It's a surprise that we've barely heard anything from Chinese scene so far. We've seen Moonglade emerge from SEA's 140,000 users, but there's still no public face for CN's 290,000. Supposedly, they have skilled players who have easy access to the Korean server, yet how many of us can name three Chinese professionals? Gigabyte Stars War, CPL, and the Blizzard Invitational came and went, but none of these tournaments seemed interested at all in showing the rest of the world what the Chinese scene had to offer.
Now that IEM Global Challenge is making their to Guangzhou, the global Starcraft II community will get its first real glimpse of what their favorite game is like beyond the great firewall. Four Chinese players will go up against the world's best, eager to prove that they can truly compete.
And of course, there is the glory of winning an IEM Championship on the line. With sixteen truly global representatives coming to play in Guangzhou, it should prove to be an interesting tournament indeed.
Oh snap it’s DT, run! No, not this time. This time it’s the Chinese Starcraft 2 players are coming out of the darkness and revealing themselves at IEM Guangzhou! Though they have been largely hidden from the West and even from their illustrious Eastern neighbors, the Chinese E-Sports scene has been growing for years, and especially recently after Starcraft II took hold. Starcraft II was released in China less than 6 months ago, and in that time the Chinese scene has really taken off, even if most of us don't know it. Although several tournaments have featured Chinese players, most have been limited to events in China, or online only events.
IEM Guangzhou will be the first time in Stacraft II where Chinese players will be out in force and at an event that many non-Chinese viewers will be tuning into. This is a very big chance to show what they have to a brand new audience in the international fanbase as a whole. Who are the Chinese players coming and how will they stack up?
Make no mistake about it, XiGua may mean Watermelon in Chinese, but nothing is friendly and inviting about this player. XiGua is regarded by many including myself as “The Best Player in China” by a pretty reasonable margin. With his teammate and now manager xiaOt moving into a more managerial role within E-Sports, XiGua is the bright beacon of hope for all the Chinese fans heading into this event.
With his victory at the Chinese Battle.Net 2011 Invitational, XiGua solidified his reign of terror over the Chinese scene by winning three of the largest event held in China back to back to back. The other two events in this run were the WCG Cyber Games China National Finals, and the $27,000+ Chinese 2011 G-League. Like most Chinese players, XiGua has limited involvement in Non-Chinese events, so far only playing in the FXO Invitational #4 Tournament. His run, however, in this online event showed that he is a real competitor in any tournament, as he took series off of White-Ra, YongHwa, ViBE, and SaSe on route to a 4th place finish overall in a very stacked event.
What is unique about XiGua within the Chinese scene is not his style, but in fact the race he has chosen to play. For whatever reason the Chinese scene has embraced Protoss and Terran as their major races, and a Zerg player from China that is amazing in all aspects is something of a rarity. Because of his recent success, players across all leagues in China have been using new concepts in their play and generally learning the finer aspects of macro based play. XiGua is a player who is by himself moving the Chinese Starcraft II scene forward as a whole with every single event he plays in.
XiGua has landed in Group B, which is without a doubt now the hardest group of IEM. The other members of the group include DIMAGA, Rain, and JYP. All three of these competitors are frontrunners to take the whole tournament, and if XiGua is able to fight his way out of this group, it will be an achievement within itself.
Each of the three players present a unique challenge, but none more so then Dimaga. As I mentioned before, there is a lack of top level Zerg players in China, and thus most Chinese players have had difficulty in ZvZ’s against true world class Zerg’s. Rain is without a doubt just a stunning Korean Terran player, and his huge runs in recent MLGs have shown he is far from the all-in, all the time Rain of the old GSLs. JYP has been one of the rising Protoss hope’s in Korea with Sage. He has some of the most fantastic micro and builds out there, and as a member of TSL, is always a real threat. This group should not be missed, and if there is one Chinese player to check out, it’s XiGua.
Neither YHY nor Way have made major splashes in the Chinese scene as of yet. However, both players however have been showing massive signs of improvement as of late.
YHY has finished Top 8 in both WCG China and Blizzcon China, and has a very real chance to finish high in this tournament. He is one of the other very few top Zergs in China, though he has always been in the shadow of the beast that is XiGua. He has landed into Group A with HasuObs, PiG, and Puma. HasuObs is a very good Protoss player, however there are A LOT of Protoss players in China for YHY to practice against, and he should be very prepared.
PiG is a bit of an unknown for me but his TLPD shows sub 50% ZvZ, which should leave neither player with a significant advantage. Puma will be the flaming hoop for YHY to jump through, as Puma’s huge recent success in both MLG and NASL will make him the toughest opponent in the group, but but YHY has the talent to keep up with his raw multitasking ability.
Way has finished Top 8 in some minor Chinese online events, and is the one player that will be the biggest question mark coming into this event. There’s little record of him playing any events, and replays are next to impossible to find outside the Chinese community. He is in Group D with Strelok, iaguz, and RevivaL. None of those opponents are easy, but with the large number of Terrans in China, a two Terran group is a god send. Strelok and RevivaL will both be both very opponents matches for Way, and obviously iaguz will offer his best chance at a win.
At the time of writing, the last Chinese player, Jim, had not been announced. Diamond's brief comments after hearing the announcement:
"He's up and coming. He's done pretty much the best of any Chinese player in the Korean weekly, I think he's legit. He hasn't had that many wins, but he's taken games from nettiePrime, Choya, and Desrow."
What does it all mean?
This is the one shot China has needed to get on the map of Starcraft II, and create a desire and demand to see these players at more and more events. With the MILLIONS of E-Sports fans that exist in China, it is positioned to become a major player in Starcraft II, and a major Chinese push into Starcraft II would only help E-Sports as a whole. If fans are asking for Chinese players at MLG, Dreamhack, etc, then it will foster the growth of the scene, and bring in a slew of new professional players and a massive new market.
For the Chinese fans, this is the first time in Starcraft II they are the minority in the tournament, as every other event they've seen featured mainly if not all Chinese players. This could give the Chinese fans a great event to rally around and discover the amazing global competitive scene for Starcraft II.
Europe: The Next Best Thing
by tree.hugger
There's no doubt that the Koreans are the favorites here. They're always the favorites; that's just how it is. But if the Koreans weren't in attendance, then the Europeans would have this easy. And in the off chance that one of the Korean invites doesn't take the whole thing, than they will most certainly have lost to European. Because that's just how it is too.
It's true though, the hopes of the Euro scene took a significant hit when MaNa was compelled to drop out. The hottest foreigner Protoss at the moment, MaNa has recently notched several wins against PuMa, and with good fortune could've repeated his performance at IEM. Sadly, he won't get the chance. But there's reason to be positive about the other Europeans in the tournament. Three of them are on hot-streaks, and two have beaten high level Koreans before in live settings. It would be silly to insist that lightning will certainly strike twice, but equally foolish to discount the possibility of it altogether.
HasuObs qualified to IEM in a really roundabout fashion. After MaNa was forced to choose WCG Poland over Guangzhou, XlorD and Hasu, the two semi-finalists of his qualifier, faced off for the open spot. XlorD won, then dropped out himself, leaving Hasu the uncontested holder of the final qualifier spot. While each of the other Euro qualifiers have been on impressive runs of play, there's some reason to doubt Hasu's fitness for this event, and they go beyond his underwhelming qualification. With some recent awkward losses, and mediocre tournament performances, Hasu has mainly been treading water; unable to distinguish himself ever since his fourth place finish in the TSL.
One of the reasons might be that his style hasn't seen a good deal of evolution since the deathball days of earlier this year. Hasu seems most comfortable handling a maxed army and multiple bases, a style that isn't always ambitious enough to be called much more beyond 'safe'. As Zergs and Terrans have become quite adept at handling maxed Protoss armies, this passive play is losing some favor.
Overcoming that mindset will be important for Hasu in the future, but fortunately for Hasu, it probably won't matter greatly at IEM, as he has what appears to be the easiest group in the bunch. Take that with the usual grain of salt - YHY is a black box; what data we have indicates that he is at least competent in TvP. PiG is a little better known, and with a less than .500 record in SEA server events, he will most likely be easier to handle. The group's fourth member is PuMa, who is unlikely to lose to any of his groupstage opponents. But there's every reason to expect that Hasu will advance from the group in the second position.
There are few players more difficult to predict in major LANs than DIMAGA. One of the best players in the beta, he didn't look like a major threat after release until the GSL World Championships, where he became the first player to take a televised ZvZ against NesTea. Then he disappeared again, before roaring back at Assembly Summer. IEM Guangzhou catches him on a hot streak (like most of the European qualifiers) but that doesn't necessarily ensure that DIMAGA will show up and dimaga will stay home.
Unlike Pokémon, progamers rarely share physical characteristics to match their playstyle. DIMAGA is one of the exceptions. The Ukrainian Zerg is one of the most intimidating progamers in appearance and gameplay. Famous in the beta for popularizing the baneling bust, DIMAGA still plays a no-holds-barred aggressive style a year later. In the previous months, pre-patch, he was one of the best infestor-ling users in Europe. He has traditionally favored a units-based defense early, tends to drone in the midgame, and attacks with time-sensitive armies near maxed. A key part of his game is putting on pressure or the illusion of pressure throughout the game. Successful players against DIMAGA need to either prepare early to be defensive later in the game, or need to have efficient scouting to turn the tables and call the Zerg bluff.
DIMAGA's group is the toughest in the tournament, but that's in large part because he's in it. The big fish in the group is TSL_Smart (aka JYP), who is one of the best in the new Korean wave of actually good Protoss players. He's one of the leaders in the Warp Prism revolution, and his single army control might be the best of his peers. DIMAGA will have a difficult time against a player with such strong fundamentals as Smart. Headbutting walls of forcefields is one of DIMAGA's worrisome habits, and Smart will shred sloppy army control. Against the other two members of his group, DIMAGA should be counted as the favorite. Rain is another difficult player to assess, but DIMAGA seems to be the hotter of the two. And again, who knows what XiGua will bring to the table. My best guess is that it'll be less than what DIMAGA has, but that's no guarantee. Expect good things from DIMAGA at IEM, but don't be stunned if it doesn't happen.
Elfi is one of those players who I keep expecting to start dropping off. He has a low APM Protoss style that more often then not relies upon surprise and unpredictability as opposed to sound theory. But day after day, month after month, Elfi hangs around and continues to put up impressive results. Shows how much I know.
In the last month, however, Elfi has outdone himself and improved his play in a measurable way. To qualify for Guangzhou, he swept DarKFoRcE, then a little while later, beat Adelscott and Tarson to qualify for IEM New York. In the wake of this success, he was picked up by Acer, and immediately put in his best effort yet in the MSI Pro Cup 2, taking down Tarson again, then ToD, and edging the mighty MaNa to reach the final, where he fell 1-3 to teammate Nerchio.
Whether Elfi can perform up to his current form in a difficult group is hard to say. The last Chinese player in his group is Jim, who has strong PvP. That's a tough hurdle for Elfi, but the recent patch has ensured that for a little while at least, PvP will be even more of a crapshoot than before. Both Jinro and IdrA are better mechanically than him, but both have weak points to their game which could be exploited. What distinguishes Protoss players of Elfi's style is their contradictory willingness to play both long defensive games, and aggressive timing games. IdrA's ZvP vulnerability has long been against the former, and Jinro's TvP weakness has frequently been the latter. Both players will likely be confident in their chances and favor reactionary styles. This puts the ball in Elfi's court; if he prepares wisely he could easily pull a large surprise and advance first. But a mixed result and uncertain promotion from the group feels more likely. His better chance will be in New York, where his group is substantially less experienced.
A few months ago, Strelok made a video in which he christened himself 'The Ambitious Terran' and essentially pledged to start destroying everyone in sight. Don't look now, but it's happening.
Ukraine's best Terran in BW, Strelok has spent most of SC2 in the shadow of the ladder beast Kas. But with his countryman in something of a slump, Strelok has surged. Qualifying for Guangzhou on the backs of Insolence and Diestar was one step, but brilliant games so far in the NASL and in several weekly cups paint a complete picture of the Ukrainian's current strength. Guangzhou is the rare tournament with some serious question as to the best Terran in the field, Strelok might prove himself it. Solid and standard in all match-ups, Strelok is a player who rarely gets beaten by someone or something weird. It's extremely difficult to imagine him losing to iaguz, and although the strength of the Chinese players is something of a wild-card, Strelok should be counted as a favorite against Way.
The most telling match will be against RevivaL, which will be decided by how carefully Strelok can manage his marine tank pushes, something of a weakness in the past. European Zergs as a bloc are significantly closer to their Korean counterparts than are Terran and Protoss, and TvZ is Strelok's best match-up, but RevivaL will provide a dangerous aggressive change of pace that will be difficult to learn on the fly. I think Strelok takes a game, but loses the series and advances second in his pool, still good enough for the playoffs.
America, F*** yeah!
by WaxAngel
In a sharp departure from our usual behavior, us North American fans are counting on the Koreans to dominate the foreigners at IEM Guangzhou. Though we're resigned to the fact that Europe is just better, at least we have the comfort of knowing we're not the worst Starcraft II playing region in the world. That title belongs to the non-Korean Asia Pacific.
...or so we think. If China and SEA can put up more resistance against top class Koreans than NA has been able to over three MLGs, I imagine we'll all be reduced to whimpering under our tear-soaked Greg Fields blankets (get on this product line, EG). So Koreans, for the love of god, do that thing you do best: kick some foreigner ass.
Once again, Idra heads into a big international tournament carrying the hopes of thousands of Americans on his back. He might be angry, disrespectful jerk who's quick to GG, but he's our angry disrespectful jerk, and that means our faith is unwavering.
Let's make no mistake about it: even though he's gone a while without winning a big one, Idra is still a contender. All of the mentality arguments aside, it's insanely hard to put together the string of wins required for a championship, even if you have the requisite skill. Just ask DIMAGA, who didn't win a "major" tournament until he took home Assembly Summer this year. No one doubted he was one of the best Zergs in Europe during that time, and no one should doubt Idra's skill either. I'm not saying that Idra is better than Dimaga or vice versa, but simply that Idra has shown enough high quality games on his stream and in tournaments to show that he's always gonna be in the championship mix (as much as any foreigner can be against Koreans, anyway).
As far as Guangzhou goes, Idra should be fairly pleased with his group. He's going to be favored against a mid-tier Chinese player in Jim, and should be a slight favorite against the heavily slumping Jinro as well. Elfi is the wild card here, as he has been on a sneaky hot/warm streak lately. I'm going to go out on a limb and say Idra is going to die to a Protoss deathball on Shakuras (story of his life), but pull out 2-1 in that series as well.
A few weeks ago, Korea was on the fence about keeping Rain. However, after suffering series losses to DeMusliM, Idra, Cloud and Mana in the last month alone, he was released on a waiver, and Team America was there to snatch him right up. He's a very skilled player who won't win a championship because he can't beat Koreans: he's going to feel right at home on Team America.
All kidding aside, Rain's story is very intriguing, but there's just not enough information to come to any conclusions. I think that from his recent results, we can just start to make the argument that not being in Korea has begun to hurt his skill. At the same time, it's hard ascertain how good he was when he left Korea in the first place. After a few seasons as Korea's "Cheese King," he seemed to be settling down as a more standard, mid-tier Code-S Terran. But it's unclear as to whether he really was on his way to becoming another Clide, or if he was just going to cling in Code-S for a season or two and drop out like another Maka.
DH Valencia was too few games against too few opponents to get a measure of Rain. Going up against very tough opponents in Dimaga, XiGua, and JYP, this will be a golden opportunity to come closer to discovering Rain's true nationality.
All Your Money Belongs To Korea
by Fionn
Let's be honest, TeamLiquid. The Koreans have been taking the foreigners out behind the basketball court, taking their money, and then punching them straight in the gut until they cried for their mommies. It doesn't matter if the tournament has been in America, Europe, Asia, or even Antarctica. If you hold a tournament for good money, a Korean's gonna come and add that cash to the Korean trade surplus.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHbfP5SIn0Y This will never get old, and I mean NEVER
Will this tournament be any different? You have the champion of NASL, Puma; the exciting, innovative, and possibly strongest PvZ player in the world, JYP; the Swedish Gorilla Terran himself, almost having played in the Korean scene for a year, Jinro; and finally, the quiet and under the radar, sniper of the team league, Revival. All four of these players have the skills and determination to win the whole tournament,.
Do you think the other scenes can stop them?
The answer is no. It's always no. The answer will be no until the infrastructures in the other scenes can compete with Korea and offer the same training. It's no surprise that top foreign teams like FXO, TeamLiquid and EG are all investing in houses in Korea. It's where the top players play and where the best foreigners come to become even better players. Saddle up, world. It's time for another tournament to end with a player from the Korean scene holding a shiny trophy in one hand and a big wad of cash in the other.
Puma goes by many aliases: Gentleman, The Guy Who Was A Practice Partner of Flash in Brood War, and most importantly of all, Ace of Evil Geniuses. From his stunning run through the first NASL where he beat MC in the best finals we've seen so far in the history of Starcraft 2, to his domination in foreign team events for his team EG, to his strong showings at the past few MLG's, Puma has made a strong case to be considered one of the best Terrans in the entire world.
Placed in Group A, he will have to take on some tough competition, most notably HasuObs, the strong Protoss from Germany, but Puma should be considered the overwhelming favorite. After a turbulent start to his career with his new team Evil Geniuses, Puma has come into his own and done very well in almost every foreign tournament he has competed in. You don't even have to check the results for foreign tournament or clan match to know that Puma stomped his opponent.
From the start of his career, the main thing that has always held Puma from reaching his full potential was his nerves. Always considered a top player in the practice room, he wasn't able to show his true talent when put in a booth and told to play in front of an audience. Luckily for the fans, these shackles seem to be ripped off with his victory at NASL and success at MLG, so I would expect nothing but his best when coming to IEM.
If I was in Puma's group, I would pray he has an off day or has a sudden flashback to his meek, nervous days. His talent, in my opinion, is head and shoulders above the rest of his group, and Puma isn't only the favorite in this group, but a favorite to take this whole tournament.
If you're a Protoss fan and have never seen JYP, do yourself a favor and please sit down to watch him this weekend. One of the new Protoss hopes in Korea, JYP has made a strong case to be called the best PvZ player in the world with his highly innovative and exciting play. He's beaten DongRaeGu in a best-of-three series with brilliant warp prism and drop storm play. Every time you see him play, you have no idea what kind of new ideas or strategies he might be thinking of.
Sadly, JYP has a weakness. Not only is it a weakness, but it is the reason why he isn't in Code S right now. He has amazing play against Zerg and is very good versus Protoss, but against Terran? He can't beat them. He has lost his last ten games against Korean Terrans. His style, which works splendidly against even the best Zergs in the world, isn't a match for even average level Terrans in Korea at the moment. Out of all the Protosses in Korea at the moment, I believe JYP might have the most overall potential to become the best in the world, but he needs to fix his abysmal record against Terran. If he could do that, I have no doubt that we will see him wrecking Code S soon enough.
In his group, he should be able to take out XiGua, the Zerg from China, and Dimaga, one of the best foreign Zergs, with his PvZ, but the real challenge will be when he has to face Rain. In terms of overall ability, JYP should have Rain beat, but he hasn't been able to buy a win vs. Terran in forever. Rain is no pushover and has shown that he can play very solid games against players who are more skilled than he is, so don't be shocked if Rain exits the group in first place or we have a tie at the top with Dimaga, JYP and Rain.
After almost playing and training in Korea for a full year, Jinro has had his ups and downs. He peaked with two back-to-back trips to GSL semifinals (and still the only foreigner ever to make the semifinals), and slowly dropped from Code S, to the Up-and-Downs, to Code A, and then finally, out of the GSL all together.
Really, if you look at his last two visits to Code A, the people he lost to are no pushovers. asd, the player he lost to two seasons ago, won his Code S group this season (which also had Huk in it) and is the round of sixteen. Lucky, the player who beat Jinro last season, made it all the way to the quarterfinals in this season's Code A and will be battling for a spot in the upcoming Code S season.
You can't look past how Jinro has been slumping the past few months, but you also have to remember that Jinro's mechanics and skill are still some of the best a foreigner can offer if he is well prepared. When looking at his competition, his former foreigner rival in the GSL, Idra, has also been in a slump ever since he left Korea and went back to the United States. Both Idra and Jinro have great talent and mechanics that put them ahead of a lot of the foreign opposition, but neither have been able to put it together in the past couple of months. For Jinro, the Korean metagame has caught up to him after he was ahead of the curve during his semifinals runs, and Idra's strong mechanics that he built up while living three years in Korea haven't been enough to keep him atop the foreigner scene with other players putting in seemingly more and more effort. Both players have been shown that talent and mechanics can only get you so far.
The wild card in this group is elfi, the young Protoss from Finland, who actually lost to Jinro back at Dreamhack Summer. This group will truly come down to who practiced and put the most effort into preparing for this tournament. If Idra comes in, having practiced hours upon hours a day and focusing mainly on this tournament, he should be able to come out as the top player. If he doesn't, and loses his concentration while looking ahead to MLG Orlando, then a prepared Jinro will defeat Idra just like he did back in the GSL quarterfinals months ago and get first place in the group. If neither come in ready to play their best, I can see elfi upsetting both and proudly carrying the flag for his home nation of Finland.
Coming in as the least known Korean among the four, Revival has actually been doing well for himself the past few months. He did well for his team TSL in the current team league, finishing with a record of 6-2, earning victories over MC and Nada. He also qualified for the most recent season of Code A where he narrowly lost in the first round to the very skilled, and widely known, Terran from MvP, sC.
Revival really likes his Banelings and can be hyper aggressive if need be in situations. Looking at his group, I would say that he is going to be able to at least get second in his group. The real challenge will be going up against the fearsome Ukrainian Terran Strelok. Strelok's TvZ is monstrous, the best match-up he plays, while Revival has shown lately that his ZvT is nothing to look down upon either. He played brilliant games against StC and Nada when he faced both in the GSTL, and it really feels like Revival has only been getting better and better each time he steps inside the booth to play a game.
If Revival can calm his nerves playing in his first foreign event and play like he has in the GSTL against other top Terrans in Korea, I would not be shocked if he won the group, or even goes on to take the entire tournament with his blossoming skill. It also wouldn't shock me if he somehow ended up third in his group and got knocked out right away. He's a very unpredictable player and you never know what kind of game he will show you. He might play flawlessly and make you believe that he could be a top Zerg one day, or he can make you pull out your hair and wonder why he is playing in the GSL at his skill level.
Will we see the Good Revival or Bad Revival in China? For the fans of the foreigners, I hope you're crossing your fingers that the Bad Revival shows up on the day of the tournament.
Many apologies to SEA fans. Our SEA writer was unable to finish his segment before deadline for personal reasons.
Extra: WaxAngel and Tree.Hugger's IEM Bets
WaxAngel took "Idra will lose to a Protoss deathball on Shakuras" at 1-30 odds. Tree.Hugger bet against "Dimaga will place highest of all non-Korean invites" at 4-1 odds. WaxAngel took "The final will be between two Koreans" at 5-2 odds. Tree.Hugger took "Two or more Chinese players will advance from their groups" at 1-130 odds.
Ever since Michal "Carmac" Blicharz joined ESL as the product manager of IEM, it's been hard to think of the Germany based international tournament without him. Not limiting himself to working for IEM behind the scenes, Carmac has become the tournament's charismatic front man as well. Heading into IEM Global Challenge Guangzhou, Carmac found some time to answer our questions.
First, congratulations on a successful IEM Cologne, that was pretty fun event to watch as a fan.
Thanks a lot. We try our best and hopefully our events will get even better to watch.
The next event sees the global challenge moving to Guangzhou, which has been a pretty unexposed market for SC2 esports fans so far. What lead you guys to want to hold the event there, compared to say, another esports hub in Asia?
Originally wanted to come back to ChinaJoy in Shanghai as the venue for the Global Challenge in China. We had a fantastic event last season there with tons of people coming to watch, but there was a direct schedule conflict with one of the MLG events.
I think it is unfair on players and fans to make them choose which event they should go to and which event they should watch. We avoid those conflicts whenever possible, which is why we did not have CS in Cologne as well (due to eStars in Korea happening at the same time).
You guys know from experience that China has a pretty robust Warcraft 3 scene, but what do you think about its Starcraft II scene? Do you expect the same kind of enthuisiasm for for SC2?
I think that within the next 12 months, at least two Chinese players will be considered top international elite players. This is what I think makes the Guangzhou event so interesting - we could easily see a new megastar on his first breakthrough event. You might not know the Chinese players, but who expected much of NesTea in the beginning?
Right now China is slightly behind Korea because StarCraft II came into China later than elsewhere, but they will catch up quickly.
The prize purses in StarCraft II are much more meaningful for a Chinese player than a European or American, so they have more reasons to train all day.
So you consider China to be the center of your Asian activities for the future? Has any thought been given to Korea?
It's hard to say what exactly will happen. If I were to wager a guess, assuming that Heart of the Swarm comes out in China at the same time as elsewhere, 18 months from now the top 25 in the world will consist of 6-8 Chinese, 3-4 Europeans and the rest will be Korean. That number will shift towards China with time, though.
"White Dudes" don't have enough of a reason to take up StarCraft II full time yet. ESL, MLG and DreamHack together cannot generate enough practice hours from Europeans and Americans to be able to play on even footing with Koreans. Unless that changes, "we" will always be behind.
The Chinese don't have this problem and they've got one advantage over Korea. The SC2 pro scene will not be in the shadow of BroodWar and should be able to blossom much more rapidly.
But at least for this tournament, you consider it an investment step? It's hard to see any of the Chinese players besides XiGua realistically having an impact.
Everything we do we do as an investment. At the end of the day I am fully aware that we could have more viewers watching our tournaments if we directly invited a White Ra instead of allowing a Beastyqt to beat him in the qualifiers and show up instead. We spend almost half of the $21,000 prize money to make sure every player gets a guaranteed $600, so he can more easily afford the trip. $15,000 for first place looks way cooler and helps us today, but it sets all of us back for tomorrow.
But inviting players directly because they have a big name and a pretty face is a very dangerous dead end. It cuts off any chance for players from the background to become pros. Invitational tournaments, unless there's an interesting theme and a good reason to host them, are harmful to e-Sports in the long run.
Last season Global Challenges were strictly invitational. This time you have to qualify for each. All of it is an investment and while it might not always yield the most exciting player lists, I hope that the community appreciates it. I am 100% sure that one of the next big players you haven't heard of will surface through Intel Extreme Masters.
Going back one of your earlier comments, you predicted mostly Korean and Chinese domination in the future. What would that mean for IEM's relationship with Starcraft II?
It's my job, Sundance's, Robert's, Blizzard's and a few other people's to make sure our White Dude events provide a good excuse for thousands of practice hours for foreigners, and an appealing base for Asian players to show themselves also.
We really must fight to avoid a situation where the foreigners are too far behind Asia. We have a major obligation to nourish our own respective communities before we nourish Korea. We must fight to keep the gap between Korea and the rest of the world as small as possible. And I think we can only achieve it through working together.
If Koreans and the Chinese dominate StarCraft II entirely, then we could potentially face a Brood War situation... and would have to reevaluate StarCraft II. Luckily it's way, way too early for that.
What are some of the unique difficulties of having an event in China? Conversely, what are some of the unique payoffs, besides the obvious "only major tournament that has a Chinese event" factor?
The difficulties are that we need to coordinate efforts of entire crews that speak three different languages and work under four different bosses. That is challenging, as well as producing a live stream in two languages at the same time. It's not really rocket science, but requires an experienced crew and we're lucky to have that.
The benefits are potentially ridiculous viewing numbers. We all know China is able to blow the rest of the world out of the water. I think our League of Legends stream could potentially break the e-Sports record for concurrent viewers. I am hoping SC2 won't be far behind, but I've been to China and I've seen how much the people here enjoy MOBA games.
It's also extremely important for our brand to be globally recognised and deliver that value to our partners. Our last event was viewed by people from 173 countries, but actually going to places really makes a difference. Both for the brand and for e-Sports locally.
So, what are your predictions for SC II at Guangzhou? Who's hot, who's not, and who's gonna win it all?
The best Terran will obviously be the #1 favourite, so my good friend PuMa should do well. Maybe he'll get voted the Sick Nerd Baller of the event also . JYP will do well, I think. Other than that, I am really hoping for a Chinese player to be in the top 4. I love a good underdog story.
The Gorilla Terran must do well so I can have a good reason to interview him . I hate Terran, though. Protoss FTW.
Ok finally: was Uszat able to acquire a Chinese visa?
F*** yes. League of Legends players brace yourselves.
Ok, thanks for the interview, and I hope Global Challenge Guangzhou is a great event!
I hope so, too. We will be providing a dedicated channel this time, so you won't have to be jumping around different streams to catch the content. Thanks for the interview, tune in and keep spreading the word, boys and girls!
Very Exciting! Ever since I learned what was called "Chinese PvZ" where you forge fe and do 8 gate blink stalkers, I've been wanting to see some more of their play. (your right the replays are few and far between!) I can say in the depth of infestor run PvZ, I made some Zergs on ladder very angry with that build. Sniping thirds and getting away clean put many smiles on my face.
I really hope we see more Chinese in the future. After all the scene in China is nearly as big as the rest of the world SC2 scene combined from what I've heard. I'm anxious to see what else has developed in such a large, competitive, and isolated scene.
Carmac is the man, i hope he keeps doing his job for a looooong time. I stand fully behind his reasoning, and his support for "the future" players. It's the right thing to do qualifiers, so new blood can enter the scene, as well as providing good reason for the established to keep practicing hard and don't start slacking.
God Jinro is from Sweden an European country. Plz for the love of god stop with that nonsense. Sase lived a long time in China also when he played wc3 is he a Chinese ofc he is not.
I love carmac if every big event had the attitude iem has it would be awesome. The only thing is the total prize purse going to one person thing kind of sucks but it is a necessary evil I suppose.
I think jyp or revival got this, because they both have shown a lot of potential these past few months, especially jyp. Also the equation JYP and revival = korean means that korean > everybody else still works
Very interesting read, I've seen some of the Chinese players in the ESV Korean Weekly, and they have some very impressive play, can't wait to see more Chinese players come onto the scene.
On October 01 2011 11:01 Paragleiber wrote: YHY Zerg? He is listed as Terran everywhere else. But I guess we will find out soon which race he really plays.
I'm like 99.99% sure he's Z and I even asked my contact in China and he said he's Z.
Hi Diamond, Ive done a write up for these two players feel free to add them if you like, i am more than happy to look after interviews in the future
SEA MEN (Yes we exist)
PiG PiG Qualified for IEM in spectacular fashion- 2-0ing Moonglade in the Upper Bracket FINAL . While a relatively unknown on the Global Level PiG has been a finalist in SEA comps since the release of SCII last year. Some may argue that players such as Moonglade, xGKing.Mafia. FXO.tGun and xGKing.Jazbas are overall stronger Zerg Players, no one denies the PiG’s ZvZ is quite possibly the best in SEA.
Unfortunately for PiG he has no Zergs in his group he faces Terrans YHY and PuMa and Protoss HasuObs, but PiG is fresh off a win in the WCG:Brisbane Qualifier is not doubt wanting to continue he’s success, the rest of this group better watch out PiG is in no way a walkover!
EDIT: We are getting mixed reports that Chinese Player: YHY may actually player Zerg, once he's race has been confirmed Ill update the group info accordingly
Iaguz
xGKing.Iaguz’s entry into IEM was somewhat different, having placed 3rd behind Moonglade in the Lower Bracket FINAL Iaguz thought he’d missed out once again on a major competition (he’s absence along with FXO.tGun from the Blizzard SEA/ANZ Invitationals was somewhat surprising). However Due to WCG: Australia and Blizzcon Globals falling in subsequent weeks Glade decided to forfeit he’s place in IEM.
The story goes like this, We were all at dinner celebrating after Blizzard SEA invitationals Glade calls to Iaguz from across the table “Hey Iaguz how would you like to go to China” to which Iaguz replied “%^$ Yeah, thanks man”.
Iaguz is well known among SEA and has been Dubbed “The Gimli Terran” for his striking resemblance to the LotR’s character, As the nickname suggests he plays Terran and has been one of the most consistent performers of his race in SEA tournaments since the games release. He recently joined as a founding member of a new Pro team to emerge in SEA “Xeria Gaming” arguably the strongest SEA player based pro team at the moment.
Iaguz is in a Group with two Terrans- Strelok and Way and Zerg Player- RevivaL, while he is critical of his own TvT it is by no means still terrifying to play, his team mates xGKing.Mafia (3rd place @ Blizzard SEA/ANZ Invitational) and xGKing.Mafia (2nd place @ Blizzard SEA/ANZ Invitational) assure me his TvZ is well up to scratch. Iaguz has been given this chance to so the world what SEA is made of, he will not take this opportunity lightly!
On October 01 2011 11:17 Chris_CityHunter wrote: Hi Diamond, Ive done a write up for these two players feel free to add them if you like, i am more than happy to look after interviews in the future
SEA MEN (Yes we exist)
PiG PiG Qualified for IEM in spectacular fashion 2-0 Moonglade in the Upper Bracket FINAL . While a relatively unknown on the Global Level PiG has been a finalist in SEA comps since the release of SCII last year. While some may argue that players such as Moonglade, xGKing.Mafia. FXO.tGun and xGKing.Jazbas are all stronger Zerg Players overall no denies the PiG’s ZvZ is quite possibly the best in SEA.
Unfortunately for PiG he has no Zergs in his group he faces Terrans YHY and PuMa and Protoss HasuObs, but PiG is fresh off a win in the WCG:Brisbane Qualifier is not doubt wanting to continue he’s success, the rest of this group better watch out PiG is in no way a walkover!
Iaguz
xGKing.Iaguz’s entry into IEM was somewhat different, having placed 3rd behind Moonglade in the Lower Bracket FINAL Iaguz thought he’d missed out once again on a major competition (he’s absence along with FXO.tGun from the Blizzard SEA/ANZ Invitationals was somewhat surprising). However Due to WCG: Australia and Blizzcon Globals falling in subsequent weeks Glade decided to forfeit he’s place in IEM.
The story goes like this, We were all at dinner celebrating after Blizzard SEA invitationals Glade calls to Iaguz from across the table “Hey Iaguz how would you like to go to China” to which Iaguz replied “%^$ Yeah, thanks man”.
Iaguz is well known among SEA and has been Dubbed “The Gimli Terran” so he’s striking resemblance to the LotR’s character, As the nickname suggests he plays Terran and has been one of the most consistent performers of his race in SEA tournaments since the games release. He recently joined as a founding member of a new Pro team to emerge in SEA “Xeria Gaming” arguably the strongest SEA player based pro team at the moment.
Iaguz is in a Group with two Terrans- Strelok Way and Zerg Player- RevivaL, while he critical of his own TvT it is by no means still terrifying to play, his team mates xGKing.Mafia (3rd place @ Blizzard SEA/ANZ Invitational) and xGKing.Mafia (2nd place @ Blizzard SEA/ANZ Invitational) assure me his TvZ is well up to scratch. Iaguz has been given this chance to so the world what SEA is made of, he will not take this opportunity lightly!
Good writeup, could use some grammar editing ^^ maybe they'll add it
DotA and LoL are much much more popular in China and I wasn't too impressed with what I saw from the chinese players in the korean weekly but anyway I'm excited!
C:\Documents and Settings\customer1>ping cn.logon.battle.net
Pinging cn.logon.battle.net [122.198.64.130] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 122.198.64.130: bytes=32 time=273ms TTL=108 Reply from 122.198.64.130: bytes=32 time=275ms TTL=108 Reply from 122.198.64.130: bytes=32 time=279ms TTL=108 Reply from 122.198.64.130: bytes=32 time=275ms TTL=108
Ping statistics for 122.198.64.130: Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss), Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds: Minimum = 273ms, Maximum = 279ms, Average = 275ms
On October 01 2011 10:31 LostBLuE wrote: I love carmac if every big event had the attitude iem has it would be awesome. The only thing is the total prize purse going to one person thing kind of sucks but it is a necessary evil I suppose.
Where does the total prize purse go to one person?
I wish carmac was right about the stream numbers being huge and potentially record breaking for starcraft 2 at this event.
But has anyone noticed that the viewership for starcraft 2 has been on decline over the past month or 2, usually the finals of a tournament still post some impressive numbers but i remember when the first days of tournaments where almost as impressive as the finals a few months ago.
Right now their are only 3000 viewers watching this IEM, that seems really low for the western world. Im sure including the china stream the numbers would be quite a bit higher, but for IEM and their sponsors (aside from intel i guess) their target is the western market regardless of the location they are having the event at.
How does Idra always manage to get the easiest groups... No koreans even, hopefully he can do well for NA. Even luck doesn't seem to help him much lately though.
On October 01 2011 14:29 darkest44 wrote: How does Idra always manage to get the easiest groups... No koreans even, hopefully he can do well for NA. Even luck doesn't seem to help him much lately though.
Yet wouldn't be surprised if he ended up third in his group, Elfi might upset him.
the only thing that bothers me in this article is that he said "white dudes" what is he saying?? all europeans and americans are white?? what about all the brown and black people that play starcraft who live in america... like me... shit... thx for the representation! gosh!
I think one of the interesting things that I took out of the Carmac interview was, "Western players, quit sucking and practice more if you want to have a job in five years."
I really wish xiaOt continued as a player full time because that would have been epic! I hope xigua can live up to Diamonds hype and blow everyone out the water.
Also, it's about time IdrA dominated but with some good Koreans and just Protoss players in general I am unsure.
On October 01 2011 10:31 LostBLuE wrote: I love carmac if every big event had the attitude iem has it would be awesome. The only thing is the total prize purse going to one person thing kind of sucks but it is a necessary evil I suppose.
Where does the total prize purse go to one person?
DreamHack Valencia, where Thorzain comes, makes 4-5 in the finals against DRG after beating Hero and HuK, but still go home with 0€ in the pocket.
On October 01 2011 14:29 darkest44 wrote: How does Idra always manage to get the easiest groups... No koreans even, hopefully he can do well for NA. Even luck doesn't seem to help him much lately though.
WTF? Name 2 more events when he had an easy group. He constantly got the groups of Death in consecutive MLGs and other big offline events
On October 01 2011 15:50 Bacon-X wrote: the only thing that bothers me in this article is that he said "white dudes" what is he saying?? all europeans and americans are white?? what about all the brown and black people that play starcraft who live in america... like me... shit... thx for the representation! gosh!
I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
On October 01 2011 18:47 Paladia wrote: I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
Sure the tournament only got one of the best zergs "Dimaga" in EU and one of the best terran "Strelok" in EU. US only got the best player "Idra" attending. The Chinese only got there best players. And Rain, JYP, Puma, Revival not top Koreans really?
On October 01 2011 15:50 Bacon-X wrote: the only thing that bothers me in this article is that he said "white dudes" what is he saying?? all europeans and americans are white?? what about all the brown and black people that play starcraft who live in america... like me... shit... thx for the representation! gosh!
it's an inside joke....
Yeah, when he says "White dude" he is referring to the time when he made Moon says "Korean owns white dude" back in IEM a year ago.
Puma (lives in America now, btw) won NASL among other feats of bad-assery. Rain came in second back in one of the GSL open seasons, and was a code S player. JYP hasn't done anything super great yet, but I seriously would not at all be surprised to see him in code S in the next season or two. So, the line-up isn't really that weak.
At the same time, I'm not surprised that it's not attracting the huge powerhouse players. IEM has a significantly smaller prize fund than other major SC2 tournaments. The GSL prize fund is approximately $150,000 for example. NASL season 2 is going on right now ($100,000 prize fund), and IPL 3 starts the day after IEM ends ($100,000 prize pool in that too). With only a 21k prize fund at IEM, the players that can't make every event are probably more likely to choose one of the other events over IEM.
Also,
On October 01 2011 18:20 WhiteDog wrote: DreamHack Valencia, where Thorzain comes, makes 4-5 in the finals against DRG after beating Hero and HuK, but still go home with 0€ in the pocket.
At Dreamhack, it was only an 8 player invitational compared with big tournaments like MLG, so having only a prize for 1st makes more sense in this case than others, I think.
On October 01 2011 19:09 jsemmens wrote: At the same time, I'm not surprised that it's not attracting the huge powerhouse players. IEM has a significantly smaller prize fund than other major SC2 tournaments. The GSL prize fund is approximately $150,000 for example. NASL season 2 is going on right now ($100,000 prize fund), and IPL 3 starts the day after IEM ends ($100,000 prize pool in that too). With only a 21k prize fund at IEM, the players that can't make every event are probably more likely to choose one of the other events over IEM.
First of all, the comparision to NASL and GSL is not a good one, because both are tourneys over a significantly longer time span than the IEM. While IPL III has a bigger price pool overall, the chances to win it are also slimmer, because the player pool is deeper.
Furthermore, the finalists of IEM China don´t just win money, but also a spot in the IEM finals in Hanover next year. This one has a price pool of $75.000.
The reason, why this IEM is a little bit less staked is, that the system gives more "hometown" players a chance. Thats why in contrast to IEM Cologne, which feautered several Top EU players (Kas, Socke, Mana etc.), this IEM has a lot of unknown players from china and the SEA region.
However, IMO especially EU is good represented in this tourney. You have one Top player of each race (Hasu, Dima, Strelok) and one up and coming player (elfi). Its still a high competetion.
Carmac always comes across really well in interviews, really makes me feel quite comfortable that he's at the helm of IEM. I imagine LoL will outshine sc2 at this event, being chinese, but im personally looking forward to day 2 of the action.
one reason I feel like why SC2 isnt so popular in china, is that they have to pay per month to play it.. They can't buy a unlimited client for the chinese server, which is pretty dumb imo..
But lets hope some of the Chinese players get somewhat far, so they inspire the Chinese youth open their eyes to SC2..
On October 01 2011 18:47 Paladia wrote: I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
Sure the tournament only got one of the best zergs "Dimaga" in EU and one of the best terran "Strelok" in EU. US only got the best player "Idra" attending. The Chinese only got there best players. And Rain, JYP, Puma, Revival not top Koreans really?
Yea the line-up sure do look weak
As I said, it doesn't have any of the best players from any region.
Players such as Thorzain, Naniwa or Mana from EU.
Huk or Sheth from NA.
MVP, NesTea or DRG from Asia
While people love to dispute who the best players are, I think it is quite apparent that the IEM only got the second grade players, which is quite surprising and sad. Instead of the best it has players like Elfi, Jinro, Idra and YHY.
And no, players like Revival, Rain or JYP are no-where near the top. If anything, they are closer to the bottom. This is without a doubt the weakest line-up I've seen in in a high concept tournament, as it doesn't have a single one of the very top from either regions.
As usual the post quality is good, however I cant help my self but to be annoyed over comments where the authors shows that he hasn't been watching the player that much: "You can't look past how Jinro has been slumping the past few months, but you also have to remember that Jinro's mechanics and skill are still some of the best a foreigner can offer if he is well prepared"
Jinros mechanics aren't really good, honestly. His macro is just supbar if we compare to players like thorzain, strelok, major, and though he has improved his unit control it still isn't that fantastic.
On October 01 2011 18:47 Paladia wrote: I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
Sure the tournament only got one of the best zergs "Dimaga" in EU and one of the best terran "Strelok" in EU. US only got the best player "Idra" attending. The Chinese only got there best players. And Rain, JYP, Puma, Revival not top Koreans really?
Yea the line-up sure do look weak
As I said, it doesn't have any of the best players from any region.
Players such as Thorzain, Naniwa or Mana from EU.
Huk or Sheth from NA.
MVP, NesTea or DRG from Asia
While people love to dispute who the best players are, I think it is quite apparent that the IEM only got the second grade players, which is quite surprising and sad. Instead of the best it has players like Elfi, Jinro, Idra and YHY.
And no, players like Revival, Rain or JYP are no-where near the top. If anything, they are closer to the bottom. This is without a doubt the weakest line-up I've seen in in a high concept tournament, as it doesn't have a single one of the very top from either regions.
Well they need to qualify and they couldn't so those players in IEM atm deserve to be here. The great thing about IEM is that you have to qualify to get to play in IEM. So no matter how much you think how good those players are the fact of the matter is they didn't qualify.
Personally I like this format much better then the invitational tournaments
On October 01 2011 18:47 Paladia wrote: I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
Sure the tournament only got one of the best zergs "Dimaga" in EU and one of the best terran "Strelok" in EU. US only got the best player "Idra" attending. The Chinese only got there best players. And Rain, JYP, Puma, Revival not top Koreans really?
Yea the line-up sure do look weak
As I said, it doesn't have any of the best players from any region.
Players such as Thorzain, Naniwa or Mana from EU.
Huk or Sheth from NA.
MVP, NesTea or DRG from Asia
While people love to dispute who the best players are, I think it is quite apparent that the IEM only got the second grade players, which is quite surprising and sad. Instead of the best it has players like Elfi, Jinro, Idra and YHY.
And no, players like Revival, Rain or JYP are no-where near the top. If anything, they are closer to the bottom. This is without a doubt the weakest line-up I've seen in in a high concept tournament, as it doesn't have a single one of the very top from either regions.
Well they need to qualify and they couldn't so those players in IEM atm deserve to be here. The great thing about IEM is that you have to qualify to get to play in IEM. So no matter how much you think how good those players are the fact of the matter is they didn't qualify.
Personally I like this format much better then the invitational tournaments
None of the players I mentioned "couldn't qualify". It is that either they qualified but didn't even bother to go (such as Mana), didn't have a qualifier (such as MVP, Nestea or DRG) or didn't even enter the qualifier. Either way, the tournament lacks all of the top players, which is really too bad.
I've not stated whose fault it is, I just pointed out that the tournament lacks the top players. IEM can either be happy about that and continue with their 3k viewers on the stream for the tournament, or attempt to step it up for the future. Though part of that failure isn't just the lack of top players but also their inability to broadcast the stream on the correct channels.
Stephano streaming his ladder grind had more viewers than the IEM tournament stream, which has to be seen as a complete failure. Carmac is good in may ways but he isn't very into the SC2 community, I really hope he takes responsibility for this though and fixes it for the future. For what's the point in having a tournament if no one sees? There arent even any vods or rebroadcasts so there is little chance for anyone to ever see it.
On October 01 2011 18:47 Paladia wrote: I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
Sure the tournament only got one of the best zergs "Dimaga" in EU and one of the best terran "Strelok" in EU. US only got the best player "Idra" attending. The Chinese only got there best players. And Rain, JYP, Puma, Revival not top Koreans really?
Yea the line-up sure do look weak
As I said, it doesn't have any of the best players from any region.
Players such as Thorzain, Naniwa or Mana from EU.
Huk or Sheth from NA.
MVP, NesTea or DRG from Asia
While people love to dispute who the best players are, I think it is quite apparent that the IEM only got the second grade players, which is quite surprising and sad. Instead of the best it has players like Elfi, Jinro, Idra and YHY.
And no, players like Revival, Rain or JYP are no-where near the top. If anything, they are closer to the bottom. This is without a doubt the weakest line-up I've seen in in a high concept tournament, as it doesn't have a single one of the very top from either regions.
Well they need to qualify and they couldn't so those players in IEM atm deserve to be here. The great thing about IEM is that you have to qualify to get to play in IEM. So no matter how much you think how good those players are the fact of the matter is they didn't qualify.
Personally I like this format much better then the invitational tournaments
None of the players I mentioned "couldn't qualify". It is that either they qualified but didn't even bother to go (such as Mana), didn't have a qualifier (such as MVP, Nestea or DRG) or didn't even enter the qualifier. Either way, the tournament lacks all of the top players, which is really too bad.
I've not stated whose fault it is, I just pointed out that the tournament lacks the top players. IEM can either be happy about that and continue with their 3k viewers on the stream for the tournament, or attempt to step it up for the future. Though part of that failure isn't just the lack of top players but also their inability to broadcast the stream on the correct channels.
Stephano streaming his ladder grind had more viewers than the IEM tournament stream, which has to be seen as a complete failure. Carmac is good in may ways but he isn't very into the SC2 community, I really hope he takes responsibility for this though and fixes it for the future. For what's the point in having a tournament if no one sees? There arent even any vods or rebroadcasts so there is little chance for anyone to ever see it.
Whatever don't watch it then. Just because you as fan clearly favor the player of the month doesn't mean that IEM have to invite the best of the best. There is so many players in the world and IEM is trying to showcase the best from China and SEA and I think its great for the international scene to give up and coming players like JYP like Revival,XiGua a chance to show them self.
And 3k viewers ?? they had around 10k viewers on the English stream and properly a lot more on the Chinese stream when they ended day 1. That´s really good considering it was played very early in the morning for EU and US.
On October 01 2011 18:47 Paladia wrote: I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
Sure the tournament only got one of the best zergs "Dimaga" in EU and one of the best terran "Strelok" in EU. US only got the best player "Idra" attending. The Chinese only got there best players. And Rain, JYP, Puma, Revival not top Koreans really?
Yea the line-up sure do look weak
As I said, it doesn't have any of the best players from any region.
Players such as Thorzain, Naniwa or Mana from EU.
Huk or Sheth from NA.
MVP, NesTea or DRG from Asia
While people love to dispute who the best players are, I think it is quite apparent that the IEM only got the second grade players, which is quite surprising and sad. Instead of the best it has players like Elfi, Jinro, Idra and YHY.
And no, players like Revival, Rain or JYP are no-where near the top. If anything, they are closer to the bottom. This is without a doubt the weakest line-up I've seen in in a high concept tournament, as it doesn't have a single one of the very top from either regions.
Well they need to qualify and they couldn't so those players in IEM atm deserve to be here. The great thing about IEM is that you have to qualify to get to play in IEM. So no matter how much you think how good those players are the fact of the matter is they didn't qualify.
Personally I like this format much better then the invitational tournaments
None of the players I mentioned "couldn't qualify". It is that either they qualified but didn't even bother to go (such as Mana), didn't have a qualifier (such as MVP, Nestea or DRG) or didn't even enter the qualifier. Either way, the tournament lacks all of the top players, which is really too bad.
I've not stated whose fault it is, I just pointed out that the tournament lacks the top players. IEM can either be happy about that and continue with their 3k viewers on the stream for the tournament, or attempt to step it up for the future. Though part of that failure isn't just the lack of top players but also their inability to broadcast the stream on the correct channels.
Stephano streaming his ladder grind had more viewers than the IEM tournament stream, which has to be seen as a complete failure. Carmac is good in may ways but he isn't very into the SC2 community, I really hope he takes responsibility for this though and fixes it for the future. For what's the point in having a tournament if no one sees? There arent even any vods or rebroadcasts so there is little chance for anyone to ever see it.
Whatever don't watch it then. Just because you as fan clearly favor the player of the month doesn't mean that IEM have to invite the best of the best. There is so many players in the world and IEM is trying to showcase the best from China and SEA and I think its great for the international scene to give up and coming players like JYP like Revival,XiGua a chance to show them self.
And 3k viewers ?? they had around 10k viewers on the English stream and properly a lot more on the Chinese stream when they ended day 1. That´s really good considering it was played very early in the morning for EU and US.
Haters gonna hate
Yes, when I check it had 3k viewers, less than Stephanos stream.
Of course, one can be as you and praise everything and flame all criticism but then nothing will ever improve. You have to give feedback for things to improve. A lot of things went wrong in this tournament, no vods, no rebroadcast (it was early as you say), lack of top tier players and not to mention that they didn't get the stream out to the proper channels. It wasn't mentioned on the front page of any of the larger SC2 sites, such as TL, Gosugamers or Rakaka.
So instead of writing random posts flaming people, write constructive feedback instead. As what you are doing is killing esports, it will never go anywhere unless there is feedback and improvement. Intel may very well stop sponsoring these tournaments due to the low viewer count, which isn't due to the lack of interest in SC2 tournaments but due to the lack of getting the stream out there on the proper channels (and to some degree not having the top players there).
On October 01 2011 18:47 Paladia wrote: I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
Sure the tournament only got one of the best zergs "Dimaga" in EU and one of the best terran "Strelok" in EU. US only got the best player "Idra" attending. The Chinese only got there best players. And Rain, JYP, Puma, Revival not top Koreans really?
Yea the line-up sure do look weak
As I said, it doesn't have any of the best players from any region.
Players such as Thorzain, Naniwa or Mana from EU.
Huk or Sheth from NA.
MVP, NesTea or DRG from Asia
While people love to dispute who the best players are, I think it is quite apparent that the IEM only got the second grade players, which is quite surprising and sad. Instead of the best it has players like Elfi, Jinro, Idra and YHY.
And no, players like Revival, Rain or JYP are no-where near the top. If anything, they are closer to the bottom. This is without a doubt the weakest line-up I've seen in in a high concept tournament, as it doesn't have a single one of the very top from either regions.
Well they need to qualify and they couldn't so those players in IEM atm deserve to be here. The great thing about IEM is that you have to qualify to get to play in IEM. So no matter how much you think how good those players are the fact of the matter is they didn't qualify.
Personally I like this format much better then the invitational tournaments
None of the players I mentioned "couldn't qualify". It is that either they qualified but didn't even bother to go (such as Mana), didn't have a qualifier (such as MVP, Nestea or DRG) or didn't even enter the qualifier. Either way, the tournament lacks all of the top players, which is really too bad.
I've not stated whose fault it is, I just pointed out that the tournament lacks the top players. IEM can either be happy about that and continue with their 3k viewers on the stream for the tournament, or attempt to step it up for the future. Though part of that failure isn't just the lack of top players but also their inability to broadcast the stream on the correct channels.
Stephano streaming his ladder grind had more viewers than the IEM tournament stream, which has to be seen as a complete failure. Carmac is good in may ways but he isn't very into the SC2 community, I really hope he takes responsibility for this though and fixes it for the future. For what's the point in having a tournament if no one sees? There arent even any vods or rebroadcasts so there is little chance for anyone to ever see it.
Whatever don't watch it then. Just because you as fan clearly favor the player of the month doesn't mean that IEM have to invite the best of the best. There is so many players in the world and IEM is trying to showcase the best from China and SEA and I think its great for the international scene to give up and coming players like JYP like Revival,XiGua a chance to show them self.
And 3k viewers ?? they had around 10k viewers on the English stream and properly a lot more on the Chinese stream when they ended day 1. That´s really good considering it was played very early in the morning for EU and US.
Haters gonna hate
Yes, when I check it had 3k viewers, less than Stephanos stream.
Of course, one can be as you and praise everything and flame all criticism but then nothing will ever improve. You have to give feedback for things to improve. A lot of things went wrong in this tournament, no vods, no rebroadcast (it was early as you say), lack of top tier players and not to mention that they didn't get the stream out to the proper channels. It wasn't mentioned on the front page of any of the larger SC2 sites, such as TL, Gosugamers or Rakaka.
So instead of writing random posts flaming people, write constructive feedback instead. As what you are doing is killing esports, it will never go anywhere unless there is feedback and improvement. Intel may very well stop sponsoring these tournaments due to the low viewer count, which isn't due to the lack of interest in SC2 tournaments but due to the lack of getting the stream out there on the proper channels (and to some degree not having the top players there).
Killing esport o.0?
One thing is to write constructive feedback and one thing is to whine why my favorite players isn't playing.
Killing esports because I like a tournament that do qualifiers in each region to showcase the hole international scene and there up and coming players? Holy drama queen
On October 01 2011 18:47 Paladia wrote: I have to say that this is likely the weakest line-up I've seen for a very long time in one of the major tournaments. It doesn't feature any of the power houses from any of the regions.
Sure the tournament only got one of the best zergs "Dimaga" in EU and one of the best terran "Strelok" in EU. US only got the best player "Idra" attending. The Chinese only got there best players. And Rain, JYP, Puma, Revival not top Koreans really?
Yea the line-up sure do look weak
As I said, it doesn't have any of the best players from any region.
Players such as Thorzain, Naniwa or Mana from EU.
Huk or Sheth from NA.
MVP, NesTea or DRG from Asia
While people love to dispute who the best players are, I think it is quite apparent that the IEM only got the second grade players, which is quite surprising and sad. Instead of the best it has players like Elfi, Jinro, Idra and YHY.
And no, players like Revival, Rain or JYP are no-where near the top. If anything, they are closer to the bottom. This is without a doubt the weakest line-up I've seen in in a high concept tournament, as it doesn't have a single one of the very top from either regions.
Well they need to qualify and they couldn't so those players in IEM atm deserve to be here. The great thing about IEM is that you have to qualify to get to play in IEM. So no matter how much you think how good those players are the fact of the matter is they didn't qualify.
Personally I like this format much better then the invitational tournaments
None of the players I mentioned "couldn't qualify". It is that either they qualified but didn't even bother to go (such as Mana), didn't have a qualifier (such as MVP, Nestea or DRG) or didn't even enter the qualifier. Either way, the tournament lacks all of the top players, which is really too bad.
I've not stated whose fault it is, I just pointed out that the tournament lacks the top players. IEM can either be happy about that and continue with their 3k viewers on the stream for the tournament, or attempt to step it up for the future. Though part of that failure isn't just the lack of top players but also their inability to broadcast the stream on the correct channels.
Stephano streaming his ladder grind had more viewers than the IEM tournament stream, which has to be seen as a complete failure. Carmac is good in may ways but he isn't very into the SC2 community, I really hope he takes responsibility for this though and fixes it for the future. For what's the point in having a tournament if no one sees? There arent even any vods or rebroadcasts so there is little chance for anyone to ever see it.
Whatever don't watch it then. Just because you as fan clearly favor the player of the month doesn't mean that IEM have to invite the best of the best. There is so many players in the world and IEM is trying to showcase the best from China and SEA and I think its great for the international scene to give up and coming players like JYP like Revival,XiGua a chance to show them self.
And 3k viewers ?? they had around 10k viewers on the English stream and properly a lot more on the Chinese stream when they ended day 1. That´s really good considering it was played very early in the morning for EU and US.
Haters gonna hate
Yes, when I check it had 3k viewers, less than Stephanos stream.
Of course, one can be as you and praise everything and flame all criticism but then nothing will ever improve. You have to give feedback for things to improve. A lot of things went wrong in this tournament, no vods, no rebroadcast (it was early as you say), lack of top tier players and not to mention that they didn't get the stream out to the proper channels. It wasn't mentioned on the front page of any of the larger SC2 sites, such as TL, Gosugamers or Rakaka.
So instead of writing random posts flaming people, write constructive feedback instead. As what you are doing is killing esports, it will never go anywhere unless there is feedback and improvement. Intel may very well stop sponsoring these tournaments due to the low viewer count, which isn't due to the lack of interest in SC2 tournaments but due to the lack of getting the stream out there on the proper channels (and to some degree not having the top players there).
Underwhelming? Yes because of hours they couldnt crank up any international numbers, also some players are out of place. But is it making it a bad tournament? No.
I have to say I really like what Carmac has to say about "Investments," He seems very mind full of the localization of professional sc2. I am from the west coast of USA and I would love to see more localized tournaments and play. Props Carmac I will start following IEM whole heartedly.
I wasn't all that impressed with the Chinese play honestly, but it's nice to see them competing at least. I really do hope they are able to progress in to the mainstream SC2 scene. Was a fun night all together, and IEM always does a great job setting everything up =D
Strelok was the only one with a chance against Puma (JYP didnt live up to the expectations). If not for the ridiculous admin blunder he would've faced Puma after Idra (I think, he is capable of winning against Idra, besides it would've been a hell of a game in general). Now I dont really see how anyone can beat Puma. qq
Great article. It's been a really cool tournament. Lots of upsets and people barely getting out of their groups... Can't wait to see how finals turn out.
On October 01 2011 10:01 Carmac wrote: I am told SC2 is not THAT hot in China (PC bangs cannot support it), so I might turn out looking like an ass soon =)
What do they play at the PC bangs then? There still was a decent amount of people who is in the camera view at IEM. GSL finals have a lot more audience, but the intel audience in Guangzhou fills a small auditorium quite nicely.
On October 01 2011 10:01 Carmac wrote: I am told SC2 is not THAT hot in China (PC bangs cannot support it), so I might turn out looking like an ass soon =)
What do they play at the PC bangs then? There still was a decent amount of people who is in the camera view at IEM. GSL finals have a lot more audience, but the intel audience in Guangzhou fills a small auditorium quite nicely.
Carmac is right, SC2 is not doing well in China.
SC2 May 2011 stat posted by "some guy in a forum", I am just reposting it. I repeat these are NOT VERIFIED!
Note: these number are the maximum number of players on ladder. If you look at China it might not seem that bad at first, but the problem is, most(all?) of the 192,540 ppl playing are on 1 Month Pass. ATM forums are reporting the Chinese server as "ghost servers".
edit: Some SC2 players are blaming the situation on the Chinese media and Blizz. The media in China is not exactly on SC2's side, every now and then, the main sites will write an article about how "sc2 failed, gonna fail, horrible imba, etc etc". As for the Blizz blame...I don't want to start a xx vs xx2 war...
On October 01 2011 10:01 Carmac wrote: I am told SC2 is not THAT hot in China (PC bangs cannot support it), so I might turn out looking like an ass soon =)
What do they play at the PC bangs then? There still was a decent amount of people who is in the camera view at IEM. GSL finals have a lot more audience, but the intel audience in Guangzhou fills a small auditorium quite nicely.
Carmac is right, SC2 is not doing well in China.
SC2 May 2011 stat posted by "some guy in a forum", I am just reposting it. I repeat these are NOT VERIFIED!
Note: these number are the maximum number of players on ladder. If you look at China it might not seem that bad at first, but the problem is, most(all?) of the 192,540 ppl playing are on 1 Month Pass. ATM forums are reporting the Chinese server as "ghost servers".
edit: Some SC2 players are blaming the situation on the Chinese media and Blizz. The media in China is not exactly on SC2's side, every now and then, the main sites will write an article about how "sc2 failed, gonna fail, horrible imba, etc etc". As for the Blizz blame...I don't want to start a xx vs xx2 war...
But there is a piece of good news. Plu.cn(biggest sc/sc2 site in china) manage to get the broadcast right for WCG. Their caster has a huge cult following like tastosis. This will bring many BW viewers to sc2.
IdrA's performance here may actually be the deciding point we look back at in 10 years and say, this is when Greg Fields grew up, learned to handle his emotions and showed his capability. Really impressed!
'In a sharp departure from our usual behavior, us North American fans are counting on the Koreans to dominate the foreigners at IEM Guangzhou. Though we're resigned to the fact that Europe is just better, at least we have the comfort of knowing we're not the worst Starcraft II playing region in the world"
Is it over yet? I can't bear to watch what happened to the poor defenseless american. I have my stuffed animal Hobbes me with me and a box of chocolates, going to check the results.
what the hell with the comments in the post-game interview? am i the only one that thought it was unnecessary for him to more or less talk crap about elfi after his win? have some freaking tact.
was rooting for idra, but his comments after the games really made me wish elfi had won.
Idra the man and I think he gonna be winning alot more tournaments from now on, he can talk what ever trash he wants about elfi, most of his fans love the trash talk.