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By far the greatest strategies in PvP are 4gate, and 3gateblink, but everytime I get DT rushed I lose now. I am in diamond, and I lost to my RL friend in gold the other day because he went fast DTs and I went blink stalkers. He was 15 food behind, but still won obviously cause I had 0 detection. I couldn't midgame probe scout his shrine due to his units being at the front, and all I saw was a few zealots and stalkers. Nothing out of the ordinary.
I have now been thinking robo will give me a higher win percentage in league PvP, as any sort of DT play will get shut down. However, it seems 2/3gate robo loses to 4gates and is about 50/50 with blink stalkers.
What should I do? It seems like a gamble, and I HATE being caught by a DT scrub who cannot macro for his life and just DT rushes for a 50% win ratio in PvP.
Thanks.
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Is it worth it to hallucinate a phoenix as a scout?
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You're the scrub that uses a build that completely ignores DTs. try walling your ramp at the DT timing with blink stalkers, or busting him before dts come out.
also, 3 gate robo is actually at an advantage against 4gate, if you can get the immortals out.
User was warned for this post
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On August 19 2010 06:05 bombcar wrote: Is it worth it to hallucinate a phoenix as a scout?
Tried this, comes too late for fast DTs.. I am really at a loss here on what to do against this stupid DT rush. I hate robo play vs Protoss, I prefer 4gate or Blinkstalkers.
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Why not try and get a forge and use cannon at the ramp?
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If you have Blink, you can get DTs pretty quick... Do it yourself... problem solved!
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If you get an advantage (which you will if they're teching to dts), just put down a forge and 1 cannon. You can get +1ups as a bonus.
On August 19 2010 06:07 Surrealz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2010 06:05 bombcar wrote: Is it worth it to hallucinate a phoenix as a scout? Tried this, comes too late for fast DTs.. I am really at a loss here on what to do against this stupid DT rush. I hate robo play vs Protoss, I prefer 4gate or Blinkstalkers. Wait how fast are these fast dts? They can't be that fast or they'd be steam rolled by a 3/4gate.
If he doesn't get immortals and doesn't get blink, get a cannon...
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if you make the forge for upgrades and you suspect DT may happen, throw down 1 cannon near a choke point in proximity of your base?
sure 150m is better than 350m +200g, the cost is mobility, but at least as far as your base is concerned you are covered.
forge you "should" have anyway for upgrades.
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On August 19 2010 06:07 FortuneSyn wrote: You're the scrub that uses a build that completely ignores DTs. try walling your ramp at the DT timing with blink stalkers, or busting him before dts come out.
also, 3 gate robo is actually at an advantage against 4gate, if you can get the immortals out.
And going 3gate robo is completely ignoring a zealot heavy build. so your post is rather condescending for no reason at all. The advice regarding the stalkers on the ramp is useless, as he will just kill your stalkers with DTs and you won't have time to put up detection and your entire force will be killed.
However, busting his front door with stalkers before blink finishes is a valid point. The only problem is I have ran into cannons a few times against this DT build, so the early bust may not work all the time.
DTs are a gamble, and so is preparing/not preparing for them. I'm sort of at odds with this build. The only real detection we have is observers unless you want to spend a fortune on cannons.
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Ok, you guys don't seem to understand the situation. You have 0 scouting until your push or hallucinate as a blink stalker build. You do NOT have the money to just go throw cannons down every game just in case of DTs. At high level play you do not see people just throwing down cannons in PvP for fun. Its a fast paced and deadlocked matchup, with every little bit of food counting.
If I prepare with a forge+cannons every PvP, I will lose to anyone who robos or blinks.
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On August 19 2010 06:12 Surrealz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 19 2010 06:07 FortuneSyn wrote: You're the scrub that uses a build that completely ignores DTs. try walling your ramp at the DT timing with blink stalkers, or busting him before dts come out.
also, 3 gate robo is actually at an advantage against 4gate, if you can get the immortals out. And going 3gate robo is completely ignoring a zealot heavy build. so your post is rather condescending for no reason at all. The advice regarding the stalkers on the ramp is useless, as he will just kill your stalkers with DTs and you won't have time to put up detection and your entire force will be killed. However, busting his front door with stalkers before blink finishes is a valid point. The only problem is I have ran into cannons a few times against this DT build, so the early bust may not work all the time. DTs are a gamble, and so is preparing/not preparing for them. I'm sort of at odds with this build. The only real detection we have is observers unless you want to spend a fortune on cannons. 1 cannon in your mineral line is all you need to buy time for observers.
if they go zealot heavy vs 3-gate robo your stalkers will kite them to death early, if they really get a lot you can always get collossus instead of immortal.
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And you realize it takes an eternity to warp in a forge and then a cannon?
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First of all, when you scout in the beginning, keep your probe alive and you can see if it is a 4 gate. If you go 3 gate robo and chronoboost that first observer, you will know what your opponent is doing. If its dts, just chronoboost another observer; if its a 3gate just go 3gate + immortals and you should overrun his army.
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be more aggressive, when i DT rush i have like 4 stalkers and a few zealots, not alot at all, just poke in and see if u can run him over right then.
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Actually i'm very surprised a DT rush can work against a 4 gate... Can't you just crush him before he gets them out ? Surely he can't ff his ramp forever since he goes for such a heavy gas build... Maybe your timing is a bit off and you should push earlier.
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A possible solution to this would be to allow the sentry to create hallucinated observers which can function as detectors. They'd still be super squishy (essentially only 30 HP) and not cloaked, but it would also give Protoss something against cloaked banshee/observer snipe builds. I don't think this would terribly break any other matchups (it would free Protoss from auto-losing against cloaked banshees they don't get a robo, so that might annoy Terran players), although it would make DTs 100% useless in PvP.
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On August 19 2010 06:10 enekeri wrote: Why not try and get a forge and use cannon at the ramp?
you should do this even if you're not scared of DTs (cept for the cannon). upgrades pay for themselves very quickly, and you can typically micro a smaller force better than a larger one (at least I can). especially true with blinkstalkers; tougher individual stalkers means more time to tell the focused fired one or weak ones to blink to the back.
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Go 2/3 gate into robo and you should be fine... you're basically asking how to keep doing what you're doing without dying to DTs. Either suck it up and go robo or put down some cannons.
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On August 19 2010 06:21 Kyadytim wrote: A possible solution to this would be to allow the sentry to create hallucinated observers which can function as detectors. They'd still be super squishy (essentially only 30 HP) and not cloaked, but it would also give Protoss something against cloaked banshee/observer snipe builds. I don't think this would terribly break any other matchups (it would free Protoss from auto-losing against cloaked banshees they don't get a robo, so that might annoy Terran players), although it would make DTs 100% useless in PvP.
You can make hallu observers!!!!??? You, sir, just make my day. I usually get Hallucinate anyway, so now I won't need robo till later! woot!
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