Here is the link to the youtube Channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLRD0vAAv6XrV_oXuhAs0bQ/videos
and here is the link to where he does live streams
http://www.livestar.co.kr/play/93051
Have a nice day.
Forum Index > Closed |
MymSlorm
Chile187 Posts
Here is the link to the youtube Channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLRD0vAAv6XrV_oXuhAs0bQ/videos and here is the link to where he does live streams http://www.livestar.co.kr/play/93051 Have a nice day. | ||
noobcake_
29 Posts
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GTR
51132 Posts
edit: lol just realised it was a 6 month old bump. | ||
noobcake_
29 Posts
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noobcake_
29 Posts
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onlystar
United States971 Posts
these days burrow is often used to avoid mass drone massacre from vessels.. | ||
Letmelose
Korea (South)3227 Posts
On August 20 2018 08:15 onlystar wrote: i don't think this was a move he invented.? (but maybe someone with more insight about this can elaborate) these days burrow is often used to avoid mass drone massacre from vessels.. I don't know who invented the move, but it was utilized way before sAviOr made his professional debut, such as JinNam using the move to minimize the harass from BoxeR, who loved using the eraser move to eradicate the enemy drone count. Tournaments broadcasted by iTV (one of the four domestic television stations that used broadcast professional Brood War) have most of its records gone, so I couldn't find the VOD, but the write up for the game (in one of the Korean Brood War sites) clearly explains how JinNam burrowed his drones in response to BoxeR's eraser move. sAviOr was a gifted player blessed with a sharp mind, but people tend to magnify the significance of his moves because of his past examples of sheer genius, not necessarily because the move itself was total genius. He's one of the players where the idea of the said player overshadows the actual player himself. | ||
[AS]Rattus
422 Posts
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RWLabs
Korea (South)273 Posts
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Li_Xin
45 Posts
On August 20 2018 07:13 noobcake_ wrote: As much as I love JD, Saviour was a God of a player. I remember in late game zvt, he would burrow all his drones to avoid science vessel irradiate. Pure genius. It would force the vessels to irradiate one drone at a time 1. You spelled his name wrong. 2. Burrowing drones to avoid irradiate is basic and has always been. That's like saying burrowing lurkers so they can attack is pure genius. 3. JD is much more impressive than sAviOr in several ways. (More Starleague titles & single-handedly carrying Hwaseung Oz on his back for many years, and above all else he wasn't a greedy piece of shit that went around begging people to throw matches for cash.) Honestly, I was a big fan of sAviOr back in the days. He was an especially great player in 2006, I agree... but if burrowing drones to avoid irradiated science vessels is what comes to mind when you think of how skilled sAviOr was, then something is seriously wrong. | ||
jimminy_kriket
Canada5466 Posts
On August 20 2018 06:48 GTR wrote: over/under how many posts debating the ethics of savior streaming seeping in to this thread? edit: lol just realised it was a 6 month old bump. On August 20 2018 10:11 [AS]Rattus wrote: sAviOr (motherfucker) On August 20 2018 11:04 RWLabs wrote: If Savior played LoL, few people would care. But for him to who cripple Starcraft for his gain, and then stream it a few years later? What a massive turd. So it begins | ||
reincremate
China2208 Posts
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noobcake_
29 Posts
On August 20 2018 11:30 Li_Xin wrote: Show nested quote + On August 20 2018 07:13 noobcake_ wrote: As much as I love JD, Saviour was a God of a player. I remember in late game zvt, he would burrow all his drones to avoid science vessel irradiate. Pure genius. It would force the vessels to irradiate one drone at a time 1. You spelled his name wrong. 2. Burrowing drones to avoid irradiate is basic and has always been. That's like saying burrowing lurkers so they can attack is pure genius. 3. JD is much more impressive than sAviOr in several ways. (More Starleague titles & single-handedly carrying Hwaseung Oz on his back for many years, and above all else he wasn't a greedy piece of shit that went around begging people to throw matches for cash.) Honestly, I was a big fan of sAviOr back in the days. He was an especially great player in 2006, I agree... but if burrowing drones to avoid irradiated science vessels is what comes to mind when you think of how skilled sAviOr was, then something is seriously wrong. seriously man, get off your high horse. I never said he invented the move. I watched every ASL and KSL game and i haven't seen anyone mass burrow drones to avoid vessels. It might be a fundamental move but the fact is, most progamer zergs of today don't utilise it. My point was how attentive he was. He would be in the middle of a big attack yet still mindful to burrow all his workers. I guess I shouldn't have used the word genius. But his attentiveness with it was pretty dam good. He was genius how he never got irradiated due to being so attentive. He was so attentive with it, his drones were burrowed well before the vessel even got into position. Go check out the replays, its impressive. I disagree that burrowing all your drones while your busy doing a million other things is as simple to do as remembering to burrow your lurkers. Most of the time, your monitoring your army (where most of your lurkers will be). Burrowing drones also means less income. It's not like you want to burrow them well in advance of vessel attacks. Savior's timing was impeccable with it. I seen so many Broodwar replays and it was just a skill that stood out to me. The way he implemented it. I've rarely seen it used at pro level over the last 5 years or so. If it was so easy and fundamental like burrowing lurkers, I wonder why the pros aren't using it? And the terran pros are still to this day irridating mass vessels and hovering over mineral patches. I really like JD and i'm a big fan. But I have seen Savior's replays at his peak and never seen a zerg so busy on the map. Seen games where he does everything JD does but more. Back in those days, zerg would make a good 30 to 40 sunks sometimes. But on those maps he was still maxing his armies in very efficient time. | ||
Letmelose
Korea (South)3227 Posts
On August 20 2018 16:18 noobcake_ wrote: Show nested quote + On August 20 2018 11:30 Li_Xin wrote: On August 20 2018 07:13 noobcake_ wrote: As much as I love JD, Saviour was a God of a player. I remember in late game zvt, he would burrow all his drones to avoid science vessel irradiate. Pure genius. It would force the vessels to irradiate one drone at a time 1. You spelled his name wrong. 2. Burrowing drones to avoid irradiate is basic and has always been. That's like saying burrowing lurkers so they can attack is pure genius. 3. JD is much more impressive than sAviOr in several ways. (More Starleague titles & single-handedly carrying Hwaseung Oz on his back for many years, and above all else he wasn't a greedy piece of shit that went around begging people to throw matches for cash.) Honestly, I was a big fan of sAviOr back in the days. He was an especially great player in 2006, I agree... but if burrowing drones to avoid irradiated science vessels is what comes to mind when you think of how skilled sAviOr was, then something is seriously wrong. seriously man, get off your high horse. I never said he invented the move. I watched every ASL and KSL game and i haven't seen anyone mass burrow drones to avoid vessels. It might be a fundamental move but the fact is, most pro zergs of today don't utilise it. My point was how attentive he was. He would be in the middle of a big attack yet still mindful to burrow all his workers. I guess I shouldn't have used the word genius. But his attentiveness with it was pretty dam good. He was genius how he never got irradiated due to being so attentive. He was so attentive with it, his drones were burrowed well before the vessel even got into position. Go check out the replays, its impressive. I disagree that burrowing all your drones while your busy doing a million other things is as simple to do as remembering to burrow your lurkers. Most of the time, your monitoring your army (where most of your lurkers will be). Burrowing drones also means less income. It's not like you want to burrow them well in advance of vessel attacks. Savior's timing was impeccable with it. I seen so many Broodwar replays and it was just a skill that stood out to me. The way he implemented it. I've rarely seen it used at pro level over the last 5 years or so. If it was so easy and fundamental like burrowing lurkers, I wonder why the pros aren't using it? And the terran pros are still to this day irridating mass vessels and hovering over mineral patches. I really like JD and i'm a big fan. But I have seen Savior's replays at his peak and never seen a zerg so busy on the map. Seen games where he does everything JD does but more. Back in those days, zerg would make a good 30 to 40 sunks sometimes. But on those maps he was still maxing his armies in very efficient time. Nobody here is questioning sAviOr's genius during his prime. He was a totally different type of gamer to Jaedong, and probably would have fared decently well even to this date if Brood War was a turn-based strategy game. Alas, it isn't, and sAviOr has been getting butt-fucked by mechanically superior players for over a decade now. The problem arises when you ruin his actual moments of past genius by pretending that he still is rocking it, when in actuality all he is doing is lowering the level of his opponents to preserve his vintage playstyle. What made his genius special was not the novelty value (doing random shit on the off-chance that it works does not make you a genius), but the application value of his unique approach to the game for the other players. If doing unorthodox moves versus low level competition is genius, I'm sure there are thousands of amateur players out there doing "genius" moves that isn't readily seen at the highest levels of competition. When iloveoov was no longer capable of competing versus the newer generation of players, he still flexed his strategical muscle as a coach by creating new build orders that the next of kin could use. That is genius. Changing the paradigm of the protoss-versus-terran match-up in 2011 by coming up with the basic concepts of the 21 nexus build shows that. What you are currently describing is sAviOr rehashing already known concepts (that has its strategical purpose) versus vastly inferior players, that has basically zero competitive value to other zerg players. They already know this concept (even if they don't use it). sAviOr isn't doing anything novel, or providing anything worthwhile to other zergs who are superior to him in terms of skill. What exactly is genius about it? | ||
noobcake_
29 Posts
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Letmelose
Korea (South)3227 Posts
On August 21 2018 01:10 noobcake_ wrote: I was having a nostaglic moment condensed into one sentence. Then look at these lengthy replies trying to pick my one sentance apart . Also, I never said he was still rocking it. How could he be, given his life ban. His play style wasn't really all that vintage, but yeah of course the meta does shift.Go watch his replays from the around 2008ish. The games look fairly similar to JD of today. Only big noticeable difference were that he used more sunks and often burrowed his drones. The JD of today rarely does either of those. Today's muta harass is probably a bit better as well but not by a significant margin. But I wasn't trying to compare players across eras because you can't really but I can judge them within their respective eras, I would give Savior the slight edge over JD. JD is a great player and I pretty much want him to win every game he plays. He's just very solid. But Savior just had this really quirky edge to him that seemed to really stand out within the era he played in. And that quirkiness wasn't at the expense of APM, macro and micro. His APM and macro wasn't incredible but it was pretty good given the quirkiness of his play. Nostalgia is fine. Delusional thinking is not. sAviOr became mediocre as a professional far before his involvement within match-fixing. He had a domestic record of 15-28 (34.88%) against the terran race in 2008, and spent more time losing than winning within the ProLeague, and was busy getting knocked out in the earlier rounds of the individual leagues. Either you don't remember the career arc of sAviOr correctly, or you are just looking for the most random things in the depths of total mediocrity, while labelling those things falsely as pure genius. If you are interested in terrible players doing quirky things while losing, I would suggest LASL for viewing, where the most random shit can and will happen. Random quirkiness isn't in short supply, any shit player can display imagination and creativity should the stakes and level of competition be low enough. | ||
ShowTheLights
Korea (South)1654 Posts
Think about your life; you've fucked up PLENTY of times in your life. You're just some random ass nerd sitting on your computer complaining about shit on message boards. He just happened to be in the spotlight when he fucked up. MOVE ON, and forgive him, just like you moved on from your own mistakes. If you do not approve of him, that's fine. Him streaming affects your life 0%. | ||
itsdaniel
Austria326 Posts
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reincremate
China2208 Posts
On August 21 2018 08:16 ShowTheLights wrote: For me, it is simple as this: He is human. He made a mistake and apologized for it. He didnt murder anyone. He should be forgiven. Think about your life; you've fucked up PLENTY of times in your life. You're just some random ass nerd sitting on your computer complaining about shit on message boards. He just happened to be in the spotlight when he fucked up. MOVE ON, and forgive him, just like you moved on from your own mistakes. If you do not approve of him, that's fine. Him streaming affects your life 0%. If Savior, Blizzard and everyone else responsible for killing off Kespa era Brood War can bring all that back, then I can consider forgiving them. Blizzard's at least been making minor amends with the KSL, which is definitely better than nothing. What has Savior done other than continue to pathetically exploit the game whose professional scene he helped destroy? Fucker wasn't lying when he said "I will destroy everyone in 2009" and he's showed no sign of remorse since. Maybe if he donates all the proceeds from his streaming to charity (or to Brood War tournaments), then maybe he's not a total dickface, but until then I'm not sold on his "apologies". | ||
Little-Chimp
Canada948 Posts
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