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On May 30 2010 16:45 rbkl wrote: I would recommend you get an iPad - saw one for the first time the other day and it was realyl amazing. For the same price you honestly get a lot more at least with functionality.
The Kindle is about half the price as the cheapest iPad. And honestly, since when did Apple products actually cost the same as their competitors? You are pretty much always paying a premium fee for the brand.
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I have a Kindle, and like it for the following reasons:
I can read it in the sun. It works. Battery seems infinite. Kindle software syncs everywhere and can be used simultaneously. For example, My girlfriend can read on her iPhone while I use the Kindle.
Prior to that I've used a Nook and hated it. Mostly everyone in my family who has owned or tried a Nook has hated it. They have loved my kindle however.
Reasons why we hated the Nook:
It doesn't always work. Battery didn't last as long. E-Ink is slow compared to Kindle (this is a huge annoyance for anyone who can read fast. Which is probably anyone on TL.net) Touch Screen is gimmicky and unresponsive. Felt like a rushed product. (B&N admitted that it was rushed to compete with Kindle)
Having a Kindle really facilitates reading for me. Buying books is easy as pie (too easy...), and having my whole book collection (programming books) on one device is really handy. The fact that my e-books sync online is the best part. I have all my programming books on my PC for reference at work, and am able to make bookmarks that sync with the device to check up on at home.
Price wasn't really a concern for me at the time, though I did like the smaller Kindle for ease of transportation. I figured that any amount of money is worth it if I ended up reading more as a result. I did end up reading more, and thus it was worth the money.
Now. While I have, and will continue to sing praise for the Kindle. I feel that it will become a dead platform in a few years' time. The e-book market is becoming increasingly volatile, and I feel that eventually a few products will become edged out. The Nook is currently the underdog, and I fear Kindle will be next once Google and Dell's devices reach the center stage. However, that's a long time coming, and I expect all devices to exist for a good few years. So if you consider it an investment in your education you should buy whichever you like the most. You can test a Nook at a B&N, and I believe you can test a Kindle at Target soon (maybe already?). Really though, the Kindle makes reading so easy, and strangely too much fun. :D
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On May 30 2010 16:14 [ur]Chin wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2010 16:12 heyoka wrote: You have enough time to read a book, but the 20 minutes it takes to go to the store and acquire it puts you just over the edge enough that you no longer have the time? quote for truth. make an effort.
You like calling people? Why not make the effort and go inside and use a house phone instead of the ease and convenience of a cell phone?
Same dumb argument, its the age of information. Technology is imminent. Same reason why barnes+noble is going out of business.
I would get what i have(8 gig itouch for sub 200). not only can you read books, but have music and apps.
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I think e-readers are great but please don't get a Kindle. It's a decent e-reader from what I have seen, not great but decent, but the biggest problem with the Kindle is that it can only handle books you buy from Amazon (at least that used to be the case when I looked into buying an e-reader).
So with buying a Kindle you are basically committing yourself to a Amazon monopoly with regards to what books you can and can't read. Also the books you buy, you are not buying at all but renting them because Amazon still keeps full control over the books and can do whatever they want with them.
ps. please don't listen to everybody suggesting you buy an iPad. The iPad isn't made for reading. It uses a normal screen and not e-ink. This renders it useless in a lot of situations.
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On May 30 2010 18:36 Phunkapotamus wrote: I have a Kindle, and like it for the following reasons:
I can read it in the sun. It works. Battery seems infinite. Kindle software syncs everywhere and can be used simultaneously. For example, My girlfriend can read on her iPhone while I use the Kindle.
Prior to that I've used a Nook and hated it. Mostly everyone in my family who has owned or tried a Nook has hated it. They have loved my kindle however.
Reasons why we hated the Nook:
It doesn't always work. Battery didn't last as long. E-Ink is slow compared to Kindle (this is a huge annoyance for anyone who can read fast. Which is probably anyone on TL.net) Touch Screen is gimmicky and unresponsive. Felt like a rushed product. (B&N admitted that it was rushed to compete with Kindle)
Having a Kindle really facilitates reading for me. Buying books is easy as pie (too easy...), and having my whole book collection (programming books) on one device is really handy. The fact that my e-books sync online is the best part. I have all my programming books on my PC for reference at work, and am able to make bookmarks that sync with the device to check up on at home.
Price wasn't really a concern for me at the time, though I did like the smaller Kindle for ease of transportation. I figured that any amount of money is worth it if I ended up reading more as a result. I did end up reading more, and thus it was worth the money.
Now. While I have, and will continue to sing praise for the Kindle. I feel that it will become a dead platform in a few years' time. The e-book market is becoming increasingly volatile, and I feel that eventually a few products will become edged out. The Nook is currently the underdog, and I fear Kindle will be next once Google and Dell's devices reach the center stage. However, that's a long time coming, and I expect all devices to exist for a good few years. So if you consider it an investment in your education you should buy whichever you like the most. You can test a Nook at a B&N, and I believe you can test a Kindle at Target soon (maybe already?). Really though, the Kindle makes reading so easy, and strangely too much fun. :D
What version of the Nook firmware were you using? If it was before April I agree it was probably crap. The firmware updates have largely taken care of the unresponsiveness. I will mention that it doesn't do "flick" type gestures like the iPhone. I believe this is purposeful; you wouldn't want to accidentally navigate somewhere on the touchscreen if you brushed it accidentally. That would be annoying. In terms of the e-ink speed I don't know why you would think this b/c both Amazon and BN use Vizplex e-ink.
BN never admitted it rushed the product to compete with the Kindle. Please post a link to a company statement in this regard. When it is was first released it was definitely rushed (the software was buggy) but I don't think the timing had anything to do with the Kindle. Amazon's price cutting response (they lowered the Kindle price like $50 instantly) is evidence of this. We've speculated endlessly at our store why the company released the Nook like it did and we have no clear answer. The most reasonable line of thinking is that it was an attempt to try and bump Q4 sales from Nook pre-sales (it was announced during the Holiday shopping season but wouldn't actually ship until mid Dec to January).
The battery life for both devices is comparable and largely depends on how much actual reading you do. I believe both devices use lithium polymer batteries. If you set the Nook touchscreen to be on all the time and play music constantly this will obviously drain the battery faster. For normal usage the Nook is rated at ~10 hours, I'm not sure what the Kindle is rated at b/c they don't advertise an hourly figure (i.e. rated for 4 days? what does that mean?).
Finally the Nook is not the "underdog." It only took 2 & 1/2 months before Nook sales exceeded Kindle sales. Link. Granted Amazon doesn't release sales figures on the Kindle (mostly they've never needed to before b/c there was no competition, but their lack of response is telling) but the evidence the analysts are using is # of device shipped which is a common metric for electronic sales comparisons when actual sales numbers are unknown. Also, the Nook is retailed from two physical locations, Barnes and Noble and Best Buy. This is definitely a shoe-in for any potential customer.
E-readers are awesome, if you have the luxury money you should get one. Once you've used it you'll have a hard time going back to a regular book.
EDIT: clarity, style
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how timely when i have decided to buy a nook.
the reasons for me buying were 1. running out of physical space. i live in a small apartment and the books cramp up my space i know a library looks nice and cool but i just hate moving around with all those books ( i finish a book on average 1 per 1.5 weeks. 2. i live in singapore and books are damn expensive. the savings i'll get with buying ebooks are a lot and i calculated that the nook will buy itself after 20-23 books. 3. amazon's quite strict with international purchases and sadly they don't sell the kindle in sg. (need a us address and credit card to buy books for the kindle)
if you really are into reading then i don't think its a hard decision. i do love the smell and feel of a book but it's just illogical for me when i think of the benefits.
(and yes i tried both prior to buying)
or give this a shot www.koboereader.com/
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On May 30 2010 19:00 Golden Ghost wrote: I think e-readers are great but please don't get a Kindle. It's a decent e-reader from what I have seen, not great but decent, but the biggest problem with the Kindle is that it can only handle books you buy from Amazon (at least that used to be the case when I looked into buying an e-reader).
So with buying a Kindle you are basically committing yourself to a Amazon monopoly with regards to what books you can and can't read. Also the books you buy, you are not buying at all but renting them because Amazon still keeps full control over the books and can do whatever they want with them.
ps. please don't listen to everybody suggesting you buy an iPad. The iPad isn't made for reading. It uses a normal screen and not e-ink. This renders it useless in a lot of situations.
Thank you! I have to convince customers everyday at our store why the iPad sucks for e-books. It's so frustrating to try and explain what seems so obvious. I think part of the problem is that there is an Apple store 200 feet from the Barnes and Noble I work at so there are lots of Apple zombies.
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On May 30 2010 19:12 eugene17 wrote:how timely when i have decided to buy a nook. the reasons for me buying were 1. running out of physical space. i live in a small apartment and the books cramp up my space i know a library looks nice and cool but i just hate moving around with all those books ( i finish a book on average 1 per 1.5 weeks. 2. i live in singapore and books are damn expensive. the savings i'll get with buying ebooks are a lot and i calculated that the nook will buy itself after 20-23 books. 3. amazon's quite strict with international purchases and sadly they don't sell the kindle in sg. (need a us address and credit card to buy books for the kindle) if you really are into reading then i don't think its a hard decision. i do love the smell and feel of a book but it's just illogical for me when i think of the benefits. (and yes i tried both prior to buying) or give this a shot www.koboereader.com/
You will run into a similar problem buying books for the Nook. The Nook ebooks don't have the DRM that Kindle books have but you can't buy ebooks from BN.com directly from a non-US IP address. Here is how to get around this:
1) Use another ebook retailer besides BN.com. The Nook uses epub which is an open ebook format supported by other online retailers. 2) Use a proxy server located stateside or use VPN 3) Have someone buy the book in the U.S., then log into their BN account to download it to your comp and sideload it onto the Nook*
You can do some googling yourself for more details on 1-3.
*I can't personally verify this one works but I think the IP checking is only for making purchases; I read about this technique on a nook enthusiast forum
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United States22883 Posts
On May 30 2010 16:26 Comeh wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2010 16:16 BroOd wrote: e-readers are fine for magazines and newspapers, but I don't like the for books at all. This. There is some aesthetic experience in reading actual books that is lost when transferred to the electronic screen. It's tough to explain my reasoning, but actual books are an experience in themselves, not JUST words written on a page. Also, you can just go to the library to get a book. You still have to pay for books with a Kindle. eInk is "quiet" and sort of nice. That said, there's no way in hell I'd buy a Kindle right now. They have to do a revamp soon since Apple just decimated them, and there's other readers like the Sony or B&N ones that give you access to ePub books. Also, the next generation of eReaders should be much better than the current.
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The Kindle is a good device, however is not the best.
If you need to read PDFs that are 99.9% in A4 format, you will need to go to the irex DR1000S.
If you only want the device to read novels and not technical things, the Kindle will do a great job.
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On May 30 2010 19:38 space_yes wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2010 19:12 eugene17 wrote:how timely when i have decided to buy a nook. the reasons for me buying were 1. running out of physical space. i live in a small apartment and the books cramp up my space i know a library looks nice and cool but i just hate moving around with all those books ( i finish a book on average 1 per 1.5 weeks. 2. i live in singapore and books are damn expensive. the savings i'll get with buying ebooks are a lot and i calculated that the nook will buy itself after 20-23 books. 3. amazon's quite strict with international purchases and sadly they don't sell the kindle in sg. (need a us address and credit card to buy books for the kindle) if you really are into reading then i don't think its a hard decision. i do love the smell and feel of a book but it's just illogical for me when i think of the benefits. (and yes i tried both prior to buying) or give this a shot www.koboereader.com/ You will run into a similar problem buying books for the Nook. The Nook ebooks don't have the DRM that Kindle books have but you can't buy ebooks from BN.com directly from a non-US IP address. Here is how to get around this: 1) Use another ebook retailer besides BN.com. The Nook uses epub which is an open ebook format supported by other online retailers. 2) Use a proxy server located stateside or use VPN 3) Have someone buy the book in the U.S., then log into their BN account to download it to your comp and sideload it onto the Nook* You can do some googling yourself for more details on 1-3. *I can't personally verify this one works but I think the IP checking is only for making purchases; I read about this technique on a nook enthusiast forum
did my research on this as well. nothing hotspot shield can't do and bn isn't as strict with CCs. I just need a US address (thank you multinational company) and any CC. In case I run into anything now i know who to ping. thanks for the help spaceyes.
(also a colleague has a nook and i verified it with him and he loves it as he can buy online and the book will sync via wifi)
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I've put in hundreds of hours of reading on my nintendo DS. At 150$ it's very cheap for the amount of screen size you get and I can't imagine doing without it anymore. I heard that it's possible to read pdfs and things with images too, but mostly I've used it for just text or html so I don't know how well it performs with pdf books. I did convert a few pdfs to html.
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I've got this one and I can say it's pretty well worth the price. Its size and its easy readability (as well as its ridiculous battery life) make it worth buying. Keep in mind it's not backlit so you'll need some sort of light to read at night.
Also, either a kindle or a nook (I've seen but have not used the nook, so I can't offer advice on whether or not it's any good) have a ridiculously longer battery life and a more comfortable form than any product apple has made or is likely to make, so stay away from the iPad etc.
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As long as you don't buy an Ipad , Apple is pure evil
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I'm might get flamed for saying this, but if you plan on getting a Kindle you could opt to save up a some more money for an ipad. it doesn't use e-ink so there are a lot of situations that you can't really read, but weigh out your options (when you would use it) It's ebooks haven't really kicked off yet, but there's a lot of more different stuff. Just my 2 cents, but I would rather get an iPad than a Kindle, but one of the reason is because I wouldn't do any extensive reading on it (So yeah the other stuff is more appealing). If you're serious about replacing ALL of your hardcopy books with e-devices, then yeah, get a Kindle over a iPad.
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On May 30 2010 16:23 mmp wrote: If your computer is discomforting to look at this is probably on account of poor resolution, image quality, brightness, a gaudy desktop/wm theme, or something else that's straining your eyes. You can certainly adjust things for easier reading.
I think there's something inherently difficult about reading directly from the light source.
On computers, the backlight sits directly behind the screen. This produces intense light and sends it straight to the eye, which usually causes strain after longer periods. The paper on books just reflects light from its surroundings, and reflects it inefficiently. I think this might be why it's so easy on the eyes compared to white backgrounds and black text on a computer screen.
From my experience, inverting colors by turning the background black helps a lot with strain. However, it can be painful to switch between normal and inverted colors, especially since most websites and programs use their own colors.
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You can't compare the "Electronic ink" displays to a computer monitor or iPad-type device, because they are not the same. No matter what Apple's marketing machine tells you, a pixelated LCD display will cause your eyes to be fatigued after awhile. Electronic ink does not have this drawback, any more so than a real book.
That being said, I'd still rather read with a nice book in my hands. But that is just my opinion.
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Germany2896 Posts
I don't know much about current reader hardware, but I have a few points you might consider * If you read lots of pdfs you probably want a rather big display, since most pdfs are A4 and cannot be resized very well * Support for drm-free E-Pub * When buying drm-protected books there is the danger of vendor lockin since you might not be able to use your books if you buy your next reader from a different company.
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On May 30 2010 22:22 Issorlol wrote:I've got this one and I can say it's pretty well worth the price. Its size and its easy readability (as well as its ridiculous battery life) make it worth buying. Keep in mind it's not backlit so you'll need some sort of light to read at night. Also, either a kindle or a nook (I've seen but have not used the nook, so I can't offer advice on whether or not it's any good) have a ridiculously longer battery life and a more comfortable form than any product apple has made or is likely to make, so stay away from the iPad etc.
Yes, they are evil. Yes, they are proprietary. Yes, they have sick margins on their products.
But form/UI/battery life are not the main issues with Apple:s products.
Regarding chosing iPad or e-book reader
It comes down to: 1. If you want a device optimized for reading or price is a priority then the clear choice is the Kindle. 2. If you want a device that does a lot of things well, including reading, then the iPad is the clear choice.
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+ Show Spoiler +On May 30 2010 17:35 space_yes wrote: Kindle: no wifi, you can't replace the battery yourself (you have to send it back to Amazon), ugly, a keyboard on the bottom you'll never use, DRM ebooks Amazon might delete if they get into a pricing dispute with the publisher (i.e. MacMillan).
Nook: touchscreen, wi-fi, you can replace the battery yourself, looks cooler, better accessories. You can also root it to access the Android OS but there's not a lot of third party apps that utilize this yet but if you can code then you add functionality yourself. The only disadvantage is that your side buttons might crack if you abuse them too much however this doesn't impact the functionality of the device at all.
Both support PDFs, both have relatively similar content offerings, screen sizes, dimensions, and are price competitive in terms of ebooks.
FYI: I work at Barnes and Noble. I'm not a shameless hack though, I actually hated the Nook when it first came out b/c the firmware was so bad I refused to sell it to people. Thankfully the company has updated it several times and its significantly better. At the store I work at we've sold many Nooks to customers who own Kindles. Their biggest comment is that the Nook "feels faster" b/c you use the touch screen to navigate your device settings etc. whereas all device manipulation on the Kindle occurs through the e-ink screen.
My advice: if you get the Nook don't abuse the buttons (press the too hard on the very edges). On one of our store demo units the bezel cracked from this. Also you can use the touchscreen to turn pages. If this concerns you get the extended warranty. The Kindle is really an awful device I would never buy one. The nook is mediocre to good but not amazing however it is definitely better than the Kindle.
Don't get the Sony, ridiculously smudgy screen and poor content offerings. Don't get the iPad for reading b/c you can't use it in direct light i.e. outside. At the Apple Store near the BN I work at they actually turn the lights off above the iPads b/c of this. The lightning environment can also impact the iPad's viewing angles and how it picks up reflections. Experiment: go use your iPhone on a sunny day outside to see what I mean. Sure you can use it but it would really suck for reading.
I have personally used the Kindle, Nook, Sony e-reader, and the iPad.
EDIT: one more thing, don't get an e-reader to just read PDFs. They can do it, but it is more of an additional feature. If the text isn't encoded in the PDF you can't resize it (i.e. a scanned document or a document that is basically images to prevent user copy-paste). You can zoom on the Kindle (awkward) and BN hasn't added zoom functionality to the Nook (forthcoming but probably easier with the touchscreen). I will mention though that most PDFs have the text encoded into the file so this may not be an issue for you. If you're just going to read PDFs indoors though, get a ultraportable laptop, netbook (with a newer processor), or an iPad. You'll get more functionality for your $$$ (except with the iPad lol). If you're going to be reading mostly books get the Nook.
OK, I have 500 USD, and I'm looking for an e-reader that could read DJVU format, since is the scanned advanced math book format (in my country is almost impossible to find advanced math paper-books so i had to read e-books). I had search a lot in the interwebz and I think the best choice is the Hanlin : + Show Spoiler +
However, I need an advise from the nice TL people about it, because I don't want to buy something that doesn't fit my needs for math books :D
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