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| icystorage Philippines. May 14 2012 15:00. Posts 3975 | Profile Blog # |
they have a large chunk of hp too  and an above average movement speed |
| | Leta for bonjwa | Forever Iris fan | BuGzlToOnl is my hero |
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| xxpack09 United States. May 14 2012 15:22. Posts 1798 | Profile Blog # |
| I believe in stork vs GGplay, ggplay used acid spores + ensnare to cripple the corsair attack rate, allowing more of his scourges to hit. It's also worth nothing that devourers can tank a lot of damage, especially from sairs. |
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| Torpedo.Vegas United States. May 14 2012 16:13. Posts 1842 | Profile Blog # |
On May 14 2012 14:50 CaffeineFree-_- wrote:
They're useful when your opponent get's a good number of air units. Acid spores slow attack speed and magnify damage done to targets. So like mass muta fights or wraith/valks.
Are they the best choice for that scenario though? Would Hydra, muta and maybe Defilers be a more versitile composition against mass air then just devourers? I mean, I can understand why devourers would be good, but its such a narrow function for such an expeniture tech and unit wise. |
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doubleupgradeobbies!  Australia. May 15 2012 11:29. Posts 960 | Profile Blog # |
On May 14 2012 16:13 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 14 2012 14:50 CaffeineFree-_- wrote:
They're useful when your opponent get's a good number of air units. Acid spores slow attack speed and magnify damage done to targets. So like mass muta fights or wraith/valks.
Are they the best choice for that scenario though? Would Hydra, muta and maybe Defilers be a more versitile composition against mass air then just devourers? I mean, I can understand why devourers would be good, but its such a narrow function for such an expeniture tech and unit wise.
They are one of many options. Dev mutt is probably your best option if your intent on retaking air, or if the map makes it difficult to engage sairs with hydras. Devs are also a really strong force multiplier for hydras since the spores also increase damage dealt to sairs, but they are more optional if you are going for hydras.
Whether or not they are the best choice is really hard to say because people haven't had enough experience with devs to make a good judgement. Generally PvZs are lopsided enough that either the Z can't really afford to tech to devs, or they are so rich that they don't really need to. |
| | MSL, 2003-2011, RIP. OSL, 2000-2012, RIP. Proleague, 2003-2012, RIP. And then there was none... Even good things must come to an end. |
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| Release United States. May 15 2012 13:14. Posts 3973 | Profile Blog # |
| Watch Reach vs Chojja too. See the bad side of devourers. |
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| hacklebeast United States. May 15 2012 14:56. Posts 4635 | Profile Blog # |
On May 14 2012 16:13 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 14 2012 14:50 CaffeineFree-_- wrote:
They're useful when your opponent get's a good number of air units. Acid spores slow attack speed and magnify damage done to targets. So like mass muta fights or wraith/valks.
Are they the best choice for that scenario though? Would Hydra, muta and maybe Defilers be a more versitile composition against mass air then just devourers? I mean, I can understand why devourers would be good, but its such a narrow function for such an expeniture tech and unit wise.
Terran never makes enough air units for devourers to be viable in that way. They have a very limited role in that their spores detect cloaked wraiths, but that is highly situational (zerg went for 3 base +1 muta all in, and wanted guardians anyway).
They had a role vs protoss, but not any more. If a player was to go for that type of late game corsair carrier combo, usually defiler hydra is a better counter.
Vs zerg is where they have their most use. If it gets that late, they become horribly effective. It is a costly tech switch, but it is worth it compared to just more mutas, and a defiler tech switch does not work well with the huge muta flock you would have at that point in the game. |
| | Protoss: Best, Paralyze, Jangbi, Nal_Ra || Terran: Oov, Boxer, Fantasy, Hiya|| Zerg: Yellow, Zero |
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| Skeggaba Korea (South). May 15 2012 21:31. Posts 1509 | Profile Blog # |
| I have only made Devour in ZvZ when you hit late game, which is rare to say the least. Usually dont make too many since they dont deal alot of damage and are expensive; just a few for tanking hits, and to get that nice spore infestation over the clumped mutas. |
| | Bisu[about JD]=I was scared (laughs). The force emanating from his facial expression was so manly that I was even a little jealous. | |
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| CoughingHydra May 18 2012 04:01. Posts 57 | Profile # |
| What is the best way to micro hydras against speedlots on open field? Should I hold ground and target fire, or run away and shoot once, run away again shoot once and so on, or just move small packs of front hydras back? Is there any other way? And what is the least ratio of hydras to speedlots that I can take on to fight cost efficiently ( assuming some micro )? Last edit: 2012-05-18 04:02:39 |
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| Bakuryu Germany. May 18 2012 04:54. Posts 271 | Profile Blog # |
| u focus the first 1-2 zeals and u move back the hydras at the front line which are attacked. i would say around 2,5:1 ratio |
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| CoughingHydra May 18 2012 06:17. Posts 57 | Profile # |
| Thanks |
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| blubbdavid Switzerland. May 18 2012 06:33. Posts 2241 | Profile Blog # |
| Why is there something like portforwarding, and is there really not an alternative (i.e. some program)? |
| | What do you desire? Money? Glory? Power? Revenge? Or something that surpasses all other? Whatever you desire - that is here. Tower of God |
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| Fakie Canada. May 19 2012 05:31. Posts 56 | Profile # |
| How does high ground work exactly? Do units on high ground not take damage? Or is damage reduced? |
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| Dead9 United States. May 19 2012 05:34. Posts 2328 | Profile Blog # |
the units on the high ground don't take damage from ranged attacks ~50% of the time (it's either 45% or 55% i forget)
it works differently for splash damage and depends on the unit (lurker/firebat will never miss, siege tank attack will be offset so the target takes 50% splash damage, archon damage offset 50% damage) |
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| hacklebeast United States. May 19 2012 13:46. Posts 4635 | Profile Blog # |
On May 19 2012 05:31 Fakie wrote:
How does high ground work exactly? Do units on high ground not take damage? Or is damage reduced?
To be more specific:
there is a 46.875% miss chance when a low ground ranged unit attacks a high ground unit.
If a miss does occur, it is as if the attack hit one "space" in front of that unit. For units with standard attacks (marines, dragoons, hydralisks, defensive structures, ghosts, goliaths, vultures, and all workers) a miss means the attack does nothing. For normal splash units (siege tanks and archons), then the miss does not affect the splash damage (other than the placement of the epicenter) and it is applied otherwise normally (it does not affect burrowed units). In addition, if there is a unit perfectly placed to be in the spot where the bullet graphic hits, they will take full damage instead. For special splash units (lurkers and firebats) the miss chance is irrelevant because it does not change the hit box of the attack whether the target is one space closer or not. Reavers are a special case because high ground can only block the trajectory of the scarab. A scarab used on long ramps with no cliffs to block the scarab will act no differently than a scarab on flat land.
Dark swarm has the same rules, but "miss chance" is 100. |
| | Protoss: Best, Paralyze, Jangbi, Nal_Ra || Terran: Oov, Boxer, Fantasy, Hiya|| Zerg: Yellow, Zero |
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| Jealous United States. May 20 2012 14:15. Posts 2206 | Profile Blog # |
On May 18 2012 06:33 blubbdavid wrote:
Why is there something like portforwarding, and is there really not an alternative (i.e. some program)?
Long story short: Because it's a game that deals with packets of information (can't explain it better than this; old technology perhaps), and no. It's really not hard... Just go to your router settings and open ports 6112-6119 iirc.
I remember a time when playing over the internet was a luxury... Now people complain about port forwarding rofl xD The times they are a-changin' |
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| ZeKk Sweden. May 20 2012 21:40. Posts 317 | Profile Blog # |
On May 19 2012 13:46 hacklebeast wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 19 2012 05:31 Fakie wrote:
How does high ground work exactly? Do units on high ground not take damage? Or is damage reduced?
To be more specific: there is a 46.875% miss chance when a low ground ranged unit attacks a high ground unit. If a miss does occur, it is as if the attack hit one "space" in front of that unit. For units with standard attacks (marines, dragoons, hydralisks, defensive structures, ghosts, goliaths, vultures, and all workers) a miss means the attack does nothing. For normal splash units (siege tanks and archons), then the miss does not affect the splash damage (other than the placement of the epicenter) and it is applied otherwise normally (it does not affect burrowed units). In addition, if there is a unit perfectly placed to be in the spot where the bullet graphic hits, they will take full damage instead. For special splash units (lurkers and firebats) the miss chance is irrelevant because it does not change the hit box of the attack whether the target is one space closer or not. Reavers are a special case because high ground can only block the trajectory of the scarab. A scarab used on long ramps with no cliffs to block the scarab will act no differently than a scarab on flat land. Dark swarm has the same rules, but "miss chance" is 100.
Did you just test this thing out recently? Quite impressive otherwise u could take such large information from ur memory and print it out. I dont know where u get ur data from chance to hit accuracy. But last time I checked it it's actually only 30% miss chance.
http://classic.battle.net/scc/GS/hc.shtml |
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| corumjhaelen France. May 20 2012 21:57. Posts 4788 | Profile Blog # |
On May 20 2012 21:40 ZeKk wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 19 2012 13:46 hacklebeast wrote:
On May 19 2012 05:31 Fakie wrote:
How does high ground work exactly? Do units on high ground not take damage? Or is damage reduced?
To be more specific: there is a 46.875% miss chance when a low ground ranged unit attacks a high ground unit. If a miss does occur, it is as if the attack hit one "space" in front of that unit. For units with standard attacks (marines, dragoons, hydralisks, defensive structures, ghosts, goliaths, vultures, and all workers) a miss means the attack does nothing. For normal splash units (siege tanks and archons), then the miss does not affect the splash damage (other than the placement of the epicenter) and it is applied otherwise normally (it does not affect burrowed units). In addition, if there is a unit perfectly placed to be in the spot where the bullet graphic hits, they will take full damage instead. For special splash units (lurkers and firebats) the miss chance is irrelevant because it does not change the hit box of the attack whether the target is one space closer or not. Reavers are a special case because high ground can only block the trajectory of the scarab. A scarab used on long ramps with no cliffs to block the scarab will act no differently than a scarab on flat land. Dark swarm has the same rules, but "miss chance" is 100.
Did you just test this thing out recently? Quite impressive otherwise u could take such large information from ur memory and print it out. I dont know where u get ur data from chance to hit accuracy. But last time I checked it it's actually only 30% miss chance. http://classic.battle.net/scc/GS/hc.shtml
Your source is innacurate, funnily enough^^ |
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| Puyi United States. May 21 2012 00:02. Posts 161 | Profile # |
On May 20 2012 21:40 ZeKk wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 19 2012 13:46 hacklebeast wrote:
On May 19 2012 05:31 Fakie wrote:
How does high ground work exactly? Do units on high ground not take damage? Or is damage reduced?
To be more specific: there is a 46.875% miss chance when a low ground ranged unit attacks a high ground unit. If a miss does occur, it is as if the attack hit one "space" in front of that unit. For units with standard attacks (marines, dragoons, hydralisks, defensive structures, ghosts, goliaths, vultures, and all workers) a miss means the attack does nothing. For normal splash units (siege tanks and archons), then the miss does not affect the splash damage (other than the placement of the epicenter) and it is applied otherwise normally (it does not affect burrowed units). In addition, if there is a unit perfectly placed to be in the spot where the bullet graphic hits, they will take full damage instead. For special splash units (lurkers and firebats) the miss chance is irrelevant because it does not change the hit box of the attack whether the target is one space closer or not. Reavers are a special case because high ground can only block the trajectory of the scarab. A scarab used on long ramps with no cliffs to block the scarab will act no differently than a scarab on flat land. Dark swarm has the same rules, but "miss chance" is 100.
Did you just test this thing out recently? Quite impressive otherwise u could take such large information from ur memory and print it out. I dont know where u get ur data from chance to hit accuracy. But last time I checked it it's actually only 30% miss chance. http://classic.battle.net/scc/GS/hc.shtml
wtf tree cover? is that a real thing? |
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| hacklebeast United States. May 21 2012 00:09. Posts 4635 | Profile Blog # |
On May 21 2012 00:02 Puyi wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 20 2012 21:40 ZeKk wrote:
On May 19 2012 13:46 hacklebeast wrote:
On May 19 2012 05:31 Fakie wrote:
How does high ground work exactly? Do units on high ground not take damage? Or is damage reduced?
To be more specific: there is a 46.875% miss chance when a low ground ranged unit attacks a high ground unit. If a miss does occur, it is as if the attack hit one "space" in front of that unit. For units with standard attacks (marines, dragoons, hydralisks, defensive structures, ghosts, goliaths, vultures, and all workers) a miss means the attack does nothing. For normal splash units (siege tanks and archons), then the miss does not affect the splash damage (other than the placement of the epicenter) and it is applied otherwise normally (it does not affect burrowed units). In addition, if there is a unit perfectly placed to be in the spot where the bullet graphic hits, they will take full damage instead. For special splash units (lurkers and firebats) the miss chance is irrelevant because it does not change the hit box of the attack whether the target is one space closer or not. Reavers are a special case because high ground can only block the trajectory of the scarab. A scarab used on long ramps with no cliffs to block the scarab will act no differently than a scarab on flat land. Dark swarm has the same rules, but "miss chance" is 100.
Did you just test this thing out recently? Quite impressive otherwise u could take such large information from ur memory and print it out. I dont know where u get ur data from chance to hit accuracy. But last time I checked it it's actually only 30% miss chance. http://classic.battle.net/scc/GS/hc.shtml
wtf tree cover? is that a real thing?
Yes, doodads such as trees or those spinning machines on space maps give units the same properties as if they were on high ground. And blizzard lied about their miss percentage, it is hard-coded in at 46.875. I don't know why, blizzard is just weird like that. |
| | Protoss: Best, Paralyze, Jangbi, Nal_Ra || Terran: Oov, Boxer, Fantasy, Hiya|| Zerg: Yellow, Zero |
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| Jealous United States. May 21 2012 01:07. Posts 2206 | Profile Blog # |
On May 21 2012 00:09 hacklebeast wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 21 2012 00:02 Puyi wrote:
On May 20 2012 21:40 ZeKk wrote:
On May 19 2012 13:46 hacklebeast wrote:
On May 19 2012 05:31 Fakie wrote:
How does high ground work exactly? Do units on high ground not take damage? Or is damage reduced?
To be more specific: there is a 46.875% miss chance when a low ground ranged unit attacks a high ground unit. If a miss does occur, it is as if the attack hit one "space" in front of that unit. For units with standard attacks (marines, dragoons, hydralisks, defensive structures, ghosts, goliaths, vultures, and all workers) a miss means the attack does nothing. For normal splash units (siege tanks and archons), then the miss does not affect the splash damage (other than the placement of the epicenter) and it is applied otherwise normally (it does not affect burrowed units). In addition, if there is a unit perfectly placed to be in the spot where the bullet graphic hits, they will take full damage instead. For special splash units (lurkers and firebats) the miss chance is irrelevant because it does not change the hit box of the attack whether the target is one space closer or not. Reavers are a special case because high ground can only block the trajectory of the scarab. A scarab used on long ramps with no cliffs to block the scarab will act no differently than a scarab on flat land. Dark swarm has the same rules, but "miss chance" is 100.
Did you just test this thing out recently? Quite impressive otherwise u could take such large information from ur memory and print it out. I dont know where u get ur data from chance to hit accuracy. But last time I checked it it's actually only 30% miss chance. http://classic.battle.net/scc/GS/hc.shtml
wtf tree cover? is that a real thing?
Yes, doodads such as trees or those spinning machines on space maps give units the same properties as if they were on high ground. And blizzard lied about their miss percentage, it is hard-coded in at 46.875. I don't know why, blizzard is just weird like that.
I concur with this information and yes it has been tested and there are threads about these things on TL. |
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