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| NewSunshine United States. February 29 2012 12:23. Posts 1007 | Profile # |
Good news! It would appear that, ever so steadily, Blizzard is showing that they are, in fact, listening to their players.
Link: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/4519245/Season_7_GSL_Map_Poll-2_28_2012#blog
They're letting the people vote on up to 2 maps each, to see which ones they'll be adding to the ladder. I hope some of the older, more tired maps get ousted. Like The shattered Temple, maybe Metalopolis as well.
I've seen tons of people ask for Daybreak to be on the ladder, and I suspect it'll finally be happening. I personally voted for Daybreak and Metropolis. And with Ohana's debut on the horizon as well, the future of the SC2 ladder looks rather bright! 
and yes, I know there's a thread for this in general SC2. However, there are some folk, like me, who come here entirely for mapping, and we also care what goes on in our ladders. Check it out! |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| Kaitlin United States. February 29 2012 13:02. Posts 2191 | Profile # |
| A poll about a map pool. I couldn't help but think of IdrA vs. Alive ... |
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| Timetwister22 United States. February 29 2012 13:06. Posts 305 | Profile # |
| Voted Daybreak on Crevasse. I REALLY REALLY want an in base expo on ladder and see how it plays out with the average player. Though, I don't really like any of the other maps with the exception of terminus and I suppose Belshir. Belshir is fairly standard and has no main ramp. No me gusta 4gate vs 4gate >.> |
| | ESV Mapmaking Team | twitter.com/ESV_Timetwister |
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| Broodie Canada. February 29 2012 13:15. Posts 752 | Profile Blog # |
Bel'Shir and Daybreak for me
Easily the best imo, Crevasse would be an amazing option too but its just not friendly to a lot of lower league players, it's still one of my favs though. I'd say these maps are the most "Mass friendly" maps from the choices we're given.
If only pros played ladder I would be voting Daybreak and Terminus |
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| prodiG Canada. February 29 2012 13:27. Posts 1993 | Profile Blog # |
Posted my thoughts on this In this blog post
+ Show Spoiler [Please Don't Ruin Daybreak] +
On February 29 2012 11:42 prodiG wrote:So Daybreak is getting in... That's great. But I have one question: In the TL Map Contest, Blizzard specifically indicated to the contest organizer that the bases should each have 8 mineral fields and 2 gas to avoid confusion for players at the lower levels. Some of you may remember the small controversy around the change from GSL Tal'Darim Altar which had its third at 6m1g. When it was added to ladder, it became Tal'Darim Altar LE and saw the third changed to 8m2g with the addition of destructible rocks. This was a pretty significant change, one that the map's creator LSPrime had not intended in it's original design (and one that if memory serves, he was pretty chapped about). If Blizzard continues to follow the protocol that they have in the past, all non-standard resource bases will be changed to 8m 2g. It's pretty fair to say that Daybreak is one of the most exciting and brilliant 2p map designs we've seen yet in competitive SC2, but changing the forward expansion to 8m2g has some pretty significant effects. Now players can start taking that expansion as their 4th, positioning their armies in such a way that makes it very easy to defend everything (centered around the Xel'Naga Tower nearby). Daybreak isn't an awesome map because of how defensive it is. It's awesome because of how much action it creates. The basetrades that occur because of the rush distance and the rocks in the middle path forcing players to cross the map in opposite directions often missing one another's army entirely. The strategic placement of armies and map control around the high ground pods & expansions at the 12 and 6. The action packed game that when doesn't end in a 2-base timing attack usually leads to an all-out war of attrition as players whittle each other down. All to that last forward base with 6 minerals and one gas. Please Blizzard. Please don't fix what's not broken. When you add Daybreak, don't change the expansion <3 Signed, prodiG
Mapmaker & Commentator for ESV
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| | ESV Mapmaking Team || http://twitter.com/prodiGsc || Real talk, I don't have time to sugar-coat it for you sir |
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| NewSunshine United States. February 29 2012 13:43. Posts 1007 | Profile # |
On February 29 2012 13:27 prodiG wrote:Posted my thoughts on this In this blog post+ Show Spoiler [Please Don't Ruin Daybreak] +
On February 29 2012 11:42 prodiG wrote:So Daybreak is getting in... That's great. But I have one question: In the TL Map Contest, Blizzard specifically indicated to the contest organizer that the bases should each have 8 mineral fields and 2 gas to avoid confusion for players at the lower levels. Some of you may remember the small controversy around the change from GSL Tal'Darim Altar which had its third at 6m1g. When it was added to ladder, it became Tal'Darim Altar LE and saw the third changed to 8m2g with the addition of destructible rocks. This was a pretty significant change, one that the map's creator LSPrime had not intended in it's original design (and one that if memory serves, he was pretty chapped about). If Blizzard continues to follow the protocol that they have in the past, all non-standard resource bases will be changed to 8m 2g. It's pretty fair to say that Daybreak is one of the most exciting and brilliant 2p map designs we've seen yet in competitive SC2, but changing the forward expansion to 8m2g has some pretty significant effects. Now players can start taking that expansion as their 4th, positioning their armies in such a way that makes it very easy to defend everything (centered around the Xel'Naga Tower nearby). Daybreak isn't an awesome map because of how defensive it is. It's awesome because of how much action it creates. The basetrades that occur because of the rush distance and the rocks in the middle path forcing players to cross the map in opposite directions often missing one another's army entirely. The strategic placement of armies and map control around the high ground pods & expansions at the 12 and 6. The action packed game that when doesn't end in a 2-base timing attack usually leads to an all-out war of attrition as players whittle each other down. All to that last forward base with 6 minerals and one gas. Please Blizzard. Please don't fix what's not broken. When you add Daybreak, don't change the expansion <3 Signed, prodiG
Mapmaker & Commentator for ESV
I agree entirely, and that was something that had just occured to me. If they make changes to make an LE version, that base looks like it would be right in Blizzard's cross-hairs.
This looks like a real defining moment for the entire future of the ladder. Do they hold strong to their 8M2G bylaw, or do they set a precedent for future maps, of all sorts and shapes? Something similar would be the case if Crevasse were to make it, but Daybreak looks like the 1 shoo-in here.
It's gonna be interesting. |
| | [ESV mapmaking team member] [Former DF map team founder] [@ESVNewSunshine] |
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| wichenks Canada. February 29 2012 13:51. Posts 151 | Profile # |
| Please don't vote for belshir. Not another 4gate map on PVP |
| | Sometimes Artosis and I like to have Hot 6ix with each other - Tasteless |
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| Gl!tch United States. February 29 2012 14:26. Posts 573 | Profile # |
| Voted for Daybreak and Metropolis. And it looks like those are the two maps at the top of the poll. If they both get in, I think metalopolis will be swapped for Metropolis, not sure what they would swap Daybreak in with, maybe Tal'Darim? (Thats just the Protoss in me wanting less 4gates) |
| | “I mean, they say you die twice. One time when you stop breathing and a second time, a bit later on, when somebody says your name for the last time.” ― Banksy |
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| Timetwister22 United States. February 29 2012 14:51. Posts 305 | Profile # |
Metropolis is a bad map, and even morrow seems to agree as he says here. Maybe balance wise it's alright. Only complaints are late game zvt and I suppose even tvp would be hard considering there are only 2 chokes into your side of the map. The map in general however is just too boring. Nothing extraordinary about it. In fact, I think Shattered Temple is more interesting than that map...which is saying something >.>
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| | ESV Mapmaking Team | twitter.com/ESV_Timetwister |
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| bpat United States. February 29 2012 14:53. Posts 157 | Profile # |
On February 29 2012 14:26 Gl!tch wrote:
Voted for Daybreak and Metropolis. And it looks like those are the two maps at the top of the poll. If they both get in, I think metalopolis will be swapped for Metropolis, not sure what they would swap Daybreak in with, maybe Tal'Darim? (Thats just the Protoss in me wanting less 4gates)
I agree that those two are the best GSL maps, but Tal'Darim should stay (I play Protoss too). Even though one matchup is pretty predictable, it's one of the most balanced maps in the game. The Playhem statistics showed almost exactly a 50% winrate for each matchup. |
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| a176 Canada. February 29 2012 14:57. Posts 5383 | Profile Blog # |
| SC2 going from 2-base play to free-3rd-NR20 gameplay |
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| monitor United States. February 29 2012 15:01. Posts 2276 | Profile Blog # |
On February 29 2012 14:57 a176 wrote:
SC2 going from 2-base play to free-3rd-NR20 gameplay
Misinformed? PvZ has never had a free third, and neither has TvZ. Show me one game where players took a free third without any form of aggression. Right now we're stuck in 2 base Protoss all-ins if you ask me!! |
| | Starcraft 2 Mapmaker for TPW || Author of Korhal Compound |
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| SidianTheBard United States. February 29 2012 15:41. Posts 965 | Profile # |
I agree with Timetwister. I voted for Daybreak and Crevasse as well.
Daybreak is a no-brainer.
Crevasse, I think would play out extremely well now a day. Beforehand it was Terran favored, but I feel with zergs getting better with scouting, infestors and their tier 3 tech as well as protoss being able to defend most 1 & 2 base play from Terran it'll put them in a great spot. |
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| Capiachi February 29 2012 16:20. Posts 78 | Profile # |
| Calm before the storm and metropolis |
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| MugenXBanksy United States. February 29 2012 16:24. Posts 381 | Profile # |
i voted for terminus and daybreak. i am gonna cry if belshir gets chosen. granted blizzard doesn't do the usual dustin browder lets add extra rocks for no F*CKING reason.
terminus will fill the void terrible space maps have left me with since scrap station and delta quadrant were removed. proxy stargates will be a possiblilty again. that and its a nice macro map. even though i know people will still do some kind of all in over 50% of the time on ladder -_-'
would love one of the more macro maps in and not living in rock land and changning the bases though. |
| | we all hope to be like whitera one day |
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| IronManSC United States. February 29 2012 16:24. Posts 1640 | Profile # |
| DayBreak and Metropolis. Would go bel'shir but Ohana will be the tropical map instead |
| | ESV Map Maker. || twitter: @ESVironManSC || Author of Ohana, Khalis, Ravage, Khaydaria, Spring |
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| shadymmj February 29 2012 17:41. Posts 1304 | Profile # |
On February 29 2012 13:27 prodiG wrote:Posted my thoughts on this In this blog post+ Show Spoiler [Please Don't Ruin Daybreak] +
On February 29 2012 11:42 prodiG wrote:So Daybreak is getting in... That's great. But I have one question: In the TL Map Contest, Blizzard specifically indicated to the contest organizer that the bases should each have 8 mineral fields and 2 gas to avoid confusion for players at the lower levels. Some of you may remember the small controversy around the change from GSL Tal'Darim Altar which had its third at 6m1g. When it was added to ladder, it became Tal'Darim Altar LE and saw the third changed to 8m2g with the addition of destructible rocks. This was a pretty significant change, one that the map's creator LSPrime had not intended in it's original design (and one that if memory serves, he was pretty chapped about). If Blizzard continues to follow the protocol that they have in the past, all non-standard resource bases will be changed to 8m 2g. It's pretty fair to say that Daybreak is one of the most exciting and brilliant 2p map designs we've seen yet in competitive SC2, but changing the forward expansion to 8m2g has some pretty significant effects. Now players can start taking that expansion as their 4th, positioning their armies in such a way that makes it very easy to defend everything (centered around the Xel'Naga Tower nearby). Daybreak isn't an awesome map because of how defensive it is. It's awesome because of how much action it creates. The basetrades that occur because of the rush distance and the rocks in the middle path forcing players to cross the map in opposite directions often missing one another's army entirely. The strategic placement of armies and map control around the high ground pods & expansions at the 12 and 6. The action packed game that when doesn't end in a 2-base timing attack usually leads to an all-out war of attrition as players whittle each other down. All to that last forward base with 6 minerals and one gas. Please Blizzard. Please don't fix what's not broken. When you add Daybreak, don't change the expansion <3 Signed, prodiG
Mapmaker & Commentator for ESV
flat out disagree
current daybreak is like metalopolis: it has a 3rd with a massive opening AND 2 pathways, one of which you must choose to go through. it creates unnecessary strain on the defender and like you said promotes base trades instead of real action. i don't think many people pay to play/watch base trades instead of army trades.
if you look at fighting spirit, destination, tau cross, blah blah, the 3rds with gas always have a defenders advantage in a small choke, uphill ramp, or the ability to defend both the 2nd and 3rd simultaneously.
the games may tend to become a NR 20 because the 4th is also not contested on the potential daybreak LE. what blizzard tends to do by changing the 4th will slow the game down somewhat on the ladder, which I think is still preferable to encouraging base trade scenarios.
what i would do is to the remove the current third and its accompanying ramp into the natural, and restore the current "4th" to a full 3rd. then it will promote aggression.
![[image loading]](http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg651/scaled.php?server=651&filename=daybreak.jpg&res=medium)
like this...
of course then it might seem a bit small and with only 10 bases, it'd be the smallest map. may have to put some extra distance in the middle.Last edit: 2012-02-29 17:56:56 |
| | There is no such thing is "e-sports". There is Brood War, and then there is crap for nerds. |
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| Drowsy United States. February 29 2012 17:46. Posts 4824 | Profile Blog # |
On February 29 2012 14:57 a176 wrote:
SC2 going from 2-base play to free-3rd-NR20 gameplay
hahaha
Anyway, I'd like Daybreak and Calm Before the Storm. Calm won't win because pvt is prob massively toss favoured. I'm ambivalent about Metropolis. It seems alright, but just the fact that it reminds me slag pits brings back the psychological trauma of that god awful map.
I actually want to see Nerazim Crypt back. I really couldn't find a single flaw in that map. The chokes were fairly wide so forcefields were a little less powerful, but the map was on the big side, the 3rd was accessible but not free, there was no gold, rocks were only used tastefully, you could easily wall off your nat for ffe (a feature I'm finding woefully lacking these days... being able to wall off with only 3 buildings is kind of a huge deal to toss players in pvz, makes you have to worry about early pools so much less), rush distances that weren't crazy long or crazy short. It was just an overall solid map. Last edit: 2012-02-29 17:47:12 |
| | Our Protoss, Who art in Aiur HongUn be Thy name; Thy stalker come, Thy will be blunk, on ladder as it is in Micro Tourny. Give us this win in our daily ladder, and forgive us our cheeses, As we forgive those who play zerg against us. |
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| Ampster February 29 2012 18:48. Posts 31 | Profile # |
My vote goes to Daybreak & Terminus,
I get to choose two maps, so I based my decision on what I think is the best 2 players and 4 players map in the map choice Blizzard had given me.
Best 2 players map: Daybreak
♦I think it has the best 2 players map layout compared to other 2 players map in the poll
♦I seen a lot of good games on this map in GSL - a good variety of cheese and macro games
♦Visually, it looks very beautiful
♦The tileset is not distracting to the eyes when I play multiple games on it
♦Daybreak > Bel'shir Winter > Dual Sight
Best 4 players map: Terminus
♦I think it has the best 4 players map layout compared to other 4 players map in the poll
♦I like the tileset of the map
♦Good old Terminus
♦Terminus > Crevasse / Metropolis > Calm Before the Storm
*I personally don't like 2 players map, I think the only good ones are Daybreak and Cloud Kingdom.
Volcano tileset
I wish they will stop using the dark volcanic tileset like the one they used in Dual Sight (right half), its so dark you can barely see anything clearly, plus it hurts my eyes when I watch or play many games a map that has that tileset.Last edit: 2012-03-01 13:09:42 |
| | DRG (zvt,zvz) | Stephano (zvp, zvt) | Parting (pvt) || Fantasy (tvt, tvp, fan) | Baby (fan) | Jaedong (fan) |
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| ArcticRaven France. February 29 2012 18:53. Posts 1163 | Profile # |
Shady - you mad ? The third's very defensible as of now. Massive opening ? I don't think so. But then, maybe you were mistaken and are talking about the nat. Which can be walled with 3 3x3 buildings and à depot or zealot, quite standard.
The map's fine as it is. Are you something like Dustin Browder's evil twin ? :D
I liked Nerazim too - the tower setup was just a little ridiculous, but it's a shame that Antiga is played in tournaments and Nerazim was scrapped.
I voted for Daybreak and Calm Before The Storm, because it was cool to pla on :D |
| | [EatThePath] I call assassins as my faction. Please tell me we can all agree that in the version of history, Steppes of War will be Jerusalem. |
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