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| Gaga Germany. March 16 2012 03:30. Posts 419 | Profile # |
well ...
everyone who read a little bit of financial news since 2008 should know this already  |
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| teer United States. March 16 2012 03:31. Posts 177 | Profile # |
| only took him 12 yrs to make this decision. |
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| Rassy Netherlands. March 16 2012 03:33. Posts 1499 | Profile # |
paralleluniverse Australia. March 15 2012 21:48. Posts 857
PM Profile Report Quote #
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On March 15 2012 20:43 ControlMonkey wrote:
Why anyone would go to a big investment bank for advice is beyond me.
A company which sells you something, and then takes out an insurance policy on that same thing, so that if it loses money, they gain money?
Who the fuck would want to do business with that firm?
edit - lol typo.
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In finance, It's called hedging, aka covering your ass.
Huh?? no lol.
The company does not have annything to hedge, since they are not the ones buying something.
They sell a product to a client long and at the same time they go short
They dont have a long position themselves (neccesarely), this has nothing to do with hedging and it is realy speculating against the client (or rather advice the client to buy products wich they are shorting themselves)
Annyway: Where else to go then an investment bank with a 100 year+ reputation for advise about investing?
Its not like there are manny alternatives.Last edit: 2012-03-16 03:36:58 |
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| LaLLsc2 United States. March 16 2012 03:38. Posts 502 | Profile # |
| This is not news, in order to work at GS you have to first sell your soul. |
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| UrielSC Canada. March 16 2012 03:40. Posts 142 | Profile # |
I think the title should be changed if it isn't the OP's article.
Makes it confusing when it says I and refers to someone else.
Unless it actually is him, which is still somewhat confusing for me to tell.Last edit: 2012-03-16 03:40:53 |
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| Rassy Netherlands. March 16 2012 03:41. Posts 1499 | Profile # |
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/price_clubbed_in_jRGGyS9wKfAKjxAs0bkVnO
It must be easy for you to dismiss everything that disagrees with your worldview as 'conspiracy'. The only hatter here is you. You don't even live in America and you are telling me that I must be making this up when I have to go to the grocery store, pay bills, gas, and all the basic amenities. Hell, just comparison to 10 years ago indicates an insane inflation rate, let's not even go back to 1970!
I am not even that old and I remember when gas used to be .79 a gallon, a can of soda pop was .25, milk was 1$ a gallon, candy was between .01 and .05$, energy and water bills under 50$ a month. Wages never keep pace with inflation. When a currency is inflated the purchasing power is always transferred to the wealthy and connected as they are the first to receive the new money.
It's not called a Cantillon effect for no reason.
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The EPI can't be taken seriously. It does not measure core inflation, and the increase is driven my higher gas prices, which is already included in the CPI, and not even caused by the Fed's policies.
Lol usa inflation uses hedonic pricing,
official inflation figures in all countrys are a huge joke btw, not only in the usa
say 4 gb computer would have costed 20.000$ in 2004, while it costs 1000$ now, then they count that as 95% deflation for computers over the years 2004-2012.
Well this is simplified a bit off course but it realy works this way and its not even completely unreasonable, still it makes official figures verry unreliable.Last edit: 2012-03-16 03:43:03 |
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| Glacierz United States. March 16 2012 03:46. Posts 467 | Profile Blog # |
On March 16 2012 03:41 Rassy wrote:http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/price_clubbed_in_jRGGyS9wKfAKjxAs0bkVnOIt must be easy for you to dismiss everything that disagrees with your worldview as 'conspiracy'. The only hatter here is you. You don't even live in America and you are telling me that I must be making this up when I have to go to the grocery store, pay bills, gas, and all the basic amenities. Hell, just comparison to 10 years ago indicates an insane inflation rate, let's not even go back to 1970! I am not even that old and I remember when gas used to be .79 a gallon, a can of soda pop was .25, milk was 1$ a gallon, candy was between .01 and .05$, energy and water bills under 50$ a month. Wages never keep pace with inflation. When a currency is inflated the purchasing power is always transferred to the wealthy and connected as they are the first to receive the new money. It's not called a Cantillon effect for no reason. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The EPI can't be taken seriously. It does not measure core inflation, and the increase is driven my higher gas prices, which is already included in the CPI, and not even caused by the Fed's policies. Lol usa inflation uses hedonic pricing, official inflation figures in all countrys are a huge joke btw, not only in the usa say 4 gb computer would have costed 20.000$ in 2004, while it costs 1000$ now, then they count that as 95% deflation for computers over the years 2004-2012. Well this is simplified a bit off course but it realy works this way and its not even completely unreasonable, still it makes official figures verry unreliable.
I can't tell if your computer example is a troll or a serious attempt at making a point. Either way it's pretty funny. |
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| Mohdoo United States. March 16 2012 03:46. Posts 3940 | Profile # |
| Can't believe people still believe in anything except extremely strict regulation of the financial sector after this. The free market's ability to regulate its self is the biggest lie ever. |
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| Psychobabas United Kingdom. March 16 2012 03:47. Posts 1962 | Profile Blog # |
Nothing that surprises me.
Having worked for one of Goldman Sachs biggest competitors, you literally have to sell your life to these companies. Ridiculous overtime. Ridiculous stress. Working in Xmas, New Year, Easter and all bank holidays pretty much. Pay nowhere near reflects that shit, not since the 2008 crisis anyway.
I'm currently trying to shift my career.Last edit: 2012-03-16 03:50:04 |
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 liberal March 16 2012 03:53. Posts 1116 | Profile # |
On March 16 2012 03:46 Mohdoo wrote:
Can't believe people still believe in anything except extremely strict regulation of the financial sector after this. The free market's ability to regulate its self is the biggest lie ever.
You mean the free market where government injects inflation, sets interest rates, creates bubble, insures investments, bails out failing companies, and gives all sorts of loop holes and benefits and breaks to some companies at the expense of others? The free market where conglomerates lobby for wealth?
The market was bankrupting these firms. The government rescued them. Now if you want to talk about how the corporate world has insulated major decision makers against the consequences of their policies, that is a valid point. |
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| Glacierz United States. March 16 2012 03:57. Posts 467 | Profile Blog # |
On March 16 2012 03:41 Rassy wrote:
Well this is simplified a bit off course but it realy works this way and its not even completely unreasonable, still it makes official figures verry unreliable.
In case you are serious, I hope you realize you can't calculate inflation on the same item when it comes to depreciating technology gadgets.
Example: If you are measuring inflation on automobiles, you would use the price change between the 2012 and 2013 generation of the same car model. You don't use the same 2012 model for both years to calculate price chagnes. that's just common sense... |
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| Rassy Netherlands. March 16 2012 04:11. Posts 1499 | Profile # |
Hmm i did look up some recent advices from goldman sachs and one is particulary interesting.
1 feb 12
TNT Express
sell
result
-44,75%
On 1 february this year GS brought out the new advise to sell the stock TNT with as price target 4.80
The stock at that time had a price of 6.30
2 weeks after goldman brought out their new advice UPS announced a takeover bid on TNT for 9.00/share and shares have been above 9.00 since then.
Even more interesting is the advise of JP morgan.
JP morgan did lower the advice for this stock on 17 oktober with a new target of 6.30 and the advice "underweight" (down from 6.90)
This was higher then the share price of that time, though it still is a negative advise due to the "underweight"
JP morgan is one of the banks UPS has contracted to help with the takeover, i dont know if goldmansachs is invloved.
Seeing how much preperation is needed for these take over bids it is highly unlikely that JP morgan did not knew of ups intentions to take over this stock at the time they gave this advise.
A look at the other public advices from GS or JP does not make one anny happier btw, you can see for yourself that more often then not buy advices are given at a high and sell advises are given near a low.
The example i gave about the computer is true btw, though it is probably a bit exagerated.
In the usa they do take into account improved performances when measuring inflation, not only with computers but also with cars for example.
If the performance rises with 100% and the price rises with 50% (or stays the same as often is the case with computers) they do measure that part as a negative inflation, this has masked a huge part of the inflation.
The other huge part of masking inflation is undervaluing the rising prices of houses.
Houses went up much faster then inflation, even now after the bubble has bursted in the usa, houses still are up more from 2000 then the normal inflation.
I dont know exactly for what percentage housing prices make part of the totall inflation figure but seeing that the average person spends 1/3rd of what he will spend his entire life on a house, it should be 33% realy
It is alot lower , though i dont know how low exactly.
The person quitting goldman is also on vid btw, not sure if posted already.
http://www.bloomberg.com/video/88414292/
Last edit: 2012-03-16 04:56:00 |
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| Glacierz United States. March 16 2012 04:46. Posts 467 | Profile Blog # |
Performance and prices do not form a linear relationship, how prices should be adjusted due to improvement in performance is probably based on a complex set of subjective rules. Technological improvements make same-quality goods cheaper by depreciating obsolete version of products, this doesn't mean deflation...
I do agree on the housing part. The valuation of real estate is fairly subjective and you don't get accurate values until there is a new transaction in the area. However, the current lack of demand in the real estate market will make it hard to argue that properties are worth more than what's reported on paper. |
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| Boblion France. March 16 2012 04:51. Posts 7797 | Profile Blog # |
On March 15 2012 15:19 pathetic fool wrote:
It wasn’t just about making money; this alone will not sustain a firm for so long. It had something to do with pride and belief in the organization. I am sad to say that I look around today and see virtually no trace of the culture that made me love working for this firm for many years. I no longer have the pride, or the belief.
Spoken like a true samaritan hahaha. Bankers aren't greedy for sure.Last edit: 2012-03-16 04:52:40 |
| | fuck all those elitists brb watching streams of elite players. |
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| remedium United States. March 16 2012 05:02. Posts 211 | Profile # |
| Interesting timing for this piece, given the absolute disaster that is the El Paso / Kinder Morgan deal, and the way Goldman steadfastly refused to step aside for Morgan Stanley despite owning 19% of KM. |
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| Iranon United States. March 16 2012 05:51. Posts 963 | Profile Blog # |
| Interesting piece. Honestly I'm pretty surprised to hear that there ever WAS a culture of caring about clients at a firm like Goldman Sachs... When I was a senior in college a handful of years ago, the easy road to take after graduation was reaching out to alumni contacts to land an entry level position at whatever investment firm would take you. It was pretty clear (and celebrated) to all involved that it was a purely materialistic thing -- you put on your power ties and kiss some asses and work 100-hour weeks for a couple decades, then retire early with an obscene amount of money largely acquired through stepping on throats and blow it on hookers and condos or whatever. No thanks. |
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| DocTheMedic United States. March 16 2012 06:29. Posts 75 | Profile # |
On March 16 2012 05:51 Iranon wrote:
Interesting piece. Honestly I'm pretty surprised to hear that there ever WAS a culture of caring about clients at a firm like Goldman Sachs... When I was a senior in college a handful of years ago, the easy road to take after graduation was reaching out to alumni contacts to land an entry level position at whatever investment firm would take you. It was pretty clear (and celebrated) to all involved that it was a purely materialistic thing -- you put on your power ties and kiss some asses and work 100-hour weeks for a couple decades, then retire early with an obscene amount of money largely acquired through stepping on throats and blow it on hookers and condos or whatever. No thanks.
Well he didn't say anything about stepping on non-clientele throats or blowing his money on hookers and condos. All he said was firms used to follow "clients come first" since that's what appeals to the honest, hardworking image of business America. Of course, this motto is just a different veiled form of business as moral good, designed to fool people who have internalized without understanding that there is no morality in business.Last edit: 2012-03-16 06:30:43 |
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| paralleluniverse Australia. March 16 2012 07:06. Posts 2957 | Profile # |
On March 16 2012 03:41 Rassy wrote:http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/price_clubbed_in_jRGGyS9wKfAKjxAs0bkVnOIt must be easy for you to dismiss everything that disagrees with your worldview as 'conspiracy'. The only hatter here is you. You don't even live in America and you are telling me that I must be making this up when I have to go to the grocery store, pay bills, gas, and all the basic amenities. Hell, just comparison to 10 years ago indicates an insane inflation rate, let's not even go back to 1970! I am not even that old and I remember when gas used to be .79 a gallon, a can of soda pop was .25, milk was 1$ a gallon, candy was between .01 and .05$, energy and water bills under 50$ a month. Wages never keep pace with inflation. When a currency is inflated the purchasing power is always transferred to the wealthy and connected as they are the first to receive the new money. It's not called a Cantillon effect for no reason. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The EPI can't be taken seriously. It does not measure core inflation, and the increase is driven my higher gas prices, which is already included in the CPI, and not even caused by the Fed's policies. Lol usa inflation uses hedonic pricing, official inflation figures in all countrys are a huge joke btw, not only in the usa say 4 gb computer would have costed 20.000$ in 2004, while it costs 1000$ now, then they count that as 95% deflation for computers over the years 2004-2012. Well this is simplified a bit off course but it realy works this way and its not even completely unreasonable, still it makes official figures verry unreliable.
That's completely false.
I suggest reading the CPI methodology before claiming these falsehoods.
The CPI takes a representative sample for each a elementary aggregate, so in the case of a computer, a 4 GB computer that fell 95% in prices is not representative of the types of computer being sold, such a computer price would not be collected. They also do not take price of 1 computer, but many computers in their sample.
Furthermore, the weights in CPI are derived from an household expenditure survey and are updated, so they are not arbitrary, like the EPI, they correctly represent the types of goods people buy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cpi
http://www.ilo.org/public/english/bureau/stat/guides/cpi/index.htm#manualLast edit: 2012-03-16 13:11:21 |
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| paralleluniverse Australia. March 16 2012 07:38. Posts 2957 | Profile # |
On March 16 2012 03:53 liberal wrote:
Show nested quote +On March 16 2012 03:46 Mohdoo wrote:
Can't believe people still believe in anything except extremely strict regulation of the financial sector after this. The free market's ability to regulate its self is the biggest lie ever.
You mean the free market where government injects inflation, sets interest rates, creates bubble, insures investments, bails out failing companies, and gives all sorts of loop holes and benefits and breaks to some companies at the expense of others? The free market where conglomerates lobby for wealth? The market was bankrupting these firms. The government rescued them. Now if you want to talk about how the corporate world has insulated major decision makers against the consequences of their policies, that is a valid point.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=320893¤tpage=5#97
Particularly the part which says:
This also shows why laissez-faire markets cannot work: a laissez-faire market is necessarily an unregulated market, therefore there would be no mechanism to align the activities of massive investment banks, like GS, with the public interest. The argument that we don't live in a laissez-faire market so that my above criticism does not apply is completely erroneous and misses the point. In a laissez-faire market, there would be no incentive to act properly or ethically.
One might say that it's in GS's long term interest to give correct and proper advice to it's clients. But today it's been proven that's not how they see things. Indeed, this demonstrates another hypothesis needed for efficient laissez-faire markets being completely wrong: rational expectations. In a fantasy world, GS should act in their long term interests which may in fact be for the public good, i.e act according to rational expectations. To think they will do this in the real world we live in is simply delusional. Indeed, a delusion proved false today.
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