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@eneyeseekay
-Sorry, I should have been clearer. For all 3 races I use tab for small groups of units that are scouting or harassing. For Terran/Protoss I use alt-Q for cc/nexus, alt-w for barracks/gates, alt-e for factory/robo, alt-r for ports/stargates. As you can see, it is super intuitive going between the two. For zerg, I use alt-q for all hatcheries, I use alt-w for main, alt-e for natural, alt-r for third. If I want to produce a bunch of units and I don't care where they come from I just use alt-q, if I need to be more specific I can. I believe this is very close to the suggested usage you have.
-Mouseless backspace is really, really good, but for whatever reason in the early game I've fallen into the habit of going to a base using the camera location hoteky, selecting the queen and injecting manually. I'm currently trying to break that habit, because while it does offer some control it is slow and clunky. I think I was just frustrated with wandering queens and did it this way as a temporary solution. My next 15-20 games are actually dedicated to getting my injects more fluid. I'm just having trouble with queen wandering when I have more hatches than queens.
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On June 26 2013 19:47 Orgganon wrote: - the most important change i made and the one i'd think most ppl should consider (and i have to thank to Jak and thecore crew) is changing the add to control group from shift+key to Ctrl+key. what this alows is to reduce the number of keypresses. when i warp in 5 dt's and 4 stalkers and 2 zealots i intend to put them in different CG's so i Ctrl+Click on 1 unit and then CG key then Ctrl+click on the next unit and the next CG key... without ever letting go of Ctrl. (fleetkeys and thecore) as long as you acknowledge the ppl who took that to you!
Now it all makes sense! One of the reasons I chose fleetkeys over the core was because of the wonky usage of shift and ctrl in the core. I can definitely see how this is desirable for protoss. It seems less useful for zerg/terran though.
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@naxi it depends on what u get used to, i still use thecore for zerg and fleetkeys for toss and won't trade that Crtl to add cause it applies to egg hotkeying too. if you are making mutas and lings, for example, u make mutas till u run out of gas and the rest is lings. so --> select hatcheries (and larvae) --> press muta key till it can't produce anymore --> Ctrl + click on eggs in the midle box to select all eggs --> just press CG for mutas with Ctrl still pressed --> repeat process for lings till larvae runs out or supply cap
and again, not yet grabbed terran so can't really put it into practice but shouldn't be that different for those who don't have a clear idea, to do the same with the normal keyset u have to -->Ctrl+click on units/eggs to select -->Shift+CG key to add to CG so your pinkie has to bounce from Ctrl to Shift everytime
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@orgganon
Heyyy it's pretty cool to see someone who uses both layouts, you're actually the first I've seen so far. Usually when it comes to layouts people tend to want to pick up and stick with only one. Do you find it hard to juggle both? What's that "firm user and defender of TheCore declaration all about"? It's really not necessary-- I don't think you'll be getting attacked, hahaha.
Regarding your changes and other points---
-How does changing Alt+A to V work when you want to use A,S,D or F, or the very infrequently used keys along Z-V? Wouldn't that cause you to jump directly to a camera? There are a lot of bindings on A-S and some on D. How does that work?
-Have you tried injects with the Zerg version of Alloy? It's pretty tight. You can use the Backspace method, the Mouseless Backspace method (eliminates the need to click on all of your Hatcheries), Camera (aka Layered) Injects, which in my opinion works extremely well with Fleet Keys, and then there's always the Minimap method, and the Rapidfire Minimap method. To sum it up, Zerg with Fleet keys is actually quite efficient as a result of necessary, focused racial optimization. I had to provide Zerg with its own hotkey file because of the results of it. Refinements in Injects was the main reason.
-When it comes to Warp-ins, you can use Alt+MMB to select your Warpgates. I would still recommend Q for Warpgates so you can check them quick, but I think accessing them with Alt+MMB is sick. You can Warp-in really easily-- Alt(hold)+cam, MMB, then Warp-in units. Pretty simple and easy. You don't even have to do it in that order. Cam first, Warpgates first, it doesn't matter.
-The Ctrl+ for adding is a neat improvement for layouts like TheCore, BaseJ and Iron Grid or other layouts that use the thumb for modifiers. In using Fleet Keys your modifiers are pressed with your pinky and Alt is used with your thumb. I have fairly large hands myself and anchoring my pinky to Ctrl while reaching for 1-5 is quite a difficult stretch, so I can't see Ctrl for adding being a key feature of the layout. The goal of Fleet Keys was never to achieve the least amount of keystrokes by any means necessary. I wouldn't encourage the use of a traditional keyboard and basic mouse if that was the goal. It tries to find a middle ground, one where you only gain ability and keep ability, but not lose it. Whether it's through increased efficiency through key proximity, familiarity, a generally lower learning curve, it doesn't really matter as long as it improved your play in some way without completely re-wiring your brain.
-The Subroup switching on MMB is interesting and I suppose you could do that, but you'd forego the beloved Drag Scroll feature! Are you using tabbed production and not want F1 and F2? As it stands, Alt+MMB is for selecting Warpgates, and Shift+MMB lets you Center on Current Selection. I actually have F1 and F2 set to next/previous subgroups because I don't push for tabbed production by default, and I never expect users to have side buttons on their mouse, but I feel like it should have some presence on the board. If you put upgrades/tech on R, then it works pretty good. If one were to use tabbed production, I'd recommend keeping the Next/Previous Subgroup Selection buttons on the forward and back side mouse buttons. Even the crew working on TheCore seem agree to agree on that.
Fun Fact: When I first developed Fleet Keys (still applies to Element and Alloy to this day!) I had the side mouse buttons suggested to be used as next/previous subgroups. Those were my suggested bindings that I found were the best, and when possible, encouraged the use of them in that fashion. The suggested MMB usage changed slightly, but the side button bindings stayed! Where's the credit and rights for that? wtf?! (totally kidding). In all seriousness though, use side mouse buttons for tabbed production if possible-- it's good!
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ok, so i made that "declaration" cause i've seen a lot of nerd rage against Jak and thecore developers in regards of their league placement and stuff... (why the hell does it matter where u are placed for ppl to take you serious? Catz isn't top 8 GM in America and he comes up with insane strats before the whole world and ppl still take him into account! the same for WhiteRa). nevertheless, i think ppl like you and Jak (along with all developers) deserve the credit for time and work put into these things (which is a lot!)
injects: haven't tried the fleet with zerg yet since i started playing toss haven't played zerg but the minimap rapidfire thingy is definitely something to look and try! when i do i'll give my thoughts on it. i just feel more confortable and in control when i "cam inject". queens all in 1 group , select, press inject then cycle through bases with cam keys and just alternate key and click. i can assure i inject 6 bases in less than 1 sec though my mecanics aren't that great and my apm is around 75 :D (this is mostly due to the "less keystrokes" way of thinking)
as the Z-C changes regards: i find it easier to have those keys just for cams. what i did was allocate the former binds to the free keys u suggested (T;G;B) with the habilities less used. the major reason was those were already on ASD and one thing i never expected to be so awesome is the multi functiom spacebar! i use it with those essential things so no need to really have them there. one thing i'd like to state and hope jak reads this too, is that i morphed the multi function key on the core layout! (if you want i can discuss it too but this thread wouldn't be the place for it ) one thing left to say in the cams department is why i find easy to NOT Alt+(ZXC): i binded Z to chrono cam (with most of the gates on it), X to the wall off cam (usually at the natural) and C to the warp in cam (usually at a warp prism or a forward pylon) so this way i can cycle faster and not use modifiers.
as for the MMB: i just use it to cycle subgroups to discourage the use of drag cam since i believe we should always cam hotkey and hotkey move (not that it shouldn't be done, it's just that i'm lazy and if i do it i'll gain that bad habit)! also i use a Razer Abyssus therefore i don't have side buttons but with side buttons it's definitely the bind to do! the warpgates button (Alt+MMB) i don't really use since my production is on Q so i select production and the gates are favoured over the robos so, for example, i'm in a battle and need to warp in - Alt+Q (select production) - C (go to pylon or prism) - Q (for zealots) - Shift+S (to empty gates) - MMB (to change to robos) - R (to queue colossus) - then go on with adding to CG and doubletapping on army CG to get back to battle 3 or 4 secs in total with the lowest amount of APM. the same goes for the upgrades as you stated, i do use the R CG for them and also cycle through
one other thing i didn't mention is the return cargo button. i bound it to V cause it was the closest key i could find that i wouldn't miss many presses. i find it important to press it especially when u are transferring workers to gas and ppl should be incouraged to use it more! i found it not being easy for me with the original layout.
to finish up i do respect and agree that the Ctrl+ thing is a bit of a stretch into the less keystrokes way so sorry for that didn't mean to confuse new users (or old) and i do, since i'm a thecore user aswell, try to combine the two which can leave to some overlay :D either way this is the best non "hardcore" layout out there! once again congrats on that! :D
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@naxi + Show Spoiler +-Sorry, I should have been clearer. For all 3 races I use tab for small groups of units that are scouting or harassing. For Terran/Protoss I use alt-Q for cc/nexus, alt-w for barracks/gates, alt-e for factory/robo, alt-r for ports/stargates. As you can see, it is super intuitive going between the two. For zerg, I use alt-q for all hatcheries, I use alt-w for main, alt-e for natural, alt-r for third. If I want to produce a bunch of units and I don't care where they come from I just use alt-q, if I need to be more specific I can. I believe this is very close to the suggested usage you have. Hey I like that idea. I'm just playing around with it now and as Zerg I find that I'm really missing the Tab>Q>W and Tab>Q>E motions. Seems like slightly more work when it comes to Zerg production, and also when looking to drop quick Scans and MULES as Terran. To be honest though, I like the feel of rolling my fingers across Q,W,E,R like this. Easier to monitor things, yet slightly more inconvenient to control your CC's/Nexus//Hatcheries. I can definitely see the appeal in it despite said disadvantage. Perhaps I missed this detail, but I see that you're basically using Tab for another unit Control Group and moving the bindings on Q,W,E,R over one key-- where do you put your upgrade/tech structures now? Do you still bind them?
+ Show Spoiler +-Mouseless backspace is really, really good, but for whatever reason in the early game I've fallen into the habit of going to a base using the camera location hoteky, selecting the queen and injecting manually. I'm currently trying to break that habit, because while it does offer some control it is slow and clunky. I think I was just frustrated with wandering queens and did it this way as a temporary solution. My next 15-20 games are actually dedicated to getting my injects more fluid. I'm just having trouble with queen wandering when I have more hatches than queens. I getcha. Wandering Queens can be a problem with any method that bundles all Queens on to one hotkey group. It's also possible to get wandering Queens even with the Camera/Layered method, but that's never mentioned for some reason. Just one wrong click on the wrong Hatch can send a Queen wandering, but there are ways around this.
A couple things regarding wandering Queens when using Backspace methods:- Mouseless method - Issue a Hold Position command after injecting, but remember to let go of Shift before giving the Hold command . This cuts your Shift-commanded inject orders short, and it will keep the Queens next to their closest Hatch every time provided that you inject fairly quick. It's easier than it sounds.
- Suggested Backspace method using mouse - Use only S+Space Bar and Click for each Hatch (don't use Shift). Doing this quickly tells each Queen to inject the nearest Hatch only once, and then issuing a Hold command will keep them in place just in case you are at risk of wandering Queens. S+Space Bar then Click can be done nearly simultaneously, so it feels like only 3 keystrokes including the Queen selection step (Caps Lock in default Alloy). This is how I used to do it all the time, and I still think it's a great way to do Backspace injects. The one downside is you may need to get a little used to timing your keystrokes right with your clicks when performing this method extremely fast. I personally prefer this method.
So basically, try adding Hold Position to your methods, and your Queens will be fine under any circumstance. Hold Position is on W by default with Alloy, so it's as close as possible to your Spawn Larva command. Hold also helps out quite a bit when it comes to dealing with drops as well, because your Queens will only attack what's in range and not wander toward the dropped/harassing enemies. They stay put so you don't have to worry about them as much.
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Hi, I would like to try out this hotkeys, but I am having trouble installing it. I download the file and then I save it or drag it from the folder it goes to and put it in the Hotkeys folder for SC2 accounts. I think the problem is that it is a a notepad file, because my other hotkey setup I made was a "SC2Hotkeys" file or something. Can anyone please help me so that I can try out these hotkeys?
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On July 01 2013 20:18 chronocross7 wrote: Hi, I would like to try out this hotkeys, but I am having trouble installing it. I download the file and then I save it or drag it from the folder it goes to and put it in the Hotkeys folder for SC2 accounts. I think the problem is that it is a a notepad file, because my other hotkey setup I made was a "SC2Hotkeys" file or something. Can anyone please help me so that I can try out these hotkeys? First suggestion is to check out the "Give it a Try" subsection in the OP, it will tell you most of what I'll be telling you here. There's a subsection in both of the Element and Alloy main sections, so check that out first. Or, just read this post:- Make sure this is where you're plugging them into: C:\Users\Username\MyDocuments\Starcraft II\Accounts\AccountNumber\Hotkeys. If there is no "Hotkeys" folder there, then create it manually and plug the hotkey files in there.
- Make sure the files were "Downloaded" and not "Saved As". If "Saved As", they wind up looking like this http://i.imgur.com/8mNJpLZ.jpg
- Check the properties of the file by Right-Clicking on the file and Clicking "Properties", and it should tell you the file format and what it opens with. If the filetype says "SC2HOTKEYS (.SC2Hotkeys file)", then it should be fine. If not, then I suggest deleting that file and re-Downloading. They should be ok, as I'm looking at my Dropbox folder now and seeing that they are all .SC2Hotkeys files.
You can open up SC2hotkeys files with notepad fine. In fact, many people will use it to edit their bindings instead of going through the game's UI.
Opening up these files with notepad is an association setting that you must have created yourself, and that's ok, because the file format will be untouched despite being accessible with notepad.
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@orgganon + Show Spoiler +ok, so i made that "declaration" cause i've seen a lot of nerd rage against Jak and thecore developers in regards of their league placement and stuff... (why the hell does it matter where u are placed for ppl to take you serious? Catz isn't top 8 GM in America and he comes up with insane strats before the whole world and ppl still take him into account! the same for WhiteRa). nevertheless, i think ppl like you and Jak (along with all developers) deserve the credit for time and work put into these things (which is a lot!) Makes sense. Still, I don't think the defender thing is a great way to go about things; it can put otherwise friendly or neutral people in a defensive stance instantly. Early on I received the same thing you're talking about here from people who were "defenders" of whatever (yes, some but not all were users of TheCore too), and initially I would suddenly find myself being defensive towards them, not really knowing what to expect. Nowadays I'd just rather ask people about their point of view instead of getting defensive with them about it.
What I've dealt with so far is probably not anywhere near the amount JaK and his crew has though. I suppose by taking on TheStaircase, TheCore and hosting a stream (dat promotion), people would expect more "credibility" (gauged strictly by ladder rank; a flawed way to measure worth for sure). Not everyone pours all of their efforts into ranked Ladder games and bases their success off of it. Casters are probably one of the best examples of that, and many of them are held in high regard by the community despite this. Overall, I don't really worry about this kind of thing, but I do see how it is/can be. There is a bright side to this though. You do get people who support what you do and appreciate your efforts for what they are, and those people really help keep you moving. I think anyone who received some positive feedback or appreciation regarding something they've done can understand this.
+ Show Spoiler +injects: haven't tried the fleet with zerg yet since i started playing toss haven't played zerg but the minimap rapidfire thingy is definitely something to look and try! when i do i'll give my thoughts on it. i just feel more confortable and in control when i "cam inject". queens all in 1 group , select, press inject then cycle through bases with cam keys and just alternate key and click. i can assure i inject 6 bases in less than 1 sec though my mecanics aren't that great and my apm is around 75 :D (this is mostly due to the "less keystrokes" way of thinking) Well if you're ever curious as to why the injects are the way they are, give them a try! Who knows, you might find some sort of middleground between your ZRM layout (just a guess) and Alloy Zerg. All I can say is Alloy Zerg injects feel really, really good. Adding to and selecting your Queens Control Group is also really easy, and Hold Position is right next to Spawn Larva, so any room for error has been cut down significantly. On top of all that, most of (if not all) the other inject methods that exist feel smooth too. Just hop into a vs AI game and see what I mean; you'll have a much better understanding of Alloy Zerg.
+ Show Spoiler +as the Z-C changes regards: i find it easier to have those keys just for cams. what i did was allocate the former binds to the free keys u suggested (T;G;B) with the habilities less used. the major reason was those were already on ASD and one thing i never expected to be so awesome is the multi functiom spacebar! i use it with those essential things so no need to really have them there. one thing i'd like to state and hope jak reads this too, is that i morphed the multi function key on the core layout! (if you want i can discuss it too but this thread wouldn't be the place for it ) one thing left to say in the cams department is why i find easy to NOT Alt+(ZXC): i binded Z to chrono cam (with most of the gates on it), X to the wall off cam (usually at the natural) and C to the warp in cam (usually at a warp prism or a forward pylon) so this way i can cycle faster and not use modifiers. As far as the Smart Key goes, I'm surprised that it hasn't been assimilated into their layout yet. There are people involved in these projects that like to keep an eye out for what's going on, and I'm sure someone's mentioned it to them or they've seen it just from checking things out, so who knows, it could be in the works or could have been totally dismissed. At some point, I'm sure we'll see a layout come around that takes all the good ideas of all the available layouts and attempts to meld them together in a single working design-- it's just a matter of when, and who would be willing to do it. As it stands now, Fleet Keys and TheCore are at two opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to design, so I think that the person willing to helm a project like that would have a lot of hard work ahead of them, especially if they wanted it to be tournament legal and fairly easy to grasp. What you're doing now kind of foreshadows this, and I'm sure as more users want the best of both worlds like you, it will come about in some form, sooner or later.
+ Show Spoiler +as for the MMB: i just use it to cycle subgroups to discourage the use of drag cam since i believe we should always cam hotkey and hotkey move (not that it shouldn't be done, it's just that i'm lazy and if i do it i'll gain that bad habit)! also i use a Razer Abyssus therefore i don't have side buttons but with side buttons it's definitely the bind to do! the warpgates button (Alt+MMB) i don't really use since my production is on Q so i select production and the gates are favoured over the robos so, for example, i'm in a battle and need to warp in - Alt+Q (select production) - C (go to pylon or prism) - Q (for zealots) - Shift+S (to empty gates) - MMB (to change to robos) - R (to queue colossus) - then go on with adding to CG and doubletapping on army CG to get back to battle 3 or 4 secs in total with the lowest amount of APM. the same goes for the upgrades as you stated, i do use the R CG for them and also cycle through Drag Scrolling a bad habit? You can only hotkey so many Camera Locations, and a some point, you will have to scroll your screen to get to places (most likely through Edge Scroll). Drag Scrolling with the sensitivity turned up to the maximum setting is actually a lot quicker than Edge Scrolling, can save you a lot of time, and can also become very precise with some practice. I use an Abyssus as well. I often use my Drag Scroll to jump to areas that have no hotkeyed Camera Locations and extra Creep spread paths (basically replaces clicking down on the Minimap constantly to get everywhere). At this point in time I feel Edge Scrolling is on the top of my list of bad habits.
On the other hand, I don't normally use tabbed production, so for me, MMB isn't competing with subgroup selections, so I can see the reasoning behind your binding. If I did use tabbed production, I would use a mouse with side buttons and keep the bindings as I normally would suggest (MMB being Drag Scroll, side mouse buttons being Next/Previous Subgroup Selection.
+ Show Spoiler +one other thing i didn't mention is the return cargo button. i bound it to V cause it was the closest key i could find that i wouldn't miss many presses. i find it important to press it especially when u are transferring workers to gas and ppl should be incouraged to use it more! i found it not being easy for me with the original layout. Yeah, I bound it to a key that isn't taking up vital keyboard space, somewhere out of the way. My decision to keep it out of the way was also backed by a couple things like: - Your base structure is always really close to your mineral patches and gasses--you can just Shift+Right Click the base, and then send your workers wherever. - Ctrl+Clicking doesn't separately select workers, so you can't Ctrl+Click workers holding resources and press the Return Cargo key, and then Ctrl+Click the empty ones and send them on their way through a single keystroke. - In Alloy, you get a really compact and optimized Unit Command row (Q-R), and then you get the A-F abilities. This leaves little immediate room for a feature most people simply don't use. - As much as I generally discourage T,G,B with Fleet Keys (poor Element and its T for Attack key), Y,H,N is almost not even an option. I could put them there, but I felt like putting the lesser-used commands on F-keys a much easier way to identify that they were being left out by simply looking at the Command Card (a visual aid or sorts that makes even more sense as time goes on).
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please don't get me wrong, if i said i'm a defender of thecore i didn't mean to underate any of the other key layouts! (i know u got it just wanted to put it out)
the core isn't in real need of the smart key cause the purpose is to have less keystrokes, so all the habilities are bound in a way that makes it intuitive so they probably never even considered it :D (no harm done there i guess, though i do use it)
actually after reading your post i realized i'm using edge scroll a lot more than i wanted (or should). i have to force myself to not use it a lot though since i used to be a drag scroller and thought it was bad cause it prevented me from using cam keys... maybe it's time to go back to drag cause i got used to cam with keys, makes more sense now! will have to re-think the MMB
as far as being in oposite ends, alow me to disagree, it's 2 really good and user aimed layouts and that's enough! which suites anyone better is a matter of prefference. they do work in different ways with different goals but that's just a mechanical question.
whoa... Ctrl+click... selecting which ones are carrying... :O Shift+click base i do use... the rest is a bit too much for my mechanics! ahahah i play too little to do much more than box+click+hit return cargo :D
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@eneyeseekay
Perhaps I missed this detail, but I see that you're basically using Tab for another unit Control Group and moving the bindings on Q,W,E,R over one key-- where do you put your upgrade/tech structures now? Do you still bind them?
I don't bind upgrade/tech structures. They usually end up being in the vicinity of a camera location and upgrades take so long to research that I'm fairly comfortable just manually clicking on the building to start the next set of upgrades.
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@orgganon Drag Scroll can feel a bit jarring at first because you're physically grabbing the camera and panning it around, but it feels really good as you go. I always say to just max the speed setting and go from there. Here are some tips/benefits for you or anyone else considering the use of Drag Scrolling:- Use the camera frame (the square on the minimap) to guide you while Drag Scrolling. This forces you to be so much more aware of the Minimap, and map awareness is huuuuuge!
- You can produce units while Drag Scrolling! Not sure if this requires much explaining, but it's an important point to note.
- The cursor disappears when holding in the Drag Scroll key, but it stays where you left it. Personally, the cursor disappearing annoyed me a bit at first, but the cursor locking for the duration was nice. I hope Blizzard includes an option to keep the cursor visible some day.
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Why not use Q-R for cc's/rax/fact/star? Isn't it easier to roll down a macro cycle holding alt the entire time instead of having to throw it in there randomly?
Doesn't seem you can bind alt+shift+tab either to add to group =/
Drag scroll is completely second nature to me since casting games quite a bit. Mouse scroll has always been awkward for me, I grew up playing BW using arrow keys for pan (reaaaaaally bad habit eh).
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@decemberscalm
Drag Scroll is second nature for you? That's pretty awesome! How do you like it when used in-game (as you being the active player)? Is there anything you might want to add regarding Drag Scrolling?
I like how everything on Q-R feels for monitoring production, but if you take into account all of the actions performed with your CC/Nexus/Hatchery, it quickly begins to feel like a separately managed structure rather than just another production building. Here are a few reasons why putting them all on Q-R hasn't become the default way of the layouts, despite the monitoring part feeling nice:- Your CC/Hatch/Nexus (lets call it "base") produces the fastest-to-train units, and in Zerg's case, that fact is even more present. Chances are you won't be getting from 6 to 60+ workers completely uninterrupted, so it's a long road to maximum saturation off of 3 bases. That's a long time constantly producing your fastest trained unit, especially when taking into account workers lost along the way.
- Your bases (with T & P mainly), have macro abilities tied to them, and they need to be accessed and spent ASAP and as frequently as possible (unless the build calls for holding them) to avoid any opportunity loss. So not only are you making workers at scattered 17 second intervals, you also need to spend you Chronoboosts, MULES, Scans when needed (although less applicable in this case). Then you get Queen production, base morphing, and upgrades as Zerg. Zerg is also different because of the natural Larva re-spawning, which happens faster than Drones are even morphed.
- As Zerg, your base is also your rax/fact/port so you will be forced to use it more than any other structure of any race. You're also forced to select Larva before morphing anything, so that is an extra keystroke in itself that you cannot efficiently circumvent. By having Q-R already under a modifier and considering the positive/negative feedback received for that, having Hatcheries on Alt+Q would be a big dealbreaker for most (why there is a Select Warpgate command at this point and not a Select Larvae command is beyond me).
- In the case of Alloy, you only have to ever drop your fingers in an alternating motion to perform said unit production commands and base macro abilities; some examples of this would be: Tab>Q, Tab>W, Tab>Q>W, Tab>Q>Q. It's a helpful refinement to allow you to spend the least amount of time doing everything mentioned above. The custom Smart Key and its default bindings allow you to squeeze even more time out of it, by allowing you to drop your finger on Tab, then Space Bar, then click. It's about as fast as you can make it while keeping everything familiar.
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I am already a avid minimap clicker, but for slight adjustments I can't even pretend to try edge scrolling over dragon.
Drag scrolling in theory seems like it should be superior in every way for slight adjustments compared to edge scrolling, especially due to your mouse not changing position. The one thing that bugs me is that the center on unit command is very easy to trigger when drag scrolling. I'll have to actually change that to something else. It is basically incompatible with drag scroll because of how easy it to accidentally do it. It is shift+middle mouse button if I'm not mistaken, which means if I am doing something like putting turrets around a base it will always trigger when I try to que up the commands. Or if I put down a building a little too far off from the minerals but close enough to just drag scroll to it easily the shift command back to the mineral line will trigger it.
I'm trying to get used to tab vs shift+alt+Q. So far I'm at the point where my 2 toss base macro is all well and spent fine enough. It is definently one of the less friendly aspects though.
It has been a joy to learn so far though. I do have one idea. Sub group selection from F1-F2 to F1-F4. This would make hitting the proper F keys much easier (akin to removing F3-F4 keys). Might be useful for those people who just feel awkward trying to hit up to the F rows.
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@decemberscalm
I'm glad to hear you've been enjoying it so far!
There didn't seem to be much room left for the Center on Current Selection command, so I figured the best spot at the time was Shift+MMB. Seemed obscure enough so you wouldn't use it by accident, but accessible should you ever need it. This however, was before I began experimenting more heavily with Drag Scrolling. I've since hit Shit+MMB at times when I didn't want it, and I totally see your point. Right now, it's not really optimal. Even if I do this once every couple matches, I would still rather not have it happen. Having said that----
Do you have any suggestions as to where it could go? Is it even important enough to keep? Ideally, one could get better at Drag Scrolling and line up the camera well enough to emulate the effect of centering. Or, one could simply click once on the unit portrait (I'm pretty sure it's only used for prepping Camera injects atm). As of now I feel like competent Drag Scrolling or clicking the portrait could allow for cutting the Center on Current Selection command out, but perhaps I'm missing something?
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nice point there with the drag scrolling...
justa suggestion, have you guys tried binding something like Alt + Right mouse click to center the cam?
would still be acessible and not a frequently used combo... that poped to mind cause ctrl and shift are used to queue commands and create CG so might be a margin for a miss click.
other acessibl combos are ctrl + alt + right click; or ctrl + shift + middle click; or alt + shift + left click... so many possibilities... why not even alt+tab? :D
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Hello, I am trying to learn the Alloy fleet keys layout for zerg.
Everything seems to be working great, but I have a couple questions.
In order to switch to different cameras, I have to deselect my units/buildings. But I can't seem to find a way to deselect units, ESC doesn't work, I tried rebinding all the keys that use ESC and it still doesn't work.
And Question 2, Do I have to do a registry edit in order to turn off caps lock while I am playing starcraft 2?
Thanks!
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On July 04 2013 02:22 darkling wrote: Hello, I am trying to learn the Alloy fleet keys layout for zerg.
Everything seems to be working great, but I have a couple questions.
In order to switch to different cameras, I have to deselect my units/buildings. But I can't seem to find a way to deselect units, ESC doesn't work, I tried rebinding all the keys that use ESC and it still doesn't work.
And Question 2, Do I have to do a registry edit in order to turn off caps lock while I am playing starcraft 2?
Thanks!
Hey there, you shouldn't be forced to de-select units when switching to other cameras. Alt+A-F, and Alt+Z-V are where the Camera Location bindings are currently located. If you have units selected and press Alt+A, the camera switches and you also keep your selection. In the very early iterations of Fleet Keys, Alt had a double binding, but that feature was cut long ago due to de-selection issues. Perhaps you have an older Fleet keys file in your hotkeys folder?
In response to question 2, the answer is "nnooooope". The layouts are designed so that modifications of any kind aren't necessary. If you have a basic keyboard, and a mouse with a middle mouse button, you can make use of the layout as intended.
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After doing a fair amount of testing today, these are the changes I'm thinking of implementing. If anyone wants to try these out, be my guest. I'll leave this post up, but after about a day I will push the changes through, so if any of you have any really strong and sound objections to the proposed changes and reasoning, offer me yours. Also, testing the settings for yourself will help you understand them the most, so yeah.. Let me know what you all think after trying them out.
CENTER ON CURRENT SELECTION Currently: Shift + Middle Mouse Button Proposing: Ctrl + Middle Mouse Button Main Reasons and Thoughts:- 1.
Ctrl + A-F and Z-V create the 8 available Camera Locations. Often times, the first few cameras are created for each base, centered over the base structure (CC, Nexus Hatchery). While being quite important, (depending on the player) the Center on Current Selection command is not really used for many reasons aside from base structure centering when preparing cameras for Camera (aka Layered) Injects, or general purpose base cameras. Ctrl + Middle Mouse Button flows extremely well while creating said cameras, effectively shaving off keystrokes and increasing the speed and ease of camera creation.
- 2.
This command no longer gets in the way of issuing any type of "Shift +" commands while Drag Scrolling. Even pressing Shift by accident while Drag Scrolling and activating was becoming a common occurrence, resulting in hampered play.
- 3.
Nothing else known at this time is negatively affected by this change. It appears to be a safe binding, and also one that results in a slight efficiency increase.
CANCEL TARGETING Currently: Right Click Proposing: Keeping Right Click, adding W as alternate. Main Reasons and Thoughts:- 1.
While injects are easy to perform with the layouts, and feel all-around great, wandering Queens can still pose a problem for some users who wish to use any method aside from the "44v, Click" variants. Wandering Queens is not a flaw of the layout, rather, a potential disadvantage of the methods used. Given that, I tried and tested new ways of managing Queens during post-Injection. I wanted to make putting Queens on Hold Position after a multi-base Inject round even easier, and I'm happy to say there's been some improvement in that area.
- 2.
For any method employing Shift + Spawn Larva key, there are now two methods to force the Queens to stay put. After an Inject round with Queens selected, press W,W. This Cancels the Inject target on the Queens, and then immediately places them on Hold Position. Apart from double-tapping W, you can achieve the same effect by pressing Right Click, W. Tapping W twice only applies when the Spawn Larva (or any targeted ability for that matter) is active.
- 3.
While the Right Click, W sequence works quick, often times Right Clicking can accidentally order your Queens to move, especially if the W is delayed. Depending on whether you end your Inject round with a target being displayed or not, the W, W sequence is always going to work, 100% of the time. No wandering, no accidental Move commands. Pressing W in the past (while targeting) did not allow the Hold Position command to register, the game ignored it completely because the command card changed and the unit that was targeting temporarily lost its Unit Command abilities. This fixes that.
- 4.
Does not seem to conflict with any other command or action, as Hold Position tells units to stay put to begin with, most likely canceling a spell or command anyway. Hold Position on its own still functions as intended, and production structures aren't affected by W's target canceling binding.
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