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| tsuxiit May 26 2012 04:47. Posts 1274 | Profile # |
| I'm kind of in camp hypercube on this. These Red Bull events are basically curated by Day9, and Day9 thinks LS's play is interesting for various reasons of his. Arguing that someone else is more deserving of the invite is pretty futile when the entire point of the invite is that it's whoever the fuck Day9 wants. |
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| An2quamaraN Poland. May 26 2012 04:56. Posts 359 | Profile # |
On May 25 2012 19:42 dubRa wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 25 2012 19:22 Surili wrote:
On May 25 2012 19:01 Dalavita wrote:
I would laugh hard if Lastshadow went far in the tournament.
I absolutely hope he does do well, but you have to look at it from the position of a progamer. Lets look at Socke for instance, i'm sure he would have loved the opportunity to be invited to that tournament, and he is a really strong player who competes a lot, and often interacts with the community, and yet lastshadow got invited. They get $500 just for turning up to the tournament. Does it really seem fair on people like Socke that Lastshadow gets invited. Or Machine maybe? Or QXC? Or Morrow? All these are players who are much better known than lastshadow, and spend more time investing themselves in the community. They also, despite few big results, have better results than LS. That is why people like Incontrol are pissed off. And they deserve to be, especially IF it is true that LS basically got invited because he is friends with Day9.
Day9 said LS was not invited because he is friends with him.
And THAT is a definite prove that it's not the case.
Dude, You must be a toy in real life...
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| Atlas247 Canada. May 26 2012 05:03. Posts 309 | Profile # |
| Who really cares if Lastshadow is there? Only reason we are discussing it is because Incontrol brought it up for whatever reason. Redbull Battlegrounds will be an amazing event but instead we're arguing about whether or not some guy that got invited deserves it. Maybe we should just wait and see? |
| | Don't blink. Don't even blink. Blink and you're dead. [ThorZaIN] [NaNiwa] [IdrA] [NonY] |  |
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| Angel_ United States. May 26 2012 05:05. Posts 1615 | Profile Blog # |
Let's ask these two questions:
If it was Jinro or Machine would people be causing such a stink? Frankly the only real difference between the two is that the others make more appearances for equally abysmal results for the past year.
If the community in general wasn't shitting on Day9 recently, or if it he flat out weren't involved with the event, would people be making these stupid arguments? When qxc was brought to the first one after having been basically out of the spotlight (unless my memory is just shit off) was there so much crying? No. there wasnt.
Ask yourself those two really hard and decide if you're bandwagon-ing or not. Last edit: 2012-05-26 05:07:06 |
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| McFeser United States. May 26 2012 05:08. Posts 2451 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 05:05 Angel_ wrote:
Let's ask these two questions:
If it was Jinro or Machine would people be causing such a stink? Frankly the only real difference between the two is that the others make more appearances for equally abysmal results for the past year.
If the community in general wasn't shitting on Day9 recently, or if it he flat out weren't involved with the event, would people be making these stupid arguments?
Ask yourself those two really hard and decide if you're bandwagon-ing or not.
Jinro and Machine would be out of place there - except the difference is even more pronounced because LS has done nothing. I"m actually holding out to see if he is really good, but if not someone else deserved that.Last edit: 2012-05-26 05:09:05 |
| | Promethelax still hasn't changed his quote | |
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iNcontroL   USA. May 26 2012 05:10. Posts 28383 | Profile Blog # |
On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you. If you are upset because more deserving people should have been invited.. and by "more deserving" lets be clear, I am talking about people that actually participate in the community and do things around here like go to events, create content, win etc. LS is most famous for being kicked from the GOM house, calling all foreigners shit and being a former hacker/cheater. Recently he made videos that helped a lot of people, I think that is rad. But I don't think that means he starts getting invites to the most prestigious tourneys on the planet.
That being said this will be my last post on it. I will love/watch this tourney regardless. I think Day9 is doing a fantastic job helping Redbull get into eSports and I could care less in the grand scheme of things about LS. I made a point, I think it's valid, but it in no way shape or form will detract from the entertainment value of this tourney for me. To post more would make it seem I care MORE than I do which is simply not the case.. it's a small drop in a big bucket as far as I am concerned. |
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| Angel_ United States. May 26 2012 05:16. Posts 1615 | Profile Blog # |
taking a minute to think before posting is good. you pointing it out isn't actually a problem.
the people making the assumption that your word is fact and as proof that it is in fact day9 fucking up and true and then bashing on people using the same level of no actual proof to defend it is. Last edit: 2012-05-26 05:21:17 |
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| Mr Showtime United States. May 26 2012 05:21. Posts 1350 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 05:16 Angel_ wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 05:10 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you. If you are upset because more deserving people should have been invited.. and by "more deserving" lets be clear, I am talking about people that actually participate in the community and do things around here like go to events, create content, win etc. LS is most famous for being kicked from the GOM house, calling all foreigners shit and being a former hacker/cheater. Recently he made videos that helped a lot of people, I think that is rad. But I don't think that means he starts getting invites to the most prestigious tourneys on the planet. That being said this will be my last post on it. I will love/watch this tourney regardless. I think Day9 is doing a fantastic job helping Redbull get into eSports and I could care less in the grand scheme of things about LS. I made a point, I think it's valid, but it in no way shape or form will detract from the entertainment value of this tourney for me. To post more would make it seem I care MORE than I do which is simply not the case.. it's a small drop in a big bucket as far as I am concerned.
[redacted statement]
moot pointLast edit: 2012-05-26 05:22:26 |
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| snailz Croatia. May 26 2012 05:27. Posts 636 | Profile # |
this "drama" actually helps the tournament, no? getting well followed guys like incontrol to disagree with even more popular guys like day9 is a win-win, i for one am almost interested to see how good LS can perform now... before, it was just another undeserving invite that i thought got in because no one else was interested  (then i looked at prize pool )
btw iNc, go stream, tx... ^^ prime time on EULast edit: 2012-05-26 05:28:03 |
| | "I am saying that there are 300 current pros and semi-pros that have the potential to come in and dominate SC2 at any moment, with a latency of a few months from the day they switch." - intrigue |  |
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| hypercube Hungary. May 26 2012 05:38. Posts 1915 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 05:10 iNcontroL wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you.
You mean, am I fine watching an event completely for free without complaining about a tiny detail that might have been done better? Yes, I think I'm fine with it.
If you are upset because more deserving people should have been invited.. and by "more deserving" lets be clear, I am talking about people that actually participate in the community and do things around here like go to events, create content, win etc. LS is most famous for being kicked from the GOM house, calling all foreigners shit and being a former hacker/cheater. Recently he made videos that helped a lot of people, I think that is rad. But I don't think that means he starts getting invites to the most prestigious tourneys on the planet.
There's no moral dimension to this decision. None. Creating content, or interacting with fans (or even winning) doesn't make you deserve invites. Ideally it will lead to invites because it makes sense for organizers to invite people who are skilled, well-known and well-liked. But if they don't, that's their right too.
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| | "[...] you wanna have a future where you're expecting things to be better, not one where you're expecting things to be worse." |  |
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| Mr Showtime United States. May 26 2012 05:41. Posts 1350 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 05:38 hypercube wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 05:10 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you.
You mean, am I fine watching an event completely for free without complaining about a tiny detail that might have been done better? Yes, I think I'm fine with it.
You have entirely missed the point of the issue. No, your viewing experience is affected very little, but the principle of the decision needs to be challenged.
You don't have to be mad. I don't think anybody is mad about this. It's just slightly unsettling. I and many others don't want this to happen again if there was any funny business.Last edit: 2012-05-26 05:42:32 |
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| Junichi Germany. May 26 2012 05:47. Posts 1006 | Profile # |
To whomever started this discussion:
Thank you very much! Now I have another point of interest while watching the tournament.  Since I can't do anything against the fact that I already invested some of my interest into the debate whether LS is "deserving of the invite" I can now be a little bit more excited about the answer to the question if he is total crap or if he is actually not that bad (or even really good? who knows...). |
| | "Until the very, very top, in almost anything all that matters, is how much work you put in. The only problem is that most people can't work hard even at things they do enjoy, much less things they don't have a real passion for." - Greg "IdrA" Fields | |
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| TrickyGilligan United States. May 26 2012 05:53. Posts 581 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 05:38 hypercube wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 05:10 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you.
You mean, am I fine watching an event completely for free without complaining about a tiny detail that might have been done better? Yes, I think I'm fine with it.
Show nested quote +If you are upset because more deserving people should have been invited.. and by "more deserving" lets be clear, I am talking about people that actually participate in the community and do things around here like go to events, create content, win etc. LS is most famous for being kicked from the GOM house, calling all foreigners shit and being a former hacker/cheater. Recently he made videos that helped a lot of people, I think that is rad. But I don't think that means he starts getting invites to the most prestigious tourneys on the planet.
There's no moral dimension to this decision. None. Creating content, or interacting with fans (or even winning) doesn't make you deserve invites. Ideally it will lead to invites because it makes sense for organizers to invite people who are skilled, well-known and well-liked. But if they don't, that's their right too.
What? There's clearly a moral dimension. Perhaps you've just never heard the term "cronyism."
Now, if the event organizers were interested in inviting LS and Day9 merely confirmed that he's a good player, then you're correct, that's completely fine.
However, it's also entirely possible that Day9 thought that his friend could use some free press and a guaranteed $500, and pushed for LS for those reasons. If the latter is the case, there's very clearly a conflict of interest and moral issues.
So, it's a question of motivation really, and not something we're ever going to get a difinitive answer on. It's still something that's very worthy of discussion though, especially since much of the SC2 scene is already an old boy's club. It's gotten much better recently, but it's absolutely something we as a community should be aware of and voice opinions about.Last edit: 2012-05-26 05:56:46 |
| | "I've had a perfectly wonderful evening. But this wasn't it." -Groucho Marx |
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| Sein United States. May 26 2012 05:59. Posts 1641 | Profile Blog # |
On May 26 2012 00:57 Angel_ wrote:
It disappoints me that the upper tier of the community (if that's what you want to call it) are falling to the lows of picking on eachother. If anything they should be setting an example on how to act; instead they choose to take little pot shots at eachother because it's popular within the cesspool section of the "community".
That said, I was pretty happy with the rest of the show.
They're not "taking little pot shots at eachother becuase it's popular within the cesspool". They are expressing their opinions, and they did so in a reasonable manner.Last edit: 2012-05-26 05:59:52 |
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| hypercube Hungary. May 26 2012 06:02. Posts 1915 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 05:41 Mr Showtime wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 05:38 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 05:10 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you.
You mean, am I fine watching an event completely for free without complaining about a tiny detail that might have been done better? Yes, I think I'm fine with it.
You have entirely missed the point of the issue. No, your viewing experience is affected very little, but the principle of the decision needs to be challenged.
No, I haven't. I addressed it when I said there's no moral dimension. The principle I support is that the organizer exercises their judgement in invites. IMO that's a much more sensible way to go about it than "the community should set and enforce standards on invite policy".
TBH, I don't get why people would even want to get involved in this. Except to support a friend, which I sort of understand. |
| | "[...] you wanna have a future where you're expecting things to be better, not one where you're expecting things to be worse." | |
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| neoghaleon55 United States. May 26 2012 06:04. Posts 6172 | Profile Blog # |
Hi guys,
I'm having trouble syncing state of the game episode 69 on to my iPhone 3S.
I've had the same problem starting with episode 67 and 68
Recently, as in within a week or so, episodes 67 and 68 was able to sync.
Episode 69 is currently not in the apple store, so I can't download it there yet.
If any of you have suggestions, please let me know.
Thanks. |
| | moo...for DRG |  |
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| hollabackk May 26 2012 06:11. Posts 83 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 05:10 iNcontroL wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you. If you are upset because more deserving people should have been invited.. and by "more deserving" lets be clear, I am talking about people that actually participate in the community and do things around here like go to events, create content, win etc. LS is most famous for being kicked from the GOM house, calling all foreigners shit and being a former hacker/cheater. Recently he made videos that helped a lot of people, I think that is rad. But I don't think that means he starts getting invites to the most prestigious tourneys on the planet. That being said this will be my last post on it. I will love/watch this tourney regardless. I think Day9 is doing a fantastic job helping Redbull get into eSports and I could care less in the grand scheme of things about LS. I made a point, I think it's valid, but it in no way shape or form will detract from the entertainment value of this tourney for me. To post more would make it seem I care MORE than I do which is simply not the case.. it's a small drop in a big bucket as far as I am concerned.
Too be honest, you seem to be on a personal vendetta against LS, honestly he is one of the only north american players that is decent. He's been practicing in Korea and doesn't get the exposure he deserves because he isn't on a high profile team. Sorry he hasn't won a GSL, but i think this has to do with NA really slacking in players. |
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| fraktoasters United States. May 26 2012 06:22. Posts 617 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 06:02 hypercube wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 05:41 Mr Showtime wrote:
On May 26 2012 05:38 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 05:10 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you.
You mean, am I fine watching an event completely for free without complaining about a tiny detail that might have been done better? Yes, I think I'm fine with it.
You have entirely missed the point of the issue. No, your viewing experience is affected very little, but the principle of the decision needs to be challenged.
No, I haven't. I addressed it when I said there's no moral dimension. The principle I support is that the organizer exercises their judgement in invites. IMO that's a much more sensible way to go about it than "the community should set and enforce standards on invite policy". TBH, I don't get why people would even want to get involved in this. Except to support a friend, which I sort of understand.
Are you friends with LS? because you apparently want to get involved in this.
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| hypercube Hungary. May 26 2012 06:29. Posts 1915 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 06:22 fraktoasters wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 26 2012 06:02 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 05:41 Mr Showtime wrote:
On May 26 2012 05:38 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 05:10 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:43 hypercube wrote:
On May 26 2012 04:28 iNcontroL wrote:
On May 26 2012 03:44 Ballack wrote:
On May 25 2012 08:31 iNcontroL wrote:
What I am saying is it would be LESS bad fi the invite was qualifed as someone that would bring more eyes and has done things like compete in events, win some stuff or been around the community.
inviting a former cheater who has 0 accomlishments inside 2 years and doesn't actually participate in the community/events outside of making youtube videos IS a wasted invite.
I disagree, I for one is quite excited to see a foreigner who's lived in Korea for quite a while and is said to have a grandmaster account there. To quote was it Darkforce(?) from the show who said something like "if Soulkey is in Grandmaster league he should be able to do some damage in the open bracket (MLG)", well same goes for LS, if he is a grandmaster player in Korea he should be able to do some damage at the Red Bull Battlegrounds (his group is tough as shit though). Also, a pull-factor is the fact that we know very little about him. He got 4th at MLG Raleigh 2010, which doesn't say much about his skill now of course, but it does tell you that he used to be on par with the best. It will intrigue me (and I'm sure a lot of other people) to see him play. He is an unknown with history and so it will be a cute storyline that say EGMachine or EmpireHappy wouldn't match, even though they probably are more deserving of the invite.
It's fine for you to disagree, not everyone can be correct. This isn't the open bracket.. so far from it. The reason you fail to even enter into this discussion properly is not limited to but deserves recognition precisely because you cannot tell the difference between a 41k$ 16 man invite and the MLG open bracket.
It's an invite. It's not deserved or underserved. It's within the organizer's discretion. Ultimately, if it helps make the tournament more interesting it's good, if it doesn't it's not. Day9 (somewhat cynically) said that the criticism for inviting lastshadow is good, because it created a storyline for the tournament. Maybe that's not entirely true. But still, the fact remains that a single bad invite in a 16 player tournament hardly matters at all.
If you are fine with people being invited because they are friends with the head caster then that is that.. not really anything to say to you.
You mean, am I fine watching an event completely for free without complaining about a tiny detail that might have been done better? Yes, I think I'm fine with it.
You have entirely missed the point of the issue. No, your viewing experience is affected very little, but the principle of the decision needs to be challenged.
No, I haven't. I addressed it when I said there's no moral dimension. The principle I support is that the organizer exercises their judgement in invites. IMO that's a much more sensible way to go about it than "the community should set and enforce standards on invite policy". TBH, I don't get why people would even want to get involved in this. Except to support a friend, which I sort of understand.
Are you friends with LS? because you apparently want to get involved in this.
No, I'm just bored
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| | "[...] you wanna have a future where you're expecting things to be better, not one where you're expecting things to be worse." | |
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 Noam Israel. May 26 2012 06:36. Posts 1580 | Profile # |
On May 26 2012 06:11 hollabackk wrote:
He's been practicing in Korea and doesn't get the exposure he deserves because he isn't on a high profile team. Sorry he hasn't won a GSL, but i think this has to do with NA really slacking in players.
Isn't it possible that he's not getting the exposure he deserves because these two links are practically empty:
http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/sc2-international/players/1822_Lastshadow/games
http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/sc2-korean/players/1822_Lastshadow/games
There are enough open tournaments on NA and KR for him to get exposure, and if he is already playing in them and still has no TLPD entries it means he isn't getting very far.
Anyway, RBB is an invite tournament and this is what you get in an invite tournament. There is room in this scene both for the invite tournaments and the competitive tournaments.
I honestly don't see the point in arguing over an invite list that someone created when it isn't based on results. I either agree with them that it creates exciting showmatches and watch the event, or disagree and not watch. |
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