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Alex is verbose, and you owe it to yourself (and the rest of us) to read the statement in its entirety. Remember, when making comments/claims to provide proper evidence, facts etc. Arguments based on incorrect assumptions, facts and straw men, will be dealt with swiftly. If in doubt, PM a mod or ask IRC. Do NOT spread misinformation, when in doubt, check your sources. In short, be smart. Alex comments on Idra: https://twitter.com/#!/ottersareneat/status/177964162113224705Orbs Statement: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319038Personal attacks against other posters in this thread will be met with a ban -- 14:20 KST | Sc1pio United States. March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 800 | Profile Blog # |
A more apt comparison people might give is if Joe Buck or somebody verifiably called someone a nigger in a public space and it was recorded, even if it occurred before he was fired by Fox, he would probably be fired if it became public and had a level of shitstorm this did. This decision is consistent with nearly every other field in this case.
That being said, I support EG's decision on a moral basis rather than the practical one they just gave. Personally I consider BM juvenile, but I don't support throwing people off of teams because of BM. When it steps into the realm of using slurs, especially ones so charged and with such a history like the word nigger, it has to be put to an end. |
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| Tektos Australia. March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 1310 | Profile # |
If you don't empower such a word with responses like this then the word loses value and stops causing so much offense.
I learned a lot about this through the differences in Australian and American culture over the past 15 years. The words cunt and bastard are probably the two biggest examples. Here in Australia such terms are treated with such lax that they are even sometimes used as terms of endearment (much like how black people sometimes use the word nigga amongst themselves) and as a result are view by their context and not the word itself.
EG here has completely overreacted solely on the word used and as a result severely damaged the career of an individual who is better at his job than almost anyone out there.
I am extremely disappointed in EG for this response and will no longer be supporting them or their sponsors.
Political correctness gone wrong.
Last edit: 2012-03-09 13:10:36 |
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| seiferoth10 March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 2684 | Profile # |
On March 09 2012 13:01 EnderSword wrote:
I'm incredibly disappointed in EG for this.
They've been my favourite team, I've got an EG mousepad, and one of the Hoodies and generally watch a lot of the team in general.
That certainly ends today.
This type of caving in to pressure by a loud, vicious minority of people who were hunting, not out of genuine offense, but to cause drama is an incredible display of horrible judgement and a complete lack of loyalty.
I could give two shits about orb...and to be honest, no one could. Nobody REALLY cares about it. It's just something to talk about between events.
Totally selling out an employee to save your own ass, especially while completely tolerating IdrA's...existence, and inviting Destiny onto EG sponsors and produced shows is so hypocritical as to be laughable.
I don't believe a single damn word Alex Garfield said, and his fake offendedness over this word is so ridiculous it's not worthy of any respect. It's the worst type of fake, two-faced holier-than-thou bullshit you can get.
Shove your sanctimonious bullshit and hypocritical policy and fuck off.
Or to quote your Own popular Team Member IdrA: "This Game is Retarded" and "The Game is worse because of Fags like you"
I agree with all of this. This explanation is so damn hypocritical it is mind blowing. He used that language while not affiliated with EG. He was NOT given any chance to reform himself either. Seriously? A past reference not used while affiliated with EG, and no chance to even try to reform? What the fuck.
Why keep Idra around? He's used (in the past, like in Orb's situation) language that offends Alex. Hell, he's done it while being affiated with EG. And yet he was given the chance to reform? Why is that? Why wasn't Orb given that chance? Why don't you just let Idra go, instead of being so two-faced.
Ugh. I might start liking TL again because of this. Disgustingly hypocritical. |
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| shinyA China. March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 434 | Profile # |
People who are saying that "it happened before he was contracted" need to take into account a few things.
1 - The fact that he did this shows, at least a part, of his character.
2 - SC2 hasn't been out that long, it isn't as if this happened years ago - it was quite recent.
3 - Orb had aspirations of becoming a community figure, caster, and personality - yet he still acted like this. Why would someone do something like that? It's a question that I don't really have an answer to, but I do think that whatever the reason, he isn't fit to be what he aspired to be.
I gained a lot of respect for EG. |
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 tree.hugger Saint Paul, MN. March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 8989 | Profile Blog # |
Appreciated the digression on race. No sarcasm, I just picked up Michelle Alexander's The New Jim Crow for Spring Break reading. This is serious stuff, it's good that people think more about it.
And appropriate decision given the circumstances. Professional and smart response from EG.Last edit: 2012-03-09 13:10:36 |
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| foehammer United States. March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 79 | Profile # |
All I can say is holy moly are you a good writer. Everything you have written about has been top notch. Great post and a well thought-out and professional decision.
gg and wp sir! Last edit: 2012-03-09 13:18:39 |
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| AnachronisticAnarchy United States. March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 2299 | Profile Blog # |
Wait, so when did this happen? Like, when did Orb say n-----? Because if it was months ago or something, I'm not sure if he should get fired for it. Maybe I'm not the best judge on these things, but people can change a good bit over even a few months, and Orb is usually pretty professional.
Also, it happened before he was employed by you guys.
That said, it is a harsh but fair decision. Provided he didn't put all his eggs in one basket (that basket being EG) and this didn't happen a few months ago, I think that this decision is entirely fair. While he does deserve to be punished, I don't think he needs to be ejected from eSPORTS entirely. |
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| CrazyF1r3f0x United States. March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 1739 | Profile Blog # |
Man this sucks 
I can't believe this happened for some offensive in game chat, yeah what he said was immature, but you can't help but feel bad for the guy; he lost such a big opportunity because of a reddit witch hunt. |
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| Suc Australia. March 09 2012 13:09. Posts 1566 | Profile Blog # |
On March 09 2012 12:50 kibeth wrote:
I actually find your post overly condescending and obnoxious, and I like EG as an organization.
It's kind of like if I stole a toy from a grocery store when I was 8. Later in life I work there, and somehow someone finds out that a decade ago I stole a 99cent toy, and I was fired. Sounds ridiculous right?
Yeah.. no. That analogy doesn't really hold up here as the offences hold different weighting. |
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| Rorschach United States. March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 604 | Profile # |
On March 09 2012 13:06 nO.Usagi wrote:
Lets kick idrA off for calling people faggots in games and lets also kick off Huk for saying nigga on Twitter. I am done with Starcraft II completely. Sick of the game, sick of the community and sick of ignorant people.
I felt bad for Katu and I feel even worse for Orb.
EG's decision disgusts me far more than a players choice of words in a stream.
They allow their star player to get away with calling others a fagot but orb gets canned for being an asshat?
So sick of the whole hypocritical community.... |
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| Danzo United States. March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 407 | Profile # |
| Everything about this situation is hypocritical. From the action from EG to the majority of the community. |
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| Gamegene United States. March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 6653 | Profile Blog # |
On March 09 2012 13:08 jianming wrote:
Show nested quote +On March 09 2012 12:54 TheSwamp wrote:
On March 09 2012 12:50 kibeth wrote:
I actually find your post overly condescending and obnoxious, and I like EG as an organization.
It's kind of like if I stole a toy from a grocery store when I was 8. Later in life I work there, and somehow someone finds out that a decade ago I stole a 99cent toy, and I was fired. Sounds ridiculous right?
I did not realize Orb was eight when this all happened.
You obviously have the mental capacity of an 8 year old if you don't know what a metaphor is.
that's not the point. you can be forgiven for your mistakes when you're a dumbass adolescent but when you're an adult you are expected to act responsibly or face scrutiny. |
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| WilliamDecker Canada. March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 43 | Profile # |
While I think people are more than okay to do what they want in their own time I think the specific item that I'd like to pull out of your post is the following:
I have never said it, typed it, or written it. If it's used in my presence, I immediately speak up and demand that it not be used again in my presence, regardless of context or circumstances
Now people are okay to do whatever they want on their own time, but the people I tend to surround myself with sometimes make lacks in judgement. I think it's important to anyone to speak up for what they think is right. It takes a lot to stand up and say that's not okay even if everyone looks at you like you made it awkward. I was in a situation similar to this with a family member where I told them what they were saying about a particular group of people was not okay. I come from a specific minority group and explained that it's not okay for us to discriminated against and that we should understand this most of anyone.
It's okay to make mistakes. It's not okay to deny it and hide behind your own shame. The moment you admit that you're at fault is the moment you're able to progress as a person and move forward. |
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| Blargh United States. March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 535 | Profile # |
| I am going to search every single person who posts here and make sure that they have never seen anything offensive to anyone in Starcraft matches. If I find anyone who HAS indeed said something offensive, I will be sure to inform their employer so they can be punished immediately. It is, after all, only professional. |
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 Barrin United States. March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 4206 | Profile Blog # |
I forgive him :D
But I'm really not down with community figures using words like that. I don't think I've ever used the n word. Haven't even said "faggot" or "gay" in many years.
<3 orb. I don't think any less of you man, I think you've learned your lesson... don't let it get to you you'll be fine♥ |
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| GhostLink Spain. March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 399 | Profile # |
| Racism is a word that loses meaning, but there is a very good reason for that. I'll give you a quick analogy. If there are two astronauts in space, and one is hating on another simply because he/she's wearing a space suit that is of a different color, what is this concept called? Is there an overused word for that? Well, of course not. Why? Because the concept is ridiculous. Racism is ridiculous, and as more and more people realize that, the word "racism"will simply be a historic word that people from different communities will look back on and laugh. It's getting there now, since most racism comments and remarks that we see today are intended as humor, and don't offend anyone at all, besides the few oversensitive people that the community doesn't like. Of course, what orb did here was not very acceptable, since his "racism" was intended as hate, not humor, as well as the still existing controversy of the word "nigger", and i support EG's decision. I just wanted to emphasize how ridiculous racism really is, and how people should stop caring about it. This, more than any action, will make those that are still truly racist (neo-nazis, white supremacists, or OTHER cultures who are racist (yes, other communities CAN be racists too, it's not just whites)) look foolish, and hence be beneficial. |
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| Shiori March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 2825 | Profile Blog # |
| Your major was black studies? No offense, but that answers a lot of questions for me. At least you prefaced it by saying it's your opinion. And what a weird, platitudinous opinion it is.... |
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| Angelbelow United States. March 09 2012 13:10. Posts 3722 | Profile # |
I just hope whoever decided to message the sponsors of EG actually did it because they were genuinely offended by Orbs comments and not for any other reason. Complaining to sponsors for any other reason is so potentially damaging..
If you complained and are satisfied with the decision now, please take the time to let the sponsors know. |
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| SgtCoDFish United Kingdom. March 09 2012 13:11. Posts 1449 | Profile Blog # |
I think at the end of the day, if Orb had immediately said "that was the old me, I'm truly deeply sorry, I didn't mean it literally and I'm not racist. I have trouble with my emotions sometimes and I let it out, but I'm honestly trying to change and specifically remove my use of words like that." in a big post on TL and reddit, this wouldn't have happened.
His first mistake was obviously using the n word in the first place. He didn't learn from his mistake (and he knew it really was him that said it, obv) and tried to shift the blame away from him. It was not learning from his mistake that got him fired, imo.
I really can't believe that EG would've fired him, or there would've been such a witch-hunt, if he'd apologised honestly and promised to never do it again. |
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| Corrosive Canada. March 09 2012 13:11. Posts 3661 | Profile # |
Yeah guys, Reddit made orb say nigger while streaming, go on a psychotic rant, and then delete the vod and lie about it saying that it wasn't him and people were slandering him while name dropping other people who have said nigger in the past.
1. he shouldnt have said it ever.
2. but mistakes happen, so he said nigger, he should have apologized in a professional manner. I'm sure he would have been alot better off if he did this. Even if EG still decided to fire him, he would have been in a better position to find another good casting job.Last edit: 2012-03-09 13:11:27 |
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