[NASL] Sunday Showdown - IdrA vs Alive

On February 14 2012 05:53 Full.tilt wrote:
Idra just made EGAlex look like a complete idiot. http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=295222 Nice blog Alex.

If Alex is to retain any credibility, he has to punish IdrA for this. That's all there is to it. Like Alex clearly defined in the blog post, IdrA crossed the line between being BM and actually ruining the show for the fans.

p1cKLes United States. February 14 2012 06:05. Posts 339

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Obviously, it shows poor sportsman ship. I’ve never been a big fan of Idra’s unstable attitude, but I love is game and it’s hard not to. Though on some level you have to accept Idra for Idra. He has moments where his emotions get the best of him, because he takes it extremely serious, but it doesn’t mean he’s a bad guy. Some of the greatest guys I know where their feelings on their sleeve and have a hard time controlling them. The problem we run into like any celebrity so to speak is we only see the negative, because it sells. It makes headlines.

Though in general I think Idra is his own worst enemy. When he’s feeling it, he’s unstoppable, but most of the time he can’t get out of his head. He overanalyzes every situation and takes everything way to serious, which ends up in bad game play for Idra.

If I could recommend one thing for Idra (not that he will see this post or even listen to it) is something that I took from a really good quarterback who’s on the verge of going pro. He wears a rubber band around his wrist and he’s trained his mind through repetition and muscle memory that every time he’s done with a play, good or bad, he snaps the rubber band against his wrist to start to remind himself that this is a new play. That he forgets everything that went wrong in the last play and that this is a clean slate where he is ready to make that game winning play.

I asked him if it worked and he said at first it was awkward and people looked at him funny, but after the 50 time of doing it…his mind was so engrained that after he snapped that rubber band he forgot everything that went bad and played every play like it was going to be the game winner.

I think he actually got the idea from another quarterback, but I can’t remember who it was.

I think idra would benefit from this immensely!

paschl Germany. February 14 2012 06:05. Posts 500

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at this point idra is just an overhyped crybaby that doesnt deserve half the attention hes getting.
someone should sign him up for the real world show, thats clearly where his talent lies.

theJob February 14 2012 06:06. Posts 264

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On February 14 2012 06:01 Snotling wrote:
nobody is banning him, but the will think twice before they invite him to a showmacht again. not the same ting. and totally justified

Well, it seems like that you can choose to play the showmatch without sixpooling and everything is fine.
But if you choose to sixpool you have to give up the pricemoney for NASL to consider inviting you to a future event.

This should be in the rulebook so that no missunderstandings occur in the future.

Last edit: 2012-02-14 06:08:29

Winners train. Loosers complain.

Noocta France. February 14 2012 06:07. Posts 8618

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So, i missed the whole thing.
Can someone resume everygame, even very briefly ? ( from the thread, i guess that wont be long to write )

There are no secrets to success. It is the result of preparation, hard work, and learning from failure.

bdair2002 Israel. February 14 2012 06:09. Posts 51

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On February 14 2012 06:03 liberal wrote:

Show nested quote +

Exactly my thoughts. Idra is to blame for the BM, but if I'm asking myself who ruined the showmatch, it started with alive. No one cares at all that alive cheesed the first two games, when Idra was trying to provide a good showmatch? Idra probably just quit caring after the first two games, but we still shouldn't make a standard of assuming a person's intentions based on their play.

DRG, leenock, nestea would lose to aLive cheese? No, and they would deliver an epic games

No, wait, let me ask it again,

Catz, Destiny, Dimaga would lose to aLive cheese? No and they would deliver an excellent games

wait..

HappyZergling would to lose to that? I think Not aswell, and he probably would deliver a very good game

Idra would lose? ofc he would, no question needed.

I think you got the idea.

bonifaceviii Canada. February 14 2012 06:10. Posts 2840

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On February 14 2012 05:18 Durp wrote:
This series reminds me of GSL Open Season 1.

hahahaha

But seriously, Incontrol or Alex needs to comment on this.

Stay a while and listen || http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=354018

str10_hurts Netherlands. February 14 2012 06:10. Posts 3

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Sheth and Khaldor are the clear winners of this match.

Epic quote from Sheth:

Please let it be a macro game, I want to learn.

And even if Idra wanted to just go for the quick 100, its a show match do something else crazy but not sixpool to get it over with. Hatch in aLive his base would take him 1 min longer to die, but at least I would have enjoyed that game.

Snotling Germany. February 14 2012 06:11. Posts 399

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On February 14 2012 06:06 theJob wrote:

Show nested quote +

really? even idra doesnt defend his actions (as we can se by him giving back the money). why do you?

Last edit: 2012-02-14 06:11:50

00Visor February 14 2012 06:12. Posts 4067

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On February 14 2012 06:03 liberal wrote:

Show nested quote +

This is pathetic. alive played to win, like he should.
Second game wasnt really cheese. alive had 2 bases up and constantly produced scvs. If Idra would have actually scouted and got his wall up, alive wouldnt have been behind too much. He could have denied Idras third for quite some time and Hellions were still useful against Idras many lings. Sheth pointed out how Idra could have defend better, but Idra just amoved his drones into the hellions.

dani` Netherlands. February 14 2012 06:13. Posts 2151

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On February 14 2012 06:03 liberal wrote:

Show nested quote +

Exactly my thoughts. Idra is to blame for the BM, but if I'm asking myself who ruined the showmatch, it started with alive. No one cares at all that alive cheesed the first two games, when Idra was trying to provide a good showmatch? Idra probably just quit caring after the first two games, but we still shouldn't make a standard of assuming a person's intentions based on their play.

You don't try to provide a good showmatch by not GG'ing and throwing 2 games. Stop this ridiculous defense. aLive was using strategies which work wonders against IdrA, it would be stupid if he wouldn't have used them. You can even argue it's not 'cheese' vs IdrA, i.e. a coin flip. It's a strategy which works 80% of the time vs him if not more, and if it doesn't the game goes on because you will deal massive damage either way. aLive made the right choice, IdrA failed to defend and as usual doesn't show manner. The term 'showmatch' shouldn't be taken literally anyway, everybody just does whatever is needed to win. Except for IdrA I suppose.

Arnstein February 14 2012 06:14. Posts 2606

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After watching the games all I can do is LOL! HAHA

rsol in response to the dragoon voice being heard in SCII: dragoon ai reaches new lows: wanders into wrong game

Bellygareth France. February 14 2012 06:15. Posts 493

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On February 14 2012 06:11 Snotling wrote:

Show nested quote +

really? even idra doesnt defend his actions (as we can se by him giving back the money). why do you?

Because in this thread most people deal in superlatives and are hating way much than what it should be. I hate pitchforks and torches...

On February 14 2012 06:13 dani` wrote:

Show nested quote +

So it's ok to cheese in a showmatch if you're going to win? So if Idra had won the two 6 pool it would have been ok?

If you're not winning after a cheese then you'll get banned. Cool. This thread should focus on why not gging is unsportsmanlike. Not in the way Idra Lost.

Last edit: 2012-02-14 06:19:42

liberal February 14 2012 06:15. Posts 1116

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On February 14 2012 06:00 Stiluz wrote:
When Alive cheeses it's clever play to get into IdrA's head, when IdrA cheeses it's bad sportsmanship... Wtf Xeris?

Pretty much sums up my thoughts. If the 6pools somehow won we wouldn't even be having this conversation at all, right? So all that matters is the results?

Kich United States. February 14 2012 06:15. Posts 338

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I don't think people realize yet that Korean's probably don't see cheesing the same way we do. Koreans rarely, very rarely ever actually go all-in. Nestea 6 pooled Genius. It wasn't an all-in. He was behind, for sure, because Genius defended it about as perfectly as you could, but the game went on and Nestea could have very realistically taken it had he not gotten blind-countered by mass phoenix.

I think people need to get past "cheese" and look at it more like early pressure. Reactored hellions isn't a cheese and it's sure as shit not all-in, hellions cost 100 minerals and you can expand behind them easily since they're so god damn annoying. Calling things "cheese" is a convenient way to blame the opponent for your lack of scouting, lack of preparation, and lack of defense.

As a whole, cheese is largely looked down upon. I don't really get why though...they punish people for being greedy and apply early pressure. They can be held off, and if you do, you're in a better position for it.

Idra has been playing starcraft for a long, long time. He's very smart, but I don't see why it takes him so long to adapt. Christ, pool first once in awhile. When I watch him play I feel like he feels the need to get a lead from the get-go and then hold onto it the entire game, if he ever lets it go then he'll lose. That's not how this shit works and he should know that. You play it out, you always play it out, you employ the strategies you need to in order to come back, you take risks and try to catch your opponent off-guard. Do -something-, don't just rage quit.

Coal Sweden. February 14 2012 06:16. Posts 1515

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On February 08 2012 05:38 Coal wrote:
Why are you doing this to Idra? =(

I knew something bad would happen =(

In order to succeed, your desire for success should be greater than your fear of failure.

Kich United States. February 14 2012 06:17. Posts 338

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On February 14 2012 06:15 Bellygareth wrote:

Show nested quote +

Because in this thread most people deal in superlatives and are hating way much than what it should be. I hate pitchforks and torches...

Holy bejesus this might be one of the only sane level headed people on the forums. You're the man.

theJob February 14 2012 06:17. Posts 264

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On February 14 2012 06:11 Snotling wrote:

Show nested quote +

really? even idra doesnt defend his actions (as we can se by him giving back the money). why do you?

Because arbitrary use of power to punish players is bad. And yes, it IS arbitrary if the prerequisit for being punished is "failing to please the league".

If Idra was somehow able to punish Alive for his early gamepushes – would that mean that Alive would have been the one to have to forfeit pricemoney to be considered being reinvited?

I don't defend Idra for his actions but I defend his right to do them UNLESS it's stated in the rules that he's not.

Winners train. Loosers complain.

gullberg Sweden. February 14 2012 06:18. Posts 1265

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On February 14 2012 06:07 Noocta wrote:
So, i missed the whole thing.
Can someone resume everygame, even very briefly ? ( from the thread, i guess that wont be long to write )

game1 11-11 rax opening on bel'shir beach with 3 bunkers (idra fails to prevent the bunkers from going up and leaves the game without trying to break it)
game2 2fac reactor hellion on daybreak took Idra by surprise and killed him (didn't get up spines in time and he was doing a greedy build aswell)
game3 Idra 6pools on crossfire while alive builds a proxy rax, looked like Idra had a decent chance but while idra was attacking the main alive built a bunker behind his minerals and floated his command center there which pretty much nullified the attack (built roaches on 1base but it's pretty much over). Idra leaves when he realizes that he can't really do anything.
game4 Idra 6pools and fails. alive drops the "u sixpool?"

Last edit: 2012-02-14 06:21:33

Erik.TheRed United States. February 14 2012 06:18. Posts 1171

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On February 14 2012 06:15 Kich wrote:
I don't think people realize yet that Korean's probably don't see cheesing the same way we do. Koreans rarely, very rarely ever actually go all-in. Nestea 6 pooled Genius. It wasn't an all-in. He was behind, for sure, because Genius defended it about as perfectly as you could, but the game went on and Nestea could have very realistically taken it had he not gotten blind-countered by mass phoenix.

I think people need to get past "cheese" and look at it more like early pressure. Reactored hellions isn't a cheese and it's sure as shit not all-in, hellions cost 100 minerals and you can expand behind them easily since they're so god damn annoying. Calling things "cheese" is a convenient way to blame the opponent for your lack of scouting, lack of preparation, and lack of defense.

As a whole, cheese is largely looked down upon. I don't really get why though...they punish people for being greedy and apply early pressure. They can be held off, and if you do, you're in a better position for it.

Idra has been playing starcraft for a long, long time. He's very smart, but I don't see why it takes him so long to adapt. Christ, pool first once in awhile. When I watch him play I feel like he feels the need to get a lead from the get-go and then hold onto it the entire game, if he ever lets it go then he'll lose. That's not how this shit works and he should know that. You play it out, you always play it out, you employ the strategies you need to in order to come back, you take risks and try to catch your opponent off-guard. Do -something-, don't just rage quit.

There's a big difference between 6 pooling a terran and 6 pooling a protoss. protoss go FFE the majority of the time in the MU, where 6 pool has a much higher chance of doing some damage.

Last edit: 2012-02-14 06:19:59

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