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Hi, I'd posted this in a community feedback topic, but seems that nobody has seen it so I will post it here.
I read the american SC2 forum of the LOTV beta. Currently, they are discussing how to "redefine" the protoss race in order to fix some of the issues with them. I would like to share my opinion but as I can´t post on those forums I will write it here.
It seems that a lot of people thinks that one of the main problems is the current wp state and the need to use t3 area-units for being competitive. I would like to help in this topic by sharing an idea I had regarding of how to improve warp-gate units changing how the wp-system works. To keep it simple, make the wp system linked and limited to the core building of the protoss: The Nexus.
The technology of Wp still has to be researched, of course, but instead of morphing wp to be able to warp, the Nexus is the one that can do it (or an extra specific building created for this task, with energy, that has to be near the Nexus). The warping method remains as it is now but now, warping a unit spends ENERGY from the nexus. I think this accomplish two things firstly, you can control the abuse of the warps early game with the energy consuming mechanics and second, you maintain the mid-late game warping feature of the actual gameplay because, as you expand (or build more nexus: maybe this has to be limited somehow) you can warp more units. In addition, this adds a new depth as now it is necessary to choose between chrono-boosting something or warping. An example: Instead of chrono-boosting, a full energy nexus could warp 6 zealots or 4 stalkers or 2 templars with that energy. The cost of the unit it’s the same as warping/building, and, of course, the numbers need balancing. On the other hand, with this change I think that protoss should be able to warp ANY unit of their army (except probes) as this warping mechanic is more restrictive. I think this proposal maintains a protoss feeling to the warping mechanism.
Maybe, some will be concerned about the protoss being able to warp carriers in the middle of a battle. Remember that now warping units take more damage, so if we increase the warping time depending on the unit you are warping I think this will solve the "issue". For example, if you can only warp one carrier spending all the energy of the nexus and its warping time is 12 seconds it will actually be a viable mechanism of increasing your army or defending a base without being overpowered. What do you think? PS: Sorry if my English is bad, is not my native language. Thanks for your time and opinions.
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If anyone thinks warp-gate is a problem maybe it's time to stop playing starcraft.
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On August 03 2015 16:21 LongShot27 wrote: If anyone thinks warp-gate is a problem maybe it's time to stop playing starcraft.
Even the devs are trying to rework the warpgate mecanic. Maybe it's time for you to stop starcraft.
About the thread in itself : I like the basic idea that localized production should cost something, and by something I mean not the 100 min of a pylon. Give protoss a choice between agressive warping and something else would be very good for protoss, giving them more options. However, I feel the main concern in this kinda of matter is gameplay legibility. I mean you can't always look at your nexii to watch for how much energy you're spending, it's took complicated.
Boucing on the idea blizzard gave, about pylon warping taking 12 seconds, warp prism warping taking 2 and "pylon next to warpgate" warping 2 seconds too, my proposition would be :
- pylon warpin takes 14 seconds - prism warpin takes 4 seconds - the nexus now casts an energy field around itself, of 4-5 units of distance, and if you warp in this field, it only takes 2 seconds, but it cost 10 energy for each unit or so - warpgate starts recharging itself when the warp begins, not when it is finished, so you don't loose "production time" depending on your warping choice - remove warping rally points
The advantages of this solution would be to : - greatly reinforce protoss defense : not only can you warp really fast around nexii, but you also can build canons right around your nexus without pylones and un-power risks - you don't nerf protoss production rate, you don't limit protoss offensive reinforcing, you just increase the delays - you give protoss a choice which is easy for the protoss player to see : if he warps on the nexus he can see how much energy he's consumming - about the warping rally point, the aim of removing it is to increase the multitasking you need to runby as a protoss. You need to warp, then attack with the units. In HOTS protoss late game is avoided by all terran pro players because protoss can warp 10 zealots and right clic on a base without giving it much attention, and attacks with his army at the same time. With all other races harass unit, you can't do that, you have to micro somehow to not die to static defenses or defense units.
DISCLAMER : this proposition HAS to be related to a general buff of protoss gateway units. HOTS units with this model would be a straight up nerf.
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Best solution IMO : split warp-in power and energy power as suggested in a previous community update. Warp-in power is provided by warpgates, warp prisms and Nexi. Warp-in time is left unchanged.
What I don't like about the solution they suggested is how broken it makes the warp prism. This would leave zero place to any gateway buff since there are huge chances warp prism + 8 gates all-ins would become unbeatable, whereas the split leaves so much place to toy with.
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I said it a dozen times and I am going to say it again: Give Warp Gates a disadvantage when compared to Gateways. For example: Increase the cooldown when warping in units. This way you could create an army faster with Gateways but you can reinforce immediately with Warp Gates. Its now a decision whether to use Warp Gates or Gateways.
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My idea separates gateways from warp-gates, so the warp mechanics is an extra for recruiting units not and alternative.
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On August 03 2015 16:21 LongShot27 wrote: If anyone thinks warp-gate is a problem maybe it's time to stop playing starcraft.
Warpgate is pobably the biggest problems in starcraft.
1. It makes timing attacks to strong, which leads to ->
2. protoss core units are being too weak, which leads to ->
3(a). Protoss cannot defend early game so they need a band-aid hero unit (MSC) 3(b). support units are very strong and gimmicky (forcefield, colossus, blink), which leads to ->
4. strong units being guarded by an army of fodder which cannot be separated (deathball).
That's just about every problem with protoss in HoT right now. All caused by the warpgate..
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I believe that Blizzard should do more to punish poor warpins. For example, if the pylon is destroyed while the units are warping in, the player should not get the resources refunded back. The units should be counted as been killed.
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On August 03 2015 16:21 LongShot27 wrote: If anyone thinks warp-gate is a problem maybe it's time to stop playing starcraft.
Yea, I think your definitely in the minority on this one man.
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On August 03 2015 21:52 RoomOfMush wrote: I said it a dozen times and I am going to say it again: Give Warp Gates a disadvantage when compared to Gateways. For example: Increase the cooldown when warping in units. This way you could create an army faster with Gateways but you can reinforce immediately with Warp Gates. Its now a decision whether to use Warp Gates or Gateways.
I like this idea a lot. However, I can see how it would get annoying very fast for players to switch between gateways and warp gates.
Only in the late game stages do I think that people could have dedicated warp-in gateways and dedicated normal gateways.
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