On June 23 2011 12:40 DimmuKlok wrote: What changes would you guys make, if any at all, to the paleo diet for someone who is diabetic? I'm trying to get my mom to eat healthier and lose weight. I'm not very educated on what she needs and don't want to cause any harm, so I was wondering what you guys thought.
Thanks!
I'm not sure, but I think paleo diet is actually perfect for diabetic people. wait for a nutrition expert to confirm this though.
This is what Robb Wolf says in The Paleo Solution. He claims you can even reverse diabetes with a paleolithic diet.
Better today, felt real shitty to begin with and didn't think id managed my bench, but pulled it together on last set for much better form than my shakey 2nd set.
I think I love deadlift, really feel it in my tiny forearms!
Squat was better but... probs post vids later. I kinda realised that I was trying to keep too verticle. Feels much better when I lean forwards a fraction before going down. Better balance too. Idk will see next time.
Squat 40kg 3x5 or wtvr I done Bench 65kg 3x5 Dead 70kg 3x5 or more
Cool BW Music Vid - youtube.com/watch?v=W54nlqJ-Nx8
eshlow United States. June 23 2011 22:46. Posts 5007
On June 23 2011 12:40 DimmuKlok wrote: What changes would you guys make, if any at all, to the paleo diet for someone who is diabetic? I'm trying to get my mom to eat healthier and lose weight. I'm not very educated on what she needs and don't want to cause any harm, so I was wondering what you guys thought.
Thanks!
None.
Diabetes type 2 is completely reversible (well, depending on how long you've had it and how much damage you've done your pancreas) just like cardiovascular disease and atherosclerosis are reversible to an extent.
Yes, good exercise and nutrition can actually reduce narrowing of the arteries.
Diabetes type 1 is even reversible in some cases.
Diabetes type 3 (alzheimer's disease) is also reversible to some extent with proper nutrition, but since it's neurodegenerative and neurons don't exactly regrow/adapt that fast it's likely losses there will be more permanent.
So if you know people with stuff like multiple sclerosis, alzheimer's, parkinson's, seizures, etc. at least plead with them to try Paleo or ketogenic diet for at least 2 months so they can see that their quality of life will be improved.
Overcoming Gravity: A Systematic Approach to Gymnastics and Bodyweight Strength
eshlow United States. June 23 2011 22:47. Posts 5007
On June 23 2011 14:38 MeShiet wrote: I hate being sick - started feeling symptoms of strep throat on Monday morning and have been on break from workouts since then. I can't believe how hard it is to resist the temptation of giving into lifting. Luckily it's been getting better and getting about an hour and a half of sun today while slowly mowing the lawn sure helped me feel energized. Gonna take it easy and just keep on stretching and resting until at the very least Friday.
On June 23 2011 21:23 inimenesc wrote: I cant go outside, because my gym is in the middle of the town, i am doing my workouts at some officebuildings basement. My father built a little gym there.
Seated overhead press is the best solution then i think.
Yes, seated overhead press works fine.
You can also try dips if you want but they're a bit different than pressing overhead (but still work tons of pressing muscles)
Overcoming Gravity: A Systematic Approach to Gymnastics and Bodyweight Strength
I found a study where type2 diabetic patients were put on a paleo diet and it really helped them. I think 90% of the cohort could suspend their medication and other insane results.
On June 23 2011 08:18 AoN.DimSum wrote: uh oh, i asked my coach to switch to power jerks. I feel much faster getting under the bar when i power instead of splitting. I got 4 week until nationals. lol
rofl you're crazy. Switching up 4 weeks before nationals. good luck :D
how reasonable is it to eat off wood instead of your tummy?
On June 23 2011 22:46 eshlow wrote: Diabetes type 3 (alzheimer's disease) is also reversible to some extent with proper nutrition, but since it's neurodegenerative and neurons don't exactly regrow/adapt that fast it's likely losses there will be more permanent.
So if you know people with stuff like multiple sclerosis, alzheimer's, parkinson's, seizures, etc. at least plead with them to try Paleo or ketogenic diet for at least 2 months so they can see that their quality of life will be improved.
What?
Diabetes and Alzheimer's Disease have nothing to do with each other. Currently, Alzheimer's Disease is incurable and the best we can do is palliative therapy and attempt to slow its progress.
While I'm not going to outright say you're factually incorrect on your other point, the onus is on you to provide peer-reviewed evidence in a respected scientific journal that supports your claims.
It's indisputable that a healthy diet is advisable for anyone, and that a paleo-type diet is probably preferable to the current "standard/average" American diet, but switching from the current average American diet to a healthier one will result in positive health changes for pretty much anyone. To suggest that Parkinson's or Alezheimers can be treated with diet change is intellectually disingenuous.
Here is a link to a news report that summarizes the study.
As far as I know, Salk Institute is the only one to conduct studies into the links between diabetes and Alzheimer's. Maybe eshlow knows of more. As far as eating paleo (or just plain healthy in general) I agree that of course it would be helpful to anyone. The science of it though is far beyond me aside from just the common sense aspect that one would feel when a healthier diet is discussed.
Last edit: 2011-06-24 00:39:02
AoN.DimSum United States. June 24 2011 01:00. Posts 2806
On June 23 2011 16:14 Drowsy wrote: DimSum, are you still doing a lot of clean sots presses? Do you find they're helping with locking out jerks? How do you program them? As part of your c+j warmup? Beginning or end of the workout? What kind of sets/reps? Do you start every rep from the top or bottom?
I'm splitting right now, but getting a little frustrated with lockout and the degree of shoulder rotation. I can lock it out where its bone on bone if I just rotate my shoulders back as far as I would in a squat jerk. This is a little bit uncomfortable and if I do it for several days in a row I get shoulder pain that goes away after a few days. It takes me a long time to warmup if I lock them out this way, and it gets the job and I never have to worry about pressing out. If I try and lock it out to the distance that most people do, to more like a regular press, I often have soft elbows when the weight gets heavy. I think doing more clean sots presses might help me with this.
I can clean grip overhead squat (from the bottom position in a power rack) a bit under what I can jerk , but I could only sots press 40kgx5.
I dont really do them much anymore. I add them at the end of a workout if I feel like doing it haha. I always sit at the bottom and press.
I would work push presses and overhead presses to work on lockout and upper body strength. I feel like these help a lot more. In the sots press, you cant do as much weight so my frequency of using it is low.
Also you can try jerk recovery. I never done them but the exercise focuses just on the lockout.
by my idol krokkis : "U better hope Finland wont have WCG next year and that I wont gain shitloads of skill, cause then I will wash ur mouth with soap, little man."
eshlow United States. June 24 2011 01:07. Posts 5007
On June 23 2011 22:46 eshlow wrote: Diabetes type 3 (alzheimer's disease) is also reversible to some extent with proper nutrition, but since it's neurodegenerative and neurons don't exactly regrow/adapt that fast it's likely losses there will be more permanent.
So if you know people with stuff like multiple sclerosis, alzheimer's, parkinson's, seizures, etc. at least plead with them to try Paleo or ketogenic diet for at least 2 months so they can see that their quality of life will be improved.
What?
Diabetes and Alzheimer's Disease have nothing to do with each other. Currently, Alzheimer's Disease is incurable and the best we can do is palliative therapy and attempt to slow its progress.
While I'm not going to outright say you're factually incorrect on your other point, the onus is on you to provide peer-reviewed evidence in a respected scientific journal that supports your claims.
It's indisputable that a healthy diet is advisable for anyone, and that a paleo-type diet is probably preferable to the current "standard/average" American diet, but switching from the current average American diet to a healthier one will result in positive health changes for pretty much anyone. To suggest that Parkinson's or Alezheimers can be treated with diet change is intellectually disingenuous.
It would be actually nice if you ran a search through pubmed or google scholar before actually contesting this point.
For example, this one in the above link looks at the specific biomarkers of DM1 and DM2 and compares them to Alzheimer's before explicitly stating that Alzheimer's can be considered type 3 diabetes. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19885299
Note that I have never been short of providing peer reviewed evidence when asked to support my statements. If you want evidence just ask. You don't have to be belligerent about it.
It's true that I tend to come up with statements out of nowhere sometimes, but this is because i research a lot of things in my own time.... not because I'm pulling stuff out of my butt.
Also, as you may know now your current knowledge on Alzheimer's is a bit outdated so you may want to revise that with this new information.
Last edit: 2011-06-24 01:12:08
Overcoming Gravity: A Systematic Approach to Gymnastics and Bodyweight Strength
vicariouscheese United States. June 24 2011 01:26. Posts 571
^^ Once you follow the thread long enough, you pretty much have to assume everything eshlow says is backed up with studies. So even if it turns out to be wrong some day there is a good basis for it...
I'm considering bringing up diet issues with family that I work with- alot of obese and diabetics :/
While I'm at it since I'm in a fairly good mood at the moment I'll write up a bit why some of the ketogenic diets have significant impacts on neurodegenerative illnesses.
As you may know things like fructose, trans fats, gluten, etc. in great amounts start to cause dysfunctions within the body.
Metabolic syndrome in particular (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metabolic_syndrome ) is pretty much a concomittent set of risk factors that refer to obesity and in particular the accumulation of a lot of visceral abdominal fat.
Of course, accumulation of abdominal fat leads to all sorts of complications such as high blood pressure, impaired fat metabolism, increase in estrogenic hormone emission, etc.
Basically, what happens is when there is chronic inflammation present in the body because of high amounts of sugars and accumulation of excessive ratios of O6 and trans fat, bad things start to happen.
Autoimmune diseases such as diabetes type 1, rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, multiple sclerosis, etc. all have some sort of inflammatory component. This is similar to cancer, and many of the neurodegenerative diseases I mentioned in the previous post. When inflammation goes haywire because of the poor diet, it starts impairing homeostasis within the body.
Yes, that means ketogenic diet can treat some forms of cancer depending on how that cancer developed. Yes, that means ketogenic diet can "cure" rheumatoid arthritis, DM type 1, MS, etc. in some cases.
NOte that this is in SOME cases. If the development of the process was highly contributed to nutrition intake. Some people have genetic anomalies where they WILL get some diseases. Some people have genetics where they are only predisposed. Proper nutrition will tend to only help people who are predisposed who have not been on a poor diet as long as such that they have irreparably harmed their body to an extent that it cannot function normally anymore.
Okay, so I said i was going to talk a bit more about why Ketogenic diets in particular are useful for improving (and treating in some cases) neurodegenerative diseases such as Alzheimer's.
So they move signalling receptors away from the surface of the cell, and reduce activity within the brain.
IF the brain has impaired glucose metabolism, which means it cannot get energy... then the brain is going to down regulate its energy activities (which include intra and intercellular signalling), correct?
So the brain creates B-A plaques to downregulate itself because it has impaired metabolism of glucose.
The reason why ketogenic diets have been proven effective in neurodegenerative diseases as far as I know is two fold (and there may be more than two reasons... but these are the reasons).
1. As much as everyone says the brain (and heart for that matter) only runs on glucose this is not true. The brain can also operate on some types of fats namely medium chain triglycerdides (of which an example is coconut oil/milk has a lot of them) and some types of other sources of energy some of which are ketone bodies.
Obviously, a ketogenic diet allows the body to produce lots of ketone bodies which is going to improve energy to the brain which is going to help with that situation.
As you now know, the brain preferentially uses glucose over ketone bodies. But when glucose use is impaired, the brain can turn to ketone bodies to supply energy and thus improve neurodegenerative disease functional states.
Basically, ketogenic diet, in particular medium chain triglycerides are very good.
I was going to write an article, which I have on hold at the moment, which shows that MCTs should be used for improving sleep. Basically, it improves sleep in infants (and other mammals). Cows milke contains some degree of MCTs, horse milk contains a lot, and so does human breast milk.
2. Impaired glucose metabolism in part has to do with down regulation of insulin receptors or damage to the pancreas, but it also has some part to do with mitochondrial dysfunction. In fact, in many cases of cancer this is the case.
For example, p53 tumor suppressor gene is part of the mitochondrial apoptosis pathway which is deactivated in nearly 50% of cancers. Basically, if the cell senses it is getting dysregulated then it tries to activate apoptotic pathways to try to kill itself because our bodies are actually pretty damn smart. But if there is impaired metabolism it leads to mitochondrial dysfunction.
Basically, sugar fuels cancer cells for the most part, and going ketogenic is a way to pretty much starve them out in some cases. However, this is all a side note.
What actually happens when you go ketogenic is you take out the inflammatory elements from the diets. This along with the cellular clean up this allows the body to basically "reset" its metabolism which is why Paleo type diets and ketogenic diets signfiicantly improve metabolic function in all forms of diabetes and obesity. This is done through multiple pathways including turning on some of the specific anti-aging genes/processes within cells and reducing oxidative stress.
Indeed, helping to reset metabolism especially within the brain where glucose metabolism is impaired with Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, ALS, Multiple sclerosis, etc. is very very important. And, given that ketone bodies can also be used as fuel by the brain, this helps to repair some damage that is done to the brain..... but usually not all which sucks.
Hope that helped inform some people.
Last edit: 2011-06-24 02:08:12
Overcoming Gravity: A Systematic Approach to Gymnastics and Bodyweight Strength
SoleSteeler Korea (South). June 24 2011 01:40. Posts 4112
Woke up one morning about 10 days ago and my right knee was in pain... It's only a flexibility thing. I could (but have stopped since) even do squats, deadlifts with no pain. I could run and bike with no pain also. But if I raised my knee to my chest (or tried to) I would feel some pretty serious pain. Some days I don't feel it much, but others I feel it a lot. I feel it the most when I'm... lying down! Sleeping and such.
Finally going to the doctor tomorrow morning... not easy when you don't speak the language in the country you live in. Hope this is temporary >_< (And I have no idea what originally caused it. I just woke up and it was like this >_<)
edit: and also, it feels... tight if I walk a lot. I went for an hour walk this morning and all day my knee felt tight. But last Saturday I spent the whole afternoon running around on a beach playing sports and felt fine later on. Walking seems to tighten it up rather than running, then. Hmmm.
edit2 : changed 10 weeks ago to 10 days >_<
Also. It wasn't 10 days ago, but now my lower back is starting to ache a bit... ugh... I'm worried about what the doctor is gonna say tomorrow. Hamstrings feel a bit tight too.
Last edit: 2011-06-24 01:44:58
eshlow United States. June 24 2011 02:11. Posts 5007
On June 24 2011 01:40 SoleSteeler wrote: Woke up one morning about 10 days ago and my right knee was in pain... It's only a flexibility thing. I could (but have stopped since) even do squats, deadlifts with no pain. I could run and bike with no pain also. But if I raised my knee to my chest (or tried to) I would feel some pretty serious pain. Some days I don't feel it much, but others I feel it a lot. I feel it the most when I'm... lying down! Sleeping and such.
Finally going to the doctor tomorrow morning... not easy when you don't speak the language in the country you live in. Hope this is temporary >_< (And I have no idea what originally caused it. I just woke up and it was like this >_<)
edit: and also, it feels... tight if I walk a lot. I went for an hour walk this morning and all day my knee felt tight. But last Saturday I spent the whole afternoon running around on a beach playing sports and felt fine later on. Walking seems to tighten it up rather than running, then. Hmmm.
edit2 : changed 10 weeks ago to 10 days >_<
Also. It wasn't 10 days ago, but now my lower back is starting to ache a bit... ugh... I'm worried about what the doctor is gonna say tomorrow. Hamstrings feel a bit tight too.
Tight on the inside of the knee? Do you have trouble bending and straigthening the leg?
Overcoming Gravity: A Systematic Approach to Gymnastics and Bodyweight Strength
god damn i need to learn some biology, I cant understand the terms in those articles...
by my idol krokkis : "U better hope Finland wont have WCG next year and that I wont gain shitloads of skill, cause then I will wash ur mouth with soap, little man."
eshlow United States. June 24 2011 02:29. Posts 5007
On June 24 2011 02:20 FFGenerations wrote: I lay awale a lot of last nite cz I thought my legs were keep going into cramp!! That was after 20 mins hamstring n ankle stretchin in the morning.
Magnesium, yo.
Overcoming Gravity: A Systematic Approach to Gymnastics and Bodyweight Strength
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Empyrean June 24 2011 00:12. Posts 16299
