Iraq & Syrian Civil Wars - Page 374
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Please guys, stay on topic. This thread is about the situation in Iraq and Syria. | ||
AssyrianKing
Australia2104 Posts
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Ayaz2810
United States2763 Posts
http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/20/politics/syria-convoy-strike-us-conclusion-russia/index.html https://www.google.com/amp/www.wsj.com/amp/articles/u-s-believes-russia-bombed-syrian-aid-convoy-1474400403?client=ms-android-hms-tmobile-us | ||
TheFish7
United States2824 Posts
If Bradgelina takes top story I might have to jump off a bridge. Do you think this was somehow retribution for the Deir ez zor incident? | ||
Ayaz2810
United States2763 Posts
On September 21 2016 09:15 TheFish7 wrote: Unless this development is put into context the whole syrian war will still feel very far away to most Americans. Right now it's just being framed as yet another bombing in Syria. Let's see what happens tomorrow when it starts to sink in who is getting bombed now. + Show Spoiler + If Bradgelina takes top story I might have to jump off a bridge. Do you think this was somehow retribution for the Deir ez zor incident? I wouldn't think so. This incident doesn't do anything to punish Americans or the coalition. This hurts the civilians, pisses off the U.N, and enters the realm of war crimes. There's nothing to be gained unless the attack at Deri ez zor really drove Assad crazy to the point that he wanted to do the only thing he knew would really piss off the offenders: harm more of his own people. I just don't know on that one. | ||
xM(Z
Romania5257 Posts
"The examination of the video footage made via drones of the movement of the humanitarian convoy in areas controlled by militants in the province of Aleppo has revealed new details. The video clearly shows how terrorists are redeploying a pickup with a large-caliber mortar on it using the convoy as a cover," Maj. Gen. Igor Konashenkov said. https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/20160920/1045521488/aleppo-un-convoy.html + Show Spoiler + | ||
iPlaY.NettleS
Australia4254 Posts
On September 20 2016 23:00 AssyrianKing wrote: God forbid the 'moderates' take over. They include parties that are no different from ISIS except for the fact that they are against ISIS because they attack Muslims as well. Same old same old. Observe this 1993 article from The Independent http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/anti-soviet-warrior-puts-his-army-on-the-road-to-peace-the-saudi-businessman-who-recruited-mujahedin-1465715.html Anti-Soviet warrior puts his army on the road to peace When the history of the Afghan resistance movement is written, Mr Bin Laden's own contribution to the mujahedin - and the indirect result of his training and assistance - may turn out to be a turning- point in the recent history of militant fundamentalism; even if, today, he tries to minimise his role. 'When the invasion of Afghanistan started, I was enraged and went there at once - I arrived within days, before the end of 1979,' he said. 'Yes, I fought there, but my fellow Muslims did much more than I. Many of them died and I am still alive.' But what of the Arab mujahedin whom he took to Afghanistan - members of a guerrilla army who were also encouraged and armed by the United States - and who were forgotten when that war was over? 'Personally neither I nor my brothers saw evidence of American help. When my mujahedin were victorious and the Russians were driven out, differences started (between the guerrilla movements) so I returned to road construction in Taif and Abha. I brought back the equipment I had used to build tunnels and roads for the mujahedin in Afghanistan. Yes, I helped some of my comrades to come here to Sudan after the war.' | ||
SK.Testie
Canada11084 Posts
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Dan HH
Romania8853 Posts
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Redox
Germany24793 Posts
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13774 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17188 Posts
On September 22 2016 23:45 LegalLord wrote: But on the aggregate, it looks like pretty much no progress has been made. I disagree. The area has shrunk. And they've lost strategic positions for being able to expand their terrain (in other words, they're on the defense instead of the offense). They are of course still in Raqq and Mosul, which are the main problems, and whatever is going on around Palmyra doesn't look good, but on the whole, they are on the back foot. | ||
RvB
Netherlands6077 Posts
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41103 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17188 Posts
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Dan HH
Romania8853 Posts
On September 23 2016 18:20 Acrofales wrote: Some context would be nice. Who is Hawar Ali? Is he a resident of Kobani, a leader of a Kurdish faction? Or a random uninformed rabble rouser? Kurdish journalist it seems, but the way I'm reading it he's not saying he knows it, but simply quoting Erdogan. Speaking at an event organized by the Turkish American Cultural Society (TACS) in New York, Erdoğan said that when he told Biden about the weapons being dropped to Kobani three days ago, Biden responded by saying that he was unaware of it. "I told him I am aware of it" Erdoğan said and continued by adding that the U.S. had done the same thing in the past and half of the weapons ended up in the hands of Daesh terrorists. http://www.dailysabah.com/politics/2016/09/22/us-vp-biden-didnt-know-about-weapons-airdropped-to-kobani-president-erdogan-says "If you think you can finish off Daesh with the YPG and PYD, you cannot, because they are terrorist groups too," Erdogan said in comments broadcast on Turkish television, using an Arabic acronym for Islamic State. "Three days ago America dropped two plane loads of weapons in Kobani for these terror groups," he said, adding he had raised the issue on Wednesday with U.S. Vice President Joe Biden who he said had no knowledge of this. http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-syria-turkey-idUSKCN11T0G4 | ||
lastpuritan
United States540 Posts
How would you, or your beloved media would cover IF Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Russia, Qatar or any other non-allied country bombed regime forces that fight ISIS? My amateur headlines: "T-t-t-t-t-u-r-k-e-y-yyy the ISIS supporter, Jihadist ErDOGan!" "Warmonging Russia!" "Dirtyscum Saudis! I'm so happy to hear Russia and Assad green-lighted Turkey to bash all those kurdish milita on the borders and secure its border from ISIS. There was a post on Reddit from someone who claims that he's a turkish official and posted only one thing then never came back. I screened his post but lost it later, he was saying Kurds will be f*cked so bad by the Turks, Assad and Russians and this region will be US free finally. All 3 countries agreed on ending US-SAUDI games. 2 years ago this was the last thing I would hope for. I always believed the fact that whatever US does is for a better world and its people safety, but again and again, no matter how much I try not to believe, this shit is obvious. There is a god damn ceasefire declared and some folks gather ( US, UK, Oz (best buddies) ) and bomb Syrian forces. And do what? You expect some manly attitude like, we bombed you Assad, suck it up! What you get? THAT WAS A MISTAKE. PLEASE FORGIVE US. And even in that statement, you read it underlines it wasn't a mistake but a deliberate action. GODS SAKE FOR WHAT? Why fueling this war? On Kurdish part: Why US is still arming kurdish milita WHO actively fights an ALLY today? If US picked Kurdish side on this fight, WHY THE HELL US OFFICIALS told media that Kurds had it coming by land-grabbing? Why US leaves them at their final fight? If Kurds were landgrabbing why US did not stop them till Turkey decided to f*ck em up? If US tried to stop them landgrabbing with warnings etc, why today STILL arming them? On Turkish part: Why US is still backing Turkish fight against PKK? Yet still saying YPG isn't a terrorist organization when everyone knows that those two are the same shit. Why FETHULLAH GULEN is still in the US, when everyone BUT everyone! except US officials believes and confess! the guy was behind the coup attempt that killed 200 and more Turks? For his rights? Really? Do you seriously care an islamist cleric's rights that much to risk losing your final strong ALLY in the region and turning its public into US haters? One god damn guy? If I was OBAMA, I would personally kill the guy and send it to Turkey. His pilots (the ones who confess that they took orders from him) tankfired civilians we have HD CAMERA recordings. HD. What would you do IF Turkey kept OSAMA and said no we dont believe he was behind all the terrorism hit US. | ||
Yoav
United States1874 Posts
The airstrike was a mistake. Retaliation on their part is understandable. If a hostile force kills some of your guys, you have a right to throw some shells at their guys. Fair enough. But don't bomb aid convoys. Don't be that guy. US is arming Kurds because honestly, they're one of the very few countries in the Middle East worthy of the name... and they don't have it yet. The Turks are not natural allies, not anymore. The racialized nationalism was always an issue, and now that its combined with strongman semi-Islamism, they're just not that close in terms of values or even strategic aims. Why we leave them? Because the opinion I've laid out above is still just an opinion. Lots of folks still think we need to back Turkey through thick and thin. Because NATO, because Muslim Democracy. Why are we still arming them? Because plenty of people agree with me that they deserve their land and their chance to try to govern. If Turkey had any real proof about Gulen, of course we'd turn him over. We'd be bound by law and custom. And honestly, we'd probably like to just to get rid of the irritant. But it's literally illegal. You can't arrest someone without evidence. Even if "everyone thinks they did it". In the US, rights trump national interest. Again and again. Strange thing about having rule of law. Obama can't kill the guy. That's not how it works in not-Russia. If Turkey had Osama, we'd have turned over proof that he did the shit. We had plenty. They have jackshit. They're probably right, but it honestly doesn't matter. You can't arrest the mafiosi without evidence. Even if it would save lives. Becaus rule of law. | ||
xM(Z
Romania5257 Posts
also, it is reported that major news outlets like BBC, CBS etc., showed an edited version of the footage in which they removed the sparks + Show Spoiler + http://www.moonofalabama.org/2016/09/syria-the-aid-convoy-attack-points-to-further-escalation-.html#comments Second, the blessing/curse of being ex-military is sounding like a nut to most of you when I bring up these minute details that I think are terribly significant. Given that, take this for what it's worth: There are several variations of the Hellfire missile fired from U.S. drones like the Predator. As evidenced by vidoes of Hellfire strikes beginning with the Iraqi war, one very popular flavor seems to be the AGM-114N variant. It contains a pretty energetic PBX-112 explosive charge surrounded by a layer of metal particles. Fine-mesh fluorinated aluminum in case you were curious. Without getting into the physics of it all, I'll just say that this design came out of research to produce a 'better' fuel-air explosive. The Metal-Augmented Charge (MAC) Hellfire AGM-114N belongs to the thermobaric category of weapons - ones designed to kill/destroy by an extended blast overpressure wave rather than conventional explosive's overpressure spike. A secondary effect of a MAC/thermobaric weapon's hotter, longer-duration blast wave is that it's more likely to set things on fire than a conventional explosive. Not as much as a incendiary-purpose weapon, but more so than conventional explosives. Isn't killing people efficiently by more clever designs fascinating? It is to Lockheed-Martin shareholders, but I digress. At any rate, plenty of info out there on the AGM-114N and theromobarics if you're interested. Now, the MAC-enhanced blast of the U.S. Hellfire missiles produces an interesting visual effect at night. After the decay of an intensely-bright and well-consolidated blast flash, you can see what look like little sparkles at the edge of the receding explosion. The sparkles are residue of the burnt fluorinated aluminum that undergo a secondary burning, of sorts. It's very distinctive once you notice it. The Russians have thermobaric bombs as well, but they are of a different design and the blast usually looks different - non-existent sparkles because of a micronized metal powder, or long-duration sparkles on very large charges for whatever reason. So (sorry, TL:DR already) I notice that many of the MSM-replays of the supposed rebel convoy attack video was edited in a particular way to mask what is plainly (to me) a MAC blast. The BBC reports are a good example. Their version is enlarged, shaky and blurry consistent with the poor head-chopper production standards. But it is an edited version of the much clearer original video. ABC must have produced their report before the censorship memo went out. If you look at only the first second of this ABC video and try to pause it during the blast, you can see a few frames with the visual effect I'm talking about. So what am I yammering about that has any relevance here? This: If this video was shown to me outside the context of the convoy attack, I would guess it was a Hellfire strike somewhere. Now we hear from Russia that a Predator drone (typically Hellfire-armed) was loitering around the 'bombed convoy' area immediately before and after the attack. An attack that produced no crater (typical of the air-blast of a thermobaric Hellfire) and numerous fires (also more likely from a thermobaric Hellfire). Then I see the curiously-edited video on most MSM seemingly intended to obscure the signature blast of a thermobaric Hellfire. [adjusts tin-foil hat] I think you know where I'm going here. Just to set the stage for the next chapter of lies, CENTCOM or the U.S. DoD will undoubtedly deny that a U.S. drone attacked the convoy (not that any journalist will bother asking). AS we saw in the SAA/Deir EzZor attack though, it's not necessarily a U.S. aircraft. The U.S. can deny responsibility if needed because 1) any of a number of 'coalition partners' have Hellfire-armed Predators violating Syrian airspace every day, and 2) all Predators of coalition partners are not necessarily under the command of their military or the CJTF-OIR coalition. The CIA, for instance, has plenty of armed drones in the Middle East. Not that these potential loopholes will be needed or used - the U.S. isn't bashful about flinging outright lies when convenient and difficult to disprove. This isn't offered as any kind of proof the U.S. did it - it's just reasonable speculation. I'm sure our inquisitive and unbiased investigative journalists in the press will get to the bottom of this in no time. then you have http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-syria-russia-idUSKCN11R238 The Russian Defense Ministry said on Wednesday that a U.S. Predator drone was in the area where a U.N. aid convoy was partially destroyed in Syria on Monday and had appeared on the scene minutes before the incident. Major-General Igor Konashenkov, a spokesman for the ministry, said the drone had taken off from the Incirlik air base in Turkey, arrived in the area a few minutes before the convoy had caught fire, and left about 30 minutes later. He noted that such drones were armed with air-to-ground missiles. "Only the drone's owners know what it was doing there at the necessary moment and what tasks it was carrying out," Konashenkov said in a statement, saying Russia was not drawing any conclusions about the drone's presence. next, you have links between the latest (US)attack on Deir Ezzor and the attack of US backed kurdish forces on syrian army in Hasakah with the 2012 DIA(Defense Intelligence Agency) declassified memo which stated, among others THERE IS THE POSSIBILITY OF ESTABLISHING A DECLARED OR UNDECLARED SALAFIST PRINCIPALITY IN EASTERN SYRIA (HASAKA AND DER ZOR), AND THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT THE SUPPORTING POWERS TO THE OPPOSITION WANT, IN ORDER TO ISOLATE THE SYRIAN REGIME ... so ... yea ... | ||
TheFish7
United States2824 Posts
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zeo
Serbia6176 Posts
Al-Nusra is throwing a lot into the defense of Sheikh Saeed but you can already see the toll the encirclement is having on the militants in the north. Still, everything is moving really fast and the situation is tense, a lot can happen. Meanwhile to the north of Aleppo pro-Turk forces seemed to have recovered and are launching a counterattack against ISIS forces there, recapturing 5 settlements. | ||
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