WHEN TO WATCH Group Stage: 14 April 2018 11:00 PDT 15 April 2018 11:00 PDT 21 April 2018 11:00 PDT 28 April 2018 11:00 PDT Playoffs: 13 May 2018 11:00 PDT
I have no idea what Future was planning to do with that double praxy barracks that were floated after creating 3 reapers then lifting his barracks and sending one into the opponent's base and the other home before anything even really happened.
Future vs Epic sound like something a 50 years old TV writer would made up for a one time episode featuring esport on CSI.
He would also write lines for a 20 years old guys like: "You never heard of Epic? He is the greatest bonjwa ever, he has the best APM micro and marine zerg rush control".
On April 16 2018 03:23 Boggyb wrote: It would be nice if all players eligible to compete in WCS Circuit played under the same rules regarding Challenger.
On April 16 2018 03:23 Boggyb wrote: It would be nice if all players eligible to compete in WCS Circuit played under the same rules regarding Challenger.
Who are you referring to?
TRUE had to forfeit his spot in NA challenger while players like Scarlett and Elazer did not.
On April 15 2018 04:00 Mozdk wrote: TvT has always been a praised mirror, but my god I hate it. This shit in particular.
What happened? TvT played by Korean Terrans is pretty much always amazing, but I could see NA Terrans turning mech vs mech into a slow turtley game.
Uhh... Korean TvT involves exactly the same nonsense with cyclones and ravens as foreign TvT. Pure turtling à la avilo is not the norm of course, but neither is it the norm for the foreign scene.
On April 16 2018 03:38 Shellshock wrote: fun fact Kane was actually 7-3 against Scarlett before today
Peak Kane was a pretty frickin scary player.
I don't remember his ZvZ being all that great tbh, so this is rather surprising to me. Flashes of brilliance in the other match-ups, but ZvZ not so much.
edit: ...yeah okay that's a way to lose a game. Going for fifteen +3 brood lords, and just losing to a bunch of unupgraded corruptors.
On April 16 2018 05:09 Nakajin wrote: Hive on 2 base, hum.... Well that work out, still look like kind of a strange build to me.
Fitzyhere used to go for 2-base hive every game. Admittedly this was with the 8 armor ultra, and the build was still bad.
Scarlett also used to do a 2 bases BL build in zvz that was quite good in HOTS, but anyway this was suppose to be on three base I think since the third was sniped, but still going hive before hydra seems super risky to me, but maybe it's a genious call. And the fact that I have never heard of Fitzyhere in my life don't exactly make me want to try it lol
On May 14 2018 03:08 MarianoSC2 wrote: Anyone saw Masa play recently? What are the chances he just shows up and trashes everyone?
Unless he's streamed, nobody has seen Masa recently. His chances of trashing everyone are zero even if Scarlett and Neeb are having a bad day. Neeb is at least 2 tiers above him and Scarlett is at least 1.
On May 14 2018 03:08 MarianoSC2 wrote: Anyone saw Masa play recently? What are the chances he just shows up and trashes everyone?
Unless he's streamed, nobody has seen Masa recently. His chances of trashing everyone are zero even if Scarlett and Neeb are having a bad day. Neeb is at least 2 tiers above him and Scarlett is at least 1.
Well, Masa always had that strange vibe of seeming totally irrelevant and invisible and then he suddenly appeared and just totally recked players that were supposed to be 2 classes above him. But I would be very surprised if he does that today, I haven't heard about Masa in ages
On May 14 2018 03:31 [PkF] Wire wrote: the casters really trying hard to make the games look less one-sided than they truly are . Can't blame them, of course, they're doing their job.
Honestly PandaBearMe looked like he was going to win game 2 up until he didn't.
On May 14 2018 03:31 [PkF] Wire wrote: the casters really trying hard to make the games look less one-sided than they truly are . Can't blame them, of course, they're doing their job.
Honestly PandaBearMe looked like he was going to win game 2 up until he didn't.
the attack looked doomed to fail to me but maybe he had more of a chance than I gave him credit for
I understand puCK thought he needed to do something to get back into the game, but man was that a bad idea. There was zero chance he was getting into the main.
Is Semper playing a throw competition? If so then he is a master, each game he plays the throw is bigger and bigger lol Well, good games at least, pretty close. Although Semper really should have won at least 2 out of that 3
On May 14 2018 05:01 Bagration wrote: Both of these players are infinitely better at SC2 than I ever will be, but I don't think either one of these guys knows how to "win" an SC2 game haha
When you're the best at playing 'not to lose,' you're Maru. When you're less good at playing not to lose, you're avilo.
On May 14 2018 05:13 VengefulTree wrote: I don't know, it was a cool game, was on the edge-ish of my seat. And both players displayed pretty cool control at times (esp Semper with the splits)
I feel like it is the kind of game you can only really appreciate if you don't care about who wins otherwise you just get irritated by all the misplays.
On May 14 2018 05:13 VengefulTree wrote: I don't know, it was a cool game, was on the edge-ish of my seat. And both players displayed pretty cool control at times (esp Semper with the splits)
I feel like it is the kind of game you can only really appreciate if you don't care about who wins otherwise you just get irritated by all the misplays.
I get what you mean, but at the same time if you're emotionally invested in the game the back and forth foreigner baseball makes it a very intense experience No matter the lead, it can always be thrown
On May 14 2018 05:13 VengefulTree wrote: I don't know, it was a cool game, was on the edge-ish of my seat. And both players displayed pretty cool control at times (esp Semper with the splits)
I feel like it is the kind of game you can only really appreciate if you don't care about who wins otherwise you just get irritated by all the misplays.
I get what you mean, but at the same time if you're emotionally invested in the game the back and forth foreigner baseball makes it a very intense experience No matter the lead, it can always be thrown
Uhm, okay. Masa totally shrecked him. Kinda disappointing so far. Not counting Neebs match because that was always going to be, well, not close. But Semper vs Puck was a shitshow throwfest and this was just brutally one-sided
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Cheesing the better player literally describes every series she's ever played against Neeb in LotV.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Given that it was the same one week where she peaked by cheesing superior players out of series she should have lost (and was heavily expected to lose).......it's not a false comparison.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Cheesing the better player literally describes every series she's ever played against Neeb in LotV.
She cheesed in 2 of the 5 games she won against Neeb in the IEM Pyeongchang qualifiers. Go and troll somewhere else.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Cheesing the better player literally describes every series she's ever played against Neeb in LotV.
She cheesed in 2 of the 5 games she won against Neeb in the IEM Pyeongchang qualifiers. Go and troll somewhere else.
I said every series, not every game. 2 cheeses out of 5 is a huge percentage, especially when PvZ was functionally unwinnable if the Protoss didn't play super defensively and playing super defensively just got you killed to lurkers later.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Cheesing the better player literally describes every series she's ever played against Neeb in LotV.
She cheesed in 2 of the 5 games she won against Neeb in the IEM Pyeongchang qualifiers. Go and troll somewhere else.
I said every series, not every game. 2 cheeses out of 5 is a huge percentage, especially when PvZ was functionally unwinnable if the Protoss didn't play super defensively and playing super defensively just got you killed to lurkers later.
40% is a completely normal amount of cheese for a series. sOs cannon rushed Jaedong twice in the Blizzcon 2013 finals and 2 Gated herO twice in the IEM Katowice finals in 2014, but I wouldn't say he won those series entirely off of cheese.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Cheesing the better player literally describes every series she's ever played against Neeb in LotV.
She cheesed in 2 of the 5 games she won against Neeb in the IEM Pyeongchang qualifiers. Go and troll somewhere else.
I said every series, not every game. 2 cheeses out of 5 is a huge percentage, especially when PvZ was functionally unwinnable if the Protoss didn't play super defensively and playing super defensively just got you killed to lurkers later.
40% is a completely normal amount of cheese for a series. sOs cannon rushed Jaedong twice in the Blizzcon 2013 finals and 2 Gated herO twice in the IEM Katowice finals in 2014, but I wouldn't say he won those series entirely off of cheese.
That's because sOs is a good player rather than a patch X.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Cheesing the better player literally describes every series she's ever played against Neeb in LotV.
She cheesed in 2 of the 5 games she won against Neeb in the IEM Pyeongchang qualifiers. Go and troll somewhere else.
I said every series, not every game. 2 cheeses out of 5 is a huge percentage, especially when PvZ was functionally unwinnable if the Protoss didn't play super defensively and playing super defensively just got you killed to lurkers later.
40% is a completely normal amount of cheese for a series. sOs cannon rushed Jaedong twice in the Blizzcon 2013 finals and 2 Gated herO twice in the IEM Katowice finals in 2014, but I wouldn't say he won those series entirely off of cheese.
That's because sOs is a good player rather than a patch X.
One of the best foreigners of all time isn't a good player? Oh right, only Koreans are good, foreigners only have the illusion of being good because they rape and pillage the Korean scene.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Cheesing the better player literally describes every series she's ever played against Neeb in LotV.
She cheesed in 2 of the 5 games she won against Neeb in the IEM Pyeongchang qualifiers. Go and troll somewhere else.
I said every series, not every game. 2 cheeses out of 5 is a huge percentage, especially when PvZ was functionally unwinnable if the Protoss didn't play super defensively and playing super defensively just got you killed to lurkers later.
40% is a completely normal amount of cheese for a series. sOs cannon rushed Jaedong twice in the Blizzcon 2013 finals and 2 Gated herO twice in the IEM Katowice finals in 2014, but I wouldn't say he won those series entirely off of cheese.
That's because sOs is a good player rather than a patch X.
One of the best foreigners of all time isn't a good player? Oh right, only Koreans are good, foreigners only have the illusion of being good because they rape and pillage the Korean scene.
Prior to 2018, you have to go back to 2014 to find a really impressive Scarlett performance. Scarlett was a tier 4 WCS Circuit player in 2017. (Tiers: Neeb, Championship Contenders, They could make a finals with bracket luck, and then Scarlett) That's literally the definition of patch Zerg.
On May 14 2018 08:29 Solar424 wrote: When you know you're outclassed, just cheese. #1 way to win series you shouldn't.
That's funny to say when someone is playing SCARLETT.
Right, because the one week of her career when won games by cheesing defines her as a player entirely. Just shows your complete ignorance when you classify her as a cheeser off of 3 series.
Cheesing the better player literally describes every series she's ever played against Neeb in LotV.
She cheesed in 2 of the 5 games she won against Neeb in the IEM Pyeongchang qualifiers. Go and troll somewhere else.
I said every series, not every game. 2 cheeses out of 5 is a huge percentage, especially when PvZ was functionally unwinnable if the Protoss didn't play super defensively and playing super defensively just got you killed to lurkers later.
40% is a completely normal amount of cheese for a series. sOs cannon rushed Jaedong twice in the Blizzcon 2013 finals and 2 Gated herO twice in the IEM Katowice finals in 2014, but I wouldn't say he won those series entirely off of cheese.
That's because sOs is a good player rather than a patch X.
One of the best foreigners of all time isn't a good player? Oh right, only Koreans are good, foreigners only have the illusion of being good because they rape and pillage the Korean scene.
Prior to 2018, you have to go back to 2014 to find a really impressive Scarlett performance. Scarlett was a tier 4 WCS Circuit player in 2017. (Tiers: Neeb, Championship Contenders, They could make a finals with bracket luck, and then Scarlett) That's literally the definition of patch Zerg.
Consistent Ro8-Ro16 finishes is a tier 4 player? By that logic PartinG and DRG were tier 4 GSL players for nearly their entire career. Just keep moving the goalposts more, maybe you'll eventually find a way your hatred of Scarlett is justified.
On May 14 2018 09:00 Solar424 wrote: maybe you'll eventually find a way your hatred of Scarlett is justified.
Oh, I don't need to do that. Professionals don't say to delete a race they don't like.
Were you even around for HotS? Protoss was filled to the brim with the most insane builds that worked out because the race had so many options you couldn't prepare for all of them. Wanting the race to be redesigned was something people had been asking for since WoL.
I mean Scarlett is obviously a patchzerg no question. That's not bad per se. There are tons of zergs that can't get results even when patch favors zergs.
Someone needs to go through their match history and count the number of proxy rax builds Masa has done to Scarlett. It must be a comedically large number
On May 14 2018 09:22 SetGuitarsToKill wrote: Someone needs to go through their match history and count the number of proxy rax builds Masa has done to Scarlett. It must be a comedically large number
On May 14 2018 09:13 Bagration wrote: Patch zergs are players that are irrelevant post-patch. Think JohnnyRecco
Wins premier tournament. Race gets patched. Bombs out of GSL in ro32.
If that made Rogue a patch Zerg, it makes Scarlett a patch zerg.
Alternatively, she just rode a hot streak. She got knocked out of DH Leipzig in the Ro32 the week before IEM. Scarlett is a player who's form is never really constant, and the patch wouldn't have made an impact on her Ro16 group, since she used ling drops in precisely zero of her games.
Maybe MaSa's entire approach was to get Scarlett off her game plan from the get go, get it to a weird position. Or maybe he just really likes proxy rax
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
Clearly we need to increase bunker build time.
This but actually not totally joking. Or eliminate salvage because it's always been a weird mechanic
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
Clearly we need to increase bunker build time.
This but actually not totally joking. Or eliminate salvage because it's always been a weird mechanic
Either of those would seem to make some Zerg all ins extremely hard to defend.
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
Clearly we need to increase bunker build time.
This but actually not totally joking. Or eliminate salvage because it's always been a weird mechanic
Either of those would seem to make some Zerg all ins extremely hard to defend.
Which one, the 2 base Roach Ravager timing, or the... oh wait I guess that's about it for Zerg all-ins.
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
Clearly we need to increase bunker build time.
This but actually not totally joking. Or eliminate salvage because it's always been a weird mechanic
Either of those would seem to make some Zerg all ins extremely hard to defend.
Yes but it would directly benefit me and my favorite players.
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
Clearly we need to increase bunker build time.
This but actually not totally joking. Or eliminate salvage because it's always been a weird mechanic
Either of those would seem to make some Zerg all ins extremely hard to defend.
Yes but it would directly benefit me and my favorite players.
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
Clearly we need to increase bunker build time.
This but actually not totally joking. Or eliminate salvage because it's always been a weird mechanic
Either of those would seem to make some Zerg all ins extremely hard to defend.
Yes but it would directly benefit me and my favorite players.
On May 14 2018 09:30 Solar424 wrote: If ling drops got nerfed based on one series, can we get bunker rush nerfed off of this one? Apparently that's the precedent that's been set.
Dropperlords were nerfed because PvZ was at ~43.5% and opening anything other than Stargate into Oracle was an auto-loss against a not very committed ling attack.
And anything but opening pool first is an auto-loss against bunker rushes, which are basically 0 commitment because bunkers can still be salvaged and barracks can just be floated back to your main base.
Clearly we need to increase bunker build time.
This but actually not totally joking. Or eliminate salvage because it's always been a weird mechanic
Either of those would seem to make some Zerg all ins extremely hard to defend.
Yes but it would directly benefit me and my favorite players.
MaSa is 28-58 vs Neeb in map score historically and Aligulac gives Neeb a 78% chance of winning, but also according to Aligulac MaSa played his first match on the 10th anniversary of 9/11 and this is NA Challenger so who knows what can happen.
On May 14 2018 10:06 Ciaus_Dronu wrote: Oh my god this is proper NA. This is 100% unadulterated NA pro SC2, and I want to hate it. But... I almost can't.
"Are you not entertained? Is this not why you are here?"
On May 14 2018 10:30 Waxangel wrote: Wait, didn't the other Maru also do a fake 1-1-1 proxy right outside his base to force 1-base defensive play from Protoss in the finals???
I feel bad but I can't remember what series are you referring to
On May 14 2018 10:30 Waxangel wrote: Wait, didn't the other Maru also do a fake 1-1-1 proxy right outside his base to force 1-base defensive play from Protoss in the finals???
I feel bad but I can't remember what series are you referring to
GSL finals (the most recent one) Game 4 of Maru vs Stats
On May 14 2018 10:30 Waxangel wrote: Wait, didn't the other Maru also do a fake 1-1-1 proxy right outside his base to force 1-base defensive play from Protoss in the finals???
I feel bad but I can't remember what series are you referring to
abyssal reef where Maru "proxies" his factory and starport at his third base, confusing stats and getting him to go 3 gate 1 stargate off one base in his panic
On May 14 2018 11:06 MarianoSC2 wrote: What is Neeb doing? He had a sick economy. Just build those carriers and immortals and get your free win dude... OMG
I think he could have just built immortals instead of disruptors and win with that first push tough disruptor stalker did much better than I thought it would.
Masa is actually doing us all a favor: he's showing that Terran can be just as bullshit as Protoss and Zerg so that Terran players stop acting superior.
On May 14 2018 11:26 Boggyb wrote: I feel like those series wouldn't have been nearly as fun without iNcontroL and Nathanias bringing the top tier commentary.
On May 21 2018 23:09 YourLocalRabbi wrote: Can someone tell incontrol not to complain about other casters' observing unless he is willing to observe himself?
Otherwise,
Considering every time he criticized FearDragon or Nathanias's observing, he said that if he took over, they'd look like Funka or Shine in comparison, he already knows.