck for EU, the EU final will suck for Americans, and the America final will suck for Koreans and so on. There is no need to change anything. Also the idea of having the matches starting at 9:00 PM in Korea is hilarious. There would literally be 3 people in the crowd. Wrong. European events are in pretty good times for Americans. Dreamhack finals rounds are even a lot better times for Americans than Europeans. Yeah it's gonna be bad for korea. At what KST does it start. Because GSL and Proleague are pretty watcheble most of the time. the first few rounds of dreamhack are okay for korea, but the second half of each day is past midnight
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While the situation is marginally better here than in most of the rest of Europe (not that I question the need for the finals to happen at these times) I think I'll just subscribe, avoid TL and Twitter like the plague, and catch the VODs the morning after (assuming they're available that soon, I've not subscribed to a Twitch channel before).
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Event organizers have to cater to the live audience to. You can't just do an event in the middle of the night because then nobody will show up. Besides every region will have their finals so everybody can watch at a good time at least once.
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The times for WCS are perfect for me, the whole schedule is perfect. =)
So much whining about time zones, shit happens, you'll likely live. Most EU tournaments are pretty awful for me but I rarely complain unless the times are worse than normal.
On June 06 2013 18:18 Relaaja wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Every region gets a season final. While the KR final will suck for EU, the EU final will suck for Americans, and the America final will suck for Koreans and so on. There is no need to change anything. Also the idea of having the matches starting at 9:00 PM in Korea is hilarious. There would literally be 3 people in the crowd. Wrong. European events are in pretty good times for Americans. Dreamhack finals rounds are even a lot better times for Americans than Europeans.
Oh so you have experience watching multiple EU tournaments from America and EU? lol, so funny.
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On June 06 2013 18:46 Hall0wed wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 18:18 Relaaja wrote:On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Every region gets a season final. While the KR final will suck for EU, the EU final will suck for Americans, and the America final will suck for Koreans and so on. There is no need to change anything. Also the idea of having the matches starting at 9:00 PM in Korea is hilarious. There would literally be 3 people in the crowd. Wrong. European events are in pretty good times for Americans. Dreamhack finals rounds are even a lot better times for Americans than Europeans. Oh so you have experience watching multiple EU tournaments from America and EU? lol, so funny. Euhm, you do know here in the EU we can do basic math? It really isn't hard to calculate the time at which the rounds are for other people.
So much whining about time zones, shit happens, you'll likely live. Most EU tournaments are pretty awful for me but I rarely complain unless the times are worse than normal. And that is exactly the point, the times are worse than normal, and I guess it is to make the NA crowd happy. Most EU tournaments have the last rounds in afternoon for America, and earlier rounds in the morning. Sure you might miss the first few, but most will be in the morning/afternoon.
The same is true for EU if Korea plays at a more regular time. However they play really early now, so only the last round will be watchable, and even that one will be very early in the morning. That WCS America, and the finals when they are hosted there, is pretty much unwatchable makes sense, with 3 time zones you cannot always have it good for you. But both America and Korea unwatchable if they use a normal schedule for America is a bit stupid.
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So is it at 9pm east or not?
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United States23455 Posts
On June 06 2013 18:53 Sissors wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 18:46 Hall0wed wrote:On June 06 2013 18:18 Relaaja wrote:On June 06 2013 16:34 Fionn wrote: Every region gets a season final. While the KR final will suck for EU, the EU final will suck for Americans, and the America final will suck for Koreans and so on. There is no need to change anything. Also the idea of having the matches starting at 9:00 PM in Korea is hilarious. There would literally be 3 people in the crowd. Wrong. European events are in pretty good times for Americans. Dreamhack finals rounds are even a lot better times for Americans than Europeans. Oh so you have experience watching multiple EU tournaments from America and EU? lol, so funny. Euhm, you do know here in the EU we can do basic math? It really isn't hard to calculate the time at which the rounds are for other people. Show nested quote +So much whining about time zones, shit happens, you'll likely live. Most EU tournaments are pretty awful for me but I rarely complain unless the times are worse than normal. And that is exactly the point, the times are worse than normal, and I guess it is to make the NA crowd happy. Most EU tournaments have the last rounds in afternoon for America, and earlier rounds in the morning. Sure you might miss the first few, but most will be in the morning/afternoon. The same is true for EU if Korea plays at a more regular time. However they play really early now, so only the last round will be watchable, and even that one will be very early in the morning.
...The times are different than usual because they have to do four groups on day one, two groups on day two, and then semis/finals on day three. The finals are scheduled for around the time usual Code S finals scheduled for. The complaining is so ridiculous.
I live on the west coast of the USA and have covered the GSL for two years. The average start time has been 2:00 AM to 5:00 AM+ every weekday. Timezones fucking suck, but I don't go off making threads complaining that they should cater to their American audience because they care more about the Korean audience.
No time is going to be perfect for everyone, so discussing it is just silly.
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On June 06 2013 16:17 MockHamill wrote: Premise Korea is 7 currently 7 hours ahead of Europe (using Central European Summer time) Europe is currently 7 hours ahead of USA (using Central Standard Time). The season finale in South Korea should not be played at a time that is in the middle of the night in Korea, Europe or the US. The most important matches: quarter-finals, semi-finals and finals should be prioritized.
Solution The most important matches should be played between 9 PM to 1 AM Korean time. That would be 7 AM to 11 AM in the US, and 2 PM to 6 PM in Europe.
What you suggest is, quite literally, the middle of the night in Korea. Well done on that.
It makes perfect sense for matches in Korea to be played at a time which is convenient for Korea. Yeah, it's not great for EU, but EU matches are freaking terrible for Asia. It's just the way it works.
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On June 06 2013 18:22 Zheryn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 17:55 Schelim wrote:On June 06 2013 17:28 4ZakeN87 wrote:On June 06 2013 16:45 Schelim wrote: guys, this time around it's gonna suck for us because it's in Korea, in season 2 it's gonna suck for americans and be great for us because it's in Europe, and in season 3 it's gonna kinda suck for us and Koreans again but will be great for Americans cause it's in NA. that's just how it is. I dont get why everyone say that EU is bad for NA. I suppose its sort of bad for people on the west coast but for the rest it is not a problem in my eyes. I mean if goes on a weekend, which it will, and goes between ~16:00-24:00 CET it will air between 10:00-18:00 US East coast. Again it is on a weekend day. How is that a "horrible" time? Even if you are lazy and cannot bother to wake up before 09~10 the only thing you are going to miss is like the first group/quarterfinal or something along those line. To touch on the topic, yes it is a bad time for EU and most likely the EU finals will have greater number than this because of it. Personally I will try to wake up early to catch the ending Saturday and Sunday. As for the ideal time zone, I think events starting in early day in EU is the best time zone for EU/NA, not for Asia though. The peak number of viewers are usually achieved around weekends ~20-01:30 CET. i guess that's subjective. i don't usually sit at home on a weekend day unless i have something important to do for uni. or if i'm hungover i guess So you don't actually have a problem with timezones, only with your personal priorities? i don't have a problem with anything, i explained earlier why this was to be expected and is not actually a problem. there's gonna be one season finals that will be at good times for each region. and i'm not sure it's a problem with my priorities if i'd rather go to work or socialize rather than sit in front of my computer to watch a video game all day (i love sc2 though, don't get me wrong).
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On June 06 2013 19:01 Belisarius wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:17 MockHamill wrote: The season finale in South Korea should not be played at a time that is in the middle of the night in Korea, Europe or the US. The most important matches: quarter-finals, semi-finals and finals should be prioritized. [...] The most important matches should be played between 9 PM to 1 AM Korean time. That would be 7 AM to 11 AM in the US, and 2 PM to 6 PM in Europe. What you suggest is, quite literally, the middle of the night in Korea. Well done on that. It makes perfect sense for matches in Korea to be played at a time which is convenient for Korea. Yeah, it's not great for EU, but EU matches are freaking terrible for Asia. It's just the way it works. I think this has more to do with convenient timing for AM than for Korea. If the finals would be for example with the schedule a DH uses (or even a bit earlier) it would be fine for europe, but bad for AM. Then Europe would be fine for AM, but bad for Korea, and AM would be fine for Korea, but bad for Europe. Sounds fair to me, you always have timezone issues. But this makes both Korea and AM finals bad for europe.
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On June 06 2013 19:01 Belisarius wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2013 16:17 MockHamill wrote: Premise Korea is 7 currently 7 hours ahead of Europe (using Central European Summer time) Europe is currently 7 hours ahead of USA (using Central Standard Time). The season finale in South Korea should not be played at a time that is in the middle of the night in Korea, Europe or the US. The most important matches: quarter-finals, semi-finals and finals should be prioritized.
Solution The most important matches should be played between 9 PM to 1 AM Korean time. That would be 7 AM to 11 AM in the US, and 2 PM to 6 PM in Europe. What you suggest is, quite literally, the middle of the night in Korea. Well done on that. It makes perfect sense for matches in Korea to be played at a time which is convenient for Korea. Yeah, it's not great for EU, but EU matches are freaking terrible for Asia. It's just the way it works.
In Finland DH finals usually ends at 1-2 am. Once it went to 3 am... (Sweden is -1)
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I don't think that Koreans want to play or watch the games at midnight...
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Canada16217 Posts
On June 06 2013 16:17 MockHamill wrote: Currently the WCS season finals is played in the middle of the night from a European perspective. This means that WCS Season finals loses almost all European viewers. So I was thinking on how to solve this so that both Korea, Europe and the US can watch at a reasonable time.
Premise Korea is 7 currently 7 hours ahead of Europe (using Central European Summer time) Europe is currently 7 hours ahead of USA (using Central Standard Time). The season finale in South Korea should not be played at a time that is in the middle of the night in Korea, Europe or the US. The most important matches: quarter-finals, semi-finals and finals should be prioritized.
Solution The most important matches should be played between 9 PM to 1 AM Korean time. That would be 7 AM to 11 AM in the US, and 2 PM to 6 PM in Europe.
This is obviously not ideal, but is much better then the current solution where Europe missed the whole WCS season final.
It would be a bit ironic if WCS Europe had more viewers the WCS season final. There would hardly be anyone in the actual audience if it was that late. there is no getting around time zones every region has to deal with it and that's not going to change.
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On June 06 2013 17:58 phuzi0n wrote: For NA, regular GSL starts at 2am PT or 5am ET. EU can live with one event being in the middle of the night... This. That 2am bullshit with no more rebroadcast is the main reason I have never paid for a GSL ticket.
To the TC, 9PM-1AM is still the middle of the night. Players and people who are at the event wont want stay at those times, and the players can't play the best at those times. They're always going to prioritize the Players and the Live Audience in these cases, because honestly, that is what is most important.
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so this is why they won't include wcs in the year-ticket they want money for VODs,,
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GSL Finals are the best time for us in the forgotten land of Australia. \o/ Never get to watch a lot of EU/NA tournaments :'(
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They could restream at decent hours, can't they ?
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How bloody hard is it to understand this event is held in KOREA? You can`t honestly expect them to play ridiculous times just to cater to EU.
Guess what? this is pretty much what people from NA on the east coast have to deal with every single GSL. Please be realistic for once, you cannot have everything. You will have your turn the next seasons.
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United States32499 Posts
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