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On October 18 2017 09:34 Boggyb wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2017 08:40 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 08:23 leublix wrote:On October 18 2017 03:35 pvsnp wrote: They talk about the $$$. It was a well-paid showmatch.
At this point, I think it would be fairly straightforward to finalize the Terran hierarchy for 2017. Inno is unquestionably first. TY clearly takes second. After that though, it gets murkier. Maru, then Gumiho, then ByuN, then aLive, then Ryung, would be my ranking. But I can see how people could rank them differently. Well, the power ranking should be more about current form then overall season achievements. TY clearly (imo) had a better year than gumiho but he didn't look particularly strong lately. Gumiho's most recent offline trophy was winning GSL Season 2. Since then he has gotten no further than the Ro16 of any big tournament. TY's most recent offline trophy was way back in March. But while Gumiho's been dropping out in the Ro16, TY has gotten to the quarterfinals of GSL S3, the semifinals of IEM Shanghai, and the finals of GSL vs the World. Gumiho plays some online stuff, but TY basically never does, so it's hard to draw any conclusions from that. On the balance, I would put TY > Gumiho more than the other way around. -TY's ro16 GSL S3 was by far the easiest of the 4, so getting one round further than GuMiho isn't that impressive. -That IEM Shanghai semifinals came off the back of beating Dark and nobody else of note. (Yes, he beat iAsonu which GuMiho didn't, but he had the benefit of being able to watch his ZvT before the series which GuMiho did not) -TY beat absolutely nobody of note at GSL vs The World and that tournament was a complete joke due to being a popularity contest. (Scarlett and Showtime at an event that is supposedly pitting the top non-Koreans against the top Koreans? Scarlett brings world class whining and nothing else. Showtime isn't close to the player he was in 2016) TY does play in some online tournaments. Take a look at one of the only major online tournaments: Master's Coliseum. -GuMiho won the 1st which included eliminating TY in the group stages. -GuMiho made the ro8 in the 2nd while TY was eliminated in the group stages though TY's group was by far the hardest. (he went 2-6 in maps though and finished last...) So, what I take from this is that....TY doesn't have the best results, but they are still better than Gumiho's. Offline > Online every day of the week.
Beating Dark in a series is quite the achievement, given that Dark is either the greatest or second-greatest Zerg currently playing. It's also something that Gumiho has never managed to do–Dark 8-0 Gumiho in career records. Also, TY beat Neeb and soO to get to the GSL vs the World finals. If you want to call soO, outside of a finals no less, "absolutely nobody of note" then I think it's safe to discount Gumiho's GSL Season 2 trophy as well.
Ergo, TY > Gumiho.
On October 18 2017 10:14 Phredxor wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2017 05:57 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 04:04 Heartland wrote:On October 18 2017 03:43 Charoisaur wrote:On October 18 2017 03:30 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 03:25 Olli wrote:On October 18 2017 03:24 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 02:52 Boggyb wrote:On October 18 2017 02:44 pvsnp wrote: Lmao at all this controversy. Maybe Gumiho is better than Neeb, maybe not. There's a reasonable argument to be made either way, and I expected Neeb to outrank at least one Korean in any case. Of all the Koreans, Gumiho's 2017 achievements are by far the least impressive. A single amazing run and nothing else does not a legend make. The fanboy rage is amusing, but immaterial.
Next spot could be Neeb, or TY, or soO. A single amazing run basically describes TY's 2017. Not only that, but TY's was 7 months ago compared to GuMiho's being approximately 4. In terms of current form, you can argue TY over GuMiho, but it isn't a super credible argument. You realise that "one amazing run" is more accurate to describe Gumiho's year right? Over the entirety of 2017, Gumiho has 2 ro8 finishes and a win. TY has 3 ro8 finshes, a ro4, a final, and a win 2 wins, WESG too. Oh yeah, I forgot about TY winning that bo7 showmatch against Maru. People never seem to talk about it on here for some reason he also beat Neeb who is a better player than Gumiho bringing us all back to the fact that the Unofficial World Champion is the only true way to measure Starcraft skill Mvp was the GOAT but Inno beat him H2H so he is GOAT but Taeja beat him H2H so thefore Taeja confirmed GOAT. It is known. Some nice liquid bias you got going there. Otherwise you'd go to the next logical step that Flash beats Taeja H2H. Sorry friend, but Fango beat you to the party:
On October 18 2017 06:15 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2017 05:57 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 04:04 Heartland wrote:On October 18 2017 03:43 Charoisaur wrote:On October 18 2017 03:30 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 03:25 Olli wrote:On October 18 2017 03:24 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 02:52 Boggyb wrote:On October 18 2017 02:44 pvsnp wrote: Lmao at all this controversy. Maybe Gumiho is better than Neeb, maybe not. There's a reasonable argument to be made either way, and I expected Neeb to outrank at least one Korean in any case. Of all the Koreans, Gumiho's 2017 achievements are by far the least impressive. A single amazing run and nothing else does not a legend make. The fanboy rage is amusing, but immaterial.
Next spot could be Neeb, or TY, or soO. A single amazing run basically describes TY's 2017. Not only that, but TY's was 7 months ago compared to GuMiho's being approximately 4. In terms of current form, you can argue TY over GuMiho, but it isn't a super credible argument. You realise that "one amazing run" is more accurate to describe Gumiho's year right? Over the entirety of 2017, Gumiho has 2 ro8 finishes and a win. TY has 3 ro8 finshes, a ro4, a final, and a win 2 wins, WESG too. Oh yeah, I forgot about TY winning that bo7 showmatch against Maru. People never seem to talk about it on here for some reason he also beat Neeb who is a better player than Gumiho bringing us all back to the fact that the Unofficial World Champion is the only true way to measure Starcraft skill Mvp was the GOAT but Inno beat him H2H so he is GOAT but Taeja beat him H2H so thefore Taeja confirmed GOAT. It is known. TRUE beats Taeja head-to-head and TL had the nerve to put him 15th....smh
On October 18 2017 06:48 pvsnp wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2017 06:15 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 05:57 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 04:04 Heartland wrote:On October 18 2017 03:43 Charoisaur wrote:On October 18 2017 03:30 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 03:25 Olli wrote:On October 18 2017 03:24 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 02:52 Boggyb wrote:On October 18 2017 02:44 pvsnp wrote: Lmao at all this controversy. Maybe Gumiho is better than Neeb, maybe not. There's a reasonable argument to be made either way, and I expected Neeb to outrank at least one Korean in any case. Of all the Koreans, Gumiho's 2017 achievements are by far the least impressive. A single amazing run and nothing else does not a legend make. The fanboy rage is amusing, but immaterial.
Next spot could be Neeb, or TY, or soO. A single amazing run basically describes TY's 2017. Not only that, but TY's was 7 months ago compared to GuMiho's being approximately 4. In terms of current form, you can argue TY over GuMiho, but it isn't a super credible argument. You realise that "one amazing run" is more accurate to describe Gumiho's year right? Over the entirety of 2017, Gumiho has 2 ro8 finishes and a win. TY has 3 ro8 finshes, a ro4, a final, and a win 2 wins, WESG too. Oh yeah, I forgot about TY winning that bo7 showmatch against Maru. People never seem to talk about it on here for some reason he also beat Neeb who is a better player than Gumiho bringing us all back to the fact that the Unofficial World Champion is the only true way to measure Starcraft skill Mvp was the GOAT but Inno beat him H2H so he is GOAT but Taeja beat him H2H so thefore Taeja confirmed GOAT. It is known. TRUE beats Taeja head-to-head and TL had the nerve to put him 15th....smh Clearly another case of egregious Liquid bias. TRUE is the one true GOAT. The throne is his by rights. All those who deny that are my foes.
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Rats. I'll allow it though.
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On October 18 2017 10:25 Phredxor wrote: Rats. I'll allow it though. Tbh I only embraced TRUE for the puns. Also because I couldn't resist slipping in that shoutout.
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On October 18 2017 10:22 pvsnp wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2017 09:34 Boggyb wrote:On October 18 2017 08:40 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 08:23 leublix wrote:On October 18 2017 03:35 pvsnp wrote: They talk about the $$$. It was a well-paid showmatch.
At this point, I think it would be fairly straightforward to finalize the Terran hierarchy for 2017. Inno is unquestionably first. TY clearly takes second. After that though, it gets murkier. Maru, then Gumiho, then ByuN, then aLive, then Ryung, would be my ranking. But I can see how people could rank them differently. Well, the power ranking should be more about current form then overall season achievements. TY clearly (imo) had a better year than gumiho but he didn't look particularly strong lately. Gumiho's most recent offline trophy was winning GSL Season 2. Since then he has gotten no further than the Ro16 of any big tournament. TY's most recent offline trophy was way back in March. But while Gumiho's been dropping out in the Ro16, TY has gotten to the quarterfinals of GSL S3, the semifinals of IEM Shanghai, and the finals of GSL vs the World. Gumiho plays some online stuff, but TY basically never does, so it's hard to draw any conclusions from that. On the balance, I would put TY > Gumiho more than the other way around. -TY's ro16 GSL S3 was by far the easiest of the 4, so getting one round further than GuMiho isn't that impressive. -That IEM Shanghai semifinals came off the back of beating Dark and nobody else of note. (Yes, he beat iAsonu which GuMiho didn't, but he had the benefit of being able to watch his ZvT before the series which GuMiho did not) -TY beat absolutely nobody of note at GSL vs The World and that tournament was a complete joke due to being a popularity contest. (Scarlett and Showtime at an event that is supposedly pitting the top non-Koreans against the top Koreans? Scarlett brings world class whining and nothing else. Showtime isn't close to the player he was in 2016) TY does play in some online tournaments. Take a look at one of the only major online tournaments: Master's Coliseum. -GuMiho won the 1st which included eliminating TY in the group stages. -GuMiho made the ro8 in the 2nd while TY was eliminated in the group stages though TY's group was by far the hardest. (he went 2-6 in maps though and finished last...) So, what I take from this is that....TY doesn't have the best results, but they are still better than Gumiho's. Offline > Online every day of the week. Beating Dark in a series is quite the achievement, given that Dark is either the greatest or second-greatest Zerg currently playing. It's also something that Gumiho has never managed to do–Dark 8-0 Gumiho in career records. Also, TY beat Neeb and soO to get to the GSL vs the World finals. If you want to call soO, outside of a finals no less, "absolutely nobody of note" then I think it's safe to discount Gumiho's GSL Season 2 trophy as well. Ergo, TY > Gumiho. Show nested quote +On October 18 2017 10:14 Phredxor wrote:On October 18 2017 05:57 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 04:04 Heartland wrote:On October 18 2017 03:43 Charoisaur wrote:On October 18 2017 03:30 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 03:25 Olli wrote:On October 18 2017 03:24 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 02:52 Boggyb wrote:On October 18 2017 02:44 pvsnp wrote: Lmao at all this controversy. Maybe Gumiho is better than Neeb, maybe not. There's a reasonable argument to be made either way, and I expected Neeb to outrank at least one Korean in any case. Of all the Koreans, Gumiho's 2017 achievements are by far the least impressive. A single amazing run and nothing else does not a legend make. The fanboy rage is amusing, but immaterial.
Next spot could be Neeb, or TY, or soO. A single amazing run basically describes TY's 2017. Not only that, but TY's was 7 months ago compared to GuMiho's being approximately 4. In terms of current form, you can argue TY over GuMiho, but it isn't a super credible argument. You realise that "one amazing run" is more accurate to describe Gumiho's year right? Over the entirety of 2017, Gumiho has 2 ro8 finishes and a win. TY has 3 ro8 finshes, a ro4, a final, and a win 2 wins, WESG too. Oh yeah, I forgot about TY winning that bo7 showmatch against Maru. People never seem to talk about it on here for some reason he also beat Neeb who is a better player than Gumiho bringing us all back to the fact that the Unofficial World Champion is the only true way to measure Starcraft skill Mvp was the GOAT but Inno beat him H2H so he is GOAT but Taeja beat him H2H so thefore Taeja confirmed GOAT. It is known. Some nice liquid bias you got going there. Otherwise you'd go to the next logical step that Flash beats Taeja H2H. Sorry friend, but Fango beat you to the party: Show nested quote +On October 18 2017 06:15 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 05:57 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 04:04 Heartland wrote:On October 18 2017 03:43 Charoisaur wrote:On October 18 2017 03:30 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 03:25 Olli wrote:On October 18 2017 03:24 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 02:52 Boggyb wrote:On October 18 2017 02:44 pvsnp wrote: Lmao at all this controversy. Maybe Gumiho is better than Neeb, maybe not. There's a reasonable argument to be made either way, and I expected Neeb to outrank at least one Korean in any case. Of all the Koreans, Gumiho's 2017 achievements are by far the least impressive. A single amazing run and nothing else does not a legend make. The fanboy rage is amusing, but immaterial.
Next spot could be Neeb, or TY, or soO. A single amazing run basically describes TY's 2017. Not only that, but TY's was 7 months ago compared to GuMiho's being approximately 4. In terms of current form, you can argue TY over GuMiho, but it isn't a super credible argument. You realise that "one amazing run" is more accurate to describe Gumiho's year right? Over the entirety of 2017, Gumiho has 2 ro8 finishes and a win. TY has 3 ro8 finshes, a ro4, a final, and a win 2 wins, WESG too. Oh yeah, I forgot about TY winning that bo7 showmatch against Maru. People never seem to talk about it on here for some reason he also beat Neeb who is a better player than Gumiho bringing us all back to the fact that the Unofficial World Champion is the only true way to measure Starcraft skill Mvp was the GOAT but Inno beat him H2H so he is GOAT but Taeja beat him H2H so thefore Taeja confirmed GOAT. It is known. TRUE beats Taeja head-to-head and TL had the nerve to put him 15th....smh Show nested quote +On October 18 2017 06:48 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 06:15 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 05:57 pvsnp wrote:On October 18 2017 04:04 Heartland wrote:On October 18 2017 03:43 Charoisaur wrote:On October 18 2017 03:30 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 03:25 Olli wrote:On October 18 2017 03:24 Fango wrote:On October 18 2017 02:52 Boggyb wrote: [quote] A single amazing run basically describes TY's 2017. Not only that, but TY's was 7 months ago compared to GuMiho's being approximately 4. In terms of current form, you can argue TY over GuMiho, but it isn't a super credible argument. You realise that "one amazing run" is more accurate to describe Gumiho's year right? Over the entirety of 2017, Gumiho has 2 ro8 finishes and a win. TY has 3 ro8 finshes, a ro4, a final, and a win 2 wins, WESG too. Oh yeah, I forgot about TY winning that bo7 showmatch against Maru. People never seem to talk about it on here for some reason he also beat Neeb who is a better player than Gumiho bringing us all back to the fact that the Unofficial World Champion is the only true way to measure Starcraft skill Mvp was the GOAT but Inno beat him H2H so he is GOAT but Taeja beat him H2H so thefore Taeja confirmed GOAT. It is known. TRUE beats Taeja head-to-head and TL had the nerve to put him 15th....smh Clearly another case of egregious Liquid bias. TRUE is the one true GOAT. The throne is his by rights. All those who deny that are my foes. Gumiho beat TY in his GSL win
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"kamikaze with a taste for survival"
excellent, good job
gumiho had such an unique career, this guy winning so few (tournaments) is an anomaly
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Throughout all his career, Neeb has never defeated a Korean Terran player in an offline tournament.
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Raise your towels!... I hope Gumiho could take down Inno to deny him for winning Blizzcon.. I don't see anyone with better chance than Gumiho
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On October 18 2017 17:25 Divain wrote: Throughout all his career, Neeb has never defeated a Korean Terran player in an offline tournament.
At first you make me laugh but then I checked...
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On October 18 2017 17:25 Divain wrote: Throughout all his career, Neeb has never defeated a Korean Terran player in an offline tournament. GOAT foreigner boys.
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On October 18 2017 17:25 Divain wrote: Throughout all his career, Neeb has never defeated a Korean Terran player in an offline tournament.
He didnt have many opportunities to play vs koreans offline during his prime tho because of region lock
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lol I had a feeling... Still, GuMiho is going to be in form for blizzcon. It's too important not to be.
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On October 18 2017 21:47 zealotstim wrote:lol I had a feeling... Still, GuMiho is going to be in form for blizzcon. It's too important not to be. Tell that to the Koreans who showed up to WCS Global Finals last year and played like garbage.
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is this ranking so we could put a TRUE korean below Neeb and save face ?
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On October 19 2017 04:56 Yo_Man wrote: is this ranking so we could put a TRUE korean below Neeb and save face ?
"True Korean" is such a hilarious thing to say
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Neeb has a good chance in his group with zergs. Probably he will never be solid like soO /or anyone else/, but soO never got enough energy left for the end of the years and worlds championsihps. Rogue is on fire. Still, Neeb looked so unreal and above all non-koreans this year. In order to be the best or one of the very very top in this game, you have to cross three phases. In the first phase you are just a very good and achieved player, like idra, huk, Stephano and etc. in the second phase is where Neeb stands right now. He knows how to fight with koreans and beats them. The third phase is where he must DOMINATE against korreans and he hasn't proved this yet. So Neeb holds his future and we shall see what is really made of. Winning Kespa cup is an achievement that we cannot compare it with anything else, I mean even Grrr.... is from another age of e-sports while metagame was still on its origin. Still Neeb misses the dominance and this is what is the next step of the evolution for him, because still no non-korean made it possible. Need only made something that Naniwa and Jinro couldn't in Code S.
This chat in the previous article with the rankings of Gumiho and Neeb was surprising. I am sure that both of them don't care that much. But who is more achieved? A Code S champion, and ALL-Kill in GSTL against all Slayers? Yeah, Gumiho was a shadow for all of those 7 years in Korea, but he is far more successful than Neeb, who still has a lot to prove. And he has the potential, but we will see.
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All im saying is. Now that Life is gone and sOs is watching from home, Gumiho is the best player in the game in chaotic low econ situations. Gumiho is an agent of chaos and if he can introduce a little anarchy
He can win this thing.
User was warned for this post
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I feel like Gumiho is this year's Neeb. He won a single tournament with amazing bracket luck, and then everyone overhyped him despite most of his results being mediocre (he only reached ro8 3 times in the whole year)
+ Show Spoiler + Just kidding, Neeb is this year's Neeb
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bookmarked this thread. I'll be back to make fun of people when GuMi wins blizzcon. smell ya later
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I wonder if Gumiho is still in top form for Blizzcon
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