TL Mafia L
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kingjames01
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kingjames01
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/in | ||
kingjames01
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I like ponies AND kittens. | ||
kingjames01
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kingjames01
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kingjames01
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Everytime I see TL Mafia L in the sidebar I get my hopes up that the game is about to start... | ||
kingjames01
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Best of luck to everyone! Let's make this game one that we'll remember for a really long time; one worthy of it's number! | ||
kingjames01
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I am going to wait for everyone to show up to see if there are any more candidates before I make my decision as to who to vote for. Everyone needs to keep in mind that the mafia will have at least one of their players run in the elections. It's possible that they might choose two players to run in a bid to take Mayor AND Sheriff. I am NOT running for mayor. The more candidates we have, the easier it will be for the mafia to slip their choice(s) by us. After the elections are finished we need to carefully inspect the voting records. Consider also, that the Sheriff role might be more desirable for the mafia to control. Both roles are good, but having the weight of 3 votes means that the mafia will always have to justify their lynch votes and that's harder than justifying who to incarcerate. With all that said, I FULLY SUPPORT the elected Mayor choosing another candidate as their lynch target. The number of candidates will be low and I expect the mafia will have at least one player running. As long as we choose an intelligent mayor, the odds are good that we draw first blood. Finally, I would like official confirmation: Can the elected players be roleblocked? Also, is it possible to vote for Double Lynch on Day 1? | ||
kingjames01
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On January 13 2012 19:28 Bill Murray wrote: Speaking of Meapak, I am really getting a village idiot vibe from him. His criticism of Nissani has me wondering if he is a VI or if he is scum trying to push an easy lynch. Nissani's complaining about the mayoral candidates is actually my strongest towntell from the thread so far. I'm also like Adam. Recently, I've been vibing Cyber_Cheese as town. I like his attacking Mr.Wiggles for setup speculation. On January 13 2012 05:38 flamewheel wrote: No. There are 50. Role PMs will be sent out tonight, game will start tomorrow. Unless I'm mistaken, he can't be Village Idiot. So let's stop this discussion now before it spirals out of control. | ||
kingjames01
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On January 13 2012 19:41 Adam4167 wrote: This hasn't been mentioned yet and I think it deserves to be: Electing our best scum hunters so they can use the bodyguards as shields is just inviting the scum to wipe out both of our elected officials after they replace our bodyguards with their own. If they kill both officials on night 1, we'll never know who the scummy bodyguards were and we'll be down 2 of our best scum hunters and both of our elected roles. Id prefer if our best scum hunters didn't run for election, and left their protection in the hands of the sheriff/medic. There are ways around this. Remember the elected roles know who the bodyguards are. If one is killed at night and one of them survives, we'll know who 2 of the mafia are. As long as everyone is on the ball and put some thought into their play, we'll come out on top. | ||
kingjames01
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Here's my analysis on this: Case 1) 2 x Town Bodyguard As long as one of the Bodyguards is alive, our elected officials are protected. They will not require protection before the Bodyguards are killed thus freeing a Medic to do something else. If a player dedicates themselves to protecting a Bodyguard until they die, then the elected officials are protected as well. Case 2) 1 x Town Bodyguard If the mafia kills the Town Bodyguard then the elected officials are vulnerable. However, if the elected officials are targetted we will have learned that the other Bodyguard is mafia. Not a good trade, but at least we don't come away with nothing. Case 3) 0 x Town Bodyguard Here, if either of the elected officials are killed before the Bodyguards are both lynched, we'll have confirmed mafia. | ||
kingjames01
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On January 14 2012 00:38 kitaman27 wrote: KJ's bodyguards should claim plan is incredibly poor. So is Jackal's. Even if the scum team did subsititute all three bodyguards, they still have to worry about a electoral official being a vet, which would cost them 3 scum or that one of the bodyguards wasn't jailed, which would also cost them 3 scum. First, there are only 2 Bodyguards. Second, I agree with you about Jackal's comment about lynching a Bodyguard. Third, you're actually agreeing with me in essence. I'm saying that if they sneak in a Bodyguard, it will be risky to take out the elected officials. However, to make it harder for them, they should be revealed from the beginning. What if both elected officials are killed and we have 0 clue as to who the Bodyguards were? Are you okay with that risk? Finally, are you stating for the record that if you were elected, you would not reveal your Bodyguards? | ||
kingjames01
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I'm going to reiterate, that I support the Bodyguards being made public. There was a point raised earlier which suggested that if this plan were carried through, the elected officials would be more vulnerable. I don't think that is the case. I have already stated my reasoning but here is the idea again. If at least one of the Bodyguards is Town, then they player has to die before our Mayor and/or Sheriff are vulnerable. If both Bodyguards die, everyone will be on guard and can then start to protect the elected officials. If at most one dies, then the Mayor and/or Sheriff are still safe. Why? Because the mafia will have to trade at least one of their own to kill the Mayor and/or Sheriff. Next, I think the Mass Mason Roleclaim is a terrible plan. The mafia know the roles of 10 players out of 50, namely, their own players. If all of the Masons claim, then they know the roles of more players in the game. If they can, they will target our powerful Blue roles, like Town Jack, Medic, Detective. Why are you guys okay with helping them to narrow down their targets? | ||
kingjames01
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If he uses his Mason power on Day 1 to establish his credibility and then is subsequently elected to office, we will not be able to find the mafia Jack. It is a risk, but I know that BC will take that risk. He is very much a medium-risk, high-reward player. EVERYONE! WHAT HAPPENS IF BLOODYC0BBLER IS MAFIA JACK? I consider this scenario involving BC to be within his bag of tricks, and I will not vote to elect him into office. | ||
kingjames01
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On January 13 2012 16:40 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Vote for BC, vote for accountable and vocal leadership. We should be holding BC accountable for Palmar's lynch. BC has been engaging in discussions with sandroba behind the scenes. Because of this, they have formed some sort of agreement. On January 15 2012 06:05 sandroba wrote: I'll vote BC since we came to a compromise in pms. Gotta roll. ##Vote: BloodyC0bbler I can infer that the choice to lynch Palmar was also a topic of discussion between them. We should scrutinize their relationship so that we can judge for ourselves whether BC or sandroba was the spearhead of this lynch. BloodyC0bbler: be accountable for your lynch. Summarize for us what you and sandroba have been discussing. | ||
kingjames01
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On January 16 2012 07:29 Mr. Wiggles wrote: Mr. Wiggles' Mason Circle Plan A Visual Representation Hey, because people all decided to claim mason for some reason, what do we think about making a mason circle? Let's say we have: Mason A Mason B Mason C Mason D Mason E Who I will refer to solely by letter from now on. The circle would work like this: A masons with B, B masons with C, C masons with D, D masons with E, and then E could either mason with A, or another player. This effectively creates a two way line of communication with all our masons. In other words, it creates a pseudo-mason circle. This will allow our claimed masons to talk to each other, as a group, thus increasing their effectiveness. As well, this allows the same people to talk to each other day after day, simply by switching the order of the masoning. Additionally, this solves the problem of either ignoring masons, or worrying about mafia influence through talking to masons. With this plan, each mason should be passing on each message they receive, so all information will be disseminated in the chain, and it increases the likelihood of catching any scum mason who has claimed. This plan relies chiefly, that all claimed masons will be active and diligent in passing on their PMs. If any mason is found to be active in thread, but not passing on their PMs, or having a sharp drop in activity and thus not allowing the circle to function, then we should consider them for a vig shot or lynch. Next, there is the problem of a scum mason editing the messages he receives in order to sow confusion. First, we must agree that all masons will simply copy+paste any message they receive. Next, we have several options depending on what kind of circle we use. If we have all masons mason each other, with no extra people, then we have a circle. So, each mason will simply pass his message along, with any additional text, in the same direction that his PM has been going. If he wants to respond directly to the person who PMed him, then he can send the PM in both directions. How this will work, is that everyone will always pass on each message they receive, until it reaches them again, at which time, they will compare the PM to their original and check for differences. (This program will help: http://www.sourcegear.com/diffmerge/ ) If they find any differences, then they will say so in the thread, and each mason will post their respective PM. Then, we search for the origin of the discrepancy. Scum will be hesitant to actually fake a discrepancy with their original PM, as it will essentially be trading one-for-one. Also, town has NO reason to doctor PMs they send out in the mason circle. If we have all masons mason each other, but then add in an extra person to the circle, so that it's a line with two ends, we will have to use a different method to check for sinister editing. The first is that we post all PMs publicly in the thread. This reduces the effectiveness of the circle, but is the safest method for checking that all PMs were sent in their original form and remained intact. The other method, is for the two people at each end of the line to ask questions about certain PMs. It will be unlikely that both of them are scum, and if they are, they should only remain at the end of the line for one day. If they fake editing and we kill a couple of town masons, then we'll just cull the entire circle, as again, town has NO reason to doctor PMs they send out in the mason circle, so it must mean there are multiple mafia in the circle, or the extra people added to the circle were mafia. In this form of a line, each person will either send a PM in one direction if they don't add anything to it, or in both directions if the do. This again ensures that all players in the circle receive all PMs. So, that's my plan for salvaging all the mason claims and creating a powerful tool for the town. We have two ways we can implement this. Either we go with a line, which is slightly more effective, as it allows an extra person into the circle, or we go with a circle, which is much safer. In my opinion, using the circle method is the better choice, for while the circle will be smaller, it lets us check much more easily for mafia influence, and the dissemination of information should proceed much more smoothly. This is open for discussion though. What do people think? This is not a good idea. If the players involved in the Mason chain are known, it is too easy to disrupt by the mafia. This will inject chaos into the thread which we absolutely do not need. Furthermore, if there is at least one mafia Mason in the chain, it will give the mafia even more information that they can use. They can find out about any plans being made ahead of time. This will give them time to mobilize and counter-plan. I don't support this idea at all. In fact, even with all of the claims so far, I still do not support the mass Mason claim. | ||
kingjames01
Canada1603 Posts
On January 16 2012 09:51 Jitsu wrote: Why should we have it summarized? Wouldn't posting the logs be better? Since there is discussion of all the Mason's doing it, why not have all the Mason's do it? Why was Mattchew modkilled? Maybe I misunderstood the situation. | ||
kingjames01
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Why do I think this? There was a lot of chaos during Day 1. It started out with some decent speculation and debate as to who should be elected and why. Although there were a large number of candidates, certain candidates were becoming clear leaders in the race. After BC's mason plan and claim, the environment of the thread quickly spiralled out of control. From a focussed discussion of who to elect, we observed multiple mason claims, several nonsensical posts and a drop in the useful posts-to-noise ratio. Either the level of Town play is low (which I don't believe, based on the experience of the player list involved) or the mafia arrived in earnest. At the end of the day, there was a surge in votes cementing BC as Mayor over BM, who was elected as sheriff. It is WIFOM to discuss which role is more desirable for the current mafia family so I will stop here. Instead of constantly looking for scumslips in every vote. Step back and think about the day's events. What did the players ATTEMPT to do? What did the players ACCOMPLISH? For Day 2, we ABSOLUTELY need to get back on track. There's going to be a lot of discussion I'm sure due to the night actions but don't lose sight of what we learned in Day 1. Finally, the degree to which we hold BC and BM accountable should increase! BC claimed Mason. BC proposed a mass Mason claim. BC claimed to Mason sandroba. BC and sandroba reached 'a compromise'. BC used his Mayoral right to choose the Day 1 lynch and chose Palmar. We can no longer check BC's role and/or alignment. If BC's mass Mason claim was so pro-town, what did it actually accomplish? It wasn't very well thought out. Even if he is Town-aligned, it injected so much chaos into this game, that players are struggling to keep up. Weaker mafia can slip in a few posts here and there and we'll never even notice if they mess up. BC: tell us what you think your plan accomplished? Why did you suggest a plan that inherently would cause the Town to go in circles? Also, BM previously supported my idea to reveal the Bodyguards. Do you support this proposal? Will you give up their names after the night is over? | ||
kingjames01
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On January 16 2012 10:09 Mr. Wiggles wrote: KJ, what do you propose the claimed masons do then? I don't see them being very effective right now, and how does not forming a circle stop mafia from injecting chaos into the thread, or gaining additional information? Instead, they'll just use their masons in a coordinated fashion to target as many different players as they can, while our masons will flounder due to all the confusion and chaos surrounding the role stemming from the day 1 discussion. There is no difference between my plan, and a normal PM game or game with a mason circle in it, besides that the masons have to pass on communications. Would you not support masons in a circle discussing in another game where they started in a circle, because there might be scum in it? In fact, if there's a scum in the circle, all the better, because the town members should be able to sniff them out and get them lynched. The Masons should do what Masons always do. Why should their actions and choices be dictated by someone else? Masons: pick a partner, harass them for 3 days straight and report to us if you found someone suspicious. Be smart. Make plans inside of plans and don't give up everything to your partner just because they seem pro-Town. Masons: feel free to make mistakes. Finally, who is the player that continues to suggest that Town Masons suck? Oh, that's right. BC. Instead of providing advice as a vet, he undermines their confidence in themselves. "Hey Town Masons. I know you really suck, so instead of using your roles properly, why don't you just tell us who you are? Furthermore, don't even think about hiding yourself just in case you're actually a super-experienced Town Mason. If you claim later, we'll just lynch you!" - a synopsis of BC's Mason plan Wait a second... I thought BC was supposed to be our Mayor? Why is he making it harder for the Town to protect our power roles and easier for mafia to muddy up the thread? BC has made some very bad decisions for the Town. I am undecided as to his alignment, but we should all be wary of him and compare what he proposes to what he accomplishes. | ||
kingjames01
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On January 16 2012 10:31 Mr. Wiggles wrote: Masons can only talk to someone for 1 cycle when they mason them, and never again. So, they can't harass someone for three days straight, like you want them to. The longest they can try to get information out of someone is one cycle, which is barely long at all. Making a circle lets them talk to the same people for multiple days, though. A cycle is a Day and Night. That's 3 days in real time. That's what I meant. Suppose there 10% of the players are Masons. Making a circle means that you get to talk to the same 5 people over and over. Further suppose, of the 5 players, only 1 is mafia. There are 9 more out there to find. In a 50 player game, it would be nice to have the ability to speak privately to more people over the course of the game. More discussion will give more information. More information will lead to better lynches. Masons should have been left alone to do what they're supposed to do. BC screwed it up big time. | ||
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