Casting: Professionalism vs Profanity - Page 11
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30538 Posts
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Sapphire.lux
Romania2620 Posts
On November 29 2015 03:00 BronzeKnee wrote: Read what you wrote. How can I confuse the word "rape" with what the word actually stands for? Is that a real question? As someone mentioned, you may mean nothing at all by saying the word "nigger," but because the word carries significant baggage of centuries it is incredibly offensive to people. The same can be said when someone flies the Confederate flag or draws a Swastika. It doesn't matter what those symbols mean to you, it matters what they actually stand for. And the same can be said for the word rape. You're misusing the word and demeaning it. Rape is something serious, not something to be demeaned. That is very offensive to a lot of people. When someone says rape, it isn't a joke and it means what it actually stands for. I can't think of any instance where swearing isn't childish. If you can't speak without using offensive words, then you're just immature and need you expand your vocabulary. Look, if cursing wasn't the subject, i would have said "get the fuck out of here". I would have said that, because you and me both know that you swear, ok? You swear when someone cuts you off (with the car), when you get Protossed 2 base all in :p, when that THAT girl just goes with some other guy. Swearing isn't childish, it's human. Humans are emotional creatures. They love, they hate, they want others to know what they feel. | ||
flipstar
226 Posts
On November 29 2015 06:31 weikor wrote: I think the main point is, that its just not needed. Sc2 casting isnt a show for cool 14 year olds that enjoy fuck beeing said over 5 times. Commentary doenst get better because someone uses foul jokes or profanity. Like today at Dh semi finals, Solar said (about firebat) something along the lines of "Im pretty hungry for baguette" - which in itself is a racist slur, like saying "im in the mood for some fried chicken" to someone black. Then the casters brought it up again, making a penis joke out of it. Wasnt really quality there. Actually, FireCake gave a perfect comeback 'Dont touch my baguette' which to any slightly perverted mind is a penis joke and good wordplay. You were probably too shocked to notice. You're honestly leaving me in stitches here, I couldn't even post something remotely similar even if I tried my best to be PC. Are you educated in the scientific field of PC? | ||
Phredxor
New Zealand15075 Posts
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30538 Posts
On November 29 2015 06:31 weikor wrote: I think the main point is, that its just not needed. Sc2 casting isnt a show for cool 14 year olds that enjoy fuck beeing said over 5 times. Commentary doenst get better because someone uses foul jokes or profanity. Like today at Dh semi finals, Solar said (about firebat) something along the lines of "Im pretty hungry for baguette" - which in itself is a racist slur, like saying "im in the mood for some fried chicken" to someone black. Then the casters brought it up again, making a penis joke out of it. Wasnt really quality there. You realise that O'gaming the biggest french channel has 'raise your baguette' as a subscriber emoticon? It's a lighthearted joke about a stereotype. Calling it a racist slur is mind boggling. | ||
RevTiberius
Canada353 Posts
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Poopi
France12466 Posts
Aren't walls of text without subsections / no spacing bigger turn-offs than casters using profanity in streams? :o | ||
ClanWars
United States330 Posts
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Poopi
France12466 Posts
On November 29 2015 07:47 ClanWars wrote: ITT: People that think for some reason that just because gamers are ok with swearing, sponsors will be too. Razer: "For gamers, by gamers" so, yeah? | ||
opisska
Poland8852 Posts
On November 29 2015 03:36 y0su wrote: Since you replied would you mind engaging me on this a bit more? Do you feel freedom of speech entitles you to say anything without consequence? Are you also feeling that casters (of a "major" event) should be allowed to speak and dress as they please? What do you do for work? What level of "professionalism" is required there? Yes, I would very much like it for people to be able to say almost anything without serious consequences. The obvious exemption is a binding agreement that they will do something, because that's just a convenient thing to have in society - and not without any consequence, as I also do want people to be able to have an opinion and thus they are clearly free to make their opinion based on what people say. That being said, I would prefer, if people didn't make much of those judgement, but they need to be free to do so. But I really don't like the idea of people being scrutinized for everything they say, and in particular when it is by an "official" authority, be it the state or just anyone who happens to be in power above them. Casters are there to provide a service, that is entertain the viewers, so they should probably not act "as they please", but moreso to please the viewers. I would however like the viewers to think about what they really want and to realize that a laid back atmosphere is just more fun. In no way or form I want to force them to do so, I just think world would be a better place that way and hope that people aren't complete morons. For work, let's say I am a scientist (I am technically a PhD student, but after all those years many people don't even know that and I have to continually correct people who call me "Doctor"). I can dress in any way I like and in the workplace I do not restrict myself from swearing. When representing - such as giving talks and teaching - I try to talk more formally, because people seem to want that and I also feel that I am there to provide service to my listeners, not for my personal enjoyment of my voice. | ||
ClanWars
United States330 Posts
lol | ||
Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
On November 29 2015 07:47 ClanWars wrote: ITT: People that think for some reason that just because gamers are ok with swearing, sponsors will be too. You seem to hold sponsors on a pedestal. They're corporate but they're not completely insane. They know their demographics, some mild swearing won't prevent them from investing money in tournaments. We're seeing Intel, Eizo, Nvidia, etc. All those big companies are putting mad skrilla into e-sports despite the not-particularly-invasive swearing that goes on. | ||
Luolis
Finland7001 Posts
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
On November 29 2015 11:48 Luolis wrote: I dont understand this discussion. Sure i swear alot in everyday life and so on, but i dont really see any reason why we need swearing for casters :D I dont think it adds anything to the cast. You don't need swearing. You just don't need to remove it. People don't generally think about swearing, more likely they censor themselves. If a caster's natural reaction to something that happens is to swear and you tell him he can never do that, you'll get some artificial reactions IMO. Not desirable. | ||
Luolis
Finland7001 Posts
On November 29 2015 11:56 Djzapz wrote: You don't need swearing. You just don't need to remove it. People don't generally think about swearing, more likely they censor themselves. If a caster's natural reaction to something that happens is to swear and you tell him he can never do that, you'll get some artificial reactions IMO. Not desirable. mm i dunno, i dont really see why professional environment should have swearing. I just dont think it really is the right place for it. imo its not that big of a deal that it really should be defended, as its kind of standard at most broadcasting that the casters dont swear. | ||
Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
On November 29 2015 12:00 Luolis wrote: mm i dunno, i dont really see why professional environment should have swearing. I just dont think it really is the right place for it. imo its not that big of a deal that it really should be defended, as its kind of standard at most broadcasting that the casters dont swear. Well I think we'll just have to disagree. I don't think it necessarily has to be a "professional environment". I think it can be looser than an office job. It's entertainment, after all, where professionalism shouldn't be as rigid and formal, in my opinion. And I don't think that we should use previous practices as a standard for this emerging business. We can do things differently. This whole notion of professionalism is just weird to me. It's like how some videogame journalists and youtubers who make a living off of games are often told to "get a real job", as if they had to be as miserable as the rest of us. I find that arbitrarily polished language is annoying, and while swearing may not "add" to a commentary necessarily, its usage in the context of the fact that the caster is expressing him or herself as they usually would does add to the experience. It's genuine. To me, swearing is nothing bad. Swear words are different everywhere. The degree to which they're considered "bad" varies depending on where you are, who you talk to. Some of them are mild enough and general enough, and they're widely used enough that I don't feel they take away from a commentary. | ||
Thorakh
Netherlands1788 Posts
When Rotterdam says "oh man, thats a fucked up situation for him", it is professional for me. that doesn't bother me. Don't use swear words every other sentence but the occasional one when the situation lends itself to it is fine. It's the intent behind a word that makes it offensive, not the word itself. If Rotterdam instead said "Solar is a fucking idiot" then it wouldn't be OK.He talks about the game and he expresses how bad the situation is by using "strong words" And please, for the love of everything, don't say 'the n-word' or 'he dropped the f-bomb'. Everyone knows what you mean, in fact it focuses people's attention on those words. Just say the words. | ||
y0su
Finland7871 Posts
So far it does seem that most gaming related sponsors (hardware, software, gear, energy drinks) don't take too much issue with how things are currently done (minor censorship). Then again, I haven't spoken directly with any sponsors and I would assume that if they were asked they'd prefer as "clean" an event as possible. (TB would know much better than I.) I also believe that in order to attract any bigger sponsors outside of gaming they would require a "professional" cast. On a similar vein, there's been rumors of "adult entertainment" companies wanting to sponsor events/teams but being denied. There's obviously some concern about the public image... I also take issue with saying "a caster's natural reaction/emotion should be okay". These are people getting paid. This shouldn't just be "hey, I have high knowledge of the game, let me talk". If they take their profession seriously they should be constantly working to expand their vocabulary and work on what to say (and not to say). There's actually a lot of things for casters NOT to say (that have nothing to do with profanity). Like, saying like over and over. Like, stuttering. Like interrupting. Like saying the same things over and over. There's also a lot of other things regarding behavior. What to do with hands. Where to look when on camera. How the handle throws. This is part of the job. It's not easy and as someone that's done casting I have the utmost respect for the guys that do this. That doesn't mean I'm not going to hold them to the highest standard possible. If they can't control what they say, they shouldn't be given a mic. | ||
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