People have been cheating in games since games existed. Some players map-hacked in SC1 during KBK because literally everyone map-hacked and nothing was being done about it and it was the only way to get through the online qualifiers. Other kids blatantly map-hacked in online tourneys simply because they did not give a shit and were greedy. Then of course there were ppl like Testie who hacked over and over after being caught many times just because he wanted to fill some void as a young naive kid.
Whatever motivations there are...the fact of the matter is there will always be people in competitions that will cheat. Especially now in SC2 where all these events have(or will have soon enough -- MLGs prizes are still considerably small this season compared to the hype) huge prize money and/or huge fame and potential marketability and sponsorship of players who do well.
I was watching some games at MLG this weekend and I just thought to myself theres nothing to stop a player from taping like an iphone in vibrate mode or any other sort of advice to the inside of his thigh or whatever and having someone watching in the crowd give some morse-code-ish signals to tell the player what build or whatever his opponent is doing. It would be really simple. (I've posted about this in SC1 days but no one seemed to give a fuk lol.)
I know (but not sure how often and to what extent) in SC1 in Korea for proleague and starleague matches they would make players give their phones and even do pat-downs and or use a metal detector wand thingy like they have at airports to make sure.
So I'm just wondering is there any sort of measures against this in the foreign SC2 live tournaments now? If not, maybe time to have some random screenings here and there to scare off potential cheaters (obviously you can't do it before every game that would just be insane.)
Probably shouldn't have even posted this publicly cuz now some sad nerds r gunna get ideas. O well lol.
im wondering is it possible to just read an battlenet msg from a realidfriend whos watching the stream? of course u have to put busy on but u can still read them in the friends window, right?
The obvious countermeasure would be to electromagnetically insulate the booth and turn it into a Faraday cage. There'd still be the problem of the progamers being able to see audience members using semaphore outside the booth, of course, but there's ways to stop that too.
If all else fails, we can have them playing the game from within lead-lined sarcophagi; the bonus being that if they DO get caught, we can disqualify, terminate, and securely bury them without them needing to leave the booth.
On August 31 2011 20:49 nalgene wrote: I can see this being done by some people at a casino... but I've never heard of one being done for some computer game... I guess that's news...
Because no money is involved with computer games, right?
Yea, I was wondering the same things when i was watching the VODS of MLG and seeing the players not even in booths for some of the important matches. i was wondering if they could hear other info from crowds or whatever. but they were wearing headsets so maybe they couldnt hear random shouts from crowds telling them info
That's actually a very good point, never really thought of someone cheating in such a way in offline competitions although the setup at MLG really seemed like it would've been easy to cheat. Hopefully offline tournaments start taking more precautions to prevent cheating as e-sports is getting bigger and bigger, but I don't think that there's really any proper way of detecting cheating in online cups and such other than blizzard's own antihack system, unfortunately.
Sadly the online stuff will always happen, that is why I think it is crazy to have an online tournament with big cash prizes in the balance. I didn't think there were many people who had the balls to do it in a live tournament, but now that you say that, I'm sure there are plenty of ways to get good information about what your opponent is doing. Just think if someone got a text every time their opponent expanded so they had perfect timing pushes without scouting....etc.
Either way, the more money the more likely someone is going to risk cheating to win it all.
On August 31 2011 20:49 nalgene wrote: I can see this being done by some people at a casino... but I've never heard of one being done for some computer game... I guess that's news...
why not, people had elaborate schemes to cheat in similar ways in chess.
On August 31 2011 20:55 Aim Here wrote: The obvious countermeasure would be to electromagnetically insulate the booth and turn it into a Faraday cage. There'd still be the problem of the progamers being able to see audience members using semaphore outside the booth, of course, but there's ways to stop that too.
If all else fails, we can have them playing the game from within lead-lined sarcophagi; the bonus being that if they DO get caught, we can disqualify, terminate, and securely bury them without them needing to leave the booth.
Or tranquilise everyone from the waist down and make them play shirtless.
There are LOTS of ways to cheat in SC2, and you can not prevent all =/
Simple as that, every single people choose what is gonna do
I myself think cheating is stupid lol, and many other players could think the same, but the problem is when money enters in game. Losing will matter, because you want to earn money, not only "points"
The only posible solution could be frisk them and quit them any electronic device, as well controlling their screens while playing -_-U
On August 31 2011 20:49 nalgene wrote: I can see this being done by some people at a casino... but I've never heard of one being done for some computer game... I guess that's news...
wouldn't make much sense in a casino. -> would only "work" in poker games.
-> people using pot-odd calculators are so bad players, they loose anyway (if they were good they wouldn't need calculators -> nobody should see your cards anyway -> would be way to risky for televised poker games
but back to esports: I don't think it will work, because you have to be extremely focused on the game and don't have time to watch or listen to your phone
I think that it is pretty pointless to use your phone or a device like that to gain an advantage. it would probably make you alot less focused on the game and therefore make you play worse especally if you have to use your hands at some points to use the device.
On August 31 2011 20:58 jjhchsc2 wrote: Yea, I was wondering the same things when i was watching the VODS of MLG and seeing the players not even in booths for some of the important matches. i was wondering if they could hear other info from crowds or whatever. but they were wearing headsets so maybe they couldnt hear random shouts from crowds telling them info
The booths shield players from the commentary when they're on the main stage because otherwise it makes for a dull spectating experience, the featured stations (where important matches are played with an audience but no booths) don't have commentary except for on-stream at home, if someone in the crowd was shouting out info loud enough for them to hear through the headset then surely the refs would pick them up on it, you see them standing right then when the games finish.
Not ruling out other kinds of elaborate cheating, but MLG's setup is reasonably well thought out, even going so far as having a ref on the stage during main-stage matches to check signs.
On August 31 2011 21:11 JollyJumper wrote: I think that it is pretty pointless to use your phone or a device like that to gain an advantage. it would probably make you alot less focused on the game and therefore make you play worse especally if you have to use your hands at some points to use the device.
1) I'm pretty sure players of their calibre can cheat and win at the same time. 2) He never said anything about having to use their hands. Using morse code, or messaging ingame requires little physical interaction
Overall I think with tournaments with say >$50k prize pool and especially offline events should have some sort of screening or maybe even drug tests...
It won't affect tournaments such as MLG (I mean cheating for the later rounds) since in the end there are really few pros who can beat koreans with cheats like this so they won't risk cheating.
On August 31 2011 20:55 Aim Here wrote: The obvious countermeasure would be to electromagnetically insulate the booth and turn it into a Faraday cage. There'd still be the problem of the progamers being able to see audience members using semaphore outside the booth, of course, but there's ways to stop that too.
If all else fails, we can have them playing the game from within lead-lined sarcophagi; the bonus being that if they DO get caught, we can disqualify, terminate, and securely bury them without them needing to leave the booth.
hmm morse-code messages to a vibrating iphone... brilliant! I'm going to win the next MLG! :D Seriously though it is a good point and there will have to be measures taken in the near future. Especially since rekrul just gave a bunch of nerds ideas.