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Not really sure what to think now T_T but let's be honest:
On August 04 2012 04:13 DarthPunk wrote: Ignoring the 'crumb' Why would you try to medic save the person that had missed a vote and has been the most inactive?
I don't buy it at all.
He's right, saving me is dumb for an actual medic. it doesn't really matter how I vote at this point, but hell I'll swap anyway ##unvote ##vote Zorkmid
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@Shady Sands: Basically, you're saying that my main scum tell is that I'm lurky. While I definitely AM lurky, it's not because I'm scum, it's because I barely have stuff to say . Even when I do contribute, people point out that I'm just agreeing with others. Hell, I even missed the day 2 lynch (though that was because I was incredibly busy). If I was scum, I'd at least have jumped on a bandwagon or something beforehand, rather than thinking I'd be able to make up my mind later (and consequently missing the vote).
On Jingle: Recently, he's made a lot of emotional/fluff posts. At least in IRL mafia, when someone does that, it's generally because they can no longer find strong defenses against the arguments made against them. However, I don't see why Jingle would be so obvious in his 'fuck it they got me' attitude, especially considering how many believe he is experienced and skilled.
On Darthpunk: like others have noted, that 'breadcrumb' by zork could easily have been just a way to give DP an excuse to seem anti zork. Note how previously, he was reluctant on voting zork, and finally changed when he saw there was no point in not doing so. This is a typical scum move, just trying to blend in with the other townies and going with the bandwagon. In fact, at one point he even calls zork a bad player (presumably for pulling the crappy breadcrumb stunt). This falls in sync with DP's other actions regarding the mordanis vs zork swap.
Because of his recent somewhat random defense of Jingle, I'm led to believe that if Jingle is scum, then so is DP Also remember that one of the remaining mafia is godfather, meaning he will not turn up red. This means that a cop check will be substantially less effective, and the 2 mafia can cover/defend each other more easily.
On Ange: I actually didn't have much of an opinion on he/she, but what Shady said makes sense to me. It's highly unlikely that scum would bus at that point, meaning that ange is in the clear.
on GK: I initially had a somewhat scummy read on him. However, I think his recent posts seem really town oriented, and I have a feeling I was heavily influenced by his game long tunneling of me. Because he's been going after Jingle, I find it highly unlikely that he's mafia if Jingle is.
At this point, I was debating between Jingle and Darthpunk. However, I'm voting for Jingle because of 3 main things 1)I'm fairly certain Jingle is scum 2)If Jingle is mafia, then it puts the nail in the coffin imo that Darthpunk is scum. It also somewhat confirms GK's town status 3)It's our best chance of getting a lynch at this point, seeing as Shady Sands is going for it, and is our most confirmed townie.
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EBWOP In conclusion: Jingle/Dathpunk are mafia,
##vote Jinglehell ##FoSDarthpunk
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my opinion on Alan: I'm getting a town vibe from him. I'm also still fairly certain that DP and JingleHell are scum, so that might be playing into it as well.
One major thing he brings up is Jingle's play from NMM XXI. This is more of a town move, imo. I don't see why scum would find meta info about a player that CLEARS them unless they're clearing scum (obviously). Therefore, if Alan is scum, then Jingle is probably scum too, meaning we should STILL lynch Jingle this turn.
Alan also doesn't post as much as many others. However, judging by my own lack of activity, I'm hesitant to call him scum based on that. Also, much of his posting is insightful. Though he was often wrong, he might just be unlucky or not playing well this game. Unlike Obvious, I'm hugely against lynching 'bad townies.'
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EBWOP ninja'd by alan lol he's basically agreeing with me at this point, so chances are we're both scum or both town. As Jingle is more scummy than either of us, and I think DP is too, I think it's fairly obvious that we're both town.
@Obvious I can see why you think I'm scum because of inactivity. I've noted several times how my lurking has been bad. I'd like to ask you a question, though. Why the hell would scum me miss day 2 vote? Scum can plan out votes/plays and jump on bandwagons much easier, as their goal is NOT actually finding scum, rather just looking like town (no shit). I
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Expect Goodkarma to paint me as 100% scum #3, he's been tunneling me literally all game long
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On August 06 2012 07:48 Obvious.660 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 06:33 aRyuujin wrote: Expect Goodkarma to paint me as 100% scum #3, he's been tunneling me literally all game long My last post towards aRyuujin was completely disregarded. Where the hell does this post come from? The only town motivation I can see for aRyuujin to come into the thread pointing out that GK has been "tunneling" him the entire game is that he's been essentially inactive for most of the game and it's self preservation for the sake of the town. That said, there's nothing coming from aRyuujin that's showing me he's town. Yes, GK's earlier play was easily characterized as primarily anti-lurker. GK was mentioning aRyuujin a lot during his anti-lurker posts. I wouldn't call that "tunneling" since it's stating the obvious.
... If by your last post you mean this? + Show Spoiler +On August 05 2012 19:14 Obvious.660 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2012 18:50 Obvious.660 wrote:On August 05 2012 18:40 aRyuujin wrote: EBWOP ninja'd by alan lol he's basically agreeing with me at this point, so chances are we're both scum or both town. As Jingle is more scummy than either of us, and I think DP is too, I think it's fairly obvious that we're both town.
@Obvious I can see why you think I'm scum because of inactivity. I've noted several times how my lurking has been bad. I'd like to ask you a question, though. Why the hell would scum me miss day 2 vote? Scum can plan out votes/plays and jump on bandwagons much easier, as their goal is NOT actually finding scum, rather just looking like town (no shit). I Did you finish that post? There's an I at the end there, so I just wanted to know if you had anything else to add before I answer. Something more like this? Show nested quote +Scum aRyuujin: Why the hell would scum me miss day 2 vote? Scum can plan out votes/plays and jump on bandwagons much easier, as their goal is NOT actually finding scum, rather just looking like town (no shit). I lost track of the thread trying to look like bad town and it slipped my mind because I wasn't going to make a meaningful vote anyhow. I honestly don't know what to tell you. Your read on me is that I'm scum faking as a bad town who turned into a bad scum while still having this genius bad town fake. This seems like a logical read /sarcasm. People LYNCH bad townies (you yourself said something to that extant.) When I saw that post, I thought you were just joking, I didn't realize that was your actual analysis.
Now at DP:
+ Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 08:27 DarthPunk wrote:If I had to make a scum read right now. It would probably be on Aryuujin. I am far from confident in my ability to make reads but the logic behind an aRyuujin lynch is this. Take this HYPOTHETICAL situation: Obvious, GoodKarma and aRyuujin make it to endgame. Obvious is town, Goodkarma is scum, aRyujjin is town. If you take that situation aRyuujin is a CLEAR liability. Take another: Myself, Ange777 and aRyuujin make it to endgame. I am town, ange777 is Town and aRyuujin is scum If you take that situation aRyuujin is a clear liability also. Add to that these points: Every single opinion he has had has been on someone on which a bandwagon has formed. Every single piece of analysis of his has been blatantly plagiarised off other players. He has never taken an unpopular stance. He has voted for Golbat on his bandwagon. Missed a vote. Voted for Mordanis when he was the most popular choice and his reasoning was almost the exact same as mine from a few posts earlier. Voted for Zork at the last minute. Now is jumping on the jinglehell/darthpunk bandwagon Martyrs himself slightly and disappears again. With all that being said I find it equally likely him to just be a bad town as a scum (oh no I am 'soft defending' him) but at this point he is a CLEAR liability right now, and will become an even larger liability as the game progresses. UNLESS his posting and analysis improve dramatically. @ aRyujjinShow nested quote +On August 05 2012 17:26 Obvious.660 wrote: Your current play is 100% against the town win condition.
You're saying that I jumped on the Jingle/DP bandwagon? Look at the thread. I'm pretty sure I was the first to point at that BOTH of you are scum working together. Actually, I think I'm also the first to really say you're scum. Another thing to note is your usage of these heavily negative connoted words, like 'blatantly plagiarized'. You're bringing up Obvious' HOLY FUCK YOU NEED TO GET LYNCHED big red signpost. You're starting to get emotional, defensive, and are now striking back at your accusers. Another sign of scum. You're continuing to follow the pattern of behavior that Ange set out, even ignoring Jingle to make me your number 1 target. Sorry, DP, but you're digging yourself deeper and deeper into your hole.
@Ange: As I said earlier, I'm certain that it's Jingle/DP as remaining scum. However, I think its important to lynch Jingle first, as that's what Shady wants us to do, and he's our biggest townie right now. I'll vote Darthpunk if town decides that we're going with him, but as of now I plan to vote Jingle today and DP tomorrow.
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EBWOP: @Obvious: Meant to put this in my previous post, but I didn't realize i forgot this part. You asked, "where did this post even come from?" Did you even read the thread? Goodkarma made a post, at the end of which he said As for aRyuujin, expect a follow-up post on him within the next twelve hours. Unfortunately, something else has come up and I won't be able to post some additional impressions on him I had planned to right away.
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+ Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 08:49 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 08:45 aRyuujin wrote:On August 06 2012 07:48 Obvious.660 wrote:On August 06 2012 06:33 aRyuujin wrote: Expect Goodkarma to paint me as 100% scum #3, he's been tunneling me literally all game long My last post towards aRyuujin was completely disregarded. Where the hell does this post come from? The only town motivation I can see for aRyuujin to come into the thread pointing out that GK has been "tunneling" him the entire game is that he's been essentially inactive for most of the game and it's self preservation for the sake of the town. That said, there's nothing coming from aRyuujin that's showing me he's town. Yes, GK's earlier play was easily characterized as primarily anti-lurker. GK was mentioning aRyuujin a lot during his anti-lurker posts. I wouldn't call that "tunneling" since it's stating the obvious. ... If by your last post you mean this? + Show Spoiler +On August 05 2012 19:14 Obvious.660 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2012 18:50 Obvious.660 wrote:On August 05 2012 18:40 aRyuujin wrote: EBWOP ninja'd by alan lol he's basically agreeing with me at this point, so chances are we're both scum or both town. As Jingle is more scummy than either of us, and I think DP is too, I think it's fairly obvious that we're both town.
@Obvious I can see why you think I'm scum because of inactivity. I've noted several times how my lurking has been bad. I'd like to ask you a question, though. Why the hell would scum me miss day 2 vote? Scum can plan out votes/plays and jump on bandwagons much easier, as their goal is NOT actually finding scum, rather just looking like town (no shit). I Did you finish that post? There's an I at the end there, so I just wanted to know if you had anything else to add before I answer. Something more like this? Show nested quote +Scum aRyuujin: Why the hell would scum me miss day 2 vote? Scum can plan out votes/plays and jump on bandwagons much easier, as their goal is NOT actually finding scum, rather just looking like town (no shit). I lost track of the thread trying to look like bad town and it slipped my mind because I wasn't going to make a meaningful vote anyhow. I honestly don't know what to tell you. Your read on me is that I'm scum faking as a bad town who turned into a bad scum while still having this genius bad town fake. This seems like a logical read /sarcasm. People LYNCH bad townies (you yourself said something to that extant.) When I saw that post, I thought you were just joking, I didn't realize that was your actual analysis. Now at DP: + Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 08:27 DarthPunk wrote:If I had to make a scum read right now. It would probably be on Aryuujin. I am far from confident in my ability to make reads but the logic behind an aRyuujin lynch is this. Take this HYPOTHETICAL situation: Obvious, GoodKarma and aRyuujin make it to endgame. Obvious is town, Goodkarma is scum, aRyujjin is town. If you take that situation aRyuujin is a CLEAR liability. Take another: Myself, Ange777 and aRyuujin make it to endgame. I am town, ange777 is Town and aRyuujin is scum If you take that situation aRyuujin is a clear liability also. Add to that these points: Every single opinion he has had has been on someone on which a bandwagon has formed. Every single piece of analysis of his has been blatantly plagiarised off other players. He has never taken an unpopular stance. He has voted for Golbat on his bandwagon. Missed a vote. Voted for Mordanis when he was the most popular choice and his reasoning was almost the exact same as mine from a few posts earlier. Voted for Zork at the last minute. Now is jumping on the jinglehell/darthpunk bandwagon Martyrs himself slightly and disappears again. With all that being said I find it equally likely him to just be a bad town as a scum (oh no I am 'soft defending' him) but at this point he is a CLEAR liability right now, and will become an even larger liability as the game progresses. UNLESS his posting and analysis improve dramatically. @ aRyujjinShow nested quote +On August 05 2012 17:26 Obvious.660 wrote: Your current play is 100% against the town win condition.
You're saying that I jumped on the Jingle/DP bandwagon? Look at the thread. I'm pretty sure I was the first to point at that BOTH of you are scum working together. Actually, I think I'm also the first to really say you're scum. Another thing to note is your usage of these heavily negative connoted words, like 'blatantly plagiarized'. You're bringing up Obvious' HOLY FUCK YOU NEED TO GET LYNCHED big red signpost. You're starting to get emotional, defensive, and are now striking back at your accusers. Another sign of scum. You're continuing to follow the pattern of behavior that Ange set out, even ignoring Jingle to make me your number 1 target. Sorry, DP, but you're digging yourself deeper and deeper into your hole. @Ange: As I said earlier, I'm certain that it's Jingle/DP as remaining scum. However, I think its important to lynch Jingle first, as that's what Shady wants us to do, and he's our biggest townie right now. I'll vote Darthpunk if town decides that we're going with him, but as of now I plan to vote Jingle today and DP tomorrow. Ah I am far from emotional. In fact I would say that you are being emotional and are lashing back at your accusers.
I'd actually like to point out that my main accusers have been GK (all game long) and Shady Sands (Fairly recently). I'm only now getting annoyed with GK, and of course neither scum nor town me would accuse Shady. However, the supposed striking back at you that you say I'm doing... actually began BEFORE you accused me. Pretty weird how that works, huh... In my eyes, you're just driving yourself deeper into red territory now.
Something else I'd like to note is that throughout the game, my main supporters have been Keirathi (mason who was NKd) and Promethelax (townie who was lynched the day I missed). Why would scum me NK Keirathi? Seems kind of dumb if you ask me. Especially when noone but Shady knew he was mason, and he wasn't scumhunting very heavily. Now, let's pretend for a minute that I'm scum following the plan that Obvious laid out for me. Why would I sit back and let Promethelax get lynched? as a supporter of mine, it would make a lot more sense to keep him alive.
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On August 06 2012 10:03 Obvious.660 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 08:58 aRyuujin wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 08:49 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 08:45 aRyuujin wrote:On August 06 2012 07:48 Obvious.660 wrote:On August 06 2012 06:33 aRyuujin wrote: Expect Goodkarma to paint me as 100% scum #3, he's been tunneling me literally all game long My last post towards aRyuujin was completely disregarded. Where the hell does this post come from? The only town motivation I can see for aRyuujin to come into the thread pointing out that GK has been "tunneling" him the entire game is that he's been essentially inactive for most of the game and it's self preservation for the sake of the town. That said, there's nothing coming from aRyuujin that's showing me he's town. Yes, GK's earlier play was easily characterized as primarily anti-lurker. GK was mentioning aRyuujin a lot during his anti-lurker posts. I wouldn't call that "tunneling" since it's stating the obvious. ... If by your last post you mean this? + Show Spoiler +On August 05 2012 19:14 Obvious.660 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 05 2012 18:50 Obvious.660 wrote:On August 05 2012 18:40 aRyuujin wrote: EBWOP ninja'd by alan lol he's basically agreeing with me at this point, so chances are we're both scum or both town. As Jingle is more scummy than either of us, and I think DP is too, I think it's fairly obvious that we're both town.
@Obvious I can see why you think I'm scum because of inactivity. I've noted several times how my lurking has been bad. I'd like to ask you a question, though. Why the hell would scum me miss day 2 vote? Scum can plan out votes/plays and jump on bandwagons much easier, as their goal is NOT actually finding scum, rather just looking like town (no shit). I Did you finish that post? There's an I at the end there, so I just wanted to know if you had anything else to add before I answer. Something more like this? Show nested quote +Scum aRyuujin: Why the hell would scum me miss day 2 vote? Scum can plan out votes/plays and jump on bandwagons much easier, as their goal is NOT actually finding scum, rather just looking like town (no shit). I lost track of the thread trying to look like bad town and it slipped my mind because I wasn't going to make a meaningful vote anyhow. I honestly don't know what to tell you. Your read on me is that I'm scum faking as a bad town who turned into a bad scum while still having this genius bad town fake. This seems like a logical read /sarcasm. People LYNCH bad townies (you yourself said something to that extant.) When I saw that post, I thought you were just joking, I didn't realize that was your actual analysis. Now at DP: + Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 08:27 DarthPunk wrote:If I had to make a scum read right now. It would probably be on Aryuujin. I am far from confident in my ability to make reads but the logic behind an aRyuujin lynch is this. Take this HYPOTHETICAL situation: Obvious, GoodKarma and aRyuujin make it to endgame. Obvious is town, Goodkarma is scum, aRyujjin is town. If you take that situation aRyuujin is a CLEAR liability. Take another: Myself, Ange777 and aRyuujin make it to endgame. I am town, ange777 is Town and aRyuujin is scum If you take that situation aRyuujin is a clear liability also. Add to that these points: Every single opinion he has had has been on someone on which a bandwagon has formed. Every single piece of analysis of his has been blatantly plagiarised off other players. He has never taken an unpopular stance. He has voted for Golbat on his bandwagon. Missed a vote. Voted for Mordanis when he was the most popular choice and his reasoning was almost the exact same as mine from a few posts earlier. Voted for Zork at the last minute. Now is jumping on the jinglehell/darthpunk bandwagon Martyrs himself slightly and disappears again. With all that being said I find it equally likely him to just be a bad town as a scum (oh no I am 'soft defending' him) but at this point he is a CLEAR liability right now, and will become an even larger liability as the game progresses. UNLESS his posting and analysis improve dramatically. @ aRyujjinShow nested quote +On August 05 2012 17:26 Obvious.660 wrote: Your current play is 100% against the town win condition.
You're saying that I jumped on the Jingle/DP bandwagon? Look at the thread. I'm pretty sure I was the first to point at that BOTH of you are scum working together. Actually, I think I'm also the first to really say you're scum. Another thing to note is your usage of these heavily negative connoted words, like 'blatantly plagiarized'. You're bringing up Obvious' HOLY FUCK YOU NEED TO GET LYNCHED big red signpost. You're starting to get emotional, defensive, and are now striking back at your accusers. Another sign of scum. You're continuing to follow the pattern of behavior that Ange set out, even ignoring Jingle to make me your number 1 target. Sorry, DP, but you're digging yourself deeper and deeper into your hole. @Ange: As I said earlier, I'm certain that it's Jingle/DP as remaining scum. However, I think its important to lynch Jingle first, as that's what Shady wants us to do, and he's our biggest townie right now. I'll vote Darthpunk if town decides that we're going with him, but as of now I plan to vote Jingle today and DP tomorrow. Ah I am far from emotional. In fact I would say that you are being emotional and are lashing back at your accusers. I'd actually like to point out that my main accusers have been GK (all game long) and Shady Sands (Fairly recently). I'm only now getting annoyed with GK, and of course neither scum nor town me would accuse Shady. However, the supposed striking back at you that you say I'm doing... actually began BEFORE you accused me. Pretty weird how that works, huh... In my eyes, you're just driving yourself deeper into red territory now. Something else I'd like to note is that throughout the game, my main supporters have been Keirathi (mason who was NKd) and Promethelax (townie who was lynched the day I missed). Why would scum me NK Keirathi? Seems kind of dumb if you ask me. Especially when noone but Shady knew he was mason, and he wasn't scumhunting very heavily. Now, let's pretend for a minute that I'm scum following the plan that Obvious laid out for me. Why would I sit back and let Promethelax get lynched? as a supporter of mine, it would make a lot more sense to keep him alive. aRyuujin, you still there? Today's your day, mate. DarthPunk wants your case against him, and I'd welcome any contributions you have to helping us figure out who is scum. That's the whole reason I built a case against you, if you haven't noticed. You've posted a few times today, what can a case or two hurt to add?
I'm actually in the process of writing a case, lol. Just taking me a while.
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I'm hesitant to call this a case, because from what I understand, a case is more a post by post analysis of one or two people showing that they're scum. Instead, this is an analysis of the current situation as a whole. Because of this, it's EASY for scum to break this post down and address only a few points. Make sure that scum can't take advantage of this. They must address the whole post, or the conclusion. Not just cherry pick some parts. (I'm especially expecting DP to try to dismantle the first point against him, and try to shift the whole portion against him to that)
Right, I'm starting this post at 00:28 GMT (+00:00). In this post, I'm going to be analyzing the current situation.
I believe there are two likely scum scenarios. Either A) Zork/Jingle/Darthpunk or B) Zork/Darthpunk/Alan
I'm leaning towards situation A. However, because I think there's still a small chance situation B exists, I'm changing my vote to ##vote Darthpunk, in the hopes that others will follow the lead of Ange and I. If there is a threat of no lynch, I will change to Jingle.
Let's be honest. Zork's doctor claim was fairly obviously there to let scum have an excuse to swap to his bandwagon. The people who swapped are me, alan, jingle, and darthpunk. I know I'm innocent, but it's up to you guys to decide that for yourselves, though it should be fairly self evident especially with this post that I'm town.
This leaves Alan, Jingle, and DP.
Jingle
Everyone is fairly certain that Jingle is mafia, because of several 'scum slips'. I'm not going to address what others have talked about countless times. However, Jingle's latest post is quite intriguing. + Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 10:28 JingleHell wrote:I'm entirely amused that playing LoL for the day turns me into a ragequit, in a game where there's literally no point in me trying to defend myself, because unless a scum attacking me claims scum, the tunnel won't get off me. Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 08:55 DarthPunk wrote: Of course I am ignoring jingle. 1.) I have a town read on him, and 2.) he is not in the thread to defend himself so accusing him would not reap any new information. It is also odd that you were lurking the thread, not contributing anything and then almost immediately after myself and obvious link you with being scum you come out with that rather ironic post. By the way, DarthPunk... much as I appreciate the vote of confidence, claiming you have a townread on me at this point makes me wonder if you're setting people up to look bad after I flip. ##Vote DarthPunk . So, why would Jingle make this post? Let's say for a minute that he's scum, as that's what most of us believe. He posted that in the hopes that if DP gets lynched, then he'll look clean. Also, if he gets lynched, it'll help DP look clean as well. However, we can't ignore the fact that townJingleHell would make a similar move. It seems as if Ange has also seen this possibility: that Darthpunk could easily just be setting up to be in the clear when JingleHell flips green.
He later even makes this post: + Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 11:25 JingleHell wrote: Are they mutually exclusive? Is there a problem with seeing something as being a scumslip? Even if you people are too busy wallowing in your WIFOM and confirmation bias about me to see it, DarthPunk seems to be preparing town to sheep him after I flip green. . This continues to reinforce what I'm saying. Either Jingle and DP are scum, or DP and someone else are scum.
So for Jingle, while I'm FAIRLY sure that he's scum, I think there's a possibility that he's innocent and it's DP/Alan.
Darthpunk
This line of reasoning is going to seem a bit silly, but I think it's just piling onto the evidence DP has left us. + Show Spoiler +On August 04 2012 03:05 Zorkmid wrote: I didn't want to have to do this just yet.
I am a Doctor
On day one I saved Keir.
Day 2 I attempted to save aRyuujin.
I tried to breadcrumb this early on. Show nested quote +
##unvote ##vote Mordanis
I think we're going to lose. happened at 3:05, after which DP immediately posts voting for Zork, (looks like he started writing that post before zork pulled the whole claim thing). DP posts again 4 minutes after Zork's claim. I think it's quite possible for them to have decided on the mafia qt, "k, bros, imma pull this stunt so u can accuse me," Zork claims, and immediately DP responds, helping him cover for the fact that he was SUCH a late switcher. Thought this has been brought up by Mordanis and Ange, it's pretty much disregarded because it's so situational. (It pretty much gets forgotten) The thing that makes this move from 100% WIFOM to kind of useful imo is this post: + Show Spoiler +On August 05 2012 11:12 DarthPunk wrote: So I have read through the thread. First up I would like to say GG mordanis my great sparring partner. I always believed you to be scum but I was proven wrong. I hope you can forgive me for tunnelling you so hard all game.
I am going to write up a long post addressing the cases against me.
On the thing with the post timing. It was 4am at the time and I wanted to get some sleep. It was tied at 5-5 and even though I was leaning towards Zork being just a bad townie rather than scum. I would rather lynch him than a no lynch. I actually didn't see zorks post because it happened whilst I was writing mine. I honestly just wanted to go to bed and didn't want to risk a no lynch. (obviously I stayed up for an extra hour because of his medic claim.) I have suspicions on who may be scum and I will make a case on them at some stage also. But I have some reading to do before class tomorrow so it won't come immediately (I will work on these posts on and off all day)
That being said we are in a really good position at the moment. So I am glad people didn't listen to me which is ironic because yesterday I was annoyed mord was getting away again. Here, he defends himself from the accusations of Ange and Mord by saying it was late. However, he doesn't talk about ANY other part of those cases. Instead, he just brings up irl problems why he couldn't. The biggest thing here is that he says he was up an extra hour. Why the hell did that happen? When I saw that post, I was like k, wtf is he doing, and voted him and moved on. Especially considering he says it was incredibly late in the morning, (and that during this hour all he did was make two tiny posts at the very end) it sounds to me like he's just trying to paint himself as a mislead townie brought to his senses by Zork's move. Yes, this is weak. However, it is just icing on the proverbial cake.
Something that I don't think has been brought up in this context is this post: + Show Spoiler +On August 03 2012 23:04 DarthPunk wrote:@Jingle @Ange777 Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 22:19 Ange777 wrote: @DarthPunk: You said you will re-read my case on Jingle? What's your opinion? Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 06:01 Ange777 wrote: But only a couple of hours later (to be precise directly after I had posted my case against Zork) you had miraculously not only finished reading the thread, no you also had a very strong conviction that I am scummy. Based on arguments you yet have to show me. And while you have been tunneling me you have totally ignored my case on Zork based on his scumslip and the following reactions. Would you please give me a town motivation for ignoring the case on Zork? Oh, and please keep in mind, attacking me doesn't qualify as a defense! So this is just wrong. Jingle started airing suspicions against you well before you started going after zork. In no way is the jingle situation between you and him relevant to the zork case. I don't know why you would draw that connection at all. If you had read the last game you will see that jingle caught scum by Identifying and avoiding a similar situation so it is understandable that he would be on the look out for a repeat of that. Your response to him was OMGUS and WIFOM. I can understand why he finds you suspicious, particularly when you immediately become super aggressive towards him when he posts a case on you. I don't really think you have a case on him to be honest. I initially had a small town read on you but after actually reading through the discussion between yourself and jingle I am starting to worry about you. Your reaction to jingle's pressure was an incredibly disproportionate response, and trying to draw a connection to a case you posted hours after jingle had first cast suspicion on you is very suspicious to me. I don't see any connections whatsoever between Jingles pressure on you and your case on zork. I have no idea why you would try and draw a connection that wasn't there. It seems to be OMGUS. but I don't like the fact that several aspects of your case (Jingle connection, MrMedic post) seem to have fallen apart on closer inspection and the fact that many of the other points could just be bad town play, makes me even more wary of following your lynch on Zork. It seems like it is just an attempt to make an easy mislynch on a lurky bad town player. [/b] Once more, though it's not an IRONCLAD HARDCORE damning post, it's something that seems very... interesting. Essentially, Ange begins to link Zorkmid and JingleHell. Darthpunk strikes that down without providing much real evidence, and begins accusing Ange. Why? Because he/she is making these connections. DP even says something to that degree, at I initially had a small town read on you but after actually reading through the discussion between yourself and jingle I am starting to worry about you. Your reaction to jingle's pressure was an incredibly disproportionate response, and trying to draw a connection to a case you posted hours after jingle had first cast suspicion on you is very suspicious to me. I don't see any connections whatsoever between Jingles pressure on you and your case on zork. I have no idea why you would try and draw a connection that wasn't there. . If you reread this section of the post, it's quite obviously leaning towards a scumDarthpunk trying to protect his scum buddies. He even goes on to make this post (talking to Ange)You seem to have been desperate to link jingle hell to your zorkmid case even though his case on you began hours earlier. You asked me several times to state why I felt the Zork case was weaker, and are now using all those answers you dug for yesterday in order to build a case that isn't there. It seems as if you 100% KNEW that zork would flip red. And then desperately tried to manufacture connections to him wherever you could. I can 100% see a scum motivation for this you bussed zork and not only gained 'confirmed town' status but have also set up 2 mislynches. , further showing his determination to bust that link.
And finally, as I mentioned earlier, if you look at the last page of his filter, he progressively gets more and more emotional and lashes out at the people who accuse him. Like I noted when discussing Jingle, this seems to be a fairly scum move.
Honestly, there's only one thing that made me a bit unsure of DP's red status. That's the NK of Mordanis. It seemed a LOT easier for scum to keep Mordanis alive than to kill him. He served as DP's punching bag for a quite a while, and he was a fairly controversial figure. It'd be easy to get a mislynch on him, right? However, this could also serve as a fairly decent defense, too. Not only does it seem less likely for DP to be mafia on Mord's green flip, but Mord was beginning to really hunt down DP. By eliminating him, mafia removes one threat who is highly motivated to hunt down a scum Darthpunk. It also has the benefit of not being a super telling kill, like NK of Ange could be.
After looking at DP, I'm like 100% sure that he's scum. Either Jingle or Alan are his buddies. Because I'm so sure of it, like Ange(oh people are gonna yell at me for this -.-) I'd strongly urge town to vote DP today and (likely)Jingle tomorrow.
Alan113 One thing that makes me believe it's not Zork/Alan/Jingle is this post: + Show Spoiler +On August 04 2012 06:07 JingleHell wrote:Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 23:35 alan133 wrote:
@Zorkmid What the heck is your game? Where the fuck did you go? Why did you go out and posted that "SCUM SLIP"? Why are you making such a big deal about a stupid relief post? Why do reading your filter makes me want to vote for you so bloody much?
Why did you sheep? Why were your cases a rehash of everyone else's case? Where is your own reads? You and all the lurkers are all hurting town, or is being INCREDIBLY LAZY SCUMS.
This came 5 hours before your vote. I voted late too, but I wasn't sold until the pathetic fakeclaim. You wanted to vote for him so bloody much but waited 5 hours anyway. It makes little sense to start the pain train right there like that on Alan assuming Jingle is scum if Alan is too. It makes a lot of sense for red Jingle and DP to pull that, though, because it helps divert attention to Alan. It's a fairly towny move, too, however. It's one more of these silly little things that are 99% DP/Jingle but have the 1% possibility of being Alan/DP.
Alan's most recent post ends with this:I would like to put my vote on VOTE## JingleHell, and FOS## DarthPunk. I believe we got this in the bag
At that point, I think that's one of the better town things to do. Humor me for a minute, though. Let's pretend Alan is scum with DP. It's actually STILL a decent move, as I'm sure scum has realized that Darthpunk is starting to get quite a bit of heat and may believe that this pseudobussing of DP could give Alan the edge he needs to be appear as a semiconfirmed townie. In the same post, he also makes this assertion (regarding Me and MrMedic/JingleHell):I am not saying both can't be town (or with WIFOM, scum), but it won't make sense if both are town, unless there is some ballsy bussing maneuver going on in day 3. This is a fairly scum thing to do. He's suggesting in a fairly noncommital way that if Jingle is green, then I am red. He's basically setting up a next day mislynch of either of us, and he does this in a HUGELY scummy way, where he's set it up in a way that he can take back and explain away easily.
After looking at Alan, I think the chance of it being DP/Alan goes up quite a bit. While Jingle is definitely more likely, we can't ignore the possibility of DP/Alan.
Conclusion
To conclude: Basically, there are two options. Either it's Zork/DP/Jingle or Zork/DP/Alan. Either way, DP is scum. Let's lynch him, and pick Jingle tomorrow.
I finished this portion at 04:17 GMT (+00:00). I'm now going to address Goodkarma's post. + Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 12:13 goodkarma wrote:As promised, here is my most recent impressions on aRyuujin. @aRyuujin:So, recent developments for aRyuujin include what I consider to be his first "real" analysis post. Bolded are the parts of it that stood out to me, and what I'd like to discuss. This post is where I'll start: + Show Spoiler +On August 05 2012 17:19 aRyuujin wrote:@Shady Sands: Basically, you're saying that my main scum tell is that I'm lurky. While I definitely AM lurky, it's not because I'm scum, it's because I barely have stuff to say . Even when I do contribute, people point out that I'm just agreeing with others. Hell, I even missed the day 2 lynch (though that was because I was incredibly busy). If I was scum, I'd at least have jumped on a bandwagon or something beforehand, rather than thinking I'd be able to make up my mind later (and consequently missing the vote). On Jingle: Recently, he's made a lot of emotional/fluff posts. At least in IRL mafia, when someone does that, it's generally because they can no longer find strong defenses against the arguments made against them. However, I don't see why Jingle would be so obvious in his 'fuck it they got me' attitude, especially considering how many believe he is experienced and skilled. On Darthpunk: like others have noted, that 'breadcrumb' by zork could easily have been just a way to give DP an excuse to seem anti zork. Note how previously, he was reluctant on voting zork, and finally changed when he saw there was no point in not doing so. This is a typical scum move, just trying to blend in with the other townies and going with the bandwagon. In fact, at one point he even calls zork a bad player (presumably for pulling the crappy breadcrumb stunt). This falls in sync with DP's other actions regarding the mordanis vs zork swap. Because of his recent somewhat random defense of Jingle, I'm led to believe that if Jingle is scum, then so is DP Also remember that one of the remaining mafia is godfather, meaning he will not turn up red. This means that a cop check will be substantially less effective, and the 2 mafia can cover/defend each other more easily. On Ange: I actually didn't have much of an opinion on he/she, but what Shady said makes sense to me. It's highly unlikely that scum would bus at that point, meaning that ange is in the clear. on GK: I initially had a somewhat scummy read on him. However, I think his recent posts seem really town oriented, and I have a feeling I was heavily influenced by his game long tunneling of me. Because he's been going after Jingle, I find it highly unlikely that he's mafia if Jingle is. At this point, I was debating between Jingle and Darthpunk. However, I'm voting for Jingle because of 3 main things 1)I'm fairly certain Jingle is scum 2)If Jingle is mafia, then it puts the nail in the coffin imo that Darthpunk is scum. It also somewhat confirms GK's town status 3)It's our best chance of getting a lynch at this point, seeing as Shady Sands is going for it, and is our most confirmed townie. aRyuujin's excuse for never posting: "it's because I barely have stuff to say" I find this very hard to believe. Why would you even bother playing this game if you went in with the intention of contributing nothing? What satisfaction could you possibly get, even if you won, if you weren't in any way responsible for the outcome of the game? While pretty much everything you've said to date has been rehashings of others' views, several things stuck out to me about this post: When discussing Jingle's most recent actions: "Recently, he's made a lot of emotional/fluff posts. At least in IRL mafia, when someone does that, it's generally because they can no longer find strong defenses against the arguments made against them. However, I don't see why Jingle would be so obvious in his 'fuck it they got me' attitude, especially considering how many believe he is experienced and skilled." This is really the first point that seems to actually come from you. If you want any chance at establishing your innocence you will need to start making many more posts with points like this, where you create arguements of your own that portray your perspective of who is scum. "It's highly unlikely that scum would bus at that point, meaning that ange is in the clear." So this point from Shady makes sense to you... Why exactly does it make sense to you? This has been one of the biggest issues I've had with you all game. You seem to go, "Yeah, what he said." There's nothing wrong with this, as long as you also add some content of your own to demonstrate to us exactly why it is you agree with a certain view. Regarding me: "I initially had a somewhat scummy read on him. However, I think his recent posts seem really town oriented, and I have a feeling I was heavily influenced by his game long tunneling of me. Because he's been going after Jingle, I find it highly unlikely that he's mafia if Jingle is." This is yet another view of your own. Why is this the first time we are hearing about this? If you had a scummy read on me, you should have shared it with everyone. The last thing I remember you saying of your read on me was something like: Then there's this closing point from you: "2)If Jingle is mafia, then it puts the nail in the coffin imo that Darthpunk is scum." You'd better explain this better, because in no way do I see this to be necessarily true. I've already brought to attention your rehashings of others' arguements in your "cases," and why I believe your "lurking" to be deliberate. This is all clearly spelled out in my case against you. But also, there's this: Show nested quote +On July 28 2012 01:48 aRyuujin wrote:
-snip-
Suspecting me-Smart I did not yet provide posts Either i'm scum or
A really bad Town. This shows to me that you have some idea what it takes to be a good town. You clearly know that lurking hurts town. So why, exactly, is it that now, of all times you feel compelled to actually try to contribute? My suspicion is that it has something to do with people mentioning you as a suspect again. You had a brief flurry of activity while defending yourself when Golbat and myself had voted for you on Day 1. You explained it as a fear of "a bandwagon forming around you." The bottom line is I actually like your + Show Spoiler +post (or at least the parts of it that you provided your own analysis). I am deeply suspicious, though, of the timing of your new activity, as well as why it took until day 4 before you felt inspired to contribute anything of value. And regarding this quote: Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 06:33 aRyuujin wrote: Expect Goodkarma to paint me as 100% scum #3, he's been tunneling me literally all game long No, aRyuujin. I'm not going to say you're 100% scum. I wouldn't even say that of JingleHell, who I'm currently pretty sure is scum. What I will say, though, is that to date you've done nothing to establish your innocence, and that's every townie's responsibility (if a townie you truly are). In fact everything you've written to date has read scummy to me. If you've seen my more recent case writeup on you it should be apparent why. If you plan to have a chance at showing your innocence, you will be doubling your posting activity right now and establishing some cases that demonstrate your views on who is scum. If you're in agreement with someone, you will clearly explain why what they say makes sense. Basically, you will start to do what you should have been doing since day one. Unfortunately, no amount of activity now is going to make up for your posting habits to date. But you can still work on showing you can actually contribute. This will go a long ways in showing you're pro-town. But as of right now, I'm planning my vote for Day 5 to still be on you. Instead of being "annoyed" with me, I encourage you to do something about it.
On his first suggestion:
I find this very hard to believe. Why would you even bother playing this game if you went in with the intention of contributing nothing? What satisfaction could you possibly get, even if you won, if you weren't in any way responsible for the outcome of the game? I played because I love IRL mafia. I've played hundreds of games of IRL mafia on school trips to competitions, during lunch, and exam periods that my friends and I are exempt from. I rarely had stuff to say because this is my first game of forum mafia on any forum. I'm used to making calls based on people's emotions, their faces, and their personalities. I think this is a fairly silly thing to say, saying that I will know what to say, how to say it, and when to say it, just because I know you should contribute. After all, look at Golbat. He tried to contribute, but didn't do it correctly. If anyone still does believe I'm scum, it really shouldn't be because of this.
The next thing he says:
This is really the first point that seems to actually come from you. If you want any chance at establishing your innocence you will need to start making many more posts with points like this, where you create arguements of your own that portray your perspective of who is scum.
One of the reasons I could come up with this is irl mafia. It's a typical tell there. And I'm fairly sure what I'm doing in this post addresses everything else in this section.
He goes on to say:
So this point from Shady makes sense to you... Why exactly does it make sense to you? This has been one of the biggest issues I've had with you all game. You seem to go, "Yeah, what he said." There's nothing wrong with this, as long as you also add some content of your own to demonstrate to us exactly why it is you agree with a certain view. I agree with something... because I agree with it. Isn't that how it works? That what someone says makes sense? I can add a sentence saying, oh it makes sense because scum has 0 need to bus at that point, it only hurts them. But then people would say that I'm just paraphrasing the quote.
he then says:
Regarding me: "I initially had a somewhat scummy read on him. However, I think his recent posts seem really town oriented, and I have a feeling I was heavily influenced by his game long tunneling of me. Because he's been going after Jingle, I find it highly unlikely that he's mafia if Jingle is."
This is yet another view of your own. Why is this the first time we are hearing about this? If you had a scummy read on me, you should have shared it with everyone. The last thing I remember you saying of your read on me was something like:
On July 28 2012 09:24 aRyuujin wrote:
-snip-
You still feel like town
The reason why I never mentioned it is because from what I understand, OMGUS votes are largely discouraged. I had a somewhat scum read on you, but I feel like it was basically a defensive reaction to your accusing me all game long based on what I felt was largely... nothing. If I start talking about why I think you might be scum when there are bigger fish to fry, it's not really helping town, especially when it's probably colored with my own defensive reaction.
The last part of his post that I feel is really relevant is:
Then there's this closing point from you: "2)If Jingle is mafia, then it puts the nail in the coffin imo that Darthpunk is scum."
You'd better explain this better, because in no way do I see this to be necessarily true.
I said this because I was certain that DP was mafia. I feel like I discussed it enough in that post, and it was pretty much there to encourage a lynch of Darthpunk (who I am still 100% certain is mafia).
He questions the timing of my post, as well. Basically, I have a ton of free time today and tomorrow, and I noticed stuff.
He then basically says I need to provide analysis to be town. Like I said earlier, this post pretty much handles that, I think.
Sorry this took so long, I had to eat dinner and do some other stuff in the middle -.-
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EBWOP ugh I do this all the time(forget to add one line) but I'll be back to this thread in around 15-30 minutes. I will not see anything posted in the meantime until I get back
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@Shady: Why not kill the guaranteed scum now? unless you're of the opinion that me/Jingle or alan/jingle(which I think we basically ruled out) is more likely than DP/alan, then it's objectively better not to risk that 1% that we end up mislynching Jingle.
Also, in case the mods don't see my vote tangled up in the huge post I made up above, I voted DP: ##unvote and ##vote Darthpunk
And Shady, if the consensus is still that we need to lynch Jingle first, rest assured that I will vote Jingle over a mislynch. I just believe that it's in our best interests to hit DP first.
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+ Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 15:26 DarthPunk wrote:@ aRyuujins ROFLCASEShow nested quote +On August 06 2012 13:43 aRyuujin wrote: This line of reasoning is going to seem a bit silly, but I think it's just piling onto the evidence DP has left us. + Show Spoiler + happened at 3:05, after which DP immediately posts voting for Zork, (looks like he started writing that post before zork pulled the whole claim thing). DP posts again 4 minutes after Zork's claim. I think it's quite possible for them to have decided on the mafia qt, "k, bros, imma pull this stunt so u can accuse me," Zork claims, and immediately DP responds, helping him cover for the fact that he was SUCH a late switcher. Thought this has been brought up by Mordanis and Ange, it's pretty much disregarded because it's so situational. (It pretty much gets forgotten) The thing that makes this move from 100% WIFOM to kind of useful imo is this post: + Show Spoiler + Here, he defends himself from the accusations of Ange and Mord by saying it was late. However, he doesn't talk about ANY other part of those cases. Instead, he just brings up irl problems why he couldn't. The biggest thing here is that he says he was up an extra hour. Why the hell did that happen? When I saw that post, I was like k, wtf is he doing, and voted him and moved on. Especially considering he says it was incredibly late in the morning, (and that during this hour all he did was make two tiny posts at the very end) it sounds to me like he's just trying to paint himself as a mislead townie brought to his senses by Zork's move. Yes, this is weak. However, it is just icing on the proverbial cake. This is nothing. I have also already responded to this several times in what I believe to be a satisfactory way. It is interesting that there is so little to go off that half a page of your 'case' on me is so impotent. It is also interesting that once again you are bringing nothing to the thread or the case on me that is new or original. Just once again repeating allegations that others have stated and I have cleared up. About staying up an hour later. I was interested in the medic claim and I was finishing watching heros game in ASUS ROG whilst I was in bed. I did fully intend on going to bed however I changed my mind (oh my god how scummy wtf?) I was posting my Vote switch at the time and did not see the zork claim. Just from reading my next post this should be clear as I immediately address it. I switched to prevent a no lynch. nothing more, nothing less. I said I would do this at the very beginning and I stuck to it. I don't know why this seems to be so difficult to understand but that is what happened. As you say this allegation is piss weak. and I don;t know how many times people like yourself will bring it up when I have already addressed it. If you are going to make a case. Might I suggest instead of repeating others ad nauseum you actually contribute some original thought. or anything. at all. In no way does this constitute any part of a case. Just saying it is suspicious does not mean anything. Moving on. Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 13:43 aRyuujin wrote: Something that I don't think has been brought up in this context is this post: + Show Spoiler + Once more, though it's not an IRONCLAD HARDCORE damning post, it's something that seems very... interesting. Essentially, Ange begins to link Zorkmid and JingleHell. Darthpunk strikes that down without providing much real evidence, and begins accusing Ange. Why? Because he/she is making these connections. DP even says something to that degree, at I initially had a small town read on you but after actually reading through the discussion between yourself and jingle I am starting to worry about you. Your reaction to jingle's pressure was an incredibly disproportionate response, and trying to draw a connection to a case you posted hours after jingle had first cast suspicion on you is very suspicious to me. I don't see any connections whatsoever between Jingles pressure on you and your case on zork. I have no idea why you would try and draw a connection that wasn't there. . If you reread this section of the post, it's quite obviously leaning towards a scumDarthpunk trying to protect his scum buddies. He even goes on to make this post (talking to Ange) You seem to have been desperate to link jingle hell to your zorkmid case even though his case on you began hours earlier. You asked me several times to state why I felt the Zork case was weaker, and are now using all those answers you dug for yesterday in order to build a case that isn't there. It seems as if you 100% KNEW that zork would flip red. And then desperately tried to manufacture connections to him wherever you could. I can 100% see a scum motivation for this you bussed zork and not only gained 'confirmed town' status but have also set up 2 mislynches. , further showing his determination to bust that link. So you are saying that I need to provide evidence in order to prove something isn't there? Really? Ange needed to provide evidence something was there. Something other than Jingle is accusing me whilst I accuse someone else. That is not a link. Jingle started against Ange HOURS before that. and at that time this was her entire argument. So not providing evidence for a link existing is townie. But me asking for evidence for a link existing is? Right. Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 13:43 aRyuujin wrote: And finally, as I mentioned earlier, if you look at the last page of his filter, he progressively gets more and more emotional and lashes out at the people who accuse him. Like I noted when discussing Jingle, this seems to be a fairly scum move. So the only case you have that is new or not retarded is that you perceive emotion in a text base game which is incredibly difficult to both convey and perceive emotion through. I don't know how to respond to your perceptions of emotion that isn't there. but next time you write a wall of text 'case' against me could you please include a case? If anyone sees something important could someone please convey it to me. Concisely if possible lol. [/b] You did exactly what I said you'd do in the first paragraph...
Make sure that scum can't take advantage of this. They must address the whole post, or the conclusion. Not just cherry pick some parts. (I'm especially expecting DP to try to dismantle the first point against him, and try to shift the whole portion against him to that)
Come on, man. I expected better than this! Anyway, DP, why don't you provide us with your own opinions?
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On August 06 2012 15:40 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 14:26 aRyuujin wrote: @Shady: Why not kill the guaranteed scum now? unless you're of the opinion that me/Jingle or alan/jingle(which I think we basically ruled out) is more likely than DP/alan, then it's objectively better not to risk that 1% that we end up mislynching Jingle.
Also, in case the mods don't see my vote tangled up in the huge post I made up above, I voted DP: ##unvote and ##vote Darthpunk
And Shady, if the consensus is still that we need to lynch Jingle first, rest assured that I will vote Jingle over a mislynch. I just believe that it's in our best interests to hit DP first. Of course it is in your best interest to lynch me first. I am under suspicion and am accusing you. You said not that long ago that Jingle was the best to lynch first. The thing that has changed? I cast suspicion onto you. That's it. Can you be any more transparent? LOL I am 100% sure if GK had voted mordanis that you would be all over her like a bad salesman. Yet you sheeped my case on mord and are 100% innocent? LMAO
Why don't you address my conclusion rather than getting all worked up?
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On August 06 2012 15:35 DarthPunk wrote: @Jingle. I have a town read on you because you are experiencing exactly what I am experiencing. If the same people that are trying to mislynch you are also trying to mislynch me. I assume you must be town. If you think there is an ulterior motive for me believing you to be town and that that is enough reason to vote for me, so be it.
That being said. I will continue to post cases and defend myself but I am sheeping shadys vote no matter what this cycle. If shady votes for me I will vote for myself etc. The reason for this is that the situation is bad at the moment. a mess really. I will sheep the vote of the confirmed town. Whilst still contributing as much as possible.
If I had to vote for someone right now it would be aRyuujin he had less than a pages worth of filter but has LEAPT into action now more than one person is considering voting for him. I mean read his filter. the contrast is obvious.
So basically you don't want any responsibility for your vote? It's been said, time and time again, the strongest weapon of a town is their vote. Abandoning your vote is NEVER a pro town move. Now, let's see what he actually says in this post. He has a town read on Jingle. Why? Because DP says DP is town, and anyone who says DP is town cannot ever accuse someone correctly. Seems legit. Now, let's see, why would DP actually say Jingle is town? Maybe... it's because DP ALREADY KNOWS that Jingle is town. Darthpunk is furthering his ploy to have Jingle's green flip make him look clean. Shady, come on man. At this point, lynching Darthpunk needs to be priority #1.
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Hey GK! Glad to see you're here. The thing about Darkpunk is that rather than it being one big thing confirming that he's scum (like how Zorkmid dropped that bomb), DP's red status' confirmation is made up of many small tells. Over time, DP has had lots of these small tells, that if we add together, pretty much confirm that he's a scum. One is his defense of Zork. Contrary to popular belief, rather than just stating that Zork is a lurker, DP tried to find town motives to explain away Zork's slips. At some points, (I think where it simply became too difficult because of all the mistakes Zork was making), DP was just like fuck it, he's a bad townie, but..... let's lynch Mordanis! And when people realized how obviously scummy Zork was, THAT was the point when DP was like nope Zork = lurker. Then he made his supposed "instigating attack" that apparently led to me OMGUSing him. Control F for Zork here, it's quite telling.
The other thing I really want to point out is that rather than advancing town's position, after being accused, DP has pretty much curled into a ball. He didn't even properly address my analysis (no I don't think it's a case), instead doing exactly what I said he would do: Ignoring my conclusions and instead trying to discredit it by taking small parts and acting absurdly.
And it seems that I was ninja'd by Ange, but the thing we need to look for is motives. Not necessarily the actions themselves, but the motives. Why does DP behave the way he does is the question that we need to ask ourselves.
On August 06 2012 16:00 goodkarma wrote:It appears that the Darthpunk lynch is gaining momentum. And now there's side-tangents that include alan too... I'm still against lynching Darthpunk today. Can someone kindly explain to me why he's 100% scum? Ange's arguement against him was summarized as: Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 07:10 Ange777 wrote:1. During the Zork lynch discussion DarthPunk repeatedly soft-defended Zork, pushed Mordanis as lynch candidate and proposed to lynch aRyuujin instead of Zork. 2. He switches votes very conveniently at around the same time when Zork fake claims medic. I believe that scum decided in their QT to concede to the Zork lynch.
1) Correct me if I'm wrong, but I recall Darthpunk's "defense" of Zork amounting to he felt Zork was some kind of lurker. And if we were to lynch solely based off that reasoning we should lynch aRyuujin. I don't recall much further "defense" than that, and that seems like a reasonable arguement if he was looking at it solely from the lurker standpoint. 2) I find Darthpunk's claim that he hadn't seen Zork's post before his post FAR MORE BELIEVABLE than that in QT scum were like "let's have Darthpunk change vote and bus Zork TWO MINUTES AFTER he incriminates himself." I'd expect a move like this to be planned out hours ahead of time so that Darthpunk could change his vote way ahead of time and avoid suspicion... Thanks aRyuujin for your most recent case post. It's a dramatic improvement from earlier . One thing on your case against Darthpunk I'd like to specifically address, though, is your implication that NK'ing Mordanis benefited Darthpunk. Any such discussion of why scum NK'ed a specific person I feel is too much WIFOM to really bring up. I could come up with other realistic reasons why they might have NK'ed Mordanis. The first that comes to mind is they wanted to get someone they were pretty sure wouldn't be medic saved... If someone could summarize a specific case point that shows Darthpunk's guilt that I haven't discussed here please let me know. I wanted to give Darthpunk a chance to defend himself, as I feel his defense is just as important as what was said in the case against him to get a good read of the situation. But after his defense, I don't feel the evidence is there to say he's a sure scum, especially compared to Jingle. Jingle has been spending his posting time calling us tunneling sheep, which is hardly a compelling arguement -_- I understand the need for town to stay united, and will coincide my vote with Shady's to secure the lynch for Darth IF IT COMES TO THAT, but I honestly hope it doesn't. I feel we're getting ahead of ourselves. Almost everyone is in agreement that Jingle is scum, so why are we now voting Darth? If there's some compelling arguement for lynching him I've overlooked, please enlighten me.
and @ Darthpunk If you want us to take you for a townie, you're going to have to act like a townie. All you've really posted is that you feel for Jingle for getting accused and that you're mad at me/i'm an idiot/i'm scum/there's something very funny for accusing you. What do you think about Alan? Who's the other scum besides myself? Why is it that when I address you, you ignore what I'm saying, and then say that I'm the one ignoring what you're saying? What's the REAL reason why you think Jingle is town? And why are you going to brush this post off with plenty of LOL, ROFL. and LMAO?
Something else I dug up: + Show Spoiler +On August 03 2012 17:29 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 03 2012 17:25 goodkarma wrote: @Shady, wherever you are: I hope you have good reason to be away from these forums...
We need 6/7 town to get lynch majority... With our current division, I just don't see that happening... I still believe that banding together around Shady was our best chance, and I hope he returns to provide his impressions with the most recently presented cases.
I feel very uneasy about voting Mord. On top of the reasons I've already presented, aRyuujin, my top scum suspect, has also gotten onto that bandwaggon.
If Shady comes back and decides Mord. is still his best choice, then fine. Until then:
b]##unvote ##Vote: Zorkmid
Zorkmid is an obvious scum. I sincerely hope that Darthpunk will change his vote. Even then, I can't help but feel that town is in trouble here. -_-
I will be checking this forum again before the deadline, and will only consider changing my vote to one of the following to achieve a majority lynch: aRyuujin, JinglHells, or Shady's choice (if he ever provides an update post). Good luck all... Can I just clarify before you leave why you are voting for Zork if Aryuujin is your top scum read. also. SEE waiting around for shady sands to see who to vote for is ridiculous. I am SO GLAD you are going back on that. [/b] Here, we have a discussion where DP is . Word for word, DP says that his(DP's) current behavior is "ridiculous"
This is somewhat offtopic, so I'll keep it in a spoiler, but it's directed at DP
+ Show Spoiler +On August 06 2012 16:40 DarthPunk wrote: EBWOP: you also flat out ignore goodkarmas request. have some respect. Hey man, cool down. You're the only person who's been accused of breaking this: However, this does not mean that you should try to win by being a jerk to the other players so they all want to quit playing. , (In my eyes) you've behaved quite rudely after being accused. Hopefully (and chances are), I'm just getting annoyed because of something stupid, and everyone disagrees with me, but still. Relax and chill
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Also @ Obvious: I spent about 2 minutes trying to figure that mystery out myself, as well, finally gave up lol. And Obvious references a good point:
Darth has a town read on Jingle. On August 06 2012 16:07 goodkarma wrote: EBWOP: Jingle has been spending his posting time calling us tunneling sheep, which is hardly a compelling defense -_-
I don't really see a reason to disagree with GK's summary. I'm trying to figure out how he can know Jingle is town without the use of WIFOM.
On August 06 2012 15:55 aRyuujin wrote: Now, let's see what he actually says in this post. He has a town read on Jingle. Why? Because DP says DP is town, and anyone who says DP is town cannot ever accuse someone correctly. Seems legit. Now, let's see, why would DP actually say Jingle is town? Maybe... it's because DP ALREADY KNOWS that Jingle is town. Darthpunk is furthering his ploy to have Jingle's green flip make him look clean. Shady, come on man. At this point, lynching Darthpunk needs to be priority #1.
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On August 06 2012 17:13 DarthPunk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 17:06 Ange777 wrote:On August 06 2012 16:57 DarthPunk wrote: Is there anything else? i fail to see a blatant revelation that explains your position. seems like a weak case to go with the other weak cases to join an increasingly easy bandwagon You are getting sulky. The easy bandwagon would have been Jingle. When we had the consensus to lynch him, there was no posting at all from town for the entire first half of day 3. This is what I am talking about. I am getting sulky?? what does that add to the case. you are posting ad nauseum whilst adding nothing to the case that I have not addressed, even though you Implied you would.
Actually, posting ad nauseum would mean that nobody wants to discuss anymore. Clearly, that's not the case. Now, what I'm interested in is why you haven't answered the ~6 questions I posed you, or even referenced that post. It's actually quite possible that you missed it entirely, seeing as it was the last post on the page before this. However, if you were town, you'd actually be answering them by yourself.
And like Ange said, the only scum motivation in accusing you would be to block Jingle's lynch, seeing as his bandwagon had already basically been set to go. (note that this would require 4 mafia in this game) However, as town players, our job is actually not to lynch town and sow confusion while saving ourselves. Instead, we need to hunt out the scum. Honestly, you're not providing us with anything remotely town motivated to go off of for ages.
And is your reasoning for having a town read on Jingle still that you understand what its like to have a bandwagon?
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EBWOP: Sorry, should've refreshed the main thread. Didn't see all of DP's posts you just made 5 crappy posts in a row, accusing your accusers. Why? Because they accused you. Sounds like flailing to me. Your "argument" against the whole "Jingle = ez lynch" literally makes no sense. He's not there to defend himself? Wait a minute. Earlier, you said that Ange attacks people who aren't there to defend themselves BECAUSE they're not there (using yourself as an example). And in those 5 posts, you still haven't done anything constructive except provide absurd arguments. Because you seem to like traditional argumentation, you can say this post is basically 50% Reductio ad absurdum.
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