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I havent watched much lotv, just some but the other day I watched qxc stream lotv archon mode. I think it was a tournament and basetradetv was casting it too. Qxc was playing with beastyqt and it was so much fun to watch his stream as he played archon mode.
I know streaming SC2 is a big thing and that many streamers explain their thinking pattern and give some commenting during the game. However for me the enjoyment and insight of watching archon mode far exceeded watching someone stream 1v1.
Since archon mode works the way it does its a co-op mode for 1v1 meaning that the standard meta (more or less) for 1v1 is also true for archon mode. In 2v2 the meta is totally different.
The defining difference is how communication is key in archon mode, qxc and beasty in this example was sharing their thoughts throughout the game. Since sc2 is high paced you need to prioritize what is most important to tell, what decision should we make. Maybe I'm bad at explaining but I was really blown away by how fun it was watching an archon stream with good players. You get to hear the decision making as it enterers the players heads and hear how they think about it themselves.
I feel streaming archon mode could become huge, especially since what you are watching depends on the roles of the players. Imagine watching marineking and innovation and all you do is watch marineking fighting and microing while inno macroes and defends. Watching the streams of players was much more fun than watching it being casted in my opinion.
Not to mention that every archon mode game is bound to be much more action packed than a normal 1v1, there's more to see and get the hang off. Often two battles are being fought at the same time at different places by different players.
I didn't predict archon mode to have this entertainment factor but I really belives it does, what do you guys think of streams or casts of archon mode?
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I agree listening to the players exchanging during the game is interesting and adds to the stream appeal, but I had already that feeling in a 2v2. The issue you have is that from a casting perspective archon mode and 1v1 are the same (except the archon player is perhaps slightly better).
Unsure about watching an inno/marineking archon though: if you don't understand the coms you fall back to watching the 1v1 of a very good player. It might even be more interesting for me to look at a player I can still understand (even if I could never do as good) than to know I watch half the action of an 800 apm player.
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On May 20 2015 16:45 Oshuy wrote: I agree listening to the players exchanging during the game is interesting and adds to the stream appeal, but I had already that feeling in a 2v2. The issue you have is that from a casting perspective archon mode and 1v1 are the same (except the archon player is perhaps slightly better).
Unsure about watching an inno/marineking archon though: if you don't understand the coms you fall back to watching the 1v1 of a very good player. It might even be more interesting for me to look at a player I can still understand (even if I could never do as good) than to know I watch half the action of an 800 apm player.
Well the feeling you have when watching 2v2 is different since if you yourself dont play 2v2 the decision making and thought process is not relevant to you. The decision making in archon mode is.
My example of marineking and inno was more to show how exciting it could be watching a players that excels in his micro just focus on his micro. Watching sc2 1v1 can be slow/stale to a new player but I believe archon mode could be much easier to get into sc2 if you are new to it since it will be much more acftion packed and therefore more interesting initially.
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That would be cool if the campaign could be played as archon
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I think archon mode in general is pretty cool... I think there's room for some "spectator experiences" (you can read that as show matches if you like). I think people will want to play it and with more action it could be more fun to watch.
Personally, I'd love to see a quad view split of each player's camera with commentary (you need more tech to make it happen but it also cuts out the observer).
It will also be a great way for streamers to entertain fans (be it pro players or personalities).
The role of individual skill and multitasking (the things that should influence top level of play) will be lower so "as an esport" I don't see it being featured competitively after LotV is released. It could still be a great way to increase casual tournament participation and overall game growth. Anything that promotes SC2 is good in my opinion.
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I had a blast playing with qxc in the tournament, it's very different from 1v1 because not only you need good decision making/mechanics, you need to communicate with your partner as well during the game.
I was skeptical about archon mode when it was announced, but after playing it two days ago I think archon mode has big potential. I can imagine tournaments with good prize pools and requiring players to be on voice communication and mid game to switch from casters to players and hear how they are communicating with each other and their thoughts during/after the game. I really hope there is more tournaments like this, because me as a player I had a blast.
I also think that mechanics and skill in the game don't beat communication between the players in archon mode, mid-late game it becomes chaotic and good communication is the key to victory.
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I remember watching Destiny/Kaitlyn do archon mode when beta was just released. That was fucking hilarious.
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On May 20 2015 18:39 Beastyqt wrote: I had a blast playing with qxc in the tournament, it's very different from 1v1 because not only you need good decision making/mechanics, you need to communicate with your partner as well during the game.
I was skeptical about archon mode when it was announced, but after playing it two days ago I think archon mode has big potential. I can imagine tournaments with good prize pools and requiring players to be on voice communication and mid game to switch from casters to players and hear how they are communicating with each other and their thoughts during/after the game. I really hope there is more tournaments like this, because me as a player I had a blast.
I also think that mechanics and skill in the game don't beat communication between the players in archon mode, mid-late game it becomes chaotic and good communication is the key to victory.
Yes "archon" mode was one of the most fun things in broodwar. We beat players who were much better than us but by working as a unit we still won a lot
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On May 20 2015 17:11 y0su wrote: I think archon mode in general is pretty cool... I think there's room for some "spectator experiences" (you can read that as show matches if you like). I think people will want to play it and with more action it could be more fun to watch.
Personally, I'd love to see a quad view split of each player's camera with commentary (you need more tech to make it happen but it also cuts out the observer).
It will also be a great way for streamers to entertain fans (be it pro players or personalities).
The role of individual skill and multitasking (the things that should influence top level of play) will be lower so "as an esport" I don't see it being featured competitively after LotV is released. It could still be a great way to increase casual tournament participation and overall game growth. Anything that promotes SC2 is good in my opinion.
Many mobas are played 5v5 based on skill, multitasking and communication, and are played competitively. I can't see why a 2v2 can't be in a competitive scene too, even if 1v1 is the true spirit of it.
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Maybe it would be good to have the units selected by each player light up differently so you can tell who's controlling what units.
For example one team would be Red/Pink and the other Blue/Teal.
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On May 20 2015 21:45 JCoto wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2015 17:11 y0su wrote: I think archon mode in general is pretty cool... I think there's room for some "spectator experiences" (you can read that as show matches if you like). I think people will want to play it and with more action it could be more fun to watch.
Personally, I'd love to see a quad view split of each player's camera with commentary (you need more tech to make it happen but it also cuts out the observer).
It will also be a great way for streamers to entertain fans (be it pro players or personalities).
The role of individual skill and multitasking (the things that should influence top level of play) will be lower so "as an esport" I don't see it being featured competitively after LotV is released. It could still be a great way to increase casual tournament participation and overall game growth. Anything that promotes SC2 is good in my opinion. Many mobas are played 5v5 based on skill, multitasking and communication, and are played competitively. I can't see why a 2v2 can't be in a competitive scene too, even if 1v1 is the true spirit of it.
The game is simply not balanced around it. But sure, I'd watch it if they made better maps...
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it's be cool if you can go 1 archon against 1 player, if you're playing your friends and you are an odd number or if your skill differs a lot
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On May 21 2015 07:18 johax wrote: it's be cool if you can go 1 archon against 1 player, if you're playing your friends and you are an odd number or if your skill differs a lot Yeah, I would like to see them implement this. I feel like we might see this in customs. This was, to my knowledge, how KeSPA used to train BW. But I can't say for sure that it's correct.
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For archon mode to be spectator friendly we'd really need to be able to clearly see who is controlling which units I think.
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I want to see 5v5 SC2, Imagine the control with 5 koreans playing Terran....... Split marines any one?
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I Agree with some Hud & UI & party improvements this can be the next RTS revive.
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Germany3367 Posts
On May 25 2015 05:59 TheDougler wrote: For archon mode to be spectator friendly we'd really need to be able to clearly see who is controlling which units I think. I agree, at the moment it's not that special to watch Archon mode from the casters/spectators viewpoint, right? At least I feel like that.
The ability to really see who is doing what and how the two players are communicating with each other is the key to really make watching it enjoyable in my opinion. Otherwise there isn't that big of a difference to watching a normal 1v1.
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On May 20 2015 17:04 FFW_Rude wrote: That would be cool if the campaign could be played as archon AFAIK allied commanders would be the equivalent of archon mode campaign.
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On May 31 2015 14:25 XXXSmOke wrote: I want to see 5v5 SC2, Imagine the control with 5 koreans playing Terran....... Split marines any one? 4v4 with 6 people controlling each. 48vs48
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