On August 24 2016 12:57 Aceace wrote: People are missing one big point on Valla's skillset. 1) You need to get your trait working ASAP. 2) Eventho you are playing a AA character, you have to offer somewhat burst damage.
Agreed
On August 24 2016 12:57 Aceace wrote: First things first. You have to have high hatred to deal damage with Valla. Its freaking %30 dmg boost and ability to stutter step. (People seems to forgot how important stutter step is) In theory Rancor offers %15 attack speed but... You can't reach 10 hatred in teamfight with Rancor easily. This isn't going to happen. Even you reach 10 hatred with Rancor, a punishment user Valla already dealt a lot more
This is probably due ppl not knowing how to use her trait effectively. If your team is fighting in the jungle all the time, i agree Punishment looks much better.
On August 24 2016 12:57 Aceace wrote: Q build offers 1v1 but its risky AND absurdly mana intensive. In hotslogs it shows people picks Rancor %60 of the time while Punishment only %5 of their games (Master-Dia only). And surprisingly Punishment has highest winrate. (I know there is weird pickrates has weird winrates but this is not the case for Punishment)
It really comes down to playstyle/map/team rather then being better or worse. For example, boss objectives (Temple of Anubis / Battlefield of Eternity / etc) Rancor is the way to go.
On August 24 2016 12:57 Aceace wrote: Rancor is better for bosses. Punishment is waay better for anything else. It offers an extremely high burst.
Oh, you already said that
On August 24 2016 12:57 Aceace wrote: About Hot Pursuit... Teamfights tends to go a little longer against double warrior compositions. Also Searing Arrow's bonus damage isn't that important anymore. But having +%10 movespeed becomes much more important. Its not so hard to keep 10 hatred stacks when you start with 8
Fair point but i disagree here. Hot Pursuit is useful in some situations, especially when you have do deal with their tanks first like you said. But Searing arrow helps to bring down their healers faster and can be the difference between life and death vs assassins and/or mages. Considering team-composition, peelers and priority targets, Hot Pursuit can be very good in the right situation but wouldn't say it should be picked more often then Searing arrow.
The most amusing part of the post is when he's talking about an extreme change they tested out, but which will not be in the game:
To provide some insight into how we do design, sometimes we test extremes to see if the direction is even worth pursuing before settling on something that feels appropriately tuned. One such example was increasing the mounting cooldown from 4 seconds to 80 seconds, but the Movement Speed was increased from 40% to 80%. Ultimately we didn’t like the extreme change this made to Heroes of the Storm, but it make us think about where we were on the map more often. We really enjoyed that, so we wanted to bring a slightly tamer version of it to live.
I'm still having some success with Q build Valla, and depending on the circumstances take Cost-effective materials at 1, Tumble at 16, and Vengeance at 20. It gives you pretty absurd burst, especially the ult, no healer can keep up with a full-duration upgraded Strafe on more than one target.
Although, hotslogs is showing basically all the dedicated Q talents as the worst of their respective tiers, so maybe it's just my own play style - I tend to be greedy as AA Valla and end up dying more than I probably should.
To provide some insight into how we do design, sometimes we test extremes to see if the direction is even worth pursuing before settling on something that feels appropriately tuned. One such example was increasing the mounting cooldown from 4 seconds to 80 seconds, but the Movement Speed was increased from 40% to 80%. Ultimately we didn’t like the extreme change this made to Heroes of the Storm, but it make us think about where we were on the map more often. We really enjoyed that, so we wanted to bring a slightly tamer version of it to live.
I don't think the average player will even notice the difference if they didn't read about it first. Chu8 plays more than the vast majority of players and didn't notice it until someone asked him to check. Two seconds more travel time from bottom lane to the top temple of Sky Temple doesn't seem like enough difference to create the benefits they are hoping to gain. I'm interested to see the changes to the "number of equivalent powers".
The most amusing part of the post is when he's talking about an extreme change they tested out, but which will not be in the game:
To provide some insight into how we do design, sometimes we test extremes to see if the direction is even worth pursuing before settling on something that feels appropriately tuned. One such example was increasing the mounting cooldown from 4 seconds to 80 seconds, but the Movement Speed was increased from 40% to 80%. Ultimately we didn’t like the extreme change this made to Heroes of the Storm, but it make us think about where we were on the map more often. We really enjoyed that, so we wanted to bring a slightly tamer version of it to live.
I don't think the average player will even notice the difference if they didn't read about it first. Chu8 plays more than the vast majority of players and didn't notice it until someone asked him to check. Two seconds more travel time from bottom lane to the top temple of Sky Temple doesn't seem like enough difference to create the benefits they are hoping to gain. I'm interested to see the changes to the "number of equivalent powers".
Yeah, me too. For instance, if they don't nerf Enhanced Agility on Dehaka then that is pretty nice. Similar assertions can be made of lunara, falstad, medivh, sgt hammer, etc, etc.
I wonder how will this affect the likes of Rehgar and such, since he can have 40% currently with the lvl 1 talent?
trikslyr:
Many movement speed traits/etc, have been reduced to reflect the change. For example, Rehgar and Falstad have been tuned to make sure they are in line with the alterations.
Question:
What about Brightwing and Dehaka? Even if you increase the cooldown, can they still teleport directly in from anywhere on the map?
trikslyr:
In some cases, like Dehaka, there wasn't a change. He can still Brushstalk at the same rate of speed that we've all come to know. More details to come with the PTR, and you'll get to try out the changes for yourself.
The balance team took the time to dig through every interaction and make sure adjustments were made where needed. With that being said, if you do see something on the PTR that feels off, feel free to give us the feedback. We'll be keeping an eye out.
On August 24 2016 12:57 Aceace wrote: About Hot Pursuit... Teamfights tends to go a little longer against double warrior compositions. Also Searing Arrow's bonus damage isn't that important anymore. But having +%10 movespeed becomes much more important. Its not so hard to keep 10 hatred stacks when you start with 8
Fair point but i disagree here. Hot Pursuit is useful in some situations, especially when you have do deal with their tanks first like you said. But Searing arrow helps to bring down their healers faster and can be the difference between life and death vs assassins and/or mages. Considering team-composition, peelers and priority targets, Hot Pursuit can be very good in the right situation but wouldn't say it should be picked more often then Searing arrow.
Great post.
Thank you!! I should've posted it earlier but real life commitments sucks.
I used to pick Searing Arrows before double (even triple) warrior meta. But in HL people picks double warrior again. Its completely meta pick. If somehow meta return to one warrior, I'll choose Searing Arrows then.
On August 23 2016 16:30 Leolio wrote: Greymane really needed that IMO but is it possible to balance such a character ? Not really sure. Hammer needed that. Yesterday I played HL vs one. I asked if someone was good with Chromie. Turns out the guy who picked Chromie was. Hammer got no-gamed by Chromie's superior range and high burst. It was lost for them the moment they picked hammer without banning Chromie.
Hammer team could have always taken Medivh. Which is really fun vs mages. Add Auriel and you got some scary poke team. If I ever play mage vs Hammer + Medivh, I will not leave my supports side. Only way to life.
Yes Medivh is a pain for Chromie, but at Diamond 5 or so, people won't play like that. And playing well Chromie can mitigate Medivh's role, like focusing him instead of hammer or not letting them see when you use your attack so that he doesn't know the timing to protect hammer. This is diamond HL, people draft the hero they want to play, amongst the heroes who may suit the needed roles.
The best example of this is players who pick Diablo in the 4rth and 5th slot of the draft. So, I'm 4rth pick, I'll have to take warrior and I don't want to, but hey, at least Diablo's a fun one, right ? Ends up diving 1v5 all game, no peeling, no teamwork. Same with Tyrande picks. I'm stuck with support, but at least she's fun. And they'll end up using their shadowstalk way too soon, never scouting with owl because, hey, it's funnier to keep it for fights and so. Keep stun for mosh ? Aw come on, you know I'll be dancing, right ? (true story, he picked Tyrande for Mosh, he never countered one, and got caught often) Am I the only one who notices that ? I got 2 Tyrande and 4 Diablo this last few days that were forced into warrior / support and played terribly. Since I try to play "carry" when top of draft I notice that (I used to go warrior only when top of draft)
To provide some insight into how we do design, sometimes we test extremes to see if the direction is even worth pursuing before settling on something that feels appropriately tuned. One such example was increasing the mounting cooldown from 4 seconds to 80 seconds, but the Movement Speed was increased from 40% to 80%. Ultimately we didn’t like the extreme change this made to Heroes of the Storm, but it make us think about where we were on the map more often. We really enjoyed that, so we wanted to bring a slightly tamer version of it to live.
Glad they didn't do that change...that would absolutely wreck me.
If i had a dollar for how many times a single archer minion has dismounted me immediately or trying to get to an objective. I'd be about 80 dollars richer.
I like Mc's Greymane build over Kaeyoh's. Flask build is still just so meh. Greymane's human form hasn't changed all that much, so playing him like a Valla or Raynor makes a bit more sense. I would even consider taking Eager Wolf over Executioner just because it helps his PvE after taking a hit with the Swipe nerfs.
All in all, he's not that bad as a ranged assassin, but I don't think he's anywhere near the quality of someone like Valla or Lunara who do tons more damage. Even Raynor might be better since he's got more sustain and an interrupt.
PTR is scheduled to go live tomorrow for SC maps. At least one other hero besides Valla was teased as getting a rework. My guess is The Butcher who they previously said they have been working on about two months ago.
On August 29 2016 09:11 karazax wrote: PTR is scheduled to go live tomorrow for SC maps. At least one other hero besides Valla was teased as getting a rework. My guess is The Butcher who they previously said they have been working on about two months ago.
And I look at Tassadar and my heart weeps. Tass literally only has one build. Taking other talents at almost every tier is a really bad idea the vast majority of the time. Butcher has a solid winrate and surprising talent diversity (people think it HAS to be meat related talents for some reason, but he has varied Q talents that are actually pretty good). Butcher needs some tweaking, not a rework. Tass needs a new talent level rework. Murky needs... something. Poor lil guy hasn't been touched properly in forever. Malf could do with some changes. Nova is still a trainwreck. Other heroes are still bugged to hell (Rexxar?). I hope some of this gets sorted over the next two patches, instead of reworks to heroes that shouldn't be the priority and yet another bunch of KT changes.
The thing with butcher is, he needs to go all-in. Feels like that atleast. I do hope he gets a proper rework since i really think he should get one.
He might be picked in competetive now atleast SOMETHING but still. He do so poorly compared to thrall for example if u pick him in hero league. So ye a rework is a neccessity imo.
On August 29 2016 09:11 karazax wrote: PTR is scheduled to go live tomorrow for SC maps. At least one other hero besides Valla was teased as getting a rework. My guess is The Butcher who they previously said they have been working on about two months ago.
And I look at Tassadar and my heart weeps. Tass literally only has one build. Taking other talents at almost every tier is a really bad idea the vast majority of the time. Butcher has a solid winrate and surprising talent diversity (people think it HAS to be meat related talents for some reason, but he has varied Q talents that are actually pretty good). Butcher needs some tweaking, not a rework. Tass needs a new talent level rework. Murky needs... something. Poor lil guy hasn't been touched properly in forever. Malf could do with some changes. Nova is still a trainwreck. Other heroes are still bugged to hell (Rexxar?). I hope some of this gets sorted over the next two patches, instead of reworks to heroes that shouldn't be the priority and yet another bunch of KT changes.
Nova is perfectly fine right now, except she may need more build diversity. Not that it matters as her only build is good IMO. Tass is the same. Murky needs just a little something, but it's such a cheese character, he can never really be balanced.