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"Avilo subs" are pretty active in tourney chats from what i've seen, i'm surprised other streamer's subscribers aren't as active as well, but perhaps they don't have as awesome/fun emoticons to use or something :D oh, and nice try, but "avilo subs" never spew garbage, only gold, this site is not reddit, if you want to start anti-stream circlejerks or continue on hate trains post this on reddit instead.
Overall though nice thread about the new hosting feature. It can be good or bad depending on how you look at it or want to use it. Personally, i think it's pretty lame because it inflate's a person's viewer count to something that is not really their own, nor was produced through their own hard work.
But that is just my opinion as a streamer, and it probably is not a common one because people like the cheap and easy way to fame/views.
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On August 20 2014 00:14 avilo wrote:
But that is just my opinion as a streamer, and it probably is not a common one because people like the cheap and easy way to fame/views.
Thanks, I was in dire need of a good bit of irony.
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On August 20 2014 00:51 Broodwurst wrote:Show nested quote +On August 20 2014 00:14 avilo wrote:
But that is just my opinion as a streamer, and it probably is not a common one because people like the cheap and easy way to fame/views.
Thanks, I was in dire need of a good bit of irony. avilo rationalizes massive amounts of people pitying his attitude by trying to categorize them all as "a circlejerk" or "esports illuminati". its classic paranoid behavior, everyone is out to get him as some kind of conspiratorial butt buddy bonanza, it cant possibly be that many many people independently find him unappealing for many reasons
nice writeup, as always basetrade is very proactive in trying to promote the scene and raise involvement and awareness, but that said i cant agree with the twitch culture apologia - i understand basetrade thrives on that sort of thing so it only makes sense businesswise to appeal to the lowest common denominator, but if disallowing unfunny repetitive crap posts on TL means rifkin posting less, i'm fine with that, he can just keep doing the great job he does offsite even if he doesnt post much im glad TL has that attitude toward memes
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On August 20 2014 00:55 brickrd wrote:Show nested quote +On August 20 2014 00:51 Broodwurst wrote:On August 20 2014 00:14 avilo wrote:
But that is just my opinion as a streamer, and it probably is not a common one because people like the cheap and easy way to fame/views.
Thanks, I was in dire need of a good bit of irony. avilo rationalizes massive amounts of people pitying his attitude by trying to categorize them all as "a circlejerk" or "esports illuminati". its classic paranoid behavior, everyone is out to get him as some kind of conspiratorial butt buddy bonanza, it cant possibly be that many many people independently find him unappealing for many reasons
That was rather aimed at him profiting a lot from a gimmick (his annoying personality), aka a "cheap and easy way to fame/views."
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Maybe this needs some extra clarification, I'm seeing some comments that don't make sense...
If you /host someone (you can test it yourself as a normal twitch user, go to your own user's channel and type in something like /host wcs_europe) - your channel needs to be Offline, which means, that even if you're hosting another channel, you will still be offline and Not listed on the Twitch live directory.
So basically you can only use it to direct your viewers to watch something else After you've broadcasted something yourself, or if you have an amazing chat community (ie. Basetradetv) you can hint people to watch something through your channel by announcing it on Twitter for example.
All the extra viewer count will only apply to the channel that's actually Live and broadcasting.
(And as mentioned, all ad revenue, views, etc, will be to the Live channel, basically Everything Except Chat)
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On August 19 2014 16:59 opisska wrote:Show nested quote +To begin with, let's talk about "twitch culture" for a moment, even though it's not embraced by everyone, it is heavily influential on the majority of fans enjoying SC2. Are you really sure about this statement, or just seeing the world in your own eyes? Is it really the majority of SC2 fans, or just the majority of people you come around because, well, you are a significant part of the Twitch community itself? Maybe for the small personal streams, the percentage of viewers that care about the chat is large, but considering that very few streamers even cross a thousand viewers, this is still a pretty small number of people when compared to the 10.000s people watching major tournaments. In general, I think the twitch chat is greatly overrated, because it is just the part of viewers, that are easiest to hear and reach. I basically discovered your stream thanks to "the big one" that I randomly decided to watch as it was in the eventbar. I tuned in in a middle of a game and the game was interesting and the casting good, so I stayed. If I tuned in between games when you spend half the time talking about something related to twitch chat, I would probably quickly dismiss the stream as another twitch nonsense ... Moreover, looking and my own viewing habits, this does absolutely nothing for me. I watch only tourneys and when the games are finished, I usually turn it off rather quickly (almost anything except GSL runs quite deep into the night anyway for EU, so I hurry to sleep often). Even if they somehow manage to end streaming so quickly after the last games that I still have the player open when they host someone, I will likely turn it off the next second, if the target is not a stream I would watch anyway. As for me, I do not use twitch besides watching embedded streams via TL.net or Liquidhearth. That is not because I love TL.net that much (well, I do though), but more because whenever I watch on twitch.tv - it just feels sucky. The layout feels boring and clumpy, the design looks bad to my eyes, and the site does not have very good usability. Also, twitch chat is a cancer to every sane human being. Whenever a caster refers to common twitch stuff like "kappa", "peperino" (or whatever it is), I feel the instant urge to stop watching. I even did a few times - sorry to say that, but the "twitch talk" (among with that kind of american speak habit of rifkin) was a reason for me to absolutely dislike basetradetv. These days I do enjoy BTTV, you're doing great stuff, going more into the organizer side of things etc (well, I disabled adblock for your stream, that has to mean something, right?) and just providing a really entertaining but still somehow analysis influenced cast.
Your efforts to the scene are great.
Edit: for the sake of not wielding the "twitch chat sucks" hammer against basetradeTV only: I love Apollo's cast. Got him to sign some stuff on Gamescom 2013, and when he started to include those "pepperino" shits into his casts, I started to seriously dislike it. Thank god and the queen, he doesn't really use it anymore.
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Places where this seems most likely to be used/useful (IMO):
You are a "B" streamer on a tournament (or it's a tournament B stream) and you are done with your casting. /host the main stream.
You are a player on a team. You finish your streaming session, but a teammate is on. /host your teammate to boost your team's viewers and maybe keep some people on the team's streams. Or "community"/group type channels, e.g. snipealot /hosts to a different BW stream when someone goes offline.
Something like WCS diverting viewers to Minigun (or any individual player) would be rather dodgy, because it's the official SC2 tournament/stream, and so that sort of thing might be a problem (but /hosting to another running tournament once the day is over might be reasonable, since it's likely to be Blizzard sanctioned). Similarly WCS EU /hosting to WCS AM when they are running one after the other (like tournament A/B streams).
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On August 20 2014 00:14 avilo wrote: "Avilo subs" are pretty active in tourney chats from what i've seen, i'm surprised other streamer's subscribers aren't as active as well, but perhaps they don't have as awesome/fun emoticons to use or something :D oh, and nice try, but "avilo subs" never spew garbage, only gold, this site is not reddit, if you want to start anti-stream circlejerks or continue on hate trains post this on reddit instead.
Overall though nice thread about the new hosting feature. It can be good or bad depending on how you look at it or want to use it. Personally, i think it's pretty lame because it inflate's a person's viewer count to something that is not really their own, nor was produced through their own hard work.
But that is just my opinion as a streamer, and it probably is not a common one because people like the cheap and easy way to fame/views.
My twitch chat improved immensely when I started using BetterTwitchTV to filter aviDoge and aviKungfu, no offense.
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On August 20 2014 06:48 Lonyo wrote:Something like WCS diverting viewers to Minigun (or any individual player) would be rather dodgy, because it's the official SC2 tournament/stream, and so that sort of thing might be a problem (but /hosting to another running tournament once the day is over might be reasonable, since it's likely to be Blizzard sanctioned).
But honestly, this is exactly what would do the most good. Tournament viewing numbers are still high, but individual streamers could use a boost right now, and a lot of casual Twitch viewers would be more interested in an individual with 5-10k viewers who's playing a game they don't know much about than a tournament for that same game. There are ways to alleviate the conflict issue. You could have a WCS stream only host players from another region. Or players who had just competed in that day's group. Or only players whose groups had already concluded. Or only eliminated players. Or all manner of ways to avoid accusations of bias. I'm all for WCS hosting the Ascended Starcraft League or The Breakout Invitational, but to ignore individual players streaming is to miss out on a major growth opportunity, which is what I think Rifkin sees as the benefit of hosting in the first place. Sum of its parts and all that.
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I was hosted by nathanias the other night and I didnt even know until an hour after it happened because I didn't have the chat open. Was really surprised to see 300 viewers when I normally get <10.
Hosting is pretty cool, let the ties that bind grow even stronger! We're not number 1 anymore we have to stick together.
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On August 19 2014 20:27 KadaverBB wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2014 16:51 FFW_Rude wrote:On August 19 2014 15:01 looknohands119 wrote:On August 19 2014 14:59 lichter wrote:On August 19 2014 14:53 looknohands119 wrote:On August 19 2014 14:50 lichter wrote: KBB got mad at me for giving blanket warnings for all twitch memes regardless of context so you are free to go
THIS TIME Oh, come on Lichter. I'm like the hardest ass mod on Twitch and even I think that warning Graham for that is a bit of a stretch. giving one's self a fake warning is also a warnable offense >.> KeSPA jail has clearly sapped you of your funny bone Lichter. Or maybe KBB teached him how to forget humor. On topic, i'm fealing offended cause i'm not a 12 yo and i didn't get a thing about that. But the comments were funny at least ! EDIT : you should include your last post of the first page as a TL;DR because that was more understandable than your article. Good thing they are doing that. They will implement cool stuff to make people forget the music thing and the save thing. Yes, I destroyed Lichters sense of humor! You monster!
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I see a few things that you can think about economically and as a gamer that will hopefully make some sense.
1. Twitch has now opened up Power Leveling via hosting. It is important when considering on who to help that no one does anything without at least perceived value. IE: If your going to spend stream time helping SuperNova that does something for you in some shape or form. That also power levels in Twitch form SuperNova kinda like an MMO.
2. Trade smart. If your good at what you do you can have non-stop quality streams for you and and your viewers.(kind of like a tv network). Your buddies would have good mods and you have good mods, close to 24 hours of awesome content boost everyone.
3. First with the most win. Play the new game, but you better be good at it, and be first in the door with that completed product. Example of this would be Itunes and the Ipod vs Windows Media player and the Zune.
I like your post and wish you the best
ArmyHobbiT
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TL:DR => I don't think "big" companies should host any " particular ".
1) They wouldn't have any control over what is stream, what is said, what music ( yeah easy one ) is play during the stream or anything.
2) Why would a stream with a good amount of viewer would take any risk of losing or dissapoiting anyone by hosting someone else ? They wouldn't really win anything.
3) I see too much conflicts. In your example WCS is hosting Minigun, let's take this one: - the guy is part of a team, does it mean WCS is giving exposure to this team in particular ? - why isn't WCS hosting my favorite mech player, or my favorite australian-zerg ? - if WCS had a sponsor and ROOT had their most vile rival, how would you deal with that ?
Edit : the following seems false, I'm pretty I experienced it, I don't know why, ignore it more then. (((((((Last, very personnal ( so forget about it), I personnaly HATE when someone is showed as " online " I open the stream and encouter a complete random ( unless ofc I love this stranger, but this is a coin flip I don't think any "serious" companies should take).))))))))))))))
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Ehhem don't usually use forms anymore but here goes! At first I was a bit skeptical when I saw that twitch was going for this /hosting feature however, after seeing how beneficial it can be while watching streams like BaseTradeTV or WinterSC (to name a few) it pretty interesting. Yes it's still in its early stages but atm I don't really see an issue with it and I think it would be pretty awesome to see bigger tournaments use the feature as well.
Anyway just my opinion
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Jp is the only streamer who seems to actually use the hosting thing, and announce who he is hosting. I think it's cool and mostly useful for people who are on the same team to use. Like if EG Incontrol streams for awhile then goes offline but hosts EG ppd streaming Dota it helps promote the team over more games.
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On August 21 2014 04:38 Gurderoy wrote: Last, very personnal ( so forget about it), I personnaly HATE when someone is showed as " online " I open the stream and encouter a complete random ( unless ofc I love this stranger, but this is a coin flip I don't think any "serious" companies should take).
The stream that's /hosting another channel does NOT show up as Online.
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This feature is really awesome on paper. Could really help, it's at least extremely interesting.
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I need people to host BaseTradeTV so I can watch without partouf betting spam.
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I think this is an awesome new feature. You scratch my back. I'll scratch yours. One thing to keep in mind is that if you have more than 1k viewers, a lot of them are probably afk, so if you host a new stream, they won't leave. They'll just transfer over. I think..
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I love the pictures you used to get your point across haha
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