On July 10 2008 00:39 ThePhan2m wrote: When it comes to Lucifer, I never said he should have gotten high spot on PR, he should have gotten one of the last spots on PR, maybe instead of Pure
This right here raises alarm bells in my head. Pure vs Lucifer was one of the things on last month's PR that was absolutely not up for debate. I don't understand how anyone can watch the two of them play and think Lucifer was playing better.
But, since you took the time to write all of that, I owe you an explanation about Best.
Here's the thing: The top spots on the PR are earned, not handed out. Flash and Jaedong have been the two best players for quite a while, and both of them are still performing at the level to which we are accustomed. I understand where you're coming from, but Flash and Jaedong have been this good for much longer than Best has, and consistancy is something that should be rewarded.
Additionally, the leagues aren't even finished yet. If Best were to win OSL, and neither Flash nor Jaedong won MSL, you can count on Best taking the top spot. As it stands right now, Flash and Jaedong are both fresh off of StarLeague wins, and look like they'll meet in the MSL final.
Straight results simply aren't enough to make an accurate Power Rank. The top spot goes to the best player on earth, and without a little more to boast, Best can't take it without Jaedong or Flash playing worse than usual.
It's rather unfortunate for Best that the leagues were at the stage they were at when the PR came out. There are still unanswered questions about him. Will the finals stage intimidate him? Can he handle July's unique style? Can he sustain his high level of play for more than a single league, or will he become a protoss GGPlay? Until those questions are answered, Best can't have the top spot.
Basically the bottom line is that Best is playing exceptionally well, but so are Jaedong and Flash, and there's nothing yet that indicates Best is playing better than those two. Also, Best hasn't played the OSL final yet, and it would be nothing but sensible to wait until that happens before claiming he's superior to Flash or Jaedong.
Their respective records for the month have so little to do with it that I'm surprised you brought them up in the first place.
On July 10 2008 00:39 ThePhan2m wrote: When it comes to Lucifer, I never said he should have gotten high spot on PR, he should have gotten one of the last spots on PR, maybe instead of Pure
This right here raises alarm bells in my head. Pure vs Lucifer was one of the things on last month's PR that was absolutely not up for debate. I don't understand how anyone can watch the two of them play and think Lucifer was playing better.
But, since you took the time to write all of that, I owe you an explanation about Best.
Here's the thing: The top spots on the PR are earned, not handed out. Flash and Jaedong have been the two best players for quite a while, and both of them are still performing at the level to which we are accustomed. I understand where you're coming from, but Flash and Jaedong have been this good for much longer than Best has, and consistancy is something that should be rewarded.
Additionally, the leagues aren't even finished yet. If Best were to win OSL, and neither Flash nor Jaedong won MSL, you can count on Best taking the top spot. As it stands right now, Flash and Jaedong are both fresh off of StarLeague wins, and look like they'll meet in the MSL final.
Straight results simply aren't enough to make an accurate Power Rank. The top spot goes to the best player on earth, and without a little more to boast, Best can't take it without Jaedong or Flash playing worse than usual.
It's rather unfortunate for Best that the leagues were at the stage they were at when the PR came out. There are still unanswered questions about him. Will the finals stage intimidate him? Can he handle July's unique style? Can he sustain his high level of play for more than a single league, or will he become a protoss GGPlay? Until those questions are answered, Best can't have the top spot.
On July 10 2008 05:53 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote: Hey now, I like Best
Well i don't know if it is better to be GGplay then Stork .GGplay has won at least an OSL but stork has won more special events . Frankly after seeing their PvZ/ZvP on andromeda if i had to choose to be progamer i wouldn't want to be both of them , but then again i wouldn't want to be an andromeda either . The map is becomeing a who can out expand and out turtle the other player to win in PvZ .
thanks for the explenation, now that clears things up.
However, Best is no way GGplay. GGplay didnt play like Best does now, he went trough OSL with lucky oppnements, he never really had it. Tbh whole that OSL was a joke, and GGplay winning that OSL was just showing Gods big joke of luck prepared for the BW world. Maybe a Stork, maybe... guess we only have to wait and see. There is more than just skills that we have to take into count. Sadly enough, there will be alot of pressure on Best. But anyhow, Julyzerg hasnt really shown his strenght yet either? To think he is the old July, the war of God is to be hopeful, his former oppenements hasnt exactly been top players. SO SATURDAY! here we come! *drums*
On July 10 2008 06:49 ThePhan2m wrote: thanks for the explenation, now that clears things up.
However, Best is no way GGplay. GGplay didnt play like Best does now, he went trough OSL with lucky oppnements, he never really had it. Tbh whole that OSL was a joke, and GGplay winning that OSL was just showing Gods big joke of luck prepared for the BW world. Maybe a Stork, maybe... guess we only have to wait and see. There is more than just skills that we have to take into count. Sadly enough, there will be alot of pressure on Best. But anyhow, Julyzerg hasnt really shown his strenght yet either? To think he is the old July, the war of God is to be hopeful, his former oppenements hasnt exactly been top players. SO SATURDAY! here we come! *drums*
Lol ?
GGplay a joke ? He had to beat Hwasin first (who is always very good in TvZ), then Flash (who has always been a TvZ monster ) then defeated Iris in 5 brillant set That OSL was a joke ? Seriously it produced the best TvZ of 2007, a lot of amazing series, it was one of the Best OSL seriously (savior vs iris, hwasin vs GGplay, Flash vs GGplay, iris vs GGplay, the other matchup i dont remember) Lucky opponents ? O_O
On July 10 2008 06:49 ThePhan2m wrote: thanks for the explenation, now that clears things up.
However, Best is no way GGplay. GGplay didnt play like Best does now, he went trough OSL with lucky oppnements, he never really had it. Tbh whole that OSL was a joke, and GGplay winning that OSL was just showing Gods big joke of luck prepared for the BW world. Maybe a Stork, maybe... guess we only have to wait and see. There is more than just skills that we have to take into count. Sadly enough, there will be alot of pressure on Best. But anyhow, Julyzerg hasnt really shown his strenght yet either? To think he is the old July, the war of God is to be hopeful, his former oppenements hasnt exactly been top players. SO SATURDAY! here we come! *drums*
You're so wrong it hurts. GGPlay played some of the best ZvT i've ever seen during his OSL run, but faded afterwards
That finals series. It was just unbelievable. Both of them disappeared afterwards, one of them having lost the fire and the other having their dreams crushed. But in that game with all the glory for the win, 2-2, playing for that epic comeback it was just perfect. As much as I dislike any leagues where sAviOr doesn't sex things up that OSL was awesome.
Coming back from a 0-2 deficit in the midst of the OSL finals is quite impressive. Once GGPlay reached 4 gas, it was over. Some of the best Hive play I've ever seen against very top tier terrans.
This OSL however, no one can deny that July had an easy route to the Finals. Rock, then Backho. PvZ chumps.
i really like leta and he has been playing very good tvt lately
backho isnt really a lesser player anymore since he has been dominating pros like bisu and jaedgon (was it jaedong?) all over the place and knocking them out i really dislike backho as well and hate his play but you have to admit that he has some skills
forgg is ranked way too high, he is going to get slaughtered by flash
also, have you seen the games of hwasin vs jaedong? he didnt get "totalled", he played extremely well and several of the plays can be pimpest play candidates, like hwasin's m&m micro vs lurkers and winning the battle that he shouldnt have been able to win, with 1 marine left alive. it was an exciting series to say the least and it isn't like jaedong was able to push hwasin over easily, he just made a couple of mistakes taht cost him the victory
[edit] i was making a case for best but i saw your explanation but i think that since the powerrank is done monthly, it should reflect the best player of the month. consistency should not be the main thing, but performance. and with that, best is undoubtedly number 1. his comeback vs luxury was simply epic
On July 10 2008 15:19 kpcrew(Gg) wrote: [edit] i was making a case for best but i saw your explanation but i think that since the powerrank is done monthly, it should reflect the best player of the month. consistency should not be the main thing, but performance. and with that, best is undoubtedly number 1. his comeback vs luxury was simply epic
Yeah, an epic choke by Luxury. Wasn't Bests win, it was Luxury's loss.
On July 10 2008 15:19 kpcrew(Gg) wrote: i really like leta and he has been playing very good tvt lately
backho isnt really a lesser player anymore since he has been dominating pros like bisu and jaedgon (was it jaedong?) all over the place and knocking them out i really dislike backho as well and hate his play but you have to admit that he has some skills
forgg is ranked way too high, he is going to get slaughtered by flash
also, have you seen the games of hwasin vs jaedong? he didnt get "totalled", he played extremely well and several of the plays can be pimpest play candidates, like hwasin's m&m micro vs lurkers and winning the battle that he shouldnt have been able to win, with 1 marine left alive. it was an exciting series to say the least and it isn't like jaedong was able to push hwasin over easily, he just made a couple of mistakes taht cost him the victory
[edit] i was making a case for best but i saw your explanation but i think that since the powerrank is done monthly, it should reflect the best player of the month. consistency should not be the main thing, but performance. and with that, best is undoubtedly number 1. his comeback vs luxury was simply epic
You do not attack 5 lurkers burrowed with MnM no matter how great your micro is he could have iradiated 4 or 2 with his vessels then go in .He was able to kill the lurkers but at what cost microing his ass of losing his army and vessels .And please Best barely won 1 series vs zerg and has played only PvP's JD has been rapeing in all 3 MUs .And please don't write stuff like best is on a 12321312311 games winning streak .
Hey Steve, I just have a sort of random question. Do you also look at "unofficial" matches when you're deciding? (I'm thinking mostly of the averatec-intel tournament) I'm just curious. Also, if you do look at them, do the players performances carry less weight than in the official matches?
On July 10 2008 21:51 elias poncho wrote: Hey Steve, I just have a sort of random question. Do you also look at "unofficial" matches when you're deciding? (I'm thinking mostly of the averatec-intel tournament) I'm just curious. Also, if you do look at them, do the players performances carry less weight than in the official matches?
I do, but the quality of opponent is often drastically lower in something like the averatec-intel classic. things like WWI i give absolutely no credit for
On July 10 2008 15:19 kpcrew(Gg) wrote: i really like leta and he has been playing very good tvt lately
backho isnt really a lesser player anymore since he has been dominating pros like bisu and jaedgon (was it jaedong?) all over the place and knocking them out i really dislike backho as well and hate his play but you have to admit that he has some skills
forgg is ranked way too high, he is going to get slaughtered by flash
also, have you seen the games of hwasin vs jaedong? he didnt get "totalled", he played extremely well and several of the plays can be pimpest play candidates, like hwasin's m&m micro vs lurkers and winning the battle that he shouldnt have been able to win, with 1 marine left alive. it was an exciting series to say the least and it isn't like jaedong was able to push hwasin over easily, he just made a couple of mistakes taht cost him the victory
[edit] i was making a case for best but i saw your explanation but i think that since the powerrank is done monthly, it should reflect the best player of the month. consistency should not be the main thing, but performance. and with that, best is undoubtedly number 1. his comeback vs luxury was simply epic
You do not attack 5 lurkers burrowed with MnM no matter how great your micro is he could have iradiated 4 or 2 with his vessels then go in .He was able to kill the lurkers but at what cost microing his ass of losing his army and vessels .And please Best barely won 1 series vs zerg and has played only PvP's JD has been rapeing in all 3 MUs .And please don't write stuff like best is on a 12321312311 games winning streak .
You can attack burrowed lurkers with marine medic. It's not hard, I do it all the time. I play SK style in like every TvZ I play and I bulldoze lurkers with relative ease
Its all positioning and upgrades, but yeah you can mow lurkers down same as anything else
On July 10 2008 21:51 elias poncho wrote: Hey Steve, I just have a sort of random question. Do you also look at "unofficial" matches when you're deciding? (I'm thinking mostly of the averatec-intel tournament) I'm just curious. Also, if you do look at them, do the players performances carry less weight than in the official matches?
I do, but the quality of opponent is often drastically lower in something like the averatec-intel classic. things like WWI i give absolutely no credit for
Great ranking. I laugh at everyone who is flipping out about Sea being #1. Sea seems like an awesome guy and I'm glad you decided to pay tribute to the Korean who is willing to contribute to and entertain us foreigners here at TL.