On April 25 2014 02:26 Kaeru wrote: I haven't played SC2 for a very long time and I might used Swarm Host in action maybe 2-3 times. Not watched any games in a long time either so my idea might be absolutely worthless since I have no understanding of how the meta or match-up looks right now. But I will throw it out anyway...
...Maybe make Loctus unable to attack other Loctus? That could in theory make Swarm hosts a good counter to Swarm hosts. The story behind it could be that "Loctus have developed an armor and dna that makes them immune to their own poisonous projectiles".
Way too specific.
It makes Starcraft 2 look pretty stupid when such specific rules are used to balance the game. Just like putting those little rocks below a ramp so it can't be walled, etc.
The beauty of BW was that everything was put together in the way the game design seemed best, and it somehow managed to all balance out. Making changing like that would make it feel too much like artificially balancing the game, and it just wouldn't feel nice.
Widow Mines don't splash widow mines and BW had it's own bandaids as well (like hoovering units against mines).
The idea itself is pretty bad though, just starting with pathing when locusts run into each other withou attacking...
Swarm host are not even a issue, not sure why threads like this are popping up. No one goes swarm host in zvz in any real high level matches, it's easily stoppable before they snowball in zvz. All this "ban unit" talk is disgusting and silly IMO.
How many top Koreans are going swarm host in zvz?? it was a cute idea at the start of HOTS, but it was easy to deal with. Early baneling bust on top of them, suppy vs vibe show matches were pretty fun both went swarm hosts, they just banebusted on top of each other before it snowballed.
In ZVP, The good protosses have figured out how to deal with them to a point where most top zergs in Korea don't even bother with using swarmhosts on most maps, some Korean zergs have been using swarm hosts has a hit run unit already with out any changes.
Swarm host aint no broodlord/infestor type unit and it's easily to deal with at the highest level of play. Is the unit annoying? sure. No reason to ban it.
Maybe Europeans and North Americans need to watch the Koreans more closely on to play vs them, because seems like turtle swarm host vs turtle is only a issue in some EU matches no where else.
Rework Neural Parasite, or replace it with a spell that fixes the match up! It's a shame to see such a worthless spell in the game.
EDIT: I feel like good micro and good use of abilities (energy) should be the counter to swarm hosts. Most end game metagames where maps start to get mined out, become energy wars. Vipers/Infestor just doesn't have the late game power of Ravens/Ghosts or Mothership/HT/Sentry
If you could NP while burrowed, It might break the shit out of the game in other ways, but hey it would be pretty cool to see a bunch of burrowed infestors go NP a clump of swarm hosts and have them start killing each other!
On April 25 2014 04:09 LingBlingBling wrote: Swarm host are not even a issue, not sure why threads like this are popping up. No one goes swarm host in zvz in any real high level matches, it's easily stoppable before they snowball in zvz. All this "ban unit" talk is disgusting and silly IMO.
How many top Koreans are going swarm host in zvz?? it was a cute idea at the start of HOTS, but it was easy to deal with. Early baneling bust on top of them, suppy vs vibe show matches were pretty fun both went swarm hosts, they just banebusted on top of each other before it snowballed.
In ZVP, The good protosses have figured out how to deal with them to a point where most top zergs in Korea don't even bother with using swarmhosts on most maps, some Korean zergs have been using swarm hosts has a hit run unit already with out any changes.
Swarm host aint no broodlord/infestor type unit and it's easily to deal with at the highest level of play. Is the unit annoying? sure. No reason to ban it.
Maybe Europeans and North Americans need to watch the Koreans more closely on to play vs them, because seems like turtle swarm host vs turtle is only a issue in some EU matches no where else.
I wouldn't be so sure of this, KR tends to lag behind a bit on passive playstyles. It took a surprisingly long time for BL / Infestor to become popular in KR even after EU Z's had been abusing it for months, and some Zergs (Notably DRG, Leenock held out for a long time as well) didn't like using it even after it became the meta.
idk why people think ultraliskcould be any good against swarmhosts... just imagine a melee colossus trying to fight a locust wave... by this point i think sh are much more of a problem in zvz than zvp right now
On April 25 2014 00:31 Existor wrote: Why Zergs never trying to use Ultralisk+Baneling+Infestors against mass swarm hosts?
Banelings can clear giant wave of Locusts, giving ultras some time to reach SH themselfs, and more banes can clear newly created locusts so Ultralisks can kill all the Swarm Hosts.
And add small amount of fungals to Locusts and Swarm hosts, so they can't unburrow, move and they'll be weak to Ultras.
Killing free stuff with Blings is a no go, otherwise valid ideas i guess.
Stop talking about "Killing free units is not good" -_-
You need to buy time and clear road for Ultras directly to Swarm Hosts, Otherwise Ultralisks die to Locust wave and can't reach Swarm Hosts
Other variant: 2x less Banelings and 2x more Overseers. Similar cost, but the goal is same. Quickly clear the road for Ultras and "open doors" to Swarm Host bunker.
Are you serious? the locusts didn't even spawn until the units were on top of them, in a real game the locusts would be engaging all the way across map with spores, spines, infestors, roaches, and lings still inbetween the units.