On November 22 2012 02:09 marvellosity wrote:
*colours Cave in orange*
*colours Cave in orange*
Can I have a legend for your color scheme?
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:09 marvellosity wrote: *colours Cave in orange* Can I have a legend for your color scheme? | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:17 Oatsmaster wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 02:11 Toadesstern wrote: On November 22 2012 01:41 Oatsmaster wrote: On November 22 2012 01:39 Toadesstern wrote: On November 21 2012 22:48 Acrofales wrote: Oh, ok. Syllo is running. That makes me feel a bit better about taking a back seat. At least there's a choice. No offence, iamperfection and dino, but given your play so far, you are not serious contestants. screw you. I am running as well. Yay you are back. What do you think about my case on Clarity? I don't think it's that much yet. I really don't want to get into detail about that though. Because? Clarity is acting like you have said is a scum read, posting a lot but without content. Or did I read your earlier posts wrongly? You're taking things at face value, but you have no concept of each player's meta. Blanket statements are reasons for suspicion but you need to demonstrate why something is scummy. Clarity asks questions, he's involved in conversations. I'm learning that if I want to read him, I need to direct questions back at him for him to answer. Trying to draw information from others while not giving your own is not necessarily scummy. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:27 marvellosity wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 02:16 Hopeless1der wrote: On November 22 2012 02:09 marvellosity wrote: *colours Cave in orange* Can I have a legend for your color scheme? orange is a scumread. Z-bo/Hapa were this colour end of day 1 in mario. Crossfire was in red when I died, for "i'm certain". Cave comes in calling some fluffly nublet scum without actually calling him scum and for nebulous reasons. Supremely easy target. "his mafia team could have told him to do that" is nonsense too. Does this scale move across to green/blue? What color are you and what color is syllo? | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:22 Promethelax wrote: You know catching up with this thread is a million times worse than I was hoping, remember how I said that I was toning down the amount which I am posting? Could you all do me a favour and consolidate too. Thanks. After reading the last ~20 pages I have come to a conclusion as to who I want to vote. It isn't Sylo and it isn't Sand. Their abilities are, no doubt, incredible but I don't like the way Sand took over the thread early and no one challenged him. I feel that a mafia player would in fact have tried to take over. (Remember Matt's reed of Decundo in PP) as such I'll be voting away from the two of them and towards someone who I read as town right now and who is known for having good reads. ## Vote: Acro Come on boys, lets do this right and make Sand have to fight for his nomination. I'll be out again for a few hours. See ya'll soon. I still expect some kind of a campaign with the intended party they'd choose. We're going to know what the party was from the next day post, so the leaders can't lie about it. As for sand 'taking over'. We let him, because his scum play is supposed to be drastically different from his town play. You said you'd initially have taken marv on your team, and marv has voted syllo. Why isn't syllo a viable candidate for you to vote? | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:37 CaveJohnson wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 02:33 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 02:32 CaveJohnson wrote: On November 22 2012 02:27 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 02:16 Hopeless1der wrote: On November 22 2012 02:09 marvellosity wrote: *colours Cave in orange* Can I have a legend for your color scheme? orange is a scumread. Z-bo/Hapa were this colour end of day 1 in mario. Crossfire was in red when I died, for "i'm certain". Cave comes in calling some fluffly nublet scum without actually calling him scum and for nebulous reasons. Supremely easy target. "his mafia team could have told him to do that" is nonsense too. Easy target != wrong Kill the easy targets before end game or you lose its simple game logic. Trying to go around that on day 1 is idiotic and foolish and you should know better. obviously you misunderstand what I say, but do carry on. Easy target as in he's new and fluffy. Technically you're an easy target too, but I still think you're scum. The new and fluffy will have to die as well. We don't need complications in the end game. The scum and Lavos need to die. You would potentially kill off power roles because they were new? | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 02:39 Dienosore wrote: I'm not trying to accuse anyone with this post or anything, but are you guys even considering that sand may be aware of your meta reads on him and is playing as if he were towny to throw you all off? Just seems strange so many people are blindly believing him to be towny based on past games Who do you want to lead us today dienosore? Sandroba has demonstrated his abilities in past games, giving him that opportunity in this one makes sense. As a side note, if a mission were to fail, I think we can safely assume scum was within the 4-man party that the leader chose. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 03:05 Toadesstern wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 03:02 Keirathi wrote: On November 22 2012 03:01 Toadesstern wrote: On November 22 2012 02:53 Dienosore wrote: I would want ME to be the leader, of course. I realize I'm not running with any history, so I understand how that puts me at a disadvantage if you are trying to play it safe. However, I believe not having any track record in this situation is actually better, due to my campaign platform: All I want is the first leader position. If elected, I will open up the party selection process to everyone by making a poll and taking the top three with me (I know i said two earlier; was an honest mistake). I will also have a poll for what to do for our first action. I believe this is the best way to go about things, seeing as we have NO IDEA what is going to actually happen at the end of the first cycle. Once we have seen how the game is played, I will step down and let someone else have a turn as leader. I already adressed this. This kind of post is something that is supposed to look nice while not being nice at all. We want to elect someone who's comfortable to make a decision himself and willing to take responsibility. We don't want to vote someone who's dodging responsibility and opting to go with some kind of majority decreed team. Now the bolded part is interessting. Why do you want to be the first leader? I take it it's not to improve our chances because frankly speaking you don't even feel comfortable to judge someone yourself, do you? So if it's not to improve our chances, what's your reasoning behind running for this position? Do you really have to ask that question? There's a pretty obvious explanation (to me), and if you're not able to see it then it makes me doubt that you are town. I've got a bunch of explanations. I want to hear why he wants to be leader from himself. I don't intend to give people possible explanations as to how they "should" answer when asking them to explain themselves... You'll notice keir didn't say what the 'obvious' was. Keir are you just upset that Toad charged into the thread with a scumread on you? If you can't see a town reason for questioning someone's motives.... | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 03:10 Toadesstern wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 03:04 Acrofales wrote: On November 22 2012 02:06 Toadesstern wrote: On November 22 2012 01:14 Acrofales wrote: On November 22 2012 00:36 Oatsmaster wrote: kush makes me want to shout at him in every single post... Ok for now, I think the party leader should be toadesstern because He started off his post with a scumread, which shows effort in reading the thread instead of mindlessly posting without actually analysing anything like almost every player so far. His posts look really sincere and his logic is spot on On November 21 2012 17:13 Toadesstern wrote: Oh and I forgot: Yeah we need to find someone to send d1 and that's all nice and fine but I don't think it's a good way to keep the talk all focused on only that. Faking townreads as mafias is incredibly easy. Faking mafiareads as mafia is something that takes effort. If we're only going to talk about who we're going to send d1 we're giving mafia an incredibly easy time skating by. I know it feels counterintuitive as clearly the shortterm "goal" is to send a good guy d1 but I think we should try and balance those issues out. After all, the goal in the longrun is to figure people out and we won't be able to do that by playing nice all day long. His posts look really hard to fake for scum and because of his reputation as being imba, I am voting Toadesstern ##Vote: Toadsstern You clearly don't know toad at all. You don't even know toad's reputation. 1. Toad is notoriously hard to read. He posts giant walls of text that ramble on as either alignment and gets into hissyfits with whoever he feels like (most notoriously bugs and VE) as either alignment. 2. If he is imba, he is imba as scum, not so much as town. Personal opinion here, but I haven't seen toad make the difference as town. Unlike some other players in this game. Now on to the beef of your post: why exactly do you feel his posts are hard to fake as scum? What specific quality makes you lean town on him? So far I am seeing you park your vote in a similar manner to Keirathi, for a similar reason. Last time I had to gather people I was some sort of mason who get's to invite people each and every night to join his QT resulting in the QT growing in number every cycle and having an incredibly powerfull town-circle. I think I picked something like 5 townies straight without a problem at all, including people like WBG who are notoriously hard to read according to most people here. The only mistake I made was when I gambled in lategame as we had 2 Kenpachi-like people (real Kenpachi and someone like Kenpachi) who didn't play the game while not being able to get a read on Marv as well. I picked Marv because I figured that if neither of those 2 Kenpachis is mafia we've lost anyways because one of them will get lynched at some point and it already was lylo. So yeah I think I'm pretty decent when it comes to that as well. I agree I'm by no way the best scumhunter around and I'm mostly working by process of elimination but that's because I trust in my townreads so heavily and they're never wrong. So yeah I think I'm the right guy for the job. Not saying you're not. Just that I have reservations voting for you, and correcting the jubjubs as to your reputation. I've seen you play good as town. I've seen you play better as scum. I saw you are running and I like that. What makes you a better candidate than syllo or sandro? I don't think anyone in here can claim to be better than Syllo or sandro when it comes to reads if that's what you're asking. However unlike Syllo and Sandro I'm someone who's pretty talkactive and I will get people talking about reads. Syllo and Sandro both tend to be pretty lazy threadwise and I don't think that that's something we want for someone who's running for the d1 spot. If they're strong, motivated town players who can in turn read others correctly as town, I want them as party leader. Activity isn't the only indicator, and getting others to talk shouldn't require you to be leader. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 03:14 Dienosore wrote: I italicized 'first' because I wanted to draw attention to the fact that party leaders will be changing quite often and I feel as if people are thinking this is going to be a permanent position. As for the majority elected team, I think it's more logical to do things this way, at least for the first cycle while we are completely in the dark. I don't view polling the masses as dodging responsibility, but rather taking away the mafias chance to have an iron grip on the initial proceedings (assuming scum is elected and starts a dictatorship). By putting the vote out into the open, we also have another opportunity to see where loyalties lie. Its not your fault if people don't read the mod's posts, but you can just quote them if that's a concern. You don't get to 'step down' from being the party leader, we elect a new one. On November 21 2012 14:53 GreYMisT wrote: If it were not clear in the OP, A new party leader will usually be elected before each event. Just something I'm not sure I put out there. As for the poll, we already have a plurality party leader. I assume the top 3 votes in your poll get selected, but what if you only have 1 hour to decide? The party leader has final say, and needs to be accountable for success or failure for an event. In addition, your poll system allows scum to push their own member into the party and the party leader that we tried so hard to town-read can't stop it from happening. I hate that idea. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 03:36 CaveJohnson wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 03:28 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 03:24 CaveJohnson wrote: On November 22 2012 03:17 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 03:16 CaveJohnson wrote: On November 22 2012 03:13 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 03:10 Toadesstern wrote: On November 22 2012 03:04 Acrofales wrote: On November 22 2012 02:06 Toadesstern wrote: On November 22 2012 01:14 Acrofales wrote: [quote] You clearly don't know toad at all. You don't even know toad's reputation. 1. Toad is notoriously hard to read. He posts giant walls of text that ramble on as either alignment and gets into hissyfits with whoever he feels like (most notoriously bugs and VE) as either alignment. 2. If he is imba, he is imba as scum, not so much as town. Personal opinion here, but I haven't seen toad make the difference as town. Unlike some other players in this game. Now on to the beef of your post: why exactly do you feel his posts are hard to fake as scum? What specific quality makes you lean town on him? So far I am seeing you park your vote in a similar manner to Keirathi, for a similar reason. Last time I had to gather people I was some sort of mason who get's to invite people each and every night to join his QT resulting in the QT growing in number every cycle and having an incredibly powerfull town-circle. I think I picked something like 5 townies straight without a problem at all, including people like WBG who are notoriously hard to read according to most people here. The only mistake I made was when I gambled in lategame as we had 2 Kenpachi-like people (real Kenpachi and someone like Kenpachi) who didn't play the game while not being able to get a read on Marv as well. I picked Marv because I figured that if neither of those 2 Kenpachis is mafia we've lost anyways because one of them will get lynched at some point and it already was lylo. So yeah I think I'm pretty decent when it comes to that as well. I agree I'm by no way the best scumhunter around and I'm mostly working by process of elimination but that's because I trust in my townreads so heavily and they're never wrong. So yeah I think I'm the right guy for the job. Not saying you're not. Just that I have reservations voting for you, and correcting the jubjubs as to your reputation. I've seen you play good as town. I've seen you play better as scum. I saw you are running and I like that. What makes you a better candidate than syllo or sandro? I don't think anyone in here can claim to be better than Syllo or sandro when it comes to reads if that's what you're asking. However unlike Syllo and Sandro I'm someone who's pretty talkactive and I will get people talking about reads. Syllo and Sandro both tend to be pretty lazy threadwise and I don't think that that's something we want for someone who's running for the d1 spot. I don't really see syllogism as lazy. Not his play so far anyway. On November 21 2012 15:28 syllogism wrote: Oh Sandro is here and posting quite a bit, I may re-evaluate my nomination if I like what I see as I would definitely prefer being as lazy as possible On November 21 2012 22:55 sandroba wrote: On November 21 2012 22:51 marvellosity wrote: On November 21 2012 22:50 sandroba wrote: I wouldn't mind syllo being leader either and if I win I will give him veto power over the people I choose. I'm fairly certain he is town at this point. what distinguishes a town syllo from a scum syllo in your opinion? He is way less conflict enticing / questions asking as scum and just chillax and agrees with people that are the right track. This game he says he will be lazy, but isn't and is activily doing shit left and right. So yeah. I'll take the wishes of the actual player over an interpretation of play from someone who is being supported by the player in question. Syllo has chosen himself to be taken out of the running and we should respect that. On November 21 2012 22:45 syllogism wrote: Right now it is likely that I will support sandroba if I do not gain the necessary votes, even if I'm not "fairly sure" that he is town. The problem is that just electing someone who is very likely to be town isn't enough as the person has to also be able to identify 3 townies at a high enough probability on day 1. Anyway, currently it would definitely optimal from my point of view that I would be elected over him due to my uncertainty. I'm not likely to put effort into convincing sandroba voters to switch to me, if that's what you mean by running, but I'm definitely "running" in the sense that I wouldn't mind people voting for me. Last time I respond to you. You clearly don't read the thread. He doesn't care to convince people - Thats taking himself out of the running. You clearly don't read the thread Since I'm hoping marv keeps himself in check, I'm not likely to put effort into convincing sandroba voters to switch to me, if that's what you mean by running If I ran, he'd probably be trying to get votes FROM me onto himself. But I'm not running. Sandroba is running, and syllo is a-okay with people voting sandroba. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 03:41 CaveJohnson wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 03:38 Hopeless1der wrote: On November 22 2012 03:36 CaveJohnson wrote: On November 22 2012 03:28 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 03:24 CaveJohnson wrote: On November 22 2012 03:17 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 03:16 CaveJohnson wrote: On November 22 2012 03:13 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 03:10 Toadesstern wrote: On November 22 2012 03:04 Acrofales wrote: [quote] Not saying you're not. Just that I have reservations voting for you, and correcting the jubjubs as to your reputation. I've seen you play good as town. I've seen you play better as scum. I saw you are running and I like that. What makes you a better candidate than syllo or sandro? I don't think anyone in here can claim to be better than Syllo or sandro when it comes to reads if that's what you're asking. However unlike Syllo and Sandro I'm someone who's pretty talkactive and I will get people talking about reads. Syllo and Sandro both tend to be pretty lazy threadwise and I don't think that that's something we want for someone who's running for the d1 spot. I don't really see syllogism as lazy. Not his play so far anyway. On November 21 2012 15:28 syllogism wrote: Oh Sandro is here and posting quite a bit, I may re-evaluate my nomination if I like what I see as I would definitely prefer being as lazy as possible On November 21 2012 22:55 sandroba wrote: On November 21 2012 22:51 marvellosity wrote: On November 21 2012 22:50 sandroba wrote: I wouldn't mind syllo being leader either and if I win I will give him veto power over the people I choose. I'm fairly certain he is town at this point. what distinguishes a town syllo from a scum syllo in your opinion? He is way less conflict enticing / questions asking as scum and just chillax and agrees with people that are the right track. This game he says he will be lazy, but isn't and is activily doing shit left and right. So yeah. I'll take the wishes of the actual player over an interpretation of play from someone who is being supported by the player in question. Syllo has chosen himself to be taken out of the running and we should respect that. On November 21 2012 22:45 syllogism wrote: Right now it is likely that I will support sandroba if I do not gain the necessary votes, even if I'm not "fairly sure" that he is town. The problem is that just electing someone who is very likely to be town isn't enough as the person has to also be able to identify 3 townies at a high enough probability on day 1. Anyway, currently it would definitely optimal from my point of view that I would be elected over him due to my uncertainty. I'm not likely to put effort into convincing sandroba voters to switch to me, if that's what you mean by running, but I'm definitely "running" in the sense that I wouldn't mind people voting for me. Last time I respond to you. You clearly don't read the thread. He doesn't care to convince people - Thats taking himself out of the running. You clearly don't read the thread Since I'm hoping marv keeps himself in check, I'm not likely to put effort into convincing sandroba voters to switch to me, if that's what you mean by running If I ran, he'd probably be trying to get votes FROM me onto himself. But I'm not running. Sandroba is running, and syllo is a-okay with people voting sandroba. Splitting votes is a silly idea in that situation. It would have to take Sand stepping down and you gaining a majority for Syllo to actually run properly. I meant that if we hypothetically replaced sandroba with myself, syllo would step up his game. Your whole thing about syllo being lazy and scummy is mis-representative of what has been put into the thread because he's not removing himself in general, he's removing competition for sandroba. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 03:52 Dienosore wrote: Hmm, thanks for the responses to my platform, guys. I knew it would be a (likely) possibility for the mafia to push someone into the group when I suggested it. In fact, I was actually counting on a move like that. It's true that we might lose the first challenge and someone might die, but then we would know for sure one of those people are scum. Then we would only have to flip the scope on those three people and root out the villain, and we would have the polling process to help us draw info. I know the move is risky, but it is a calculated risk. Of course if you have a better way to identify mafia, one that perhaps doesn't potentially sacrifice a towny to draw out scum or one that doesn't include blind reads, I'm all ears. [On second thought, I think its pretty clear now I don't have any real shot at first leader. However, I would still like my day 1 strategy to be considered by whoever is in that position] That's true regardless of how the party is formed. Event Failure = scum was present. Your plan just makes failure more likely for day 1. The only benefit is that scum have to be more careful about outing themselves through the voting, but if it were actually a poll, it'd be anonymous anyways. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 05:00 CaveJohnson wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 04:40 Clarity_nl wrote: @ Cavejohnson While I appreciate the fact that you're trying to "think of the endgame" we don't know what an endgame will look like at all in this format. We don't know how many (if any at all) lynches we'll have. For all we know there is no such thing as lylo. Yet you are suggesting we get rid of people who give off a newb town vibe because they might be a problem later? Seriously, our win con is defeating Lavos, with a secondary objective of killing scum. How will getting rid of a newb towny help town? lylo still exists in these two forms: Either when mafia could out number us Or we don't have the tools to kill lavos We don't know what it takes to kill lavos except I presume for firepower. Of course the success of the missions will also impact this. We don't want to have to fight lavos in the ocean palace for example because we failed too many. I want the newbies to prove themselves like any other but that may not be possible when one false move could easily screw us up on either one of those conditions. This game will be so chaotic that one false move means a loss so we can't afford risks at any point in the game. On November 19 2012 09:43 GreYMisT wrote: Setup Information Mafia: Kill ALL town and have 1 mafia left alive | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 05:26 CaveJohnson wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 05:23 Clarity_nl wrote: Okay, so walk me through how failing an event will be a newbie's fault. Especially if you know they're newbies. When all the "vets" are dead with only them alive do you really believe they will have the knowledge and experience to make the correct choice? No. Failure of events = newbies fault Go. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 05:28 phagga wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 02:28 Hopeless1der wrote: On November 22 2012 02:27 marvellosity wrote: On November 22 2012 02:16 Hopeless1der wrote: On November 22 2012 02:09 marvellosity wrote: *colours Cave in orange* Can I have a legend for your color scheme? orange is a scumread. Z-bo/Hapa were this colour end of day 1 in mario. Crossfire was in red when I died, for "i'm certain". Cave comes in calling some fluffly nublet scum without actually calling him scum and for nebulous reasons. Supremely easy target. "his mafia team could have told him to do that" is nonsense too. Does this scale move across to green/blue? What color are you and what color is syllo? Why exaclty is this important to you? What do you hope to gain from it? I want to know what his reads are and he keeps them color coded. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 05:53 iamperfection wrote: well like clarity my info is different so different from me is usually not good NEVER TRUST GREYMIST | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 07:47 Acrofales wrote: As I was on the way to the supermarket, I thought of something that might be worth considering. I know this is a greymist game and aperture mafia was hardly about aperture at all, but I, at least, am not the goddamned batman or any kind of planar dragon, so from my point of view the theme is more serious this time around. If you agree that the theme could be serious, consider that the first mission in Chrono Trigger is also in a church. The playable characters are Crono, Lucca and Frog. Of these, I feel Frog is the most important, lorewise, in this mission. I don't think an outright claim is in order, but it might be worth considering, if you're one of these chars, in particular Frog, and running for the campaign, to make a more serious go at becoming the party leader. Frog, of all the characters, seems like he would wield the most influence in favour of town in the first mission of Chrono Trigger, assuming lore is an important aspect of this game. I swear to god if this gains traction I'm going to be pissed. | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
Either claim or fuck off with that goddamn poster | ||
Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On November 22 2012 07:59 Acrofales wrote: Show nested quote + On November 22 2012 07:54 Hopeless1der wrote: On November 22 2012 07:47 Acrofales wrote: As I was on the way to the supermarket, I thought of something that might be worth considering. I know this is a greymist game and aperture mafia was hardly about aperture at all, but I, at least, am not the goddamned batman or any kind of planar dragon, so from my point of view the theme is more serious this time around. If you agree that the theme could be serious, consider that the first mission in Chrono Trigger is also in a church. The playable characters are Crono, Lucca and Frog. Of these, I feel Frog is the most important, lorewise, in this mission. I don't think an outright claim is in order, but it might be worth considering, if you're one of these chars, in particular Frog, and running for the campaign, to make a more serious go at becoming the party leader. Frog, of all the characters, seems like he would wield the most influence in favour of town in the first mission of Chrono Trigger, assuming lore is an important aspect of this game. I swear to god if this gains traction I'm going to be pissed. Why? Because my head got bitten off for trying to speculate on setup. | ||
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