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| semantics August 02 2011 04:14. Posts 8561 | Profile Blog # |
On August 01 2011 13:14 Phayze wrote: Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 13:05 GhostKorean wrote: Seriously your keyboard matters very little in gaming. I'm on a friggin laptop and I'm doing fine
Until you buy a mechanical keyboard and have your world changed. Not going to go into a mech vs cheap membrane here, it might not matter specifically in casual gaming but as far as life expectancy (of the keyboard) potential rsi injuries and overall performance there most certainly is a difference. Sure you can repeatedly spend small amounts of money for a mediocre keyboard, or you can get a mechanical keyboard which is great for typing and probably never have it break in your lifetime. $100 now, or $100 over the next 5 years, you be the judge.
Excuse me but list me a case of a RSI of the finger due to typing, RSI has more often to do with posture then what you're tapping. Most injuries due to typing are avoided by using a proper wrist rest and a proper chair and desk to match the appropriate height you should be sitting for your arms to slightly rest at an incline and be positioned directly in front of you.
Also your point of money saved is purely based on how a person take care of the keyboard, i've seen office and school keyboards last 5+ years on the other end i've seen keyboard dead in a month because idiots spill fluid and basically shit all over it. Same principle applies to mech keyboards most often it's much more deadly to spill something on such a keyboard.
Along with a 15 dollar keyboard say last a good 2 years(A short but acceptable period) over 10 years if you bought a mech keyboard saying cost 100 dollars you did not save money 15 * 5 replacements every 2 years is 75 dollars so you lost 15 dollars. If over 5 years hell let's make it you bought a new keyboard every year that's still not saving till the 7th year.
Say you spend 20 dollars on a keyboard because you like media keys, something most mech keyboard don't have, that's only a saving after 6 years on the replace it per a year cycle and 12 year if you replaced it every other year.
Hell even at 2 years a K120 from logitech is under warranty so you would save money if you just registered your keyboard with them went you bought it, logitech often offers free shipping so if it broke down every year you could have it replaced for nearly free every time. http://www.logitech.com/en-us/keyboards/keyboard/devices/6692 http://www.logitech.com/en-us/footer/terms-of-use?wt.mc_id=usym_redirect_/warranty&id=3101 Ofc the warranty is likely void because you beat the shit out of the keyboard that's why it broke in 1 to 2 years. And likely your mech keyboard would not last much longer then that under such abusive conditions.
Your points are fallacious and not helpful.
as far as keyboard http://www.logitech.com/en-us/keyboards/keyboard/devices/6692 is what i like when buying a nice cheap one, the keys are half height but still easily distinguishable though feel and very similar to laptop keys in feel when pressed, not as flat though, sense i usually work between a desktop and laptop i find it usable and to that end worth the 14 bucks to buy it.
+ Show Spoiler [read] +http://scienceblogs.com/cortex/2009/04/the_psychology_of_the_sale.phpI was doing my grocery shopping yesterday when I stumbled upon a discount that I assumed was a clerical mistake: some fancy olive oil had been reduced from $23 to $9. Needless to say, I immediately put a bottle in my cart, even though I didn't need another bottle of olive oil. But then, just a few minutes later, I began to wonder: why was the olive oil so drastically reduced in price? Is something wrong with it? What isn't Whole Foods telling me? That nagging suspicion - and I'm sure it was completely unfounded - was enough for me to put the bottle back on the shelf. It was too good a deal. My perverse behavior illustrates something interesting about consumers. In general, people rely on a simple heuristic, or mental short-cut, when trying to evaluate the quality of a product: we assume that more expensive things are of higher quality. In other words, you get what you pay for. As a result, we automatically suspect products on sale of being faulty, or inferior. And because our expectations profoundly influence our experience, an olive oil that we expect to be lower in quality will actually taste lower in quality. Look, for example, at this witty little experiment, which I describe in my book. Baba Shiv, a neuroeconomist at Stanford, supplied a group of people with Sobe Adrenaline Rush, an "energy" drink that was supposed to make them feel more alert and energetic. (The drink contained a potent brew of sugar and caffeine which, the bottle promised, would impart "superior functionality"). Some participants paid full price for the drinks, while others were offered a discount. The participants were then asked to solve a series of word puzzles. Shiv found that people who paid discounted prices consistently solved about thirty percent fewer puzzles than the people who paid full price for the drinks. The subjects were convinced that the stuff on sale was much less potent, even though all the drinks were identical. Why did the cheaper energy drink prove less effective? According to Shiv, consumers typically suffer from a version of the placebo effect. Since we expect cheaper goods to be less effective, they generally are less effective, even if they are identical to more expensive products. This is why brand-name aspirin works better than generic aspirin, or why Coke tastes better than cheaper colas, even if most consumers can't tell the difference in blind taste tests. "We have these general beliefs about the world⎯for example, that cheaper products are of lower quality⎯and they translate into specific expectations about specific products," said Shiv. "Then, once these expectations are activated, they start to really impact our behavior. Over time, the presence of sales can really diminish a brand. I used to buy all my clothes at the Gap - I'm stuck with the fashion sense of an 8 year old boy - but, starting a few years ago, I noticed that everything at the Gap appeared to be on sale. This is problematic for two reasons: 1) It triggers deflationary expectations - why buy the t-shirt now when you can buy the same t-shirt for less in two weeks, after yet another "final" sale? and 2) It erodes the quality of the brand, at least as perceived by consumers. I implicitly assume that Gap has to put t-shirts on sale because they're of lower quality, when the actual reason might have to do with the overproduction of some factory in Turkey, or an inventory accounting rule, or some other banal corporate mistake. Nevertheless, the sale has had a psychological impact - I associate the brand with stuff people don't like. There must be a reason why that shirt is so cheap and why the price of that olive oil has been slashed. For comparison, look at American Apparel. Have you ever seen an American Apparel store advertise a sale in the window? Or slash the price of their t-shirts? I thought not. They know that they are in the perception business, and that how we perceive a t-shirt depends on many other factors that have nothing do with the quality of cotton. Sometimes, the easiest way to make the consumer happier with a purchase is to increase the price. When you use phrases like change your life on a product that is a give away of a bias and faulty approach likely lead though reading countless forum posts saying it's a good product to invest your money in and thus once obtained you believe it was the shit and hold it true to this day because either they are right and it is well worth the 100 dollar or you just spent a lot of money on a keyboard that is essentially the same functionality as one at 1/6th the cost
On August 02 2011 04:39 FuRRyChoBo wrote: go to walmart and buy a cheap keyboard that looks like it would come with a dell setup from best buy. there's nothing more ridiculous than people thinking you need a mechanical keyboard and some crazy razer mouse to play sc2.
A mouse simply on credence of preference of dpi ie how much a mouse can go on the screen has value, but a keyboard has no value, SC1 which much much higher apm pros played on essentally disposable keyboards they got in bulk from samsung hit 400+ apm on without skipping a beat, some on ball mice which was fine for the 640x480 size SC1 but may not fit the same on a 1920x1200 screen. As far as the keyboard these are people who play 8+ hours at 300+ apm everyday to stay sharp if they wear down keyboards ever 2 weeks or w.e it may be that is from heavy use that a person outside of that scene is unlikely to match.Last edit: 2011-08-02 04:57:08 |
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| GrimmJ Canada. August 02 2011 04:36. Posts 131 | Profile # |
I'm personally using the Logitech K120, until I eventually buy a mechanical keyboard. The K120 is cheap, and it has a nice feel to it. I also have a Deathadder and the combo works beautifully.
EDIT: You also live in Canada, and you can buy it basically anywhere. Walmart, Futureshop, Staples, etc.Last edit: 2011-08-02 04:39:34 |
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| FuRRyChoBo United States. August 02 2011 04:39. Posts 218 | Profile Blog # |
| go to walmart and buy a cheap keyboard that looks like it would come with a dell setup from best buy. there's nothing more ridiculous than people thinking you need a mechanical keyboard and some crazy razer mouse to play sc2. |
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| Zeke50100 United States. August 02 2011 04:55. Posts 2179 | Profile Blog # |
I've had the same Dell keyboard that came with my prebuilt 7 years ago for...7 years. And it's still going strong (it's quite disgusting because I rarely ever clean it, but that's only additional testimony to its durability). Whenever you hear people say mechanical keyboards will last long enough to save you money, discard unless you literally use your keyboard like a drum set while submerged in liquid.
But if there's a certain feel you're going for, definitely try to find something similar. If you're used to using laptop keyboards/similar smooth keyboards, try finding one of those (I haven't found any reasonable ones DX). If you don't like raised keys, avoid those. Essentially, go for something you like and are comfortable with. Only go with something expensive if you really want it, not because someone else told you to for no particular reason (unless it's a genuine compatibility with your tastes). |
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| LMPeaches United States. August 02 2011 05:36. Posts 155 | Profile # |
On August 01 2011 22:11 Tablespoon wrote:Try and see if you can find one of those Dell keyboards with the huge spacebar. They are surprisingly good. ![[image loading]](http://img.gfx.no/746/746931/dell_keyboard_11.jpg)
I'm use that dell board, and prefer it to my old Lycosa. Idra said somewhere that generic dell keyboard feels a lot like the qsenn board. |
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| FeiLing Germany. August 02 2011 06:17. Posts 417 | Profile # |
Cherry eVolution STREAM XT (15-20€):
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| wolfe United States. August 02 2011 06:33. Posts 756 | Profile # |
Logitech illuminated Keyboard is amazing, can be found on sale for 20.  |
| | Swift as the wind, felt before noticed. |
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| nlite August 02 2011 06:40. Posts 6 | Profile # |
| Go to the computer section of any thrift store and test out the keyboards until you find a mechanical one. To confirm just pull out a key and inspect the switch. You might have to clean it, but it should cost you about $5 max. |
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| semantics August 02 2011 06:46. Posts 8561 | Profile Blog # |
On August 02 2011 06:40 nlite wrote: Go to the computer section of any thrift store and test out the keyboards until you find a mechanical one. To confirm just pull out a key and inspect the switch. You might have to clean it, but it should cost you about $5 max.
or you could go to a best buy and buy a keyboard for 10 bucks and not spend your afternoon going though thrift stores. You're not selling a product you're selling an experience there sort of like restoring an old car it's more about status then practicality. You're also under the assumption that keyboards from the 80's will still be around in such area's sort of like the assumption you could find cheap good 1950's-70's US muscle cars juts in any junk yard just being ready to be plucked from there, when that's far from the truth.Last edit: 2011-08-02 06:46:21 |
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| CosmosXAM United States. August 02 2011 08:51. Posts 114 | Profile # |
| Switching keyboards isn't terrible either. You will just have to spend a little bit getting used to it. |
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| Jeenyus United States. August 02 2011 09:05. Posts 109 | Profile # | |
| | Ganzi, Heart, Nada, coL <3 Keen,DRG,Naniwa |
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| Mayor United States. August 02 2011 10:06. Posts 467 | Profile Blog # |
On August 02 2011 05:36 LMPeaches wrote: Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 22:11 Tablespoon wrote:Try and see if you can find one of those Dell keyboards with the huge spacebar. They are surprisingly good. ![[image loading]](http://img.gfx.no/746/746931/dell_keyboard_11.jpg)
I'm use that dell board, and prefer it to my old Lycosa. Idra said somewhere that generic dell keyboard feels a lot like the qsenn board.
Does anyone know the model of this/where I can find it? o.o
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| bps United States. August 02 2011 10:28. Posts 13 | Profile # |
| look on ebay for a dell AT101W. A NIB one shouldn't run you more than $50, and you can pick up a good condition one for <$30. The only problem I could see is that like most older keyboards it's PS2 so you might need a converter if you don't have a PS2 port. |
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| Phayze Canada. August 02 2011 10:58. Posts 2017 | Profile Blog # |
On August 02 2011 10:28 bps wrote: look on ebay for a dell AT101W. A NIB one shouldn't run you more than $50, and you can pick up a good condition one for <$30. The only problem I could see is that like most older keyboards it's PS2 so you might need a converter if you don't have a PS2 port.
If you're spending $50 on a keyboard you might as well put in the $20 and get the black widow. |
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| jw232 United States. August 02 2011 11:41. Posts 151 | Profile # |
| +1 for the stock Dell keyboard (SK-8115 I believe). It lasted me 3+ years of BW before I got a mechanical. It didn't make me a better player, but it's fun to type on, and I type a lot in my job. |
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| Boblhead United States. August 02 2011 14:26. Posts 2557 | Profile # | |
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| zipz0p United States. August 02 2011 14:53. Posts 111 | Profile # |
On August 01 2011 22:11 Tablespoon wrote:Try and see if you can find one of those Dell keyboards with the huge spacebar. They are surprisingly good. ![[image loading]](http://img.gfx.no/746/746931/dell_keyboard_11.jpg)
Yeah, if I wasn't a technophile and feel like I need fancy things (like this Filco Majestouch Ninja on which I now type), I'd get one of those. Or essentially any keyboard with laptop-style scissor switch keys. Actually, that said, I really like chiclet keys too. I think there exist any number of these keyboards for not too much money. Go to local microcenter (if you have one), and profit.
I've personally never used those wrist things either... I don't think they help at all. Just make sure to rest your arms on your desk, and don't tense your hands/arms/wrists. Stretch if you feel your forearm muscles are too tight... I've never had any issues and spend absolutely absurd amounts of time in front of a computer, usually using only the keyboard and hotkeys to navigate. |
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| Ben... Canada. August 02 2011 16:35. Posts 1706 | Profile # |
I used the Dell 8135 for about 4 years (it is the same as the frequently posted 8115, but with multimedia keys) and it was the most comfortable keyboard I've used. I'm definitely considering ordering a few of them if I don't end up getting a Das.
After my 8135 died, I used this Lenovo for a while before I got my 6Gv2. I have two of these, one that is full sized, and one that is compact, and has the f-keys really close to the number keys, but still maintaining full sized keys and spacing otherwise. I prefer the latter but both are quite pleasant, with full sized keys and none of that low profile crap. The keys have a textured finish I paid a total of 5 dollars for both. The full sized was bought from my mom's library as they were upgrading machines (it was used but fully functional), and the compact one was brand new from my dad's work, where they buy them in lots of 50 once a year or so, so I asked the owner if I could have one and happily agreed. You will often find them on the cheap from businesses or universities upgrading their systems who are selling old equipment.
I could only find the link for the full sized one:
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823218011CVF
Last edit: 2011-08-02 16:54:01 |
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| nihlon Sweden. August 02 2011 16:51. Posts 5277 | Profile # |
On August 01 2011 22:11 Tablespoon wrote:Try and see if you can find one of those Dell keyboards with the huge spacebar. They are surprisingly good. ![[image loading]](http://img.gfx.no/746/746931/dell_keyboard_11.jpg)
I can sign off on this. I've had a very similar model for 5+ years. Given it wasn't on my gaming computer but it's a great all-round keyboard and feels better than a lot of more expensive ones. |
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