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| firehand101 Australia. November 01 2011 18:24. Posts 3000 | Profile Blog # |
| I cant believe cruncher is retiring, wtf when did this happen? |
| | The opinions expressed by our users do not reflect the official position of TeamLiquid.net or its staff. |
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| m0ck November 01 2011 18:24. Posts 3326 | Profile Blog # |
| As a place to discuss featured and, I presume, de-featured players it would be helpful if you would include the list of recently de-featured players in the op. Last edit: 2011-11-01 18:25:16 |
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| Torte de Lini Canada. November 01 2011 18:26. Posts 27345 | Profile Blog # |
Why is Attero defeatured? He's been a driving member and great player since the beta (from random to Protoss). He's not "known", but he was just on complexity's "The V" for 4 weeks straight (still the current winner until next week is a new opponent against him), he's been on Kings of Tin, he attends all the MLG's (championship bracket back in Anaheim beating Jinro for instance), qualified for IEM NY (and just got invited to a tournament I can't mention yet), in NASL's Semi-Open, etc.
He was both popular and skilled (consistent high results, 200 to 300 viewers), has a Q&A after each streaming session and participates heavily in weekly tournaments and commentates MSI tournaments and WCG Canada with Chill. His GM ranking ranged from 20 to 50 (for 2 seasons, tomorrow he will be GM again) and he still offers coaching to many players while being a recognizable person amongst many of the professionals (unfortunately his public fame isn't the same as iNcontrol or idra for some odd reason, despite playing both of EG's crew regularly on ladder [and winning]).
He uploads all his replays from his ladder matches in his topic: Road to Rank 1 Grandmaster: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=222609.
So we have: interactivity (he talks during his games, give the viewers what's going on in the mindset of the opponent and himself), popularity (200-300 is still pretty good for someone most people don't recognize right off the bat), consistent tournament plays (almost always losing to only Koreans) and defeating high-level professionals, participant in major LAN tournaments (MLG, IEM, WCG), offers reasonable coaching, active in his topic and easy resource for great Protoss replays against the many pros you hear casted a lot. Great community member with casting, guest appearances on various shows and entertaining showmatches.
Did I mention he's been doing this since the beta? Same team as HuK (VT Gaming), he recruited him, jeez. He got second, only losing to Kiwikaki (a good friend and practice partner for him) in WCG of Canada (2011)
He's probably the few streamers I watch in addition to HuK, HerO and Snute. He streams nearly everyday.
+ Show Spoiler [Tournament Results] + * Winner of Go4SC2 #37, #44, #48, #70 & Monthly Final #06 [7]
* Second place of Go4SC2 #15, #16, #20 [8]
* Second place in Justin.tv Invitational #2 [9]
* Winner of 2 US Craft Cups [10]
* Winner of N'fusion LAN June 2011 [11]
* Qualified for IEM Americas Cup (Defeated EG's iNcontroL, Col's Cruncher, FXO's Drewbie and Fnatic's Kawaiirice)
* Top 16 Seed for Qualifications at the Intel Extreme Masters NA/SA Qualifier (2011) [12]
* Shared Third place with ROOTSlush at LAN ETS 2011 [13]
* Ranked 20th Grandmaster with 1644 points and 468 wins out of 713 games (65.64%)
* Ranked 37th Grandmaster with 1335 points and 306 wins out of 456 games (67.11%)
* Semi-Finals in the StarCraft II Go4SC2 IEM NYC Qualifier #1 (defeating Fnatic's TT1) [14]
* Championship Bracket (2-1) at MLG Anaheim 2011 (defeating players such as Complexity's Stalife, RSVP, GGLastshadow, Liquid Jinro and InkA!), defeated by ThisIsJimmy [15]
* Participation at It's Gosu Invitational #1 (defeating Empire Beastyqt, FXO Optikzero) [16]
* Third place in Skyzo Cup #4 [17]
* Participation at MLG Raleigh 2011 [18]
* Third place in the TeamSpeak TL SC2 Open #22 (defeated by Zenex's Yong) [19]
* First place in Complexity's Week #25 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Reign's Spades (score: 4-3) [20]
* First place in Complexity's Week #26 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Complexity's Trimaster (score: 4-1) [21]
* First place in Complexity's Week #27 Showmatch: "The V" vs. It's Gosu's Ostojiy (score: 4-3) [22]
* First place in Complexity's Week #28 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Lizzuma(score: 4-1) [23]
* Second place in the StarCraft II Go4SC2 IEM NYC Qualifier #2 (defeating Fnatic's TT1) [24] [25]
* Qualified for the Intel Extreme Master's New York Comic Con event(defeating Fnatic's TT1) [26]
* Second place in the Xilence Cup #11 [27]
* Participation at Intel Extreme Master's - New-York [28]
* Participation in the FXOpen International KOTH #10 [29]
Really don't know why he isn't featured besides his namesake not ringing maybe a few bells to some.Last edit: 2011-11-01 18:54:09 |
| | https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini) | |
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 France. November 01 2011 18:26. Posts 14476 | Profile Blog # |
I really believe Rainbow should still be featured. Great player, ex BW pro (reaver god on top of that), streams all the time in very good quality, etc. Also very funny and interacts a lot with the community. Guy can play so many different styles so well it's always a treat to watch.
I believe he just qualified for Code A too? (not sure)
TSL.Plot and Choya should definitely be there too. These guys are sick good.Last edit: 2011-11-01 18:28:59 |
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| Trump United States. November 01 2011 18:33. Posts 303 | Profile # |
| (Edit: There was an error in the stream. Everything is okay as usual! Thanks teamliquid!) Last edit: 2011-11-01 19:14:39 |
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 Heyoka Administrator November 01 2011 18:50. | Profile Blog # |
On November 01 2011 18:24 firehand101 wrote:
I cant believe cruncher is retiring, wtf when did this happen?
About a month ago |
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| ProTech November 01 2011 18:54. Posts 238 | Profile # |
I'm pretty much the only 2v2 stream that TL had. 2v2 isn't nearly as popular as 1v1, so gaining the viewership required to become featured again is nearly impossible, however the whole reason I got featured in the first place as per whoever featured me was because of the diversity.
But, if it's an absolute must to meet those requirements then i'll do my best! |
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| lozertuser November 01 2011 18:57. Posts 1 | Profile # |
I believe that Trump and ProTech should both be re-featured. Those are two of three people that I come and watch as much as I can. Trump is a very interesting watch as he talks mostly about his play choices and he, as a player, is very well mannered, and honestly I can think of no one better to have a spot in the featured list for 1v1 terran play than him.
ProTech is the ONLY person that I see that does 2v2 in a professional level of gaming. Just for this I believe he should be re-featured. He is a very talented player who dedicates a lot of his day to playing the game and streaming to the viewers while taking time after games to explain what happened, rage at his allies and the opponents, and how it could have gone better. I'm sure if more tournaments made themselves available in the 2v2 world, he would be entering them.
Take both as a consideration, I believe they are worthy of the list, and I'm not really sure I understand the reasoning why the list was truncated in the first place. |
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| akaMadMike Norway. November 01 2011 19:06. Posts 87 | Profile # |
I also agrees that Protech should be featured. I know most hardcore SC2 fans only care for 1v1 skill etc, but there is alot of us who mainly play and care for teamgames. See protech coach others in 2v2 or rip trough master team after master team is just pure joy to watch. He also won the PTSL season 2. He is also communicationg alot with his vewiers and often plays with them.
Hope this will be taken into consideration for the next review of the featured list. Last edit: 2011-11-01 19:07:27 |
| | I know i was born and I know that I’ll die – the in between is mine! |
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| Hiwashi United States. November 01 2011 19:10. Posts 36 | Profile # |
I also agree with Trump being re-featured. He may not be ( yet ) at the level of some of the other featured Terrans, but I learn more from his stream then all the others together, I find myself turning down streamers from Polt, Jinro, Demuslim, and TLO every time that his stream is online.
Its really easy to find replays or VoDs of "pros", there is the GSL, MLG and a lot of other sources of "first hand" gameplay footage, but none of them bring the friendly-insightful-learning from your own mistakes type of thing that Trump does, and the fact that he is the only Terran players that REALLY interacts with his viewers.
I reached Diamond a few weeks ago as Terran, and watching Trump had a HUGE impact on it. Please consider featuring him again. |
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| KrazyTrumpet United States. November 01 2011 19:15. Posts 933 | Profile # |
| I would honestly like to see the Featured section be a rotating list of people every couple weeks to get everyone some more exposure. |
| | www.twitch.tv/krazytrumpeter05 Best Stream Quality NA |
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 Hot_Bid Administrator November 01 2011 19:16. | Profile Blog # |
On November 01 2011 18:26 Torte de Lini wrote:Why is Attero defeatured? He's been a driving member and great player since the beta (from random to Protoss). He's not "known", but he was just on complexity's "The V" for 4 weeks straight (still the current winner until next week is a new opponent against him), he's been on Kings of Tin, he attends all the MLG's (championship bracket back in Anaheim beating Jinro for instance), qualified for IEM NY (and just got invited to a tournament I can't mention yet), in NASL's Semi-Open, etc. He was both popular and skilled (consistent high results, 200 to 300 viewers), has a Q&A after each streaming session and participates heavily in weekly tournaments and commentates MSI tournaments and WCG Canada with Chill. His GM ranking ranged from 20 to 50 (for 2 seasons, tomorrow he will be GM again) and he still offers coaching to many players while being a recognizable person amongst many of the professionals (unfortunately his public fame isn't the same as iNcontrol or idra for some odd reason, despite playing both of EG's crew regularly on ladder [and winning]). He uploads all his replays from his ladder matches in his topic: Road to Rank 1 Grandmaster: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=222609. So we have: interactivity (he talks during his games, give the viewers what's going on in the mindset of the opponent and himself), popularity (200-300 is still pretty good for someone most people don't recognize right off the bat), consistent tournament plays (almost always losing to only Koreans) and defeating high-level professionals, participant in major LAN tournaments (MLG, IEM, WCG), offers reasonable coaching, active in his topic and easy resource for great Protoss replays against the many pros you hear casted a lot. Great community member with casting, guest appearances on various shows and entertaining showmatches. Did I mention he's been doing this since the beta? Same team as HuK (VT Gaming), he recruited him, jeez. He got second, only losing to Kiwikaki (a good friend and practice partner for him) in WCG of Canada (2011) He's probably the few streamers I watch in addition to HuK, HerO and Snute. He streams nearly everyday. + Show Spoiler [Tournament Results] + * Winner of Go4SC2 #37, #44, #48, #70 & Monthly Final #06 [7]
* Second place of Go4SC2 #15, #16, #20 [8]
* Second place in Justin.tv Invitational #2 [9]
* Winner of 2 US Craft Cups [10]
* Winner of N'fusion LAN June 2011 [11]
* Qualified for IEM Americas Cup (Defeated EG's iNcontroL, Col's Cruncher, FXO's Drewbie and Fnatic's Kawaiirice)
* Top 16 Seed for Qualifications at the Intel Extreme Masters NA/SA Qualifier (2011) [12]
* Shared Third place with ROOTSlush at LAN ETS 2011 [13]
* Ranked 20th Grandmaster with 1644 points and 468 wins out of 713 games (65.64%)
* Ranked 37th Grandmaster with 1335 points and 306 wins out of 456 games (67.11%)
* Semi-Finals in the StarCraft II Go4SC2 IEM NYC Qualifier #1 (defeating Fnatic's TT1) [14]
* Championship Bracket (2-1) at MLG Anaheim 2011 (defeating players such as Complexity's Stalife, RSVP, GGLastshadow, Liquid Jinro and InkA!), defeated by ThisIsJimmy [15]
* Participation at It's Gosu Invitational #1 (defeating Empire Beastyqt, FXO Optikzero) [16]
* Third place in Skyzo Cup #4 [17]
* Participation at MLG Raleigh 2011 [18]
* Third place in the TeamSpeak TL SC2 Open #22 (defeated by Zenex's Yong) [19]
* First place in Complexity's Week #25 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Reign's Spades (score: 4-3) [20]
* First place in Complexity's Week #26 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Complexity's Trimaster (score: 4-1) [21]
* First place in Complexity's Week #27 Showmatch: "The V" vs. It's Gosu's Ostojiy (score: 4-3) [22]
* First place in Complexity's Week #28 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Lizzuma(score: 4-1) [23]
* Second place in the StarCraft II Go4SC2 IEM NYC Qualifier #2 (defeating Fnatic's TT1) [24] [25]
* Qualified for the Intel Extreme Master's New York Comic Con event(defeating Fnatic's TT1) [26]
* Second place in the Xilence Cup #11 [27]
* Participation at Intel Extreme Master's - New-York [28]
* Participation in the FXOpen International KOTH #10 [29] Really don't know why he isn't featured besides his namesake not ringing maybe a few bells to some.
Attero was defeatured due to low viewer count. He averaged 150 viewers over 96 hours in the last two months. Had he averaged 300 like you said, he would not have been defeatured.
Last edit: 2011-11-01 19:16:48 |
| | @Hot_Bid on Twitter - ESPORTS life since 2010 - http://i.imgur.com/U2psw.png |
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| Torte de Lini Canada. November 01 2011 19:23. Posts 27345 | Profile Blog # |
On November 01 2011 19:16 Hot_Bid wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 18:26 Torte de Lini wrote:Why is Attero defeatured? He's been a driving member and great player since the beta (from random to Protoss). He's not "known", but he was just on complexity's "The V" for 4 weeks straight (still the current winner until next week is a new opponent against him), he's been on Kings of Tin, he attends all the MLG's (championship bracket back in Anaheim beating Jinro for instance), qualified for IEM NY (and just got invited to a tournament I can't mention yet), in NASL's Semi-Open, etc. He was both popular and skilled (consistent high results, 200 to 300 viewers), has a Q&A after each streaming session and participates heavily in weekly tournaments and commentates MSI tournaments and WCG Canada with Chill. His GM ranking ranged from 20 to 50 (for 2 seasons, tomorrow he will be GM again) and he still offers coaching to many players while being a recognizable person amongst many of the professionals (unfortunately his public fame isn't the same as iNcontrol or idra for some odd reason, despite playing both of EG's crew regularly on ladder [and winning]). He uploads all his replays from his ladder matches in his topic: Road to Rank 1 Grandmaster: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=222609. So we have: interactivity (he talks during his games, give the viewers what's going on in the mindset of the opponent and himself), popularity (200-300 is still pretty good for someone most people don't recognize right off the bat), consistent tournament plays (almost always losing to only Koreans) and defeating high-level professionals, participant in major LAN tournaments (MLG, IEM, WCG), offers reasonable coaching, active in his topic and easy resource for great Protoss replays against the many pros you hear casted a lot. Great community member with casting, guest appearances on various shows and entertaining showmatches. Did I mention he's been doing this since the beta? Same team as HuK (VT Gaming), he recruited him, jeez. He got second, only losing to Kiwikaki (a good friend and practice partner for him) in WCG of Canada (2011) He's probably the few streamers I watch in addition to HuK, HerO and Snute. He streams nearly everyday. + Show Spoiler [Tournament Results] + * Winner of Go4SC2 #37, #44, #48, #70 & Monthly Final #06 [7]
* Second place of Go4SC2 #15, #16, #20 [8]
* Second place in Justin.tv Invitational #2 [9]
* Winner of 2 US Craft Cups [10]
* Winner of N'fusion LAN June 2011 [11]
* Qualified for IEM Americas Cup (Defeated EG's iNcontroL, Col's Cruncher, FXO's Drewbie and Fnatic's Kawaiirice)
* Top 16 Seed for Qualifications at the Intel Extreme Masters NA/SA Qualifier (2011) [12]
* Shared Third place with ROOTSlush at LAN ETS 2011 [13]
* Ranked 20th Grandmaster with 1644 points and 468 wins out of 713 games (65.64%)
* Ranked 37th Grandmaster with 1335 points and 306 wins out of 456 games (67.11%)
* Semi-Finals in the StarCraft II Go4SC2 IEM NYC Qualifier #1 (defeating Fnatic's TT1) [14]
* Championship Bracket (2-1) at MLG Anaheim 2011 (defeating players such as Complexity's Stalife, RSVP, GGLastshadow, Liquid Jinro and InkA!), defeated by ThisIsJimmy [15]
* Participation at It's Gosu Invitational #1 (defeating Empire Beastyqt, FXO Optikzero) [16]
* Third place in Skyzo Cup #4 [17]
* Participation at MLG Raleigh 2011 [18]
* Third place in the TeamSpeak TL SC2 Open #22 (defeated by Zenex's Yong) [19]
* First place in Complexity's Week #25 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Reign's Spades (score: 4-3) [20]
* First place in Complexity's Week #26 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Complexity's Trimaster (score: 4-1) [21]
* First place in Complexity's Week #27 Showmatch: "The V" vs. It's Gosu's Ostojiy (score: 4-3) [22]
* First place in Complexity's Week #28 Showmatch: "The V" vs. Lizzuma(score: 4-1) [23]
* Second place in the StarCraft II Go4SC2 IEM NYC Qualifier #2 (defeating Fnatic's TT1) [24] [25]
* Qualified for the Intel Extreme Master's New York Comic Con event(defeating Fnatic's TT1) [26]
* Second place in the Xilence Cup #11 [27]
* Participation at Intel Extreme Master's - New-York [28]
* Participation in the FXOpen International KOTH #10 [29] Really don't know why he isn't featured besides his namesake not ringing maybe a few bells to some.
Attero was defeatured due to low viewer count. He averaged 150 viewers over 96 hours in the last two months. Had he averaged 300 like you said, he would not have been defeatured.
In another example, a player like dignitas.Killer may not average many viewers but his skill level and notability (good tournament performances in recent months, Dignitas member) justifies a position as well.
There's a bit of irony here: he's beaten d.Killer before several times [and vice-versa to be fair]
Regardless of potentially low viewer-count (sometimes he'd stream early in the morning, so there may be less viewers on average at that time, I don't know. TL and him have the numbers of course).
After all that I named, why was he defeatured? He has above-average results, good participation, in offline and online tournaments, been a member of previously famed teams (VT Gaming).
Just lacks the viewer count apparently (Whenever I check, it's 200 to 300 at least, I think he had 900 recently at one point). But everything else seems to be in check overall. Everything else minus the viewer count seems to be rather good.
I'm also now confused on what the featured section is for. What is its intent? Is it a reward or a way to promote? The system is a bit odd as it continues to keep people afloat and push down those up and coming. It's like the MLG bracket where those who did well once or a few times remain in pool play while really great players are stuck fighting the herd in the open brackets.
edit: I get there is a discrepancy and personal selection sort of way. Where one person could be defeatured for one reason and another remains featured for the same reason despite the other components not even close to being on par, but I just feel the system is too rewarding to those who are already comfortably at the top or, in essence, paid for their professional contribution. The big-named pros already get plenty of exposure with featured articles, showmatches, casted games during major tournaments, invites to those very same major tournaments. Why give them even more exposure and advertising when they can do that with their 1,000+ followers or Facebook status or whatever. Why give them another outlet to shine when they're already given so much attention.Last edit: 2011-11-01 19:30:47 |
| | https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini) | |
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| AIOL! France. November 01 2011 19:28. Posts 896 | Profile # |
I desagree with mostly 4 of your defeatured streamers : sYz, Snute, Deathangel and Phoenyx.
I don't understand since deathangel and sYz are verry good and achieved a lot in online cups, they are easily top10 zerg EU at the moment. Also deathangel is verry funny and always complaining about someone else who streams, who has 1k viewers, saying "i never loose to him and i got 5 times less viewers wtf ?"
Today you show that he is right, the system is biased, how do you want they have viewers if they are not featured.
Also i really don't understand why you defeatures snute since he's verry good, he teaches verry well while he's playing. He streams almost everyday with quite a lot of success, he's between 200 and 500 viewers most of the time (at the beginning he was 100 and he had success with the time because he was a regular good teching zerg featured streamer.)
So please re feature those 3 guys at least cause i'm a sad zergling now. (why do have i to watch destiny only wtf !)
At least for sYz who is really really good (i don't see som1 better in the ban list), just behind Stephano, Nerchio, Ret, Morrow, Dimaga, Lalush... Yeah he is top7. And also he has a verry good music taste, even better than stephano's one (i dont think it matters but i mention it cause it's prety rare among the progamers who mostly listen to kpop  )Last edit: 2011-11-01 19:38:20 |
| | Stephano!!!!!!/Nerchio/Mana/Hasuobs/Grubby/Kas/Tarson/Sarens/Goody/BeastyCury |
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| grs Germany. November 01 2011 19:29. Posts 1453 | Profile Blog # |
I also think this is way to strict. How will a player like Protech or Attero, who does not win big tournaments ever have a chance to become featured again? Their viewer numbers will only dwindle if they are not featured. Protech is just streaming now with 400+ viewers while GSL is running. How will he keep these numbers or even improve them if he is defeatured? Where is the advantage of having only 1 featured stream up atm?
Also, where is TB/Shoutcraft? I neither find him on the featured not on the defeatured list. |
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| ApolloSC2 United Kingdom. November 01 2011 19:29. Posts 672 | Profile Blog # |
yay thanks for adding me! I am moving to Sweden in January so ill be streaming constantly from there!! As most of you know, I am currently living at home in Wales, United Kingdom with a 2down 0.3upload internet, maxed out!
+ I do, do some events from dignitas office on my account also, so thank you! |
| | www.twitter.com/apollosc2 |
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| JerKy Korea (South). November 01 2011 19:32. Posts 1968 | Profile Blog # |
On November 01 2011 19:06 akaMadMike wrote:
I also agrees that Protech should be featured. I know most hardcore SC2 fans only care for 1v1 skill etc, but there is alot of us who mainly play and care for teamgames. See protech coach others in 2v2 or rip trough master team after master team is just pure joy to watch. He also won the PTSL season 2. He is also communicationg alot with his vewiers and often plays with them.
Hope this will be taken into consideration for the next review of the featured list.
But at the same time, if you really want to watch ProTech, Trump, etc you can always go find them and watch them
You also have to consider there are other people (such as myself) that dislike seeing Protech (or other streamers) on the featured list. Sometimes we win, sometimes we lose |
| | You can type "StarCraft" with just your left hand. |
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| Torte de Lini Canada. November 01 2011 19:35. Posts 27345 | Profile Blog # |
On November 01 2011 19:32 JerKy wrote:
Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 19:06 akaMadMike wrote:
I also agrees that Protech should be featured. I know most hardcore SC2 fans only care for 1v1 skill etc, but there is alot of us who mainly play and care for teamgames. See protech coach others in 2v2 or rip trough master team after master team is just pure joy to watch. He also won the PTSL season 2. He is also communicationg alot with his vewiers and often plays with them.
Hope this will be taken into consideration for the next review of the featured list.
But at the same time, if you really want to watch ProTech, Trump, etc you can always go find them and watch them You also have to consider there are other people (such as myself) that dislike seeing Protech (or other streamers) on the featured list. Sometimes we win, sometimes we lose
Not watching someone is easy, regardless if they're featured or not.
Finding out if someone is streaming isn't as easy as avoiding their stream. It does put the obligation to advertise your stream more onto the streamer, but it also inconveniences viewers who aren't active online as much as they would like to be (And thus aren't monitoring stream threads, facebook, twitter, etc.).
Whether you think someone deserves or doesn't deserve to be featured is obviously up for debate :B |
| | https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini) | |
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| AwfulPlayer November 01 2011 19:39. Posts 226 | Profile # |
On November 01 2011 18:57 lozertuser wrote:
I believe that Trump and ProTech should both be re-featured.
trump is still featured in the "other" list. yay <3
edit: i love the race icon in the stream list shown directly in the sidebar. finally you don't have to guess anymore. i suggest a random dice icon for the random players tho instead of showing the 3 race icons.Last edit: 2011-11-01 19:43:59 |
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