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Hey guys,
I just hit diamond in 1s for the first time ever (woo). I've (zerg) pretty much only focused on macro'ing as well as possible using a certain build against each race, and just scouting to adapt to whatever my opponent is building. I'm still consistently winning against diamond players, but am wondering if there are some other things I can do to get to that next level.
For one, I have never vetoed a map and I have never really adapted any of my play styles depending on which map I am playing on. Am I at the point where I should be doing these things? My success rate on each map is fairly consistent, although there are 1 or 2 that are much better than the rest (forget the names off the top of my head) and I think my Ulrena rate is quite poor.
Basically, should I start vetoing maps that do not favor zerg/I am not doing as well on, and should I be adapting my builds to whichever map is chosen (e.g. more aggressive on maps with a tough 3rd, etc.)?
Some more info on my play: I generally hatch first, drone hard and like to play for a 1/1 attack in the mid game (depending on what race I'm playing), or if my opponent is turtling, expand a few times and push to brood lord asap (unless facing air).
Any advice would be much appreciated!
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Certain maps just aren't good for certain races, and some maps are just horrible in general and if they don't fit your style then your win rates will suffer against better opponents.
I used to not use any vetoes but once I hit high diamond/masters I feel they become marginally more important. For instance, I really don't like Endion but KCK and Ulrena are just garbage maps that require very specific styles of play and they force very cheese/all in strategies from the other races. Since I prefer slightly larger maps for easier macro play, those two goes to the trash bin for me.
I really don't like Endion because the third is retarded and the close air distance makes drop play/Liberators/Banshees/Stargate play extremely powerful primarily against Zerg. I really wish I had another veto to cross it off, I pray that the next set of maps doesn't have any close by air nonsense.
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Bisutopia18980 Posts
On May 04 2016 00:35 schach wrote: Hey guys,
I just hit diamond in 1s for the first time ever (woo). I've (zerg) pretty much only focused on macro'ing as well as possible using a certain build against each race, and just scouting to adapt to whatever my opponent is building. I'm still consistently winning against diamond players, but am wondering if there are some other things I can do to get to that next level.
For one, I have never vetoed a map and I have never really adapted any of my play styles depending on which map I am playing on. Am I at the point where I should be doing these things? My success rate on each map is fairly consistent, although there are 1 or 2 that are much better than the rest (forget the names off the top of my head) and I think my Ulrena rate is quite poor.
Basically, should I start vetoing maps that do not favor zerg/I am not doing as well on, and should I be adapting my builds to whichever map is chosen (e.g. more aggressive on maps with a tough 3rd, etc.)?
Some more info on my play: I generally hatch first, drone hard and like to play for a 1/1 attack in the mid game (depending on what race I'm playing), or if my opponent is turtling, expand a few times and push to brood lord asap (unless facing air).
Any advice would be much appreciated! I've never vetoed maps. I'm not a pro and simply never cared. If you enjoy playing on the maps then it doesn't matter. But in the spirit of Elitism, ofc you should silly!
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United Kingdom20145 Posts
Some maps are hugely imbalanced (like prion) but as a zerg you're mostly alright to good statistically in the current pool. There is room for vetoing based on what you like or don't like to do rather than where you're statistically going to do badly.
For example Ulrena is quite balanced statistically but i know that a lot of zerg veto it. As a protoss you're more focused on vetoing the maps that you will suck on rather than vetoing the maps that will force you to play a certain style.
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Let me illustrate how important it is:
I've played in a bunch of TL Map Contest Opens, and I've taken out several pro players simply by designing a map specific all-in. Knowing the map, and what works on which map, and all the little nuances of each map is incredibly important.
It is the difference between winning and losing at the top.
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Hi, it is definitely important and I've started to take advantage of maps, and I believe there is still great potential on it. However I think it's less import for Z than for other races.
I'm a top diamond zerg in 2 recent seasons. Very similar to you, I've never thought about adapting play style to each maps when I was plat. And in that time I do not even have a game plan in every game.
The reason I got into diamond is that I start to have some certain play style in certain maps, and naturally, the veto of maps matters, be cause some style only work in certain maps.
For eg, i use Railgan's 3 roach opener in ZVT, but it do not work at the maps with pocket natural, like dust tower, so in dust tower, I just go ling/bane/muta.
I think you can still "consistently winning against diamond players" it's because your play style works for each maps. For eg, I think ling/bane/muta should work in every maps except Ulrena maybe, which i have banned long time ago..
Another eg is dark's ZVP , it should works on each map.
My point is, if you start to try some powerful strategy, which is usualy a little cheesy somehow, you will natrually know some maps is not suitable, and veto some maps is a simple way to let you focus on improve your excution of each build.
I hope to hear Master/GM Zerg to talk about these, feel free to correct me, because I'm still a beginner on map analysis.
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