Hello all, Yes, i'm new on TL but I visit pretty frequent in the past. So I been wondering why some people advance out of my league before even reaching 1st in the division. Or on the rare occasion, I heard someone has advance after losing. So, beside winning X amount of game. I have begun to wonder the possibilities, maybe you have to fulfill certain "requirement" to belong in the league. Here is the list so far;
Fact? - Have to be top 8 to able to advance Maybe? - Average unspent resource - Upgrades +armor/attack - Game lengths?
As testing goes for me, I won 6 games in a row and few lose in between for 20 games against gold/platinum while being top 8. But with most games with hardly upgrade with 500+ unspent resource. Same story goes for others top 8 in my group that now almost with 1600+ points, and unable to advance into platinum.
So I am just wondering for those of you, who has advanced. Please let us know How was your games. Did you win X among of games in a row or anything particular I listed above. Thank you your time, lets pile in data.
PS: Or is it as simple as win X games against higher league players to advance? .... haha ..
The way it works is that the more games you play the more the system becomes certain what your skill level is. So I'm guessing league advancement is not only your outward skill level but also the calculation of just how accurate that skill level is. Case in point: Sometimes you lose and advance a league, as possibly that game you just lost against a far better opponent, while still a loss, solidified your skill level enough to bump you up.
I was not aware the system took into account anything in game, as far as unspent resources or game length or anything of the nature. I don't think it does.
I was put into silver league and at around 20-9 after a LOSS when I was outside of top 8 (fairly certain I was at 9-12 area) I was advanced into platinum.
I would guess like a previous poster that it decided that my initial placement was incorrect after I had enough games played and it automatically bumped me up. Kind of makes sense considering 3 of my losses during placement were due to crashes (I went 6-4).
I very much doubt APM, resources, or anything like that have anything to do with rankings/placement. Those are just way too subjective to be used.
I was put in Silver (3 of my 10 ranking matches were disconnects... great) and have been doing pretty well - I'm top 10 in division 1, and I'm something like 150 - 100. I haven't advanced though - and I'd like to.
On March 01 2010 14:23 sith wrote: The way it works is that the more games you play the more the system becomes certain what your skill level is. So I'm guessing league advancement is not only your outward skill level but also the calculation of just how accurate that skill level is. Case in point: Sometimes you lose and advance a league, as possibly that game you just lost against a far better opponent, while still a loss, solidified your skill level enough to bump you up.
I was not aware the system took into account anything in game, as far as unspent resources or game length or anything of the nature. I don't think it does.
I'm #1 in silver and beat TeamEG yesterday and a few more platinum, yet I'm still in silver; and have been the whole time. =/
Same, but now I am in a HARDDDDCORE losing slump But the thing is if you have like 4-5 guys like us in the same devision that play everyday its impossible to get out since your always battling to get out. I just got unlucky and played Idra/Skew/TeamEG in prelims rofl
This is awesome, getting alot of responds, but lets be more details and give us some information about your games. Anything you can give us that I listed, and maybe with can tie something together.
On March 01 2010 14:23 sith wrote: The way it works is that the more games you play the more the system becomes certain what your skill level is. So I'm guessing league advancement is not only your outward skill level but also the calculation of just how accurate that skill level is. Case in point: Sometimes you lose and advance a league, as possibly that game you just lost against a far better opponent, while still a loss, solidified your skill level enough to bump you up.
I was not aware the system took into account anything in game, as far as unspent resources or game length or anything of the nature. I don't think it does.
I'm #1 in silver and beat TeamEG yesterday and a few more platinum, yet I'm still in silver; and have been the whole time. =/
That's good and all, but there are a lot of factors at play, like I said. For example:
- How many games total have you played? - Do you lose games occasionally versus your own skill level? - Whats your win ratio with your own league vs the plat league.
And so on. Even though you may in fact be good enough to be in the platinum, the game may think the matches you won were statistical outliers and not be paying much attention to them as it ranks you. It all comes down to the certainty that it puts on your ranking. If it's uncertain, it's likely to keep you where you are until it can get better data.
Yea I've lost to top silver and gold people (so they claimed their rank to be anyways), while me being 30-40 plaitnum. They definitely didn't seem to be bad enough to be in those ranks. I totally think gametime and spent/unspent minerals, apm, etc might have something to do with placement.
edit- lol fucking boes, you were one of these liars who said rank 2 silver >.<
boesthius, oh wait, what? your 84-48 , 1720 in silver? Yea that game was fucking hilarious, I saw ur mofo ship coming all slow, forgot it had recall cause new patch, then u smashed my bases and proceeded to 1a into me with zeals and i came back haha
i played on my friend's account for the first time. he was like ranked 15-20 in the bronze league. So, i played one game, and won it so i automatically got placed in the silver league.
I got placed in silver after going 6-4, then got into 1st in my division very quickly. Then I was about 150 points ahead of 2nd place at around 1350 total points, beat a platinum player, and advanced straight to platinum division with my points/record intact. I think my record at the time was like 20-10.
Don't think APM is the issue I have decent high amount of apm (125-150+ avg according to the sc2 thing) and I am in silver still tho, the guys I play have a lot lower amount of apm so I don't think it matters hopefully they adjust this tho cause I feel like a total scrub to be in "silver" and everyone in my devision plays 24/7 so its impossible to get ahead rofl.
Yeah.... I'm not really sure how the moving up is done. I got placed into bronze to start, and I match vs silver+ all the time and I can't move up at all. It's at the point where I'm "favored" vs some platinums and a lot of silver/golds, but I'm still in bronze, and I only get like +5 points for beating golds and silvers sometimes.
Well, I haven't advanced from Gold yet, but I consistently beat players around my level and about a 50% win rate against Platinum, using one build as Terran.
My APM is low, but I doubt that would be the reason for the non-promotion.
I guess I just have to keep laddering to get to Platinum.
There's no way things like APM or resources unspent are used for league placement. There's no objective way to measure how 'good' you are based on that.
On March 01 2010 16:19 oxxo wrote: There's no way things like APM or resources unspent are used for league placement. There's no objective way to measure how 'good' you are based on that.
You could correlate it to data from other players and then rank people by deviations from the mean. Its entirely possible but maybe not necessary.
i have nothing to contribute and haven't read past the OP but what's the point of having a fact section and putting questionable facts in them. doesn't that destroy the entire purpose of having a facts section?
This is my guess on the whole scenario: Silver player wants to move up, to move up to gold he has to: Have a Win ratio of 0.85 vs copper, 0.75 vs silver, 0.5 vs gold, 0.33 vs platinum Silver player wants to move up, to move up to platinum he has to: Have a Win ratio of 0.9 vs copper, 0.85 vs silver, 0.66 vs gold, 0.5 vs platinum
And if this system is the one they use, then right now the reason you can't progress, is maybe because the first day you lost to 1 copper, and beat 2, making your win ratio .66 vs copper, and then no or very few coppers are Qeueing any more, and you aren't getting matched vs them... So you can't advance...
im like 46-26, #1 in silver league 7 on euro by over 100 points (im 1570ish, 2nd is 1460ish) and have not moved up. went 7-3 in placement with 2 of them being discs so i figured id have moved up by now, but i guess the game thinks i suck or something.
it really doesnt matter though cause i get to play plenty of platinum people so i dont really care that im not higher its just weird that it hasnt bumped me, oh well
On March 01 2010 17:44 lawjeek wrote: This is my guess on the whole scenario: Silver player wants to move up, to move up to gold he has to: Have a Win ratio of 0.85 vs copper, 0.75 vs silver, 0.5 vs gold, 0.33 vs platinum Silver player wants to move up, to move up to platinum he has to: Have a Win ratio of 0.9 vs copper, 0.85 vs silver, 0.66 vs gold, 0.5 vs platinum
And if this system is the one they use, then right now the reason you can't progress, is maybe because the first day you lost to 1 copper, and beat 2, making your win ratio .66 vs copper, and then no or very few coppers are Qeueing any more, and you aren't getting matched vs them... So you can't advance...
I think it has to do with a bit of availability to place you in division and how hard it is to be dropped from your gold or plat ranking. I should see how many games i can just auto loose in a row till i drop down to silver again.
Beats me, after failing horribly in placement matches, I'm now at #1 in my Silver League with a 300 pts differential from the #2 holder and I haven't been moved up .
My first 10 games was the first 10 rts games i play in 4 years, and i got 6-4, and into silver. Then after 10-15 games I got put into gold after i _lost_ a game. Then after another 100 games im still in top 5 gold league, been that for over a week now, and never seem to advance, even tho im somthing like 20-3 my last games and 1700 elo.
" Please not that the Find Match functionality is currently configured to find games more quickly, rather than find evenly matched games. While this gets you playing faster, the chances are greatly increased that you will play against opponents that are well above or below your skill level. As we continue to invite players to the beta and adjust the matchmaking accuracy versus matchmaking speed, the odds finding an even match improve dramatically." From blue.
I guess we'll have to wait for bigger pool of players, until the system is more accurate.
There might be some sort of function where it tries to even out players in the different leagues so that if lots of people are put in the silver league after their placement games, some of the top silver league players will get bumped up to other leagues. That would explain the seemingly arbitrary way people are getting moved.
I actually tried to move down from gold division to something lower. My inital stats were ~30-30 and i went down to ~30-85 with ~650 rating - still, i didnt move (lost against a whole lot of bad copper league players)
On March 01 2010 19:26 Arikuna wrote: I actually tried to move down from gold division to something lower. My inital stats were ~30-30 and i went down to ~30-85 with ~650 rating - still, i didnt move (lost against a whole lot of bad copper league players)
It seems to me that the system calculates some in-game info. After I got the key, I immediately jumped into the Ladder without even knowing which units each race has. So, I went 5-5 and was placed to Bronze. Than I have read some strats and practiced hotkeys, and after 15-20 games I was promoted from Bronze straight to Gold, jumping over Silver.
No one knows their ELO rating - it isn't shown - so please stop talking about your POINTS as though they were a SKILL RATING. All divisions have similar point spreads - there are people in copper divisions with 1600+ points who suck huge balls and would lose 50-0 against 1200 pt Plat players.
Your skill rating (the one Blizz doesn't show you) is what mostly determines your league placement. It's simply about winning and losing and against who.
On March 01 2010 22:12 Pacer wrote: No one knows their ELO rating - it isn't shown - so please stop talking about your POINTS as though they were a SKILL RATING. All divisions have similar point spreads - there are people in copper divisions with 1600+ points who suck huge balls and would lose 50-0 against 1200 pt Plat players.
Your skill rating (the one Blizz doesn't show you) is what mostly determines your league placement. It's simply about winning and losing and against who.
Then what should we talk about? The sky being blue?
On March 01 2010 22:12 Pacer wrote: No one knows their ELO rating - it isn't shown - so please stop talking about your POINTS as though they were a SKILL RATING. All divisions have similar point spreads - there are people in copper divisions with 1600+ points who suck huge balls and would lose 50-0 against 1200 pt Plat players.
Your skill rating (the one Blizz doesn't show you) is what mostly determines your league placement. It's simply about winning and losing and against who.
Then what should we talk about? The sky being blue?
Talk about whatever the fuck you want, just don't talk about POINTS as though they are (or even try to be) a measurement of your SKILL.
In my opinion it's too early to evaluate the ladder system. Sure, you can see the rough idea behind it, but when it comes to evaluate it... I think this isn't the ideal situation.
I know there's lot of discussions regarding divisions and matchmaking, but most of the negative feedback I read was referring to the matchmaking system not working properly, thus pairing players with different skill levels, especially during the ranking matches. This is mostly due to the number of players in the Beta and I'm confident that this issue will solve itself during release.
About being moved to different divisions and/or ladders: what you're seeing now in the Beta isn't what you will get in release. Movements will occur differently and periodically, you will finally have a reason to be in those top spots of your division: don't forget that we also have a "Pro" ladder waiting for you, even if it's not there yet!
I understand your questions and I'm pretty sure that more information will be released in the future, just be patient: Battle.Net is supposed to work at its best with a large number of players and this is why it's still early to rate it
On March 01 2010 22:12 Pacer wrote: No one knows their ELO rating - it isn't shown - so please stop talking about your POINTS as though they were a SKILL RATING. All divisions have similar point spreads - there are people in copper divisions with 1600+ points who suck huge balls and would lose 50-0 against 1200 pt Plat players.
Your skill rating (the one Blizz doesn't show you) is what mostly determines your league placement. It's simply about winning and losing and against who.
Actually the rating that IS shown IS the ELO rating. You do not see their rating used for the matchmaking and league swapping evaluations, but with regard to the "teams even / favored" comments at start, it can roughly be assumed that 200-300 displayed rating difference translate into one league up/down. There might be other factors, but this assumption is pretty accurate usually.
I am around 1500 in bronze and i constantly play silver and gold players with 200-300/400-500 worse rating (according to their chat), having an average win ratio of 60% (started at 40%, getting slowly better and thus advancing in my league as well). So imho the system works actually pretty well so far. You just have to get over the feeling that you are worse just because your league is lower, which is actually not true. It is the combination of elo rating and league that determines your position.
Of course bigger player numbers and a higher amount of games played will make everything alot more accurate.
Basicaly I played Protoss as my qualifying matches since they are my best and at the time I just didn't knew I could be demoted so I started playing Terrans, Zergs and Random. I don't have to tell you that I suck at Zerg and i'm soso at Terran (same thing in SC1).... so I lost alot of games. Basicaly at some point I was like 40th and had to play Protoss to get my ranking back to 12~20....
But after I got back from 40th to 15ish just right after a 5 win streak.... I got a message saying "CONGRADULATION, You have been promoted to the GOLD division" Promoted? anyways... I don't mind since I keep playing all races in the Gold division the difference is that now I'm always in the 1-8 position hehe!
On March 01 2010 22:12 Pacer wrote: No one knows their ELO rating - it isn't shown - so please stop talking about your POINTS as though they were a SKILL RATING. All divisions have similar point spreads - there are people in copper divisions with 1600+ points who suck huge balls and would lose 50-0 against 1200 pt Plat players.
Your skill rating (the one Blizz doesn't show you) is what mostly determines your league placement. It's simply about winning and losing and against who.
Then what should we talk about? The sky being blue?
Talk about whatever the fuck you want, just don't talk about POINTS as though they are (or even try to be) a measurement of your SKILL.
Even though they more or less are we should not dare speak of the points we have obtained through playing other people.
On March 01 2010 23:09 APurpleCow wrote: IIRC your division gets reevaluated every thirty games. It doesn't matter if your 30th game is a loss if you went 29-0 before that.
As I've theorized in previous posts, I think it's related to a hidden matchmaking rating (MMR) that's based off the entire player pool. Something like this example scenario (again, this is unproven because Blizzard hasn't revealed the inner workings):
There are 20 players participating in a ladder. The top 4 MMRs are 2000, 1950, 1900, and 1850. The top 10%, or top 2 players, get placed in Platinum. The next 10% are placed in Gold. Based on your performance, and especially streak performance, your MMR increases or decreases wildly (so if you're just starting and you beat that 1500 person, you get matched against the 1700 person and win, then the 2000 person and lose, then the 1800 person). The system attempts to assign you a confidence (or volatility) value that eventually places you at an estimated 50% win rate. Let's say your MMR after 20 games is 1925. You're between the top 10% and 20% of players so you get placed in Gold. Now let's say 20 additional players join the ladder, for a total of 40. Their MMRs are all quite low, below 1800, so the ranks even themselves out. You now join the top 10% of players and get placed in Platinum. Your MMR is independent of your shown "elo-style" rating, which appears to only place you within your own division.
I played some 2v2 with a friend and got placed in Bronze to start, but as we won more and more games against higher level players, we were promoted to Gold, completely skipping over Silver. This is because the system determined that our MMR was likely much higher than the other Bronze players. I think as more and more people join the beta, we'll see a more accurate layout (and Blizzard has said that at present, the system is configured to match through speed rather than accuracy due to the low number of players).
After reading through this thread it sounds like the current ladder system sounds pretty inaccurate. I assume blizzard's calculations must know that too because I had a game where I was "favored" yet I am in silver and my opponent was in gold...
Just wondering has anyone got moved up twice? I know people have skipped ladders but I havent heard of anyone getting moved up again. It seems you get placed and then after about 30 games or so it re-evaluates you and then thats it, youre stuck there untill the end of the season maybe.
On March 02 2010 03:37 Motoxpro wrote: Just wondering has anyone got moved up twice? I know people have skipped ladders but I havent heard of anyone getting moved up again. It seems you get placed and then after about 30 games or so it re-evaluates you and then thats it, youre stuck there untill the end of the season maybe.
I was wondering that as well. I've moved up once, but not twice. It took me only 1 day to move up from silver->gold, and even though I was still getting exponentially better, I only went to the top of the gold ladder and never advanced to plat.
I'm not going to be a poser or anything, but I've talked to the blizzard RTS ACM EU manager and told her about how its confusing how the ranking system, the leagues etc work and told her my friend got up a league (silver to gold) when he lost a game. She said that they were going to put up an explanation of how it works..
oh nice.. I've been ranked 1 in my silver division for 3 days and 40 games now.. it's kinda stupid. I'm sure I've been playing some plat players though
edit: side note, if you move up divisions do your points stay the same?
It doesn't make sense at all. Cause I play vs gold and plat players so why am I stuck in silver? Seems as tho there's a hidden ranking system that can have you at same points as plat player when your in silver. Why doesn't it just move you up?
I've beaten butt loads of platinum players but still am rank 3 in gold. It's pretty ridiculous, really. I also went 9-1 in placement tests with my friend and we got put into plat 2v2.
On March 02 2010 06:46 Whiplash wrote: I've beaten butt loads of platinum players but still am rank 3 in gold. It's pretty ridiculous, really. I also went 9-1 in placement tests with my friend and we got put into plat 2v2.
I'm rank bronze (220-160) 2000+ points, I(we) only play platinum players.
The guy who said it only reevaluates you after 30 games and then stops is probably right. We went from plat to bronze because one of the players on our account kept having disconnection issues for 20 straight games which dropped us.
Overall the ladder seems useless, I don't play anyone in my league (have not once), and I can't move up. There's no end goal.
It's not your first 10 games that truly place you, it's your first 40 games.
The first 10 games only put you into a league on a provisional basis - a rough guess on the system's part if you will. Then based on your next 30 games, the system verifies whether or not its rough guess was accurate based on your performance, then moves you up or down accordingly.
After 40 games, you are locked into your league for the rest of the ladder season - no matter how well or how bad you play from then on out.
I want to know what's going to happen with the Proleague...League. And how you advance to it. My pet theory is that all the leagues will funnel into the one big proleague ladder. Hopefully non-country specific (but I doubt it).
I don't think there's been any concrete information on this (has there?)
On March 02 2010 06:58 NotAZergRush wrote: How the system works is simple -
It's not your first 10 games that truly place you, it's your first 40 games.
The first 10 games only put you into a league on a provisional basis - a rough guess on the system's part if you will. Then based on your next 30 games, the system verifies whether or not its rough guess was accurate based on your performance, then moves you up or down accordingly.
After 40 games, you are locked into your league for the rest of the ladder season - no matter how well or how bad you play from then on out.
This theory explains my situation.
Has ANYONE been demoted or promoted from game 40 and on?
On March 02 2010 06:58 NotAZergRush wrote: How the system works is simple -
It's not your first 10 games that truly place you, it's your first 40 games.
The first 10 games only put you into a league on a provisional basis - a rough guess on the system's part if you will. Then based on your next 30 games, the system verifies whether or not its rough guess was accurate based on your performance, then moves you up or down accordingly.
After 40 games, you are locked into your league for the rest of the ladder season - no matter how well or how bad you play from then on out.
This actually makes the most sense out of any theory I've read so far.
I will go ahead and say that I *WAS* moved leagues after my 40th game, and I have not moved again despite going on many 10-12 game winning streaks, beating plat players in the top 10 of their div. etc etc, and I have been sitting in the top 1-3 of my gold league for many days now.
From everything I've read it sounds like 10 games to place, 30 games to secure, and then you stay where you are until the end of the ladder season, which would make sense because if people in the leagues below plat were constantly being juggled around there would be no "fair" end of season tourney in the leagues.
Maybe they'll change this in the future, but it seems like a pretty fair system as long as each ladder season is only a couple of months in duration, and at the start of a new ladder season you get a new 30 games to try and move up a league, or maybe it will just automatically move you up at the start of a new season?
has anyone experienced the "player found" bug today in 1v1? I keep getting losses from games that never spawned for me, but when I check the logs it shows I had an opponent and I end up losing after about 3-4 minutes. Just started today for me, never had it happen before. I have to log out for a significant period of time for it to spawn a game for me, and then even after that it seems to happen again.
On March 02 2010 06:58 NotAZergRush wrote: How the system works is simple -
It's not your first 10 games that truly place you, it's your first 40 games.
The first 10 games only put you into a league on a provisional basis - a rough guess on the system's part if you will. Then based on your next 30 games, the system verifies whether or not its rough guess was accurate based on your performance, then moves you up or down accordingly.
After 40 games, you are locked into your league for the rest of the ladder season - no matter how well or how bad you play from then on out.
I have also heard this and form my experience, what I have read/heard from others it seems to be true.
I'm probably the worst player im Platinum. So far I've only got one win against another Plat, I rarely beat Golds, but I tend to do alright against Silver. I started it in Silver and after two losses I got shifted up to Platinum. The system seems seriously flawed.
Lol i just lost and got promoted to silver. I was top 8 in bronze except i would drop down when i would get busy for a day or two but would always be eventually top 8, and i just got moved up to silver after a loss... lol i dont understand at all. Granted it was a close loss.. i had 3 banshees out and held off 2 MmM pushes but the 3rd finally killed me. i had like 8 marines then straight into cloaked banshees. but once the wall was down and he wouldnt give me time to repair it it eventually ran me over. But yay i guess? i loss'ed myself into silver? haha. Im 11th in my silver ladder have played 195 games. just in case some1 is using these numbers for something specific. Just read the post at the top of this page. Guess your wrong? Since i got promoted leagues on my 195th match. After every loss i tend to ask what div they are in ,especially if they are friendly/respectful gamers with the whole Gl/hf comment at start. and then answering questions you might have during games about what they did, but anyways about 75% of my games were vs silver league players anyways about the rest were fair mix between bronze,gold, and like 2 copper when i first started (well i assume they were copper cause they were like "omg you have no idea wtf ur doing, bad".
I just got promoted from Bronze to Platinum after my latest game (a loss). My record is 216-192, so well over 40 games.
The strange thing is, for my last 50 games or so I've been messing around with different build orders and strategies, and losing a ton, my rating a few days ago in bronze was 1970, when I got promoted it was down to 1850.
Same as poster above strangely and i just got promoted about 5 mins ago. The past 50-100 games i have played random (the first 100 i was terran only) and have been using variety of diff strats/openings.
On March 02 2010 10:53 mnofstl007 wrote: Lol i just lost and got promoted to silver. I was top 8 in bronze except i would drop down when i would get busy for a day or two but would always be eventually top 8, and i just got moved up to silver after a loss... lol i dont understand at all. Granted it was a close loss.. i had 3 banshees out and held off 2 MmM pushes but the 3rd finally killed me. i had like 8 marines then straight into cloaked banshees. but once the wall was down and he wouldnt give me time to repair it it eventually ran me over. But yay i guess? i loss'ed myself into silver? haha. Im 11th in my silver ladder have played 195 games. just in case some1 is using these numbers for something specific. Just read the post at the top of this page. Guess your wrong? Since i got promoted leagues on my 195th match. After every loss i tend to ask what div they are in ,especially if they are friendly/respectful gamers with the whole Gl/hf comment at start. and then answering questions you might have during games about what they did, but anyways about 75% of my games were vs silver league players anyways about the rest were fair mix between bronze,gold, and like 2 copper when i first started (well i assume they were copper cause they were like "omg you have no idea wtf ur doing, bad".
people in silver play sooooo much more than bronze haha. I have moved up and down like 30 spots just in the time of one game. lol in bronze i was generally the only one moving.
I think I figure it out, the system does /random 100 every so often. Then we have our lucky winner!
But on the serious note, if from what people are telling us are true. Then it might as well be completely random to a certain degree, due to lack of players to accurately determined each of our skill level. So I like to close this thread for the time being, and wait for future wave of invites to speculate the advancement issue. Until then, lets not waste anymore time on this matter and just play! Thank you for everyone input.
On March 02 2010 11:09 squ1d wrote: I also got promoted right now.
Means that the system probably runs through and indexes all players once a week or so.
i was just promoted from gold to platinum just now as well. i went 8-2 and was placed in gold and on exactly my 80th game (my record is now 47-33). i won against a platinum player which i didn't know until the end of the game. weird part was that i was slightly favored BEFORE the game started when i was rank 7 in gold, while he was rank 10 in platinum.
the game does not seem to rely on rank/points to determine who is favored...
On March 02 2010 11:09 squ1d wrote: I also got promoted right now.
Means that the system probably runs through and indexes all players once a week or so.
i was just promoted from gold to platinum just now as well. i went 8-2 and was placed in gold and on exactly my 80th game (my record is now 47-33). i won against a platinum player which i didn't know until the end of the game. weird part was that i was slightly favored BEFORE the game started when i was rank 7 in gold, while he was rank 10 in platinum.
the game does not seem to rely on rank/points to determine who is favored...
Interesting so instead of the previously thought "every 30 games" it sounds like it may actually be "every 40 games" that it checks?
i got promoted to platinum, after i had just given up all hope 62-33, got it on my latest win vs a favored opponent now in division 3 TOPPING REKRUL np
On March 02 2010 08:00 Modus wrote: has anyone experienced the "player found" bug today in 1v1? I keep getting losses from games that never spawned for me, but when I check the logs it shows I had an opponent and I end up losing after about 3-4 minutes. Just started today for me, never had it happen before. I have to log out for a significant period of time for it to spawn a game for me, and then even after that it seems to happen again.
On March 02 2010 11:09 squ1d wrote: I also got promoted right now.
Means that the system probably runs through and indexes all players once a week or so.
i was just promoted from gold to platinum just now as well. i went 8-2 and was placed in gold and on exactly my 80th game (my record is now 47-33). i won against a platinum player which i didn't know until the end of the game. weird part was that i was slightly favored BEFORE the game started when i was rank 7 in gold, while he was rank 10 in platinum.
the game does not seem to rely on rank/points to determine who is favored...
Interesting so instead of the previously thought "every 30 games" it sounds like it may actually be "every 40 games" that it checks?
either every 40 games... or on a time basis like every week. that and how well you do against higher ranked players whether you win or lose.
i think that the system knows how badly you beat the person as well...
On March 02 2010 11:58 intrigue wrote: i got promoted to platinum, after i had just given up all hope 62-33, got it on my latest win vs a favored opponent now in division 3 TOPPING REKRUL np
nm to every 40 games. you played 95 and got promoted. but that's at least 3 people who got promoted today... it might be on a time basis and i believe the game measures how well you do against high ranked players win or lose...
I have only played zerg for all 94 of my games and have not been promoted to gold yet. Does anyone think this may be a contribution to being able to rank up? (i.e. have the people that ranked up played alot of races, and people that have not ranked up only played maybe the same race?)
On March 02 2010 12:05 Disastorm wrote: I have only played zerg for all 94 of my games and have not been promoted to gold yet. Does anyone think this may be a contribution to being able to rank up? (i.e. have the people that ranked up played alot of races, and people that have not ranked up only played maybe the same race?)
i've only played protoss for all 80 games. that has nothing to do with it.
So I was right It seems that the system re-indexes everyone and re-balances the divisions based on time, not necessarily games played (while that may also be true).
i still stand by the idea that it goes on a weekly basis or so. i just checked my platinum league division 10 and out of 62 people, over half are new (exclamation mark next to their names). and i mean over half.
Hey guys, I'm new to the forum and am in the beta. I was never a huge Starcraft player, but loved Warcraft III and will be moving on!
Anyway, I've had 2 interesting experiences since I've started playing the beta. The first was after going 0-7 in the placement rounds for 2v2, I then won the last 3 very convincingly (after lots of practice) and got placed into silver with a 3-7 record. Since then, my total record stands at 20-15 and I just got promoted from silver to platinum (skipping gold).
There's obviously no way that this just looks at record. I'm guessing it has something to do with your average unspent resources, result of last x matches, time taken to win/lose, closeness to opponents score etc.
EDIT: Also, my name is RHINOCEROS.feelsgoodman in beta if anyone needs to verify any of my claims.
I just went form gold 12 to plat 12 ON A GAME I LOST you can see the -13 points
2 times so far i've been promoted on a loosing game lol wth up with that. win 68 loose 54 (about 20 of those are disconnects~~~) i don't play enough to get to number 1 and stay there
also now my points fed up again lol i start at 922 points wtf lol
On March 02 2010 13:00 Virtue wrote: I just went form gold 12 to plat 12 ON A GAME I LOST you can see the -13 points
2 times so far i've been promoted on a loosing game lol wth up with that. win 68 loose 54 (about 20 of those are disconnects~~~) i don't play enough to get to number 1 and stay there
also now my points fed up again lol i start at 922 points wtf lol
On March 02 2010 13:00 Virtue wrote: I just went form gold 12 to plat 12 ON A GAME I LOST you can see the -13 points
2 times so far i've been promoted on a loosing game lol wth up with that. win 68 loose 54 (about 20 of those are disconnects~~~) i don't play enough to get to number 1 and stay there
also now my points fed up again lol i start at 922 points wtf lol why not 1000? 1300 points too high in gold to plat i need more points???
i envy you, i want to advance
I am super confused on how this game does placement and advancement lol it seems fing random lol
On March 02 2010 13:08 _rdm_ wrote: 1950 170-110 silver #1 division 9
Stuck there since the beginning
I think you get multiple points 1 for plat 1 for gold 1 for silver 1 for bronze 1 for copper
and every game you win against people in those leagues it affects those points values and win % and what ever leauge you're currently in always gets effected by everything
else i don't get why i started at 922 points in plat in the lonely division in the world only 30 people i think mostly people who are 10-0 or 9-1 and are 1000 points makes up the top 3 lol i won 2 games and advanced to rank 8 t-t
I don't feel very accomplished in this division.
becuase the person i lost to was a platinum player fing 3 gated me
Oh , another thing to add is I had a huge bonus points pool after being promoted. I was close to 1400 in copper I think, but under 1100 after the promotion to silver, but with 195 bonus points.
On March 02 2010 12:25 Rhinoceros wrote: Hey guys, I'm new to the forum and am in the beta. I was never a huge Starcraft player, but loved Warcraft III and will be moving on!
Anyway, I've had 2 interesting experiences since I've started playing the beta. The first was after going 0-7 in the placement rounds for 2v2, I then won the last 3 very convincingly (after lots of practice) and got placed into silver with a 3-7 record. Since then, my total record stands at 20-15 and I just got promoted from silver to platinum (skipping gold).
There's obviously no way that this just looks at record. I'm guessing it has something to do with your average unspent resources, result of last x matches, time taken to win/lose, closeness to opponents score etc.
EDIT: Also, my name is RHINOCEROS.feelsgoodman in beta if anyone needs to verify any of my claims.
Again there is almost no chance that they do that. There's no objective way to rank people based on all these variables.
People are overthinking this.
It is almost guaranteed to simply be overall W/L (taking into account opponent strength for both wins and losses, if you lose to people you 'shouldn't then you aren't going to move up), maybe last X games, and that's it.
On March 02 2010 12:25 Rhinoceros wrote: Hey guys, I'm new to the forum and am in the beta. I was never a huge Starcraft player, but loved Warcraft III and will be moving on!
Anyway, I've had 2 interesting experiences since I've started playing the beta. The first was after going 0-7 in the placement rounds for 2v2, I then won the last 3 very convincingly (after lots of practice) and got placed into silver with a 3-7 record. Since then, my total record stands at 20-15 and I just got promoted from silver to platinum (skipping gold).
There's obviously no way that this just looks at record. I'm guessing it has something to do with your average unspent resources, result of last x matches, time taken to win/lose, closeness to opponents score etc.
EDIT: Also, my name is RHINOCEROS.feelsgoodman in beta if anyone needs to verify any of my claims.
Again there is almost no chance that they do that. There's no objective way to rank people based on all these variables.
People are overthinking this.
It is almost guaranteed to simply be overall W/L (taking into account opponent strength for both wins and losses, if you lose to people you 'shouldn't then you aren't going to move up), maybe last X games, and that's it.
I'm quite sure it will be relatively weighed. Read up on ELO.
Well I played my first game today, lost and got promoted. It seems they do promotion in waves, and only weekly or bi weekly. Something like that i assume.
I went 8-2 during my placement matches and was placed into platinum division 10. While playing in platinum division I think my record almost about broke even 13-11(ELO was in 900s at the time) and was dropped down to silver division 10. Now after finishing my last game, I was bumped back up into platinum division 11 and not gold division with an ELO of ~1450 and 90-74. This seems to be a new division because next to almost everyones' names there are yellow ! marks that are saying they joined the division today. Also when I joined this new division my ELO dropped to 1354.
If anyone played WoW, you would know Tuesday is teh reset day for raids/update for Arena points. Maybe there a connection? I doubt it.. but something to consider
I really don't understand this. I'm playing on a friends account and we've been in silver for a really long time. Then today I got on a 2 (amazing!!) win streak vs platinum users and BABOOM! We're currently on 9th place in platinum
On March 02 2010 18:17 BigBalls wrote: JOKE JOKE JOKE JOKE JOKE
I was at 1880 or so yesterday in Gold(300 ahead of the dude in 2nd) before i lost a game and got the "Player found" bug 4 times. Pretty sure the system is just broken/terrible like all of Bnet 2.0
i got moved after my 95th game (a loss) to platinum division 9 euro. there are only 35 people in it, my rating went from 1707 silver to 945 platinum, but whatever, at least its fair for everyone now
You playing in euro server??? Btw I just got moved from Gold to Plat after a win fwiw, but it was against a lower rank and I got like 3pts anyways... seems like its just once per week or something.
Five hours ago i was 16th in my Silver with 15xx points, top two were over 2000, several close to it. I won a few games, lost a few, same spot same score.
I log in 15 minutes ago and find myself 9th with the same amount of points, top 7 moved on somewhere. So i play a noob from probably Bronze (I was favored), - win. Bam! I get promoted to Plarinum Div 8 on 7th spot with MorroW on top.
I am probably the worst platinum player ever, when B.net placed me in Silver after 6-4 (2 crashes) i was fine, went 65% winning ratio, but the skill level felt fine, i was probably at 45-50% ratio against favored, although i played a few games vs Kolll (almost won) and Infernal.
Did they implement ProLeague for all the good players?
Currently I am at Rank 1 Silver Division 12 (1550 pts 111 wins - 92 loses)
I don't don't understand, the last 20 games i've played has literally been nothign but platinum and a couple golds. I am playing and beating all these platinum players as a silver shouldn't I see a promotion? I make it a point to check who I play after each match and have not played anyone below gold in almost 25 games.
here is my match history of last matches
win plualone platinum win streetwise platinum loss frozenphone platinum win setheron gold loss mass platinum loss bisu platinum win ocedic platinum loss littlenemo platinum win ryuk platinum win LUNASKY platinum win chakra platinum
I have played like 15 games today and not one of them has been silver. i can update this post after every match as i continue to play nothing but gold + plat as a silver.
i think it's clear that i am not stuck in silver because i play at a silver level. i really wish to get some clarification from blizzard
On March 02 2010 14:46 sixduck wrote: Heres some info.
I went 8-2 during my placement matches and was placed into platinum division 10. While playing in platinum division I think my record almost about broke even 13-11(ELO was in 900s at the time) and was dropped down to silver division 10. Now after finishing my last game, I was bumped back up into platinum division 11 and not gold division with an ELO of ~1450 and 90-74. This seems to be a new division because next to almost everyones' names there are yellow ! marks that are saying they joined the division today. Also when I joined this new division my ELO dropped to 1354.
I've been in Division 11 since there were like 4 people. It's not new, just that it only had a few people in it for a quite a while (~30).
Finally got plat on a win that got me to 2k in silver, jumped to plat from there. I was 450 pts ahead of the rest of the league. Just keep playing, it doesnt really matter what league your in since you get matched vs gold and plats anyway. Thats how I was 450 points ahead, I was mostly playing "favored" games which is a good way to get points.
So I have had a kind of suspicion about people losing a match and suddenly getting promoted right after a loss. So me and a friend were in the same division, and we were #1 (him) and #2. As soon as I overcame him in points (he was 1396, i reached 1406), the very second my match finished, he was promoted. Battle.net 2.0 is seriously fucked up.
I don't have the time to read the whole thread right now so I don't know if this has already been adressed, but you don't need to be top 8 to move up a league. I moved up when I was ~25 in my division with around 15 games played.
On March 04 2010 09:57 ProtossSalad wrote: Currently I am at Rank 1 Silver Division 12 (1550 pts 111 wins - 92 loses)
I don't don't understand, the last 20 games i've played has literally been nothign but platinum and a couple golds. I am playing and beating all these platinum players as a silver shouldn't I see a promotion? I make it a point to check who I play after each match and have not played anyone below gold in almost 25 games.
here is my match history of last matches
win plualone platinum win streetwise platinum loss frozenphone platinum win setheron gold loss mass platinum loss bisu platinum win ocedic platinum loss littlenemo platinum win ryuk platinum win LUNASKY platinum win chakra platinum
I have played like 15 games today and not one of them has been silver. i can update this post after every match as i continue to play nothing but gold + plat as a silver.
i think it's clear that i am not stuck in silver because i play at a silver level. i really wish to get some clarification from blizzard
What's probably happening is that the system is probably waiting until there's enough people to start a new platinum division.
Notice how division 4 still has around 30 players, that to me shows that getting the divisions filled up to 100 isn't a priority at the moment, and that the priority is in creating new divisions.
Makes no sense to me, I was rank 18 plat with a 1350rating, and it dropped me down to Gold where I stayed #1 for over a week at 1500-1600 rating, and still hasn't moved me back up. Really wish they would release something explaining it.
I was hanging around in the Silver top 10 since I started, and getting a +/-50% win rate, but then I went on a bit of a slump; lost a few of games in a row, putting me down to the 40s-50s (massive jump, I know), but as I started to climb back again, I got randomly bumped down to Bronze ;'(.
I have no idea what level of players I've been playing against, but my APM is higher than every opponent I face and my unspent resources are usually lower. I don't really mind, as I know I'm a noob, but it was just pretty surprising.
On March 04 2010 07:30 0neder wrote: Guys, be patient. This is beta so the sample size is skewed, and until we know the concrete details of the system, we can't really evaluate it.
I'd be willing to be that there are almost NO "concrete" details, but rather that they are trying to adjust the ratings systems based on what is going on with the players. Many of the seeming inexplicable results are quite explicable if you don't assume that the formula is constant. They tweak the formula, people change spots, seemingly for no consistent reason. This is just true, the reason isn't consistent yet.
Still stuck in #1 Copper spot since the beginning of beta with over 2k rating and a positive win ratio. Ive pretty much lost hope at this point. Guess ill just hang out with the 1500 rated players and have to defend against every type of cheese every single game .
On March 04 2010 09:57 ProtossSalad wrote: Currently I am at Rank 1 Silver Division 12 (1550 pts 111 wins - 92 loses)
I don't don't understand, the last 20 games i've played has literally been nothign but platinum and a couple golds. I am playing and beating all these platinum players as a silver shouldn't I see a promotion? I make it a point to check who I play after each match and have not played anyone below gold in almost 25 games.
here is my match history of last matches
win plualone platinum win streetwise platinum loss frozenphone platinum win setheron gold loss mass platinum loss bisu platinum win ocedic platinum loss littlenemo platinum win ryuk platinum win LUNASKY platinum win chakra platinum
I have played like 15 games today and not one of them has been silver. i can update this post after every match as i continue to play nothing but gold + plat as a silver.
i think it's clear that i am not stuck in silver because i play at a silver level. i really wish to get some clarification from blizzard
bisu? as in the bisu or just some poser? i'm betting poser.
although that would explain bisu's shitty playing int he proleague currently tho.
On-topic. I think it's probably based mostly on your win-lose ratio in addition to the caliber of opponents you're beating/losing to?
I think something like map control/scouting and what you do with said information may even factor into how you are placed. I was Disconnected in 2 placement matches for 1v1 and got placed in gold, I didn't even play 10 more matches before the game figured out to put me in platinum, and I got upgraded on a loss.
On March 01 2010 16:16 DoubleU wrote: I'm pretty sure APM is not a factor in calculating advancement, otherwise blizzard are just being straight silly.
On March 11 2010 15:05 Perseverance wrote: I think something like map control/scouting and what you do with said information may even factor into how you are placed. I was Disconnected in 2 placement matches for 1v1 and got placed in gold, I didn't even play 10 more matches before the game figured out to put me in platinum, and I got upgraded on a loss.
On March 11 2010 15:05 Perseverance wrote: I think something like map control/scouting and what you do with said information may even factor into how you are placed.
thats just really impossible for the matchmaking system to accurately judge, so no.
I progressed to the next league when I won against a guy that was better then me I think.. I just suddenly progressed and I was really surprised, because I won a game and didnt progress and then I lost a game and won again, then I suddenly progressed:O
On March 11 2010 16:37 Kare wrote: I progressed to the next league when I won against a guy that was better then me I think.. I just suddenly progressed and I was really surprised, because I won a game and didnt progress and then I lost a game and won again, then I suddenly progressed:O
when did that happen?
It would be really helpful if you all said WHEN THE HELL you progressed (none does that !?!) so we can see if its like a weekly thing
I went 6-4 in placement games, got put into silver league.
I was promoted from silver to platinum (skipping gold) when i had about a 200 point lead on #2 in my silver division - this was after i'd played 10 games in a row where my opponent was favored, winning 8 of them. funnily enough, it was after a loss that i was promoted
In my opinion it's too early to evaluate the ladder system. Sure, you can see the rough idea behind it, but when it comes to evaluate it... I think this isn't the ideal situation.
I know there's lot of discussions regarding divisions and matchmaking, but most of the negative feedback I read was referring to the matchmaking system not working properly, thus pairing players with different skill levels, especially during the ranking matches. This is mostly due to the number of players in the Beta and I'm confident that this issue will solve itself during release.
About being moved to different divisions and/or ladders: what you're seeing now in the Beta isn't what you will get in release. Movements will occur differently and periodically, you will finally have a reason to be in those top spots of your division: don't forget that we also have a "Pro" ladder waiting for you, even if it's not there yet!
I understand your questions and I'm pretty sure that more information will be released in the future, just be patient: Battle.Net is supposed to work at its best with a large number of players and this is why it's still early to rate it
It's not working yet. Movements WILL occur periodically in release.
heres some more info to boggle your mind. Tonight i played this guy Maverick, and I won got 10pts. the VERY next game I played him again, won again, and got 12 points.
On March 11 2010 19:11 Disarray wrote: heres some more info to boggle your mind. Tonight i played this guy Maverick, and I won got 10pts. the VERY next game I played him again, won again, and got 12 points.
figure that one out lol
oooh i know! bnet sucks. seriously though what the hell
On March 04 2010 09:57 ProtossSalad wrote: Currently I am at Rank 1 Silver Division 12 (1550 pts 111 wins - 92 loses)
I don't don't understand, the last 20 games i've played has literally been nothign but platinum and a couple golds. I am playing and beating all these platinum players as a silver shouldn't I see a promotion? I make it a point to check who I play after each match and have not played anyone below gold in almost 25 games.
here is my match history of last matches
win plualone platinum win streetwise platinum loss frozenphone platinum win setheron gold loss mass platinum loss bisu platinum win ocedic platinum loss littlenemo platinum win ryuk platinum win LUNASKY platinum win chakra platinum
I have played like 15 games today and not one of them has been silver. i can update this post after every match as i continue to play nothing but gold + plat as a silver.
i think it's clear that i am not stuck in silver because i play at a silver level. i really wish to get some clarification from blizzard
Right click, add to friendslist, open instant messager, right click, view profile.
if those platinum players are around 1100 rating (which should equal something between rank 60-80), it perfectly matches my theory of overlapping leagues. ;-)
I'm in silver at the moment, number first with 300 points difference from second place, play mostly with platinum and gold players and still in silver... kinda sucks voley.devou on eu server
I was #1 in my platinum league then i got bumped into a different platinum league and now I'm #1 there. Not really sure how this happened. I'm guessing blizzard doesn't view all platinum leagues as even.
Let's take a look at the newest platinum division which just opened today. Division 19:
So just 9 players, and like the pattern i've been noticing there's players with around 100 games and others with around ten games.
Let's see who these players have been playing recently, I'll start with the leader and go down to the 9th ranked player, and goes from most recent game to older. stats are as of march 11 4pm est :
#1, Shikeye: win vs azurewrathe, rank 11 silver with 9-6 rec. 1048 elo. played 2 hours ago. win vs arash, rank 50 platinum with 88-66 rec. 1249 elo
#2, Lator: loss vs kron, rank 4 gold with 276-253 rec. 1604 elo. played 9 hours ago. win vs James, rank 14 gold with 22-14 rec. 1263 elo loss vs doomboom, rank 9 platinum with 259-214 rec. 1669 elo win vs probe, rank 1 silver with 222-198 rec. 1734 elo
#3, Xav: win vs doommaster, rank 29 gold with 11-8 rec, 998 elo. played 2 hours ago. loss vs ghosty, rank 5 gold with 56-47 rec, 1431 elo. loss vs byronichero, rank 3 gold with 107-81 rec, 1639 elo. loss vs practice, rank 27 platinum with 149-116 rec, 1476 elo. loss vs moraelin, rank 9 platinum with 53-40 rec, 1505 elo.
#4, faww: error reading profile...
#5, Joklem: loss vs duowan, rank 4 platinum with 88-56 rec, 1598 elo. played 10 hours ago loss vs kron, rank 4 gold with 276-253 rec, 1604 elo. loss vs ryans, rank 1 gold with 239-204 rec, 1779 elo. loss vs indy, rank 22 platinum with 266-219 rec, 1523 elo. win vs fpx, rank 28 platinum with 209-184 rec, 1423 elo.
#6, Darkbludger: win vs meng, rank 1 gold with 135-104 rec, 1685 elo. played 9 hours ago. win vs ncx, rank 3 gold with 109-81 rec, 1518 elo. win vs violence, rank 19 platinum with 149-134 rec, 1434 elo. loss vs dontinquire, rank 45 platinum with 181-158 rec, 1335 elo. win vs vitapur, rank 4 gold with 64-48 rec, 1567 elo.
#7, Remedy: win vs taintedh, rank 12 gold with 35-27 rec, 1245 elo. played 14 hours ago loss vs ngaxiaot, rank 5 gold with 270-242 rec, 1560 elo. win vs shockwave, rank 1 bronze with 132-109 rec, 1825 elo. win vs pizzatime, rank 13 silver with 48-39 rec, 1433 elo. win vs extalliones, rank 22 bronze with 32-33 rec, 1292 elo.
#8, Butter: loss vs iceberg, rank 26 gold with 20-15 rec, 985 elo. played 9 hours ago win vs danexx, rank 1 gold with 293-268 rec, 1663 elo. win vs drdx, rank 2 bronze with 38-32 rec, 1556 elo. win vs richardn, rank 4 silver with 180-178 rec, 1480 elo. win vs coconutdonut, rank 17 copper with 22-22 rec, 1463 elo.
#9, greymann: loss vs rudin, rank 22 gold with 57-47 rec, 1445 elo. played 1 hour ago
On March 12 2010 06:06 Dionyseus wrote: Let's take a look at the newest platinum division which just opened today. Division 19:
So just 9 players, and like the pattern i've been noticing there's players with around 100 games and others with around ten games.
Let's see who these players have been playing recently, I'll start with the leader and go down to the 9th ranked player, and goes from most recent game to older. stats are as of march 11 4pm est :
#1, Shikeye: win vs azurewrathe, rank 11 silver with 9-6 rec. 1048 elo. played 2 hours ago. win vs arash, rank 50 platinum with 88-66 rec. 1249 elo
#2, Lator: loss vs kron, rank 4 gold with 276-253 rec. 1604 elo. played 9 hours ago. win vs James, rank 14 gold with 22-14 rec. 1263 elo loss vs doomboom, rank 9 platinum with 259-214 rec. 1669 elo win vs probe, rank 1 silver with 222-198 rec. 1734 elo
#3, Xav: win vs doommaster, rank 29 gold with 11-8 rec, 998 elo. played 2 hours ago. loss vs ghosty, rank 5 gold with 56-47 rec, 1431 elo. loss vs byronichero, rank 3 gold with 107-81 rec, 1639 elo. loss vs practice, rank 27 platinum with 149-116 rec, 1476 elo. loss vs moraelin, rank 9 platinum with 53-40 rec, 1505 elo.
#4, faww: error reading profile...
#5, Joklem: loss vs duowan, rank 4 platinum with 88-56 rec, 1598 elo. played 10 hours ago loss vs kron, rank 4 gold with 276-253 rec, 1604 elo. loss vs ryans, rank 1 gold with 239-204 rec, 1779 elo. loss vs indy, rank 22 platinum with 266-219 rec, 1523 elo. win vs fpx, rank 28 platinum with 209-184 rec, 1423 elo.
#6, Darkbludger: win vs meng, rank 1 gold with 135-104 rec, 1685 elo. played 9 hours ago. win vs ncx, rank 3 gold with 109-81 rec, 1518 elo. win vs violence, rank 19 platinum with 149-134 rec, 1434 elo. loss vs dontinquire, rank 45 platinum with 181-158 rec, 1335 elo. win vs vitapur, rank 4 gold with 64-48 rec, 1567 elo.
#7, Remedy: win vs taintedh, rank 12 gold with 35-27 rec, 1245 elo. played 14 hours ago loss vs ngaxiaot, rank 5 gold with 270-242 rec, 1560 elo. win vs shockwave, rank 1 bronze with 132-109 rec, 1825 elo. win vs pizzatime, rank 13 silver with 48-39 rec, 1433 elo. win vs extalliones, rank 22 bronze with 32-33 rec, 1292 elo.
#8, Butter: loss vs iceberg, rank 26 gold with 20-15 rec, 985 elo. played 9 hours ago win vs danexx, rank 1 gold with 293-268 rec, 1663 elo. win vs drdx, rank 2 bronze with 38-32 rec, 1556 elo. win vs richardn, rank 4 silver with 180-178 rec, 1480 elo. win vs coconutdonut, rank 17 copper with 22-22 rec, 1463 elo.
#9, greymann: loss vs rudin, rank 22 gold with 57-47 rec, 1445 elo. played 1 hour ago
i feel like this is not progressing. everything seems too random lol
I have moved up from silver to gold after a patch came out so i think they may move ppl into different leagues then and also i have been promoted from 1 stripe copper 2v2 into 2 stripe copper 2v2 after winning a game where the opponents were favoured
I was playing mainly vs plats, but I didn't get promoted, so I did a test and left around 80 games in a row in order to become last in my league. I was matched against hilariously bad players, which were "favored" over me(btw, 11 points appears to be the maximum bonus from the opponent being favored that you can receive, 46 total max with the normal win pooints + the rested points), so I was effectively a low ranked copper player, but I remained in the gold division, while other low ranked people around me continued changing leagues. My league went from 90+ players a few days ago to less than 70 players and only 2 of the top 8 were gone, so the vast majority of the players that got placed in another legue were the ones at the bottom, but I didn't change leagues, despite being considered to be the worst player ever by the matchmaking system.
On March 12 2010 08:49 lololol wrote: I was playing mainly vs plats, but I didn't get promoted, so I did a test and left around 80 games in a row in order to become last in my league. I was matched against hilariously bad players, which were "favored" over me(btw, 11 points appears to be the maximum bonus from the opponent being favored that you can receive, 46 total max with the normal win pooints + the rested points), so I was effectively a low ranked copper player, but I remained in the gold division, while other low ranked people around me continued changing leagues. My league went from 90+ players a few days ago to less than 70 players and only 2 of the top 8 were gone, so the vast majority of the players that got placed in another legue were the ones at the bottom, but I didn't change leagues, despite being considered to be the worst player ever by the matchmaking system.
That my friends is taking one for the team. I think that pretty much proves it's completely random and meaningless. Honestly, if you're playing platinum players as a high ranked gold, it really shouldn't matter that you're in gold anyways. People might whine about not being noticed for being a good player or something I guess, but it's BETA and honestly nobody really should give a damn about rank, it's about learning the game to improve the game for release....
On March 12 2010 08:49 lololol wrote: I was playing mainly vs plats, but I didn't get promoted, so I did a test and left around 80 games in a row in order to become last in my league. I was matched against hilariously bad players, which were "favored" over me(btw, 11 points appears to be the maximum bonus from the opponent being favored that you can receive, 46 total max with the normal win pooints + the rested points), so I was effectively a low ranked copper player, but I remained in the gold division, while other low ranked people around me continued changing leagues. My league went from 90+ players a few days ago to less than 70 players and only 2 of the top 8 were gone, so the vast majority of the players that got placed in another legue were the ones at the bottom, but I didn't change leagues, despite being considered to be the worst player ever by the matchmaking system.
That my friends is taking one for the team. I think that pretty much proves it's completely random and meaningless. Honestly, if you're playing platinum players as a high ranked gold, it really shouldn't matter that you're in gold anyways. People might whine about not being noticed for being a good player or something I guess, but it's BETA and honestly nobody really should give a damn about rank, it's about learning the game to improve the game for release....
Or the system is waiting for enough players to create a new division. It's the only thing I can think of...
On March 12 2010 08:49 lololol wrote: I was playing mainly vs plats, but I didn't get promoted, so I did a test and left around 80 games in a row in order to become last in my league. I was matched against hilariously bad players, which were "favored" over me(btw, 11 points appears to be the maximum bonus from the opponent being favored that you can receive, 46 total max with the normal win pooints + the rested points), so I was effectively a low ranked copper player, but I remained in the gold division, while other low ranked people around me continued changing leagues. My league went from 90+ players a few days ago to less than 70 players and only 2 of the top 8 were gone, so the vast majority of the players that got placed in another legue were the ones at the bottom, but I didn't change leagues, despite being considered to be the worst player ever by the matchmaking system.
That my friends is taking one for the team. I think that pretty much proves it's completely random and meaningless. Honestly, if you're playing platinum players as a high ranked gold, it really shouldn't matter that you're in gold anyways. People might whine about not being noticed for being a good player or something I guess, but it's BETA and honestly nobody really should give a damn about rank, it's about learning the game to improve the game for release....
Or the system is waiting for enough players to create a new division. It's the only thing I can think of...
he said he saw a bunch of other people getting promoted (or demoted?) or whatever so i dont think thats the case.
well I advanced from gold to platinum after a loss, so I'm guessing it has to do with unspent ressources, APM and stuff like that, I'm really not sure, isn't that explained anywhere on battle.net FAQs?
I have been promoted from bronze to gold to platinum. I think it has to do with your consistency over time against players in the upper leagues. So lets say currently you are doing really well vs platinum players, lets say a 10 game win streak and you think you should be promoted. But how quickly you forget that you lost ~15 prior to that. While you might quickly forget those 'stupid' losses the system doesnt. It waits for you to show that you are performing at a given level on a consistent basis.
I think Blizzard manualy promote top 8 people from time to time. So you should add "WHEN" did you promoted? If times or date is mostly same then we have pattern
I am in div 1 ...place no 1. from beggining of ladder and never was promoted....;( I have 260-240. I have longest win streak 15.
Well I ended up getting promoted to Platinum division 14 instead of 19 in spite of coming from Shikhye's division. Not helping us develop a theory! Name is chubby.obslin
On March 12 2010 12:50 theqat wrote: Well I ended up getting promoted to Platinum division 14 instead of 19 in spite of coming from Shikhye's division. Not helping us develop a theory! Name is chubby.obslin
On March 11 2010 19:11 Disarray wrote: heres some more info to boggle your mind. Tonight i played this guy Maverick, and I won got 10pts. the VERY next game I played him again, won again, and got 12 points.
figure that one out lol
oooh i know! bnet sucks. seriously though what the hell
10 points is when you're favored, and 12 points is when you're even. My guess is that Maverick does good at the map for the second game, so the system figured he's got about a 50/50 chance against you on that map.
Let's take a look at the newest platinum division which just opened today. Division 19:
So just 9 players, and like the pattern i've been noticing there's players with around 100 games and others with around ten games.
Let's see who these players have been playing recently, I'll start with the leader and go down to the 9th ranked player, and goes from most recent game to older. stats are as of march 11 4pm est :
#1, Shikeye: win vs azurewrathe, rank 11 silver with 9-6 rec. 1048 elo. played 2 hours ago. win vs arash, rank 50 platinum with 88-66 rec. 1249 elo
#2, Lator: loss vs kron, rank 4 gold with 276-253 rec. 1604 elo. played 9 hours ago. win vs James, rank 14 gold with 22-14 rec. 1263 elo loss vs doomboom, rank 9 platinum with 259-214 rec. 1669 elo win vs probe, rank 1 silver with 222-198 rec. 1734 elo
#3, Xav: win vs doommaster, rank 29 gold with 11-8 rec, 998 elo. played 2 hours ago. loss vs ghosty, rank 5 gold with 56-47 rec, 1431 elo. loss vs byronichero, rank 3 gold with 107-81 rec, 1639 elo. loss vs practice, rank 27 platinum with 149-116 rec, 1476 elo. loss vs moraelin, rank 9 platinum with 53-40 rec, 1505 elo.
#4, faww: error reading profile...
#5, Joklem: loss vs duowan, rank 4 platinum with 88-56 rec, 1598 elo. played 10 hours ago loss vs kron, rank 4 gold with 276-253 rec, 1604 elo. loss vs ryans, rank 1 gold with 239-204 rec, 1779 elo. loss vs indy, rank 22 platinum with 266-219 rec, 1523 elo. win vs fpx, rank 28 platinum with 209-184 rec, 1423 elo.
#6, Darkbludger: win vs meng, rank 1 gold with 135-104 rec, 1685 elo. played 9 hours ago. win vs ncx, rank 3 gold with 109-81 rec, 1518 elo. win vs violence, rank 19 platinum with 149-134 rec, 1434 elo. loss vs dontinquire, rank 45 platinum with 181-158 rec, 1335 elo. win vs vitapur, rank 4 gold with 64-48 rec, 1567 elo.
#7, Remedy: win vs taintedh, rank 12 gold with 35-27 rec, 1245 elo. played 14 hours ago loss vs ngaxiaot, rank 5 gold with 270-242 rec, 1560 elo. win vs shockwave, rank 1 bronze with 132-109 rec, 1825 elo. win vs pizzatime, rank 13 silver with 48-39 rec, 1433 elo. win vs extalliones, rank 22 bronze with 32-33 rec, 1292 elo.
#8, Butter: loss vs iceberg, rank 26 gold with 20-15 rec, 985 elo. played 9 hours ago win vs danexx, rank 1 gold with 293-268 rec, 1663 elo. win vs drdx, rank 2 bronze with 38-32 rec, 1556 elo. win vs richardn, rank 4 silver with 180-178 rec, 1480 elo. win vs coconutdonut, rank 17 copper with 22-22 rec, 1463 elo.
#9, greymann: loss vs rudin, rank 22 gold with 57-47 rec, 1445 elo. played 1 hour ago
haha, joklem is me dono why im in platinum though, I have a terrible record
On March 12 2010 10:48 vradovic wrote: I think Blizzard manualy promote top 8 people from time to time. So you should add "WHEN" did you promoted? If times or date is mostly same then we have pattern
I am in div 1 ...place no 1. from beggining of ladder and never was promoted....;( I have 260-240. I have longest win streak 15.
1600 pts
No... it's not the top 8. Well, at least, I got moved from #10 Silver to #13 Platinum or something.
On March 12 2010 10:48 vradovic wrote: I think Blizzard manualy promote top 8 people from time to time. So you should add "WHEN" did you promoted? If times or date is mostly same then we have pattern
I am in div 1 ...place no 1. from beggining of ladder and never was promoted....;( I have 260-240. I have longest win streak 15.
1600 pts
No... it's not the top 8. Well, at least, I got moved from #10 Silver to #13 Platinum or something.
I got moved after i'd been #1 gold for a few hours btw, those last 4 losses, all happened AFTER i got into platinum, so not sure how that factors in lol
Got from silver to gold (after being in top 8 for a few games) after a loss. In gold i was then immediately at spot 13 or sth. My points decreased from ~1400 to ~1280. My bonuspool increased from <50 to ~250.
After a 7-3 start i got into gold. Played my own division for the first 30 games or so, had a decent (70% or so) winrate and started meeting platinum players nonstop. I never lost whenever i got a match where i was favored. This was all in the first week, i took a 1.5 week break and right after winning my first game yesterday i got into platinum with the same rating i had in gold (1200ish).
Don't know how the system works but just thought i'd post my own experience. I was rank 20ish in my gold division so i don't think the top 8 thing holds merit, unless it's by ELO or hidden rating.
I'm having so much fun this second week in silver.. 14/15 games are vs plat and randomly vs a rank 1-3 gold guy when I'm on a lose-streak. My longest win-streak is 16, of which 13 players were platinum.
They should really improve the league-up system somehow. It is very un-motivating to stay and play in silver while playing only vs platinum players. I've been top #3 in silver for about 220 games or so now.
I'm having so much fun this second week in silver.. 14/15 games are vs plat and randomly vs a rank 1-3 gold guy when I'm on a lose-streak. My longest win-streak is 16, of which 13 players were platinum.
They should really improve the league-up system somehow. It is very un-motivating to stay and play in silver while playing only vs platinum players. I've been top #3 in silver for about 220 games or so now.
Wow and I thought elo was high in my Gold division. I guess divisions everywhere are starting to get insanely high ELOs? btw my case in the gold division is the same as yours top 3 for almost 200 games. If this ELO thing keeps up, I have a feeling all the leagues are going to be around the same skill level, which is probably not what blizzard wants. I think the easier thing to do is have static ELO (do not decrease ELO from Silver to Gold etc, and instead just make ELO requirements for each league, that way you dont have people from silver league that is better than half of the people in platinum, since by definition anyone in silver will have lower ELO than Gold or Platinum. As it is right now difference in silver and platinum is 500 ELO points so since you have 2000+ ELO in silver, thast equal to 1500+ plat which means blizzard considers you better than like half of the platinum players)
my roommate played some games on my account, but after playing our placement matches, we had a combined total of 10-16, and were put into silver league.
I played until about 20-25 record, and it through me into platinum.
some of my friends and co-workers had played hundreds of games and were in 1st place in their divisions and were not moved up to platinum for quite some time.
I'm currently ranked 6th in some Bronze League...All my opponents are >20th Silver players...Many of which I'm beating with ease. Dunno why I'm not in a higher league...
On March 13 2010 05:31 FREEloss_ca wrote: I'm currently ranked 6th in some Bronze League...All my opponents are >20th Silver players...Many of which I'm beating with ease. Dunno why I'm not in a higher league...
One of my accounts is in a Gold league, and so far I've beaten three different #1 Gold players and at least half a dozen top 8 Platinum players. Not quite sure why I'm in Gold considering the lower players in Platinum leagues (25+) seem to be pretty bad.
Likewise, I've played a few Silver players that were pretty amazing. Like, top 8 Platinum material easy.
I think this randomness may come from the different starting dates of the players. Maybe two weeks ago the lower platinum players deserverd their rank, but with many new keys this may have shifted.
Placement matches are also very unpredictable. I, for instance, never took a look at sc2 before getting my key and went 6:4 -> silver. But after some time, a more solid BO, knowing the hotkeys and a little bit of feeling for the game my record is (way) better and i feel my "playing strenth" has increased at least by 500% :-) Another one could have played vs AI or Custom games and read about some BOs in the Forums could easily be ranked platinum, without a great chance of improving (if his mechanics are bad)
+Sorry if someone posted this before, but is it possible to be downranked, respectively has someone been downranked so far?
On March 13 2010 06:37 grigorin wrote: I think this randomness may come from the different starting dates of the players. Maybe two weeks ago the lower platinum players deserverd their rank, but with many new keys this may have shifted.
Placement matches are also very unpredictable. I, for instance, never took a look at sc2 before getting my key and went 6:4 -> silver. But after some time, a more solid BO, knowing the hotkeys and a little bit of feeling for the game my record is (way) better and i feel my "playing strenth" has increased at least by 500% :-) Another one could have played vs AI or Custom games and read about some BOs in the Forums could easily be ranked platinum, without a great chance of improving (if his mechanics are bad)
+Sorry if someone posted this before, but is it possible to be downranked, respectively has someone been downranked so far?
I THINK a Platinum player was just downranked into my gold division. I say "think" because he was placed in the #2 spot, and I can't imagine a Silver player being upgraded to #2 just like that.
Also, date definitely has something to do with ranks, although it seems to be broken at the moment. I've been in my league for just under a week, but it says my join date was today (and tomorrow it will say tomorrow). It probably involves mostly how long you've been in a league/position compared to your win ratio, and/or how quickly you climb ranks.
I have played like 25 games in the silver league and I have a W/L ratio around 1.0. Today I played 2 matches. The first one I lost but the second one I won. But after winning that second match I got demoted to the bronze league! I didn't only get demoted! I also lost 300(!) points! Now i'm last in this lame bronze division...
I can't see why i'm getting demoted to the bronze league when i haven't played that many games. Winning 50% of all my matches isn't that bad either. And I can't understand why this happens after winning a match. I'm not that sad that I got demoted but I am sad about loosing 300 points! now I have like 850 points... T_T
Does anyone know why I got demoted and lost all of those points?
The system is seriously fucked up. i just went from silver #29 to gold #27. What the hell are those top 8 places for then? I like how this system is not rewarding massgaming as much as iCCup (at least this is what it should have been i guess), but at least it should be consistent. There were player with well over 300 games and 1800 points in my silver division and they are still hanging out there while i am in gold.
On March 13 2010 06:44 Sere wrote:I THINK a Platinum player was just downranked into my gold division. I say "think" because he was placed in the #2 spot, and I can't imagine a Silver player being upgraded to #2 just like that.
I doubt the rank has anything to do here, the player that got moved from a league to another will take the appropriate rank with the rating the player has.
As for my own experience, after a placement in a gold division, and getting a very bad record from my friend playing on my account I was moved to silver after 30 games. Been playing a lot during the weekend and playing almost exclusively gold/plat players and was reigning at the top my silver division with a good ~250pts above #2 (that was 1800-1850 total).
Then, yesterday, I got moved to the new plat division that was being created (division 20) where the top player had a lot of games played (so obviously he was being moved up as well) with approximately 1180pts.
As for me, I had 1003pts and a bonus pool of 464, which I haven't depleted yet.
I am monitoring the growth of my division, as well as the way my bonus pool "evolves".
On March 16 2010 03:54 PerQ wrote:I can't see why i'm getting demoted to the bronze league when i haven't played that many games.
There is always a re-evaluation of your ranking at the 30 games mark. Afterwards, I could not figure out any clear mechanics.
On March 16 2010 03:54 PerQ wrote:Winning 50% of all my matches isn't that bad either. And I can't understand why this happens after winning a match. I'm not that sad that I got demoted but I am sad about loosing 300 points! now I have like 850 points... T_T
Does anyone know why I got demoted and lost all of those points?
1- Winning 50% of your games mean nothing in itself, a player that wins 50% of the time against players with 2000pts in platinum divisions is much better than a guy that wins 50% of the time against players in bronze league... It all depends on who were your opponents.
2- I have been demoted after winning 3 games in a row, and been promoted after losing 2. The result of your very last few games is irrelevant to "reranking"
3- If you lost all those pts, I would bet that you have a fairly large bonus pool at your disposal, something like 450+ pts, correct?
I just moved into the #1 spot in my copper division, I think it incorrectly ranked me, 2 of my losses in my placement matches were due to connection issues.
I'm going to wait a couple days to see if it moves me at all and then keep playing more matches if it doesn't, I'm at around 1400 points right now.
Currently moved from Silver number #5 to Gold # 9.. I was using Protoss in 40 games after wards used terran for 10 games.. there were some custom battles with my friends and some other people..
I don't really know how the system works, but I was around 31-23 before I moved up to Gold... Could it be possible that the systems checks your custom games as well? Or the fact that I slug out alot with Gold Players that's why I moved up a rank?
It seems like I don't get promoted until they make new divisions. I guess it makes sense that unless somebody gets relegated to a lower league, there is no room for you in a higher league. It seems every time I get promoted I'm in a higher number of division, with all other players marked with a !.
The one thing I've noticed before promotion is that you start to fight stronger and stronger opponents. First I've played highest ranks from my league, than the league above and after I went 4-1 against higher league opponents, I've got promoted (right after that loss). Apart from that I have no idea how to know if you are going to be promoted or not. I went on a streak 7-0 and the day after that 6-2 and even though I went from r50 to r6, I didn't get promotion so I'm still stuck where I am.
I went 5-0 in my placement matches and landed as #9 in platinum. It looked like a new division because the highest rating was something like 1500. I went about even in wins and losses in my next five games, and I got demoted down to gold, and then finally down to bottom silver. After about 20 ladder games between today and yesterday I'm sitting at #5 silver.
I believe there is a bug where you change the leagues and it keeps your actual place within a league. Like a poster above says moving from 27 silver to 29 gold. Similar thing happened to me - I moved from 40 gold to 40 silver. and in another game I went from 80 silver to 80 bronze. That's after one game. I didn't travel all the way through 80 ranks of bronze to get there.
Well, I went 4-1 in my placements. Got placed in Gold. Played some more went 20-12 and was ranked 1st in gold with 1400 ranking points. Won my next 3 games, lost 2 games in a row. Then won 1 more game and got placed in platinum. So right now my record is at 23-14. I am in a brand new platinum divison ranked 8th.
What I noticed, was the last 10 games were all vs Platinum players. Except for one which was vs another #1 ranked gold player who I also beat. I was getting 30+ points for every win. I played a few top ranked platinum players. So Im not exactly sure how it works, but I know that once u start seeing that u are getting placed vs higher ranked players, the system is testing you. If u beat the higher ranked players consistently, it will promote you. If you continue to lose vs the higher ranked players but u win vs ur same lvl or lower lvl players. The system will keep u in the same league bcuz it is where ur skill lvl is at.
On May 12 2010 17:34 zunova wrote: I just moved into the #1 spot in my copper division, I think it incorrectly ranked me, 2 of my losses in my placement matches were due to connection issues.
I'm going to wait a couple days to see if it moves me at all and then keep playing more matches if it doesn't, I'm at around 1400 points right now.
The system is not going to move you if you don't play.
On May 12 2010 18:59 Evoke wrote: I believe there is a bug where you change the leagues and it keeps your actual place within a league. Like a poster above says moving from 27 silver to 29 gold. Similar thing happened to me - I moved from 40 gold to 40 silver. and in another game I went from 80 silver to 80 bronze. That's after one game. I didn't travel all the way through 80 ranks of bronze to get there.
just to add to this, I just won a game which I started as 87 bronze and it reclassified me and put me straight to 87 copper. QQ
I think it's because leagues and rank within a league are independent. Your overall league maybe gold, copper, or platinum, but within the league everyone has points. So if you had 800 points and it decided to bump you in a league, it just takes your points and slots you in. But each league has its own set of 700-1700 points.. seems a bit random, would be nice to have a fresh start in a league, with say a 1000 points. painful.
I can't add much as far as specific numbers but here's what happened to me:
I was in bronze until I was around the 45W-40L range. I was always in the top 3 of my bronze division(#1 before I got promoted) I actually got promoted to Silver after a loss? When I was promoted to Silver I got put in a brand new division and everyone in it was added to that division on that day.
My theory is that the system starts pooling all of the top players together once they qualify to get bumped up and once there are 100 they create a new division. Also if someone get's demoted from a league I would assume the system immediately has to promote 1 person from the growing pool before the pool actually hits 100. This is just a rough guess and there are probably more variables but if this is the system it would make sense.
EDIT: As a side note I find it very annoying to be matched up against platinum members when I myself am only a Silver player right now, it seems to happen to be quite a bit. Even when I was only bronze I got matched up and destroyed by platinum members. But I typically play games like that in the very late hours of the night and once the game is public I'm hoping that will happen much less often.
This ELO system cannot last unless blizzard plans on reseting everyones rating once in a while. What will happen is that as players get into platinum people they will start at 1000 rating. As they win, with the bonus points they get, players will slowly gradually increase the average rating. So after a month i can imagine average players will have 1200 rating, after 2 months 1400 rating, etc. Already in my bronze i am in 50th because there are people with 2000 points. Eventually after a year, the top 3-4 in each division in plat will have over 3000-4000 points. So if someone new joins and gets plat and is better than the top players in the league, it will still take months to catch up. This means calulating the likelihood each player should win will be way off.
This is straight from the arena system in wow and it works because they reset the ratings all the time.
They will have ladder seasons/resets, and the problem is only that it "looks" like the newcomer is worse. If he plays good, he will be matched against better people. Seriously the ranks etc means nothing at all, what matters is blizzards hidden rating on you.
There is a hidden rating wich puts you in leagues not ranks/wins/points. Thats why a dude in silver is sometimes favored vs a gold league player. Silver player hidden rating is higher than the gold players rating. Your hidden rating increases when u beat higher (hidden) rating opponents also decreases when u lose to lesser players. From time to time (it was never specified ) the systyem checks if it should promote/demote you. Thats why you just won a game vs some1 and u get demoted. Your hidden rating sucked, the system started the promotion sweep and u got demoted...easy.
To give a bit of example of what Sadyque said, I'm pretty sure they made the matchmaking system similiar to WoW personal rating and they most likely promote/demote based on your personal rating (aka hidden rating) while we'll call your actual visible rating your "team rating".
I'm not sure if placement matches work same way, so rather then me guessing lets say you got placed in gold league. Lets say your personal rating is now 1500. You win 3 games against gold players for 20 Personal rating each your person rating is now 1560. Lets say you beat a platinum player in gold league, this will give you more personal rating, say 40, so your Personal rating is 1600 now.
I'm geussing they promote based on a combination of team rating and personal rating. If you go 50-50% your personal rating will remain steady and you will not get promoted very fast.
It's also important to note that your personal rating can be far ahead of your team rating and that when you win a game its based off your opponents personal rating. You might have noticed you got 20 points off someone and when you looked at their profile to see their ladder rank they weren't very high team rating wise, but they had a very good win/loss ratio aka a high personal rating to give you lots of points.
Its also important to note if you lose to a player ranked far below you and you have a high personal rating you might lose -16 points for the loss but lose more then 40 personal rating for it.
I really hope this whole league bullshit gets a total rework when beta goes offline May 31st.. thats the biggest disappointment with SC2 so far imo, bnet 2.0 is crap
I still just dont understand why blizzard didnt keep their original AMM system for warcraft 3. Your ladder rank was your actual matchmaking rank You played people within 6 "levels" of you, and above level 10 you started losing points (and levels) for losing games. An actual ladder to climb.
What do we have now? I just dont understand the point? has blizzard explained it? Why the system looks like it does? It makes so little sense to me. Why have a ranking system that doesnt show your actual rank?
The war3 ladder was a ladder to grind. The more games you played the more rating u had. In Sc2 no matter how many games u play u still wont advance in leagues unless u actually beat better players. edit: example:
liquid.TLO plays 50 games and wins 40-10. So lets say 40 winsX20 pts - 10losesX20pts =600pts So TLo is at 1600 points. Now comes Ihavenolifeandgrindgamesallday.pwnzor... pwnzor plays 350 games and wins 200-150. So he has 200X20pts - 150X20pts = 1000pts So pwnzor has a 2000 rating.
On May 20 2010 21:54 sadyque wrote: The war3 ladder was a ladder to grind. The more games you played the more rating u had. In Sc2 no matter how many games u play u still wont advance in leagues unless u actually beat better players.
Yeah, and i dont know about wc3's 6 lvl gap u said?? I frequently played 20+ lvl players when i was below 10... (i stopped for like 6 months (which reseted my rank) and restarted playing 2 times already).
On May 20 2010 21:54 sadyque wrote: The war3 ladder was a ladder to grind. The more games you played the more rating u had. In Sc2 no matter how many games u play u still wont advance in leagues unless u actually beat better players. edit: example:
liquid.TLO plays 50 games and wins 40-10. So lets say 40 winsX20 pts - 10losesX20pts =600pts So TLo is at 1600 points. Now comes Ihavenolifeandgrindgamesallday.pwnzor... pwnzor plays 350 games and wins 200-150. So he has 200X20pts - 150X20pts = 1000pts So pwnzor has a 2000 rating.
Now decide wich of them is the better player...
yea but the way it is now, higher ranked players have it rough.. Keep in mind in War3, it was a much more solid game in terms of consistency, you wouldnt lose to a lucky newb who 2gate proxy you at all, in War3 nothing would catch you by surprise, the better player will win almost all the time.
In SC2, proxy/7pool or 7rax reaper is a tad too strong right now, and hurts significantly more than in BW.. so its easy to drop maybe one out of every 5 times it happens, even if you are White-Ra or Sen or someone..
And how it is for me, and I was only 1950.. I am favored every game so I win like.. 5 pts total, but every loss since im favored I lose like -20 pts.. making climbing VERY hard.. I guess I hit my "hidden peak" too soon before I was high enough rank because when I was climbing even like 1700, I was beating the 2000+ guys.. so now even if I get matched vs someone like nEans Im usually tied or slightly favored.
Im all for the "hidden rank" thing, but the whole being slight favored or favored shit resulting in such a significant chunk of your bonus points is not good. It should be like, 10 pts even, 12 pts slightly favored, 14 pts favored.. EVERY time. Its lame to lose 20+ pts to a cheese or a disc (OMG thats another thing, discs raped my record/pts bad, esp combined with the favored bullshit)
On May 20 2010 21:54 sadyque wrote: The war3 ladder was a ladder to grind. The more games you played the more rating u had. In Sc2 no matter how many games u play u still wont advance in leagues unless u actually beat better players. edit: example:
liquid.TLO plays 50 games and wins 40-10. So lets say 40 winsX20 pts - 10losesX20pts =600pts So TLo is at 1600 points. Now comes Ihavenolifeandgrindgamesallday.pwnzor... pwnzor plays 350 games and wins 200-150. So he has 200X20pts - 150X20pts = 1000pts So pwnzor has a 2000 rating.
Now decide wich of them is the better player...
yea but the way it is now, higher ranked players have it rough.. Keep in mind in War3, it was a much more solid game in terms of consistency, you wouldnt lose to a lucky newb who 2gate proxy you at all, in War3 nothing would catch you by surprise, the better player will win almost all the time.
In SC2, proxy/7pool or 7rax reaper is a tad too strong right now, and hurts significantly more than in BW.. so its easy to drop maybe one out of every 5 times it happens, even if you are White-Ra or Sen or someone..
And how it is for me, and I was only 1950.. I am favored every game so I win like.. 5 pts total, but every loss since im favored I lose like -20 pts.. making climbing VERY hard.. I guess I hit my "hidden peak" too soon before I was high enough rank because when I was climbing even like 1700, I was beating the 2000+ guys.. so now even if I get matched vs someone like nEans Im usually tied or slightly favored.
Im all for the "hidden rank" thing, but the whole being slight favored or favored shit resulting in such a significant chunk of your bonus points is not good. It should be like, 10 pts even, 12 pts slightly favored, 14 pts favored.. EVERY time. Its lame to lose 20+ pts to a cheese or a disc (OMG thats another thing, discs raped my record/pts bad, esp combined with the favored bullshit)
We get it, you don't like Terran, it would be nice if you could save those complaints for racial balance discussions instead of complaining about it in every single post.
My biggest complaint about the ranking feature is the fact that you can be number one in your division and it still doesn't mean anything because many divisions have players with higher ELO, so you could be #1 Platinum div 65 and it doesn't matter because it might mean you only have 1100 ELO.
On May 20 2010 21:54 sadyque wrote: The war3 ladder was a ladder to grind. The more games you played the more rating u had. In Sc2 no matter how many games u play u still wont advance in leagues unless u actually beat better players. edit: example:
liquid.TLO plays 50 games and wins 40-10. So lets say 40 winsX20 pts - 10losesX20pts =600pts So TLo is at 1600 points. Now comes Ihavenolifeandgrindgamesallday.pwnzor... pwnzor plays 350 games and wins 200-150. So he has 200X20pts - 150X20pts = 1000pts So pwnzor has a 2000 rating.
Now decide wich of them is the better player...
yea but the way it is now, higher ranked players have it rough.. Keep in mind in War3, it was a much more solid game in terms of consistency, you wouldnt lose to a lucky newb who 2gate proxy you at all, in War3 nothing would catch you by surprise, the better player will win almost all the time.
In SC2, proxy/7pool or 7rax reaper is a tad too strong right now, and hurts significantly more than in BW.. so its easy to drop maybe one out of every 5 times it happens, even if you are White-Ra or Sen or someone..
And how it is for me, and I was only 1950.. I am favored every game so I win like.. 5 pts total, but every loss since im favored I lose like -20 pts.. making climbing VERY hard.. I guess I hit my "hidden peak" too soon before I was high enough rank because when I was climbing even like 1700, I was beating the 2000+ guys.. so now even if I get matched vs someone like nEans Im usually tied or slightly favored.
Im all for the "hidden rank" thing, but the whole being slight favored or favored shit resulting in such a significant chunk of your bonus points is not good. It should be like, 10 pts even, 12 pts slightly favored, 14 pts favored.. EVERY time. Its lame to lose 20+ pts to a cheese or a disc (OMG thats another thing, discs raped my record/pts bad, esp combined with the favored bullshit)
We get it, you don't like Terran, it would be nice if you could save those complaints for racial balance discussions instead of complaining about it in every single post.
My biggest complaint about the ranking feature is the fact that you can be number one in your division and it still doesn't mean anything because many divisions have players with higher ELO, so you could be #1 Platinum div 65 and it doesn't matter because it might mean you only have 1100 ELO.
... What the fuck are you talking about?? Where did I mention terran imbalance AT ALL in that thread? Other than mentioning 7 rax reaper, but ALSO MENTIONING 7POOL AND PROXY AS THE SAME EXACT THING.. You are fucking stupid, go kill yourself.
ALL RACES early game "cheese" rush are a tad too strong in this game. Thats clear. Doing a 2gate proxy can be significantly more devastating than it ever was in BW. It might be for the fact that units auto-target workers when theres units present now, which is the stupidest thing ever, or how workers are more fragile than in BW.
Well ye there are more no1 platinum players out there. But in normal conditions if you are no1 plat u play mostly 1-3 rank plats from your and other divisions. So you kind know how you fare against other similar ranked opponents. Also...mostly just guessing here....there is the tournament. I figure there is gonna be a tournament at the end of each season(?) that will match players from top spots in each division. So from time to time you will know who is the best on server.
On May 20 2010 21:54 sadyque wrote: The war3 ladder was a ladder to grind. The more games you played the more rating u had. In Sc2 no matter how many games u play u still wont advance in leagues unless u actually beat better players.
Yeah, and i dont know about wc3's 6 lvl gap u said?? I frequently played 20+ lvl players when i was below 10... (i stopped for like 6 months (which reseted my rank) and restarted playing 2 times already).
I clearly said, the original wc3 ladder, as opposed to the one they have now. Come on...
I started after the reset and I think went 4-1. Was placed in Gold. That's fine, I thought I belonged there. Fairly rapidly I was top10. I was sitting at #2 for quite a long while. Never got a promotion. The #1 guy in my ladder was over 100 points from me and I was ~40 points ahead of #3. Still no promotion. Now my ladder seems to have gotten more competative and I flux between #4 and #10. Those spots aren't that different. However, the #1 guy (same guy, also no promotion) is about 200 points ahead of the entire division. BNet2.0 seems really reluctant to promote players.
I can also say it seems top Gold players are better than middle platinum. Again, I'm sure they got platinum off placement and just kind of hung around the middle of the pack where gold also got placed there but had to work up to the top. I always have tougher games against top5 gold than I do 20th ranked platinum.
On May 20 2010 22:26 Kyo Yuy wrote: My biggest complaint about the ranking feature is the fact that you can be number one in your division and it still doesn't mean anything because many divisions have players with higher ELO, so you could be #1 Platinum div 65 and it doesn't matter because it might mean you only have 1100 ELO.
The problem with that is each division's rating is compared to by people IN THE SAME DIVISION. That means you are number one rating against those in your division because your the best in your division, but when you look at a something like Plat Division 1, the people in division 1 who stay are there the longest have the highest rating. Blizzard ruined the ladder because the numbers from 1 division (visible rating) don't match another division in the same league.
My view: I'm in a silver division 256 (I'm bad and I'm proud to admit it!) When I joined, the division had 30 people, I was 10th, and a vast majority of people had a rating of 1000 (so I confirmed it was new,) 24 hours later my division was approaching 90+ players (meaning it had become full.) I took a week off to play other games (since beta doesn't matter, and I'm not grinding games until launch, ruins the fun if I'm already playing it all the time) and I return to be top 10 in a division (still 256) with only 50 people. I log off 1 night 7th and wake up 2nd because 5 people had graduated to gold. Blizzard hasn't refilled my division so I'm stuck staring at people with a rating of 1200-1300 and only like 5% <= 1000 rating. If my division isn't going to be refilled, the only difference between divisions is the age of the division. So I'd suspect if someone is still in a division # < 100, that the players in their division is fewer now than when it started, and that division X-20 (X being the last created division) will be peaked towards full of new people in their league. Once you hit #1 on platinum, the only thing you can do is probably keep winning until your rating matches the hidden AMM number (I'm using AMM since I don't remember what its called.) Which when achieved would make a comparison between the other divisions. Blizzard isn't renewing old divisions with new players, which makes me suspect that you won't ever see the old division #'s until a new season (assuming they will still exist like older Battle.net titles) in which all the Platinum players will have their visible rating reset (hopefully to the invisible number) and reshuffled into new divisions.
PS: My ladder says out of the 50 people, only ONE person has joined in the last week (which is what the arrow/ ! signifies, if you highlight the ! it tells you when they joined your division.) This game does NOT USE ELO. Rating != ELO in SC2... if that were the case, your rating wouldn't need to be reset during a promotion, and you would begin to see ELO range cut-offs moving up and down. New divisions forming would all have a unique range when its created (say Silver would be 1250-1400 at the start, gold would be like 1600+ to be examined for gold and bronze would be like 1000 before looking at a demotion examination.) As new players join SC2, the cut-offs would begin to fluctuate higher to keep a constant % of players in each division, or else Battle.net 2.0 fails because everyone will eventually reach Platinum even if they are copper.
You dont beat better players than your current league. This is the reason you guys are not getting promoted. Im a platinum player (crappy player at 30ish plat...). When i started playing before the 1st reset i played on a friends account. He sucked...he was like 80th in the copper league with 30 wins 80 losses. It took me a long time to get to silver. By the time i got to silver i had like 80 wins 100 losses. This pretty much (i think) got me to a normal starter player hidden rating. From silver i had to win like 20-30 games and got promoted to plat. Its all about the hidden rating. Your are always given oportunities to play "slightly favored" opponents. If you beat those 70%(~) of the time you will get promoted eventually. But at the same time if you win vs those guys and lose vs lesser players your rating stays the same. If you beat only players of your level then its kinda obvious the sistem did its job perfectly and you are exactly were you are supposed to be.
On May 20 2010 21:54 sadyque wrote: The war3 ladder was a ladder to grind. The more games you played the more rating u had. In Sc2 no matter how many games u play u still wont advance in leagues unless u actually beat better players. edit: example:
liquid.TLO plays 50 games and wins 40-10. So lets say 40 winsX20 pts - 10losesX20pts =600pts So TLo is at 1600 points. Now comes Ihavenolifeandgrindgamesallday.pwnzor... pwnzor plays 350 games and wins 200-150. So he has 200X20pts - 150X20pts = 1000pts So pwnzor has a 2000 rating.
Now decide wich of them is the better player...
yea but the way it is now, higher ranked players have it rough.. Keep in mind in War3, it was a much more solid game in terms of consistency, you wouldnt lose to a lucky newb who 2gate proxy you at all, in War3 nothing would catch you by surprise, the better player will win almost all the time.
In SC2, proxy/7pool or 7rax reaper is a tad too strong right now, and hurts significantly more than in BW.. so its easy to drop maybe one out of every 5 times it happens, even if you are White-Ra or Sen or someone..
And how it is for me, and I was only 1950.. I am favored every game so I win like.. 5 pts total, but every loss since im favored I lose like -20 pts.. making climbing VERY hard.. I guess I hit my "hidden peak" too soon before I was high enough rank because when I was climbing even like 1700, I was beating the 2000+ guys.. so now even if I get matched vs someone like nEans Im usually tied or slightly favored.
Im all for the "hidden rank" thing, but the whole being slight favored or favored shit resulting in such a significant chunk of your bonus points is not good. It should be like, 10 pts even, 12 pts slightly favored, 14 pts favored.. EVERY time. Its lame to lose 20+ pts to a cheese or a disc (OMG thats another thing, discs raped my record/pts bad, esp combined with the favored bullshit)
We get it, you don't like Terran, it would be nice if you could save those complaints for racial balance discussions instead of complaining about it in every single post.
My biggest complaint about the ranking feature is the fact that you can be number one in your division and it still doesn't mean anything because many divisions have players with higher ELO, so you could be #1 Platinum div 65 and it doesn't matter because it might mean you only have 1100 ELO.
... What the fuck are you talking about?? Where did I mention terran imbalance AT ALL in that thread? Other than mentioning 7 rax reaper, but ALSO MENTIONING 7POOL AND PROXY AS THE SAME EXACT THING.. You are fucking stupid, go kill yourself.
ALL RACES early game "cheese" rush are a tad too strong in this game. Thats clear. Doing a 2gate proxy can be significantly more devastating than it ever was in BW. It might be for the fact that units auto-target workers when theres units present now, which is the stupidest thing ever, or how workers are more fragile than in BW.
Troll successful?
I find the matchmaking system a little weird. I have ALWAYS been against opponents whom are favored/slightly favored/even
On May 20 2010 21:54 sadyque wrote: The war3 ladder was a ladder to grind. The more games you played the more rating u had. In Sc2 no matter how many games u play u still wont advance in leagues unless u actually beat better players. edit: example:
liquid.TLO plays 50 games and wins 40-10. So lets say 40 winsX20 pts - 10losesX20pts =600pts So TLo is at 1600 points. Now comes Ihavenolifeandgrindgamesallday.pwnzor... pwnzor plays 350 games and wins 200-150. So he has 200X20pts - 150X20pts = 1000pts So pwnzor has a 2000 rating.
Now decide wich of them is the better player...
yea but the way it is now, higher ranked players have it rough.. Keep in mind in War3, it was a much more solid game in terms of consistency, you wouldnt lose to a lucky newb who 2gate proxy you at all, in War3 nothing would catch you by surprise, the better player will win almost all the time.
In SC2, proxy/7pool or 7rax reaper is a tad too strong right now, and hurts significantly more than in BW.. so its easy to drop maybe one out of every 5 times it happens, even if you are White-Ra or Sen or someone..
And how it is for me, and I was only 1950.. I am favored every game so I win like.. 5 pts total, but every loss since im favored I lose like -20 pts.. making climbing VERY hard.. I guess I hit my "hidden peak" too soon before I was high enough rank because when I was climbing even like 1700, I was beating the 2000+ guys.. so now even if I get matched vs someone like nEans Im usually tied or slightly favored.
Im all for the "hidden rank" thing, but the whole being slight favored or favored shit resulting in such a significant chunk of your bonus points is not good. It should be like, 10 pts even, 12 pts slightly favored, 14 pts favored.. EVERY time. Its lame to lose 20+ pts to a cheese or a disc (OMG thats another thing, discs raped my record/pts bad, esp combined with the favored bullshit)
We get it, you don't like Terran, it would be nice if you could save those complaints for racial balance discussions instead of complaining about it in every single post.
My biggest complaint about the ranking feature is the fact that you can be number one in your division and it still doesn't mean anything because many divisions have players with higher ELO, so you could be #1 Platinum div 65 and it doesn't matter because it might mean you only have 1100 ELO.
... What the fuck are you talking about?? Where did I mention terran imbalance AT ALL in that thread? Other than mentioning 7 rax reaper, but ALSO MENTIONING 7POOL AND PROXY AS THE SAME EXACT THING.. You are fucking stupid, go kill yourself.
ALL RACES early game "cheese" rush are a tad too strong in this game. Thats clear. Doing a 2gate proxy can be significantly more devastating than it ever was in BW. It might be for the fact that units auto-target workers when theres units present now, which is the stupidest thing ever, or how workers are more fragile than in BW.
Troll successful?
I find the matchmaking system a little weird. I have ALWAYS been against opponents whom are favored/slightly favored/even
Yea guess that newb did troll me hard =/
But yea. it is very odd, from when I started my acct this past reset, I was never favored up until I got around 1800.. then after that, I have been favored EVERY game pretty much. It doesnt make sense =[
Ironically, I switched to zerg after I got 1800 since they said reset was coming, and I wanted to mess around.. so for the first few days I was really starting to think the whole "favored" thing had some connection to what race I played; Protoss never being favored, and zerg being favored every game.. but that wouldnt make sense, since I had 40 protoss wins and 0 zerg wins at the time. It was just odd, like as soon as I hit 1800 it flipped a switch..
meh, i just find it to be complete bullshit that i used to go about 50/50 in the gold league, then the ladder reset and i fucked up my placement matches, and now im only winning like 1/3 of the time in the bronze league... a few of the guys i beat recently asked if i was in the plat division... i play guys who sit on 1 base 15 mintues into the game and have never played an rts before, and then i play guys who have a well executed strategy and an apm of like 160... i dont really care what 'rank' or 'division' or whatever i have, i just want to play agaisnt people who are at roughly the same skill level as me.
I believe that if you don't immediately advance out of a league with like 10-0 after placement, it becomes harder to do so the longer you stay in the league.
When I botched a placement match, I was put into gold but was quickly promoted to plat after winning a handful thereafter.
In contrast, a friend of mine who regularly DC'd for some time in the past recently went like 20-0 in the top #1 ranking of his league and has yet to advance.
I would point out that, in reality, the displayed rating in your division will have a fairly strong correlation with your chances for promotion, with the only factor that makes it not a perfect correlation being the bonus pool.
Consider a player with no bonus pool points and a matchmaking rating equivalent to 50/50 wins against Platinum players. If he is in Gold, his displayed rating will gain ~10-20 points per win vs a Plat player, while it will lose only 4-7 or so. As this continues, assuming the MMR is accurate, the player's displayed rating will increase.
Promotion occurs when the system determines that you are winning against players better than your current division a sufficient amount. If you are winning against players better than your current division by a certain amount, your rating will be increasing at a given rate - so most promotions will occur at roughly the same displayed rating.
The only wrench in this is the bonus pool, which could theoretically allow someone in Copper to get a displayed rating of like 3000 without ever achieving more than 50/50 vs Bronze players - but for the most part, your displayed rating is a vaguely good indicator of if you're going to get promoted soon.
It sounds like people want #100 bronze > #1 copper, #1 silver > #100 bronze, etc. This is never how the league system was meant to work, nor does it make sense for it to work that way. I think half the problem is people are taking insult to their league; eg, I'm silver but I get matched against gold/plat players, oh no! There is supposed to be a fairly wide skill gap within leagues, along with substantial overlap between leagues.
I think if Blizzard just showed your percentile for your league (eg, you are better than XX% of players in Gold), a lot of the confusion would go away.
Hmm don't know if this has been discussed or posted.
but I was in Silver league rank 3. I was on a losing streak of 3 games. Lost the 4th game and got promoted to Gold League. I placed as rank 24 Gold. there I proceeded to have a losing streak of roughly 7 games and dropped to 54th rank. and there i am wavering between 54th and 40th rank dependent on wins and loses.
On May 21 2010 06:18 kzn wrote: I would point out that, in reality, the displayed rating in your division will have a fairly strong correlation with your chances for promotion, with the only factor that makes it not a perfect correlation being the bonus pool.
Consider a player with no bonus pool points and a matchmaking rating equivalent to 50/50 wins against Platinum players. If he is in Gold, his displayed rating will gain ~10-20 points per win vs a Plat player, while it will lose only 4-7 or so. As this continues, assuming the MMR is accurate, the player's displayed rating will increase.
Promotion occurs when the system determines that you are winning against players better than your current division a sufficient amount. If you are winning against players better than your current division by a certain amount, your rating will be increasing at a given rate - so most promotions will occur at roughly the same displayed rating.
The only wrench in this is the bonus pool, which could theoretically allow someone in Copper to get a displayed rating of like 3000 without ever achieving more than 50/50 vs Bronze players - but for the most part, your displayed rating is a vaguely good indicator of if you're going to get promoted soon.
This is incorrect (bold part) If you are at a 50/50 win rate, your rating will never really stay above your "actual" rating. Bonus pool will make your wins worth more, but once your displayed rating is above your hidden rating, losses will also be worth more.
Pretty sure it's because it only evaluates league changes every so often, not after every game. I was playing on a separate account to learn Protoss, and while I was roughly rank 15-20 silver league, I went 4-1, and despite losing the last game of that 5 game series, was then promoted to gold. It seems like it's basically just constantly treating every set of N games as placement games and considering the results of the entire set before moving you.
The guy I lost to was a rank 8 platinum player, so I'm pretty sure it was scaling up my opponents as I kept winning before I hit someone I lost to.
Was single digit plat, my account got battlenet wtfpwned and now I'm silver, but I'm also playing offrace so I wonder how many games it'll take to get out? I was stuck in gold for the longest time with 1800 points and then when i promoted it took me to rank 9 plat, and I did a-o-kay so confusion is what I face now.
Means I should go get beer and play in silverstars as terran since I probably am only silver level as T, im so bad at offracing =.=;
On May 21 2010 08:17 Lemure wrote: Yea I was doing some 2v2 and we were like rank 3 in bronze. We lost a game and got promoted to like rank 30 in silver.
Must've done decent since the last time the system updated then. xD
Me and my friend lost all our 2v2 placement matches for the lulz. Here are the results:
Started: 0-0 @ 62 Copper
4-0 @ Rank 1 Copper
6-2 @ Rank 8 Bronze
14-8 @ Rank 5 Bronze
18 - 13 @ Rank 8 Bronze
23-14 @ Rank 1 Bronze (we lost to get to 14 losses, then went on a 5 game win streak)
24-14 @ Rank 8 Silver
For those wondering how we went from 1 Bronze to 8 Silver, we basically only played people divisions ahead of us. The game that brought us up to 8 Silver we won against a Gold #18 team. We asked every person we asked after our 6th or 7th game what league they were in, almost every single game they were ranks 1-15 in either Gold or Silver. I'm not exactly sure why, but that's what happened.
EDIT: Fixed the numbers a bit, mixed something up.
Just yesterday I won 6 games in a row then lost one and on the loss (it was a failed cheese) I got promoted to Gold. I've been promoted on a loss in 2v2's as well and it's happened to my friend as well so really it's a big mystery.
Well, It's putting me against rank 3-20 platinum players as silver, and now promoted me to gold really quick... Rank 2 gold already in 16 games played... 12-4, got promoted after two loss to a rank 9, and rank 2 plat players.
It's still all over the map, the link solves nothing.
On May 21 2010 09:21 Chriamon wrote:This is incorrect (bold part) If you are at a 50/50 win rate, your rating will never really stay above your "actual" rating. Bonus pool will make your wins worth more, but once your displayed rating is above your hidden rating, losses will also be worth more.
Yes, but consider this example:
A player receives 50 bonus pool points per day (way too much, obviously, but irrelevant). At first, he will win and lose equal amounts before the bonus pool applies - so, for instance, his first win will be 5 + 5(bonus) for +10, and if he lost, it would be -5, with no bonus pool application. As long as this player refused to play without a bonus pool, he would gain in ratings despite a 50-50 record, because every win would be doubled in value (on the displayed rating) while losses are not influenced by the bonus pool.
After weeks of this, maybe he's at 1500 displayed, 1000 hidden, with another 50 bonus pool points. His first game at this stage will generate rating changes as such:
If its a win, he will receive the same rating he received at 1000, because rating gains are determined by MMR (I'm fairly certain).* Thus, if its a win, he'll gain 5 + 5(bonus), for a total of 10.
If he loses, he'll lose 5, (assuming, again, that rating gains are based on MMR, not displayed rating), with no bonus pool application.
*If it works like WoW, he'll actually receive deflated gains, which might change this somewhat. I'm not sure this is how it works. Your post suggests this is true, so I suppose I could be wrong.
If it does work like WoW, it will become significantly harder for this player to gain rating the farther his displayed rating travels from his MMR, but it will still be possible for him to be significantly above his MMR with bonus pool abuse.
you just need to be consistent, stop losing to inferior opponents, and you'll move up. I don't think bnet promotes you when you are losing to players in your division on a consistent basis.
Hello Dear Starcraft 2 Gamers. I was looking at this topic wondering the same thing you guys were. Then i decieded to just play another game online. Basics: Gold after posting a 4-1 in placement matches. (Using VR/Zealot Rush) I worked my way up to rank 3, then after wondering about placement matches, i found this topic. I played 1 game and got promoted to Platnium Rank 23. (Beat a platnium player Rank 34) On regards to APM.Unspent resources etc. - I have an average APM of 20-30 (I know lol) However i do not spam clicks unless i need to. My matches were always a proxy quick zealot rush. Posted a record of 28-17(2D/C). However since i was zealot rushing i always had less then 100 recources at any given time. Now i also played people from Bronze up to Diamond, and ussualy won. Hopefully this post can help someone understand the system better. GL HF.
pretty sure it has nothing to do with your ranking. i went from like 30 in gold straight into plat in under 10 games. think it has something to do with your score combined with the score of the people you're winning against. or just the rate at which your score rises? i dunno.
If it does work like WoW, it will become significantly harder for this player to gain rating the farther his displayed rating travels from his MMR, but it will still be possible for him to be significantly above his MMR with bonus pool abuse.
The bonus pool compensates for point inflation, it does not allow you to significantly over-reach your true skill level.