On December 29 2014 13:00 LightningStrike wrote: Damdred I hope we don't have a MYLO in this game. Also GB I can't /in in the newbie game since I played 4 games already Convence them to let me /in and I might consider it.
wanna do the shadow thing?
edit: oh wait, shadowing is the thing where I have to play.
On December 29 2014 13:00 LightningStrike wrote: Damdred I hope we don't have a MYLO in this game. Also GB I can't /in in the newbie game since I played 4 games already Convence them to let me /in and I might consider it.
wanna do the shadow thing?
edit: oh wait, shadowing is the thing where I have to play.
The reverse then. Or whatever, I don't care.
I would love to shadow you if you just /in :O You were the best player I with played so far in a game!
On December 31 2014 20:22 Koshi wrote: ##Vote: DoctorHelvetica
Reason: He is attacking me with a lie. Lynch all liars. Misrepresenting that I have 1 read when I have given my opinion on 4 people. I don't need that in this town.
On December 31 2014 20:22 Koshi wrote: ##Vote: DoctorHelvetica
Reason: He is attacking me with a lie. Lynch all liars. Misrepresenting that I have 1 read when I have given my opinion on 4 people. I don't need that in this town.
in his defence you did give two people as meh. chyz was town and who else did you give a read on?
I suppose you do sort of call eden scummy when you say "I agree with chyz"
I don't think DRH had an unreasonable statement , on first glance you only have one real read. if you don't count meh as a read.
I read DRH as super eager , try hard town.
meh because I was being generous. I got my eye on them both.
I have been more than once the joker yelling at people to do stuff and make stuff up (aka exaggerate) to get the game going. So yeah, I can see Dr.H. being town.
Btw, as I'm probably going to be mostly unavailable today (it's new year's eve... why did we even start?). I'll just throw out very much not curated thoughts I had while reading up to like page... 16?
I'll catch up with the rest later.
geript is sort of scummy in some respects. I have no idea why 20 minutes into the game he started wishing for random people to be there to talk to him. Also, everything he says is sort of... too clean? not dumb enough? I don't know how to describe it and it's just a feeling based on memory, I haven't gone back and re-read, so I'd need to confirm.
Eden came off strong and he said something I thought was really dumb.
DrH is probably town, and he had a post that made me feel good about that read.
Damdred is probably town too. He too has a post I can't remember that made me think "oh that looks like a townie".
Koshi overreacting on this page (21) to DrH's dismissal of koshi's defense was kinda mafia. Idk though.
I should probably just sheep marv and lynch him if he's wrong. That's always a fine strategy.
Remember, these reads I'm just throwing out literally from memory of having read like 4-6 pages this morning. Don't pretend these are some concrete observations.
Oh it was Eden's comments on DrH that I thought were dumb. The post where he gave reasons why DrH was scummy and then called him town. Or that's what it felt like at least.
Maybe he was just calling DrH dumb town, in which case it's better. I'll have to check.
I'll actually add to my list of reads that I kinda think marv is town. I have no particular strong reasons for this, and please don't take this as a licence to never lynch him, but he just feels right. But I'd listen to what he has to say this game.
Like I'm even reading Robik's posts, although I was thinking earlier "this game is surprisingly pleasant to read" then I realized robik hadn't really posted at all and I had my explanation.
Alright, let's talk business. I've read up to page 30 so anything that happens after that I have no idea about.
Artanis is best town. I feel fairly confident in this read. I don't think anyone is calling him mafia so I don't think I need to cite any examples really.
KelsierSC is probably town too. I particularly thought his sarcastic post towards.... idontremember, the one marv quoted, was okay. Less confident but still, no reason to even consider lynching today. Also, he articulated some of the problems I had with geript's posting until that point.
DrH is very likely town. I highly agree with Robik that he seems to genuinely believe he's onto something with this chyz read. He's constantly pushing it, almost forcing it down people's throat. If chyz is town (which I very well think might tbe the case) DrH is not the mafia on his wagon.
Robik I'm not entirely sure about, but the simple fact that he pointed out things I was already thinking about DrH makes him more likely to be town than mafia. I don't think we need to lynch him today.
Batsnacks is sort of meh whatever, but at least he is quite unapologetic about his lazy posting. Maybe a very, very slight lean town read.
TheChyz is the hardest read in this game. Everything he says sounds like he's mafia, which probably makes him town. He posts a bit like nb or something. Lacks confidence and his reads are all very meh. I think the main reason I don't want to lynch him is the thing Artanis pointed out where he started his defense by talking about the only player defending him. Like this guy could very well be mafia but starsenses are telling me I should not lynch him today. If he's mafia, I'm simply gonna look for the other mafia instead.
@Chyz: if you're town, step up bro.
Koshi is another hard read. So I actually don't think Chyz needs to be lynched, and if I had to answer now I'd guess Chyz is town. However, Koshi had an unnaturally strong read on Chyz as town. Like I felt like he should have had no business thinking Chyz is town at that point. But then Koshi kept talking to Artanis (I think it was artanis...) and I started feeling less bad about him as he posted more. I'd say I lean slightly town on him, but I don't feel very confident on it.
Lazermonkey: I initially thought he was okay, but I see now multiple people want to call him mafia in the last pages before 30. He's probably the guy I need to re-read out of the people I have opinions on. He pushed Chyz which I feel is ok, after all, everything Chyz says sounds like mafia talking. But maybe he's just sort of piling on. He's null and maybe even leaning mafia. I don't know.
Damdred is up and down. I actually agreed with the people that said mafia damdred wouldn't open with a joke mafia claim. But he's also been fairly shit in the thread, and the fact he suspected DrH over Ritoky there in that post was kind of odd. He's probably a slightly leaning mafia guy.
Eden1892 started off weird (with the stuff with DrH), but he kept posting and kept raising his status. I think he's more likely to be town than mafia. I can't exactly remember when the flip happened (I initially thought he was kinda mafia) but I'm okay with him for now.
Ritoky is a complete mystery to me. He tried to bury DrH with completely asinine reasoning. Like he's gotta be a complete moron to think DrH's policies would apply to a joke somewhere in the game. However, this is so dumb I'm not even sure it has to come from mafia, it might just be ritoky jumping some random shit he saw. I have no idea what his alignment is.
Marv, because of the two reads above I don't actually feel all that good about marv. I do expect to mislynch him some game in the close future, because I am almost 100% certain marv wants to play a town game where he posts little, just so he can do so in the future and so playing mafia isn't as painful to him. However I now disagree with the things I said about Eden, or well, I think his subsequent posts made him look better, so marv agreeing with me was kinda off, and I also don't think we can read too much into the ritoky thing. Also, if marv actually had found something, I'd think he wanted to push it. Re-reading lazermonkey and seeing if marv saying he could lynch him is justifiable will help with reading marv. For now he's sort of maybe slightly kinda leaning scum.
JAT. Parroting other players. Does it as both alignments, no idea what he is. Don't particularly care for now.
Geript. We lynch this man today. He is the one in the aftermath of DrH's case on Chyz that came off as mafia. First of all he seemed to immediately make a "mental note" that Chyz was newb town. There was, at the time, nothing in the thread that suggested Chyz was town. There were reasons to wait and see, but to say he's town is way over the top. Also, in the following discussion, I feel like unlike Koshi, geript did basically nothing to actually advance his read or influence anyone to follow him. It's the difference of passively "being right" (in case chyz is town) and aggressively defending him (like koshi did). Add in what I said earlier about how his posting was fairly clean and he was appealing to veterans and I actually want to lynch him.
sicklucker. I had a thought on him but I don't remember. Probably mafia because his posts are so boring I don't even remember them. But I'll reread later and decide. Could very well be town with little time.
Superbia, GB, Vivax and RoL haven't basically posted at all, so here is a wisdom nugget. Out of the lurker list (those 4), you should shoot RoL. Just trust me on this one. If we have a vigilante, shoot the fuck out of RoL.
On January 02 2015 00:46 Damdred wrote: You haven't got to me doing some stuffs yet palmar tell me what you think of my case later besides its boring if it is. Besides that I think you are town for the knowledge bomb.
Kel you might have to convince me more that bats is scum, I can remember his posts so I don't think I would want to lynch him today.
sure I'll continue reading.
I don't care about kel or batsnacks. You should be voting geript.
Everyone should be voting geript. It's a good vote. At least make him mad, but preferably make him dead.
On January 02 2015 00:55 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Let me know what you think of Lazer when you reread him Palmar. As far as I'm concerned, today's lynch is between Robik, Robik, Robik, Lazermonkey, TheChyz and Geript unless someone decides to claim scum.
a) I'm not rereading Lazer until I finish the thread (probably not this cycle). b) Robik and Chyz should probably be off the table based on the stuff I said about them in my big list.
This leaves geript as your vote by process of elimination! Sweet!
On January 02 2015 00:55 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Let me know what you think of Lazer when you reread him Palmar. As far as I'm concerned, today's lynch is between Robik, Robik, Robik, Lazermonkey, TheChyz and Geript unless someone decides to claim scum.
a) I'm not rereading Lazer until I finish the thread (probably not this cycle). b) Robik and Chyz should probably be off the table based on the stuff I said about them in my big list.
This leaves geript as your vote by process of elimination! Sweet!
I really want to lynch Robik though.
Also, I'm still waiting for Dr.H's tl;dr post for why Chyz is scum. I wonder if he can do it.
And you should really reread Lazer because there's a good chance he's going to end up on the table this cycle and you might have to choose between two non-Geript entities.
I won't have to if you just support my case. By our powers combined I'm sure we can get geript lynched. A few other people also said they'd support a geript lynch. Time to put your money where your mouth is!
DrH, I'm not ignoring your case on Chyz btw. I just don't know if it's correct. I appreciate the effort and the push. He's just sooo scummy. I know "too scummy to be scum" is not the greatest way of thinking about things, but just about everyone aside from koshi was willing to pile in on him, including some characters that could be mafia (Lazormonkeys). And additionally, I kinda agreed with what Artanis said about his response to Koshi's defense.
Like I actually think geript was right when he called him newb town. However geript is mafia because he thinks that, but I am town because I think exactly the same thing.
On January 02 2015 05:51 marvellosity wrote: it should actually be pretty obvious I am not mafia this game.
Will be when geript flips mafia.
If you're pushing some awful town lynch, you're probably scum.
If it is an awful lynch why are YOU pushing it?
No I'm pushing a great lynch on mafia geript. However if this is town geript then marv is pushing a really shitty lynch and is probably mafia or just bad.
On January 02 2015 05:55 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Palmar, do you still believe Geript to be the best lynch today?
Yes.
One thing that particularly stands out to me is that I'm sort of in the driver's seat on this lynch, and geript hasn't even mentioned or addressed me at all. Like all he has to do is change my mind, but for some reason he's shying away from any interaction with me.
On January 02 2015 05:55 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Palmar, do you still believe Geript to be the best lynch today?
Yes.
One thing that particularly stands out to me is that I'm sort of in the driver's seat on this lynch, and geript hasn't even mentioned or addressed me at all. Like all he has to do is change my mind, but for some reason he's shying away from any interaction with me.
Well, you haven't been around until recently so that's a reasonable consideration. It's weird that he hasn't really defended the main points against him or really push anyone. Just calls Lazer an "ok lynch", calls Eden a "pretty good lynch", decides Marv is scum again yet he seems to have no interest in actively not getting lynched. It's really weird because no matter his alignment he shouldn't want to get lynched.
It's win/win
If he's mafia, we kill mafia If he's town, we call him bad postgame for getting d1 lynched.
On January 02 2015 06:13 DoctorHelvetica wrote: i didnt read your case on geript palmar and i agreed with what marv said. am i scum if he flips town too? i think this is a bit much
No, you're just another brick in the wall. Only marv is confirmed scum if he pushes a lynch on town geript.
On January 02 2015 06:16 marvellosity wrote: if someone can read geript's multiple criticisms of my list and conclude they are genuine objections rather than objections for the sake of objecting/trying to discredit me, i'm all ears.
1 fake e-sports dollar says you can't though.
True but you have to realize that this does not necessarily make him mafia.
On January 02 2015 06:13 DoctorHelvetica wrote: i didnt read your case on geript palmar and i agreed with what marv said. am i scum if he flips town too? i think this is a bit much
No, you're just another brick in the wall. Only marv is confirmed scum if he pushes a lynch on town geript.
It doesn't seem like anyone agrees. It's pointless to talk about at the moment anyway. You'll still be able to say what you want after the flip.
To be honest. There is more.
I am town. Therefore geript must be mafia for TMI. How else would he know I'm town?
On January 02 2015 06:13 DoctorHelvetica wrote: i didnt read your case on geript palmar and i agreed with what marv said. am i scum if he flips town too? i think this is a bit much
No, you're just another brick in the wall. Only marv is confirmed scum if he pushes a lynch on town geript.
It doesn't seem like anyone agrees. It's pointless to talk about at the moment anyway. You'll still be able to say what you want after the flip.
To be honest. There is more.
I am town. Therefore geript must be mafia for TMI. How else would he know I'm town?
Since you're certain Geript is mafia, if he's not you must be mafia too. 3 for 1. This is getting better and better.
On January 02 2015 06:16 marvellosity wrote: if someone can read geript's multiple criticisms of my list and conclude they are genuine objections rather than objections for the sake of objecting/trying to discredit me, i'm all ears.
1 fake e-sports dollar says you can't though.
True but you have to realize that this does not necessarily make him mafia.
i don't think town-geript bullshits reasons on multiple people on my list if he is town.
Your list is bad and you should feel bad for posting it.
On January 02 2015 06:16 marvellosity wrote: if someone can read geript's multiple criticisms of my list and conclude they are genuine objections rather than objections for the sake of objecting/trying to discredit me, i'm all ears.
1 fake e-sports dollar says you can't though.
True but you have to realize that this does not necessarily make him mafia.
i don't think town-geript bullshits reasons on multiple people on my list if he is town.
Your list is bad and you should feel bad for posting it.
Geript why are you mafia?
Because I had to get you to listen to my nightkills so we could actually win this time. Plus, no modkill would help. You think Superbia will post today or will he be replaced instead of modkilled?
I hope he's replaced. Can't have any more of my scumbuddies modkilled. But at least I got massive towncred after this bus.
geript isn't even trying to defend himself. No matter his alignment now he should be lynched. If he is town this is rubbish play.
On January 02 2015 06:05 geript wrote: Also, fwiw Artanis, I saw this lynch coming yesterday. Considering the situation, activity, etc. It's a really hard lynch to get out of and all I can do is do my best to steer who to next.
This post is complete bullshit. The only reason he's in trouble is because he's not contributing to the game when he could have. There are 20 people in the game and no one is batting an eye because some players have less activity than normal. there is a reason that 19 people are not getting lynched and geript is. It's because what he has done this game amounts to basically nothing.
In this kind of a situation, any town player will find the motivation to defend himself. He's hardly even attempting to do it. We need to kill him. And if he actually flips town, we need to call him bad postgame, because this kind of defense is basically unacceptable. All he had to do was to engage with a few people controlling the lynch, most importantly me, and change the read, but it's almost as if he doesn't think he can do it.
There are only two options here.
#1: geript thinks he's just terrible at town, has no ability to convince people, and is willing to sabotage town based on his incompetence.
#2: geript is mafia and thinks he won't be able to imitate his town style in prolonged interrogation.
I actually think geript has both confidence, and that he always plays to win. This defeatist attitude does not fit at all, so I'm hoping that option 2 is the one that is true and he simply has given up trying to fight the lynch.
Vivax is a very, very good candidate for being mafia. I have no problem with people going after him.
I'm going to bed. If you idiots voteswitch (I know last minute switching is like some fucked up porn for TL mafia players. You think it's a great idea, and you love it while it's happening, but you don't know what to think of yourself afterwards) then Vivax isn't a bad choice.
Tbh I'd be sorta okay lynching Chyz, his "I quit" post is completely unacceptable behavior. You need the balls to stand up to a bit of tunneling in mafia, but I just think he has less of a chance to flip mafia than geript or vivax.
On January 02 2015 09:29 Palmar wrote: geript isn't even trying to defend himself. No matter his alignment now he should be lynched. If he is town this is rubbish play.
On January 02 2015 06:05 geript wrote: Also, fwiw Artanis, I saw this lynch coming yesterday. Considering the situation, activity, etc. It's a really hard lynch to get out of and all I can do is do my best to steer who to next.
This post is complete bullshit. The only reason he's in trouble is because he's not contributing to the game when he could have. There are 20 people in the game and no one is batting an eye because some players have less activity than normal. there is a reason that 19 people are not getting lynched and geript is. It's because what he has done this game amounts to basically nothing.
In this kind of a situation, any town player will find the motivation to defend himself. He's hardly even attempting to do it. We need to kill him. And if he actually flips town, we need to call him bad postgame, because this kind of defense is basically unacceptable. All he had to do was to engage with a few people controlling the lynch, most importantly me, and change the read, but it's almost as if he doesn't think he can do it.
There are only two options here.
#1: geript thinks he's just terrible at town, has no ability to convince people, and is willing to sabotage town based on his incompetence.
#2: geript is mafia and thinks he won't be able to imitate his town style in prolonged interrogation.
I actually think geript has both confidence, and that he always plays to win. This defeatist attitude does not fit at all, so I'm hoping that option 2 is the one that is true and he simply has given up trying to fight the lynch.
Vivax is a very, very good candidate for being mafia. I have no problem with people going after him.
The only thing that makes me pause is that geript thinks very highly of his scumplay and did everything he could to win in russia today (you should know this even better) and then he just gives up like this?
Like before I went to sleep I told you to lynch geript.
Then I told you that if you really had to be retarded and voteswitch (which TL Mafia always fucking does, because maybe the fire is not hot this time) to lynch Vivax.
Then I mentioned I'd be sorta maybe ok with Chyz dying, but didn't really favor his lynch.
You lynched batsnacks, a townread of mine.
Thanks for the confidence in my reads guys, I really appreciate it.
On January 03 2015 01:47 justanothertownie wrote: To all the people complaining about the lynch - next time you stay up until 6 am and push what YOU think and then you can complain. GTFO Koshi at least really tried to make us lynch Vivax so he is allowed to rage a little but Palmar you are certainly not. And if anyone keeps telling me that this was obviously batsnacks towngame I am calling you a liar. Or an idiot. Your choice.
No I tried to make you kill geript.
The deadline is at 5 am. Fuck you for saying I'm not allowed to be mad when I even said that I was going to bed, and I actually explained who to vote for if you guys really wanted to voteswitch.
On January 02 2015 09:29 Palmar wrote: geript isn't even trying to defend himself. No matter his alignment now he should be lynched. If he is town this is rubbish play.
On January 02 2015 06:05 geript wrote: Also, fwiw Artanis, I saw this lynch coming yesterday. Considering the situation, activity, etc. It's a really hard lynch to get out of and all I can do is do my best to steer who to next.
This post is complete bullshit. The only reason he's in trouble is because he's not contributing to the game when he could have. There are 20 people in the game and no one is batting an eye because some players have less activity than normal. there is a reason that 19 people are not getting lynched and geript is. It's because what he has done this game amounts to basically nothing.
In this kind of a situation, any town player will find the motivation to defend himself. He's hardly even attempting to do it. We need to kill him. And if he actually flips town, we need to call him bad postgame, because this kind of defense is basically unacceptable. All he had to do was to engage with a few people controlling the lynch, most importantly me, and change the read, but it's almost as if he doesn't think he can do it.
There are only two options here.
#1: geript thinks he's just terrible at town, has no ability to convince people, and is willing to sabotage town based on his incompetence.
#2: geript is mafia and thinks he won't be able to imitate his town style in prolonged interrogation.
I actually think geript has both confidence, and that he always plays to win. This defeatist attitude does not fit at all, so I'm hoping that option 2 is the one that is true and he simply has given up trying to fight the lynch.
Vivax is a very, very good candidate for being mafia. I have no problem with people going after him.
And then this post.
On January 02 2015 09:33 Palmar wrote: [b]I'm going to bed. If you idiots voteswitch (I know last minute switching is like some fucked up porn for TL mafia players. You think it's a great idea, and you love it while it's happening, but you don't know what to think of yourself afterwards) then Vivax isn't a bad choice.
Tbh I'd be sorta okay lynching Chyz, his "I quit" post is completely unacceptable behavior. You need the balls to stand up to a bit of tunneling in mafia, but I just think he has less of a chance to flip mafia than geript or vivax.
You ignored me on three better lynches and lynched a townread of mine.
This means you cannot be anything other than mafia. Also, you saying it's not reasonable for me to be mad is so dumb that I'm okay with lynching you no matter your alignment.
Tomorrow, you're the one I'm voting. And every day after that until one of us is dead. I will repost this exact post if needed, as contains everything required to completely prove you're mafia or so bad as town that you're not worth keeping alive.
On January 03 2015 05:32 marvellosity wrote: just got home and not read anything other than this page.
jat is town, as fearsome as his mafia game may be, he's not 16 pages before day 2 starts on a NYE start good.
fin
If this is I seriously need to reconsider me thinking he's actually a good player. This was not only the worst lynch of this year, but possibly the worst lynch I've seen for a long time.
On January 03 2015 05:39 justanothertownie wrote: Batsnacks was not playing his towngame. It was obviously a bad lynch since he was town but don't even try to sell that it was an obvious mislynch, Palmar.
Yes it was, "he was not playing his towngame" is not a thing. You have to demonstrate why what he is doing makes him mafia.
On January 02 2015 00:25 Palmar wrote: Batsnacks is sort of meh whatever, but at least he is quite unapologetic about his lazy posting. Maybe a very, very slight lean town read.
such townread many defense wow
Doesn't matter, enough to never lynch on day 1 with multiple scumreads.
On January 03 2015 05:39 justanothertownie wrote: Batsnacks was not playing his towngame. It was obviously a bad lynch since he was town but don't even try to sell that it was an obvious mislynch, Palmar.
Yes it was, "he was not playing his towngame" is not a thing. You have to demonstrate why what he is doing makes him mafia.
That is what I did. And I just quoted the only post you ever made about batsnacks. Does not look like an obvious townread to me.
it's a townread, sure he had posted like 15 words or something, so it was never going to be strong. But you just don't lynch my townreads on day 1.
On January 03 2015 05:39 justanothertownie wrote: Batsnacks was not playing his towngame. It was obviously a bad lynch since he was town but don't even try to sell that it was an obvious mislynch, Palmar.
Yes it was, "he was not playing his towngame" is not a thing. You have to demonstrate why what he is doing makes him mafia.
That is what I did. And I just quoted the only post you ever made about batsnacks. Does not look like an obvious townread to me.
it's a townread, sure he had posted like 15 words or something, so it was never going to be strong. But you just don't lynch my townreads on day 1.
Never.
You mean like bunnies shouldn't have shot Breshke last game, eh?
On January 03 2015 05:51 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Do you want to move on and lynch geript tomorrow Palmar or have you done enough of convincing us that you're awesome
I'm not awesome.
I'm just explaining that the people who lynched batsnacks are terrible.
On January 03 2015 05:39 justanothertownie wrote: Batsnacks was not playing his towngame. It was obviously a bad lynch since he was town but don't even try to sell that it was an obvious mislynch, Palmar.
Yes it was, "he was not playing his towngame" is not a thing. You have to demonstrate why what he is doing makes him mafia.
That is what I did. And I just quoted the only post you ever made about batsnacks. Does not look like an obvious townread to me.
it's a townread, sure he had posted like 15 words or something, so it was never going to be strong. But you just don't lynch my townreads on day 1.
Never.
You mean like bunnies shouldn't have shot Breshke last game, eh?
wasn't day 1.
Checkmate.
Was night1. You consistently townread breshke day1/night1.
So what, didn't I lynch mafia day 1?
It was a good thing we didn't lynch Broski. Stop arguing this, you can go back through like million games. I consistently admit that I always miss one mafia. That doesn't mean you should try to lynch the one townread of mine that happens to be mafia. It's still bad play.
On January 03 2015 05:51 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Do you want to move on and lynch geript tomorrow Palmar or have you done enough of convincing us that you're awesome
I'm not awesome.
Really? Then I shouldn't listen to you tomorrow I guess?
On January 03 2015 05:39 justanothertownie wrote: Batsnacks was not playing his towngame. It was obviously a bad lynch since he was town but don't even try to sell that it was an obvious mislynch, Palmar.
Yes it was, "he was not playing his towngame" is not a thing. You have to demonstrate why what he is doing makes him mafia.
That is what I did. And I just quoted the only post you ever made about batsnacks. Does not look like an obvious townread to me.
it's a townread, sure he had posted like 15 words or something, so it was never going to be strong. But you just don't lynch my townreads on day 1.
Never.
You mean like bunnies shouldn't have shot Breshke last game, eh?
wasn't day 1.
Checkmate.
Was night1. You consistently townread breshke day1/night1.
So what, didn't I lynch mafia day 1?
It was a good thing we didn't lynch Broski. Stop arguing this, you can go back through like million games. I consistently admit that I always miss one mafia. That doesn't mean you should try to lynch the one townread of mine that happens to be mafia. It's still bad play.
On January 03 2015 05:55 DoctorHelvetica wrote: if he came to have a scumread on your townread why would voting for them be a bad idea? if it was successful it's still a bad idea because it makes your reads seem less perfect? fuck off with that
No because generally (and I say generally, maybe I'm completely wrong on everything this game? who knows?) if I throw out like 6-10 townreads there's usually only going to be 1 mafia in there. Again, maybe this is the game where I get everything wrong, but let's assume it's not.
Just from a statistical point of view it's better to lynch outside the players I've townread, because if most of the townreads are correct (even if 1 or maybe 2 are wrong) there's going to be more mafia in the remaining players.
But I cba arguing this.
batsnacks was a terrible lynch.
Now all my reads are fucked up and I will be awful for the rest of the game because I can't tell dumb from scum. Here's to hoping mafia just shoots me to rid town of me.
On January 03 2015 05:51 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Do you want to move on and lynch geript tomorrow Palmar or have you done enough of convincing us that you're awesome
I'm not awesome.
Really? Then I shouldn't listen to you tomorrow I guess?
You wouldn't anyway, as I'm voting you.
Then you are even more terrible than I am.
Yes, I have a few strengths and a few weaknesses in mafia.
List of weaknesses:
1: I'm terrible in the mid-game, because I can't tell dumb from scum. So I repeatedly lynch people who don't agree with me. 2: I generally give one mafia a free pass for no good reason 3: I ignore mafia all the time. When I have players I've mostly ignored, those players often tend to be mafia (think superbia this game).
So yes, I know that there is a possibility you're dumb town. You're either dumb town or scum. And I just have to roll the dice. Of all the people on that shitty wagon, you're the one who should have had the sense to actually get things done properly, but you didn't.
I don't think you're dumb JAT, so by process of elimination, you must be mafia.
On January 03 2015 05:55 DoctorHelvetica wrote: if he came to have a scumread on your townread why would voting for them be a bad idea? if it was successful it's still a bad idea because it makes your reads seem less perfect? fuck off with that
No because generally (and I say generally, maybe I'm completely wrong on everything this game? who knows?) if I throw out like 6-10 townreads there's usually only going to be 1 mafia in there. Again, maybe this is the game where I get everything wrong, but let's assume it's not.
Just from a statistical point of view it's better to lynch outside the players I've townread, because if most of the townreads are correct (even if 1 or maybe 2 are wrong) there's going to be more mafia in the remaining players.
But I cba arguing this.
batsnacks was a terrible lynch.
Now all my reads are fucked up and I will be awful for the rest of the game because I can't tell dumb from scum. Here's to hoping mafia just shoots me to rid town of me.
ah, you give up now then?
Never. I'll lynch like 15 townies in a row for being bad.
On January 03 2015 06:04 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Palmar is the one who told the scum to sheep JATs vote so he could come in here and try to collect town cred in light of his absence from most of yesterdays discussion leading up to the lynch. If he is town, we're still in a good position with heat on his two known scumreads but instead he's mad about not getting the cred and being obeyed - that was his true goal. It's so clear in my head man
Also another reason why DrH is dumb and shouldn't be listened to:
If I am indeed mafia, I am basically being universally townread. I have a solid tunnel going on on geript (who is then presumably town) and all I have to do is keep on trucking. Like I don't think a single person called me mafia yesterday.
So in DrH's world, I could possibly be mafia because instead of taking advantage of my already incredible amount of towncred, I'm throwing a hissy fit over a shitty lynch.
From now on I'm not going ot read DrH posts. They're worthless pile of trash.
On January 03 2015 06:07 VisceraEyes wrote: Like Palmar sure bitching a lot about a lynch he wasn't interested in participating in. Like I get time constraints, but he didn't seem super interested in the lynch when he was around, so the amount of bitching is disproportionate.
Completely false.
I was super interested. I was driving the wagon on geript, I was hassling players to vote for him, the last thing I did before going to bed was to summarize the case on geript, even with him being the leading lynch candidate, and then saying that if for some reason people really wanted to voteswitch, to do it on vivax.
Please fill in the form below to best fit your situation.
[ ] I did not read the game, therefore I didn't know Palmar was interested in participating. [ ] I am mafia [ ] I am just really awful at this thinking thing [ ] I don't believe the world is round, so timezones are just a myth created by the man to keep us down.
On January 03 2015 06:08 Palmar wrote: Also another reason why DrH is dumb and shouldn't be listened to:
If I am indeed mafia, I am basically being universally townread. I have a solid tunnel going on on geript (who is then presumably town) and all I have to do is keep on trucking. Like I don't think a single person called me mafia yesterday.
So in DrH's world, I could possibly be mafia because instead of taking advantage of my already incredible amount of towncred, I'm throwing a hissy fit over a shitty lynch.
From now on I'm not going ot read DrH posts. They're worthless pile of trash.
Yeah, you're not skilled enough at scum probably to tunnel someone or survive on Day 1. My bad, that proves you're town
Thanks. Everyone knows I'm shit as scum, yet everyone seems to think I'm good at it.
On January 03 2015 06:04 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Palmar is the one who told the scum to sheep JATs vote so he could come in here and try to collect town cred in light of his absence from most of yesterdays discussion leading up to the lynch. If he is town, we're still in a good position with heat on his two known scumreads but instead he's mad about not getting the cred and being obeyed - that was his true goal. It's so clear in my head man
See, another guy who is either dumb or scum.
I was absent because the deadline is 5am my time.
And it is 6 fucking am my time and I still stayed up and tried to make a good lynch happen. Fuck off.
Ironic that a better lynch would probably have happened if you just fucked off to sleep. You did no good.
On January 03 2015 06:07 VisceraEyes wrote: Like Palmar sure bitching a lot about a lynch he wasn't interested in participating in. Like I get time constraints, but he didn't seem super interested in the lynch when he was around, so the amount of bitching is disproportionate.
have you met Palmar dear?
Usually he screams about a better lynch repeatedly. I saw his posts about geript and Vivax and none of them left me feeling like he was super sure about them in typical town Palmar fashion. Yes I've met Palmar, to answer your question.
No need to scream.
When I went to sleep we were comfortably on my top candidate. I had already whipped people in shape.
This is why I hate night deadlines. Getting TL mafia to do the right thing is like getting toddlers to stand in a line. Doable, but take your eyes off for even a second and they go full retard.
okay I'm going to play a game of dota. then I'm gonna come back and do useful things. depending on how badly or well I do in dota I might be in a different mood then.
On second thought, I'm not doing anything more tonight.
I was mostly trolling, or I guess venting, with the JAT thing. Don't lynch him automatically, but make sure that if he does more dumb shit you do. Look very hard at robik, probably lynch him at some point. He's a very hard lynch. Basically good players who do dumb shit should be considered. But Robik more than JAT.
geript, vivax are still likely to be mafia. Damdred might be as well.
Almost everything else is mostly how it looked like in my big reads post.
Oh and VE might be mafia because RoL didn't do anything. Then again I don't know. Don't let marv afk through another day, but he isn't guaranteed to be mafia
Kosher is probably town.
Eden is another good scum candidate.
Lazermonkey probably town, so is chyz, drh, marv,
screw it I'll make a list:
Probably town (remember, almost guaranteed I put 1 mafia in here):
Also, just so people are aware, TheChyz has disappeared from the planet since people stopped trying to lynch him. He has literally not posted since that shitty martyr post.
I am actually going to vote him. I'm unsure if it's my final vote today, but he's been awol for like... 48 hours or something stupid?
I understand there might be a reason for that, and it also seems like the people defending him (mostly koshi) were actually town. And I still have the fact I didn't really think he was mafia day 1.
Still, gonna drop a vote, see if he wakes up. Aside from him I think we really should work towards reducing the number of people up for the lynch today. As I see it now, we have the following:
geript superbia vivax iamrobik ritoky VE Damdred TheChyz
I need to eliminate a few more off this list, but it looks ok for now.
Also, if someone is in the mood for meta, marv has repeatedly done something this game that I don't recall him doing before. He's doing my thing where he asks other people to confirm for him. "I think this was x, can someone confirm". Maybe it's nothing though. In any case I'm not sure marv is the lynch today.
I am sorely tempted to actually go hard after Damdred. If I get the chance to read his filter I'll see what I think of it.
On January 05 2015 07:25 Vivax wrote: Palmar if you want people to listen you have to talk. Why is Damdred mafia and all that stuff you do when you play mafia.
I've posted a bunch of stuff on geript but the most weighted point was that he changed his read on Chyz from newb town to lynchable without him having posted in between.
I talk when I have something to say baby. I don't really have much input today as it's weekend and I haven't been reading the thread.
On January 05 2015 07:27 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Am i to take it you form every read you have from a persons first couple of posts? Do we all know robik is scum now too?
Robik actually forms reads based on almost nothing as both alignments. And he's surprisingly often correct. He's the best bad player on TL Mafia.
On January 05 2015 07:27 Palmar wrote: @vivax, would you think it's fair that we lynch geript today, and if he flips mafia, we lynch you next?
I think that if he flips mafia I'll be pushing for Robik next as then we have the real explanation to his ninja vote on bats. And I doubt you can contest me pulling that through with that half-assed attitude.
Week is coming bro.
I think it's the sensible course of action, that if we don't lynch you today, we should lynch you tomorrow.
Glowingbear could very well be mafia. Can someone tell me if his "throw scumreads on literally everyone" is part of his town game?
List of people he thinks are mafia.
Jat Me Marv Eden ritoky Artanis Vivax sicklucker
Then again, I'm not entirely sure what to think of him, because he was being quite confrontational yesterday, given his filter length. He's a pretty hard read.
On January 05 2015 07:27 Palmar wrote: @vivax, would you think it's fair that we lynch geript today, and if he flips mafia, we lynch you next?
I think that if he flips mafia I'll be pushing for Robik next as then we have the real explanation to his ninja vote on bats. And I doubt you can contest me pulling that through with that half-assed attitude.
Week is coming bro.
I think it's the sensible course of action, that if we don't lynch you today, we should lynch you tomorrow.
Who did you vote yesterday again and why?
TheChyz cause I liked DrH's case for reasons I don't remember, and cause his ragequit didn't convince me.
I already mentioned that my D1 was suboptimal for obvious reasons, now you can simply do one thing instead of directing the focus towards that. The week starts, you read the game, and in reading D2 you realize I'm town. Deal?
So what did Chyz do to convince you he was town? We could be voting him right now?
On January 05 2015 07:27 Palmar wrote: @vivax, would you think it's fair that we lynch geript today, and if he flips mafia, we lynch you next?
I think that if he flips mafia I'll be pushing for Robik next as then we have the real explanation to his ninja vote on bats. And I doubt you can contest me pulling that through with that half-assed attitude.
Week is coming bro.
I think it's the sensible course of action, that if we don't lynch you today, we should lynch you tomorrow.
Who did you vote yesterday again and why?
TheChyz cause I liked DrH's case for reasons I don't remember, and cause his ragequit didn't convince me.
I already mentioned that my D1 was suboptimal for obvious reasons, now you can simply do one thing instead of directing the focus towards that. The week starts, you read the game, and in reading D2 you realize I'm town. Deal?
So what did Chyz do to convince you he was town? We could be voting him right now?
Did you read my post on geript? Do that and then think of a new question.
On January 05 2015 07:47 Palmar wrote: The mafia team is actually
geript damdred glowingbear marv robik
So just lynch down this list.
Still have to delve into GB, marv is quite possible as he disappeared and talked about irons instead of arguing with me, plus the general low activity today. Robik and geript are intertwined for obvious reasons.
I'd replace Damdred with Lazermonkey or JAT. Ritoky I still have to read properly.
Also cool you aren't putting me in there.
Lazermonkey is green checked by a cop that hasn't been ccd bro. Even I know that.
JAT has 28 pages of filter or something. also marv calls him town and therefore confirmed him town.
On January 05 2015 07:58 DoctorHelvetica wrote: What is lm talking about
He doesn't realize the Chyz vote was a pure reaction test. Palmar wanted to figure out if I'd go after the easy target to save myself since I conveniently scumread him the previous day already.
I love that play.
Yeah that's totally what I was going for.
I would never just randomly do shit and then piece together the mess later.
On January 06 2015 00:44 Damdred wrote: Ok just caught up and woke up,
I am upset at you SL, if you are trying to draw a bullet you do not unclaim during the night you let the medic make the wifom decision. I'll talk more about this tomorrow if it comes up.
I'll be honest though I really hate it how vivax and LM hard defended super during the eod, i'm not really sure why you shouldn't be ok to lynch super. Kels reasoning I think made sense to me, he didn't hard defend super.
Because of this post, if super is mafia, you are too.
Also I'm honestly going to just chill. There is literally no one being not bad in this town at the moment. Everyone has either lynched townies, or failed to push alternative lynches.
This means mafia has no idea whom to shoot tonight, because the doc save is guaranteed. So I guess I'll just see who they shoot, and figure the game out tomorrow. I may start reading tonight, but I'm not going to conclude much for now.
On January 06 2015 00:44 Damdred wrote: Ok just caught up and woke up,
I am upset at you SL, if you are trying to draw a bullet you do not unclaim during the night you let the medic make the wifom decision. I'll talk more about this tomorrow if it comes up.
I'll be honest though I really hate it how vivax and LM hard defended super during the eod, i'm not really sure why you shouldn't be ok to lynch super. Kels reasoning I think made sense to me, he didn't hard defend super.
Because of this post, if super is mafia, you are too.
Also I'm honestly going to just chill. There is literally no one being not bad in this town at the moment. Everyone has either lynched townies, or failed to push alternative lynches.
This means mafia has no idea whom to shoot tonight, because the doc save is guaranteed. So I guess I'll just see who they shoot, and figure the game out tomorrow. I may start reading tonight, but I'm not going to conclude much for now.
Did you ever look at that stuff I asked you to? Or catch up at all?
Like if anyone claims to be "caught up" with 221 pages of this game that person is full of shit. At this point I'm going to use filters and then figure out context. No one has actually read the game in any detail.
On January 06 2015 01:04 GlowingBear wrote: As hard as it is to me to say this, Robik looks townie to me. I can't really say why, also. His mafia play looked more underwhelming on Guilty Mini Mafia.
Even more underwhelming. Jesus christ
Yeah we should lynch this guy.
He's not spamming caps about lynching Holyflare, which I think is his meta. So therefore he must be mafia.
On January 06 2015 01:04 GlowingBear wrote: As hard as it is to me to say this, Robik looks townie to me. I can't really say why, also. His mafia play looked more underwhelming on Guilty Mini Mafia.
Even more underwhelming. Jesus christ
Yeah we should lynch this guy.
He's not spamming caps about lynching Holyflare, which I think is his meta. So therefore he must be mafia.
wut
In Christmas Carol, GB was town.
He posted something like this
"GOAKSFOPSAJ LYNCH THE HOLYFLARE GUYSS!!!!!!!! WAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH"
On January 06 2015 01:24 Palmar wrote: Jesus christ, you fucking did.
go on, this should be good
See you are 100% correct. I have absolutely no problem lynching you when I think you're mafia. And you also know I'm completely useless when trying to lynch you when I'm mafia, as literally anyone can see if they go back and read world heavyweight.
The problem is, as I've already explained this game, that I know you want to play a game of mafia where you are town and don't do much, just to break your meta. Last game we played where I got you on day 1 you actually made a very clumsy move early in the game with the "bitch" post.
Now, the important part here is your sentence
"you're usually not scared to lynch me". The simple fact that you said this must mean that you are mafia. The reason is that you absolutely 100% know that I am not scared of lynching you right now. The reason I haven't pushed it is because it took me 2 days to get my preferred lynch in AND because you simply haven't fucked up. I can only know you're mafia when something fits perfectly.
Saying I'm scared is your version of slowplaying a suspicion on me, something you wouldn't do if you were actually town. If you were town, you'd basically have decided my alignment now. You'd have been certain since day 1 that I am incapable of doing what I've done this game as town. There's so many of the random tells that I know about myself in my town play this game that you would know.
You just said something I KNOW you don't believe. You don't believe I'm scared of lynching you. There is no fucking way you misunderstood me consulting Robik and figuring out his opinion (which tbh, has more to do with HIM than you), as some sort of a weak attempt to gather support for a lynch on you.
Holy shit, this may be the best case I've ever made.
Like even if my assumption that you'd know my alignment by now, or at least decided it, was wrong. That doesn't change anything. The big thing is that no matter what you say, there is no way you believe that I was acting scared of lynching you.
You know I'm not an asshole, you know that not wanting to lynch you because I know you want to tone down your town meta and this could be it is completely reasonable.
On January 06 2015 01:39 justanothertownie wrote: Regardless of marvs alignment that's a pretty shitty case Palmar.
I know, that's the beauty of it.
It's 100% correct. The only way marv does not flip mafia, is if he actually knew that he didn't believe this (which is true in any world) and was trying some sort of a weird bait play. But there is no way he believes that I was being scared of lynching him. No matter his alignment.
Like as I said, I don't even know anyone is going to understand it.
The gist is this.
Marv said something he does not believe. And I know he does not believe it because of magical fairy dust. You're just going to have to trust me on the magical fairy dust part.
On January 06 2015 01:24 Palmar wrote: Jesus christ, you fucking did.
go on, this should be good
See you are 100% correct. I have absolutely no problem lynching you when I think you're mafia. And you also know I'm completely useless when trying to lynch you when I'm mafia, as literally anyone can see if they go back and read world heavyweight.
The problem is, as I've already explained this game, that I know you want to play a game of mafia where you are town and don't do much, just to break your meta. Last game we played where I got you on day 1 you actually made a very clumsy move early in the game with the "bitch" post.
Now, the important part here is your sentence
"you're usually not scared to lynch me". The simple fact that you said this must mean that you are mafia. The reason is that you absolutely 100% know that I am not scared of lynching you right now. The reason I haven't pushed it is because it took me 2 days to get my preferred lynch in AND because you simply haven't fucked up. I can only know you're mafia when something fits perfectly.
Saying I'm scared is your version of slowplaying a suspicion on me, something you wouldn't do if you were actually town. If you were town, you'd basically have decided my alignment now. You'd have been certain since day 1 that I am incapable of doing what I've done this game as town. There's so many of the random tells that I know about myself in my town play this game that you would know.
You just said something I KNOW you don't believe. You don't believe I'm scared of lynching you. There is no fucking way you misunderstood me consulting Robik and figuring out his opinion (which tbh, has more to do with HIM than you), as some sort of a weak attempt to gather support for a lynch on you.
Holy shit, this may be the best case I've ever made.
The problem is, you're not incapable of doing what you've done this game as mafia. The reason I townread you on d1 only works for me, in that you based your read on me on conditional reads compared to yours, which I thought would be difficult for you to pull off as mafia.
also, come off it. Robik is not the first person you've asked about lynching me this game without a followup behind it.
tldr: lol
Yes, asking people if they want to lynch you is a fine way of figuring out things about THEM, not about YOU.
And again, I probably should've left out the part about you having long decided my alignment, scum or town, because that's not the core.
The core is you don't believe that I am scared to try to lynch you at that point.
marv if you're town, why do you think you're alive?
Like I know the same answer for myself, because I've been hilariously bad throughout this game. However it's totally within my meta to be bad occasionally. Not sure about yours.
On January 06 2015 19:29 Palmar wrote: marv if you're town, why do you think you're alive?
Like I know the same answer for myself, because I've been hilariously bad throughout this game. However it's totally within my meta to be bad occasionally. Not sure about yours.
stupid question.
i'm sure you can figure out last night's NKs for yourself.
why are you even asking me this? there's no answer to be given, whether i'm town or mafia.
On January 06 2015 19:29 Palmar wrote: marv if you're town, why do you think you're alive?
Like I know the same answer for myself, because I've been hilariously bad throughout this game. However it's totally within my meta to be bad occasionally. Not sure about yours.
stupid question.
i'm sure you can figure out last night's NKs for yourself.
why are you even asking me this? there's no answer to be given, whether i'm town or mafia.
Like I was wrong on geript. I'm partly mad at myself being wrong because I read him again and there were definitely signs that he was town that I ignored. I'm also partly mad at geript for being completely shit when about to be lynched. Like I had more respect for him as a player than to think he'd go down without giving us something to work with.
IMO it's the responsibility of people who are being targeted for a lynch to step up and actually do things. Because it reveals the reasons people are on their wagons, and can often help filter townies from mafia on town wagons.
So after I got him lynched I seriously lost most of my motivation for the game. I feel like I have no dots to connect and that I'm lynching blindly into a bunch of people that could possibly be mafia. Hell even my two townreads from day 1, artanis and drh, now feel like they could very well be mafia.
The lynch today is probably either gb or ritoky (please don't lynch sicklucker, there's just less chance he does something like he did as mafia. Like I don't think he's gutsy enough to do the whole claiming shenanigans as mafia). Both of them could be mafia, and I'm sure on neither. I don't even know which one to go after.
If marv is mafia, which I highly suspect, based on that one post he made in the night, then that doesn't even say much, because with both these targets, marv has soft pushed them and then not done anything with it (ritoky on day 1 and gb on day 2). JAT was about the only player this game I sort of enjoyed interacting with, but that's probably more on me than anyone else. Well I guess I like Vivax too.
If Vivax is mafia I'll just applaud the effort. I've liked a bunch of stuff he has posted.
I've also ignored laz0r because of the sicklucker thing on day 2 and I just haven't had the cares to catch up on him. I probably should.
Someone in this game got really mad at something at some point that I thought was really strange. It might have been superbia, but idk. Maybe we should lynch him? What happened to people wanting to lynch superbia?
On January 08 2015 04:45 Palmar wrote: If one of you guys is town, that's real sad.
stop it. your contribution this game is a single post and nothing else. get outta here
Who cares? I'm still not mafia for it.
you're mafia for not participating, not trying, and not solving the game.
Game is 300 pages and I have not enough fucks to read it.
this very much contradicts your d1 play of "i've read every post"...why did you give up?
I gave up around page 30... did you not notice that?
why? too hard to be scum
Whatever dude, I cba arguing with you if I'm mafia or not.
I'm gonna be mad though if I get lynched when I have no votes on me as I go to sleep. Because if nothing else I want to be around to defend myself to make it interesting.
On January 08 2015 05:07 IAmRobik wrote: you're around now. you're not asleep. defend yourself. Prove to me that you'er town so that i push on someone else. Because right now you're right in the heart of your scum range
On January 01 2015 02:07 GlowingBear wrote: O hai! I'm town
I'm also on the beach so I'm not reading the thread yet.
First page = geript and damdy trolling mafai.
Brb
Tone read. He wrote "O hai!" which sort of feels like one of these "Look how casual and chill I am, totally not mafia" (think what I said about marv's "bitch" last game.
On December 31 2014 15:14 DoctorHelvetica wrote: Uh, I don't want to make your dick hard. I don't think anything about anyone yet.
On December 31 2014 15:07 DoctorHelvetica wrote: That being said I'd like to show everyone my spreadsheet ranking Day 1 joke posts from least to most scummy.
what's up with the second post here though? seems like if you have opinions about which posts are suspicious you have opinions about which people are suspicious. non?
Seems like you take everything literally, we're gonna have problems if you waste your time with shit like this.
just checking, it seemed like a joke but i didn't want to supply that answer in case it weren't~
On December 31 2014 15:32 geript wrote:
On December 31 2014 15:27 geript wrote: I'm more concerned about how you find a post that is "stiff and awkwardly timed," two traits that are more often considered mafia tells, towny? Can you explain that more fully? It's also pretty weird that you reasonably correctly point out that his post is going nowhere while simultaneously responding to it.
@Eden Explain.
sure, i'm not sure what you meant by "shut down this line" in the previous part of the post btw so if you want a reply to that please clarify for my addled brain
as for why i read it townie, like i said, it seemed like an effort to get discussion somewhere besides early-game banter, which imo wasn't going anywhere. i followed up on the post because even if the object-level discussion ends up being pretty pointless, i can get some possibly useful meta-level reads from it - and hey, maybe it is going somewhere and i miss it, y'know?
By shut it down, I mean shut down any further discussion on useless policy. Nobody needs to find policy to find discussion. The problem with your "townread" is that your reasons for finding him town are complete bullshit. That post is a throwaway post that I could recite to newbies to "get discussion going" as either alignment and potentially useful dependent on how it's driven and moved (even moreso to scum imo not that it matters). There actually were things to be talked about in the thread already (my townread on Damdred, the ??? on sicklucker who IIRC also made a passing townread on Damdred, Robik not posting anything while making a few posts, etc.). It's odd that you comment that his post was stiff and awkwardly timed, two bad reasons that people's posts are often called scummy for and then settle on a bad reason to call him town for it. As for meta reads, what type of meta reads do you expect will lead to any sort of meaningful read off of policy discussion?
Like, THIS post is very townie. It correctly reads Eden and his reasoning seems very fluid. It also keeps discussion going on, and he keeps the push on Eden. I find this very townie.
is the bolded TMI? He was defending geript at the point but was completely unsuccessful in stopping the wagon on him. Also the reasons he thinks this is townie are quite fluffy. "keeps discussion going" is hardly a thing.
Some more scum points
On January 02 2015 06:40 GlowingBear wrote: I'll read the game in 3 hours and give you guys reads. But you can't lynch anyone other than marv when he has got only 3 pages of filter.
The wi fi works poorly here in the hotel. I'm gonna rent some hours in the lobby's computer.
I gave him town points for this at the time, and probably still should. Then again, marv is unlikely to dispute this as town, because it's essentially correct AND has very little chance to actually be pushed through.
Don't know if town, or calculated risk, or scumbuddies (another form of calculated risk).
Slight town points.
GB seems to have changed his mind a lot during day 1:
On January 01 2015 09:47 GlowingBear wrote: Ok I've started reading the game a bit before New Years Eve and I must say I don't like DrH opening, geripts call on damdred and I have a slight townread on Eden.
On January 02 2015 10:08 GlowingBear wrote: I've read until page eighteen yet, and I don't like: Eden Sicklucker Ritoky
Ritoky being more of a null. Just saw a post or him on page 16 that was horrible.
Complete 180 on Eden. In the wrong direction in my opinion (I started out thinking Eden was mafia for some interaction, with DrH I think? The one marv agreed was weird, but he kinda grew on me). I also think he had some back and forth with his vote on geript. But I can't remember what it exactly was.
On January 03 2015 07:40 GlowingBear wrote: I actually want to lynch half of the players list
Town points for this. Calling everyone mafia is usually rather townie, because mafia tends to want to make friends rather than enemies, and calling everyone mafia is a good way to make enemies.
***
Actually I'm just stopping here.
I read his case on me, and it is essentially correct. It just doesn't mean I was mafia (he was 100% correct that I wrote that post because I wanted to contribute despite being somewhat behind, I just wanted to do it to help, not to look like I was helping. Like I wanted to throw some ideas out there). Like I'm literally gonna give him a townread for writing a wrong case on me.
He has a ton of post that look sort of town actually, so despite most of the posts I wrote above I'm just gonna assume GB is town.
Here's a few examples of posts I saw while skimming his filter that oculd be from town.
On January 08 2015 03:37 GlowingBear wrote: Give me ONE REASON For why I'm mafia. ONE REASON.
On January 08 2015 03:18 GlowingBear wrote: Stop this stupidity
Also I think I got from his filter that he wanted to kill sicklucker for the claim. I think that's actually a fairly town move because mafia would most likely not want to push an un-ccd cop even if that cop is being a bit of a dick with it.
Idk, too much of GB's filter feels sort of unforced, although there are some bad spots in there too. I'm not 100% certain on it, but I think it's enough to give him a pass. He changes his mind a lot, calls a lot of people mafia, seems not worried about his own look at all, doesn't try to make friends etc etc.
On December 31 2014 14:01 Damdred wrote: I'm sorry geript was to busy in scum qt to beat you to first this time.
I've been having mafia withdrawls
I sorta gave Damdred a bit of a pass for this at the time, but now I'm less sure, mostly because of this follow up.
On December 31 2014 14:19 Damdred wrote: Also not really claiming scum just bad humor baby
It really does not need explaining that he wasn't claiming scum. No one actually claims scum and is serious about it, that's not how the game works. However the fact he felt the need to clarify that AND is apologetic about it (bad humor baby) feels really wrong in hindsight.
On December 31 2014 14:19 Damdred wrote: Also not really claiming scum just bad humor baby
why did you post this?
cause of mine and geripts history where he takes mee a bit to serious at points. Like he told me to post seals one time and I did and he went a bit nuts was a bit funny. I think he was scum that game but I think he would do the same as town.
On January 01 2015 01:53 Damdred wrote: Good morning my friends, i'll be haphazardly here all day. Sadly I have to work tonight and its one of the busiest days of the year haha. So lets get to it
The ritoky and Dr. H fight wasn't as pointless as people think. It left a very distinct taste in my mouth about both of their alignments.
In carol (Ritokys most recent mafia game) I caught ritoky for being super passive, with no follow up and no real push early on to speak of and only when confronted with this information he would passively give a wall of text to explain away what he was doing. You can look at Season of a witch I believe and see the same thing in his scum game. So i'm leaning more town on ritoky due to the fact that he said someone was acting scummy and went after said person instead of dropping it, he had really good follow up at this point even if the avenue he went down was really a different approach than what I probably would of done.
Dr H reaction to some of the things left me feeling a bit weird. Firstly he seems to have a deep suspicion of Ritoky after the conversation is starting to calm down a bit and even says that Ritoky looks bad. But you never really get a sense about what his read is, their really is no follow up besides DrH saying that he is just going to ignore Ritoky trying to do things from this point forward, which he ends up trying to explain himself a few posts later but then drops it. From all of the interaction with Ritoky (good or bad) he should of been able to formulate some form of opinion on Ritokys alignment. And yet right after the fight has affectingly ended he calls Geript scum but never pushes it at all and then moves on to chyz. Im going to put him in the leaning scum category here.
Geript just lacks something right now, hes not quite as posty as he normally would be and is really tight lipped about his thoughts. Also his post about being ableto read Palmar koshi etc really ruffled me a bit and reminded me a lot about when he was scum in russia. Hes in the leaning scum category presently
This is the first big post that started me, and probably other people questioning Damdred's alignment. In general everyone not called Damdred came to the conclusion that DrH was the one that looked good after that fight, and ritoky was either mafia or just really dumb.
On January 01 2015 01:56 justanothertownie wrote: Ok, Damdred. Marv and you just gave meta reads on ritoky that are the exact opposite of each other for the same game. Do I really need to read his filter there now?
Sadly you might need to, I think Marvs view on that game is slightly twisted due to him being a cohost and having perfect information and seeing things differently than what someone playing would see. I caught him to no follow up in that game then he shot me </3
Again, because I'm super impatient, I'm gonna summarize a bit:
I get a feeling, as I'm reading along that Damdred asks a lot of questions and makes a lot of semi-worthless posts. I'll throw in some examples:
On January 01 2015 01:58 justanothertownie wrote: Same same. Doing fine. Won't be around as much as usual today obviously. Any thoughts about the game at hand?
Thanks buddy.
Regarding the game...I have absolutely no ideas as I have read maybe like 3 total posts. I thought this would start Friday, so I was kinda surprised when I saw there were 13-14 pages. I"m kinda intimidated now that there are 25 pages and my desire to catch up is non-existent. I will give you my assurance that I have rolled quite the favorable alliance (given my extreme disdain for rolling mafia, it should be easy to figure out what that is), and I will be helping in the mass execution of all mafiosos.
Hi Robik. I will lynch you if you do not read the thread. I hope that is enough motivation. Kind regards, Artanis
Do you actually believe you'll get me lynched unless people vote me out of spite?
Let me point you to something.....
IAmRobik 0/14 = 0.0000%
It will be 0/15 after this game.
I think I'll get you lynched if you're scum or if you do not catch up to the thread. If you catch up and show that you are not scum, then I'll be happy to unvote you. Right now you are wasting space.
We're getting off on the wrong foot -- see the thing is...i'm town, so even if i'm wasting space, you shouldn't lynch me...especially on day 1. Everyone here knows that I'm a super productive member of town, even if I'm a pain in the ass. So I implore you to give me the benefit of the doubt and just accept that I will come out firing when I have the time to put into the game -- which just so happens to be AFTER A FUCKING HOLIDAY
Calm down dear, you still have until the deadline to show as such.
On January 01 2015 02:16 Damdred wrote:
On January 01 2015 02:07 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On January 01 2015 02:06 IAmRobik wrote:
On January 01 2015 01:58 justanothertownie wrote: Same same. Doing fine. Won't be around as much as usual today obviously. Any thoughts about the game at hand?
Thanks buddy.
Regarding the game...I have absolutely no ideas as I have read maybe like 3 total posts. I thought this would start Friday, so I was kinda surprised when I saw there were 13-14 pages. I"m kinda intimidated now that there are 25 pages and my desire to catch up is non-existent. I will give you my assurance that I have rolled quite the favorable alliance (given my extreme disdain for rolling mafia, it should be easy to figure out what that is), and I will be helping in the mass execution of all mafiosos.
Hi Robik. I will lynch you if you do not read the thread. I hope that is enough motivation. Kind regards, Artanis
So Artanis, why are you focusing on Robik so much for not reading the thread? GB has said that hes not reading the thread and won't catch up today for sure but you haven't even mentioned that?
Because Robik has said Hi like 3 times during the day showing he was present. Besides, I'm familiar with Robik and I like annoying him.
Since you aren't in the mood to lynch geript today, are you going to try to push robik down the lynch today? Or just trying to get him to do stuff
On January 01 2015 09:05 Damdred wrote: @Dr H. You seem to be scum reading geript currently is that correct? Also yu seem to be forming scum and town reads based off on support or disagreement with your case. Don't you think thats a bit dangerous since townies can disagree with points?
On January 01 2015 09:52 Damdred wrote: @GB, what do you think about it do you feel like he was blue fishing making a joke?
On January 02 2015 11:35 batsnacks wrote: Besides what are we going to do tomorrow if thechyz is still alive and DrH takes it upon himself to tunnel him for another 15 pages.
check him
SL what about the framer and millers? Do you think mafia really reacts the way that he did here?
You get the idea.
I wanna read more before I actually call him mafia, but I'm probably gonna ignore the later half of his filter for now and read few other people (ritoky, superbia... maybe laz0r?).
Like at some point through gb's filter I just went "nah, dude is probably not mafia". I do totally not get that feeling from Damdred's filter.
I'm probably not explaining it very well, but Damdred, unlike GB with his blatant willingness to lynch just about anyone, seems to be going out of his way not to ruffle any feathers.
Even his push on Lazor day 1 was very much downtuned. "I am of the mindset to kill lazer" or something that instead of the classic "LET'S FUCKING MURDER HIM".
Just to point it out, even if you think I'm mafia, you can easily discuss my reads with me (this goes for SL, GB and anyone else who is around too).
Worst case scenario, I'm mafia and you're doing some dumb wifom and I'm SOOOOO good that I don't leave any hints as to which people I'm reading are actually scumbuddies.
Better case scenario, I'm mafia and you'll notice me revealing my team
Best case scenario, I'm town and we get some actual discussion going with a new perspective (my re-reading people is at the moment a fresh perspective into the thread).
And tbh, if any of you are mafia, you need to do this anyway, because refusing to talk and just lynching me or someone else is actually awful and people will notice.
His tone is COMPLETELY different. I mean literally the opposite of this carefully worded, question asking boring blob of damdred that exists in this game.
I am now 100% convinced. That bro is mafia.
Like I literally claim mafia and claim him to be my scumbuddy.
On January 08 2015 06:04 Lazermonkey wrote: And yey for Palmar thinking Damdred is scum! Because he is. I'm like 101% positive to killing Damdred if we can get enough people on the wagon.
First step is you voting for him.
There is going to be resistance to this lynch, because 5 of the 13 players alive don't want to kill Damdred.
So, if your role PM is not the mafia one, you should probably vote Damdred.
Also, if your role PM is the mafia one, consider voting damdred to blend into the town justice train.
On January 08 2015 06:06 ritoky wrote: let's all spam votes on the guy doing endless vote logic, coloring names left and right, and clearly softing his role every chance he gets. such donkey much wow.
On January 08 2015 05:58 ritoky wrote: le sigh. you guys should really move your votes off me.
ok out your checks then bro
DrH n1 was green SL n2 was green
i softened a bit on SL because of it, but i think he was a prime frame target last night so i am still kinda convinced he is red.
fuck you all for making me claim and the only person who shouldn't be mad at himself is robik because i think he is the only person who actually got the endless hints.
I'm assuming this is a hard claim.
If we have a cop, there should be a counterclaim immediately. If there is none, ritoky is confirmed.
(I actually kinda expect a counterclaim, that'd be fun...)
blue = my town reads Note: kelsier attempted to vote on superbia but failed to bold his post in the voting thread, hence why i added him in parenthesis.
I have added Lazermonkey as another one of my town reads now because he was the one who gave the case on damdred that I really liked and inspired me to look further into damdred and make my case on him.
I added marv as mafia because of him being on the second wagon both times coupled with my day 1 read of him having shallow reads and that flow chart that some1 posted that showed him as mafia. apparently it is a super accurate flow chart.
because i added marv as mafia i added palmar as half town, the only reason i am half town on him is because he has a couple "why are we both alive"-type posts. if marv flips mafia palmar is likely town but those posts could be setting up a bus. if palmar lives multiple days after marv dies and flips mafia, reconsider the read.
so my scum team right now is: 1) marv 2&3) i think that 2 of the 3 between damdred, robik, and SL are mafia. damdred would be my first lynch of the 3 as of right now because i have slightly lessened on my scum read of SL. 4) 1 of superbia and gb; could be both they are kinda the coin-flippy question marks for me 5) vivax - i actually have a higher scum read on vivax than this in terms of his individual play, it is just once i started making this list i realized that vivax would be getting mega-bussed if this were the team. so he is at 5.
OK, I'm convinced he's scum. he colors DrH blue, along with some other non-confirmed people but never colors sicklucker.
GG
##vote: ritoky
sorry for not listening marv
#teammarbic
We need that counterclaim.
Till then, he is confirmed. But yes, I sort of do expect a counterclaim.
Disclaimer: I am no role. Lynch me if I ever claim one.
On January 08 2015 06:11 Lazermonkey wrote: Okay lets not kill ritoky today then. If he isn't cop and someone counterclaim, we can kill him np. Untill then...
GOGO damdred.
##Unvote: ##Vote: Damdred
that's the laziest bullshit iv'e ever heard. I just proved that he's not cop lol. No need to even counterclaim hahahaha
there are 8 townies alive.
25% chance mafia shoots the cop tonight. Claiming today is probably the right play in any case.
On January 08 2015 06:18 Vivax wrote: Why did Damred not simply pile up on my wagon and try to stir the fire D2. He had basically a golden opportunity when the day alone started with like 7 votes on me. Did he expect me to die anyway and wanted cred for the flip?
Also have a hard time finding the tone differences between the two games Palmar. I think in mission mini or world cup I caught him simply cause before a lynch he claimed to have a scumread on somebody and then he didn't attempt to lynch or something similar. Or maybe it was a townread he didn't defend against a scumread.
Wait what?
Because scum is less likely to do impulsive. Literally anyone with a brain knows that wagon is going to get disputed. That doesn't absolve him at all.
Also no. There is such a massive tone difference that if you cannot see it you either didn't read, or chose to ignore it.
His tone is COMPLETELY different. I mean literally the opposite of this carefully worded, question asking boring blob of damdred that exists in this game.
I am now 100% convinced. That bro is mafia.
Like I literally claim mafia and claim him to be my scumbuddy.
##vote Damdred
The thing is we dont have much mislynches. and hes in the middle for most people. You might be right but hes not the lynch today
He's right in the middle for everyone because he has done nothing even vaguely memorable.
Like there is probably not a single person that has townread him for a good reason ever in this game at all.
Why are people coming out and trying to shut down this lynch? It's a perfectly good lynch.
On January 08 2015 06:06 ritoky wrote: let's all spam votes on the guy doing endless vote logic, coloring names left and right, and clearly softing his role every chance he gets. such donkey much wow.
On January 08 2015 06:00 KelsierSC wrote:
On January 08 2015 05:58 ritoky wrote: le sigh. you guys should really move your votes off me.
ok out your checks then bro
DrH n1 was green SL n2 was green
i softened a bit on SL because of it, but i think he was a prime frame target last night so i am still kinda convinced he is red.
fuck you all for making me claim and the only person who shouldn't be mad at himself is robik because i think he is the only person who actually got the endless hints.
blue = my town reads Note: kelsier attempted to vote on superbia but failed to bold his post in the voting thread, hence why i added him in parenthesis.
I have added Lazermonkey as another one of my town reads now because he was the one who gave the case on damdred that I really liked and inspired me to look further into damdred and make my case on him.
I added marv as mafia because of him being on the second wagon both times coupled with my day 1 read of him having shallow reads and that flow chart that some1 posted that showed him as mafia. apparently it is a super accurate flow chart.
because i added marv as mafia i added palmar as half town, the only reason i am half town on him is because he has a couple "why are we both alive"-type posts. if marv flips mafia palmar is likely town but those posts could be setting up a bus. if palmar lives multiple days after marv dies and flips mafia, reconsider the read.
so my scum team right now is: 1) marv 2&3) i think that 2 of the 3 between damdred, robik, and SL are mafia. damdred would be my first lynch of the 3 as of right now because i have slightly lessened on my scum read of SL. 4) 1 of superbia and gb; could be both they are kinda the coin-flippy question marks for me 5) vivax - i actually have a higher scum read on vivax than this in terms of his individual play, it is just once i started making this list i realized that vivax would be getting mega-bussed if this were the team. so he is at 5.
OK, I'm convinced he's scum. he colors DrH blue, along with some other non-confirmed people but never colors sicklucker.
GG
##vote: ritoky
sorry for not listening marv
#teammarbic
We need that counterclaim.
Till then, he is confirmed. But yes, I sort of do expect a counterclaim.
Disclaimer: I am no role. Lynch me if I ever claim one.
What?!?!? Absoluetly not
REAL COP DO NOT FUCKING COUNTER CLAIM. THIS IS THE MOST OBVIOUS FAKE CLAIM OF ALL FUCKING TIME. DUDE DOESN'T EVEN COLOR IN HIS FUCKING CHECK. LOLOLOL. HE ALSO DOES 0 ANALYSIS ON WHETHER THAT PERSON IS ACTUALLY FRAMED.
Ok, Robik is scum. He didn't even read the very recent post where ritoky answeres to the same accusation I made.
No, and this post + defending damdred really swings you back into mafia territory for me.
Robik's reaction is completely justifiable. The cop's job is not to interpret his own reads when breadcrumbing. Like without the claim there is 0% chance anyone would have understood what ritoky's checks are. (at leas the sicklucker one).
His job is to give us the checks and let US interpret them.
On January 08 2015 06:23 KelsierSC wrote: wait ritoky you made your list post in the night phase so that is why you didn't have SL coloured in because you didn't have your check results back? correct?
no it was during day phase. i didn't color him because my personal read GREATLY conflicts with my check
Because if he is so sure sl is mafia that he's going to ignore his own green check, why check him anyway?
list of people not cop:
sl marv palmar robik vivax ksc laz0r gb
I still think we should get a cc, not many people left anyway.
On January 08 2015 06:51 GlowingBear wrote: Exactly, Palmar. That contradiction reveals ritoky isn't the cop either.
Yes, but I'm not certain enough to kill him while unccd.
I only see 2 options:
a) kill someone random (hint: Damdred) b) get a cc
Like if he is mafia then massive kudos to whatever townies actually have the balls to just call him out on it. But I have seen so much terrible cop play over the years that this could very well be a true claim.
On January 08 2015 06:06 ritoky wrote: let's all spam votes on the guy doing endless vote logic, coloring names left and right, and clearly softing his role every chance he gets. such donkey much wow.
On January 08 2015 06:00 KelsierSC wrote:
On January 08 2015 05:58 ritoky wrote: le sigh. you guys should really move your votes off me.
ok out your checks then bro
DrH n1 was green SL n2 was green
i softened a bit on SL because of it, but i think he was a prime frame target last night so i am still kinda convinced he is red.
fuck you all for making me claim and the only person who shouldn't be mad at himself is robik because i think he is the only person who actually got the endless hints.
On January 08 2015 06:15 IAmRobik wrote:
On January 08 2015 06:13 Palmar wrote:
On January 08 2015 06:12 IAmRobik wrote:
On January 06 2015 21:19 ritoky wrote: Sorry for the vote spam, but deal with it.
blue = my town reads Note: kelsier attempted to vote on superbia but failed to bold his post in the voting thread, hence why i added him in parenthesis.
I have added Lazermonkey as another one of my town reads now because he was the one who gave the case on damdred that I really liked and inspired me to look further into damdred and make my case on him.
I added marv as mafia because of him being on the second wagon both times coupled with my day 1 read of him having shallow reads and that flow chart that some1 posted that showed him as mafia. apparently it is a super accurate flow chart.
because i added marv as mafia i added palmar as half town, the only reason i am half town on him is because he has a couple "why are we both alive"-type posts. if marv flips mafia palmar is likely town but those posts could be setting up a bus. if palmar lives multiple days after marv dies and flips mafia, reconsider the read.
so my scum team right now is: 1) marv 2&3) i think that 2 of the 3 between damdred, robik, and SL are mafia. damdred would be my first lynch of the 3 as of right now because i have slightly lessened on my scum read of SL. 4) 1 of superbia and gb; could be both they are kinda the coin-flippy question marks for me 5) vivax - i actually have a higher scum read on vivax than this in terms of his individual play, it is just once i started making this list i realized that vivax would be getting mega-bussed if this were the team. so he is at 5.
OK, I'm convinced he's scum. he colors DrH blue, along with some other non-confirmed people but never colors sicklucker.
GG
##vote: ritoky
sorry for not listening marv
#teammarbic
We need that counterclaim.
Till then, he is confirmed. But yes, I sort of do expect a counterclaim.
Disclaimer: I am no role. Lynch me if I ever claim one.
What?!?!? Absoluetly not
REAL COP DO NOT FUCKING COUNTER CLAIM. THIS IS THE MOST OBVIOUS FAKE CLAIM OF ALL FUCKING TIME. DUDE DOESN'T EVEN COLOR IN HIS FUCKING CHECK. LOLOLOL. HE ALSO DOES 0 ANALYSIS ON WHETHER THAT PERSON IS ACTUALLY FRAMED.
Ok, Robik is scum. He didn't even read the very recent post where ritoky answeres to the same accusation I made.
No, and this post + defending damdred really swings you back into mafia territory for me.
Robik's reaction is completely justifiable. The cop's job is not to interpret his own reads when breadcrumbing. Like without the claim there is 0% chance anyone would have understood what ritoky's checks are. (at leas the sicklucker one).
His job is to give us the checks and let US interpret them.
Dude ritoky hinted at being cop so early by bringing up the framer part, which makes him very likely to be cop unless he thinks that he was the lynch of the day that very moment. Plus he doesn't claim to have a red check get a better push going than simply leaving behind a guy "green, but could be framed".
Robik is still going nuts over this with no CC in sight, and I don't trust this guy to be doing it for towns sake. Like, the only thing that made me think he was town is that he claimed he was sure somebody else would be cop. Now that this is still not in sight, I'll go back to thinking Robik is scum trying his best to get our cop under suspicion. Maybe one of his team will fake-counterclaim later.
On January 08 2015 06:53 GlowingBear wrote: Palmar, I have read some posts from damdred that made him look townie. I think this is not a day to lynch him. But he isn't actively trying to solve the game. His thoughts aren't well explicit in the thread. He could be mafia, yes.
He is more of a null than scum here.
1) show me those posts.
2) he's null for everyone. Like Vivax just defended him using the same bullshit.
HE'S NULL FOR EVERYONE BECAUSE HE'S NONDESCRIPT MAFIA. GO READ HIS FILTER IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE ME.
On January 08 2015 06:51 GlowingBear wrote: Exactly, Palmar. That contradiction reveals ritoky isn't the cop either.
Yes, but I'm not certain enough to kill him while unccd.
I only see 2 options:
a) kill someone random (hint: Damdred) b) get a cc
Like if he is mafia then massive kudos to whatever townies actually have the balls to just call him out on it. But I have seen so much terrible cop play over the years that this could very well be a true claim.
i have to agree with this. i dunno if it's because we're the old hands in the game but we seem to be thinking the same
a cc would not only net us mafia (unless it's superbia at which point i start hitting babies) but also brings a massive amount of clarity
i think 2 out of the 3 of SL, robik, and damdred are mafia; i have been repeatedly stating it all phase. this is based on the day 1 lynch and how many towns were on it. i cannot believe it was entirely town. as of right now (might be the omgus in me) i am inclined to believe it is robik and SL
I don't care what you're inclined to believe. Your opinions are of no value as you (through your breadcrumbing methods, your bullshit checks etc) have proven incapable of thinking.
Robik you know I'm lynching you tomorrow if ritoky flips cop.
But as I pointed out, Robik's rage was completely justified and his reaction was too, and even more so if he actually is the cop. That also explains how certain he was the claim was fake.
On January 08 2015 07:10 IAmRobik wrote: If all of you want, we can try to hedge it and lynch Vivax today. hopefully he flips scum and then scum gets to decide whether they want ritoky to try to keep fighting against me and give me more checks or if they want to nk me and then you lynch ritoky tomorrow anyway.
We can do it the other way around, that way also gives us an exit strategy if you're the mafia here. Your way wins the game if you're mafia and vivax flips town.
I don't think you're mafia, but you know, lack of perfect info = I'd rather do the safe thing.
Seems sort of reasonable. also lines up with what I know if I just assume marv is town.
gb I read today and thought he could be town sl I think is town because of shenanigans artanis and drh I have no idea bout but I townread them both on day 1. i'm town, and robik is in this scenario town.
On January 08 2015 07:30 Lazermonkey wrote: I'm not lynching ritoky if there is no hard claim against him. Not one chance.
we're basically counting robik's claim as a hard one, in the sense that there is literally no way he'd pull this shit off as vanilla townie. So either he is the cop or mafia.
On January 08 2015 07:30 Lazermonkey wrote: I'm not lynching ritoky if there is no hard claim against him. Not one chance.
we're basically counting robik's claim as a hard one, in the sense that there is literally no way he'd pull this shit off as vanilla townie. So either he is the cop or mafia.
Most likely he is the cop.
As soon as ritoky gets lynched, I'm going to rescind my claim and Kelsier isgoing to claim cop. No big deal
Sure, if ritoky flips mafia I don't care.
If ritoky flips cop I am never doing anything other than voting you this game.
On January 08 2015 07:30 Lazermonkey wrote: I'm not lynching ritoky if there is no hard claim against him. Not one chance.
we're basically counting robik's claim as a hard one, in the sense that there is literally no way he'd pull this shit off as vanilla townie. So either he is the cop or mafia.
Most likely he is the cop.
He said like 10 times that he was about to claim cop if we wouldn't lynch ritoky. Then he claims. I'm not sure that makes him scum or cop. He could just be dumb town.
No because he knows if he's wrong as town and ritoky is cop he has thrown the game.
On January 08 2015 07:57 IAmRobik wrote: If I rescind my claim, will I get lynched here?
No
But neither will ritoky.
I mean. I'm cool with that as long as I can reclaim tomorrow. I really really want to lynch superbia today. And those people on his wagon right now look pretty townie and i kinda trust that he will flip scum. Do you really think town won't be able to make the right decision tomorrow between me/ritoky if maf doesn't nk me?
No, ritoky is never getting lynched if you rescind.
If you rescind and reclaim, your reclaim will be taken as a scumclaim. Because if you are cop, we have free mafia in ritoky.
On January 08 2015 07:57 IAmRobik wrote: If I rescind my claim, will I get lynched here?
No
But neither will ritoky.
I mean. I'm cool with that as long as I can reclaim tomorrow. I really really want to lynch superbia today. And those people on his wagon right now look pretty townie and i kinda trust that he will flip scum. Do you really think town won't be able to make the right decision tomorrow between me/ritoky if maf doesn't nk me?
No, ritoky is never getting lynched if you rescind.
If you rescind and reclaim, your reclaim will be taken as a scumclaim. Because if you are cop, we have free mafia in ritoky.
but but but i wanna be greedy I really want to lynch someone who's not ritoky to force mafia to decide on whether to kill me tonight or not
No
you're balls deep in now.
If you're VT you've literally just thrown the game.
On January 08 2015 08:15 IAmRobik wrote: Ritoky fake claimed under pressure. I counter-claimed, but am considering rescinding and letting him live one extra day in order to lynch someone else who I think is mafia with him.
On January 08 2015 07:57 IAmRobik wrote: If I rescind my claim, will I get lynched here?
No
But neither will ritoky.
I mean. I'm cool with that as long as I can reclaim tomorrow. I really really want to lynch superbia today. And those people on his wagon right now look pretty townie and i kinda trust that he will flip scum. Do you really think town won't be able to make the right decision tomorrow between me/ritoky if maf doesn't nk me?
No, ritoky is never getting lynched if you rescind.
If you rescind and reclaim, your reclaim will be taken as a scumclaim. Because if you are cop, we have free mafia in ritoky.
but but but i wanna be greedy I really want to lynch someone who's not ritoky to force mafia to decide on whether to kill me tonight or not
No
you're balls deep in now.
If you're VT you've literally just thrown the game.
What if I'm VT and someone else is the cop who is not Ritoky?
On January 03 2015 06:04 Palmar wrote: Yes, I have a few strengths and a few weaknesses in mafia.
List of weaknesses:
1: I'm terrible in the mid-game, because I can't tell dumb from scum. So I repeatedly lynch people who don't agree with me. 2: I generally give one mafia a free pass for no good reason 3: I ignore mafia all the time. When I have players I've mostly ignored, those players often tend to be mafia (think superbia this game).
So yes, I know that there is a possibility you're dumb town. You're either dumb town or scum. And I just have to roll the dice. Of all the people on that shitty wagon, you're the one who should have had the sense to actually get things done properly, but you didn't.
I don't think you're dumb JAT, so by process of elimination, you must be mafia.
On January 08 2015 19:25 Palmar wrote: marv your main mission is to clear me so people don't do dumb shit.
Could you do that for me please?
Why did you say that DrH was 'probably town' at the very start of the game?
And what was with the big list posts at the start?
Did I say that at the very start?
I think my read on him came based on the same thing Robik said day 1. That no matter if Chyz (now chezinu) is town or mafia, it really looked like DrH genuinely believed his read on Chyz.
On January 08 2015 19:27 marvellosity wrote: if you're town, I know you'll do a good enough job defending yourself not to get lynched.
lynch should only be in one place tomorrow anyways, and that's not you
Yes, I am certain that you (no matter your alignment) will be convinced if I get forced to defend myself. As I have weaknesses in mafia, I have a few strengths as well, one of them being defending against being mislynched (although a better strength would be to not get into the situation where I have to defend myself)...
The problem is I don't trust the rest of this crowd. The lynch inertia is strong.
On January 08 2015 19:36 DarthPunk wrote: The following posts both look garbage to me. Very wishy-washy, and I can't seem to empathize with the conclusions he does draw.
Palmar, admits himself that he has a strong day one but these posts feel fake and obligatory.
On December 31 2014 20:52 Palmar wrote: Btw, as I'm probably going to be mostly unavailable today (it's new year's eve... why did we even start?). I'll just throw out very much not curated thoughts I had while reading up to like page... 16?
I'll catch up with the rest later.
geript is sort of scummy in some respects. I have no idea why 20 minutes into the game he started wishing for random people to be there to talk to him. Also, everything he says is sort of... too clean? not dumb enough? I don't know how to describe it and it's just a feeling based on memory, I haven't gone back and re-read, so I'd need to confirm.
Eden came off strong and he said something I thought was really dumb.
DrH is probably town, and he had a post that made me feel good about that read.
Damdred is probably town too. He too has a post I can't remember that made me think "oh that looks like a townie".
Koshi overreacting on this page (21) to DrH's dismissal of koshi's defense was kinda mafia. Idk though.
I should probably just sheep marv and lynch him if he's wrong. That's always a fine strategy.
Remember, these reads I'm just throwing out literally from memory of having read like 4-6 pages this morning. Don't pretend these are some concrete observations.
Then he tunnels geript for a bit and does nothing I really like.
This post seems more likely to come from scum at the start of the game also, just because scum are more likely to feel demotivated early in my experience, conversely a townie who believes he has caught scum is much less likely to feel demotivated.
On January 02 2015 20:37 Palmar wrote: I'm really demotivated to even play now. Probably gonna just afk through the night and see if I turn up dead or not.
If I am alive I might just park my vote on Robik out of spite and never change it for playing terribly.
You have to read in context.
I wanted to lynch geript. I got a wagon going on geript, when I went to sleep geript was the leading candidate for a lynch. However when I woke up town had voteswitched on to batsnacks (and not Vivax as I had suggested) and killed him. This led me to being extremely frustrated as I didn't even know people were considering batsnacks as a lynch target and I had read batsnacks as town.
On January 08 2015 19:36 DarthPunk wrote: The following posts both look garbage to me. Very wishy-washy, and I can't seem to empathize with the conclusions he does draw.
Palmar, admits himself that he has a strong day one but these posts feel fake and obligatory.
On December 31 2014 20:52 Palmar wrote: Btw, as I'm probably going to be mostly unavailable today (it's new year's eve... why did we even start?). I'll just throw out very much not curated thoughts I had while reading up to like page... 16?
I'll catch up with the rest later.
geript is sort of scummy in some respects. I have no idea why 20 minutes into the game he started wishing for random people to be there to talk to him. Also, everything he says is sort of... too clean? not dumb enough? I don't know how to describe it and it's just a feeling based on memory, I haven't gone back and re-read, so I'd need to confirm.
Eden came off strong and he said something I thought was really dumb.
DrH is probably town, and he had a post that made me feel good about that read.
Damdred is probably town too. He too has a post I can't remember that made me think "oh that looks like a townie".
Koshi overreacting on this page (21) to DrH's dismissal of koshi's defense was kinda mafia. Idk though.
I should probably just sheep marv and lynch him if he's wrong. That's always a fine strategy.
Remember, these reads I'm just throwing out literally from memory of having read like 4-6 pages this morning. Don't pretend these are some concrete observations.
Then he tunnels geript for a bit and does nothing I really like.
This post seems more likely to come from scum at the start of the game also, just because scum are more likely to feel demotivated early in my experience, conversely a townie who believes he has caught scum is much less likely to feel demotivated.
On January 02 2015 20:37 Palmar wrote: I'm really demotivated to even play now. Probably gonna just afk through the night and see if I turn up dead or not.
If I am alive I might just park my vote on Robik out of spite and never change it for playing terribly.
You have to read in context.
I wanted to lynch geript. I got a wagon going on geript, when I went to sleep geript was the leading candidate for a lynch. However when I woke up town had voteswitched on to batsnacks (and not Vivax as I had suggested) and killed him. This led me to being extremely frustrated as I didn't even know people were considering batsnacks as a lynch target and I had read batsnacks as town.
Cool, so why were your first large posts on day one such wishy-washy inconclusive garbage when you are known for having strong day ones and I personally think you are an excellent player?
What benefit did you wish to gain by creating that list post? why did you call DrH probably town?
They're not inconclusive garbage. In fact, me hedging half my calls with wording like "very slight leaning town read" is probably the biggest tell that I am town this game.
However I also wouldn't expect just about anyone to understand that.
It's basically me trying not to be wrong, or if I am wrong have something to point to "hey look, I told you I just called him town for this small thing, not my fault he didn't end up being town". If I was mafia I'd be far more confident in my reads, or so I think, at least.
And the list post was basically me trying to do useful stuff. I decided to punch in what I was thinking at that point in the game.
yeah DP is probably town, if for nothing else than he actually read some of my filter, called me scum, got some explanations and read some more then changed his mind. Also DrH had reasons to be townread since back on day 1.
On January 08 2015 21:45 Palmar wrote: yeah DP is probably town, if for nothing else than he actually read some of my filter, called me scum, got some explanations and read some more then changed his mind. Also DrH had reasons to be townread since back on day 1.
So yes, I'm putting him firmly in the townpile.
Palmar I'm wondering. You were into a seemingly zero fucks given attitude D1 and D2, posting things that looked like weird trap plays. Now that basically scum has been lynched and some people start pointing to you, and during D3, you went into serious mode posting lists and actually talking in a way that makes everybody understands you.
What changed during D3 for you to switch into that mode, except that town was heading for a scum lynch?
Less players left in the game, felt like starting to read filters wouldn't be as much of a giant barrier to participating.
And I think I was fairly successful. I know I didn't end up really reading superbia or ritoky as I mentioned doing but the cop claim came out and people were being dumb so I felt like I had to intervene.
On day 2 I just wanted to lynch geript. I'm still sort of okay with lynching geript. Imma call him bad postgame for getting lynched and blame it all on him.
Like I felt that I did work on day 1, that then got stalled by the voteswitch on to batsnacks, and I basically just had to wait until I reaped the reward from that work (lynching geript). Sure I was wrong, but that's not the important part. After seeing I was wrong I basically walked away for a bit because it's time to rethink.
Whatever I posted on day 2 was mostly just opportunistic stuff. pot shots at marv etc, some random thoughts.
On January 08 2015 22:50 GlowingBear wrote: Marv is town, Vivax. I've just realised that. He isn't dying tonight because mafia wants to WIFOM the shit out of him. They want you to exactly think that he is scum because he is still alive. That's why he won't die tonight, and DP will
I would kinda expect marv to die if he's town. But I'm not gonna use that against him tomorrow because well, saying it and then trying to call him scum when it doesn't happen is dumb.
But yes, I am a potential mislynch for mafia at this point in the game. If marv is town, mafia knows he won't get lynched tomorrow, and better than anyone else in the game, he'll be able to clear me.
So keeping a town-marv alive potentially clears two people.
On January 09 2015 01:19 IAmRobik wrote: I did your work for you palmar. Go find another player to call scum
Like it doesn't even matter man.
Tomorrow we lynch ritoky. If he is not mafia you are confirmed mafia. However, he is probably mafia.
Also the best argument against kelsiersc being mafia is his post towards ritoky yesterday "give us your checks" or whatever (this is based on ritoky flipping scum). It's a sort of strange post to make towards a scumfriend if the scumfriend is then going to claim.
Once we clear ritoky up, the next day I will probably be pushing for a damdred lynch, and some people will push for my lynch, unless new evidence presents itself. During that day I will most likely clear myself (or well, depending on how strong the mistrust is, get lynched anyway).
I won't have time to read more filters today, I might do it tomorrow.
As for what I currently think of the players and why (in very short terms):
DrH/DP - Town (Robik's check + DP's change of mind as I explained + DrH's early Chyz push). GB - Town (based on my readthrough of his filter yesterday) Robik - Town (based on reasonable response to ritoky's claim + various points throughout the game. I remember agreeing on DrH back on day 1). Artanis - slight Town (based on day 1 and not much else. I think I liked his treatment of Koshi and Chyz) sicklucker - slight Town (shenanigans with claim. don't think he does that as mafia)
Laz0r - null (but assuming damdred is mafia, probably town because of damdy's "push" on day 1.) marv - null (has done some whacky things, but also reasonable at times. It's a big problem that he doesn't have many concrete reads, town or scum, or at least that's what it feels like). chez - null (who knows...) ksc - null (calls me mafia and doesn't have any real good townie points, but I guess my last point is sorta good, so null rather than scumlean)
ritoky - scum (claim is hard to believe, has been ccd, checks hard to believe, shitty breadcrumbing) damdred - scum (based on readthrough, careful wording, weak pushes, shitty questions etc)
So yes, it's likely that 2/4 in the bottom are mafia, or well, I tend to miss a mafia or two. Chez is a wildcard.
I did like Kelsier early so maybe I should not call him mafia. I remember having him as one of my strongest townreads at some point in day1/night1. But I'd have to go back and figure out why, because some of it may be due to him agreeing on geript with me.
Above are links to my filters in three games in 2014 where I got lynched as town because of fear/lynch inertia. If you want comparison, here are the last two games I got lynched as mafia.
There's nothing to do today so anyone who actually thinks they're going to lynch me needs to read this (assuming they're town, of course).
The parts I specifically want you to pay attention to is how I act when I get under pressure of being lynched. This is vitally important because the easiest way to determine my alignment is to try to lynch me. Assuming I am close to a computer enough to actually post to defend myself, I always will defend myself, because I don't like getting lynched as town.
Reading up on the meta is a good first step in not mislynching me.
I am not going to go all out today because it requires effort and I'd rather have energy when it actually matters. The way I see this game we now have ritoky as confirmed mafia, damdred as likely second one, and pending further reading maybe vivax too.
And for the love of god, listen to marv. If he is mafia he will say I'm town because that's how it works, but more importantly, if he is town, he will get my alignment right. It is very, very likely that he already highly suspect I'm town, and it will only get confirmed when people try to lynch me.
Also, just to be clear, I'm sort of looking forward to the big day. It's always exciting to see how and why people push me. I , for example, have no idea why sl thinks I'm mafia.
On January 11 2015 05:15 Vivax wrote: To the end that he's scum, if that's your question. I don't see why he starts trying so hard JUST on the day that scum is really up for lynch.
wasn't quite my question
actually he started pushing for damdred before the cop business.
thinking about it, i really dislike how he self-characterised his play as "bad" this game, like he said he was having a bad game. He's not having a bad game, he's having a game where he's not tried to play, the two aren't the same.
Like I get the idea "hey let's vote palmar so he defends himself". But you have to give at least one reason as to why I am scum. Otherwise you're just killing me for... I have no idea what.
Because the closest thing in the thread to an actual accusation, I'm just going to respond to Artanis' poem. Also, he's one of the people I want most to actually talk to, because he's basically stayed away from me throughout the game (it feels like, at least, I've interacted with vivax, gb, marv, sl etc, but him I've sorta never talked to).
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Your case on GB was most curious
Don't know what you mean by curious. It's super townie if you know how brains work. If I am mafia, I already know GB's alignment, so why would I bother with the whole "start out piling some scum points on him, pretend to read more, then completely flip my conclusion and call him town".
Like I'm not good enough at scum to do that. Now obviously you can argue this, but I'd think that because I have perfect information as mafia, I wouldn't have bothered with the whole changing my mind in the middle of the post/filter read. I think I'd rather have tried to strengthen whichever conclusion I wanted to reach by mostly citing examples pointing in that one direction.
Stopping mid-filter when I feel confident he's town after questioning some of his early stuff, is something not many mafia would do.
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: And your case against Damdred dubious
What do you think of Damdred?
Do you disagree that he's played this game very much in the background? He's not taken any kind of a leadership role in town and even now, with just a handful of players remaining, almost nothing he has written really stands out.
Sure, voting superbia on day 2 builds the case for him being town somewhat (also, remember, I didn't know superbia was mafia when I wrote my stuff on Damdred, as he hadn't flipped). But it all depends on whether or not we think superbia actually had a real chance to die that day. Also, I cba checking, but was geript firmly in the lead? or was Vivax right there? We may have to check that.
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: You helped lynch Geript, a member of our town
So what? Being wrong on my first target happens all the time. Weren't you on his wagon too? I made a case, I believed in it, geript's non-response made me want to go through with it.
Do you doubt that I believed geript was mafia? Or at least he had a good chance of being one?
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: What have you done this game that hasn't made us frown?
On December 31 2014 20:52 Palmar wrote: geript is sort of scummy in some respects. I have no idea why 20 minutes into the game he started wishing for random people to be there to talk to him. Also, everything he says is sort of... too clean? not dumb enough? I don't know how to describe it and it's just a feeling based on memory, I haven't gone back and re-read, so I'd need to confirm.
Palmar confirmed town for making me laugh. I also kinda agree that we haven't really had a Geript moment of insight yet, which reminds me a bit of LXI where he just waddled through.
I would like to hear Geript's dumb reasons for considering Dr.Helvetica town.
On January 13 2015 00:19 sicklucker wrote: Ok palmer and its a big one. In a 366 page game not one post you made has helped us find scum. This makes you scum
1st of all, read my filter. There's a ton of reads in there. And I got geript lynched.
I mean, he turned out to be town, but at least I did something. What have you done?
On January 13 2015 00:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Palmar, you were very clear in that Marv should townread you after your defense. What meta read do you believe he has on you and why did you say he should already have a townread on you to begin with?
Also, you stated before that Marv was 100% scum, then you said later that Marv should read you as town whether he's town or scum implying that you do in fact doubt your read on him. Why and where did that happen?
Marv is the big x factor this game.
At 2-3 occasions I've basically jumped up "aha, marv must be mafia", but then he keeps being reasonable and I can't convince myself he's 100% mafia. Like he does some weird things, but comes back to sound reasonable again. He reacted almost exactly the way I did to the ritoky claim (ie: we get the counterclaim, we lynch whoever is less believable). The last time I started thinking he might be town was when he posted this:
On January 08 2015 19:36 DarthPunk wrote: The following posts both look garbage to me. Very wishy-washy, and I can't seem to empathize with the conclusions he does draw.
Palmar, admits himself that he has a strong day one but these posts feel fake and obligatory.
On December 31 2014 20:52 Palmar wrote: Btw, as I'm probably going to be mostly unavailable today (it's new year's eve... why did we even start?). I'll just throw out very much not curated thoughts I had while reading up to like page... 16?
I'll catch up with the rest later.
geript is sort of scummy in some respects. I have no idea why 20 minutes into the game he started wishing for random people to be there to talk to him. Also, everything he says is sort of... too clean? not dumb enough? I don't know how to describe it and it's just a feeling based on memory, I haven't gone back and re-read, so I'd need to confirm.
Eden came off strong and he said something I thought was really dumb.
DrH is probably town, and he had a post that made me feel good about that read.
Damdred is probably town too. He too has a post I can't remember that made me think "oh that looks like a townie".
Koshi overreacting on this page (21) to DrH's dismissal of koshi's defense was kinda mafia. Idk though.
I should probably just sheep marv and lynch him if he's wrong. That's always a fine strategy.
Remember, these reads I'm just throwing out literally from memory of having read like 4-6 pages this morning. Don't pretend these are some concrete observations.
Then he tunnels geript for a bit and does nothing I really like.
This post seems more likely to come from scum at the start of the game also, just because scum are more likely to feel demotivated early in my experience, conversely a townie who believes he has caught scum is much less likely to feel demotivated.
On January 02 2015 20:37 Palmar wrote: I'm really demotivated to even play now. Probably gonna just afk through the night and see if I turn up dead or not.
If I am alive I might just park my vote on Robik out of spite and never change it for playing terribly.
You have to read in context.
I wanted to lynch geript. I got a wagon going on geript, when I went to sleep geript was the leading candidate for a lynch. However when I woke up town had voteswitched on to batsnacks (and not Vivax as I had suggested) and killed him. This led me to being extremely frustrated as I didn't even know people were considering batsnacks as a lynch target and I had read batsnacks as town.
Cool, so why were your first large posts on day one such wishy-washy inconclusive garbage when you are known for having strong day ones and I personally think you are an excellent player?
What benefit did you wish to gain by creating that list post? why did you call DrH probably town?
They're not inconclusive garbage. In fact, me hedging half my calls with wording like "very slight leaning town read" is probably the biggest tell that I am town this game.
However I also wouldn't expect just about anyone to understand that.
It's basically me trying not to be wrong, or if I am wrong have something to point to "hey look, I told you I just called him town for this small thing, not my fault he didn't end up being town". If I was mafia I'd be far more confident in my reads, or so I think, at least.
And the list post was basically me trying to do useful stuff. I decided to punch in what I was thinking at that point in the game.
and I already explained why I called DrH town.
this post is reasonable. I can't remember who it was but there was a game recently where someone made this long, terrible case on me, quoting a bunch of posts where i'm umming and ahhing.
Because it's 100% true, it's a very reasonable post by me, and marv takes it as such. The only sort-of-weird thing is that DP was much quicker to pick up on how amazing that post was than marv, which might mean marv was parroting him, might mean MARV NOT READ SO GOOD TAKE TIME, or maybe he just wasn't around.
But yeah, I see no scenario, even if I'm cop checked green that I'm leading a lynch on marv today. I think, by far, the best target is Damdred, and I have to read Vivax and LM. I keep forgetting LM actually exists, which sometimes means people are mafia.
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Your case on GB was most curious
Don't know what you mean by curious. It's super townie if you know how brains work. If I am mafia, I already know GB's alignment, so why would I bother with the whole "start out piling some scum points on him, pretend to read more, then completely flip my conclusion and call him town".
Like I'm not good enough at scum to do that. Now obviously you can argue this, but I'd think that because I have perfect information as mafia, I wouldn't have bothered with the whole changing my mind in the middle of the post/filter read. I think I'd rather have tried to strengthen whichever conclusion I wanted to reach by mostly citing examples pointing in that one direction.
Stopping mid-filter when I feel confident he's town after questioning some of his early stuff, is something not many mafia would do.
You're absolutely self-aware enough to do this Palmar. C'mon.
You think more of my scumplay than I do.
Maybe I am? I do admit I like to go for the contradictory play when I'm mafia (ie: shoot the people who call me town and then go "I'D BE INSANE TO SHOOT MY ONLY SUPPORTER!!!!!")
Which reminds me, I'd be crazy to shoot DP who actually had brains enough to call me town (I think he did).
On January 13 2015 00:41 marvellosity wrote: You know I can't possibly answer that question...
Well you can theorize, and use recent evidence (where I WAS mafia, and you WERE town, and I wanted to shoot you despite knowing it could lose us the game if the wrong person got checked, because that's how I sure I was that you were a theat).
And yes, maybe.
There are 5 mafia in that voting list and I know at least 3 townies are on the geript wagon.
On January 13 2015 00:25 Palmar wrote: Because the closest thing in the thread to an actual accusation, I'm just going to respond to Artanis' poem. Also, he's one of the people I want most to actually talk to, because he's basically stayed away from me throughout the game (it feels like, at least, I've interacted with vivax, gb, marv, sl etc, but him I've sorta never talked to).
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Your case on GB was most curious
Don't know what you mean by curious. It's super townie if you know how brains work. If I am mafia, I already know GB's alignment, so why would I bother with the whole "start out piling some scum points on him, pretend to read more, then completely flip my conclusion and call him town".
Like I'm not good enough at scum to do that. Now obviously you can argue this, but I'd think that because I have perfect information as mafia, I wouldn't have bothered with the whole changing my mind in the middle of the post/filter read. I think I'd rather have tried to strengthen whichever conclusion I wanted to reach by mostly citing examples pointing in that one direction.
Stopping mid-filter when I feel confident he's town after questioning some of his early stuff, is something not many mafia would do.
I've expanded on this in an earlier post. It feels to me like you arbitrarily decided he was town halfway through the case when you couldn't find enough to incriminate him with a fairly meaningless post in "I suspect half the players". I find it hard to imagine that you find it hard to imagine for a scum player to say it as much as to go from scumreading to townreading someone, especially after you criticized him for creating a fake tone earlier. After that you suddenly view his posts in a townie light and do a decent job at that, which I suspect is because you know his alignment. I don't doubt that it could be forged.
Obviously we're going to disagree on this one.
Here's the thing, I am trying to explain what I did when I went for GB. I sort of admit I actually went into his filter, or shortly after reading the first few posts (which I criticized) expecting to find mafia. Then I basically ran into post after post where I actually thought he looked really town.
Like I _think_ I am not capable of faking this kind of a 180 mid-filter. Maybe I am, but why bother with the scum-stuff to begin with. Like at this point of the game, he's a vaguely viable lynch target later.
Also, just for later days, if you end up lynching me. After I posted my "gb is town" thing, he said something like "the buddying is real", which basically confirms him as town. He is always going to flip town this game.
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: And your case against Damdred dubious
What do you think of Damdred?
Do you disagree that he's played this game very much in the background? He's not taken any kind of a leadership role in town and even now, with just a handful of players remaining, almost nothing he has written really stands out.
Sure, voting superbia on day 2 builds the case for him being town somewhat (also, remember, I didn't know superbia was mafia when I wrote my stuff on Damdred, as he hadn't flipped). But it all depends on whether or not we think superbia actually had a real chance to die that day. Also, I cba checking, but was geript firmly in the lead? or was Vivax right there? We may have to check that.
I think you're right in that he's mostly been in the background. He's been a question mark for me most of the game. He played a good Day 1 where he drew conclusions (albeit the wrong ones initially, town on ritoky/scum on Dr.H), asked a lot of questions and seemed to be on the hunt for information. On Day 2 he was on the right lynch as well but he hasn't been very impactful, no, and that leaves him in the question mark area. He was the second person to get on Superbia after me when there was no idea if it was going to take off or not.
The reason he's a question mark for you and literally everyone else in the game,is that Damdred hasn't said or done anything of value throughout the game.
Asking questions with no intention of followup isn't at all townie.
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: You helped lynch Geript, a member of our town
So what? Being wrong on my first target happens all the time. Weren't you on his wagon too? I made a case, I believed in it, geript's non-response made me want to go through with it.
Do you doubt that I believed geript was mafia? Or at least he had a good chance of being one?
Of course I doubt it, because I think there's a good chance you're scum. I was on the wagon reluctantly because I felt he was a better lynch than Vivax and it looked like Superbia wasn't going to get lynched when I went to bed.
Chicken and egg bro.
If you decide I'm mafia and then look at my actions through that lens, we're gonna have a bad time.
You should first go read my push on geript, responses to it etc, and THEN you should decide if I am mafia because of it. You cannot scumhunt backwards. That's called guessing.
On January 13 2015 00:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Palmar, you were very clear in that Marv should townread you after your defense. What meta read do you believe he has on you and why did you say he should already have a townread on you to begin with?
Also, you stated before that Marv was 100% scum, then you said later that Marv should read you as town whether he's town or scum implying that you do in fact doubt your read on him. Why and where did that happen?
Marv is the big x factor this game.
At 2-3 occasions I've basically jumped up "aha, marv must be mafia", but then he keeps being reasonable and I can't convince myself he's 100% mafia. Like he does some weird things, but comes back to sound reasonable again. He reacted almost exactly the way I did to the ritoky claim (ie: we get the counterclaim, we lynch whoever is less believable). The last time I started thinking he might be town was when he posted this:
On January 08 2015 20:10 marvellosity wrote:
On January 08 2015 20:03 Palmar wrote:
On January 08 2015 19:54 DarthPunk wrote:
On January 08 2015 19:49 Palmar wrote:
On January 08 2015 19:36 DarthPunk wrote: The following posts both look garbage to me. Very wishy-washy, and I can't seem to empathize with the conclusions he does draw.
Palmar, admits himself that he has a strong day one but these posts feel fake and obligatory.
On December 31 2014 20:52 Palmar wrote: Btw, as I'm probably going to be mostly unavailable today (it's new year's eve... why did we even start?). I'll just throw out very much not curated thoughts I had while reading up to like page... 16?
I'll catch up with the rest later.
geript is sort of scummy in some respects. I have no idea why 20 minutes into the game he started wishing for random people to be there to talk to him. Also, everything he says is sort of... too clean? not dumb enough? I don't know how to describe it and it's just a feeling based on memory, I haven't gone back and re-read, so I'd need to confirm.
Eden came off strong and he said something I thought was really dumb.
DrH is probably town, and he had a post that made me feel good about that read.
Damdred is probably town too. He too has a post I can't remember that made me think "oh that looks like a townie".
Koshi overreacting on this page (21) to DrH's dismissal of koshi's defense was kinda mafia. Idk though.
I should probably just sheep marv and lynch him if he's wrong. That's always a fine strategy.
Remember, these reads I'm just throwing out literally from memory of having read like 4-6 pages this morning. Don't pretend these are some concrete observations.
Then he tunnels geript for a bit and does nothing I really like.
This post seems more likely to come from scum at the start of the game also, just because scum are more likely to feel demotivated early in my experience, conversely a townie who believes he has caught scum is much less likely to feel demotivated.
On January 02 2015 20:37 Palmar wrote: I'm really demotivated to even play now. Probably gonna just afk through the night and see if I turn up dead or not.
If I am alive I might just park my vote on Robik out of spite and never change it for playing terribly.
You have to read in context.
I wanted to lynch geript. I got a wagon going on geript, when I went to sleep geript was the leading candidate for a lynch. However when I woke up town had voteswitched on to batsnacks (and not Vivax as I had suggested) and killed him. This led me to being extremely frustrated as I didn't even know people were considering batsnacks as a lynch target and I had read batsnacks as town.
Cool, so why were your first large posts on day one such wishy-washy inconclusive garbage when you are known for having strong day ones and I personally think you are an excellent player?
What benefit did you wish to gain by creating that list post? why did you call DrH probably town?
They're not inconclusive garbage. In fact, me hedging half my calls with wording like "very slight leaning town read" is probably the biggest tell that I am town this game.
However I also wouldn't expect just about anyone to understand that.
It's basically me trying not to be wrong, or if I am wrong have something to point to "hey look, I told you I just called him town for this small thing, not my fault he didn't end up being town". If I was mafia I'd be far more confident in my reads, or so I think, at least.
And the list post was basically me trying to do useful stuff. I decided to punch in what I was thinking at that point in the game.
and I already explained why I called DrH town.
this post is reasonable. I can't remember who it was but there was a game recently where someone made this long, terrible case on me, quoting a bunch of posts where i'm umming and ahhing.
Because it's 100% true, it's a very reasonable post by me, and marv takes it as such. The only sort-of-weird thing is that DP was much quicker to pick up on how amazing that post was than marv, which might mean marv was parroting him, might mean MARV NOT READ SO GOOD TAKE TIME, or maybe he just wasn't around.
But yeah, I see no scenario, even if I'm cop checked green that I'm leading a lynch on marv today. I think, by far, the best target is Damdred, and I have to read Vivax and LM. I keep forgetting LM actually exists, which sometimes means people are mafia.
I'm curious how you have an opinion on Damdred but not on Lazer, whom Damdred has been talking about ever since Superbia died.
I tend to not make associative reads. I dislike them in general although I do somewhat use them sometimes. Damdred has been talking about LAzer since day 1 actually, he wanted to kill him I think.
Also, I could be wrong about Damdred.
The point is, in order to have a read on Lazer, I'll have to go read HIS filter, not Damdred's. I'll try to do it this cycle, but probably not until tomorrow in real time.
On January 13 2015 00:25 Palmar wrote: Because the closest thing in the thread to an actual accusation, I'm just going to respond to Artanis' poem. Also, he's one of the people I want most to actually talk to, because he's basically stayed away from me throughout the game (it feels like, at least, I've interacted with vivax, gb, marv, sl etc, but him I've sorta never talked to).
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Your case on GB was most curious
Don't know what you mean by curious. It's super townie if you know how brains work. If I am mafia, I already know GB's alignment, so why would I bother with the whole "start out piling some scum points on him, pretend to read more, then completely flip my conclusion and call him town".
Like I'm not good enough at scum to do that. Now obviously you can argue this, but I'd think that because I have perfect information as mafia, I wouldn't have bothered with the whole changing my mind in the middle of the post/filter read. I think I'd rather have tried to strengthen whichever conclusion I wanted to reach by mostly citing examples pointing in that one direction.
Stopping mid-filter when I feel confident he's town after questioning some of his early stuff, is something not many mafia would do.
I've expanded on this in an earlier post. It feels to me like you arbitrarily decided he was town halfway through the case when you couldn't find enough to incriminate him with a fairly meaningless post in "I suspect half the players". I find it hard to imagine that you find it hard to imagine for a scum player to say it as much as to go from scumreading to townreading someone, especially after you criticized him for creating a fake tone earlier. After that you suddenly view his posts in a townie light and do a decent job at that, which I suspect is because you know his alignment. I don't doubt that it could be forged.
Obviously we're going to disagree on this one.
Here's the thing, I am trying to explain what I did when I went for GB. I sort of admit I actually went into his filter, or shortly after reading the first few posts (which I criticized) expecting to find mafia. Then I basically ran into post after post where I actually thought he looked really town.
Like I _think_ I am not capable of faking this kind of a 180 mid-filter. Maybe I am, but why bother with the scum-stuff to begin with. Like at this point of the game, he's a vaguely viable lynch target later.
Also, just for later days, if you end up lynching me. After I posted my "gb is town" thing, he said something like "the buddying is real", which basically confirms him as town. He is always going to flip town this game.
Obviously if you're scum you want as many potential lynch targets as you can which would explain starting with trying to paint him off scummy. Reading through his filter, you figured TownPalmar would not be able to justify scumreading him so you changed your intent to look townie instead.
As for GB always being town, that depends. If you're scum, I agree. If you're town however, I can see a scum GB being cheeky and making comments like that. With how often he's done it this game it could definitely be a deliberate strategy.
So you believe that
a) I read his filter attentively b) I actually changed my mind
On January 05 2015 09:17 Damdred wrote: Lynch superbia the anger at the cop claim is so bad do it vote him
Actually I hadn't seen this post, just like with GB I stopped a few pages into his filter when I had what I felt like a conclusion.
This makes me doubt my Damdred read because I noticed exactly the same thing.
On January 08 2015 04:58 Palmar wrote: Like I was wrong on geript. I'm partly mad at myself being wrong because I read him again and there were definitely signs that he was town that I ignored. I'm also partly mad at geript for being completely shit when about to be lynched. Like I had more respect for him as a player than to think he'd go down without giving us something to work with.
IMO it's the responsibility of people who are being targeted for a lynch to step up and actually do things. Because it reveals the reasons people are on their wagons, and can often help filter townies from mafia on town wagons.
So after I got him lynched I seriously lost most of my motivation for the game. I feel like I have no dots to connect and that I'm lynching blindly into a bunch of people that could possibly be mafia. Hell even my two townreads from day 1, artanis and drh, now feel like they could very well be mafia.
The lynch today is probably either gb or ritoky (please don't lynch sicklucker, there's just less chance he does something like he did as mafia. Like I don't think he's gutsy enough to do the whole claiming shenanigans as mafia). Both of them could be mafia, and I'm sure on neither. I don't even know which one to go after.
If marv is mafia, which I highly suspect, based on that one post he made in the night, then that doesn't even say much, because with both these targets, marv has soft pushed them and then not done anything with it (ritoky on day 1 and gb on day 2). JAT was about the only player this game I sort of enjoyed interacting with, but that's probably more on me than anyone else. Well I guess I like Vivax too.
If Vivax is mafia I'll just applaud the effort. I've liked a bunch of stuff he has posted.
I've also ignored laz0r because of the sicklucker thing on day 2 and I just haven't had the cares to catch up on him. I probably should.
Someone in this game got really mad at something at some point that I thought was really strange. It might have been superbia, but idk. Maybe we should lynch him? What happened to people wanting to lynch superbia?
On January 13 2015 01:04 marvellosity wrote: Palmar do you understand how your play this game hasn't really fitted into either your usual town or mafia frameworks?
Yes, sort of.
In fact, on the surface there is one trait that (can be reasonably explained) that should make me 100% mafia this game by a certain metric I know you use.
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: And your case against Damdred dubious
What do you think of Damdred?
Do you disagree that he's played this game very much in the background? He's not taken any kind of a leadership role in town and even now, with just a handful of players remaining, almost nothing he has written really stands out.
Sure, voting superbia on day 2 builds the case for him being town somewhat (also, remember, I didn't know superbia was mafia when I wrote my stuff on Damdred, as he hadn't flipped). But it all depends on whether or not we think superbia actually had a real chance to die that day. Also, I cba checking, but was geript firmly in the lead? or was Vivax right there? We may have to check that.
I think you're right in that he's mostly been in the background. He's been a question mark for me most of the game. He played a good Day 1 where he drew conclusions (albeit the wrong ones initially, town on ritoky/scum on Dr.H), asked a lot of questions and seemed to be on the hunt for information. On Day 2 he was on the right lynch as well but he hasn't been very impactful, no, and that leaves him in the question mark area. He was the second person to get on Superbia after me when there was no idea if it was going to take off or not.
The reason he's a question mark for you and literally everyone else in the game,is that Damdred hasn't said or done anything of value throughout the game.
Asking questions with no intention of followup isn't at all townie.
Like Marv said, he's pushed Superbia on D2 and he's been pushing LM ever since. Speaking of which, I'd still like to hear your opinion on LM. I'd also like examples of questions from Damdred that you feel were pointless or without followup.
I need to read LM's filter.
The examples of Damdred's weird questions were in my big post on him. Do you really need me to dig it up for you?
On January 12 2015 23:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote: You helped lynch Geript, a member of our town
So what? Being wrong on my first target happens all the time. Weren't you on his wagon too? I made a case, I believed in it, geript's non-response made me want to go through with it.
Do you doubt that I believed geript was mafia? Or at least he had a good chance of being one?
Of course I doubt it, because I think there's a good chance you're scum. I was on the wagon reluctantly because I felt he was a better lynch than Vivax and it looked like Superbia wasn't going to get lynched when I went to bed.
Chicken and egg bro.
If you decide I'm mafia and then look at my actions through that lens, we're gonna have a bad time.
You should first go read my push on geript, responses to it etc, and THEN you should decide if I am mafia because of it. You cannot scumhunt backwards. That's called guessing.
I always feel like there's two narratives for every person; a Town narrative and a Scum narrative. If you try hard enough either can fit. The problem is that with your filter and approach to the game I feel a scum narrative is more likely to be the case. I'm trying out both lenses but to confront you with the town narrative for your actions wouldn't really help establish my read on you any better.
Well fine, as long as you actually accept my answers and reconsider if now maybe the town narrative fits.
On January 13 2015 01:04 marvellosity wrote: Palmar do you understand how your play this game hasn't really fitted into either your usual town or mafia frameworks?
Yes, sort of.
In fact, on the surface there is one trait that (can be reasonably explained) that should make me 100% mafia this game by a certain metric I know you use.
Like this is almost fun.
Here's a hint: I actually give hardly any fucks this game.
On March 27 2014 08:11 marvellosity wrote: Mainly Palmar is not playing the game at all. He has 6 pages of filter, but he's literally not playing. The big problem is that he is pretending to play. You'll find quotes littered from me across various games giving 3 scenarios for Palmar:
1) he tries hard and he is productive. He is town. 2) he blatantly doesn't give a shit and doesn't hide the fact he is not productive. He is town. 3) he looks like he's playing the game a bit but in reality is unproductive. He is mafia.
On January 13 2015 01:04 marvellosity wrote: Palmar do you understand how your play this game hasn't really fitted into either your usual town or mafia frameworks?
Yes, sort of.
In fact, on the surface there is one trait that (can be reasonably explained) that should make me 100% mafia this game by a certain metric I know you use.
Like this is almost fun.
Here's a hint: I actually give hardly any fucks this game.
yup, and that's the townside.
it's the half-hearted, intermittent giving of fucks that is more the issue. oddly to anyone else i guess.
Yeah, I get that.
Now the big question is, can you actually figure out why this might be?
On January 13 2015 00:19 sicklucker wrote: Ok palmer and its a big one. In a 366 page game not one post you made has helped us find scum. This makes you scum
1st of all, read my filter. There's a ton of reads in there. And I got geript lynched.
I mean, he turned out to be town, but at least I did something. What have you done?
you know... identified pushed all game and got two mafia lynched?
ritoky got himself lynched.
But ok, maybe I'm mostly ignoring your posts. I thought it was robik who got superbia lynched.
The bolded sentence is a troll thing Artanis. I did the same thing with JAT and some other people on night 1. Basically terrible associative bus/tmi scenarios.
On January 13 2015 01:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Also has anyone seen Kelsier? He's been remarkably absent since everyone townread him.
I had been calling him a mafia for a while. He made a case on geript on day 1 (pfft.... what a baddie) and felt like he was sort of under the radar.
But also, he did do that weird "well out your checks then" thing with ritoky. It seems to me no mafia would ever do that knowing his partner was about to claim, because people might think "hey that was planned".
On January 13 2015 01:41 sicklucker wrote: I actually town read ritoky early day one but when super afk voted ritoky as a useless vote I knew they were both mafia right away and tried to get them lynched all game. This is why im town vivax/ gb
If im there mafia partner I NEVER EVER EVER point out their obvious bad bus.
On January 06 2015 00:44 Damdred wrote: Ok just caught up and woke up,
I am upset at you SL, if you are trying to draw a bullet you do not unclaim during the night you let the medic make the wifom decision. I'll talk more about this tomorrow if it comes up.
I'll be honest though I really hate it how vivax and LM hard defended super during the eod, i'm not really sure why you shouldn't be ok to lynch super. Kels reasoning I think made sense to me, he didn't hard defend super.
Because of this post, if super is mafia, you are too.
Also I'm honestly going to just chill. There is literally no one being not bad in this town at the moment. Everyone has either lynched townies, or failed to push alternative lynches.
This means mafia has no idea whom to shoot tonight, because the doc save is guaranteed. So I guess I'll just see who they shoot, and figure the game out tomorrow. I may start reading tonight, but I'm not going to conclude much for now.
Why did you arrive at this conclusion?
Damdred is asking a lot of "clarifying" questions, you're right, and that along with his opposite reads on Dr.H and Ritoky does point to scum. However he did hop on the Superbia lynch over two town wagons and did not stray which I feel offsets it a bit. I also like how he's gone after Lazer. However I just decided to go look at an older game. His most recent scumgame according to the database was Fantasy Football 2 and towngame Russian Today. I believe I've heard before that Damdred doesn't engage his scum suspects when he's scum. In this game he has, so I wanted to collaborate that.
First thing I notice in his scumgame is this:
On October 23 2014 10:46 Damdred wrote: God thank you, I hated rolling scum in the game that just finished. Damdred totes town
Joking about being town. The opposite and yet similar to what he did this game. Not sure what it means but it could be significant.
In the game, he engages a few of his suspects at the start but then basically only starts conversing with GlowingBear and makes random oneliners here and there. In this game, he looks more engaged with a variety of other people rather than the narrow focus he had in FF.
So, Russian Today:
On November 28 2014 08:18 Damdred wrote: Hey guys I'm town with great success.
I'm finishing up this service at work so I'm going to be catching up on break and posting thoughts
Starts the other game with a joke about his alignment as well. Guess it has no significance after all.
In Russian today he's a lot more insightful, engages a lot of people in discussion. In the Towngame he also asks a few seemingly silly questions, but that's hard to check since that'd require going through the thread and seeing if it makes sense and I aint got time for that.
This game he looks more like Russian Today so I'm going to go with Damdred being town this game.
This isn't true Artanis. Damdreds play in this game fits his scum meta. He is asking questions without clear intentions. His thoughts aren't well exposed in the thread. He just asks questions and let those answers drown in the thread.
I read him more as null because he did things that looked townie, although I don't remember exactly what they were. There was a post of him that he asked people to give thoughts on when he got ignored, which I thought was townie.
Reading through his filter in the Russian Today game he looked like he had a bunch of random questions without much purpose either. They seem to be rhetorical rather than clarifying in nature though. A few examples:
On November 30 2014 03:10 Damdred wrote:
On November 30 2014 03:08 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Elvis's completely different playstyle Reads on ezlynch players Getting bailed out at the last moment
You're cum and I know it
So my scum team is all the people who swiched to gb at the last minute?
On November 30 2014 03:29 Damdred wrote:
On November 30 2014 03:28 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
On November 30 2014 03:23 Damdred wrote:
On November 30 2014 03:21 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
On November 30 2014 03:20 Damdred wrote:
On November 30 2014 03:17 [UoN]Sentinel wrote:
On November 30 2014 03:10 Damdred wrote: [quote]
So my scum team is all the people who swiched to gb at the last minute?
No, just JAT
I see, to be truthful i was surprised people swiched off me and onto GB at the last second.
My list of scummy people is debatable, if someone does something scummy though shouldn't you scum read them even if they are an easy lynch?
I can't comment on elvis part
It ain't scummy, it just has the appearance of being so
So you don't think sno is acting scummy?
I was talking about your reasoning on me
I had more than one scum read and you made a general statement so you say you are just making these statements from OMGUS?
On November 30 2014 08:13 Damdred wrote:
On November 30 2014 08:11 justanothertownie wrote:
On November 30 2014 08:11 marvellosity wrote: if people can read that set of quotes and tell me damdred is town, i am all ears
that's all i care about now
If he flips scum can we finally lynch HF then?
When i flip town what then?
Hm.
The thing is that he doesn't do anything with those questions. There is a pattern on damdreds play which is clearly trying to solve the game. He gathers information and post a long post trying to solve it. I don't see it here. Specially late game, I don't think he is one to be so passive like he is now.
The problem with Damdred being scum is that it'd probably mean that Lazer is town and I find that a really difficult world to imagine.
Also, Palmar, why is Chez in your potential scum candidates? Did you miss this?
On January 12 2015 09:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote: DP check these posts by Chyz, two of the last posts he made before ragequitting the game. + Show Spoiler +
On January 02 2015 07:45 TheChyz wrote: Ok I'm back and refreshed a bit cause I think I was getting too emotionally invested for my own health.
Anyways I still think we should lynch laser over geript. If anything we can just have geript lynched day 2 if he still continues to play the way he is, but it really seems like it is more out of not being too invested in the game. I still think geript is scummy but not as much as laser.
On December 31 2014 17:06 TheChyz wrote: Hello all.
Currently I don't like the direction that dr.H and ritoky are going. Basically I just see it as dr.H doing something not alignment indicative (someone always talks about policy lynches :/ ) and now ritoky is just trying to either prove that dr.H is scum or (my most probably guess) is he just wants to get an early acknowledgement of dominance by trying to force dr.H into admitting he did not follow his own policy (which most people don't follow anyway). I don't see a reason why ritoky would push this so far without any agenda.
@ritoky lets move onto something a bit more important than trying to prove your dick is bigger than dr.H's. If there is anything substantial you have then go ahead, but currently your just being more of a filter spammer than anything.
Chyz doesn't follow up with anything at all untill he is called out. Why is it that he the first thing that he felt he had to post was that people was on the wrong track, instead of actually trying give some of his own opinion? This is scum mentality.
On January 01 2015 00:50 Lazermonkey wrote: Its not necesarily wrong with making a post saying that a discussion is stupid. The problem is when the only post you have is a post calling a discussion stupid. Why is it, after all the of the discussion and multiple people calling out rikoty, that all Chyz did was saying that the discussion was stupid? Just like Artanis said, why say "do something usefull" and proceed to do nothing yourself?
Granted, he did put up some reads later but only after he was called out.
Don't you think there is a scum motive in trying to look active while not really pushing the thread forward? Because I would argue that is what Chyz did.
Show me a game in which Chyz is a townleader.
My read on Chyz is not based on meta. I have never played nor read one of his games. Is this how he normaly plays as town you think?
2 people were doing something that nobody so far found useful for 20 posts in a row. 1 guy said to those 2 people to stop their shitposting and asks on of them to do something useful in 1 post.
The 1 guy gets crap for doing not more pro-towns things in his 1 post and the 2 people who made 20 shitpost together are not discussed.
---
I don't get it. Is it meta? Scum generally do exactly 1 protown thing in their post?
I get that TheChyz could have also done more digging himself, create more content, actively question people and look for scum. But unless he has a meta for doing those things, I am already content with him doing the 1 thing. It's more than others.
And like you said, he did scumhunting after that. It doesn't matter that people had to ask him for it. It is important that he did it, and I don't see you commenting on the value of those posts. You just say: "He did scumhunting because he was asked for it, so it doesn't count".
The reason I asked if you knew his meta was because you dismissed my by implying that unless you generally act as a townleader, stuff like this isn't scummy. I disagree.
Saying to two people that they should stop arguing over stupid shit is protown. But it is very non-commital. Its okay to do stuff like that as long as you are pushing scum as well. But Chyz wasn't hunting scum, not untill people called him out for not hunting scum.
It does not matter if he scumhunted after he was called out. If you are town and get called out for that, you scum hunt because it helps town. If you are scum, you scum hunt to avoid suspicion. The fact that he started scum hunt after he got called out for it IS not alignment indicative.
I feel what is relevant here is what his motive was. Its clear that he was reading the thread, its clear that he wrote a post, its clear that he didn't care to post any reads untill he got called out for it. What alignment does these action make sense from?
So first he says it is scum mentality for doing all of this and then proceeds to say that what I did is NOT ALIGNMENT INDICATIVE and that the real problem is my motive? Unless you know what my motive is that is a HUGE jump to conclusions off of my first post. During this time in the thread people liked jumping on me and as such laser seems to be trying to find different angles to attack me from. More on this jumping onto the hype train later on.
On January 01 2015 02:30 Lazermonkey wrote: Soo, about the 3 "protagonists"
Eden - Attacked DH for his policy-post. While I agree with his points about policy-lynching, it felt wierd (as some others pointed out) that he called DHs post "stiff and akward timed" while still saying he was town and yet ends up saying DH is town. Not reading to much into this though, as I felt he explained himself well later on regarding the DH-post. His interactions with DH seems possible both from town and scum. He attacks Chyz which is nice though.
DH - Got discussion going early on, posted alot (even though some of it was pretty bad). Not lynching today.
rik - tunneled the shit out of DH, didn't post much else. Tunneling is really non-alignment indicative. I'm null on him.
So this is super wishy washy to me. Not really attacking anybody or defending anybody (which is ok) but literally it sounds like im just reading a synopsis of what happened in the thread. Seems like someone not having reads but making some in order to look pro town (yes u can say im hypocrite, but I think i have given a few okish cases, kk?).
On January 01 2015 02:30 Lazermonkey wrote: Soo, about the 3 "protagonists"
Eden - Attacked DH for his policy-post. While I agree with his points about policy-lynching, it felt wierd (as some others pointed out) that he called DHs post "stiff and akward timed" while still saying he was town and yet ends up saying DH is town. Not reading to much into this though, as I felt he explained himself well later on regarding the DH-post. His interactions with DH seems possible both from town and scum. He attacks Chyz which is nice though.
DH - Got discussion going early on, posted alot (even though some of it was pretty bad). Not lynching today.
rik - tunneled the shit out of DH, didn't post much else. Tunneling is really non-alignment indicative. I'm null on him.
Your eden post has no real conclusion, are you reading them scum null or town? This read feels a bit fabricated to me
I'm not sure what to make of your DH read, what was so bad that he posted to you? Why would you not lynch someone today just because they posted a lot even if a lot of it was bad to you?
Rit got discussion going also the same as DH and posted a good bit but you don't give him the same pass? Why?
Overall this reads pretty fabricated and scummy to me
We are halfway in D1. The Eden and Rit reads are very inconclusive because they've said very little of value this far. DH got the discussion going more than Rit did (that is my impression at least). Compare their filters.
I won't argue that drh has a bigger filter than ritoky, because its obviously the truth. At the time of your reads you had their argument and drh pushing his scum read.
However I disagree that Eden and rit have said little of value a lot of discussion has happened around them so you should be able to take a stance. Hell your Eden read seems like a scum read without you saying that they are scum
Well, if your argument is "you should be able to pick a more clear stance" I cannot argue against it. I don't feel like making up a read on any of them just to please you. Also, my read on Eden is not a scum read. He is null.
Hmm, seems contradictory to a something a few posts ago. Really looks like trying not to give a real read and offer little to the town.
On January 01 2015 03:57 Lazermonkey wrote: I dislike Koshi this far. Not only does his reads seem pretty off but he doesn't push geript one single bit, despite the fact that he is voting greipt. If you are town and think someone is scum but noone else is voting that person, you push that person. Koshi is not doing that.
I have to go now, will be able to post more tomorrow.
Same complaint that people use on me can be applied here. Says something, but has no point other than having something to make it seem like he is contributing to town.
On January 01 2015 23:57 Lazermonkey wrote: Hi again.
I realize that I kinda sucked yesterday. Got way to tunnely on Chyz. I will try to reread some things and reevaluate my thoughts as best as I can.
As for the "case" on me, I think its pretty weak + I will have some time to post today so I don't fear too much for my death. Won't really bother to defend myself right now but I'd rather focus on trying to get a hang on the game and figure out who I think is the best lynch!
Like i've said before, this is reading super "I'm sorry for doing what I did yesterday, forget about it and I will be town today. Lets lynch scum. GO TEAM GO". BLEH, try to hide more?
On January 02 2015 01:06 Lazermonkey wrote: I'm posting my thoughts as I go.
I said yesterday that I dislike Koshi. After looking at his filter, I still think he looks bad. He didn't post much since yesterday evening so most of this is simply rehashing.
1. (Palmar was already touching on this but I think its a strong point which is worth repeating) Koshi was very very eager to defend Chyz in the early game. I'm not making any preflip associations here, but just by looking at his filter you can see how much time he spends on defending Chyz. This makes it looks like he is making alot of contributions (which in a sense he is) but he is in no way doing alot of scum hunting. Why is it that Koshi felt the ned to defend Chyz so hard in the first half of D1?
2. Not pushing geript despite voting him.
3. Afraid to actually call people scum. Instead saying things like "Your excuses come over scummy". Why not say YOU look scummy? Trying to set up a vote if possible, yet not pushing the lynch or having me against him as much as he could have.
So this is pretty interesting. Seems like he is trying to push koshi a little but still not commiting. I don't have anything to add other than laser described himself perfectly in his 3rd point about koshi.
Next immediately he forgets about koshi and goes onto geript. The only time before that he talked about geript is that he is slightly towny to him. So from going to leaning towny to super fine with lynching is a pretty big jump and his points he brings up don't merit that much of a jump. So what happened is koshi stuff died off a bit and then geript train was just starting. This would be a great vote for him if geript gets lynched because he was one of the first few but not the lynch starter so it seems like hes just trying to put himself in a good position if geript gets lynched.
On January 02 2015 02:04 Lazermonkey wrote: As for rikoty, I think he is mildly suspicious but not lynch worthy. He didn't really do anything but tunnel DH yesterday for a pretty retarded reason. By doing this, he essentially avoided talking about most other things. Making a massive list of all his reads is not bad, but with no follow up this isn't really helping us in any way.
I think he could be a potential candidate for lynch D2 though.
"I looked at him, not lynch worthy, but lynch tmrw is ok". Seems like he is trying to give rikoty a free pass to live another day...............!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Also following the general town wagon because rikoty not doing so hot so this gets him + town points.
On January 02 2015 02:46 Lazermonkey wrote: I'm having doubts about Chyz as well. I do think his play is bad and I don't agree with almost anything he has said this fair. But I'm not sure that makes him scum. He could just as well be bad town. I don't disagree with your case DH in the sense that I think all of Chyz plays are wierd and/or bad but can you explain his actions from a scum PoV? If something doesn't make sense from a town PoV but also doesn't make sense as scum, I don't think its a good reason to lynch someone for.
Granted, I would not be super sad if Chyz got lynched today. I do think he is a better lynch than say Robik. But I think geript is a much better lynch for today.
##Unvote ##Vote: geript
So he drops his accusation on me (remember, at this point only dr.H was on my ass, everybody was mostly like, meh about me). Again super bandwagony. And up to this point his only real reads that I have seen that aren't rehashed stuff is a little on koshi (which also applies to him) so basically garbage.
On January 02 2015 02:07 Lazermonkey wrote: Lynching Marv is a terrible idea btw.
Elaborate.
Basically what Artanis said.
marv will be posting more on D2 no matter what alignment he is. We will be able to judge him better at that point. If he sucks then, sure I can kill him. To kill the strongest player because he is inactive D1, when there are legitimate reasons to be inactive, is hardly worth it.
Besides, even if your really think he is a good target, do you really believe he is the BEST target?
If marv is scum he will probably be happy to even survive day1.
On January 02 2015 02:23 justanothertownie wrote: You didn't even give a read on marv.
I'm not super impressed by marvs play this fair but TBH I don't have a strong read on him nor do I prioritize getting a better read on him atm. My point still stands though, I'm not willing to kill the strongest player because he is playing bad/is inactive D1.
I once thought so too but this logic is actually retarded. If he is the strongest player he may aswell show us that he is town.
So you would rather kill someone for not playing the game the way you want it to be played than to actually kill the most likely scum? Besides, if you really think marv is playing that bad does it make him more scum? It doesn't make sense for scum marv to suck so I feel this is a flawed argument.
Marvs towngame is to play well and very active. Marvs scumgame is to not do jackshit. What do you think he is doing this game?
o.O really? I've never played with scum marv. I guess that makes your argument more valid.
Still, do you think he is the BEST lynch for today?
So from going from, "I'm not lynching till day 2 cause marv is a strong player and I don't have a read on him or is playing bad" into, "well people are talking about marv, might aswell seem interested now".
And finally after getting his points for being suspicious of marv he goes back to saying that geript is the best lynch so far. Again this is all unoriginal and is just following w/e the thread seems to be heading towards. I have not seen him give a good reason why he thinks geript is scummy and he just follows the threads flow.
Not doing any scum hunting and when does they are pretty weak cases. Always seems to agree with the general tone of the thread and never has anything useful to add. Just lurking on through while still pretending to be "active". Overall I think he is a better lynch the geript and I think people should at least look more indepth on him. Also I have a feeling the ritoky and him are buddied scum.
Sorry for long post, I know how you guys hate it but I really think laser is the best lynch today.
On January 02 2015 08:47 TheChyz wrote: ya im done, this game has been such a mispleasure to play. Thanks dr.H, great game played by you. Best town player by far. You caught the scum. Here are my current notes btw.
koshi - too good at defending me and making no other good reads. hasnt really contributed anything to town. scummy glowingbear - nada, not good sign geript - null to scum. Started fine but I expected more. Not leading town like I remember. Kinda just lurking but still in thread. Still nothing really. Expected more and his scum read on keslier is wtf? Scummy Artanis[XP] - somegood reads, some terrible ones. still making them and pushing them alright imo. towny. lazermonkey - bandwagoned onto me. made garbage about other people. need actual reads and not garbage at this point in the game. Tries to apologize, every post he makes makes him seem worse and worse. Tries to cover up his tracks. scummy marvellositty - apparently this great player but nada? something doesn't feel right. but terrible start can be excuse? slightly scummy justanothertownie - bothers me with some posts but I can kinda feel his train of thought. leaning townny Iamrobik - doesn't do anything but still in thread? weird. lazy. scummy theChyz - SUPER TOWN palmar - Keeps thread in good direction. If anything only look at day 3 since anything helping town (even if in wrong direction) is not worth a thought of lynching. town damdred - nothing jumps out, feels way too much of doing nothing for my taste, null to slightly scummy batsnacks - kinda weird play. posts sometimes good info, and then shit later. null sicklucker - I don't really like any of his reads hes making and they all seem kinda out in left field. scummy-ish vivax - don't like atm, not enough but just his posts are pretty off. scummy but weak at best kelsierSC - seems to be steering the town whenever he talks, pretty clear train of thought. slightly town. I like him more now, just seems to keep towny vibe. town ritoky - garbage opener, nothing since. garbage large post for no reason and terrible reads. scum Dr.H - rode me hard but kinda like how I did when town. Town. Big d bag tho. Eden1892 - nothing really sticks out too much, need to read closer, null. Also kinda just lurking around but does bring up good points every so ofter, towny. RebirthOfLegend - nada, not good sign Superbia - nada, not good sign
scum list if I had to pick: -lazermonkey -ritoky -geript -koshi -a lurker/sicklucker/damdred
##Vote: TheChyz
Do you find it reasonable to believe that a scumplayer would actually ragequit like this? The slot is pretty much confirmed town imo.
It's unlikely, and I think I even defended him on day 1.
But it's been a long time since day 1. I can't say with any sort of conviction he's town.
On January 13 2015 01:55 sicklucker wrote: Hum I think we kill lm first if palmer survives his sentencing I think that gives us the most information and he probably totally slipped on d2 and we shoulda lynched him then.
On January 12 2015 04:50 Lazermonkey wrote: Too many things about GB are pointing towards GB being scum atm I feel. There is no "SUPER SCUM MOVE" he has done but the at this point of the game I would expect scum to:
- not pushing superbia hard D1 and D2 (GB didn't do that)
- defend superbia (GB did that)
- vote ritoky over superbia (GB did that)
- Not having alot of strong town reads right now (GB doesn't have that)
This coupled with the fact that there aren't even that many people that could potentially be scum at this point (PoE basically) makes it very very likely that GB is scum.
##Vote: GlowingBear
I basically did all those things too.. well I didn't defend superbia more so than I called other lynches better.
1) Palmar I really asked you to check out some things I wrote at points and give your opinions and you never did that even though you said you would. And then i repeatedly asked you to check my filter and how much have you read and you never responded and you made your entire case based on a couple of pages? I understand its a big game and stuff gets lost but come on man.
On January 13 2015 02:30 Lazermonkey wrote: I really think we should kill GB btw. Reposting this (EDITED the misstake in the post).
On January 12 2015 04:50 Lazermonkey wrote: Too many things about GB are pointing towards GB being scum atm I feel. There is no "SUPER SCUM MOVE" he has done but the at this point of the game I would expect scum to:
- not pushing superbia hard D1 and D2 (GB didn't do that)
- defend superbia (GB did that)
- vote ritoky over superbia (GB did that)
- Not having alot of strong town reads right now (GB doesn't have that)
This coupled with the fact that there aren't even that many people that could potentially be scum at this point (PoE basically) makes it very very likely that GB is scum.
##Vote: GlowingBear
I basically did all those things too.. well I didn't defend superbia more so than I called other lynches better.
Although I have a few townreads.
Still, I think this is a shitty reason.
Why are they shitty?
Also, what do you think of GBs play these last 2 pages?
On January 13 2015 05:25 GlowingBear wrote: Palmar, would you lynch marv? Palmar, would you lynch Artanis?
maybe no
I am still undecided on marv. Once again I feel like he's taking no leadership role.
Also, I feel he's still being way too wishy washy on my alignment. After our interaction today he basically said "there is a chance you're town". He should honestly have shut down all talk of lynching me. Hell, he knows I would be lobbying so hard to kill him if I'm mafia and he's town.
But, he also makes much more sense than half of you morons all the time.
Btw, I'm calling it now, some smartass is going to post in the postgame "WTF U MORONS MARV ALIVE DAY 4 MUST LYNCH!!!!!111" if marv is mafia.
I am going to find that guy, and punch him in the face.
1) Palmar I really asked you to check out some things I wrote at points and give your opinions and you never did that even though you said you would. And then i repeatedly asked you to check my filter and how much have you read and you never responded and you made your entire case based on a couple of pages? I understand its a big game and stuff gets lost but come on man.
Am I mafia because of this?
No you would be termed lazy because of this. I would call you scrum mainly because you are somewhere between trying d1 and not caring, besides ads few moments.
Like a weird 6 on the ten scale you use.
I told marv, and I expect you to trust me on this.
There is a reason for this that I'll explain later. (postgame). I am not mafia here because of this. If you think I'm mafia, use other reasons. This one is not valid.
The reason I say this is I'm waffling super hard on LM at the moment. posts like this:
On January 13 2015 02:46 Lazermonkey wrote: SL, I'm getting kinda pissed of about you. I think you are probably town but you continue to make shit arguments for thinking I am scum.
Its like you already decided D1/D2 what alignment I was, and then whatever I am saying you are twisting it in the most ridiculous ways to make it fit your theory that I am scum.
If you really care about winning my game, try read my filter. Try this time to think that I might be town, instead of assuming that all my actions are from a scum PoV. If you still think I'm scum after that, fine. But read it first.
Look really town to me. Because he is inherently appealing to the strengths of his own filter, which people tend to be less likely to do when they know the filter is written by mafia.
On January 13 2015 01:55 marvellosity wrote: I actually expect more from Chez than what he's given us if he's town, but the town-allure from the Chyz ragequit is quite strong.
I has the perfects mafia lynching record! I even pointed out townies before they went dead townie. Plus I gotz friends!
On January 13 2015 01:56 sicklucker wrote: Chez is also my friend, and he has also said some very townie things which is hard for him to do.
But you know who was the first person to ignore me this game after replying to me like once? Vivax. Vivax ignored my comments and posts. Then mafia killed the ones who talked to me and were my friends. Then I cried out all alones. Then my friend Artanis came along and spoke with me. He the good friend. Then we lynched the bad guys together!
oh look!!! Chez has a filter link top right of this post! Oh and TheChez is not Highway 111. Highway 111 was whom the bank claimed to make checks for. Of course, bank consulted with the real cop about this. Cause, you know the bank has abilities too, they just aren't as knowns. I R series. check the filter!
PS: It's funny people rather judge a chez based on a chyz instead of chez. You should judge chez based on chez cause almost everbodies has more xp with chez than chyz. Am I brown?
On January 13 2015 05:25 GlowingBear wrote: Palmar, would you lynch marv? Palmar, would you lynch Artanis?
maybe no
I am still undecided on marv. Once again I feel like he's taking no leadership role.
Also, I feel he's still being way too wishy washy on my alignment. After our interaction today he basically said "there is a chance you're town". He should honestly have shut down all talk of lynching me. Hell, he knows I would be lobbying so hard to kill him if I'm mafia and he's town.
But, he also makes much more sense than half of you morons all the time.
Btw, I'm calling it now, some smartass is going to post in the postgame "WTF U MORONS MARV ALIVE DAY 4 MUST LYNCH!!!!!111" if marv is mafia.
I am going to find that guy, and punch him in the face.
Consider this a warning.
don't overstate your play this day. I should not have shut down the talk of lynching you, and it's bad that you're saying so
No it isn't. I've been so reasonable.
What do you think about LM and the quote I mentioned being townie?
On January 13 2015 06:28 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Palmar why did the JAT post make me town?
Because it looked like you really wanted to lynch Superbia even with the joking framework.
Like exactly the opposite of what a bus would (probably) look like.
Basically if Superbia gets lynched and this is your vote post, you can claim very little credit compared to if you made a case you already knew was right.
On January 13 2015 07:31 Damdred wrote: Ok i'm on a computer now finally.
I really don't like being tunneled, i've begged you to actually read my filter Palmar and you just wont' do it.
This is not true, I had no opinion on you until I read your filter.
Would you yourself characterize any parts of your play, especially from day 1 and 2 as different from normal?
Ok let me rephrase then,
You stopped reading my filter after a couple of pages. Actually yes I was more aggressive D1 going after LM and Bats, which is something i've been striving towards. Day two I don't remember a lot of but I know I almost got super lynched if vivax would of listened to me. Not exactly sure what else would be different.
The thing is, read your own posts regarding LM
I specifically mentioned the weird phrasing. You don't _sound_ aggressive at all.
Anyway, if you are town, which I suppose is a possibility, what is your scumteam? And if you suggest I'm in it I'm not going to listen to.
like give me 2 people who you think might be mafia and why.
On January 08 2015 06:53 GlowingBear wrote: Palmar, I have read some posts from damdred that made him look townie. I think this is not a day to lynch him. But he isn't actively trying to solve the game. His thoughts aren't well explicit in the thread. He could be mafia, yes.
On January 06 2015 00:44 Damdred wrote: Ok just caught up and woke up,
I am upset at you SL, if you are trying to draw a bullet you do not unclaim during the night you let the medic make the wifom decision. I'll talk more about this tomorrow if it comes up.
I'll be honest though I really hate it how vivax and LM hard defended super during the eod, i'm not really sure why you shouldn't be ok to lynch super. Kels reasoning I think made sense to me, he didn't hard defend super.
Because of this post, if super is mafia, you are too.
Also I'm honestly going to just chill. There is literally no one being not bad in this town at the moment. Everyone has either lynched townies, or failed to push alternative lynches.
This means mafia has no idea whom to shoot tonight, because the doc save is guaranteed. So I guess I'll just see who they shoot, and figure the game out tomorrow. I may start reading tonight, but I'm not going to conclude much for now.
Why did you arrive at this conclusion?
Damdred is asking a lot of "clarifying" questions, you're right, and that along with his opposite reads on Dr.H and Ritoky does point to scum. However he did hop on the Superbia lynch over two town wagons and did not stray which I feel offsets it a bit. I also like how he's gone after Lazer. However I just decided to go look at an older game. His most recent scumgame according to the database was Fantasy Football 2 and towngame Russian Today. I believe I've heard before that Damdred doesn't engage his scum suspects when he's scum. In this game he has, so I wanted to collaborate that.
First thing I notice in his scumgame is this:
On October 23 2014 10:46 Damdred wrote: God thank you, I hated rolling scum in the game that just finished. Damdred totes town
Joking about being town. The opposite and yet similar to what he did this game. Not sure what it means but it could be significant.
In the game, he engages a few of his suspects at the start but then basically only starts conversing with GlowingBear and makes random oneliners here and there. In this game, he looks more engaged with a variety of other people rather than the narrow focus he had in FF.
So, Russian Today:
On November 28 2014 08:18 Damdred wrote: Hey guys I'm town with great success.
I'm finishing up this service at work so I'm going to be catching up on break and posting thoughts
Starts the other game with a joke about his alignment as well. Guess it has no significance after all.
In Russian today he's a lot more insightful, engages a lot of people in discussion. In the Towngame he also asks a few seemingly silly questions, but that's hard to check since that'd require going through the thread and seeing if it makes sense and I aint got time for that.
This game he looks more like Russian Today so I'm going to go with Damdred being town this game.
This isn't true Artanis. Damdreds play in this game fits his scum meta. He is asking questions without clear intentions. His thoughts aren't well exposed in the thread. He just asks questions and let those answers drown in the thread.
I read him more as null because he did things that looked townie, although I don't remember exactly what they were. There was a post of him that he asked people to give thoughts on when he got ignored, which I thought was townie.
Btw... Jesus christ what happened here?
Like he's literally calling you mafia for exactly the reasons I am, but he defended you with the same bullshit yesterday.
You think this is a genuine change of heart Damdred?
On January 13 2015 19:39 marvellosity wrote: why are you pushing silliness at me Palmar?
That's a dumb question.
Like you understand clearly what I am doing here. There's nothing silly about this at all.
If you are actually town your townreads should mostly be good.
If you are mafia, I'm trying to make you townread all the townies.
no, you're trying to put words in my mouth and suggest things, and it looks like shit.
No it doesn't, and you trying to say it looks like shit does look like shit.
what the hell does "put words in my mouth and suggest things" even mean.
I am trying to figure out who you want to call mafia. You have 4 townreads (including yourself), and you seem to think neither Ksc nor damdred should be lynched.
This severly narrows the potential pool of lynches, and since we have 3 mafia left, and you've not (in my memory) stated ou don't want to lynch 4 people in the game, that should be a fairly high shot at hitting mafia in your world.
The problem is, your world doesn't fit with mine and I don't know why.
On January 13 2015 19:39 marvellosity wrote: why are you pushing silliness at me Palmar?
That's a dumb question.
Like you understand clearly what I am doing here. There's nothing silly about this at all.
If you are actually town your townreads should mostly be good.
If you are mafia, I'm trying to make you townread all the townies.
no, you're trying to put words in my mouth and suggest things, and it looks like shit.
No it doesn't, and you trying to say it looks like shit does look like shit.
what the hell does "put words in my mouth and suggest things" even mean.
I am trying to figure out who you want to call mafia. You have 4 townreads (including yourself), and you seem to think neither Ksc nor damdred should be lynched.
This severly narrows the potential pool of lynches, and since we have 3 mafia left, and you've not (in my memory) stated ou don't want to lynch 4 people in the game, that should be a fairly high shot at hitting mafia in your world.
The problem is, your world doesn't fit with mine and I don't know why.
It means I gave you a tiered list and for some reason you're picking 2 players in the middle of it and asking me who i should lynch between them, when there are 3 mafia left. Let's even say one of Damdred/Kelsier is mafia - that wouldn't be my starting place, would it?
No the damdred/kelsier thing comes from MY world. I was basically asking if you were okay with lynching one of them.
On January 08 2015 05:27 Palmar wrote: Also I think I got from his filter that he wanted to kill sicklucker for the claim. I think that's actually a fairly town move because mafia would most likely not want to push an un-ccd cop even if that cop is being a bit of a dick with it.
so you know sl is pushing Lazer because ritoky and superbia DID push said un-cc cop?
I don't get the question.
The assumption is that mafia has no idea whether or not SL is cop. However if LM is mafia (which certainly is a possibility) mafia would've known this was a fake claim.
On January 08 2015 05:27 Palmar wrote: Also I think I got from his filter that he wanted to kill sicklucker for the claim. I think that's actually a fairly town move because mafia would most likely not want to push an un-ccd cop even if that cop is being a bit of a dick with it.
so you know sl is pushing Lazer because ritoky and superbia DID push said un-cc cop?
I don't get the question.
The assumption is that mafia has no idea whether or not SL is cop. However if LM is mafia (which certainly is a possibility) mafia would've known this was a fake claim.
the question/point -
Your contention: mafia would not want to push un-cc cop sl's reason for pushing Lazer: 2 other mafia pushed the un-cc cop
I still don't get the point?
Yes, I was wrong in my assumption that mafia would not want to push the un-ccd cop.
it could be because mafia has more balls than I thought
it could be because mafia knew the claim was fake (either lm or sl are mafia)
if SL is town, I don't think his idea is unreasonable?
On January 13 2015 20:40 marvellosity wrote: GB - do you have any towngames where you are disaffected with the progress of the game?
No. Maybe 2p2 Werewolf after some point.
I don't know what's going on, really. This is unprecedented.
But marv, you saying that I didn't bring things that makes me townie is I fair. I made a post streak of what I think are town traits in this game. It started after DP decided to push me.
On January 14 2015 00:43 sicklucker wrote: I really want to kill palmer first actually. If only so the mafia team concedes if its who I think it is. Im so evil
On January 14 2015 00:53 sicklucker wrote: Also palmer didnt push marv day 1. Right after a game where he got marv to concede day one. Mr.marv probably isint mafia tho kill the plumber!
And in no way does this make marv not mafia. Like if anyone is dumb enough to clear him if I flip before him based on me not figuring out whether or not he's scum day 1, there's gonna be punches in postgame.
On January 14 2015 05:44 GlowingBear wrote: Ok fuck palmar's response.
I think the scum team is Damdred, LM and one of Marv and Palmar.
Actually possible.
On January 14 2015 05:44 GlowingBear wrote: Damdred, at this point, should be much more inquisitive and much more insightful than he is now. More than this, he should be on my neck for not posting what he calls that are my town traits. I haven't made a single case in this game and Damdred should wanting me dead for it. He isn't doing it now. Moreover, it makes sense if LM is scum because Damdred is very wishy washy against him. He calls LM scum but doesn't even have he guts to vote him. This sounds so much like Avogadros Mafia Damdred on LYLO.
Yes
On January 14 2015 05:44 GlowingBear wrote: Now, between marv and palmar. I find it extremely weird that they reciprocally scumread each other but votes ritoky together. Why are they voting with their scumreads? These pushes between each other feels fake. They could be scum together (marv back pedalling on palmar NOW is extremely weird). To be honest, a way to discover marv's alignment is to lynch Palmar. I think marv knows this and back pedalled on Palmar now because of this.
Because it doesn't matter what marv's alignment was at the time, he was always going to do exactly this because it was the right play.
On January 14 2015 05:44 GlowingBear wrote: That being said, I really believe the best lynch today should be marv. It will reveal palmar's alignment and I think, from the vets, marv has more probability to flip scum.
It won't say anything about my alignment, but I'm seriously warming up to the idea of lynching marv. I don't feel like he has been a major factor in anything that has happened this game.
He didn't say much (that I remember about bats) geript was my lynch superbia he did the same thing I did (which was, strictly the right play, but some people went for a hero play instead). ritoky was an autolynch after robik flipped. Even today, he's not committed to anything and there's not much left in the game. He just sort of waddles along without being controversial and makes just enough smart points to not get called out for it.
On January 14 2015 05:44 GlowingBear wrote: I'm considering that we have a mafia vet because night kills were perfect. Doctor probably tried to save marv day1 and sick avoided the kill. Which means marv is scum or scum is pro and avoided the marv's protection. In any case, there is a vet on the mafia side. And the probability of this vet being marv is higher.
I don't think this is relevant to finding mafia in the game at all.
Like what I said on night... 2? is still relevant. Marv 100% knew I wasn't afraid to push him, I was just uncertain. I've questioned all my reads this game. I'm not good enough to be right on everything every game.
Marv SHOULD by now have an opinion on me stronger than meh. If he thinks I'm mafia, so be it, but at least he should sort of think that. The problem is he sort of is okay with townreading me but doesn't really commit to it.
Both marv and DP sort of townread me (marv still basically doesn't commit, but he should). Just look at the difference in HOW they do it. DP is willing to go with the "I wouldn't lynch palmar for a long time" whereas marv sort of meekly unvotes me while still keeping reservations.
What was the point of attacking me today (without any accusations, mind you) if he was not going to use it to actually reach some sort of conclusion.
On January 14 2015 05:54 Palmar wrote: Actually let's just do this.
Like what I said on night... 2? is still relevant. Marv 100% knew I wasn't afraid to push him, I was just uncertain. I've questioned all my reads this game. I'm not good enough to be right on everything every game.
Marv SHOULD by now have an opinion on me stronger than meh. If he thinks I'm mafia, so be it, but at least he should sort of think that. The problem is he sort of is okay with townreading me but doesn't really commit to it.
##vote marvellosity
why?
Because you literally always do. I've never had you openly, repeatedly doubt my alignment like this throughout a game.
On January 14 2015 05:55 KelsierSC wrote: I think marv is town like 100%
Based on what?
This is a surprisingly strong read for someone who is basically one of the top 2-3 players in the history of mafia and has done jack shit this game.
Now stones, glass houses, etc, but that's not the point.
I remember he made a smart post about the order of my lynches on d2 which I liked initially. Then his votes look pretty good. I think almost everyone who was confirmed town has read marv as town aswell and his filter is pretty large so all in all he is a town read for me and not the lynch at all.
Votes looking good has nothing to do with being town.
In fact his votes look awful.
Not because he's been voting the wrong people but because he hasn't been making the sheeple line up and VOTE WITH HIM.
On January 14 2015 06:05 marvellosity wrote: alright i'm back
On January 14 2015 05:54 Palmar wrote: Actually let's just do this.
Like what I said on night... 2? is still relevant. Marv 100% knew I wasn't afraid to push him, I was just uncertain. I've questioned all my reads this game. I'm not good enough to be right on everything every game.
Marv SHOULD by now have an opinion on me stronger than meh. If he thinks I'm mafia, so be it, but at least he should sort of think that. The problem is he sort of is okay with townreading me but doesn't really commit to it.
##vote marvellosity
why?
Because you literally always do. I've never had you openly, repeatedly doubt my alignment like this throughout a game.
you fucking admit yourself your play this game has been unusual. which it has!
Who cares. The only thing that's unusual is the activity patches. Literally everything else is exactly how I play town.
You know I bus the fuck out of everyone on my team as mafia anyway.
On January 14 2015 05:55 KelsierSC wrote: I think marv is town like 100%
Based on what?
This is a surprisingly strong read for someone who is basically one of the top 2-3 players in the history of mafia and has done jack shit this game.
Now stones, glass houses, etc, but that's not the point.
I remember he made a smart post about the order of my lynches on d2 which I liked initially. Then his votes look pretty good. I think almost everyone who was confirmed town has read marv as town aswell and his filter is pretty large so all in all he is a town read for me and not the lynch at all.
Votes looking good has nothing to do with being town.
In fact his votes look awful.
Not because he's been voting the wrong people but because he hasn't been making the sheeple line up and VOTE WITH HIM.
you mean except where i made ritoky fakeclaim?
what is this?
I somehow don't remember the ritoky thing being your stuff. Didn't sicklucker claim it too?
The whole thing about "you're usually not afraid of pushing me" by marv confirms him as mafia in a way I hadn't even thought of before.
If he actually is town, it's 100% acceptable to him that I don't push him, because in that case I _could_ be town (he has never committed to reading me scum, at least not back then). Like he shouldn't even question it because it would be exactly how I act as town because I SHOULD (ie: I should read him correctly, why is he worried that I'm not pushing him when he knows it's the wrong thing to do).
On January 14 2015 06:05 marvellosity wrote: alright i'm back
On January 14 2015 05:54 Palmar wrote: Actually let's just do this.
Like what I said on night... 2? is still relevant. Marv 100% knew I wasn't afraid to push him, I was just uncertain. I've questioned all my reads this game. I'm not good enough to be right on everything every game.
Marv SHOULD by now have an opinion on me stronger than meh. If he thinks I'm mafia, so be it, but at least he should sort of think that. The problem is he sort of is okay with townreading me but doesn't really commit to it.
##vote marvellosity
why?
Because you literally always do. I've never had you openly, repeatedly doubt my alignment like this throughout a game.
you fucking admit yourself your play this game has been unusual. which it has!
Who cares. The only thing that's unusual is the activity patches. Literally everything else is exactly how I play town.
You know I bus the fuck out of everyone on my team as mafia anyway.
well that's wonderful if you're sitting there as town with a town role PM. "i'm playing like town because i am town" is a nothnig argument.
your words, more or less precisely -
"there is one tell that i know you use that makes me 100% mafia"
so we go from that premise, but somehow that tell doesn't seem quite right and i don't quite see how or why.
you stepped up your play today, but not to the extent that i quite expected, again leading to uncertainty.
On January 14 2015 06:13 Palmar wrote: Jesus, it's all clicking now.
The whole thing about "you're usually not afraid of pushing me" by marv confirms him as mafia in a way I hadn't even thought of before.
If he actually is town, it's 100% acceptable to him that I don't push him, because in that case I _could_ be town (he has never committed to reading me scum, at least not back then). Like he shouldn't even question it because it would be exactly how I act as town because I SHOULD (ie: I should read him correctly, why is he worried that I'm not pushing him when he knows it's the wrong thing to do).
you've pushed me when i've been town in many games.
cmon palmar.
okay, that's correct. But it wasn't the same. It's usually on day 1 (as opposed to like night 2) and it's a completely different situation.
On January 14 2015 06:01 GlowingBear wrote: When I asked marv if he would lynch damdred he gave a very fluffy answer. I asked him "yes or no" and he refused to say it. This kind of non commitment reveals that he doesn't want to link himself to damdred.
is this for real? you asked me for my read, I gave it, then I backed up my reasons for the read.
Why would I come across as unnaturally certain if I'm not certain?
Explain
I don't have reads on damdred = won't lynch I think he is scum = lynch
Instead, you gave a really unclear answer. But the lynch today should be damdred. I've played with damdred a lot and I'm positive he is mafia.
On January 14 2015 06:13 Palmar wrote: Jesus, it's all clicking now.
The whole thing about "you're usually not afraid of pushing me" by marv confirms him as mafia in a way I hadn't even thought of before.
If he actually is town, it's 100% acceptable to him that I don't push him, because in that case I _could_ be town (he has never committed to reading me scum, at least not back then). Like he shouldn't even question it because it would be exactly how I act as town because I SHOULD (ie: I should read him correctly, why is he worried that I'm not pushing him when he knows it's the wrong thing to do).
you've pushed me when i've been town in many games.
cmon palmar.
okay, that's correct. But it wasn't the same. It's usually on day 1 (as opposed to like night 2) and it's a completely different situation.
Like my point is... why would you expect me to be pushing you in that scenario? I hadn't given any real reasons as to why you were mafia.
It's this expectation of something that shouldn't have happened that makes you scum.
On January 14 2015 06:13 Palmar wrote: Jesus, it's all clicking now.
The whole thing about "you're usually not afraid of pushing me" by marv confirms him as mafia in a way I hadn't even thought of before.
If he actually is town, it's 100% acceptable to him that I don't push him, because in that case I _could_ be town (he has never committed to reading me scum, at least not back then). Like he shouldn't even question it because it would be exactly how I act as town because I SHOULD (ie: I should read him correctly, why is he worried that I'm not pushing him when he knows it's the wrong thing to do).
you've pushed me when i've been town in many games.
cmon palmar.
okay, that's correct. But it wasn't the same. It's usually on day 1 (as opposed to like night 2) and it's a completely different situation.
Like my point is... why would you expect me to be pushing you in that scenario? I hadn't given any real reasons as to why you were mafia.
It's this expectation of something that shouldn't have happened that makes you scum.
BECAUSE YOU'D KEPT DROPPING SLIGHTS AT ME
the whole *REASON* I made the comment is because you made a sly dig at me one too many times so I called you out on it. go back and READ how it happened.
and that's to everyone.
And in what universe does townMarv believe that scumPalmar is dumb enough to think that dropping random digs at townMarv is going to get townMarv lynched?
Like I know my scumplay isn't great, but that's bs man. I'd pocket the hell out of you if you were town and I was mafia. That, or kill you. Not let you live until day 4 yet constantly call you out for random shot.
It's basically impossible I'm not your top town atm.
On January 14 2015 06:13 Palmar wrote: Jesus, it's all clicking now.
The whole thing about "you're usually not afraid of pushing me" by marv confirms him as mafia in a way I hadn't even thought of before.
If he actually is town, it's 100% acceptable to him that I don't push him, because in that case I _could_ be town (he has never committed to reading me scum, at least not back then). Like he shouldn't even question it because it would be exactly how I act as town because I SHOULD (ie: I should read him correctly, why is he worried that I'm not pushing him when he knows it's the wrong thing to do).
you've pushed me when i've been town in many games.
cmon palmar.
okay, that's correct. But it wasn't the same. It's usually on day 1 (as opposed to like night 2) and it's a completely different situation.
Like my point is... why would you expect me to be pushing you in that scenario? I hadn't given any real reasons as to why you were mafia.
It's this expectation of something that shouldn't have happened that makes you scum.
BECAUSE YOU'D KEPT DROPPING SLIGHTS AT ME
the whole *REASON* I made the comment is because you made a sly dig at me one too many times so I called you out on it. go back and READ how it happened.
and that's to everyone.
And in what universe does townMarv believe that scumPalmar is dumb enough to think that dropping random digs at townMarv is going to get townMarv lynched?
Like I know my scumplay isn't great, but that's bs man. I'd pocket the hell out of you if you were town and I was mafia. That, or kill you. Not let you live until day 4 yet constantly call you out for random shot.
It's basically impossible I'm not your top town atm.
I don't, I thought that's your way of vaguely keeping up appearances and "contributing" with your traditional scumread on me.
except you refused to ever flesh it out (like you usually do), so I called you out.
On January 14 2015 06:30 marvellosity wrote: you're very much not helping right now.
like everything in my play is townmarv, from the large filter to the actually playing the game, to the pushing the mafia i'm certain of.
literally the only thing that should make people doubt is that i didn't hardpush on day 1 for a deadline i'm not around for or something?
You never even came close to lynching ritoky who you called out literally in your entrance post. I'm also 5 hours from the deadline, didn't stop me actually getting shit done.
Like I think the only thing you said after the vote and explaining why he was mafia (something which sounded actually kinda ok) is ask damdred "what was good about the followup" or something.
On January 14 2015 06:35 Palmar wrote: Why didn't you follow up on ritoky day 1, or even attempt to make anyone listen to you?
he was absent for a long time that day, and only came back shortly after bed, didn't feel certain enough to push at the time, was tired, geript looked like a really good lynch
On January 14 2015 01:55 marvellosity wrote: pretty doubtful, unless something comes up that's better than what i've seen.
to an extent I agree with Plam that Damdred has been less assertive than I might expect, but the difference is nowhere near what i'm seeing. his push on Superbia d2 was pretty good and actually quite assertive, in some ways it was bad luck (?) that it didn't yield results that day. Also similarly with his VE push (even though wrong)
and a couple of little things like how he questioned sl on his greencheck on him
Does this looks clear to you?
Of course not.
scum marv doesnt' like giving hard reads except on universal townreads (atm basically artanis and sl).
btw, I've seriously started questioning sl's status as a confirmed. But we can deal with that later.
On January 14 2015 06:35 Palmar wrote: Why didn't you follow up on ritoky day 1, or even attempt to make anyone listen to you?
he was absent for a long time that day, and only came back shortly after bed, didn't feel certain enough to push at the time, was tired, geript looked like a really good lynch
On January 14 2015 06:39 KelsierSC wrote: GB, and palmar I guess. so if you read ritoky he buddies with LM and calls Damdred Scum quite early. Damdred also votes on super d2 and d3. Then you look at the fact that dam also late votes on bats when the wagons where both town d1. Do you really think through all that , that Dam is scum?
On January 14 2015 06:42 marvellosity wrote: remember that post from earlier you said was reasonable that i said was reasonable about yours? about certainty?
you're retrofitting.
Does it make me mafia?
You have to say I'm top town. Maybe I'll reconsider your alignment when you acknowledge there is literally no way I'm mafia this game.
On January 14 2015 06:39 KelsierSC wrote: GB, and palmar I guess. so if you read ritoky he buddies with LM and calls Damdred Scum quite early. Damdred also votes on super d2 and d3. Then you look at the fact that dam also late votes on bats when the wagons where both town d1. Do you really think through all that , that Dam is scum?
How do you know day1 wagons were both town?
...
because they flipped as town.
TheChyz = Chez...
geript was the leading wagon and batsnacks was the switch.
Whenever Vivax has been around he has posted almost hyper actively. He's not afraid to push whatever comes into his mind and he also called me smart at some point I liked that. This is my disclaimer if he's mafia, that i'm a sucker for people calling me smart.
gb because of filter dive, and he always looks like he's sort of assertive when he posts. Also this jig now voting me seems fairly town.
Artanis is basically a legacy read. Also I liked that superbia post. And then there's the thing that if artanis is mafia we lost anyway, so doesn't even matter.
sl because of cop shenanigans and filter the size of my hands. And you know what they say about people with big hands + Show Spoiler +
they need big gloves
lm because of what I said earlier and because I've townread him at times throughout the game. He's still a background player I've ignroed so if I'm wrong a lot, possibly mafia.
The remaining 4 people have done almost nothing memorable in this game. Chez hasn't solved the game for me which makes me sad. Ksc and Damdred are shitty background players who I feel like have had way too little impact on the game. And then there's marv, who's mafia because I say so.
On January 14 2015 06:59 KelsierSC wrote: So for me LM and Palmar are definite scum.
No
On January 14 2015 06:59 KelsierSC wrote:[/B The question is viv/GB. I have to figure that out when GB answers my Dam question properly.
I am going to vote palmar now and try and be around for deadline. Reasons
- Has been my scum read for a long time since his first initial fight with marv that was really bad.
Wasn't bad, you're wrong. No one, not even marv, came away with a scumread. You're literally saying that your 100% not mafia read marv, who reads me better than anyone else on this forum, is just wrong and didn't notice.
On January 14 2015 06:59 KelsierSC wrote: - He has a total opposite list of reads to me
Yes, one of us is mafia.
On January 14 2015 06:59 KelsierSC wrote: - He has done absolutely nothing this game except fight with marv.
I got geript lynched, I argued probably more with JAT. I was very involved around the cop claim, to the point that DP actually townread me based on my contributions there.
On January 14 2015 06:59 KelsierSC wrote: - He votes on geript twice and afk's, for the first two days. The AFK first two days is consistent with the other mafia players in the game. (super,rit,LM)
Actually just a flat out lie. I made a case on geript, I clarified the case on geript, I nagged people into voting for geript and I got a majority wagon going on him. The only reason I afk'd is that the deadline is 5 am my time.
Jesus christ I hope you're not town. No one is this dumb.
On January 14 2015 06:59 KelsierSC wrote: - two of my top town are voting on him
Not an actual reason to do anything, but hey, I guess you needed more to fabricate a case.
[B]On January 14 2015 06:59 KelsierSC wrote: ##vote Palmar
On January 14 2015 07:03 KelsierSC wrote: neither GB or palmar have answered my points on why dam is town. They both just call him scum despite obvious logical reasons he is town.
I've done it repeatedly.
I don't think he thought superbia was going to be lynched, so that point is moot. Also, trying to use an associative read on what ritoky did is bullshit. In fact, Damdred actually took a post from ritoky that was quite scummy and somehow came to the conclusion (that no one else did) that ritoky looked good and drh looked bad.
Like you didn't even push him, you didn't ever vote him.
Let's go backwards then. You claim your push was not meek, but given that you literally didn't even vote him yourself, and you convinced basically no one, how can you say the push was anything but meek?
Like do you honestly think you made a strong push on LM?
On January 14 2015 07:18 Artanis[Xp] wrote: God, someone turned the cold air conditioning on in the train when it's freezing outside. Who the hell does such a thing? Are they trying to get me killed?!
We've basically made a pact that if you're mafia you win the game.
On January 14 2015 07:16 Damdred wrote: I hate people pulling the vote card, because I almost never vote early and I generally don't move votes a ton.
I disagree I did it the same way imo
Well maybe you should work on that if you want to ever convince anyone.
Lead by example.
Being right and not getting your lynches through is just as bad as being wrong and getting them through. Like even if I end up being wrong on fucking everything this game, at least I got shit done the way I wanted it.
On January 14 2015 07:16 Damdred wrote: I hate people pulling the vote card, because I almost never vote early and I generally don't move votes a ton.
I disagree I did it the same way imo
Well maybe you should work on that if you want to ever convince anyone.
Lead by example.
Being right and not getting your lynches through is just as bad as being wrong and getting them through. Like even if I end up being wrong on fucking everything this game, at least I got shit done the way I wanted it.
I never said I was a good player, but I'm trying to get there at least this isn't storm damdred
I'm not saying you're bad, I'm just saying it's stupid to hold votes. You're actually quite good which is one of the reasons that you may be mafia here, because I feel like you've done nothing at all.
But you seem to think I'm town now, so maybe we can work together.
On January 14 2015 07:27 Palmar wrote: ok so we kill marv?
36 page filter doe.
don't matter
Metal Mini Mafia - 3 page filter Showdown Mafia - 2 page filter Shadow Mini Mafia, where he basically went to the brink on what he can do - 23 page filter in 10 days -> 2.3 page per day. This game, 36 page filter in 14 days -> 2.6 page per day.
It's possible, but he'd have to be in even more tryhard mode than during Shadow which was one of the most hyped up games in recent times as it was an invite game. He hasn't tried as mafia since and he just rolled mafia last game. It's hard to imagine he could charge himself up for this. Possible, but hard.
The other two games you cited is where I lynched him day 1
On January 14 2015 07:36 Damdred wrote: Here's the thing Palmar, I was trying to give GB time to do whatever he was doing. But he's playing to his scrum meta by faking votes almost daily and not really here. Which I mean GB is here but never knows what happens in the past and only pushes what's in the thread currently it feels.
LM is just afking votes again to which scares me
yes LM is the ultimate "I never read anything he says".
On January 14 2015 07:27 Palmar wrote: ok so we kill marv?
36 page filter doe.
don't matter
Metal Mini Mafia - 3 page filter Showdown Mafia - 2 page filter Shadow Mini Mafia, where he basically went to the brink on what he can do - 23 page filter in 10 days -> 2.3 page per day. This game, 36 page filter in 14 days -> 2.6 page per day.
It's possible, but he'd have to be in even more tryhard mode than during Shadow which was one of the most hyped up games in recent times as it was an invite game. He hasn't tried as mafia since and he just rolled mafia last game. It's hard to imagine he could charge himself up for this. Possible, but hard.
The other two games you cited is where I lynched him day 1
I don't even know how to respond to this.
Why do you think he got lynched Day 1 there? Because he had no motivation to live. That's clearly different here.
Or, alternatively, because in one game I instadueled him, like total yolo, and in the other I pushed him and after THAT he stopped trying.
On January 14 2015 07:44 Artanis[Xp] wrote: How long are you still going to be here Palmar? I need to know how long I have to actually read the last few pages attentively.
I'm basically leaving now. it's 11 pm and I have to wake up at 7 tomorrow.
On January 14 2015 07:58 Damdred wrote: Marc is a side read for you lm. Before you included him in a list of unlynchable, now you say he looks bad with little follow up and now you will put your vote on him till deadline that's what I mean.
On January 14 2015 07:44 Artanis[Xp] wrote: How long are you still going to be here Palmar? I need to know how long I have to actually read the last few pages attentively.
I'm basically leaving now. it's 11 pm and I have to wake up at 7 tomorrow.
Can you run down your most important points one more time before going to bed?
I can, mostly because there is a real possibility I end up lynched here.
Artanis gets a free pass. He's universally townread and the game cannot be won if he's mafia, so just don't even think about it.
Sl I have very much second thoughts about him now. I liked the cop claim (well I hated the play, but I also think it makes him more likely to be town). But today he basically parked his vote on me and has done nothing since. This is the first controversial day in a while and it feels like he should be doing something.
Vivax always feels like town while he's posting, but idk. He might be mafia based on how he never actually gets lynched, but more likely to be town for now.
I actually sorta like Chez, read his filter, found it agreeable.
Damdred I'm less sure is mafia right now, but very well could be (please just consult my filter on this one). please keep him honest.
Marv is mafia, I said it. I made a post a little bit back summarizing the main points against him (but you really oughta read the conversation). Also as yet another point against him, he doesn't seem to be enjoying the argument at all, when it's sorta obvious that I really do. I am now heartbroken and want to spite lynch him.
LM could very well be mafia. I always ignore mafia, I've ignored him the entire game (remember how I said the same thing about superbia ^^)
Ksc is mafia for sticking with a mafia read on me even when I'm towniest town in town.
gb always sort of sounds like town when he posts. I admit he isn't quite the LYNCH HOLYFLARE town he was in chrismtas carol and I could be wrong on him but meh, I could be wrong on everyone.
On January 14 2015 07:44 Artanis[Xp] wrote: How long are you still going to be here Palmar? I need to know how long I have to actually read the last few pages attentively.
I'm basically leaving now. it's 11 pm and I have to wake up at 7 tomorrow.
This is Palmar saying he is choosing sleep over surviving. When he goes to sleep... the votes may shift on him..
I know.
Like I'm sorry, I don't give enough shits to ruin my day tomorrow for this game. I've been bad anyway, it'd be fitting I end up getting myself lynched.
On the other hand, town should know this.
The mafia has overcome my final line of defense, and now they plans to murder me. In the end what separates a man from a slave? Money? Power? No, a man chooses, and a slave obeys!
You think you have votes. Reads. Checks. Suspects. Lynches. And then today. Was there really a vote? Did that lynch succeed, or, was it a bus? Forced down, forced down by something less than a man, something bred to sleepwalk through town unless activated by a simple phrase, spoken by their kindly master. Come in.
Reads! would you kindly?
Vote, would you kindly? Write a case, would you kindly? Check! Protect! Lynch. Was mafia sent to kill, or a slave?
A man chooses!
A slave obeys!
Choose to lynch marv. Take control of your own destiny. Don't obey the sentiment.
On January 14 2015 06:44 Palmar wrote: Ksc, you have to stop thinking I'm mafia. Stop ignoring me even if you're mafia you need to talk to me.
yah that question about damdred was to you aswell.
well yes.
I think these people are town
vivax gb palmar artanis ~~~ less sure below sl lm
~~~ maybe scum below damdy ksc chez marv
Ya we definitely kill palmer. I just read most of it and nothing of your bitch fighting changes my lynch order
I am completely reversing my townread on sl officially now.
This will only be important after I flip town but please come back to this.
there is literally no way he read the entire conversation between marv and I in 22 minutes. Which is also why he summarized it as "bitch fighting" which is probably one of the last good phrases to describe what marv and I did.
sl basically found whatever he thought he could use to support his argument I am mafia (which doesn't exist to begin with. he has no arguments against me and is lynching me anyway).
On January 14 2015 09:25 GlowingBear wrote: Although I think marv may be scum, I'm not up to kill him yet. Palmar saying he would lynch damdred but deciding to just lynch marv is odd.
Specially that I'm voting palmar and he didn't make a move to damdred. Like, I am his townread, I'm saying I'VE GOT THIS BRO, but he doesn't try to lynch damdred, when I said that damdred will be more revealing than marv, who isn't confirmed scum.
I really don't like this
lynching marv is more fun. Maybe damdred is town?
Like it's either TMI or just that he's actually reading, but damdred reversed his read on me from today, which is exactly what anyone who is reading the game critically should have done.
But maybe he just knows I'm town. Still, it's better than the constant waffling on alignments marv has been doing.
On January 14 2015 09:33 sicklucker wrote: Lol palmer thats not something a town would ever say. We kill palmer gb and Lm. It really is that easy. If we mis on lm its vivax in tryhard mafia.
Ok let's make a pact.
When I flip town, you shut the hell up for the rest of the game and accept to be lynched.
I'm gonna write this a few times so people don't forget:
Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. 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Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town. Remember that SL is mafia for not even considering I might be town.
On January 14 2015 09:33 sicklucker wrote: Ive been committed on my reads for 2 weeks in this long as game. Its because im godamn right.
in case you're somehow town.
This is how you throw games. Just for future reference. You stick to dumb reads you refuse to update because lazy and or bad, and now mafia has 100% reason to go after you next day.
On January 14 2015 09:38 GlowingBear wrote: I'm okay with voting him palmar.
no let's kill marv.
I don't want to die in a world where scum marv got away with doing nothing, didn't get shot and then commited to a single read or so in the most important day of the game.
On January 14 2015 09:33 sicklucker wrote: Ive been committed on my reads for 2 weeks in this long as game. Its because im godamn right.
in case you're somehow town.
This is how you throw games. Just for future reference. You stick to dumb reads you refuse to update because lazy and or bad, and now mafia has 100% reason to go after you next day.
but I don't think you actually worry about that.
unless the are right . Ive read everything im not open to changing at this time
Are you certain enough to accept that you get lynched next if I flip town?
On January 14 2015 09:43 GlowingBear wrote: Palmar, my deer, you understand I'm lunching you right? You understand there are fair motives to lynch marv the next day instead of this, right?
Clearly, getting killed twice because people cannot possibly fathom that my activity varies greatly and then hard defending myself on the day of the lynch is not enough. Let's for three. See where that takes us.
I am 100% certain no one checked my list of a few filters to skim anticipating this. Morons (or mafia) just stick to "hey palmar must be mafia because he's acting like town, so he's clearly faking it".
On January 14 2015 09:47 sicklucker wrote: So like when I was mafia with dandred I remember him saying how he was afraid of gb. Something I would do tho palmer is lynch gb and if hes town id lynch danded.
I care this || much about what you want to do.
You want to lynch me, so clearly literally all your reads and lynch ideas should be completely disregarded.
On January 14 2015 09:50 sicklucker wrote: Palmer heres the thing. Me wanting to kill you has nothing to do with your activity level. Its that are lynch lists are a 180 of each other. Heres a list of people who agree with all or most of my lynch order
Jat
No, even 2 days in I can't remember him actually calling me mafia all that much (but I admit, he didn't townread me).
On January 14 2015 09:50 sicklucker wrote: Eden
No idea.
On January 14 2015 09:50 sicklucker wrote: Artanis
I don't know, I can't remember him actually saying he wants to lynch me all that much.
On January 14 2015 09:50 sicklucker wrote: marv
He's mafia
On January 14 2015 09:50 sicklucker wrote: Ksc
Bad or mafia. Doesn't matter.
On January 14 2015 09:50 sicklucker wrote: Dandred
Actually read the thread, now thinks I am town.
On January 14 2015 09:50 sicklucker wrote: chez I think?
On January 14 2015 09:47 sicklucker wrote: So like when I was mafia with dandred I remember him saying how he was afraid of gb. Something I would do tho palmer is lynch gb and if hes town id lynch danded.
I care this || much about what you want to do.
You want to lynch me, so clearly literally all your reads and lynch ideas should be completely disregarded.
If your town are you not open to the idea that your mafia siding and thats why I want to kill you?
Well then you should recognize that I am the one actively pushing my ideas (even if wrong) and whoever sheeps me (lm?) is the mafia because he is not the one calling the shots and making the reads.
The point is, it's never the outspoken controversial guy who is mafia.
If there was mafia on the geript lynch, it wasn't me who lead the lynch. Just like the people who led the batsnacks switch (jat?) weren't mafia.
I really am going to sleep now. this is awful imma sleep like 6 hours.
I'm again slightly less certain on sl so disregard that spam earlier. he may very well be this bad as town. Don't auto lynch him when I flip.
Also, I still think marv is scum, but me flipping town won't confirm that. Be wary of people trying to draw conclusions from me being town. I should be obvious town to everyone, but it's possible people like damdred simply figure it out through TMI (for example, if sl is town, that's a prime example of how supremely difficult it is to change your preconceived notions).
On January 14 2015 09:56 sicklucker wrote: The thing about that list palmer is that all those people wanted to kill gb lm and vivax as well. Could all of us be wrong? Are you on the wrong side of the fence?
On January 14 2015 09:47 sicklucker wrote: So like when I was mafia with dandred I remember him saying how he was afraid of gb. Something I would do tho palmer is lynch gb and if hes town id lynch danded.
I care this || much about what you want to do.
You want to lynch me, so clearly literally all your reads and lynch ideas should be completely disregarded.
If your town are you not open to the idea that your mafia siding and thats why I want to kill you?
Well then you should recognize that I am the one actively pushing my ideas (even if wrong) and whoever sheeps me (lm?) is the mafia because he is not the one calling the shots and making the reads.
The point is, it's never the outspoken controversial guy who is mafia.
If there was mafia on the geript lynch, it wasn't me who lead the lynch. Just like the people who led the batsnacks switch (jat?) weren't mafia.
This is mafia 101.
But your the great palmer you do have to be that person or your instantly marfia. (marv in metal)
Also, I wanna remind everyone how little marv was involved today except arguing with me to come to the conclusion that he's still waffling on my alignment.
If I'm wrong on marv, and we assume you me and sl are town (which is quite likely), mafia didn't touch the vivax wagon until quite late (probably when it was dead).
On January 14 2015 10:35 Palmar wrote: okay, Jesus told me to lynch LM
This is final. good night
## vote Lazermonkey
It actually worries me how many people are suddenly willing to vote LM.
yes, and I'm voting with all the people who I think might be mafia.
But, I don't make associative reads, I cannot exactly trust my reads this game. LM fits the mold of a player I ignore because he's so under the radar (remember, I always do this). Damdred kinda did, but the simple fact damdred actually said I was mafia, read my day today, decided "hey palmar is playing like a townie, maybe he is town" and ran with it makes me feel better about him.
If I'm wrong on marv, and we assume you me and sl are town (which is quite likely), mafia didn't touch the vivax wagon until quite late (probably when it was dead).
35 page filter and he has reads you just can't make up as scum. You just can't.
Yes, if you read what I've been saying I've been calling him town all day for that.
also marv is 100% capable of bussing. Like if he thinks there is any chance he or lm end up being the lynch today, he doesn't hesitate to just go for the long game and bus.
I don't want to talk myself out of lynch based on who else is voting.
sicklucker's fakeclaim was awful. It's always awful to lie when you're town. You distract other townies from doing their jobs with that kind of shit.
On January 17 2015 20:30 Lazermonkey wrote: I dunno. Its possible you would've nailed everyone if you were town. I never really care too much about meta arguments, maybe I should?
Like I kept bringing up you being less present and less involved than you should've been, but at the same time, someone said that you said you would try to keep down your town play in a previous game? To me, this seems like an WIFOM argument to use against you, no? If we got lynched, then we would've all looked cool and stuff, but if you were town, this would not be the case.
Compare it to Palmar, another high profile player, who was very uninvolved. Was it the correct decision to lynch him? I mean, OBVIOUSLY NOY because he was town. But thats why I kinda dislike that type of argument in general.
Not caring about meta is fine. My basis for scumreading Damdred was NOT meta. Also you're falling into the trap of looking at WHAT people are doing instead of HOW they are doing it.
Yes, I wasn't around. I have a family I like to spend my weekends with and new years was off for me too. Additionally I don't play on pointless days (like the ritoky lynch, it was automatic). However WHEN I was around I was super actively pushing my own things, thinking critically about the game, aggressively engaging people and in general trying to help and make my impact felt. Damdred on the other hand basically was carefully treading the outskirts of the game even when he was around. He never dove into the center of conversation etc. So yes, we were both absent, but the ways in which we did it could not have been any more different.
On January 17 2015 21:58 GlowingBear wrote: I just couldn't see town palmar agreeing to lynch damdred, scumreading marv, but voting LM with marv and refusing to lynch damdred.
Say it with me 10 times:
I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads I do not make associative reads
Marv could be bussing, I could be wrong on marv, who cares. It does not make me mafia in any world. And Marv should have been the lynch that day. Yes I'm a bit mad about waffling on Damdred, that's on me, sorry about that.
Half the shit this game that went wrong was because of dumb associative stuff. "Damdred is town because he pushed superbia". I had to argue with this dumbassery repeatedly through the days I tried to lynch damdred. Mafia's agenda is to literally do things that people think they wouldn't do as mafia.
I'm not trying to absolve myself of anything this game. I played badly, got myself lynched. But I don't think I should take 100% of the blame for this one. I'm like fucking nostradamus when it comes to how and when I get lynched as town.
I told you there would come a time where I had to defend myself because of some dumb accusations, and I told you to go read how I respond as town when that stuff comes up.
I'm willing to bet no one even gave the games I linked a glance.
It's a super painful process to go through. But one day people will understand that trying to read me on activity bursts or periods of inactivity is just dumb as hell. I have a job, a family and other obligations. I sometimes play interested and I sometimes don't.
Listen to what I say and how I say it. Not when I say it.
Also I don't understand why people are so resistant to advice. I am not a great mafia player, but I have played more than just about anyone here (maybe with VE as an exception). When I say shit, it's not because I like spouting random nonsense, it's because trial and error, in addition with what I learned from people who played before, has taught me that despite anecdotal evidence (hey look, this worked once), there are certain things that are generally good or bad to do. Some examples:
Don't voteswitch in the last few hours of the day. Have the lynch lined up at least 4 hours prior and an alternative in case the target goes balls to the walls town on us all.
Don't fakeclaim as town. Do your best to be a target for mafia if you're vanilla. Make them fear you to protect the blues. Don't try to wifom a shot out of them because it fucks with other townies even more.
Don't make associative reads. You do not know what the mafia wants to do, you're literally handing them weapons to use against you if you allow their actions to control your reads.
Don't use meta unless you absolutely know what you're doing. Generally only use meta on people you know extremely well, and only trust meta when it focuses on overall style, not specific things.
There's probably a ton more. I keep saying these things, and we keep failing on them.
On January 17 2015 23:57 justanothertownie wrote: I wonder how many pages a townmarv would have gotten this game.
hopefully not more, hopefully less.
I am actually pretty serious about trying to tone down my posting as town, so I don't have to go through this kind of game again as mafia.
I was bound to be in enough trouble this game without trying to at least vomit filter length too :/
It seems like you are really aiming for that mislynch.
maybe. i think i can look very town without posting a lot when i am town though. i can't as mafia.
I think your push on Lazer at the end actually looked a lot like Townmarv. If you could copy that as scum before you're in mortal danger it'd actually be quite hard to discern your alignment.
You are telling me townmarv who is left alive by scum for some unknown reason constantly tunnels on the same lynchbaity player for the last days? No fucking way.
I'm not talking about the overall picture, he was obviously mafia for it. I just mean that the way he pushed his target there resembled townmarv.
On January 17 2015 23:57 justanothertownie wrote: I wonder how many pages a townmarv would have gotten this game.
hopefully not more, hopefully less.
I am actually pretty serious about trying to tone down my posting as town, so I don't have to go through this kind of game again as mafia.
I was bound to be in enough trouble this game without trying to at least vomit filter length too :/
It seems like you are really aiming for that mislynch.
maybe. i think i can look very town without posting a lot when i am town though. i can't as mafia.
I think your push on Lazer at the end actually looked a lot like Townmarv. If you could copy that as scum before you're in mortal danger it'd actually be quite hard to discern your alignment.
You are telling me townmarv who is left alive by scum for some unknown reason constantly tunnels on the same lynchbaity player for the last days? No fucking way.
I'm not talking about the overall picture, he was obviously mafia for it. I just mean that the way he pushed his target there resembled townmarv.
It actually looked nothing like townmarv
What do you feel was different about it? It was a very concise point on why LM was scum.
Because by day 5 townmarv has actual reads to base things on.
like he'd already have developed some kind of an overall feel for him, probably talked about him multiple times, then saw this and pointed it out, but also tried to fit it with the overall read that he already had.
On January 18 2015 00:36 marvellosity wrote: Koshi made a great point in QT actually how i managed to paint myself into a corner by townreading everyone i should be townreading, leaving me with 3 scum by PoE who i kinda hadn't pushed at all.
Yes, didn't I try to force you into that position at one point?
On January 18 2015 00:36 marvellosity wrote: Koshi made a great point in QT actually how i managed to paint myself into a corner by townreading everyone i should be townreading, leaving me with 3 scum by PoE who i kinda hadn't pushed at all.
Yeah, I think your biggest flaw (other than not pushing your suspects as strongly) as scum is clearing people too quickly, but I guess you kind of have to since that's what you do as town.
yep he has to.
Marv will should win a scumteam a game. His job is to distract town for long enough to allow his team to sweep up. Most higher profile players need to take this role because in the end it will be obvious they are mafia.
The alternative option is sooo difficult to pull off.
On January 18 2015 01:08 justanothertownie wrote: Like if I have doubts about both wagons then I WILL push the scumread I am more confident on and I don't think that is wrong at all.
Sure, but you have to understand what you're losing.
I guess the main problem is people voting too late. Like there needs to be a compelling reason to actually votswitch. None of these I listed is a hard and fast rule, the problem is that everyone thinks they're the unique snowflake the rules don't apply to.
If you use hours 36-48 to decide the actual lynch, close to 100% of the people in town get to help make that choice. if you only use hours 44-48 to do it, you're cutting off a significant portion of town.
Back in the day, late deadlines (US deadlines), were much more common than they are now. And towns would sometimes impose "soft" deadlines on themselves to make sure you include everyone in the process. Basically "we're not changing the lynch after this unless there's a massively good reason to".