Would island maps really be that imbalanced?

Please don't post crap about Terrans lifting to expansions easily while the other races flounder around like headless chickens, "island map" != "only one base on your starting island". YOU CAN HAVE MORE THAN ONE BASE PER ISLAND!
Seriously there are like 20 people posting the same bullcrap on every page...

I feel as if island maps haven't been given a fair chance by mapmakers/players, perhaps largely due to the legacy of island maps in Brood War. Island maps would make for some very different gameplay, but I'm not convinced they would necessarily be imbalanced, as each race as certain advantages it can bring to the table.

Protoss:
-Warp-ins and Warp Prisms are very strong on islands, allowing reinforcements where your ground forces can't reach and harassment where the enemy army can't reach
-If the islands are close enough, blink Stalkers would be very effective and mobile
-Protoss air could be pretty viable in all matchups if you don't have to worry about dying to early rushes
-Mass Recall would be very good on island maps

Terran:
-Drop play would obviously be very powerful
-Terrans have very powerful air superiority units like the Viking and the Raven, and very powerful Air to Ground units like the Banshee and Battlecruiser
-Terrans can float their buildings to other islands (you could design the map so that you can't take expansions too easily though)
-Turrets are ridiculously powerful

Zerg:
-Has the easiest time doing massive drop play
-Queens are pretty much the best early game anti-air, and Spores are always quite powerful and very mobile
-Nydus worms allows transporting entire armies between islands
-Can build a godlike economy if they don't have to worry about early rushes

Obviously this isn't a complete list, but with all these different advantages I have a hard time telling which race would be strongest on an island map.

Of course, "island map" is just a catch-all term that could refer to all kinds of different things. You could have a map that starts of with players isolated from each other but with rocks that can be killed (I guess sort of like the Novice maps), or have straight up island maps with only main + natural on your starting island and then a main "continent" in the middle, or even have a map that starts off pretty regular but with bridges that can be destroyed to turn it into an island map (Battle Royale style, not sure if possible on a Melee map in SC2).

So, what do you guys think? What is the reason that island maps haven't been explored much? Would they be too imbalanced, and if so in who's favor? What are some things that could be done to mitigate that imbalance, or is it even worth exploring at all?

Poll: What race would be favored on an island map?

Terran (775)

77%

Zerg (93)

9%

None (it would be balanced) (79)

8%

Protoss (66)

7%

1013 total votes

Your vote: What race would be favored on an island map?

(Vote): Protoss
(Vote): Terran
(Vote): Zerg
(Vote): None (it would be balanced)

Poll: Are island maps worth experimenting with?

Yes (626)

52%

No, because they would be imbalanced (374)

31%

No, because they would be boring to watch/play on (141)

12%

No, because they would be too different from regular gameplay (62)

5%

1203 total votes

Your vote: Are island maps worth experimenting with?

(Vote): Yes
(Vote): No, because they would be imbalanced
(Vote): No, because they would be boring to watch/play on
(Vote): No, because they would be too different from regular gameplay

Last edit: 2011-08-29 12:26:40

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Slakter Sweden. August 28 2011 13:56. Posts 1845

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Doesnt matter if it´s balanced or not, playing and watching island maps are less enjoyable than ramming a knife into my nose.

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Rasun United States. August 28 2011 13:58. Posts 787

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I have always kind of wondered if Island maps would be viable in SC2. They create really fun and interesting games, and are just so different that I think it would be awesome to see such a alternative to regular maps. Cool topic, want to see what people think.

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AndreiDaGiant United States. August 28 2011 13:58. Posts 393

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i would like to see it just cuz i never saw it in SC2 0.0

Terran Metal for the Win

Chocolate United States. August 28 2011 13:59. Posts 1473

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Imo terran would be super imba
1. OC lets you get more income than usual on one base, bigger deal when it is harder to expo.
2. Medivacs are insanely good.
3. Vikings are insanely good against the other races' drop ships
4. Terrans might figure out that if they spam turrets, especially with both building upgrades, they would be nigh unbeatable against toss.

Alzadar Canada. August 28 2011 14:00. Posts 980

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On August 28 2011 13:56 Slakter wrote:
Doesnt matter if it´s balanced or not, playing and watching island maps are less enjoyable than ramming a knife into my nose.

Be honest now, how many games have you played or watched on an island map?

If more than zero, was it an island map designed by Blizzard, or by professional map makers?

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lachy89 Australia. August 28 2011 14:01. Posts 256

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Terran will be able to fast expand really easier and load up 5 scvs to another island and get a huge economical lead.

Also Island maps are boring.

Slakter Sweden. August 28 2011 14:03. Posts 1845

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On August 28 2011 14:00 Alzadar wrote:

Show nested quote +

Be honest now, how many games have you played or watched on an island map?

If more than zero, was it an island map designed by Blizzard, or by professional map makers?

Way too many.

Stagedives make me feel more alive than coded messages in slowed down songs

GTPGlitch August 28 2011 14:03. Posts 2091

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why are people saying terran are gonna be imba lol

Terran drops are just as vulnerable as everyone elses, and interceptor air units are slower TT'

Phoenixes do bonus to medivacs, mutas are just good AA because of bounce, vikings are just average...

and zerg have corruptors. g_g

Jo Byung Se #1 fan

Alzadar Canada. August 28 2011 14:04. Posts 980

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On August 28 2011 13:59 Chocolate wrote:
Imo terran would be super imba
1. OC lets you get more income than usual on one base, bigger deal when it is harder to expo.
2. Medivacs are insanely good.
3. Vikings are insanely good against the other races' drop ships
4. Terrans might figure out that if they spam turrets, especially with both building upgrades, they would be nigh unbeatable against toss.

1. Islands doesn't necessarily mean there's no natural on your starting island.
2. Can't argue with that, but given that it's an island, shouldn't the other player be more prepared for drop play?
3. True enough, although it's not like Phoenix and Mutalisks can't shut down enemy drops just as well (perhaps better due to their far superior mobility).
4. There are ways you could design the map to prevent abuse. For example, large areas on islands where you can't build anything, meaning it would take actual units to prevent drops there. You could also have islands be close enough that turrets could be killed with Colosuss or blink.

"Don't eyefuck me, I'm dying here!" -Day9

ArtemisKnives United States. August 28 2011 14:04. Posts 204

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Terran would be retardedly OP with command center first every game. Zerg would be screwed going lair tech to be able to nydus, or OL drop to another island. Protoss same boat going robo. Terran skipping gas and taking 3 bases and lolling.

Would never work.

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antilyon Brazil. August 28 2011 14:07. Posts 2487

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You forgot about Infestors, Infestor deal ridiculously well with most of air play.

Alzadar Canada. August 28 2011 14:10. Posts 980

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On August 28 2011 14:04 Frozne wrote:
Terran would be retardedly OP with command center first every game. Zerg would be screwed going lair tech to be able to nydus, or OL drop to another island. Protoss same boat going robo. Terran skipping gas and taking 3 bases and lolling.

Would never work.

Did you read my OP or any of my responses? An island map doesn't HAVE to be just one base on your starting island, that would obviously be terrible for Zerg. I'm not sure you could hold 2 seperate islands (and certainly not 3!) against Void Ray aggression either, since you'd have to divide your defenses between them. Warp Prism 4-Gate would also be powerful.

Last edit: 2011-08-28 14:11:29

"Don't eyefuck me, I'm dying here!" -Day9

neobowman Canada. August 28 2011 14:10. Posts 2862

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The thing is that theorycrafting like this will never work. Until you see how things work out in game, nothing is certain. But because there will almost certainly be some sort of imbalance, no tournament would be willing to try it since the players would be against it, and because no top players are interested, no high level testing will occur.

One thing, Terran lifting to gold to start the game is a viable option. So you'd need destructibles on golds if you have any.

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StarStruck August 28 2011 14:11. Posts 18314

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While infestors would work well, as far as zerg air units and hydras go. It would be almost as dreadful as watching island maps in Brood War.

Pretty sure that would get someone like IdrA to switch races.

Last edit: 2011-08-28 14:11:31

Chocolate United States. August 28 2011 14:11. Posts 1473

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Alzadar, why don't you make a good island map and we can try it out?

iGrok United States. August 28 2011 14:11. Posts 4218

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Goddamnit, use the search bar. This has been discussed forever. No.

Theovide Sweden. August 28 2011 14:11. Posts 912

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I've tried playing on Island maps, never quite competitively though, and it was insanely boring. Hopefully Island maps will never be implented in any form of competitive play, if it would be balanced or not, I don't know and I don't really care either

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sekritzzz August 28 2011 14:12. Posts 1256

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There simply is no way to penetrate a terrans base with turrets lol. I have experimented in bronze league a year ago. Trust me it does not work.

Sm3agol United States. August 28 2011 14:12. Posts 2005

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On August 28 2011 13:59 Chocolate wrote:
4. Terrans might figure out that if they spam turrets, especially with both building upgrades, they would be nigh unbeatable against toss.

On August 28 2011 14:12 sekritzzz wrote:
There simply is no way to penetrate a terrans base with turrets lol. I have experimented in bronze league a year ago. Trust me it does not work.

Carriers. Broodlords. Sure, you could hold both off for a while, but you can only turtle that hard for so long.

Terran would be ridiculously op though. Triple CC first, loading up 5 scvs per trip. They'd have three bases up by the time zerg or toss would even be able to expand. Add in the fact that turrets are dirt cheap for early defense and marines are the best anti-air in the game and T would would easily dominate. Toss and zerg just aren't as flexible as T.

Last edit: 2011-08-28 14:13:13