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| SC2John United States. July 19 2012 09:25. Posts 927 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 08:39 ff7legend wrote:
Guys are there any real big signs of what a zerg may be going for late game. Is there any way i can tell if they are gonig ultras or broodlords before its to late? Do i just have to wait until i see one corruptor and just go balls out to react to it?
The most obvious difference between blords and ultras is that generally the zerg will pull back and play more defensively with blords once the hive is up. Ultra play is kind of characterized by ling/bling/infestor aggression into more aggression.
You can scan the hive around 14:00-17:00 generally, depending on how aggressive the early/mid game is. If you know the location of the spire, it might help to scan that too after hive is completed. Honestly, I just stop tank production and start on thor production when the hive goes up; I don't even care if it's Blords or ultras, thors are good against both. I try to just stay aggressive with pushes and drops through the midgame, so the lategame tech for zerg is never much of a problem scouting for me. |
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 M7Jagger Sweden. July 19 2012 10:45. Posts 237 | Profile # |
| OKay, so how do I stop these retarded imba gateway-pushes protoss does sometime around 7-8 min mark? I know they are coming, I put up three bunkers but I still lose to them. |
| | Brace your're selves. Grammar, nazis are Coming |
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| Ghostdav Canada. July 19 2012 12:06. Posts 128 | Profile Blog # |
On July 19 2012 10:45 M7Jagger wrote:
OKay, so how do I stop these retarded imba gateway-pushes protoss does sometime around 7-8 min mark? I know they are coming, I put up three bunkers but I still lose to them.
What league are you? And can you be more specific? |
| | It's quite alright, goodbye for now. |
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| Kamwah United Kingdom. July 19 2012 12:17. Posts 724 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 10:45 M7Jagger wrote:
OKay, so how do I stop these retarded imba gateway-pushes protoss does sometime around 7-8 min mark? I know they are coming, I put up three bunkers but I still lose to them.
It's highly likely you need to space your bunkers out more so he has to use as many FFs as possible to stop repair on them all.
Also a good trick is to place the SCVs at the front so that his FFs negate his Zealots which are the real damage dealers. |
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| Tsuki.eu Portugal. July 19 2012 13:41. Posts 1029 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 10:45 M7Jagger wrote:
OKay, so how do I stop these retarded imba gateway-pushes protoss does sometime around 7-8 min mark? I know they are coming, I put up three bunkers but I still lose to them.
It depends on what you scout.
Is it pure zealot stalker? zealot sentry and some stalkers? some immortals?
Generally you can delay your starport and get 4rax, instead of the usual 3. And 2-3 bunkers with good repair micro and focus fire on the sentrys.
You can also skip eng bay and get fast 2 medvacs for when the push hits. Again you need really good micro and 3 bunkers with good repair.
If its a delayed push you can evacuate your nat and backstab his main with 2medvacs. Kinda risky tho. |
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| Milkomeda July 19 2012 13:41. Posts 3 | Profile # |
| How do I deal with zerg deathball consisting of fully upgraded ultra/ling/infestor? |
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| Tsuki.eu Portugal. July 19 2012 13:48. Posts 1029 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 13:41 Milkomeda wrote:
How do I deal with zerg deathball consisting of fully upgraded ultra/ling/infestor?
There is no simple awnser. The "easiest" way is to go marine/marauder with 12+medvacs and equal upgrades. During engagements marauders need to stay in front and focus fire infestors/ultras. Constant drops and "deathsquads" really help. You need to expand faster than normal, and have good macro, also late game you can transition into raven with HSM, but its tricky. |
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| Efficient Australia. July 19 2012 18:25. Posts 23 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 13:41 Tsuki.eu wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 10:45 M7Jagger wrote:
OKay, so how do I stop these retarded imba gateway-pushes protoss does sometime around 7-8 min mark? I know they are coming, I put up three bunkers but I still lose to them.
It depends on what you scout. Is it pure zealot stalker? zealot sentry and some stalkers? some immortals? Generally you can delay your starport and get 4rax, instead of the usual 3. And 2-3 bunkers with good repair micro and focus fire on the sentrys. You can also skip eng bay and get fast 2 medvacs for when the push hits. Again you need really good micro and 3 bunkers with good repair. If its a delayed push you can evacuate your nat and backstab his main with 2medvacs. Kinda risky tho.
Could I back track with a question. How do you scout a big gateway attack after the protoss 1 gate expands (eg. a 6 gate all-in) without burning a scan? |
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| Sianos July 19 2012 19:23. Posts 528 | Profile # |
+ Show Spoiler +
On July 19 2012 18:25 Efficient wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 13:41 Tsuki.eu wrote:
On July 19 2012 10:45 M7Jagger wrote:
OKay, so how do I stop these retarded imba gateway-pushes protoss does sometime around 7-8 min mark? I know they are coming, I put up three bunkers but I still lose to them.
It depends on what you scout. Is it pure zealot stalker? zealot sentry and some stalkers? some immortals? Generally you can delay your starport and get 4rax, instead of the usual 3. And 2-3 bunkers with good repair micro and focus fire on the sentrys. You can also skip eng bay and get fast 2 medvacs for when the push hits. Again you need really good micro and 3 bunkers with good repair. If its a delayed push you can evacuate your nat and backstab his main with 2medvacs. Kinda risky tho.
Could I back track with a question. How do you scout a big gateway attack after the protoss 1 gate expands (eg. a 6 gate all-in) without burning a scan?
You have 2 ways to scout those attacks:
1) You have to be present on the map with scouting scvs/marines after 6:00 - 6:30 to spot his units or a farward pylon. If you can scout a farward pylon it´s almost allways an gateway pressure/allin.
2) Another way is to to a rescout on his natrual arround 6 minutes with a scv or a scan and count sentries. If he has like 3 or more sentries, expect a gateway pressure.
Also keep in mind that the most liekly follow up after gateway pressure is templar tech and upgrades. So if you manage to hold it, you can just go straight into double ebay and get a fast 3rd. After you have confirmed high templar tech you can drop your ghost academy asap and maxout for a 2-2 timing attack or something like this, because of his gateway pressure his upgrades and tech will be late. |
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| Fus Sweden. July 19 2012 20:19. Posts 956 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 19:23 Sianos wrote:+ Show Spoiler +
On July 19 2012 18:25 Efficient wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 13:41 Tsuki.eu wrote:
On July 19 2012 10:45 M7Jagger wrote:
OKay, so how do I stop these retarded imba gateway-pushes protoss does sometime around 7-8 min mark? I know they are coming, I put up three bunkers but I still lose to them.
It depends on what you scout. Is it pure zealot stalker? zealot sentry and some stalkers? some immortals? Generally you can delay your starport and get 4rax, instead of the usual 3. And 2-3 bunkers with good repair micro and focus fire on the sentrys. You can also skip eng bay and get fast 2 medvacs for when the push hits. Again you need really good micro and 3 bunkers with good repair. If its a delayed push you can evacuate your nat and backstab his main with 2medvacs. Kinda risky tho.
Could I back track with a question. How do you scout a big gateway attack after the protoss 1 gate expands (eg. a 6 gate all-in) without burning a scan?
You have 2 ways to scout those attacks: 1) You have to be present on the map with scouting scvs/marines after 6:00 - 6:30 to spot his units or a farward pylon. If you can scout a farward pylon it´s almost allways an gateway pressure/allin. 2) Another way is to to a rescout on his natrual arround 6 minutes with a scv or a scan and count sentries. If he has like 3 or more sentries, expect a gateway pressure. Also keep in mind that the most liekly follow up after gateway pressure is templar tech and upgrades. So if you manage to hold it, you can just go straight into double ebay and get a fast 3rd. After you have confirmed high templar tech you can drop your ghost academy asap and maxout for a 2-2 timing attack or something like this, because of his gateway pressure his upgrades and tech will be late.
You can also run around with scv to scout for proxy pylons at 7-8 mins, he wouldn't make pylons if he wasn't attacking. If you scout pylon build bunker + supply depots at natural.
Also i like the terran to put on the aggresive stance when defending, because protoss has no tech and you can just trade so good with medivacs against slow zealots. Also very hard to defend drops after a failed allin, especially hard to take a 3rdLast edit: 2012-07-19 20:19:46 |
| | NaNiwa | MinChul | Stephano | MVP ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ |
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| Tsuki.eu Portugal. July 19 2012 22:34. Posts 1029 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 18:25 Efficient wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 13:41 Tsuki.eu wrote:
On July 19 2012 10:45 M7Jagger wrote:
OKay, so how do I stop these retarded imba gateway-pushes protoss does sometime around 7-8 min mark? I know they are coming, I put up three bunkers but I still lose to them.
It depends on what you scout. Is it pure zealot stalker? zealot sentry and some stalkers? some immortals? Generally you can delay your starport and get 4rax, instead of the usual 3. And 2-3 bunkers with good repair micro and focus fire on the sentrys. You can also skip eng bay and get fast 2 medvacs for when the push hits. Again you need really good micro and 3 bunkers with good repair. If its a delayed push you can evacuate your nat and backstab his main with 2medvacs. Kinda risky tho.
Could I back track with a question. How do you scout a big gateway attack after the protoss 1 gate expands (eg. a 6 gate all-in) without burning a scan?
You need to burn one scan and scout for pylons like other ppl said. And more importantly you need to know how to interpret the Protoss army. Generally if its to mineral heavy there is something going on, either a fast 3rd or an all in. Or if you manage to see his nat has no gas going on. If i defend a 6-7 gate all in I like to grab half of my scv and counter with 4+ medvacs and bio. |
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| SC2John United States. July 19 2012 23:06. Posts 927 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 13:41 Milkomeda wrote:
How do I deal with zerg deathball consisting of fully upgraded ultra/ling/infestor?
It truly depends on the composition you have. The composition I generally have is MMM + thors. I cut tank production as soon as hive comes up, replace it with thor production. From here, it's as easy as spreading your bio out (pre-splitting) behind the thors, focusing down the ultras with your thors, then cleaning everything else up with your MMM. It helps to target down infestors with thors or 3-4 marauder hit squads as well.
Hope that helps! |
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| Recoil United States. July 19 2012 23:19. Posts 241 | Profile Blog # |
What is the best way to scout whether a Zerg has been making units or whether they have been droning hard?
Scans can be hit or miss when looking for an army and I generally just use scans for looking for tech. And generally I'm worried moving my army out because if I move out and theyhave been making units I will be overrun. |
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| Sianos July 20 2012 00:44. Posts 528 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 23:06 SC2John wrote:
Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 13:41 Milkomeda wrote:
How do I deal with zerg deathball consisting of fully upgraded ultra/ling/infestor?
It truly depends on the composition you have. The composition I generally have is MMM + thors. I cut tank production as soon as hive comes up, replace it with thor production. From here, it's as easy as spreading your bio out (pre-splitting) behind the thors, focusing down the ultras with your thors, then cleaning everything else up with your MMM. It helps to target down infestors with thors or 3-4 marauder hit squads as well. Hope that helps!
I have good success with MMM + Tanks + Thors. The key is to start marrauder production very soon. Marrauders kill infestors and ultras very easy and lings will be destroyed by tanks+marines. If you see the Zerg going for ling/infestor start your marrauder production asap and build up your medivac count to 6 or 8. In combination with tanks and 1 or 2 thors for blocking your mmm will kill his army very easily.
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| Zoey.hu Hungary. July 20 2012 01:01. Posts 1 | Profile # |
Hello I'm a Top Dia ( Rank 1 ) EU Terran player and now I play against masters in TvZ i have no problem, but in TvP i can't win. No matter what i do i can make fast FE or hellion harrass in the early game in the end the deathball always kill me.
I don't really know who to deal with that i have cloacked ghosts, vikings and mmm with 3/3 on bio and 3/0 on air and still lose. Can someone tell me how to deal with that protoss late game? No matter how i engage or how good my emps are i still lose all fights because of the warpins. So pls help me how to deal with toss late game. Thank you!Last edit: 2012-07-20 01:06:48 |
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| SKDN Sweden. July 20 2012 01:16. Posts 241 | Profile # |
On July 20 2012 01:01 Zoey.hu wrote:
Hello I'm a Top Dia ( Rank 1 ) EU Terran player and now I play against masters in TvZ i have no problem, but in TvP i can't win. No matter what i do i can make fast FE or hellion harrass in the early game in the end the deathball always kill me.
I don't really know who to deal with that i have cloacked ghosts, vikings and mmm with 3/3 on bio and 3/0 on air and still lose. Can someone tell me how to deal with that protoss late game? No matter how i engage or how good my emps are i still lose all fights because of the warpins. So pls help me how to deal with toss late game. Thank you!
its impossible for us to help you without any replay |
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| n0ise July 20 2012 01:25. Posts 2807 | Profile # |
On July 20 2012 01:01 Zoey.hu wrote:
Hello I'm a Top Dia ( Rank 1 ) EU Terran player and now I play against masters in TvZ i have no problem, but in TvP i can't win. No matter what i do i can make fast FE or hellion harrass in the early game in the end the deathball always kill me.
I don't really know who to deal with that i have cloacked ghosts, vikings and mmm with 3/3 on bio and 3/0 on air and still lose. Can someone tell me how to deal with that protoss late game? No matter how i engage or how good my emps are i still lose all fights because of the warpins. So pls help me how to deal with toss late game. Thank you!
Replay. For the specific late-game problem of
i still lose all fights because of the warpins
the answer is build orbitals and sac SCVs - no other wayLast edit: 2012-07-20 01:25:51 |
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| jay.li United States. July 20 2012 02:05. Posts 23 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 08:22 Jockmcplop wrote:
Hi silver terran here.
Quick question: How do i manage to make sure i get a good concave in a TvP when both armies are out on the map? Obviously this is the difference between winning and losing the match in pretty much 100% of lategame TvPs and at the moment i seem to lose them all lol.
Thanks!
The only way (I know how) to do it is just to manually spread out your army into a concave. You always need to be aware of where the protoss army is, so sensor towers and scanning ahead when it's maxed vs maxed is extremely key. You can pre-concave your army out and you will just get better at doing it with practice. There are also a number of micro custom maps vs protoss deathballs. |
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| jay.li United States. July 20 2012 02:11. Posts 23 | Profile # |
On July 19 2012 13:41 Milkomeda wrote:
How do I deal with zerg deathball consisting of fully upgraded ultra/ling/infestor?
Mass drops due to the lack of anti-air and somewhat limited mobility.
I usually keep my primary composition as MMM and just try to split very well. Also, banshees in low numbers (add a 2nd or 3rd starport) work extremely well because there is no anti-air and they can 4 or 5 shot infestors depending on upgrades. If they want to kill these, they will have to use a ton of infestor energy. Other great units to mix in are ghosts and thors to EMP/snipe and tank the army respectively.
The micro during the fight isn't too complicated. Split well to avoid fungals, EMP/snipe infestors, and stim and flank with small groups of bio (preferably marauders) and shift click the infestors to kill them. In addition, focus fire on weak ultras is key, because if the zerg retreats or the fight is a draw, any low HP ultralisks can just be transfused to full health. |
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| spilledmilk Canada. July 20 2012 03:32. Posts 40 | Profile # |
I am looking for advice on transitioning. This is by far my weakest game aspect. I either get stuck in a tech for too long, or I go to fast and end up killing myself with lack of units. Part of the issue is my scouting, unless the building is there I really don't know how to predict a path.
I mean yes you can say well the meta dictates that blah blah blah will happen, but the meta is ever changing, and it varies player to player.
I am pretty comfortable with timings from watching pro replays, etc. The issue I am having is bronze league. The game does not flow the same way.
Now I used to be gold, then stopped playing, and my game is just now starting to pick back up, I have been playing Silvers/Golds but still mostly bronze, and it is having a detrimental effect on my overall game.
I am just wondering how I should be working on transitions.
My main build is 3 rax/Fact/Sport into Expand around 7 minutes, but I also use 1 Rax FE often as well. Generally I push or drop around 10 minutes, with +1/+1, Stim/Shields/Concs 2-3 Medivacs, and about 20-25 mixed MM. Follow that up with an Expo, and depending on how the attack goes I may double expo.
I don't often lose until the 20-25+ minutes mark, meaning at some point I think I am missing something. I just don't seem to be able to effectively transition to the late game, I feel I get strong unit mixtures in all my MU's, but unless I win in 15-20 minutes I may as well right the game off.
Any suggestions on how to work on my Transition mechanics, and what scouting information should prompt me to transition, so I am not building things to soon, or to late. (to late really only applies to TvP and TvZ I think to me as they can Warp In or stock Larvae and once tech is ready have an army you can't deal with.)
Is there any secret to this or is it just something that you have to pick up on from your gut?
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