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http://www.ggtracker.com/matches/7195883
Ok before i begin i just wanna say i know i let him take alot of bases, but my real question is whats the proper follow up unit wise after i got so far ahead? is there i way i could hve used my units better?
I feel like i outplayed him in every conceivable way and there's no way he should have gotten to where he did
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Are you the Zerg or the Terran???
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lets see. OKAY, ready for some tough love?
Opening looks solid, not a fan of the 3 roach open myself but its fine, super effective here. No block on 36. Major supply block and bank on 60 ( 4:46) - you are microing your roaches for no reason, you aren't 'doing' anything by doing that. and your macro is slipping.
5:10 - drone spread is all wrong, no drones on gasses you built, 1300 bank, your macro mistakes are killing your lead.
6:00 - terran wisely double expands after breaking out, hes AHEAD in bases due to your super later third
7:00 - you have 1500 / 200 bank, if all that was roaches you literally walk into his nat and end the game. Your injects are non existent.
Third has no queens or drones. added late to hatch group.
7:30 - liberatr at your base has 9 kills you are now equal on workers and bases with roach tech against tank. You're dead.
Your drop does nothing. You are super dead.
Your nydus do nothing. you are approaching hyper dead,.
You take your 4th and don't drone it for like three minutes. you have under 60 drones.
14:00 - terran gifts you 6 thors, making it a playable game again. Hydra viper would have been the correct target here. You chose gifting the terran 30+ roaches.
Terran has five base mech, your going for 3/3 roaches. He's a rude fuckwit who doesn't know how to play mech but even with throwing away units again and again he eventually builds an army and his harass kills a ton of your workers ( 104 ) You take some cool engages with surrounds and blinding clouds that let you trade up but it doesn't matter as you have no econ.
Long story short?
You had a stellar opening you over micored, killing your own lead with macro mistakes. You then go roach nydus, which has no long term play, it's a timing build. you miss the timing due to lacking injects and supply blocks. You are now on the wrong tech and shit econ, you get to play for another 15 minutes because your opponent messes up but you can ignore all that.
Focus on improving your injects and droning. Roachs are for timing attacks, and are useless end game, simple composition vs. mech is hydra-viper.
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^ - I agree with this. Can consider SH if you're trying to be fancy but probably unnecessary
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Lol thanks, yeah im the zerg.. ill try transitioning into hydra viper sooner and see how that works
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On October 04 2017 08:45 Woosixion wrote: Lol thanks, yeah im the zerg.. ill try transitioning into hydra viper sooner and see how that works
Your composition wasn't the issue. you could have ended the game with roaches after the opening, you need to work on your injects and basic macro.
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Focus on improving your injects and droning. Roachs are for timing attacks, and are useless end game, simple composition vs. mech is hydra-viper.
Thanks alot Iceman, just played the same guy again using your suggestions and absolutely demolished him, wasnt even close lol.
http://www.ggtracker.com/matches/7196700
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if you'd like to critique the game i won also feel free tho
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Okay, let's take a look. even from the ggtracker page the change is instantly visible from ~15% injection to 32% and your creep spread is outstanding. your SQ is 76, way higher then before, but definitely has room for improvement. No wonder you crushed him. now lets look deeper.
1. try getting drone pairs on nearer mineral patches at the start, practice it in a custom game. its just a few mineral difference but its the little things that count. its actually more important for a pool first build like yours. 2. Your 2nd overlord goes too far north, send it to your third to scout the proxy then towards his third. No one will proxy that far up the map. 3. supply block on 44 4. A 3:30 Lair?! why? Note that once you get the lair you aren't doing anything lair dependent. That money should be more drones. Where is your third? If you don't plan to make ravagers pull off gas once you have your three roaches up. if the lair gas was actually put into ravager I think you kill his natural. 5. 4:00 your main is worker rallied to its own mineral line instead of the natural, so your about to mis-spread drones. Instant third here. 6. 4:30 is super delayed for your third. You go up to four gasses without a third mineral line. thats really suspect, it kinda works here economy wise because you are tech rushing, but if he attacks here you can't actually hold anything. and you aren't scouting his front. eight helions rolling out of his base will win him the game. 7. 7:00 Okay, you made a third but you aren't droning it, so its just lost mineral at this point. you want to recoup on your bases asap. 8. 8:00 you are making a lurker den you never use, why? Your main is runing out of minerals where is your fourth base? 9. You don't take workers form your natural as it runs out. 10. You made a spire and ultralisk cavern, why?
Okay, obviously much better, congrats. Your main mistake is taking too many gasses before expanding your mineral economy. you really shouldn't commonly take more then a max of two gases until you reach three base mineral saturation. With many players even saying no more then one gas. You got real lucky here with him being overly passive as all your econ was tied up into tech until like 9:00, a simple 2base commital from him would have crushed you. your creep spread is awesome but you have no scouting of his south exit, so he takes an unscouted 4th and could have just shown up at your 4th with an army before you saw it.
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Everything you are saying is correct, except the lair part, you must not have noticed but, i drop creep at his 3rd and in his main, thats why i need the lair so early, and also why i send the ol so far north(my own personal flair on the matchup). As for the late 3rd/early gasses... Youre right the only reason to do that is for ravagers.. which is what i usually go for, and i take my 3rd after ive made all the ravagers and roaches i need to pressure/defend(which pairs very well with the creep already in his base) In this case, i was doing my build like normal except i didnt mass roach on 2 base as usual once i realized he was doing the passive mech style again and wouldnt be attacking any time soon, thats why it looks weird.
As for the spire/cavern, well at that point im like well im already rly far ahead so... whatever.
So yeah, it may look weird but thats just my playstyle, i just needed to know how to diverge correctly from my usual 2 base roach ravager push once i identify the turtle mech style. And in my defense, even that first game, if i blocked his 3rd with creep as was intended, i probably would have won.. but as you said i was overmicroing the roaches and wasnt paying attn to the other stuff so i couldnt deny it in time.
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zerg vs a turtle terran is always a suicidal mission.Let him come to you if your concept is about micro.
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