| TheSwamp United States. April 12 2012 03:16. Posts 1401 | Profile # |
| I would like to know more about queen energy management. When do I lay down a tumor and with which queen? |
| | MLG: How is your Protoss? Idra: I make Blink Stalkers, so really, really good. |
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| LazinCajun United States. April 12 2012 03:20. Posts 294 | Profile # |
| Yeah, that game was sick. I couldn't believe how much crap nestea had. I hope they release replays. |
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 jax1 Sweden. April 12 2012 03:21. Posts 35 | Profile # |
| does this really work i mean if you up agains blink stalkers you gonna be floating gas because all the ling you gonna make (they rape just roaches). then you need to tech infestors and this build goes out the window am i wrong? |
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| KalWarkov Germany. April 12 2012 03:22. Posts 2806 | Profile Blog # |
| stephano maxed out at 11:04 today on his stream, he said it was his new record. was funny, the immortal sentry push came and he was maxed :D |
| | DiaBoLuS *** HotS Grandmaster level Protoss / 6x GM in WoL & Dota2 very high bracket pub player *** TOP 30 Foreigner Ranking (Blog) - http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=412415 *** |
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| zZzJinzZz United States. April 12 2012 03:37. Posts 13 | Profile # | |
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| KalWarkov Germany. April 12 2012 03:53. Posts 2806 | Profile Blog # |
On April 12 2012 03:21 jax1 wrote:
does this really work i mean if you up agains blink stalkers you gonna be floating gas because all the ling you gonna make (they rape just roaches). then you need to tech infestors and this build goes out the window am i wrong?
a) its meant to counter 2 base allins... you mass roach/ling from 3 base and from minute 8:00 on basically.
b) how do "blinkstalkers rape roaches" please?^^ you have the bigger eco, roaches are cheaper - and at that time you will have speed out.
c) if you make infestors, you simply die oO how can you ever afford to have enough gas and time to tech to infeswtors on 3 base trying to hold a 2 base allin?
just roach ling man!
dont wanna offend you but: you play lower leagues i guess, right? |
| | DiaBoLuS *** HotS Grandmaster level Protoss / 6x GM in WoL & Dota2 very high bracket pub player *** TOP 30 Foreigner Ranking (Blog) - http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=412415 *** |
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| jax1 Sweden. April 12 2012 04:02. Posts 35 | Profile # |
b) how do "blinkstalkers rape roaches" please?^^ you have the bigger eco, roaches are cheaper - and at that time you will have speed out.
i am diamond, well maybe it works if you get the roach count up, im just saying if you only make roaches against someone who makes mass blink stalkers idk you need lings then and then you have to change thing up with the gas. i am almost offended that you say one build can beat everything.Last edit: 2012-04-12 04:04:30 |
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| TangSC Canada. April 12 2012 12:14. Posts 1613 | Profile Blog # |
On April 12 2012 03:16 TheSwamp wrote:
I would like to know more about queen energy management. When do I lay down a tumor and with which queen?
This is a matter of preference. I've seen players a 2nd queen before the 3rd hatchery so they can spread 1 tumor before moving down to the expansion.
Other times, I've seen an early production of 3 consecutive queens in the main (The third queen is used to spread tumors, first 2 for injects at main/natural) then building a 4th queen at the 3rd hatchery to inject there. I personally prefer a 4-queen, 3-hatch style to actively spread creep. |
| | Coaching TangStarcraft.com | Team All-Inspiration.com | Stream Twitch.TV/TangSC |
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| -Jackal- April 12 2012 13:56. Posts 37 | Profile # |
On April 12 2012 03:22 KalWarkov wrote:
stephano maxed out at 11:04 today on his stream, he said it was his new record. was funny, the immortal sentry push came and he was maxed :D
11 min max out... the way stephano does it is protected against viable all-in strats as well... that seems broken to me.
What is worse is when Toss do find a minor build order victory... the Zergs response is to suicide the roaches up the ramp into the natural - killing everything Toss has in the process and effectively ending the game. If it doesn't kill the Toss out right thats ok though, as Zerg has already tech'd and remaxed on Broodlords at that stage :o |
| | Streaming @: www.twitch.tv./tspau1 |
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| Tobberoth Sweden. April 12 2012 16:18. Posts 4545 | Profile # |
On April 12 2012 12:14 TangSC wrote:
Show nested quote +On April 12 2012 03:16 TheSwamp wrote:
I would like to know more about queen energy management. When do I lay down a tumor and with which queen?
This is a matter of preference. I've seen players a 2nd queen before the 3rd hatchery so they can spread 1 tumor before moving down to the expansion. Other times, I've seen an early production of 3 consecutive queens in the main (The third queen is used to spread tumors, first 2 for injects at main/natural) then building a 4th queen at the 3rd hatchery to inject there. I personally prefer a 4-queen, 3-hatch style to actively spread creep.
What I've seen Stephano do is walk down with his first queen from his main as he starts his second queen in his main. He injects his nat with this first queen, starting a queen at the nat about that time. He then waits with this first queen at the nat, put down a tumor, and walks it over to the third. So you get constant injects, and a tumor at your nat. |
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| kmh Finland. April 12 2012 19:20. Posts 235 | Profile # |
On April 12 2012 03:22 KalWarkov wrote:
stephano maxed out at 11:04 today on his stream, he said it was his new record. was funny, the immortal sentry push came and he was maxed :D
A link to a 11:10 max: http://www.twitch.tv/mstephano/b/314651590?t=114m0s
Might take the time to write the build down. |
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| jax1 Sweden. April 12 2012 21:04. Posts 35 | Profile # |
| players play so fucking stupid against him. the first thing they should do is going stargate then he have to change up alot. |
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| jax1 Sweden. April 12 2012 21:13. Posts 35 | Profile # |
| lol the guy he played went double stargate with one fucking sentry and then carrier rushed. that like gold league. he would die to like every all in that exists. |
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| Agathon France. April 12 2012 21:13. Posts 1368 | Profile # |
On April 12 2012 21:04 jax1 wrote:
players play so fucking stupid against him. the first thing they should do is going stargate then he have to change up alot.
He uses to say that a player who makes pheonix vs him is already dead. |
| | "C'est au pied du mur, qu'on voit le mieux...le mur". |
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| The_Darkness United States. April 13 2012 00:09. Posts 784 | Profile # |
| Yesterday, Stephano also hit 192/200 at 12:00 after losing his third to cannons, which is freaking ridiculous. He even built 8-10 early lings and harassed the Protoss for a good portion of the early game, killing several probes. Last edit: 2012-04-13 00:09:43 |
| | To be is to be the value of a bound variable. |
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| TangSC Canada. April 13 2012 00:43. Posts 1613 | Profile Blog # |
On April 13 2012 00:09 The_Darkness wrote:
Yesterday, Stephano also hit 192/200 at 12:00 after losing his third to cannons, which is freaking ridiculous. He even built 8-10 early lings and harassed the Protoss for a good portion of the early game, killing several probes.
Did he do his 11overpool early ling harass? I've seen him open this way to great effect, but I can't decide whether it's a better opening than 15 pool. . . |
| | Coaching TangStarcraft.com | Team All-Inspiration.com | Stream Twitch.TV/TangSC |
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| 00Visor April 13 2012 00:50. Posts 4067 | Profile Blog # |
On April 13 2012 00:43 TangSC wrote:
Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 00:09 The_Darkness wrote:
Yesterday, Stephano also hit 192/200 at 12:00 after losing his third to cannons, which is freaking ridiculous. He even built 8-10 early lings and harassed the Protoss for a good portion of the early game, killing several probes.
Did he do his 11overpool early ling harass? I've seen him open this way to great effect, but I can't decide whether it's a better opening than 15 pool. . .
I have more often seen him not doing damage and sitting there with 6-8 useless lings in the early game. Regarding his midgame is so good, I don't think thats a good risk to take.
(yeah he is getting mapcontrol, but during a time where protoss can't be aggresive and good toss have a probe out somewhere)Last edit: 2012-04-13 00:52:07 |
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| TangSC Canada. April 13 2012 00:51. Posts 1613 | Profile Blog # |
On April 13 2012 00:50 00Visor wrote:
Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 00:43 TangSC wrote:
On April 13 2012 00:09 The_Darkness wrote:
Yesterday, Stephano also hit 192/200 at 12:00 after losing his third to cannons, which is freaking ridiculous. He even built 8-10 early lings and harassed the Protoss for a good portion of the early game, killing several probes.
Did he do his 11overpool early ling harass? I've seen him open this way to great effect, but I can't decide whether it's a better opening than 15 pool. . .
I have more often seen him not doing damage and sitting there with 6-8 useless lings in the early game. Regarding his midgame is so good, I don't think thats a good risk to take.
Well what I'm wondering is whether it really impacts the mid-game that much, I've heard arguments that the 11 Overpool is just as economical as 14/15 pools. |
| | Coaching TangStarcraft.com | Team All-Inspiration.com | Stream Twitch.TV/TangSC |
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| 00Visor April 13 2012 00:54. Posts 4067 | Profile Blog # |
On April 13 2012 00:51 TangSC wrote:
Show nested quote +On April 13 2012 00:50 00Visor wrote:
On April 13 2012 00:43 TangSC wrote:
On April 13 2012 00:09 The_Darkness wrote:
Yesterday, Stephano also hit 192/200 at 12:00 after losing his third to cannons, which is freaking ridiculous. He even built 8-10 early lings and harassed the Protoss for a good portion of the early game, killing several probes.
Did he do his 11overpool early ling harass? I've seen him open this way to great effect, but I can't decide whether it's a better opening than 15 pool. . .
I have more often seen him not doing damage and sitting there with 6-8 useless lings in the early game. Regarding his midgame is so good, I don't think thats a good risk to take.
Well what I'm wondering is whether it really impacts the mid-game that much, I've heard arguments that the 11 Overpool is just as economical as 14/15 pools.
I think thats right. 11 Overpool is only a bit behind in eco. Problem is the amount of lings you make.
Its not a big eco risk, he still won most games, but I think its unnecessary.Last edit: 2012-04-13 00:56:36 |
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 Liquid`Snute Norway. April 13 2012 00:59. Posts 181 | Profile # |
Heres another 11min example, this time maxed out at 11:01. i wonder who can bring it to 10:40 first (edit: if not like 10:25-30) xD
DL: http://drop.sc/158539
+ Show Spoiler [replay comments] +major shortcuts:
- blind 3rd base
- skipped lingspeed
- skipped detection
- ignoring incoming 8min pressure (lucky cancel in this rep)
room for improvement?
- fewer drones and 4gas instead of 5, will it hit max sooner? more safe either way
- a bit late 5gas for the amount of drones.
- macrohatch could even be a 4th, maybe its not needed in the first place with lower drone count?
- get detection in for the build to remain legit and transitionable
- slight saturation balance obviously
It's really braindead but works wonders. Hopefully zergs will be able to optimize 3-4base 4gas mass roach a bit more so we can see some truly crisp timings, and hopefully will P find ways to at the very least survive in those cases where 8min-pressure is not applied.
Good luck everyone! looking forward to the developmentLast edit: 2012-04-13 01:02:50 |
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