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On January 06 2013 03:18 aZealot wrote:Show nested quote +On January 05 2013 23:14 Bodhi wrote: I'm surprised how many people are sure that HotS is going to be a success. A website like this is where the most hardcore fans of the game congregate and 30% say they aren't going to buy the game. The opinion of TL is not representative of the larger SC2 community. The quiet majority who either play the game, or don't, without feeling the need to repetitively tell everyone about it. Don't mistake one for the other. The TL community, especially in these sorts of discussion, reminds me of people who jack off to themselves in front of a mirror. So much for the TL community.
I would say TL is probably a better representation than say...reddit. SC2 supporters, BW supporters, casual gamers...we have them all. Either way, the point is that there is a good chance that more than half of the SC2 community will buy HotS, which to Blizzard, is a profit. As long as it looks like they put some work into it, more than half of everyone that knows/plays WoL will buy HotS. Some people have the money and don't really care, some people just really want HotS, some people will actually spend months on this game...whatever the reason, I wish those people would demand a higher quality product than what Blizzard is giving us right now.
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HOTS is the same old boring WOL stuff. Why are you having this discussion anyway? In case the TL elitists didn't notice: nobody play WOL anymore, let alone the failure sequel.
Back to LOL now.
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I will always play sc2, cause they can't make the game so bad that it's not a good RTS anymore. (At least not if they don't try do it on purpose )
The game is good but sadly that's it, i think everyone who played broodwar and other RTS was expecting just an mindblowing game from sc2 and it did not deliver. HOTS won't deliver on that either, because the changes aren't big enough.
If you look at another title of blizzard d3, it get's even worse...
Really waiting for the next big release of blizzard and hope they don't continue to not deliver what fans expect/hope :/
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On January 06 2013 05:21 Hetz wrote: HOTS is the same old boring WOL stuff. Why are you having this discussion anyway? In case the TL elitists didn't notice: nobody play WOL anymore, let alone the failure sequel.
Back to LOL now.
I wonder what you expect from a expansion, isn't the whole point to expand on the same game? You make me confused sir.
Im loving HoTS, not gonna say that I use the new units that much yet but there are so many other changes around the old ones and it makes it so much more fun. I just love the new hydras and mutas! :D
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On January 06 2013 05:21 Hetz wrote: HOTS is the same old boring WOL stuff. Why are you having this discussion anyway? In case the TL elitists didn't notice: nobody play WOL anymore, let alone the failure sequel.
Back to LOL now.
What a blatant troll post. If you don't care, don't post. You don't need to spew out pointless negativity.
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For terrans, not in the slightest really, but I want to play the campaign.
I think making hellbats biological is retarded as hell, archons are too good vs them. Archon immortal just obliterates mech.
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I'm enjoying HoTS a lot and seeing how throwing in the units really changes the meta game, though in the lower leagues people play the game like it is WoL but with a few HoTS units mixed in for spice. I suspect this will change rapidly when the game is released.
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I like HotS, no real complaints, and honestly, what do you expect, a totally new game? It's an expansion, you get more campaign stuff, and some more units and balance things, just like they did with brood war.
Sure, there may be some issues, it's not perfect, but thats why they do patches. And to the complaints about how Blizzard is "all about the money"... Um, again, what did you expect? Yes, they're a business, businesses do what they do, FOR MONEY. However, if you have a complaint about how "doing things for money" does not contribute to a quality product, I and many others I'm sure, would beg to differ. Sure, you can have short-sighted and long-sighted money schemes, but being in something for the money does not necessarily imply that Blizz intends to sell the game on release day, then when everyone tries it and says it sucks laugh all the way to the bank. No, perhaps they do intend to make a quality product, and continue to insure it's quality. HotS really is a fun game, if you try it out. Make your own judgment, don't just listen to the loudest voices. Hell, if you did that, you'd be like the die-hard-watchers of FOX News who just KNEW Romney was going to be our next president, and that the majority of the U.S. is pissed with Obama. Loud as they were, they were horribly outnumbered by an apparently contented-yet-quieter majority. So try it out, you might find you like the additions. I for one have been in the beta since September, and I've all but completely quit logging into WoL, as I prefer the HotS multi-player version.
And to respond to my doppleganger, haha, Duncaaaaaan:
On January 06 2013 10:10 Duncaaaaaan wrote: For terrans, not in the slightest really, but I want to play the campaign.
I think making hellbats biological is retarded as hell, archons are too good vs them. Archon immortal just obliterates mech.
Fluff-wise yes, this is strange. However, keep in mind, hellbats benefit from medivac-heals BECAUSE OF the biological tag.... As a Zerg player, that's nasty when I'm faced with incoming blueflame hellbats with medivac heals and thor tank behind... True, archons do well vs bio, but try playing zerg, a race that has NO NON-BIO UNITS and NO EMP... Archons are quite nasty to us. I say if they're that big of a problem for ya Mr. Terran, then make a ghost, get emp, and bye bye archons.
The only complaint-esque gripe I might really espouse is that they removed the warhound (sure it was broken, but hell the archon is "anti all things zerg", so why not have an "anti all things protoss" unit, but just change its stats here and there to make the unit work) and the replicator (which was a gateway unit, right? They seem to need some changes to gateway stuff, I feel, other than just the mo-ship core stuff...) and the shredder (srsly? it's too hard to use since you cant have terran units nearby and it feels like it has no place? Well I guess the widow mines are fine, and sort of do the shredders' jobs, but still....), without trying to simply balance them better. And my burrow charging ultras, I'm still sad to see that gone...
However, that's not going to stop me from still enjoying the game or of course, from buying HotS.
~Duncan Idaho
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On January 06 2013 03:18 aZealot wrote: The opinion of TL is not representative of the larger SC2 community. The quiet majority who either play the game, or don't, without feeling the need to repetitively tell everyone about it. Don't mistake one for the other.
Well I don't agree. The quiet majority who either play the game bought WoL because it was a hit and when it came out, everybody was on SC2. Then they played a few ladder games, some Desert Strike and they went on other stuff like LoL or Dota or Call of Duty... Imo a important part of WoL buyer don't even know that HOTS will come out. And if they know, will they buy it since they didn't launched WoL for months ? Will they pay $$ for single campaign..? Not sure !
Don't get wrong. The sc2 community is NOT that large, and people on TL are, in my opinion, representative of this community.
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On January 06 2013 01:49 maybenexttime wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 00:58 naastyOne wrote:On January 05 2013 19:52 Hider wrote:On January 05 2013 08:13 Avalain wrote:On January 02 2013 17:47 imBLIND wrote:
Summary-I don't know what kind of politics are going on in the development of this game, but the end result is showing us they don't really have a direction for this game other than "money money money". If this game is going to follow in the footsteps of D3...then god be with us all.
I'm just wondering, what direction do game companies go that is "money money money"? Is there a way to make money by developing bad games that no one wants? Or is the direction that you're talking about the "do something that is enjoyable to the largest number of people" which is potentially casuals? Sorry, I'm just a little irritated when people make these sorts of comments. They are completely meaningless. Yes, companies are in the business of making money. It's true for every company and game developers are no different. Plus, ideals such as "improved customer experience" can be rolled into your whole "money money money" paradigm. Do you know how a company moves away from making money? They make a bad game that nobody bothers buying. This. People are so ignorant and often we see people blaming Activision for the "failures" of d3 and the mediocricity of sc2. This has nothing to do with Activision. Blizzard is just a company with an awfull work culturue. This has probably arisen because they ahve been a monopoly for such a long time, thus they have gotten used to be lazy and hasn't got punished for it. If they chose to maximize profit though they would have redesigned the business model, but do to their incomepentices they haven't done that. If Blizzard is sooo terrible, why do they still have a monopoly? Wouldn`t onle of dosens of RTS that came out in 200x-2012 take the crown away? Or maybe the BW hardcore fans would just finally get that they are not quite the target audience of SC2, and move along, saving people that enjoy the game all the whinking. After all, there certainly should be a company that would find out the oh so big demand for a "true BW succesor" and cash in on that, right? Rught?? On January 05 2013 23:14 Bodhi wrote: I'm surprised how many people are sure that HotS is going to be a success. A website like this is where the most hardcore fans of the game congregate and 30% say they aren't going to buy the game. This website is a base of the most hardcore SC:BW community outside Korea, Since SC2 is not SC:BW2, a lot of that fanbase is upset, and viral. BW fans are not the only people who say SC2 has several gameplay flaws. There's a consensus in the SC2 community regarding certain gameplay aspects. Having flaws doesn`t mean the game is terrible. And you missed my point.
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On January 06 2013 11:18 LloydPGM wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 03:18 aZealot wrote: The opinion of TL is not representative of the larger SC2 community. The quiet majority who either play the game, or don't, without feeling the need to repetitively tell everyone about it. Don't mistake one for the other.
Well I don't agree. The quiet majority who either play the game bought WoL because it was a hit and when it came out, everybody was on SC2. Then they played a few ladder games, some Desert Strike and they went on other stuff like LoL or Dota or Call of Duty... Imo a important part of WoL buyer don't even know that HOTS will come out. And if they know, will they buy it since they didn't launched WoL for months ? Will they pay $$ for single campaign..? Not sure ! Don't get wrong. The sc2 community is NOT that large, and people on TL are, in my opinion, representative of this community.
Wow you have clearly lost touch with reality. I would go as far to say that pretty much everyone knows that there will be an expansion who bought WoL. Have you forgotten how much of a big deal it was once Blizzard announced that each race will get their campaign after each expansion? Most people will buy the expansion for the campaign just as most people bought WoL for the campaign.
Yes not everyone plays thousands of games, who would have imagine that in the first place anyway?
The Sc2 community is huge, not as huge as some others but still huge.
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On January 06 2013 11:18 LloydPGM wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 03:18 aZealot wrote: The opinion of TL is not representative of the larger SC2 community. The quiet majority who either play the game, or don't, without feeling the need to repetitively tell everyone about it. Don't mistake one for the other.
Well I don't agree. The quiet majority who either play the game bought WoL because it was a hit and when it came out, everybody was on SC2. Then they played a few ladder games, some Desert Strike and they went on other stuff like LoL or Dota or Call of Duty... Imo a important part of WoL buyer don't even know that HOTS will come out. And if they know, will they buy it since they didn't launched WoL for months ? Will they pay $$ for single campaign..? Not sure ! Don't get wrong. The sc2 community is NOT that large, and people on TL are, in my opinion, representative of this community.
I would guess that only 10% of the people I've met IRL who play starcraft have ever heard of TL, fwiw.
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On January 05 2013 00:12 maybenexttime wrote: I am here because blizzard killed BW in Korea, and I want to get a worthy successor. SC2 is not one, by a mile. And before you say they did not kill BW - they accepted KeSPA's terms when it comes to SC2 in ProLeague while giving KeSPA ridiculous, unacceptable demands a couple of years earlier as far as BW broadcasts go, and sued KeSPA over them. There will probably never be a worthy successor to BW in the sense that it captures many of BW's traits. SC2 already is a more than worthy successor in the sense of having a traditional RTS title played world-wide.
I think I am not the only one who doubts that a BW 2.0 would have been as successful as Wings of Liberty. With Heart of the Swarm, Blizzard can build on that foundation and with Legacy of the Void, SC2 can get the final polishing. But that doesn't mean that BW gets reinvented or reimagined. Dustin Browder is quite open about this attitude, he advises to play BW if one wants to play BW. I think his approach is the right one because we need a development even in Starcraft.
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Even though i think SC2 is an average game, we still have the protoss expansion left to make things right. To answer your question, i do not think HOTS is worth the price.
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On January 07 2013 02:45 Dynamitekid wrote: Even though i think SC2 is an average game, we still have the protoss expansion left to make things right. To answer your question, i do not think HOTS is worth the price. Average games don't score 93 on metacritics and sell in millions while being a fullprice PC game.
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On January 07 2013 02:10 iSTime wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2013 11:18 LloydPGM wrote:On January 06 2013 03:18 aZealot wrote: The opinion of TL is not representative of the larger SC2 community. The quiet majority who either play the game, or don't, without feeling the need to repetitively tell everyone about it. Don't mistake one for the other.
Well I don't agree. The quiet majority who either play the game bought WoL because it was a hit and when it came out, everybody was on SC2. Then they played a few ladder games, some Desert Strike and they went on other stuff like LoL or Dota or Call of Duty... Imo a important part of WoL buyer don't even know that HOTS will come out. And if they know, will they buy it since they didn't launched WoL for months ? Will they pay $$ for single campaign..? Not sure ! Don't get wrong. The sc2 community is NOT that large, and people on TL are, in my opinion, representative of this community. I would guess that only 10% of the people I've met IRL who play starcraft have ever heard of TL, fwiw.
Im guess im not clear : a majority of ppl i know who bought WOL won't buy hots because they don't play sc2 anymore. I guess lot of people still playing a lot know TL and that's why I think TL is representative.
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On January 07 2013 02:47 [F_]aths wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 02:45 Dynamitekid wrote: Even though i think SC2 is an average game, we still have the protoss expansion left to make things right. To answer your question, i do not think HOTS is worth the price. Average games don't score 93 on metacritics and sell in millions while being a fullprice PC game.
Of course its going to sell good. The game was hyped because of how good broodwar was. Even most of the pros think SC2 is mediocre. If it wasn't for the money and availability of tournaments, pros will still be playing starcraft:broodwar.
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On January 07 2013 02:47 [F_]aths wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 02:45 Dynamitekid wrote: Even though i think SC2 is an average game, we still have the protoss expansion left to make things right. To answer your question, i do not think HOTS is worth the price. Average games don't score 93 on metacritics and sell in millions while being a fullprice PC game.
lol metacritics, no one would score WOL at 93 right now
unless it was campaign only - where no one cares
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On January 07 2013 02:45 Dynamitekid wrote: Even though i think SC2 is an average game, we still have the protoss expansion left to make things right. To answer your question, i do not think HOTS is worth the price.
I disagree, sc2 is a great game; but the success is not related to the skills of the design team, which basically have made every mistake possible in their development of the game. Rather its a success because its based on BW, which is a "can't fail formula"
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On January 07 2013 02:57 LloydPGM wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2013 02:10 iSTime wrote:On January 06 2013 11:18 LloydPGM wrote:On January 06 2013 03:18 aZealot wrote: The opinion of TL is not representative of the larger SC2 community. The quiet majority who either play the game, or don't, without feeling the need to repetitively tell everyone about it. Don't mistake one for the other.
Well I don't agree. The quiet majority who either play the game bought WoL because it was a hit and when it came out, everybody was on SC2. Then they played a few ladder games, some Desert Strike and they went on other stuff like LoL or Dota or Call of Duty... Imo a important part of WoL buyer don't even know that HOTS will come out. And if they know, will they buy it since they didn't launched WoL for months ? Will they pay $$ for single campaign..? Not sure ! Don't get wrong. The sc2 community is NOT that large, and people on TL are, in my opinion, representative of this community. I would guess that only 10% of the people I've met IRL who play starcraft have ever heard of TL, fwiw. Im guess im not clear : a majority of ppl i know who bought WOL won't buy hots because they don't play sc2 anymore. I guess lot of people still playing a lot know TL and that's why I think TL is representative.
It is hard to find people to play with online. I usually have to wait a couple of minutes in-order to find someone in ladder. Also, if you watch the pros stream, it usually takes a couple of minutes for them to find an opponent as well.
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