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On June 14 2011 12:01 Varpulis wrote:A couple of guidelines for blues/players in general: - Don't mason people at random right away and certainly do not mason people who ask you to unless you're damn sure that they're town.
- In this setup, it might be worth detectives checking strong players night 0, so that you have a confirmed townie who knows what he's doing to mason should you need somebody to discuss things with later on.
- Medics should pick their protects from a pool of players that you'd like on the town's side later on. Mafia is likely to try to eliminate strong players before they have a chance to scumhunt.
- Vigis should absolutely not be shooting night 1. Your chances of hitting scum only get better if you be patient.
- In PMs:
-Do not roleclaim -Do not assume that the player that you're talking to is not mafia
That's all that I can think of atm. If you agree, disagree, or would like to add suggestions, do so. Let's get this discussion started.
This seems like a good way for dts to mason the godfather, dude. In general, though, I agree that detectives might as well save their masons to use on people that they've checked, it's a much higher chance that they are talking to town.
The rest of your advice is pretty basic, but nothing wrong with it.
I want to encourage everyone to save at least one of your mason recruitments for later in the game. The vets will probably get lots of mason requests, but remember that these are often the players that mafia eliminates first.
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If you're gf, you wouldnt start killing all the blues, you would just kill one or two at a time and keep putting them on the wrong targets every night.
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In case that didn't make it clear, I don't support this plan.
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On June 14 2011 13:37 sandroba wrote: I support the zodiac list as is. This should highly discourage mafia to shoot town veteran players, as it would draw more suspicion towards the people left on the list and make those players be forced to contribute and act extremelly pro-town if they want to avoid being lynched. This should also free our medics and dts to protect/check elsewhere for the same reasons.
This entire post is already in BC's post. You didn't say a single thing that he didn't say.
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On June 14 2011 13:44 Scamp wrote: I'm already sick to death of the talk about the mason system going around so far. Is it really that important to save your mason choices for later and/or not use any early? Quite personally I find the whole mason thing to be useless. People really seem hung up on it so maybe there's something about it I'm not getting.
What can you accomplish with it? You get a nice town circle going? I already know of a place the town circle can talk, it's called the thread. Everyone in the circle has to be a confirmed townie, and if you're a confirmed townie then everyone knows it. Obviously this mason thing can change if you're a DT and if you're a DT I hope you're smart enough to use it well.
I don't know if you've ever played a pm game of mafia before, but it can be very beneficial to discuss things with only one or two people that you trust to be town. You can make plans and lay traps for mafia. Don't underestimate the power of your mason ability.
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On June 14 2011 13:49 sandroba wrote: @wiggles I described this scenario on my original plan. If I'm mafia 1)I'm risking to be insta outed by a DT check 2)If I lie and claim someone checked me, if there is a DT who actually checked me (which I have no way of knowing since he won't mason me if I return red) he can istantly out me as mafia. So no, in that scenario there is no possible bad outcome for town.
1) You could be a miller
2) DT has to reveal himself to out you, either in the thread or to someone chosen randomly that he has no idea if he can trust.
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On June 14 2011 13:52 Scamp wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2011 13:49 GGQ wrote: I don't know if you've ever played a pm game of mafia before, but it can be very beneficial to discuss things with only one or two people that you trust to be town. You can make plans and lay traps for mafia. Don't underestimate the power of your mason ability. You give me one good example of this happening in a previous mafia game or I vote for your lynch day 1.
One of the regular games, I cant remember which. 36 or 37 maybe? jackal and ver used PMs to work together hunting the scum team. Near the end, they determined in PM that deconduo was probably the godfather, but they acted in the thread like they thought deconduo was innocent, giving him a false sense of security. Before they died, they revealed the truth and deconduo was lynched, winning town the game.
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On June 15 2011 04:39 Scamp wrote: GGQ that is an example so you don't get auto-voted. But it's still pretty weak to me. You have one of the best analyzers (Ver) and only one other person setting a trap for someone who they found suspicious long before any PM-traps happened. I'd have to see exactly what happened but I highly doubt anything involving PMs was the true cause.
The PMs didn't singlehandedly win the game, no, but the ability for pro-town forces to discuss in private allowed them to trick the mafia into thinking they were safer than they were, drawing them into complacency and lazy posting.
I'm not even sure what the issue with my original post was. I'm just encouraging people to use every tool the game gives us rather than dismiss them as useless or unimportant.
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With the amount of opposition that sandroba's plan has received, it is effectively dead at this point. It should be dropped completely. Anyone who continue to discuss the merits or demerits of it after this point is suspicious to me.
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Well, I said I was going to be suspicious of anyone who kept talking about sandroba's plan, so here's a look at the two people who have mentioned it since then.
-Hiro brought it up as part of a question to sandroba about why his activity has dropped since night 1. He asks if sandroba is still intending to use his plan, but in the next post he states that he didn't mean to keep discussing the plan and rephrases his question without mentioning the plan at all. Looking back over his posts throughout the game, we see him supporting scumhunting during the night, opposing sandroba's plan, and advising people to save their mason abilities. I agree with just about everything he's said and find nothing scummy about his play so far.
-Impervious brings up the plan just to say he opposes it and then moves on. Let's take a look at his other posts since n0, shall we? First he defends the use of statistical analysis to find scum, which is very bad because statistics can support any argument, and it's too easy for scum to find statistics supporting an accusation and make an 'objective' case that isn't based on any real scumhunting. He supports saving the mason ability for a few days, which is good, but look at his next post:
On June 14 2011 21:02 Impervious wrote: Btw, why the hell did you bring me up?
This seems like a radical overreaction to having his name simply mentioned in the thread. Ok, whatever, that's weird, let's move on. He then argues in his next two posts that there should be no talking night 0 because it helps the mafia. youngminii already pointed out why quelling discussion is scummy, but let's look at what exactly Impervious says:
On June 14 2011 22:10 Impervious wrote: Personally, I don't see why we should do anything right now. There's no information to get a decent target for a vigi, and the more we discuss veteran players, the more targets we present for the mafia (and, subsequently, also decrease the likelihood that a medic will protect a vet that gets targeted).
Let's wait for the day post.
This doesn't make any sense at all. There's no information to get a vigi target, but how will we get information without discussion? Plus, no one at all is advocating for a vigi shot on n0 anyways. Where does this come from? Also, discussing veteran players isn't giving mafia more targets. There's definitely one or two players on the mafia team who know who all the veterans are, so if one mafia knows, all the mafia know. Discussing them in the thread might actually help a newbie medic to pick a protect target. In summary, Impervious advocates no discussion for terrible reasons. His next post is an excuse for inactivity, and finally his last post, where he says that he opposes sandroba's plan, which might have been useful during n0 when we were discussing it. Even sandroba has posted saying that the plan is dead and to stop talking about it. Are you that desperate to contribute something, Impervious? The rest of the post is just generic advice, some of it good, some of it less good. Nothing about any of the players.
In case you couldn't tell, I'm leaning towards Impervious being scum. He's lurking, failing to contribute anything original, and supporting anti-town behaviour. I'm not positive, but I'm feeling good enough about it to put a vote on him. Shape up or ship out, bud.
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Lynching an inactive is a crapshoot, lynch an active lurker who is skating by with the barest skeleton of contribution. Lynch Impervious.
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On June 17 2011 07:54 youngminii wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2011 07:47 GGQ wrote: Lynching an inactive is a crapshoot, lynch an active lurker who is skating by with the barest skeleton of contribution. Lynch Impervious. You literally just said "Doing X is a crapshoot, we should do Y. Do Z." Anyway, man this thread has become a crapfest in the past few hours. Perfect conditions for mafia to be honest.
No I didnt? Impervious is lurking, contributing almost nothing, just making empty "I'm here" posts. I already looked at his posts earlier in the thread, which also answers Mataza's accusation of me bringing up Impervious way too late. No, I brought him up hours ago but no one responded to my post.
I disagree with the hiro lynch, btw. I've already made a post looking at both hiro and Impervious, I didn't find hiro suspicious at all, though that was before the 'scumslip' about voting for someone that he thought was town. I'd disagree with the logic of that post, but I'd disagree that it was scummy. He just doesn't feel like a scum to me like Impervious does.
Now, obviously Impervious isn't going to get lynched, but I dont like the ILJ lynch either, so I'm keeping my vote on him in protest.
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On June 17 2011 10:53 Mr. Wiggles wrote: GGQ, Imp looks like a modkill. Between GG, Hiro, and ILJ, who do you think should be lynched? Changing your vote?
Imp voted now, but if I had to instantly kill one of those three, probably GG.
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On June 18 2011 03:16 Mr. Wiggles wrote: I don't think Impervious would have been a good lynch, simply due to the fact that he was in line to be modkilled until 20 minutes before the lynch.
However, that makes it look even odder for GGQ. What he essentially did today, is throw away his vote, instead of voting for GG who would have been his choice out of the three, he kept it on Imp, who was either getting modkilled, or in any case, wasn't going to be lynched. So, his actions don't match up with what he was saying. Why not stand by your opinion, GGQ? FOS
On another note, the same thing looks odd for Hiro changing his vote to pull the hammer on ILJ so close to the deadline. At the time, it was six votes ILJ, and six votes GG, with ILJ to be lynched, and Hiro only had 5 votes. To have been killed, he would have needed two people to hop onto his wagon, so his nervousness and voting ILJ simply to "save" himself, looks very selfish, if not scummy. He wasn't in any danger, but still ensured ILJ's lynch.
I DID stand by my opinion. My opinion all day was that Impervious should be lynched, and I stood by it. I'm not going to switch to a bad lynch just because everyone else is ignoring a good one. You asked me a question and I answered it, but that doesn't mean I want to kill giraffe. He's just a lurker so out of those three I would kill giraffe. But I'm not satisfied with lynching lurkers, tbh, I think it's a bad way to play. And I didn't vote for him to 'save' ILJ because frankly I wasn't positive that he was town. I thought he might have been mafia, I just didn't think the case on him was good enough to warrant a lynch.
By the way, I think it's always a bad idea to ignore a good lynch just because the guy looks like he's going to get modkilled. Outside of newbie games, mafia is always going to 'miraculously' appear at the last minute to vote. Lo and behold, Impervious voted.
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Also, if a dt does check me, use one of your masons on me if you still have two.
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On June 18 2011 06:57 sandroba wrote:Show nested quote +On June 18 2011 06:35 GGQ wrote:On June 18 2011 03:16 Mr. Wiggles wrote: I don't think Impervious would have been a good lynch, simply due to the fact that he was in line to be modkilled until 20 minutes before the lynch.
However, that makes it look even odder for GGQ. What he essentially did today, is throw away his vote, instead of voting for GG who would have been his choice out of the three, he kept it on Imp, who was either getting modkilled, or in any case, wasn't going to be lynched. So, his actions don't match up with what he was saying. Why not stand by your opinion, GGQ? FOS
On another note, the same thing looks odd for Hiro changing his vote to pull the hammer on ILJ so close to the deadline. At the time, it was six votes ILJ, and six votes GG, with ILJ to be lynched, and Hiro only had 5 votes. To have been killed, he would have needed two people to hop onto his wagon, so his nervousness and voting ILJ simply to "save" himself, looks very selfish, if not scummy. He wasn't in any danger, but still ensured ILJ's lynch. I DID stand by my opinion. My opinion all day was that Impervious should be lynched, and I stood by it. I'm not going to switch to a bad lynch just because everyone else is ignoring a good one. You asked me a question and I answered it, but that doesn't mean I want to kill giraffe. He's just a lurker so out of those three I would kill giraffe. But I'm not satisfied with lynching lurkers, tbh, I think it's a bad way to play. And I didn't vote for him to 'save' ILJ because frankly I wasn't positive that he was town. I thought he might have been mafia, I just didn't think the case on him was good enough to warrant a lynch.By the way, I think it's always a bad idea to ignore a good lynch just because the guy looks like he's going to get modkilled. Outside of newbie games, mafia is always going to 'miraculously' appear at the last minute to vote. Lo and behold, Impervious voted. Okay, but it's safe to assume you weren't positive giraffe was town either. So out of the 2 you would rather let giraffe live instead of jonn. What about hiro, did you think he was more likely to be town than jonn aswell? What you did was cast an irrelevant vote. You could have tryed to sway the lynch to any of the top vote getter you thought had a higher chance of being mafia, yet you did not. You said yourseld you would preffer to kill giraffe out of the 3 yet you did not act on it.
You're really stretching to make me look scummy. I've already explained my vote and why I didn't push for any of the top three prospects.
To answer the bold part, yes I would rather have people who find X player scummy to analyse and get X lynched (even if I'm not convinced X is mafia) so we get accusations and defenses etc to scumhunt with, than to just lynch Y player because he's inactive. Inactive lynches are bad.
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On June 19 2011 05:15 VisceraEyes wrote: Well, like with the rest of your posts, this one refers to contributions you'll make either A) when you feel like it or B) when you catch up on the thread.
In the meantime, you still have like 4 or 5 votes on you, and I for one like where my vote is at for now.
I'd like for some veterans to weigh in on RebirthOfLethargy's inactivity.
It's obviously bad play, it's disappointing that he isn't helping more, but he's too upfront about it for me to think he's scum because of it. The only thing fishy about his play to me is the soft hatter claim followed by the really weak DT claim.
I'm more concerned about the people trying to push this easy inactive lynch.
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Voting syllogism, best case so far I think.
Vigs should look into the inactives tonight, especially node seeing as he's on the zodiac list. Play or die.
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On June 20 2011 04:52 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Worst 36 hours of my life that I can remember in ages. However I am back and my schedule is now back to standard life so I shouldn't be mia so long. To start with, I have just caught up on the thread and anyone voting for RoL unvote now. With so little discussion against his lynch it is clear mafia are content with him dying. Factor in his general acting like an ass to me would imply that if he is town he is using it to dodge night hits. Why the hell else would you be so apathetic? Now as to the two other vote targets proposed below. Show nested quote +On June 20 2011 04:28 Varpulis wrote:I'm still really unsure about syllogism. I've read through his posts 3 times, and I can't confidently say mafia or town. I'm leaving my vote on Hiro, at least for the time being. I suggest that we consolidate our votes to three possible lynches, to avoid letting scum hide behind outlier votes. - syllogism
- Hiro Protagonist
- RebirthOfLeGenD
Is that list OK with people? Everybody should pick one, and vote for them, providing reasons as to why they are picking that person over the other two. Protest voting a lurker or somebody in no danger of being lynched is not going to accomplish anything. Hiro has two days worth of suspect behaviour, and has been on the lynch twice. IF he survives this lynch he should be getting vigi'd. Simple. Syllogism has called people out for not contributing and then barely contributed himself. He then follows it up using the excuse. Show nested quote +On June 19 2011 05:50 syllogism wrote: It's just frustrating to even to even attempt scum hunting when play like that is tolerated from veterans. It is decidedly anti-town, even if it's more likely he wouldn't play like that as scum. Now i say this is suspect purely for one simple reason. He doesn't believe RoL would perform this way as scum, but then doesnt try to figure out why RoL is playing the way he is and still votes to kill him. He has since unvoted and has opted to analyze another player on very weak analysis. After this analysis he doesnt even back it up with a vote. Major FoS on him for now. As a new player who has a ton of expectations you don't follow through on what you expect of others, nor do you properly pressure the people you expect more from and rely on other people to do it for you. This being said your activity level throughout the day as well as attempting to do analysis (even if it was terrible but everyone starts at the bottom before learning) I am willing to give you another day to step it up. Hiro has not really done a whole lot, and the moment votes started swapping from RoL elsewhere (syllo and hiro) the thread picked up in activity from what I can see. As such it seems mafia more likely to be opposed to one of the two of these players being lynched. vote hirotheprotagonist Vigi's whichever of the two doesnt get lynched, the other should be shot.
Did you just scumslip by assuming that either of these players would flip green?
Anyways, I think at this point Node is the highest priority for a vig shot, we can't let people on YOUR zodiac list lurk that hardcore.
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On June 20 2011 10:51 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Swaying argument in pm land has led me to believe syllo is a better lynch atm. vote syllogismShow nested quote +On June 20 2011 10:18 GGQ wrote:On June 20 2011 04:52 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Worst 36 hours of my life that I can remember in ages. However I am back and my schedule is now back to standard life so I shouldn't be mia so long. To start with, I have just caught up on the thread and anyone voting for RoL unvote now. With so little discussion against his lynch it is clear mafia are content with him dying. Factor in his general acting like an ass to me would imply that if he is town he is using it to dodge night hits. Why the hell else would you be so apathetic? Now as to the two other vote targets proposed below. On June 20 2011 04:28 Varpulis wrote:I'm still really unsure about syllogism. I've read through his posts 3 times, and I can't confidently say mafia or town. I'm leaving my vote on Hiro, at least for the time being. I suggest that we consolidate our votes to three possible lynches, to avoid letting scum hide behind outlier votes. - syllogism
- Hiro Protagonist
- RebirthOfLeGenD
Is that list OK with people? Everybody should pick one, and vote for them, providing reasons as to why they are picking that person over the other two. Protest voting a lurker or somebody in no danger of being lynched is not going to accomplish anything. Hiro has two days worth of suspect behaviour, and has been on the lynch twice. IF he survives this lynch he should be getting vigi'd. Simple. Syllogism has called people out for not contributing and then barely contributed himself. He then follows it up using the excuse. On June 19 2011 05:50 syllogism wrote: It's just frustrating to even to even attempt scum hunting when play like that is tolerated from veterans. It is decidedly anti-town, even if it's more likely he wouldn't play like that as scum. Now i say this is suspect purely for one simple reason. He doesn't believe RoL would perform this way as scum, but then doesnt try to figure out why RoL is playing the way he is and still votes to kill him. He has since unvoted and has opted to analyze another player on very weak analysis. After this analysis he doesnt even back it up with a vote. Major FoS on him for now. As a new player who has a ton of expectations you don't follow through on what you expect of others, nor do you properly pressure the people you expect more from and rely on other people to do it for you. This being said your activity level throughout the day as well as attempting to do analysis (even if it was terrible but everyone starts at the bottom before learning) I am willing to give you another day to step it up. Hiro has not really done a whole lot, and the moment votes started swapping from RoL elsewhere (syllo and hiro) the thread picked up in activity from what I can see. As such it seems mafia more likely to be opposed to one of the two of these players being lynched. vote hirotheprotagonist Vigi's whichever of the two doesnt get lynched, the other should be shot. Did you just scumslip by assuming that either of these players would flip green? Anyways, I think at this point Node is the highest priority for a vig shot, we can't let people on YOUR zodiac list lurk that hardcore. Based on how both appeared on the lynch docket at roughly the same time and thread activity has spiked at the same time, I would gather 1 is red, whereas the possibility of a second is there it is not guarenteed. If the lynch flips green vig the survivor as that is who the red will be.
The way you said it made it sound like you expected either of them to flip green.
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On June 22 2011 07:50 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: wiggles, if you can mason me.
Don't use a mason on someone who's probably going to die today. Especially when the information would be fine to put in the thread, lol.
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So good of you to start playing as soon as your life is on the line, RoL.
For reference, *RoL and BC are both scum*
For everyone complaining that this would be imbalanced, hosts aren't always going to follow the same rule of splitting the two 'best' players onto opposite teams, or towns will just start metagaming to find scum. There were a lot of good players in this game, it was balanced even if those two are scum. Plus this fits everybody's belief that the three remaining mafia are most likely newbie lurkers. PLUS having two such skilled players would explain how the mafia managed to turn this game into a miry fog of crap so quickly.
BC has been largely useless right from the start of the game. His zodiac list fit mafia goals perfectly as it discouraged medics from protecting skilled players so he could pick off whoever he felt was a threat. He sets himself up as a town leader throughout day 1, then fails to lead the town in any direction at all. He has made no analysis and pushed no lynches except for vaguely encouraging inactive lynches which he of all people should know is a terrible idea. He happily bussed the most inactive player on his team in a situation where it cost his team nothing. He follows bad lynches and suggests using a vigi shot on 'whoever doesn't get lynched', as if he just doesn't give a shit who is scum and who isn't.
But BC is a problem for another time (or for a vigilante if there's an enterprising young gunman out there somewhere). Right now we need to finally kill fucking RoL, whom BC is working his ass off to save. I can't believe his 'GUYS BELIEVE ME IM BEING SO SINCERE RIGHT NOW' act is convincing so many people to switch their votes. His posts have nothing in them except some frankly uninspiring analysis from someone desperate to dodge the lynch again. He's been caught in how many lies now? He pushed a plan that he admits was bad on night one for the sole purpose of keeping himself alive (wtf, seriously?). He contributed little to nothing all game, he's been caught straight up in a trap by a virtually 100% cleared townie, and now he's claimed vigilante. Good one, RoL! And what happens when your target is still alive tomorrow and you claim roleblocked? What is the town supposed to do then?
It's not that hard, guys. Lynch RoL, shoot BC. TY.
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Oh I forgot the last thing, three of the hardest lurkers just jumped on the 'save RoL' bandwagon. Add that to the list.
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On June 23 2011 09:49 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 09:35 GGQ wrote: So good of you to start playing as soon as your life is on the line, RoL.
For reference, *RoL and BC are both scum*
For everyone complaining that this would be imbalanced, hosts aren't always going to follow the same rule of splitting the two 'best' players onto opposite teams, or towns will just start metagaming to find scum. There were a lot of good players in this game, it was balanced even if those two are scum. Plus this fits everybody's belief that the three remaining mafia are most likely newbie lurkers. PLUS having two such skilled players would explain how the mafia managed to turn this game into a miry fog of crap so quickly.
BC has been largely useless right from the start of the game. His zodiac list fit mafia goals perfectly as it discouraged medics from protecting skilled players so he could pick off whoever he felt was a threat. He sets himself up as a town leader throughout day 1, then fails to lead the town in any direction at all. He has made no analysis and pushed no lynches except for vaguely encouraging inactive lynches which he of all people should know is a terrible idea. He happily bussed the most inactive player on his team in a situation where it cost his team nothing. He follows bad lynches and suggests using a vigi shot on 'whoever doesn't get lynched', as if he just doesn't give a shit who is scum and who isn't.
But BC is a problem for another time (or for a vigilante if there's an enterprising young gunman out there somewhere). Right now we need to finally kill fucking RoL, whom BC is working his ass off to save. I can't believe his 'GUYS BELIEVE ME IM BEING SO SINCERE RIGHT NOW' act is convincing so many people to switch their votes. His posts have nothing in them except some frankly uninspiring analysis from someone desperate to dodge the lynch again. He's been caught in how many lies now? He pushed a plan that he admits was bad on night one for the sole purpose of keeping himself alive (wtf, seriously?). He contributed little to nothing all game, he's been caught straight up in a trap by a virtually 100% cleared townie, and now he's claimed vigilante. Good one, RoL! And what happens when your target is still alive tomorrow and you claim roleblocked? What is the town supposed to do then?
It's not that hard, guys. Lynch RoL, shoot BC. TY. I literally answered all of your BC bullshit in a previous post. Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 00:28 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Mataza, there is a part of me that really really wants to hope you are red, just to explain your shitty reasoning, and your flat out wrong statements. Just because we lynch a townie does NOT mean that we get no information from the day. If you say that one more time I will murder you with a keyboard. Do you see both of my analysis? They both use previous days posting, and by flat out ignoring day 2 as having information you look like a jackass. Every time someone dies you gain information from it, its just how much information. The fact you wish to ignore ALL behavior analysis and focus solely on your plan is fucking retarded. I begged, I pleaded, I did everything I could on skype to show you I was town and at the end of the day all you could say was "But the trap!" Do you see the problem here? I am outputting analysis and trying to shut down scum, and because of how hard headed you had to act I was forced to fucking role claim in order to try to save my ass. I fucking HATE role claiming, but you need to realize what you are about to lose if you kill me. I knew it would look scummy, but I also knew it was information you needed to know preferably before its 9:50pm. Please though, put together an analysis on me, then your case will ACTUALLY have merit. Whenever I set a trap for someone in PM's I make sure there is a reason behind it. They have to look partially scummy to begin with and you have to have some reason to think I am scummy in order to set a trap, so by all means show us an analysis. I don't want to see one more fucking post about your shit trap that is going to lose the town the game if people actually follow you. Second of all about BC killing Node. Are you retarded? Seriously, I want to know. We called for a vigi on hiro to clear up that issue, but then an even better answer came around. Hiro was a mad hatter and could therefore just kill himself, and if he didn't then he was a liar and we lynch him and get a mafia later. Look what you wrote. Now after the day 2 lynch both RoL and BC were in favor that the survivor of the lynch should be shot for good measure. Then Hiro claimed his role. Suddenly after this roleclaim, BC found a third guy that was never up for shooting until this point, Node. This came practically out of thin air.BC literally pulled this out after Hiro claimed his role to him. If BC really was sure about Node, why didn´t he call for Hiro and Node to be shot? I want you all to grasp the gravity of this statement, and just how stupid it was. We called for vigi's on hiro, yes. We wanted to resolve that issue, as stated previously if vigi's stack they don't waste their hits so we could ensure hiro died. Even if BC thought Node was mafia at that time there is no reasonable way for him to ensure that both hits are resolved properly and both end up dead. On top of which from what I can tell BC was working with what he had. At that time we needed hiro to die to clear up suspects, and as you even stated earlier, at that point we had no real information to work with, so even if BC was suspicious of Node, why would he call for a vigi hit on him unless he was certain? Wasting a vigilante hit is retarded, especially if you aren't sure or it isn't necessary. In the case of Hiro, if he had not claimed a vig hit would indeed be necessary because it saves the town from wasting the next days lynch. In the case of node, I would imagine BC had suspicions of him, as even I did at some points in the thread and when given the option of Mad Hatter Hiro why would we waste his suicide? Might as well hit a scummy suspect, so BC capitalized and had him hit Node, which is totally reasonable. To counter your argument of BC sacrificing Node because, well why the fuck not? Look at reasoning. If BC played along had hiro bomb someone then just role blocked him, we would be using this fucking lynch to kill hiro right now, and would still be in a world of shit. From what I know, I am pretty sure his bomb was on a townie last night as well, so a role block and a lynch would actually put us in a 6-5 scenario for tomorrow, meaning a guaranteed game over for town barring absolute perfection. So regardless of your KP math, and your wonderful little MSPaint picture, your reasoning is just flat out fucking wrong. Your explanation of BC being godfather and pushing node is wrong. Your trap while ignoring any sort of actual behavior analysis is stupid, and your belief that there is no way to get analysis from town lynches is just flat out wrong. So tell me are you going to shape up or shut up? I really don't give a shit which one at this point, but constantly deflecting your redundant and meaningless words, arguments, and opinions is growing tiresome. And as a shout out to the remaining townies, all it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to stand by and do nothing. Do something, and we will win this. If this lynch happens the way I hope it will, I can almost assure victory for us. Now shut up.
Sorry, I'm getting mixed messages from you. Did you want me to post more or did you want me to shut up?
That post doesn't answer anything about what I said about BC, just about bussing Node. Good to see you defending him like he's defending you, though, that makes me feel just a little more secure. Thanks.
And I shouldn't need to do an analysis on you to show that you are mafia if people are actually reading the thread.
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On June 23 2011 09:53 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 09:49 VisceraEyes wrote: RoL, you say 'Prove I'm Scum With Analysis'.
But you have nothing to analyze except pushing a townie lynch and defending yourself. Trust me, I looked.
Now you have a couple analyses, but those were done under the gun and could be viewed as bussing your teammates since you were actually in danger at the time.
Stop telling people PISWA...I think it's PISWAter. Anything can be analyzed. Look at youngminii, he did barely anything. Look at fudgemunkey, he did barely anything. Yet I mounted convincing cases against them. Evidence is always there, its just a matter of if you can see it or not. I have played my fair share of mafia and know how to do an analysis. If you think I am honestly just pushing my team mates in front of a train then by all means accept the free kills and get to me later. You are basically admitting right now that you can't find anything I wrote that is really scummy, nothing that stands out, yet for some reason still want to believe I am scum.
I don't find your cases convincing at all, actually. A 'long' analysis is not the same as a 'convincing' analysis.
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On June 23 2011 09:58 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 09:54 GGQ wrote:On June 23 2011 09:49 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 23 2011 09:35 GGQ wrote: So good of you to start playing as soon as your life is on the line, RoL.
For reference, *RoL and BC are both scum*
For everyone complaining that this would be imbalanced, hosts aren't always going to follow the same rule of splitting the two 'best' players onto opposite teams, or towns will just start metagaming to find scum. There were a lot of good players in this game, it was balanced even if those two are scum. Plus this fits everybody's belief that the three remaining mafia are most likely newbie lurkers. PLUS having two such skilled players would explain how the mafia managed to turn this game into a miry fog of crap so quickly.
BC has been largely useless right from the start of the game. His zodiac list fit mafia goals perfectly as it discouraged medics from protecting skilled players so he could pick off whoever he felt was a threat. He sets himself up as a town leader throughout day 1, then fails to lead the town in any direction at all. He has made no analysis and pushed no lynches except for vaguely encouraging inactive lynches which he of all people should know is a terrible idea. He happily bussed the most inactive player on his team in a situation where it cost his team nothing. He follows bad lynches and suggests using a vigi shot on 'whoever doesn't get lynched', as if he just doesn't give a shit who is scum and who isn't.
But BC is a problem for another time (or for a vigilante if there's an enterprising young gunman out there somewhere). Right now we need to finally kill fucking RoL, whom BC is working his ass off to save. I can't believe his 'GUYS BELIEVE ME IM BEING SO SINCERE RIGHT NOW' act is convincing so many people to switch their votes. His posts have nothing in them except some frankly uninspiring analysis from someone desperate to dodge the lynch again. He's been caught in how many lies now? He pushed a plan that he admits was bad on night one for the sole purpose of keeping himself alive (wtf, seriously?). He contributed little to nothing all game, he's been caught straight up in a trap by a virtually 100% cleared townie, and now he's claimed vigilante. Good one, RoL! And what happens when your target is still alive tomorrow and you claim roleblocked? What is the town supposed to do then?
It's not that hard, guys. Lynch RoL, shoot BC. TY. I literally answered all of your BC bullshit in a previous post. On June 23 2011 00:28 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Mataza, there is a part of me that really really wants to hope you are red, just to explain your shitty reasoning, and your flat out wrong statements. Just because we lynch a townie does NOT mean that we get no information from the day. If you say that one more time I will murder you with a keyboard. Do you see both of my analysis? They both use previous days posting, and by flat out ignoring day 2 as having information you look like a jackass. Every time someone dies you gain information from it, its just how much information. The fact you wish to ignore ALL behavior analysis and focus solely on your plan is fucking retarded. I begged, I pleaded, I did everything I could on skype to show you I was town and at the end of the day all you could say was "But the trap!" Do you see the problem here? I am outputting analysis and trying to shut down scum, and because of how hard headed you had to act I was forced to fucking role claim in order to try to save my ass. I fucking HATE role claiming, but you need to realize what you are about to lose if you kill me. I knew it would look scummy, but I also knew it was information you needed to know preferably before its 9:50pm. Please though, put together an analysis on me, then your case will ACTUALLY have merit. Whenever I set a trap for someone in PM's I make sure there is a reason behind it. They have to look partially scummy to begin with and you have to have some reason to think I am scummy in order to set a trap, so by all means show us an analysis. I don't want to see one more fucking post about your shit trap that is going to lose the town the game if people actually follow you. Second of all about BC killing Node. Are you retarded? Seriously, I want to know. We called for a vigi on hiro to clear up that issue, but then an even better answer came around. Hiro was a mad hatter and could therefore just kill himself, and if he didn't then he was a liar and we lynch him and get a mafia later. Look what you wrote. Now after the day 2 lynch both RoL and BC were in favor that the survivor of the lynch should be shot for good measure. Then Hiro claimed his role. Suddenly after this roleclaim, BC found a third guy that was never up for shooting until this point, Node. This came practically out of thin air.BC literally pulled this out after Hiro claimed his role to him. If BC really was sure about Node, why didn´t he call for Hiro and Node to be shot? I want you all to grasp the gravity of this statement, and just how stupid it was. We called for vigi's on hiro, yes. We wanted to resolve that issue, as stated previously if vigi's stack they don't waste their hits so we could ensure hiro died. Even if BC thought Node was mafia at that time there is no reasonable way for him to ensure that both hits are resolved properly and both end up dead. On top of which from what I can tell BC was working with what he had. At that time we needed hiro to die to clear up suspects, and as you even stated earlier, at that point we had no real information to work with, so even if BC was suspicious of Node, why would he call for a vigi hit on him unless he was certain? Wasting a vigilante hit is retarded, especially if you aren't sure or it isn't necessary. In the case of Hiro, if he had not claimed a vig hit would indeed be necessary because it saves the town from wasting the next days lynch. In the case of node, I would imagine BC had suspicions of him, as even I did at some points in the thread and when given the option of Mad Hatter Hiro why would we waste his suicide? Might as well hit a scummy suspect, so BC capitalized and had him hit Node, which is totally reasonable. To counter your argument of BC sacrificing Node because, well why the fuck not? Look at reasoning. If BC played along had hiro bomb someone then just role blocked him, we would be using this fucking lynch to kill hiro right now, and would still be in a world of shit. From what I know, I am pretty sure his bomb was on a townie last night as well, so a role block and a lynch would actually put us in a 6-5 scenario for tomorrow, meaning a guaranteed game over for town barring absolute perfection. So regardless of your KP math, and your wonderful little MSPaint picture, your reasoning is just flat out fucking wrong. Your explanation of BC being godfather and pushing node is wrong. Your trap while ignoring any sort of actual behavior analysis is stupid, and your belief that there is no way to get analysis from town lynches is just flat out wrong. So tell me are you going to shape up or shut up? I really don't give a shit which one at this point, but constantly deflecting your redundant and meaningless words, arguments, and opinions is growing tiresome. And as a shout out to the remaining townies, all it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to stand by and do nothing. Do something, and we will win this. If this lynch happens the way I hope it will, I can almost assure victory for us. Now shut up. Sorry, I'm getting mixed messages from you. Did you want me to post more or did you want me to shut up? That post doesn't answer anything about what I said about BC, just about bussing Node. Good to see you defending him like he's defending you, though, that makes me feel just a little more secure. Thanks. And I shouldn't need to do an analysis on you to show that you are mafia if people are actually reading the thread. With this logic why should anyone ever do an analysis? It answers everything about BC, what else would you like to know? Why he stepped on defending me? Well if everyone read this thread, as you undoubtedly did then you would of seen the post where I explain that too. Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 06:39 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 23 2011 06:05 ~OpZ~ wrote:On June 23 2011 05:16 VisceraEyes wrote: Balance cannot be used as far as I can see. Anyone got anything else? Time is ticking. Further evidence backing up RoL's case against youngminii and fudgemonkey. Personally I would rather we just move all the votes to fudgemonkey, allow RoL to Vig YM at night (given he is actually a vig), and go from there. That seriously seems like the best course of action, because if YM isn't red, then it's down to BC and RoL. AND WHERE THE FUCK IS KANTBEUSEFULCHI?! YM flipping might clear up an issue that I really doubt fudgemunkeys death will. That is my issue here. I really can't say more about it. Oh and Mataza you want to know why BC is defending me? I asked him for help. I saw this railroad coming and you were half ignoring everything I said claiming it was predeath scum wifom. I pleaded my case to BC and asked him if he honestly thought I was scum based off behavior, he didn't and when you showed your little "bread crumb" that was why I knew you were blue, he knew this was stupid. Btw thanks for after I post about how you do stupid shit, you respond by leaking all my mason information in a desperate attempt to prove I lied. Hint: I didn't. Please, you and your scum buddies keep bringing more and more bullshit in this thread to confuse just enough people to let you vote stack me at the very end. On that note, kenpachi unless you want to be solely responsible for another town defeat you will get back on the youngminii lynch. Right now as it is tied, I know I am going to get switched onto last minute and die. There is only an hour left in the day.
Stop talking about BC, it doesn't matter right now, theres only an hour left to the lynch. I'll get to him in the night phase.
Want an analysis of your posts? 50% of them are oneliners with nothing in them. But hey, that makes you look better when you can discredit other people for having fewer posts. Way to spam. How about an analysis of you refusing to work with the town? Or an analysis of you claiming hatter and then claiming a red dt check on Kenpachi and then bitching the whole town out when we don't lynch him on your worthless word (way to back that one up with analysis btw, thanks for that!). But I guess that was all just another ploy to help you stay alive longer because you are just so fucking valuable amirite?
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On June 23 2011 10:01 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 09:55 GGQ wrote:On June 23 2011 09:53 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 23 2011 09:49 VisceraEyes wrote: RoL, you say 'Prove I'm Scum With Analysis'.
But you have nothing to analyze except pushing a townie lynch and defending yourself. Trust me, I looked.
Now you have a couple analyses, but those were done under the gun and could be viewed as bussing your teammates since you were actually in danger at the time.
Stop telling people PISWA...I think it's PISWAter. Anything can be analyzed. Look at youngminii, he did barely anything. Look at fudgemunkey, he did barely anything. Yet I mounted convincing cases against them. Evidence is always there, its just a matter of if you can see it or not. I have played my fair share of mafia and know how to do an analysis. If you think I am honestly just pushing my team mates in front of a train then by all means accept the free kills and get to me later. You are basically admitting right now that you can't find anything I wrote that is really scummy, nothing that stands out, yet for some reason still want to believe I am scum. I don't find your cases convincing at all, actually. A 'long' analysis is not the same as a 'convincing' analysis. Please, point out my problems. You are by FAR the first person to disagree with them outright. Also funny, first you think I am bussing my team mates, but now my analysis suck? Please stick to an argument.
I never accused you of bussing your teammates, keep your player names straight.
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I put some of my thoughts on RoL's analysis of YM in red below. Didn't get very far because it's so awful.
On June 22 2011 06:04 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Alright well, lets start off with a basic explanation of mafia thread behavior. First off on day one, they will either start or support a bad lynch which is pretty easy and lacks suspicion just because everyone knows day 1 sucks. After that the mafia generally start and support bad lynches, but generally they won't comment on the lynch, or will express their reservations about the target. Most importantly though, when a town is fucking up, just let them run their war path and don't do shit. Youngminii is guilty of all of the above. Day 1 he started the wagon on ILJ with shitty reasoning and later claimed it was to apply pressure, and that he didn't think ILJ was scummy, which is complete bullshit. Read his relentless assault against ILJ, a helpless townie who got hit by a train. He goes PBP then when ILJ starts trying to counter it he continues to bash him relentlessly. ILJ not being skilled enough to defend himself gets freighted. It's not entirely ILJ's fault though, day 1 is hard to defend yourself, especially for newer players. This is a complete twisting of what actually happened. YM didn't start any wagon at all. He found a sketchy post by ILJ (and that random lurker list WAS sketchy, it caught my eye too) then compared his play this game to his play in other games and found it was more similar to his scum play than his town play. He NEVER pushed the lynch on ILJ, he just pestered ILJ to defend himself which ILJ never did adequately. In fact, YM actively encouraged other people NOT to bandwagon in his initial analysis. He also NEVER said that it was to apply pressure he just said that part of the purpose of a lynch in general is to apply pressure and judge reactions. He also never said that he didn't think ILJ was scummy, he said that ILJ had a pretty low chance of being mafia. He never EVER claimed that he was 'sure' or 'very convinced' that ILJ was mafia, just that he thought ILJ was the most likely to be mafia, even if the chances were low.
I'd go on, but this should be enough already to demonstrate that your analysis is full of twisting words to make things appear how you want them to appear. You are scum. Please lynch this guy, town.Day 2 he half ass pushes me, and as soon as I post back he claims its just to pressure me to start posting. Smart by him, since it took him off my radar temporarily, and because arguing with me would of been stupid to do. At that point the wagons on syllogism and hiro are already building, and youngminii goes AFK and lets us fuck up on our own. The thread inactivity had me feeling weird, but unluckily for me most of my scum suspects were on hiro, so I pushed through with the syllogism lynch thinking that was enough. But look at this from a mafia perspective. None of your members are under fire and the town is on its way to a bad lynch and utter confusion the next day? what are you to do as scum? Sit back and let them fuck themselves. Which is exactly what he did. Maybe he was busy with dreamhack LRing, but honestly he is still on TL.Net and you are telling me you were WAY too busy to even look at the mafia thread? Even between games? Bullshit. Day 3, he knows my lynch is a crapshoot and acts coy at first, then jumps on my bandwagon. But seriously, don't take my overview of this entire scenario for fact, I am going to go a step further and give you an analysis of youngminii, even if you bastards are going to kill me anyway. Day 1Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 14:33 youngminii wrote:aidnai I'm going to have to ask you to stop posting junk (as awesome as it may be) into this thread. This is not a public discussion thread for you to live report Ver's games. Spam: Spam is not tolerated, nor is any off-topic material. Do not discuss Proleague here. Do not talk about Starcraft II here. Play Mafia here. My first suspect for this game will be ilovejonn. He has 7 posts since game start, all of which are blanket posts that have no real content. Here are several of his posts: + Show Spoiler +On June 14 2011 11:54 ilovejonn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2011 11:53 hiro protagonist wrote: anyone up for a little night time scum hunting... I don't know... I think that requires a few (and by a few I mean a whole lot) more posts. Fluff On June 14 2011 12:15 ilovejonn wrote: @Varpulis
I think I'll have to disagree with point number 2. I'd suggest waiting it out so that most people have posted and use their checks on who they think would be scum based on the posts made during night 0. I mean the whole point of this game IS to find scum, unless of course you find the posting behaviour of a "strong player" a bit suspicious, then yea go ahead and use your check on them. If not I heed people to wait until near the end of the night cycle to submit your actions. (unless of course you won't be there on time) Note the uncertainty in this post: "I think", "I'd suggest", "unless of course", "If not", "unless of course (again)". This is quite scummy behaviour, to me it looks like he's just trying to reassure everyone that you don't HAVE to follow his rules if you don't want to because he doesn't want to seem suspicious in any way whatsoever. Which a townie wouldn't do. Hell, not even a blue would do that. On June 14 2011 12:56 ilovejonn wrote: no This is in response to Sandroba's plan. While this is a lot more forward and not as uncertain as the previous post, he's still not contributing any content with this. If you look at this post as if ilovejonn was town, why would he bother making it? If you look at his mafia play (see below) this post kind of stands out pretty clearly. On June 14 2011 13:37 ilovejonn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 14 2011 13:28 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Zodiac list time.
Rebirthoflegend BloodyC0bbler Node Mr.Wiggles Kitaman Opz Youngminii Scamp
I'd also like to suggest that people on this list, if you're on towns side of course, to start posting, because you know, getting killed Night 0 sucks. Again with the "I'd also like to suggest". He also doesn't actually post anything, he just quoted the almighty Zodiac list and said "guys you should post" which is the entire point of the list in the first place. On June 14 2011 13:59 ilovejonn wrote: I think we need to move on. The plan is bad, no one should do what sandroba suggested, now we can all stop posting about it. "I think". Obvously the plan is bad, everyone is moving on, you want everyone to stop posting about it yet you're posting about it. There's nothing here, the plan's been heralded as terrible by most of the players. On June 15 2011 11:12 ilovejonn wrote: People who did not post N0:
10. sinani206 17. grassgiraffe 23. LandenC 24. Jacinto
Putting 26. Lazorbear in as well for 1 very short post. What's the incentive for a townie posting this? Weeding out inactives. Has there been talk of an inactive lynch? No. Then why would you post this? To me this looks like ilovejonn is trying to quietly push for an (easy) inactive lynch by posting all the inactives. Notice that he doesn't just outright say "hey these guys are inactive, let's lynch one if he continues to lurk", he doesn't even accuse them of lurking. He literally only puts the list up and lets us make of it as we want. Which can only be one thing, an inactive lynch. This is so pure scum play. Content that's not real content, an agenda that's not explicitly stated and this goes well with his contentless posts that he made Night 0. He avoids the list by having posted pointless dribble. Now you might say "but youngminii, maybe he's just a bad town, you're being too harsh on him". Thankfully I went and looked at his game histories. I have two that I will share with you, one where he's a townie and one where he's scum. I'll only limit showing you the very early game posting habits of ilovejonn. + Show Spoiler [ilovejonn's town play] +Okay, for his town play I'll be referring to Mafia XXVIII. What I want you to see is how his posts are either (or a mixture of) helpful, loaded with content, fearless and very accusing. Here's a few of his first posts: On April 11 2011 00:11 ilovejonn wrote: If I appear to be inactive, that's because I am really sick atm. I've read 10+ pages and right now GMarshal and Protactinium are top of my list for mayor. However as there is no voting thread yet for whatever reason :S, I'm going to stay in bed and rest until the thread is up and my voting is required. I also like Protact's posts a lot more than GM. Yes, GM is easy to read, but I agree with Protact that he isn't superbly great at analysis. Protact's each and every post was filled with so much content, meeting quality over quantity in my eyes, and gets to the point without beating around the bush. As a town leader (yes, I know his win-condition is not town) and an analyst, I would much more likely be in favor of Protact.
I believe even by having him alive in the early game while he still feels like siding with town, he can create a much ideal environment for the town. At least his posts motivate me to play and post better.
Also, sure if you think me being sick is an excuse, but I just wanted to get this out there in the case I really cannot post due to illness. I'm already trying my best to keep up with this thread by at least posting Day 1. On April 12 2011 04:02 ilovejonn wrote: ##Vote ilovejonn
Placeholder until I get back from work and read everything tonight. He's not even afraid to vote himself as a placeholder. That's how fearless he is as a townie, he doesn't give a second thought to "oh what if people think I'm abstaining my vote until later so I can voteswitch more easily". No, he just does it, because he has no reason to be scared. You are only scared if you are guilty. On April 12 2011 12:14 ilovejonn wrote: If my counting is correct, Dr. H is leading the mayor position with 13 votes and Pardoner landing onto GM with 12 votes. (By the time I am typing this up) There are people who have yet to vote, but with this many new players in the game I'm expecting 1 or 2 modkills.
Somehow because GM attracts new players to vote for him it is very unusual and scummy. What I find more scummy is the fact that there are a ton of switch votes towards Dr. H that is making him lead in votes. Like Kavdragon said, Dr. H has said that he would not run for mayor, BUT because he doesn't trust anyone else as mayor other than himself (because that would avoid mafia influence) he ran for mayor. His whole mayor platform is just, "I'm willing to listen to town discussion but if I decide that the town decision doesn't sound right to me, I will lynch whoever I feel is scum. (Even when the majority of the town says the lynch target is not scum) Also, don't blame me if I lynched town because everyone makes mistakes." Yet, he is getting votes purely because of people having a town read on him. I want a townie as Mayor too, but definitely not Dr.H.
Having said all this, I'm not saying that Dr. H is scum, I just do not feel comfortable with him being Mayor, especially with all the vote switches onto him. I'm inclined to believe there's at least 1 scum on the list of people that voted for him.
These are a few people who decided to switch to him (not complete list of who voted for Dr. H)
13.kevconsim - GM > DocH 16.tnkted - tnkted > DocH > GM (changed vote while I was typing this) 18.urashimakt - Prot > DocH 27.DoctorHelvetica - GM > DocH (lol) 28.darmousseh - GM > DocH 33.redFF - Prot > DocH
This list serves no purpose other than for me to keep track of who voted for what, but I decided to share it for those of you who do not do these types of record-keeping. My unwillingness to vote for Dr. H is based on the fact that there are many vote switches for him, as well as the general feelings I get from reading his posts.
What I wanted was for GM to be Mayor and Protactinium as Pardoner. I'm not saying the Pardoner is not an important role. I have read about why having scum in this role is not beneficial as it gives reds a free no lynch cycle, but I am still willing to take the risk and offer Prot the position as I feel his abilities and skill can be very beneficial to town, even if he decides to turn against us during the late game.
Think about it this way, we have him in the position, he uses his KP and DT checks depending on our decision or we lynch him. Except for his last one to complete his win condition of course. We don't have him in a position and he is forced to use his own judgement and KP that will most likely hit 1 or 2 townies (due to blacks are better off playing townie-like than-scum like).
In conclusion, I will place my vote on Protactinium in hopes that he can get the Pardoner position. But the chances are probably very slim because there's less than an hour til Day ends. Just look at how much content this post has! This is great, this is analysis, this is deciding what to do and making a detailed post about what he feels and what he's going to do. All of those quotes were back to back, there was no mindless dribble between them, he didn't spam up the thread with one word posts, he made great posts that were of use to town. This is wildly different to how he's been playing this game. + Show Spoiler [ilovejonn's mafia play] +For his scum play I'll be referring to Mafia XXIX. Again, only the earlier posts (after the day post) as this is what pertains to the current context. On May 04 2011 12:33 ilovejonn wrote:Show nested quote +All you scum players looking for tips can bug them both nonstep for help at your leisure. :D not perfect On May 04 2011 12:36 ilovejonn wrote: blue font scared me there.... damn you. On May 04 2011 12:59 ilovejonn wrote: Apparently redtooth thinks Irish slipped cause he thought he knows 3-4 ppl playing in this game as ppl on his scum team. Just a misunderstood post imo. On May 04 2011 13:13 ilovejonn wrote: Yes guys.. don't edit. ever. Ahh, there's the ilovejonn we all recognise, all these posts are back to back, starting with his first post after the day post. Absolutely nothing, no content, ONE post faking content. I see a connection. On May 05 2011 04:26 ilovejonn wrote: Just finished reading the thread. I read really slow as I'm often thinking about other stuff when I read.
First I'll give my opinion on the Irish13 discussion even though it has dropped. I like what redtooth did do get responses out of people but as he said himself, it became a null tell when almost everyone defended Irish. The post redtooth used to invoke responses from was a post that could have been misinterpreted by people and from seeing people defend Irish, it leads me to believe Irish isn't scum. I've only played 4-5 games on TL mafia, but I'd like to ask what does RSV/RQV stand for?
Secondly, my gut feelings tell me that redtooth and chaoser are not scum based on their posts. They are actually quality posts, and even if they are scum, at least what they are posting benefits town for now. It is better to heed the advices in their posts than to bash them for it (for now). I don't want another Kavdragon incident in here again where we lynch someone because they are "too pro-town". Pretty silly.
Last but not least, FOS Kurumi and Airblade. Kurumi for his posting behaviour. Why are you posting like that? Maybe English isn't your first language but what about the post with numbers? Are you trying to breadcrumb something? I'm just not understanding your posts. Airblade for saying "At least if we lynch him and he flips town, we won't have to attempt to read those type of posts anymore." That is extremely anti-town. Of course you would want to lynch someone who isn't scum, because then you'd waste a day AND lynched a townie, am I right? Wishy washy. No REAL fos, just a few uncertain questions asked. Also he posts this after other people have already basically raised the same issues. I'm aware ilovejonn hasn't made any posts like this in the current game but I point this out because it is textbook scum play and he's displaying the usual uncertainty and "oh no I'm guilty how do I cover it up as best I can?". On May 05 2011 04:34 ilovejonn wrote: I don't think you should kid about lynches. Our votes are very valuable and it's basically our only way of killing scum. "I don't think", note how he doesn't say this in his town play. On May 05 2011 07:03 ilovejonn wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2011 06:36 orgolove wrote: So we're just letting people divert our attention from the actual scum posts. Redtooth has shown clear signs of scummy behavior, both in his lies, his attempts to turn this discussion into useless pages about "experience," his lies, his inane essay posts without any real substance, his lies, his lies, and his lies.
And we're just letting the suspicion go just like that? I think this is true. I don't know why he would ask questions such as what was your mafia experience. Sure it generates discussion but is any of that really relevant to scum hunting? Unless this is another one of his plans to draw out responses.. Speaks for itself, not real content, similar to posts in current game. I'm going to end this here. Even though there are more posts I can quote, they're mostly of the same dribble and will only repeat what I've been trying to point out. You can check it out yourself. Verdict? I'm voting for ilovejonn, he's the best lynch candidate (and the first of the game I guess) I can see. I am well aware I'm under scrutiny because of that Zodiac list crap and that if I am wrong about this, I might just be creating an easy bandwagon for mafia to jump on. That said, if you are a townie make sure you don't just jump on the bandwagon until you've read the analysis and read his responses. I eagerly await your response, ilovejonn. This is where he starts his band wagon on ILJ. As pointed out later, a lot of this is stretched, and to be honest this is a fine thing to do just to get ILJ to start posting. But he goes further then that. Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 15:04 youngminii wrote:On June 15 2011 14:52 ilovejonn wrote:hokay there buddy. First off, I'm not going to make a rebuttal out of every point you made because clearly with your PbPA you're stretching a lot of points to justify a conclusion you already had in mind beforehand with posts that don't actually add anything. Also, don't try to do a meta-read on me, I might be playing different because I want to, I may be playing different because I've learned a few things, I might like to use "I think" or "unless of course" because I deemed it necessary to show that I am unsure (it was n0 after all). When you meta read someone, you're heavily biased to see what you wanted to see in the first place anyways. Let's read one of those points: Note the uncertainty in this post: "I think", "I'd suggest", "unless of course", "If not", "unless of course (again)". This is quite scummy behaviour, to me it looks like he's just trying to reassure everyone that you don't HAVE to follow his rules if you don't want to because he doesn't want to seem suspicious in any way whatsoever. Which a townie wouldn't do. Hell, not even a blue would do that.
What makes you say a townie wouldn't do that? Wait a minute, I read my post again and what? You take those words out of context and shape them into something that you deem scummy. I lol'd. It also seems to be a recurring theme in your analysis. I'm done here because I don't want to waste time defending myself when I could possibly find scum, but I like the direction you're going for generating discussion since there aren't any posts since Day 1 started, so thanks. Interesting post. I'm not really stretching a lot of points, your posts literally fall into my big box of scum. I am not meta-reading you, I am using meta to support my argument, there's a difference. Also, I'd have to ask, why would you play differently if you won both games, alive and well? That's easy, you're not. You can't just decide to switch off who you are. How did I take those words out of context? The context is you saying those things in this game and in the game you were mafia. A townie doesn't say these things, a townie says what's on his mind without hindrance. You don't want to waste time defending yourself, but you're not finding scum either. You've been decently active and haven't made a single post with content in it. This is a contradiction. Your response has been pretty poor so far, did you even read the part where I showed your scum play and your town play? You kind of just ignored it and said "I might be playing different because I want to", which isn't really a defense. There's no real discussion other than this so unless you're actually going to go find some scum, why don't you spend some time defending yourself? There's nothing else to do so far, why are you avoiding the pressure? There was pages of this bullshit, him going back and forth with ILJ just reiterating his shitty points and twisting ILJ's words. From ILJ's defense posts its pretty clear he was townie, he wasn't responding in a passive aggressive way and the wagon on him built too easily. But seriously, why is youngminii tunneling so hard here? It was off an analysis he later admits was just for pressure and wasn't even good. Show nested quote +On June 17 2011 07:39 youngminii wrote: Yeah I kind of think ilj just tried to redirect focus onto the lurkers even though he said he'd scumhunt + he's lurking too. I kinda disagree with the grassgiraffe vote and I completely disagree with the hiro protagonist vote. Half the lynch is meant for you to pressure the guy and then judge his reaction, it's a little late for that.
Switching vote to ilj. So let me get this straight. The goal of you relentlessly attacking ILJ was to just judge his reaction? Then why didn't you focus on other people after he gave more than adequate responses to your shitty analysis? Well hey, maybe we can say the pressure revealed to you he must of been mafia! Show nested quote +On June 17 2011 08:25 youngminii wrote:On June 17 2011 08:19 VisceraEyes wrote: FoS Sandroba
He's either trying to protect someone by shifting votes last minute or making some kind scum-hunting-power-move. I'm more inclined to believe the former. nono it's essentially ilj vs grassgiraffe the likelihood of either of them being mafia is actually quite low, but yeah even if one of them was scum you could just vote for the other to 'hide' your vote, no need to shift your vote to someone completely random ...but then we have this! So you are pretty sure that neither of them are mafia? Cool, then why did you push ILJ so hard? Simple, because right now you are trying to avoid town backlash for tunneling a townie for half the day cycle until a sufficient band wagon had formed. Day 2Show nested quote +On June 18 2011 15:34 youngminii wrote:Everyone, do me a favour. Click that "All" button at the page numbers, type ctrl+F and look up rebirthoflegend. How the fuck is that not scummy. Here are some golden quotes. On June 14 2011 13:32 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: err, guys. Just to point something out. It's "mason" not "manson" "mansion" or any other aberration of the word.
On a game related note. This is a NORMAL set up, regardless of whatever this silly PM mechanic is. Focus on behavioral analysis because there is no way to legitimately break the game set up that doesn't come with considerable risk.
Think of it this way, in a normal set up with the ability to PM, would you ever recommend a mass role claim Day 2? No, so why the hell would this be any different? Hint: It's not.
Focus on behavioral analysis and putting pressure on people, that is how towns have won games in the past, and that's how we will win this game. Making a plan to abuse format is always secondary to behavioral analysis in any set up.
My next set of grievances would be that. 1. We can't be sure of your alignment. 2. This plan sucks. 3. I don't know anything of your ability to competently deal with an influx of PM's and sort out the bullshit from the nonbullshit. 4. Plan sucks. NOTE: He came up with the 'plan' to mass mason him. I have actually mason'd him and he's literally done NOTHING about it. We've sent each other 3 PMs basically saying 'sup'. Why the fuck would you make half the town mason you when you're literally not going to do a single thing about it? On June 14 2011 16:02 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: I currently just received another masoning, which brings me to 6. Still waiting on others. Ideally I would like to have minimum of 10 people. FOR WHAT? On June 14 2011 17:42 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: medics protect me, problem solved. My goal is different then sandroba's because he wanted to form some half assed blue circle. I am going to use it to kill mafia. I don't use it just to scum hunt, but also to town confirm. Process of elimination baby! That's bullshit, it's the exact same reason as sandroba and you managed to word it differently. On June 15 2011 03:15 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: there is no framing in this game. Stop talking about it. Holy shit.
I know where I am placing my bomb tonight, this is ridiculous. WHY WOULD YOU SOFT CLAIM MAD HATTER? ON THE FIRST NIGHT? Nah this is just scum pretending to leave bread crumbs. On June 15 2011 06:55 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 15 2011 05:20 sandroba wrote: Well, I haven't thought about that, if I'm mafia I would probably be auto elected GF on the off chance the plan might go through, so it's more risky than I originally thought for you guys to trust it. Then again I know I'm not mafia, so if you think so aswel go ahead and proceed with the plan.
The plan does not exclude analysis, it only speeds up the process of clearing and confirming the subjects of analysis. Let's supose there is a list of suspicious people based on behaviour and voting paterns on a previous inocent lynch. I can organize DTs/Vigs to check supicious players on that list and hit the dubious lurkers more efficiently.
It does not stops or hinders any kind of discussion, and it's not like the opinion of the "circle" will be taken at face value either (because even the "circle" does not know each other). Even if a guy is confirmed does not mean he's right as we can tell from many previous games.
The plan I'm sugesting is merely an optimization tool for the efficiency of our blues. The plan itself is blue efficient because it's player list dependant and it's not "required" to work. If no DTs check me or if I die night 0 due to no medic protect we can move on with our lifes. You guys can figure out if I'm mafia or not, hopefully. (clue: I'm not) I have a better method of organizing blues that doesn't involve a potentially scum third party and is completely transparent to the town. X,Y,Z,1,2 are all inactive players. I take the player count (30) divide by 5. we get groups of 6. if you are a DT/Vig between 1-6 shoot/check X If you are a DT/Vig between 7-12 shoot/check Y If you are a DT/Vig between 13-18 shoot/check Z If you are a DT/Vig between 19-24 shoot/check 1 If you are a DT/Vig between 25-30 shoot/check 2 Minimal overlap, rapes lurkers, don't need some shitty plan that gets you killed, the best part of it is that anyone can make the list of who to check/vig and it can be carried out. What the fuck nonsense is this. On June 15 2011 07:36 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 15 2011 07:18 Mataza wrote: RoL, if I recall correctly your own plan hinges on people trusting you and 1-2 Docs randomly protecting you just in case you get targeted.
You don´t plan to achieve anything, except that you are able to pressure scum to slip. Your assumption is, that scum buy *themselves* into a blatant trap. And then you hope scum, after you told everyone what exactly you intend to do, will still slip carelessly.
You being able to scumhunt via PM is a pure assumption. You are convinced it is so, but everyone else has just to hope you are actually that good.
I don´t think your plan is any better, espcially for the part where you tie up half the masoning ability of the whole town. Without any tangible benefit. You might as well get manipulated by a persuasive scum. There is no guarantee you won´t except for your promise to be Superman in PM-Land. All I need to say to this is, I am that good. My track record speaks for itself. The only track record necessary in my eyes is this game. It scream out "HAS DONE NOTHING" On June 15 2011 22:44 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: I will be a sober, conscious, contributing member of XLII society in roughly 9 hours. On June 16 2011 17:26 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: I had a much busier day then I thought, and I ended up going to a party 2.5 hours away last night on an hours notice. But tomorrow I will try to be much more active until I head back into new jersey for a couple of days. Seriously? You get half the town to mason you then you make excuses about how you've been inactive? Nonononononono. "but youngminii you have the let him fly! just wait for him to spread his wings and soar gracefully over the shitfest that TL Mafiaa XLII has become!" On June 17 2011 04:09 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: That's it, Lynch kenpachi. This is ridiculous. You are retarded, and trying to read words off a rock is going to be annoying, so I say we are better off just getting you out of the way right now. This is not flying, this is madness. On June 17 2011 04:48 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: Seriously though, I am not joking. Fuck the other 3 candidates. That was the single worst thing I ever ever read. He is inactive then makes a blanket statement with NO evidence then falls back into inactivity? It's so reckless, and annoying. It needs to go right now.
Lynch kenpachi, honestly maybe I make bold statements but at least I provide reasoning. WHAT REASONING ARE YOU KIDDING ME On June 17 2011 09:06 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: I just got my DT check back, Kenpachi is mafia. ?????????????????????? ??????????????????? ?????????????????? You said this in the day. I don't even know why'd you say this, it's just stupid. On June 17 2011 18:22 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 17 2011 17:22 Node wrote:On June 17 2011 15:54 youngminii wrote: Sorry I wasn't awake for the lynch, I might have changed my vote to hiro (I agree with Varpulis's post against him) but that doesn't really matter anymore.
So uhh, Kenpachi, you realise that pointing out A FUCKING BLUE at night will result in his death right? If RoL is blue (and the safe money is on he isn't) he's a vet trying to draw a mafia shot by claiming everything under the sun. But the fact that Kenpachi of all people realized that he's playing terribly should underline just how useless RoL has been so far this game. I also fail to understand how Kenpachi is pointing out a blue when he calls RoL the GF. Remember that time I carried you in Merc Mafia? don't hate~~ just hand grenade He just used past experiences to gain cred even though he's done literally jackall for this game. I did this once too (it was Mafia XXX that was analysed by Ver, just in case you're curious). This is a big factor in the reason why I personally believe he's mafia, but I know most of you won't accept this as a point in my argument. On June 17 2011 18:25 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: Just some FYI, every day when I wake up and F5 this thread I am given a choice. I can A. Do some analysis and make sure you guys don't fuck up too bad, or B. Watch a marathon of 24. So far 24 has won the last 2 days. Maybe, just maybe if a vigi shoots Kenpachi tonight, 24 will lose the mental coin toss tomorrow.
Just some advice. Why are you playing this game. He makes half of town claim to him, does nothing, pulls this shit?? He's giving excuses for being inactive later. ALERT ALERT THIS IS SCUMMY. On June 18 2011 11:20 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 18 2011 11:05 Kenpachi wrote: Isnt scamp one of them Vets? yeah i think he might be linked to RoL if he is linked to anyone at all. Things like this is why you were supposed to be killed last night. damn it. This just looks like he's taunting town to see how far he can get away with it. I'm sure it is too. Him being mafia can also explain his whole "DTs don't check anyone in the Zodiac list (including me)!!!" What do you have to say RoL? Because at this point you look FAR scummier than Kenpachi or even Hiro is. One of the first posts of day 2, you pressure me hard then claim it was a lawljoke to get me to post. This is seriously a condemning post when contrasted with his response to Mataza's accusation of me on D3. Just so no one misses the point, I am going to travel to the future for a moemnt. Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 00:50 youngminii wrote: stop being silly lynching opz or rol is nothing more than a crapshoot
get a lurker, the lurkers at this stage are just scummy as all hell landenc (and probably demorcerf) would have been modkilled for inactivity if they weren't mafia, the fact that they are keeps them coming back to make one single post
obvious lynches So lynching me and opz is a crapshoot huh? You did an analysis of me not even a day ago to "pressure" me, but now there is a seriously good case against me and you respond that its a crapshoot? This is mafia knowing we are heading into a shit direction and trying to be the one voice of reason in this mess, except anyone with any sense of reasoning would lynch me off of mataza's post. So far Mr. youngminii has showcased quite a bit of bipolarity. One minute hes pushing the shit out of ILJ, the next he is saying how much of a shitfest the lynch was. The next day I am scum suspect #1, and the following day when someone else is pressuring me, all of a sudden I am a crapshoot? Bullshit. When I die you are coming with me. Show nested quote +On June 20 2011 04:38 youngminii wrote:On June 20 2011 04:28 Varpulis wrote:I'm still really unsure about syllogism. I've read through his posts 3 times, and I can't confidently say mafia or town. I'm leaving my vote on Hiro, at least for the time being. I suggest that we consolidate our votes to three possible lynches, to avoid letting scum hide behind outlier votes. - syllogism
- Hiro Protagonist
- RebirthOfLeGenD
Is that list OK with people? Everybody should pick one, and vote for them, providing reasons as to why they are picking that person over the other two. Protest voting a lurker or somebody in no danger of being lynched is not going to accomplish anything. There's no need to explicitly state "these 3 people", it'll become a battle between them anyway. I know I posted a bunch of stuff on RoL but I never actually voted for him because it was just pressure, which seems to have made its point ^^ I'm voting for Hiro because, what can I say, he just seems really scummy to me. He's been accused by two people with separate analyses (which have made perfect sense by the way, I don't know why I didn't pay more attention to them earlier) and lol at his responses He just keeps going around being scum. I COULD give examples, but aidnai and sinani already have. My mind is undecided about Syllogism by the way. This is you hiding behind other peoples analysis on a lynch in which you are letting the town fuck itself up. You know my push on syllogism is going bad places, and you know the hiro lynch is going bad places? What to do as mafia? Post agreeing with someone, get your vote in, go afk and let the town fuck itself. Which is exactly what you did. Show nested quote +On June 20 2011 16:43 youngminii wrote: The vote on Syllogism was an unfortunate case of tunneling by RoL (or maybe he's mafia OHNOES) and bandwagoning.
If I were DT I would check RoL. If I were Vig I'd hit hiro. That is all. This is a classic scumtell the "Oh what bad luck for us!" bullshit. Thanks for accusing me of tunneling guy who pushed ILJ relentlessly Day 1. Proceeds to go AFK for rest of the night cycle. Show nested quote +On June 21 2011 11:34 youngminii wrote:On June 21 2011 11:11 Mataza wrote: Bam! I love it when a plan comes together.
Veteran here, I have taken a hit. I don´t know how exactly the death math turns out but I´m hit regardless. FoS RoL, since Sandroba told RoL via PM I´m blue. Coincidently Sandroba mysteriously died tonight. Removing the witnesses too, are we? mm i'm betting my money on another explanation rol and node were going head to head quite a bit i know they could be doing the shift but the simpler explanation is usually the right one, and for now we should take that into consideration I don' recall ever arguing with node, especially since I barely posted except making fun of kenpachi in Day 1, and node was playing from a cell phone. Now the obvious explanation for this post is that you are distancing yourself from a lynch you know is going to be bad, even if the face of a solid and good case against me. Show nested quote +On June 21 2011 11:42 youngminii wrote:On June 21 2011 11:41 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On June 21 2011 11:40 Mataza wrote:On June 21 2011 11:34 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On June 21 2011 11:31 Mataza wrote: And I know Sandroba masoned BC with his second mason. That is confidential information. That he was. I was never informed of this plan though. I can explain: In case i don´t get targeted tonight our plan was to confirm you by Sandro dropping sly hints towards my blueness and to see if I get targeted the night after. Makes sense. If you told us both same night it wouldnt be tell you anything about either of us. This PM land stuff is tempting me to mason one of you. How secure if your PM circle? this is just funny, trying to not appear scum while asking if BC's PM circle is secure? Well it probably is unless he invites you into it rofl. Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 00:50 youngminii wrote: stop being silly lynching opz or rol is nothing more than a crapshoot
get a lurker, the lurkers at this stage are just scummy as all hell landenc (and probably demorcerf) would have been modkilled for inactivity if they weren't mafia, the fact that they are keeps them coming back to make one single post
obvious lynches hey I completely agree with this post, but only because I know I am town, and I am pretty sure opz is also town. Once again staring in the face of a good argument, youngminii knowing I am not scum decides to try to build town credit by expressing his concerns. Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 01:55 youngminii wrote: yeah okay there's quite a decent chance that they're all red
the only reason i was hesitant on lynching rol was because he's masoned to so many people but yeah all the evidence points against him, if he ends up non-red though i will not be happy Wow, wasn't it hard to sway you here? (Read: It wasn't) and I have 2 masons alive at the moment, and saying my lynch was a crapshoot doesn't equate to you worrying about my mason count. BUT GUYS, IF WE FUCK THIS UP YOUNGMINII WONT BE HAPPY? Hint: He knows it's a fuckjob. Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 04:03 youngminii wrote: You gave us an alternative lynch yesterday. Fool us once, shame on you, fool us twice, shame on us.
You've had 3 days to 'dominate' and use your PM network. It seems as if your recurring theme this game is "fuck you I'll dominate this game later".
Anyway if you don't end up scum then mataza will obviously have some explaining to do. Hey mataza, he's already trying to set you up for tomorrow's lynch, he knows this train is going south, and he wants to make sure everyone knows you were in the conductors seat as this train went off a cliff. In 3 posts, mere hours apart his conviction on me as gone from "THIS IS A CRAPSHOOT" to "FUCK ROL, but srsly, if hes town kill Mataza" Conclusion I would like it if you guys would lynch youngminii instead of me, but I figure that isn't going to happen. The case is VERY strong against youngminii. I would also like to stress this next point. When I flip green, do NOT kill Mataza, kill youngminii. So far on Day 3 all youngminii has done was set him up to be the one guy who stood against my lynch. So do what you guys want to do, like I said earlier, I will go silently to my death. If you think this analysis makes enough sense I would encourage you to vote youngminii in my place, then hell have me vigi'd tonight if you want. I really don't care. Anyway, I am heading to the gym for now, I will drop my vote on youngminii and whoever wants to follow suite feel free. But I stress that you must NOT hold Mataza accountable for my lynch, and instead look at youngminii. Youngminii's posting actually makes me even less suspicious of Mataza because he is clearly trying to set mataza up for tomorrows lynch. I imagine I can't have much more to say. Maybe when I get home I will try to do some more analysis, but for now this is all I have. GL ##Vote youngminii
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On June 23 2011 10:18 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 10:09 GGQ wrote:On June 23 2011 09:58 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 23 2011 09:54 GGQ wrote:On June 23 2011 09:49 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 23 2011 09:35 GGQ wrote: So good of you to start playing as soon as your life is on the line, RoL.
For reference, *RoL and BC are both scum*
For everyone complaining that this would be imbalanced, hosts aren't always going to follow the same rule of splitting the two 'best' players onto opposite teams, or towns will just start metagaming to find scum. There were a lot of good players in this game, it was balanced even if those two are scum. Plus this fits everybody's belief that the three remaining mafia are most likely newbie lurkers. PLUS having two such skilled players would explain how the mafia managed to turn this game into a miry fog of crap so quickly.
BC has been largely useless right from the start of the game. His zodiac list fit mafia goals perfectly as it discouraged medics from protecting skilled players so he could pick off whoever he felt was a threat. He sets himself up as a town leader throughout day 1, then fails to lead the town in any direction at all. He has made no analysis and pushed no lynches except for vaguely encouraging inactive lynches which he of all people should know is a terrible idea. He happily bussed the most inactive player on his team in a situation where it cost his team nothing. He follows bad lynches and suggests using a vigi shot on 'whoever doesn't get lynched', as if he just doesn't give a shit who is scum and who isn't.
But BC is a problem for another time (or for a vigilante if there's an enterprising young gunman out there somewhere). Right now we need to finally kill fucking RoL, whom BC is working his ass off to save. I can't believe his 'GUYS BELIEVE ME IM BEING SO SINCERE RIGHT NOW' act is convincing so many people to switch their votes. His posts have nothing in them except some frankly uninspiring analysis from someone desperate to dodge the lynch again. He's been caught in how many lies now? He pushed a plan that he admits was bad on night one for the sole purpose of keeping himself alive (wtf, seriously?). He contributed little to nothing all game, he's been caught straight up in a trap by a virtually 100% cleared townie, and now he's claimed vigilante. Good one, RoL! And what happens when your target is still alive tomorrow and you claim roleblocked? What is the town supposed to do then?
It's not that hard, guys. Lynch RoL, shoot BC. TY. I literally answered all of your BC bullshit in a previous post. On June 23 2011 00:28 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Mataza, there is a part of me that really really wants to hope you are red, just to explain your shitty reasoning, and your flat out wrong statements. Just because we lynch a townie does NOT mean that we get no information from the day. If you say that one more time I will murder you with a keyboard. Do you see both of my analysis? They both use previous days posting, and by flat out ignoring day 2 as having information you look like a jackass. Every time someone dies you gain information from it, its just how much information. The fact you wish to ignore ALL behavior analysis and focus solely on your plan is fucking retarded. I begged, I pleaded, I did everything I could on skype to show you I was town and at the end of the day all you could say was "But the trap!" Do you see the problem here? I am outputting analysis and trying to shut down scum, and because of how hard headed you had to act I was forced to fucking role claim in order to try to save my ass. I fucking HATE role claiming, but you need to realize what you are about to lose if you kill me. I knew it would look scummy, but I also knew it was information you needed to know preferably before its 9:50pm. Please though, put together an analysis on me, then your case will ACTUALLY have merit. Whenever I set a trap for someone in PM's I make sure there is a reason behind it. They have to look partially scummy to begin with and you have to have some reason to think I am scummy in order to set a trap, so by all means show us an analysis. I don't want to see one more fucking post about your shit trap that is going to lose the town the game if people actually follow you. Second of all about BC killing Node. Are you retarded? Seriously, I want to know. We called for a vigi on hiro to clear up that issue, but then an even better answer came around. Hiro was a mad hatter and could therefore just kill himself, and if he didn't then he was a liar and we lynch him and get a mafia later. Look what you wrote. Now after the day 2 lynch both RoL and BC were in favor that the survivor of the lynch should be shot for good measure. Then Hiro claimed his role. Suddenly after this roleclaim, BC found a third guy that was never up for shooting until this point, Node. This came practically out of thin air.BC literally pulled this out after Hiro claimed his role to him. If BC really was sure about Node, why didn´t he call for Hiro and Node to be shot? I want you all to grasp the gravity of this statement, and just how stupid it was. We called for vigi's on hiro, yes. We wanted to resolve that issue, as stated previously if vigi's stack they don't waste their hits so we could ensure hiro died. Even if BC thought Node was mafia at that time there is no reasonable way for him to ensure that both hits are resolved properly and both end up dead. On top of which from what I can tell BC was working with what he had. At that time we needed hiro to die to clear up suspects, and as you even stated earlier, at that point we had no real information to work with, so even if BC was suspicious of Node, why would he call for a vigi hit on him unless he was certain? Wasting a vigilante hit is retarded, especially if you aren't sure or it isn't necessary. In the case of Hiro, if he had not claimed a vig hit would indeed be necessary because it saves the town from wasting the next days lynch. In the case of node, I would imagine BC had suspicions of him, as even I did at some points in the thread and when given the option of Mad Hatter Hiro why would we waste his suicide? Might as well hit a scummy suspect, so BC capitalized and had him hit Node, which is totally reasonable. To counter your argument of BC sacrificing Node because, well why the fuck not? Look at reasoning. If BC played along had hiro bomb someone then just role blocked him, we would be using this fucking lynch to kill hiro right now, and would still be in a world of shit. From what I know, I am pretty sure his bomb was on a townie last night as well, so a role block and a lynch would actually put us in a 6-5 scenario for tomorrow, meaning a guaranteed game over for town barring absolute perfection. So regardless of your KP math, and your wonderful little MSPaint picture, your reasoning is just flat out fucking wrong. Your explanation of BC being godfather and pushing node is wrong. Your trap while ignoring any sort of actual behavior analysis is stupid, and your belief that there is no way to get analysis from town lynches is just flat out wrong. So tell me are you going to shape up or shut up? I really don't give a shit which one at this point, but constantly deflecting your redundant and meaningless words, arguments, and opinions is growing tiresome. And as a shout out to the remaining townies, all it takes for evil to prevail is for good men to stand by and do nothing. Do something, and we will win this. If this lynch happens the way I hope it will, I can almost assure victory for us. Now shut up. Sorry, I'm getting mixed messages from you. Did you want me to post more or did you want me to shut up? That post doesn't answer anything about what I said about BC, just about bussing Node. Good to see you defending him like he's defending you, though, that makes me feel just a little more secure. Thanks. And I shouldn't need to do an analysis on you to show that you are mafia if people are actually reading the thread. With this logic why should anyone ever do an analysis? It answers everything about BC, what else would you like to know? Why he stepped on defending me? Well if everyone read this thread, as you undoubtedly did then you would of seen the post where I explain that too. On June 23 2011 06:39 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:On June 23 2011 06:05 ~OpZ~ wrote:On June 23 2011 05:16 VisceraEyes wrote: Balance cannot be used as far as I can see. Anyone got anything else? Time is ticking. Further evidence backing up RoL's case against youngminii and fudgemonkey. Personally I would rather we just move all the votes to fudgemonkey, allow RoL to Vig YM at night (given he is actually a vig), and go from there. That seriously seems like the best course of action, because if YM isn't red, then it's down to BC and RoL. AND WHERE THE FUCK IS KANTBEUSEFULCHI?! YM flipping might clear up an issue that I really doubt fudgemunkeys death will. That is my issue here. I really can't say more about it. Oh and Mataza you want to know why BC is defending me? I asked him for help. I saw this railroad coming and you were half ignoring everything I said claiming it was predeath scum wifom. I pleaded my case to BC and asked him if he honestly thought I was scum based off behavior, he didn't and when you showed your little "bread crumb" that was why I knew you were blue, he knew this was stupid. Btw thanks for after I post about how you do stupid shit, you respond by leaking all my mason information in a desperate attempt to prove I lied. Hint: I didn't. Please, you and your scum buddies keep bringing more and more bullshit in this thread to confuse just enough people to let you vote stack me at the very end. On that note, kenpachi unless you want to be solely responsible for another town defeat you will get back on the youngminii lynch. Right now as it is tied, I know I am going to get switched onto last minute and die. There is only an hour left in the day. Stop talking about BC, it doesn't matter right now, theres only an hour left to the lynch. I'll get to him in the night phase. Want an analysis of your posts? 50% of them are oneliners with nothing in them. But hey, that makes you look better when you can discredit other people for having fewer posts. Way to spam. How about an analysis of you refusing to work with the town? Or an analysis of you claiming hatter and then claiming a red dt check on Kenpachi and then bitching the whole town out when we don't lynch him on your worthless word (way to back that one up with analysis btw, thanks for that!). But I guess that was all just another ploy to help you stay alive longer because you are just so fucking valuable amirite? I got to where you say I spam, then I just laughed. This is pathetic. I don't spam.
Read over your posts in this game and say that again with a straight face, I dare you.
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On June 23 2011 10:33 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: GGQ, you are officially put on my list of people who no longer exist in my mind. It's a very exclusive club, I believe Mataza is currently the only other member.
Good defense, bro.
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Someone please switch. There's only one reason for RoL to twist YM's words so much in his analysis. It's because he isn't actually trying to find a mafia, he just picked someone and tried to make him look like mafia.
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OH HEY LOOK AT THAT
vigis do your thing
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On June 23 2011 11:03 ~OpZ~ wrote: ...well RoL...I told you what happens if YM popped green. Nighty Nighty Guys, GL Town.
If you're taking care of RoL, vigis can hit BC.
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Also, we are probably out of detectives, but if the setup is strangely dt heavy, look into the lurkers who jumped in late; shraft, landenC, deMorcef
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A little touchy there, Kenpachi? I don't really think you are mafia this game, but one day you are going to be scum and I have no idea how I'm going to tell.
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On June 23 2011 11:17 Ace wrote: what a dumb town lol
How about you play a game and show us how it's done.
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I don't mean to interrupt the VisceraEyes show, but can you explain to me why, if all this is true, the mafia would even bother with this big plan? The whole point is just to kill RoL? Why not just stack two hits on him? With one medic dead, it's very unlikely that there's more than one left. Why did they go through this whole elaborate plot and setup, right from the beginning of the game, just for one mislynch on a player who hadn't been very active up to that point? And at the very apex and culmination of this plan, why would the the mafia leave out the most critical part of evidence in their case against RoL? The mafia would have no reason not to lie and just make it up. I'm not seeing the bigger picture here.
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On June 24 2011 02:38 VisceraEyes wrote: That's because that's as far as the plan went. There was no bigger picture. Yes, it's true, -1 Medic would mean it's LIKELY that a double-stack of Mafia hits COULD have killed him. But let's assume there's 1 medic. Aside from Mataza's claim, have any other Vets come forward? No? Then it's possible that RoL would live. Not to mention how much protection he ASSURED for himself the whole game. The ultimate plan was to LYNCH RoL, because that's the only way to kill him for certain. No PRs interfering, nothing to stop them. Only a bunch of noobs who do what they're told.
Would YOU pass up an opportunity like that?
Yes I would. It would be a terrible plan and you are twisting your brain into circles trying to find the least likely explanation for what's happened in this game.
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On June 24 2011 02:53 VisceraEyes wrote: I can assure you it all fits...even if it's WIFOM, that doesn't make it wrong. It only makes it WIFOM. But really, there's NOTHING that condemns RoL that occured yesterday. Not one thing. ESPECIALLY his lynch of YM. How is it his fault if a bunch of townies foolishly voted for YM based on weak analysis and basically just the ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY OF ONE OF THE MOST ACCOMPLISHED AND RECOGNIZED VETERANS? You YOURSELF said it was weak analysis. Being wrong does not equal being scum. BEING WRONG DOES NOT EQUAL BEING SCUM.
You want Meta? Mataza tried to get Town to commit to some kind of super-power-play in SNMMII, and he was lynched for it. By the way Mataza, you never DID clear up what exactly that was, and I've always wanted to know...just never remembered to ask.
You want proof? I have none. I have only my story and my theory. I'm open to suggestions on how to clear it up, but I firmly believe that RoL is being set up. If I live through the night, I will NOT support his lynch tomorrow unless town is ABSOLUTELY set on it...by a VAST majority. Right up to the point where it becomes ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN town wants him to live, I'm pushing Mataza as hard as I can.
I don't understand how you can write this and not see the problem. How is it his fault that a bunch of townies voted for youngminii? Well probably because he made the analysis and pushed it on them. How is it his fault that it's weak analysis? Because he made it! He completely misinterpreted youngminii's play on day 1, you can believe that was an accident if you want, but the way that he literally twisted EVERYTHING to come to the conclusion that he wanted should tell you that he wasn't looking for scum, he was just trying to make someone look like scum. The only people who do that are the mafia.
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On June 23 2011 11:04 GGQ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2011 11:03 ~OpZ~ wrote: ...well RoL...I told you what happens if YM popped green. Nighty Nighty Guys, GL Town. If you're taking care of RoL, vigis can hit BC.
I'm gonna take this back, all town kp should be hitting RoL tonight. No reason to take chances, you'll get your bullets back if someone else kills him.
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On June 24 2011 04:44 VisceraEyes wrote:Note, I didn't say "PROVE my statement" I said "PROVE the credibility of my statement". You just keep digging yourself into a hole, Mataza. And GGQ, the fact that you're only questioning and responding to me leads me to believe that you're defending Mataza and it WILL be reflected on your permanent record.
Everyone has always been aware that what you're suggesting is a possibility, we're just saying that it's highly unlikely. By making your big post on the situation, you're suggesting that it's in fact probable, or even the most likely explanation. That's what I'm disagreeing with. Mafia is never a game of complete information (well almost never). You just figure out what's most likely and go from there. If you really think that this is the most likely explanation, then fine, but I really really don't, and I'm going to argue against it because if you convince people then you are going to let RoL slip away for the third (3rd!!!) time this game. That's why I changed my mind and said that every town KP should be on RoL tonight. In case you convince some of them, the ones with their heads screwed on straight need to get the job done.
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On June 24 2011 09:52 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: Alright, so here is the thing. I was never a vig. BC claimed vig to me. Tonight I told BC to kill GGQ, if he fails to follow through then we must assume he is mafia.
lolumad
lynch BC if I die
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BOOM, guess who wasn't a vigi
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If this isn't just a gimmick to get the lurkers talking, I'm gonna be pretty pissed at you Mataza.
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On June 25 2011 07:01 Shraft wrote: I think you know the reason as to why we don't speak as much as you guys. Don't be silly.
Whatever your reason is, it's bad. Even if you think you don't have anything valuable to contribute, you need to talk so we can figure out your alignment. Lurkers all look the same. Players with posts look different.
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On June 25 2011 09:53 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: yeah, this game is pretty disgusting. That is literally 1/5th of the total players of the game who haven't done shit. Nearly a third if you count GGQ and wiggles too, who both also haven't done anything.
Oh please, when did you get the right to talk like this in this game? When you put on a flurry of activity just before you were lynched? Twice? Give me a break.
I approve of the initiative to make lurkers talk, but it's lylo and we can't fuck around with our votes. Please tell me we're going to lynch RoL at the end of the day.
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On June 25 2011 11:29 Mataza wrote: What is your plan beyond lynching RoL?
I don´t have any. If we lynch RoL, a combination of Wiggles, you and me is being shot tonight, which leaves tomorrow to one guy who talks at all. And to win we must get to the day *after* that. Or we have a really good vig in the audience.
I don´t want anymore. I´m not here to tell others what to think and who to vote. There is 1 scum or more in the 6 lurkers. If we can´t find him now, good luck finding him later. (Hint: He is not going to say anything) (Another hint: The others aren´t going to say anything either)
Lynch Fudgemonkey tomorrow. RoL made 2 analysis when it looked like he was gonna die, on youngminii and fudgemonkey. However, he made the fudgemonkey analysis contingent on youngminii flipping red (and insisted on YM being killed before FM, even when other people were more willing to lynch FM). Thus, when YM flipped green, it neatly cancelled out his big 'analysis' on fudgemonkey, making FM look better. There's some WIFOM there, yeah, but combined with FM's natural scumminess, it's enough to make him by far my #2 target.
After, that hopefully I'll be dead and I won't have to worry about it anymore lol. Primary directive is making sure RoL doesn't somehow live through being obvious scum just by the force of his posting. The guy's head is swollen enough already, I don't need to see him bragging about that next game.
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On June 25 2011 12:04 FudgeMunkey wrote:Rather than lynching me save the lynches for actual mafia. If you really want me dead then just Vig me at night...
Who do you want to lynch then?
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On June 25 2011 14:03 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 11:13 GGQ wrote:On June 25 2011 09:53 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: yeah, this game is pretty disgusting. That is literally 1/5th of the total players of the game who haven't done shit. Nearly a third if you count GGQ and wiggles too, who both also haven't done anything. Oh please, when did you get the right to talk like this in this game? When you put on a flurry of activity just before you were lynched? Twice? Give me a break. I approve of the initiative to make lurkers talk, but it's lylo and we can't fuck around with our votes. Please tell me we're going to lynch RoL at the end of the day. I have been active almost every single day. What have you done? Now all you are trying to do is push 2 townies. I firmly believe fudge is town, and I think you are just trying to make sure we lose here.
What have I done? Of the players who have flipped, I've called out Impervious, Node, and BC. Who have you called out again? Kenpachi, syllogism, and youngminii? How did that work out for you?
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On June 25 2011 13:39 FudgeMunkey wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 08:13 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
Jacinto - you have less than 10 posts and reak of lurking scum. Do something productive or Mataza will push your death.
Just look at this guy he has just as many posts as me and just as/ more useless.
On June 25 2011 18:22 FudgeMunkey wrote: ##vote: Jacinto
Just sayin...
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On June 25 2011 15:46 Mr. Wiggles wrote:Sorry I was away from my computer all day. It's night now, and I'm going to bed soon, but I'm going to post a quick analysis and place my vote for now. Sinani206:Most of his posts are useless one-liners, or filled with inanity, so I'm going to avoid most of those. His general posting activity has been as follows: Decently active day 1, prompted partially by being called scummy and a small bandwagon being formed. Less active day 2, with his activity declining as time went on. Complete lurker from then on out, he's picked up a bit recently, but again, it's been mostly useless spam. Reasons I think he's scummy:Show nested quote +On June 15 2011 12:05 sinani206 wrote: There's no reason to post N0. There's nothing to discuss and there's no reason why anyone should be posting at all. Telling people who to check, shoot, bomb, and kill just allows for WIFOM and confusion which help the mafia. Nothing good can come out of posting N0. Telling people not to post N0, after N0 is already over. An attempt to chastise town while simultaneously making himself look like a voice of reason. Useless advice at that point, and it only came out after being called on for not posting for the first 24 hours of the game. He then continued day 1, by continuously calling for scum hunting to be done while pointing fingers at various veterans without providing any semblance of an analysis himself. I called him out on it, and after that he went pretty quiet, not commenting on anything I said and completely sidestepping the issue. This is around where he began his subsequent posting behaviour of very short (often one-line) posts. Show nested quote +On June 20 2011 00:06 sinani206 wrote: I'm at the Grand Canyon and have really bad internet, so I can only post like once every few hours, but Node is being really inactive for being on the Zodiac List. ##Vote: Node Votes for Node, instead of either Syllogism or Hiro, or even any other player with any semblance of an analysis against them. This is the same as his voting habits day 1, voting for Kenpachi instead of any other candidate, and then only because Kenpachi's posting was bad (lol). It looks like someone afraid to commit to an opinion, so instead taking an easy road out. Doesn't want to be held accountable for whatever the lynch target flips. Show nested quote +On June 22 2011 11:53 sinani206 wrote:Back from the Grand Canyon! It was quite fun. Spent some time with my family, and now I get to go back to living in my room. Of the 8 voting for RoL (not including me): 1 (Mataza) proved he was Mafia with the whole PM thing. (no shit) 1 (GGQ) voted without posting in the thread 6 voted with a post such as "good evidence" or something like that. Not scummy at all, considering the circumstances. I propose someone shoots GGQ tonight because he hasn't really contributed at all and killing inactives is the vigilante's job. GGQ has been passing by with 1 to 2 posts a day, and everyone has overlooked that. So I will be voting for RoL today and hopefully someone shoots GGQ tonight. ##Vote: RebirthOfLegend This was from the last day. I've already made a post, saying why I think it's scummy, but I'll reiterate a little. Basically, this shows that he's willing to jump on the bandwagon of a possible townie, without any reason behind it. The entire post just looks like an excuse to jump on the RoL wagon, and shows that he hadn't even been paying close attention to the thread. Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 05:20 sinani206 wrote: I comes after H, I think. I'm quite safe (last). DeMorcerf seems pretty scummy anyway, I guess. This post might be meant to be joking, but it still looks scummy to me. Of all the lurkers, he thinks he won't be focused on, and instead just pushes for the one the bandwagon looks like it will be on. Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 10:06 sinani206 wrote: RoL I'm not sure about him at all.
He attacked Kenpachi, Syllogism, and youngminii, who all flipped Townie. However, he defended opz and hiro protagonist, who both flipped Mad Hatter.
His posting has seemed scummy is places, but in others it seems he is a misguided townie. However, Mataza attacked him for being Mafia because of the whole PM circle thing.
-3 for attacking 3 Townies +2 for defending 2 Mad Hatters -2 for early scummy/trolling play +4 for good analysis lategame -2 because of the PM circle thing
+6-7=-1
Slightly scummy, but not enough for a lynch today.
(hey! im a math person, okay?) Another example, of a bad post with bad reasoning. How he determines RoL's alignment, isn't very good, and is in fact useless for gaining any information on Sinani himself.It's a post meant to make him look like he's contributing while really adding no new information to the thread. So conclusion:-Posts are mostly useless -Begins day 1 calling for scum hunting (while doing none himself) and chastising town to look like he's contributing while he's not. -When called out on the hypocrisy of his actions, he avoids talking about it, and instead disappears. -He's afraid to commit to an opinion the first two days, instead opting for voting someone not likely to be lynched, thus denying any information we might have gotten from his opinions. -The next two days he show a great willingness to jump on bandwagons with little or bad reasoning. -Posts with little content that don't show his own thoughts while trying to look like he is providing new content. -Avoids responding to any pressure. Probable ScumBasically, he looks like a newbie scum who's afraid to show commitment to an opinion/stance and is too afraid to respond to pressure for fear of showing his true colours. He either takes an easy way out where it's hard to get information about him, or jumps on whatever looks like the easiest bandwagon with bad reasoning. ##Vote: Sinani206That's where my vote's going for now, until I look at more people and see if someone looks scummier. I'd like to see an actual case on some of the other lurkers, instead of just calling them out and randomly voting amongst them. Mataza's town, I think RoL is town, have to look at most other people. Good night.
wtf, dude, i've had you as town for like the whole game, but this is sketchy as hell. You think RoL is town? No explanation? No justification? I'm gonna need something more here.
And then you vote for the one lurker who had the balls to actually post something at that point? Grats on your promotion to my number 3 suspect.
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On June 26 2011 05:29 GGQ wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 13:39 FudgeMunkey wrote:On June 25 2011 08:13 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
Jacinto - you have less than 10 posts and reak of lurking scum. Do something productive or Mataza will push your death.
Just look at this guy he has just as many posts as me and just as/ more useless. Just sayin...
There's a number of new players here, so I'll make my point more obvious. I've already accused RoL and FM of being mafia buddies, showing how RoL's behavior towards FM indicates both an attempt to distance himself and an attempt to protect, typical of scum behavior towards teammates. These quotes from FM show the same attitude back. FM calls RoL out as useless, trying to make them appear to be enemies, but then throw his vote on a random lurker with no explanation. He wants to appear as though he suspects RoL without actually endangering RoL.
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Just to reiterate the case on RoL because apparently it isn't as blindingly clear as I thought it was:
-He's lied repeatedly in this game, three of those times about his role, one of those times to save his own ass (which resulted in a townie getting lynched). There's a reason LAL is a good policy, townies should (almost) never lie, it's only mafia who need to lie as much as RoL has in this game.
-He proposed and supported a plan on night 0 that he himself admitted was bad and was only for the purpose of self-preservation (he also lied about the plan, see point 1). At the time, he claimed that this was because he was a vigilante and needed to survive longer. He's already admitted that the claim was false, so why did he need to push an anti-town plan with such a selfish motive? The most logical answer is that he's not town.
-His analysis of youngminii. I already made a post about this, but go back and read it. RoL conveniently quotes YM's posts, so you can easily compare what YM is saying in his posts to what RoL says he is saying. They are completely different. RoL takes YM's words out of context and twists their meaning to make YM look scummy. This is not an analysis by someone who is trying to find mafia. This is an analysis by someone who is trying to find a scapegoat. Only mafia needs to twist words to make people look scummy, because mafia knows that their target isn't actually scum
-BC, confirmed mafia, busted his ass to save RoL from the last lynch. Not only could his one vote have made the difference, but a name like BC has influence and if he hadn't pushed to save RoL, some of the lurkers might have voted RoL instead. RoL also defended BC before BC flipped, believing and supporting BC's vigilante claim.
-Mataza and sandroba's plan ensnared RoL by having sandroba leak information that Mataza was blue to RoL. Mataza and sandroba both got hit that night, and Mataza survived because he was vet. Pretty straightforward, RoL got caught in a PM mafia trap.
If this doesn't convince you and you still aren't sure enough to vote for him, go back and read/skim through the thread. You'll notice that everything RoL has been doing all game has only been to keep himself alive. It's that simple.
He is clearly, plainly mafia. Please see it.
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On June 26 2011 07:32 Mr. Wiggles wrote:Unless you think RoL is scum, don't vote for him. A mislynch is death at this point, and that's why I voted for Sinani. I'm more convinced he's likely to be scum than RoL who I'm still shaky on but think is town. @GGQ I've already given my justification for RoL being town or Mataza's "trap" not being strong enough early last day cycle. Just look at his analysis and how he's trying to scum hunt. I might be wrong, but mafia aren't normally that convinced that they're right. Look at my case on RoL above, does that address any of your reservations about voting for RoL?I'd also like you to actually respond to my analysis instead of just shrugging it off. I don't even know what you're talking about with Sinani having the balls to post. Of the lurkers, it only looks like shraft is actually saying anything this cycle, unless posting images and one liners counts as contributing. shraft has been posting a lot of garbage, he gets points for at least trying, but not many. sinani made an actual analysis and a decent post, which you immediately tore apart which discourages further contributions from the lurkersShow nested quote +On June 26 2011 07:23 sinani206 wrote: Well, as everyone seems to be voting for RoL anyway, I might as well, because he seems relatively scummy. ##Vote: RebirthOfLegend Once again hopping on the easy bandwagon. My vote stands.
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Strange that no one ever claimed role blocked though...
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Yeah I feel like we didn't so much win this game as town just wasn't really interested in winning it. The luck didn't hurt either.
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On June 27 2011 11:17 youngminii wrote: just don't lay traps like that if you're vet, do what RoL did and make yourself the center of town with people masoning you
if you really want to make a trap, make it OBVIOUS, it really is a poor trap because it relies on someone catching onto a HINT
i basically knew BC was scum as soon as RoL told me about his exchanges with BC (after i died) but obviously i couldn't say anything to him, it still shocks me that RoL didn't see it
what i learnt from this game: 1. policy lynches should become more of a norm in public games seeing as lurkers get away with everything 2. tunneling is terrible, i mean i was pressuring/tunneling but with only 48 hours to decide who to lynch, even though i moved my vote away my pressure votes/analyses basically became the actual lynch just because there was usually only one other person to lynch who was just as bad of a lynch as the one i started oh and RoL just tunneled to the death which was obviously bad 3. stop using pm land as 99% of the game, if pm land was a country then BC would be dictator of the world 4. i suck (and so do you)
also did the mafia hit sandroba and mataza out of sheer coincidence?
To answer your last question: yes we did. Also all the blue snipes on the first two nights were sheer coincidence. Also Mig died the same night he got a red check on me. We got pretty crazy lucky this game.
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