Although in this case, it probably should.
UK Politics Mega-thread - Page 71
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marvellosity
United Kingdom35817 Posts
Although in this case, it probably should. | ||
KwarK
United States40765 Posts
On July 15 2015 20:06 alekseyevich wrote: That's not the decision you have to make though. I think you're portraying it as though this vote is a make-or-break on the principles of Britain's representative democracy, and that's just not the case. Regardless of whether SNP MPs vote on this one bill, the state of our representative democracy is tragic. Does it not seem more dangerous to our representative democracy that, if it hadn't been for the interference of SNP MPs, the parliament would have passed a bill which 74% of people are against? Again, it seems inevitable now that EVEL will pass regardless, so this interfering from Scottish MPs has a short lifespan. I don't think you fully understand what the word representative in representative democracy means. Furthermore this is a manifesto promise, this is what the Tories said they would do before people voted for them. This isn't them getting elected promising to be nice and then being dicks, this is exactly what people voted for. | ||
Faust852
Luxembourg4004 Posts
Isn't that plain stupid ? I mean I kind of understand the PoV of kicking illigals, but high qualified people are what make a first world country, a first world country. | ||
marvellosity
United Kingdom35817 Posts
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dismiss
United Kingdom3341 Posts
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Dangermousecatdog
United Kingdom7084 Posts
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Drazerk
United Kingdom31255 Posts
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom8712 Posts
Jeremy Corbyn: Our timeless task in the Labour Party is to stand up against injustice wherever we find it. That notion has driven me throughout my political life -- and it's what drove me to stand for Parliament in the first place. I have been proud to be a trade union rep, a trade union official, a local councillor and a Labour MP for the last 32 years. My purpose in every role has been to share that power, providing a platform to the voiceless, at home and abroad, and to stand up with them. I am now asking for your support to become Labour leader. I want that role for the same reason -- to work with you to right the many wrongs we see around us. Our party must become a social movement again. It was founded to stand up to injustice, and too often we have lost our way, ignored our supporters or been cowed by powerful commercial interests and the press. Austerity policies are harming people’s life chances and taking away opportunities. We must reject the notion that the journey to prosperity tramples over people -- and become an anti-austerity movement. You can't build a fair economy by casting people aside. No leader has a monopoly on wisdom, so we need to organise like a social movement too, building on our party's unique base: our trade union link to millions of working people, our quarter of a million members, and our growing band of registered supporters. The more we exclude them, the weaker we are. The more we involve them, the stronger we will be. So to win, our party must draw on its greatest strength: the people. Ours is a movement to give people hope -- the hope of a better world, with less injustice and more equality, peace and solidarity. Together we need to agree policies that will achieve those goals and then campaign for them, winning more people over to these principles -- and giving them hope. If that vision inspires you like it inspires me, then join us to deliver it together. Yvette Cooper: No one is in any doubt about the importance of this Leadership Election for Labour to win again in 2020. I know we can’t afford to write off our chances in five years' time and lose another generation to a dangerous Tory future. This isn't going to be an easy task. Our new leader has to hit the ground running -- not try and learn on the job. We must not let the Tories define us, denigrate us and dismiss us in this crucial period. The ideas and energy of our activists, members and supporters will be so important to making this happen. Our leader must have the strength and confidence to harness the talent we have in this party and in our great Labour movement and we should not forget it is still great. There is much to be proud of in our values but the offer we took to the country was too narrow. We need to change, to broaden our appeal and win back voters from the Tories, the SNP and UKIP; to succeed in small towns as well as big cities, North and South, England, Scotland and Wales -- and we need a progressive, modern Labour vision to do so, rooted in our values and optimistic about the future. It’s not enough for us to focus on our core support, many of whom already feel taken for granted. But nor should we try and ape the Tories by swallowing their manifesto. With your support, Labour can send a strong message about how serious we are about victory in 2020. I’m determined take on David Cameron and the Tories from the start. Ultimately it is a choice about who will be the best Labour Prime Minister -- because that's the decision voters will be making at the General Election. We can win the next election and we must win for the sake of the fairer, stronger and less divided society we are all fighting for. I have the experience, the strength, the serious ideas, the values and the reach to speak to voters in every corner of the country. That's why I'm asking for your support. Andy Burnham: My vision for Labour is simple: we must be the Party that helps everyone get on in life. People at all levels of society share the same hopes: a secure job; a decent home; a good standard of living; prospects for their kids; and proper care for their parents. But, in our insecure, modern world, for far too many people, these dreams are dying. It will be the mission of the Labour Party I lead to revive them - and turn the light of hope back on. Labour wins when we speak convincingly and passionately to the aspirations of everyone. But the truth is we have lost our emotional connection with millions, not just in Scotland but in Wales and England too. I will take Labour out of the 'Westminster bubble' and reach out to voters everywhere. I will be a leader people can relate to, whose voice will carry into all the nations and regions of our country. And I will lead a Party that helps every person, every family and every business - whoever they are, wherever they come from - get on in life. Liz Kendall: We need a fresh start for our party and our country. .I grew up just outside Watford. My mum was a primary school teacher and my dad left school at 16, working his way up doing his banking exams on the job. They wanted me and my brother to get the best possible education, because they knew it was our ticket to a better life. The most important thing to them was that we worked hard, took responsibility for ourselves and others, and tried our best. They also taught us that we’d do better as a family if people in our area did well too. The place where I grew up wasn’t Labour – and still isn’t - but it’s somewhere our values should resonate. And they can. We need to build a movement that fights to renew our communities and country - not just a party that waits for the next election. I believe I can lead that change, taking our party through the tough times and back to power. My politics are inseparable from the party and country I love. I believe in work, opportunity and putting power into the hands of as many people as possible. I stand for responsibility from the top to the bottom, because making a contribution and playing by the rules is the bedrock of a decent society. That has to start with Labour being responsible with the public finances. I champion wealth creation, because without a dynamic economy in every part of the country, we won’t get the decent jobs or public services people need. We must confront the inequalities in power, wealth and opportunity that scar our country and hold us all back. The world is changing faster than ever before. This brings real opportunities for Britain, but is leaving too many people behind. Labour must build a stronger economy and fairer society where everyone can succeed. Together, we can renew our party and our country - and we can win in 2020 Source Below is the full Labour leadership debate, which Corbyn won, according to most commentators. + Show Spoiler + | ||
KwarK
United States40765 Posts
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom8712 Posts
On July 24 2015 03:25 KwarK wrote: No Dave? No Balls? I've only been gone a year but I feel like I've never heard of any of those three. Corbyn is a 70s style socialist and he's winning according to a key poll for the times. Its a bit worrying when you realise that for many people, a 70s style socialist is the best option for labour right now. It shows a massive lack of ideas and clever, ambitious MPs. The other 3 candidates talk more about the art of election campaigning than about the principles on which they would run. Its pretty typical of the pathetic state of modern British politics IMO. | ||
Fuchsteufelswild
Australia2028 Posts
On July 15 2015 21:42 KwarK wrote: I don't think you fully understand what the word representative in representative democracy means. Furthermore this is a manifesto promise, this is what the Tories said they would do before people voted for them. This isn't them getting elected promising to be nice and then being dicks, this is exactly what people voted for. Largely, parliaments are meant to work not only for their own voters, but for the whole country. They'll have their own policy plans, but you don't just push through policy that 3/4 disagrees with and then say "that's functional representative democracy". These days, they're more like delegates for companies/group that fund them, which makes it less of a representative democracy than you would have us believe. The bill was prevented by representatives of 3/4 of the population on this issue. Politicians lie, change their tune and make exceptions to their policy regularly but you're kicking up a fuss about the SNP doing it...on THIS occasion? All the changes of heart, backing down on election promises that are made in politics, but you're worried THIS is a threat to representative democracy? On July 24 2015 07:00 Jockmcplop wrote: Corbyn is a 70s style socialist and he's winning according to a key poll for the times. Its a bit worrying when you realise that for many people, a 70s style socialist is the best option for labour right now. It shows a massive lack of ideas and clever, ambitious MPs. The other 3 candidates talk more about the art of election campaigning than about the principles on which they would run. Its pretty typical of the pathetic state of modern British politics IMO. I'll watch the videos linked soon, but is Corbyn reaaally a socialist or is this just the same-old stupid modern western fear of anything left of New Labour? The idea that Labour needs to go further to the right rather back to the left to me is also a sign of the pathetic state of modern British politics. There is little reason for people to vote for "soft right that is less experienced at that austere approach" than "experienced austere right party". That said, I have little hope for to UK Politics to improve while they still use FPTP. | ||
Jockmcplop
United Kingdom8712 Posts
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Zaros
United Kingdom3673 Posts
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34223157 1 shadow minister resigns already, Tom Watson will be key to what happens next as he's probably the only one who can keep the labour MPs together. Edit: Another one Rachel Reeves resigns as well. | ||
fbs
United Kingdom2476 Posts
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corumjhaelen
France6884 Posts
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MoltkeWarding
5195 Posts
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Sermokala
United States13538 Posts
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KwarK
United States40765 Posts
On September 13 2015 06:17 Sermokala wrote: The major opposition in the UK wants to leave NATO? Is this a serious position for him to have? As a counter point, you realize the Soviet Union has fallen? | ||
Zaros
United Kingdom3673 Posts
On September 13 2015 06:47 KwarK wrote: As a counter point, you realize the Soviet Union has fallen? As a counter counter, Putin is acting as if it never did. | ||
Fuchsteufelswild
Australia2028 Posts
I don't like the left getting compromised by "moderating" their views too much to fit the general right-wing trend. I also, however, do not like the left throwing opportunities by taking extreme views on everything, one being leaving NATO, another being absolute non-interventionist pacifist attitudes (does he have this? my impression is he does). For NATO to work, you need each country to be willing to defend each other in the pact, not just "oh majority of country against, better veto NATO in this particular scenario because it isn't convenient for us right now". *Files nails* *Looks like he's about to say "Am I bovered?" This is one case where I definitely agree with individual national interests being put aside (although yeah, otherwise you get out of NATO. I don't think the UK should though). QE to fund infrastructure kind of indirectly makes the wealthiest pay for it largely, doesn't it? In a nutshell, by inflating the UK economy, their assets are effectively devalued, right? In addition it'll make imports relatively more expensive and international banks probably a little more reluctant to loan to the UK if his Labour get in (and expect to require higher interest on loans). | ||
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