[H] Diamond wanting to make masters.

Hi Everyone.

UPDATE: These are the FIRST 5 games I played this season. I know it is not a lot but I have been moving house and at a wedding and haven't had time to play. I want to do at least 5 games a day like this and analyse them. I had a good run, I am sure my next post will have way more losses.

I have been stuck at Diamond for a while now and I want to get into masters. So I am going to make a real effort to practise hard, work on my play and I willing to document and share my whole learning process. I will post my replays here with my analysis and thoughts of how I did. I am looking for help in figuring out what I can do better. What I have done is taking all my replays, win or lose, and applied the following to it.

I am trying to stick to one build per match for now but that might change based on your feedback. I am starting off with the following.

TvT
1 Rax FE with 3 reapers into bio mech. I use the 3 reapers for scouting info and to harass their FE or pressure tech builds.

TvZ
3 OC mech build. I use to open up 1 Reactor Fact into Expand and then 3 factory for mech mid game and then back to bio mech for late game. With the nerf to ghosts I have been struggling lately with the late game and I found that I was quite fond of mech. So I have been trying this super defensive build that gets me up to 200/200 mech army and I aim to push out by 15 minutes.

TvP
I do the 1 Rax gasless FE into 3 rax with fast medivac play. I got the build watching SelecT. This is my worst match up but I have been concentrating on my positioning, micro and my army composition more based on vlogs from LastShadow. I have had a lot more success but it is still quite unstable for me. I either roll them or they roll me based on how well our engagements go.

Matchup - Map
- Why I Won/Lost:
- SQ (Spending Quotient): Based on the work by whatthefat
- Things to improve
- Anything I learnt in particular.

So here we go...

Week 1 Played 5, W = 4, L = 1, D = 0

Game 1: TvZ - oGcIIDecibel on Metropolis LE
Why I Won:
Basically I got quite lucky. He got badly supply blocked at 05:20. He didn't respond at all to my Hellions and I was able to get a ton of free drone kills. After this is over produced lings and then tried to get into my natural which was already walled off and I had siege tanks defending my choke.

SQ: 74.5

Things to improve:
- I didn't watch the mini map and I sacrificed two Hellions to a ling surround. I could have been more cost effective there.
- I built my expo on the low ground because it looked like he wouldn't be able to that aggressive at the start from my scouting.
- I could have transferred probes earlier.
- I should have delayed my gas more to get the earlier CC because I was floating gas I didn't need yet.

Game 2: TvZ - PigeonPunter on Cloud Kingdom
Why I Lost:
I missed a supply depot. I was meant to build one with the SCV that completed the factory and never did. I then had too much mineral and built a CC when I had no clue what was coming. When my hellion caught sight of the roach rush I should have reacted better. Pulled both marines in instead of leaving them to die and save my other Hellion. Then I MIGHT have held it.
- SQ: 72
Things to improve:
- Build order mistake, not too much to learn here.

Game 3: TvT - nuka on Ohana
Why I Won:
My first 3 reapers did a lot of damage so I had a WAY better economy and then he let me kill 2 banshees for free.

SQ: 81

Things to improve:
- Got supply blocked.
- I did see him produce a medivac, I could have had marines on the cliff face at my main.
- Needed gas a little earlier
- Missed some SCVs, will have 1 SCV building and 1 queued when I have 2 bases.

Notes:
- Perhaps the 3 reaper opening is not so good on this map because it is very easy to defend.

Game 4: TvZ - mixan on Metropolis
Why I Won: I think I just out macro'd the guy. I was keeping up with harvesters and then pulled ahead. I got maxed out before he did.

SQ: 91.4

Things to improve:
- Built my 2 refineries too early again. Need to build them only AFTER I start my 3rd CC.
- Need to be WAY more active with the Hellions, denying creep etc.
- Need to watch the minimap more because I lost a lot of harvesters to muta harass.
- @ 18:20 I should have pulled my hellions behind my thors
- I had the resources for an earlier +3 weapons

Game 5: TvT - Rinzler on Daybreak
Why I Won: I got really lucky. I have never played this map before and when I went for the base trade at the end he came back to defend and run through a narrow choke and lost everything.

SQ: 98.62

Things to improve:
- @ 13:00 After stopping his initial drop I should have not been so eager to drop him. I thought I was so far ahead that I could throw an army away to do economic damage. I think I was wrong. I think I should expanded immediately and been more greedy that way while putting pressure on his third. I think 30 marines with medivac could have taken out his third.
- Better scouting, i should have had a marine at each expo or at least patrolling.
- Lost 3 medivacs for no reason. Just poor control

Big lessons for Week 1:
- Double enqueue SCVs after I get two bases up.
- Better control of the Xel Nagas

Replays
Game 1
Game 2
Game 3
Game 4
Game 5

Last edit: 2012-04-17 23:05:31

ishyishy United States. April 17 2012 07:12. Posts 795

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IMO you are taking this too seriously. You dont need to put this much 'effort' into getting to master league.

It's great if you want to improve along the way, but the bottom line is: you need to win games. Whether that means playing a long game, or 1 basing every game, all you have to do is win. If you actually care about what league you are in, then you only care about winning no matter what you think.

I play 1v1 maybe 3-5 times a week, if that. I have a slightly negative win/loss ratio, and even I am in masters. I dont analyze my replays at all, and most games I 1 base all in (mostly because i dont actually know how to do anything else lol). I put such little effort into this game, someone like you would actually call me a liar and say that I dont actually play. Guess what? I am still masters.

As for this thread in general, what do you want out of it? What is the purpose of this thread?

Banchan United States. April 17 2012 07:22. Posts 149

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On April 17 2012 07:12 ishyishy wrote:
IMO you are taking this too seriously. You dont need to put this much 'effort' into getting to master league.

It's great if you want to improve along the way, but the bottom line is: you need to win games. Whether that means playing a long game, or 1 basing every game, all you have to do is win. If you actually care about what league you are in, then you only care about winning no matter what you think.

I play 1v1 maybe 3-5 times a week, if that. I have a slightly negative win/loss ratio, and even I am in masters. I dont analyze my replays at all, and most games I 1 base all in (mostly because i dont actually know how to do anything else lol). I put such little effort into this game, someone like you would actually call me a liar and say that I dont actually play. Guess what? I am still masters.

As for this thread in general, what do you want out of it? What is the purpose of this thread?

so he could brag about going 4-1 in his last 5 games?

dohgg April 17 2012 07:40. Posts 221

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I dont think its a bad thing to take this game 2 seriousley, after all its an hobby, and alot of people like to take their hobbies and the stuff they love to spend their free time seriouskey.. it can be poker, gym or hell.. sc2!

Now to the topic,
U shouldnt be asking urself bout unimportant stuff as my rank, just try to get better and improve your game float, and the rank will come with itself.

Also, u have 1 build for each matchup, which is kinda bad - builds should be adjusting into styles that fit maps. for example not all maps are good for reaper play, and not all maps are good for mech tvz.
You must remmeber one imporatnt point - the higher skilled oponents rank you will be facing the sharper and more "standardier" build you need to have in the long run to get wins and improve in general.

The more your build is relied on the elemnt of suprise and less for being standard the less % it'll have to work on the higher lvl play.

Talk for example bout TvZ mech - theres a reason u barley c it on top levels and that because it get crushed by roaches mobilty and natural parasite infetors. zerg is a race that suppose to respond to his opp on early-mid gamem but saddly, not all zerg really understand that, and will still try to go hard with their gameplan to play infesorlings or mutas which are both get crushed by BFhellions and thors, so in bottom line, the highplat-dia zerg wont make the correct counter and will lose, while u get to highdia-master zerg who will does, and then u'll be stuck with a nice build that will just wont work anymore.

Another point i wanted to mention, playing bio mech tvz is really improving your game alot as u learn to macro split, multistaking drops, and timing pushes much better, then sitting and turtuling to 200/200 mech army and a move.

phiinix United States. April 17 2012 08:46. Posts 1124

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Um, I think the reason you're not in masters is because you don't understand the game well enough. You won 4 games, and 2 of those were because you were lucky? 5 games isn't nearly enough to determine the factors to improve your play. When I gauge a student's level, I always ask for at minimum 10 reps, preferably 15 with 5 for each matchup.

If you're looking for help, you need to be much more clear about what you need help on. Otherwise, this kind of post is much better suited for the blogs section.

yoona2012 Denmark. April 17 2012 08:58. Posts 196

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Is there a hidden question or topic relevant for players to discuss here or else this belongs in the blog section.

Stoopid0boi Australia. April 17 2012 10:06. Posts 48

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Hmm to be honest depending on how you actually execute the reaper opening, I don't like your tvz build. It seems really prone to early aggression. Tbh I play bio in tvt and would probably just kill you if i saw the 3 reapers.

Also a build I've doing against Protoss is a reactor marine into cc. Standard 13 gas but only put 2 in gas. I feel that it lets you get a much bigger army with faster upgrades without sacrificing too much Econ.

Back to you. LOoking at your spending quotient it seems like your macro is fairly decent. (can't watch replays now cuz I'm in phone). If that is the case I think a thin to focus on is your micro and general read of the game.

Another thing I find very useful is to theorycraft about the game more. It gives you a wider understanding of why you are doing specific things. I.e why am I opening reactor hellions? Why should I get faster tanks against Zerg?

Good luck!!

Wrathsc2 United States. April 17 2012 10:16. Posts 1858

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good luck, thats all i got for u xD

A marine walks into a bar and asks, "Wheres the counter?"

FoxTheDream April 17 2012 13:12. Posts 13

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On April 17 2012 07:22 Banchan wrote:

Show nested quote +

so he could brag about going 4-1 in his last 5 games?

That isn't much to brag about. We all have good runs and bad runs. This was a good one and I am sure I am around the corner from a sucky run.

FoxTheDream April 17 2012 13:15. Posts 13

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On April 17 2012 08:46 phiinix wrote:
Um, I think the reason you're not in masters is because you don't understand the game well enough. You won 4 games, and 2 of those were because you were lucky? 5 games isn't nearly enough to determine the factors to improve your play. When I gauge a student's level, I always ask for at minimum 10 reps, preferably 15 with 5 for each matchup.

If you're looking for help, you need to be much more clear about what you need help on. Otherwise, this kind of post is much better suited for the blogs section.

Maybe I should move it into the blogs. I only managed to play 5 games in my first week. I will be playing a ton more. I definitely did get lucky in some of those games. To try to be more clear, I don't know why I am not masters yet. I don't know what I need to be focusing on to get there, so here are my last 5 games played, the only 5 I have played so far.

I was going to post my new games next week. But maybe I will move it to the blog.

FoxTheDream April 17 2012 13:17. Posts 13

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On April 17 2012 08:58 yoona2012 wrote:
Is there a hidden question or topic relevant for players to discuss here or else this belongs in the blog section.

"What should I be focusing on to get into masters? I don't know why I am not there yet and I can't figure it out so here are my last 5 games, please have a look" But I was limited to the number of characters I could use.

Last edit: 2012-04-17 13:18:17

13_Doomblaze_37 United States. April 17 2012 15:14. Posts 705

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Are you trying to improve, or trying to get into masters? You can get into masters by 3rax allining every game, but it won't improve your play very much. If you're trying to improve, your rank and league doesn't matter as much. Wanting to get into masters is an ok goal to start, but if you're not motivated to go past that and improve through masters ,itll be hard to macro your way there in the first place.

dohgg said that you should have more than one build per a matchup. I disagree with this as you are trying to improve your mechanics and gamesense, and not having to worry about your opening helps this a lot. If you're not planning on playing in tourney or high masters, you never need more than 1 opening per matchup. He did however, talk about him bio mech is a good way to play TvZ, and I agree. Marine tank is standard. However, playing pure bio in all three matchups will make you improve the most. It's difficult and frustrating, but it helps you multitask, harass, macro and micro like nothing else will. Playing mech is fine if that's what you want to do, just be aware that it's difficult to play without pressuring zerg once you reach higher levels and they have broodlords out before your push hits, and scout well!

Chill:I showed empathy by making Idra's nineteenth ban on Teamliquid a 2-day

Hiea Denmark. April 17 2012 15:57. Posts 1496

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I think your right, i'm high diamond (top 3) myself, and 90% of masters players I meet do some for of all in, no matter the race.

If you wanna get masters, either all in a lot, or learn to defend very well against all ins.

SpeCtor April 17 2012 16:17. Posts 229

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Rather than say you were lucky, just say it did more damage than expected.

oOOoOphidian United States. April 17 2012 16:27. Posts 1240

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Look less at individual games and more on overall trends in your play / play more games.

http://www.twitch.tv/ooooophidian

Atoissen Norway. April 17 2012 16:28. Posts 810

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Hi Fox

I am not any better then you, so im not gonna sitt and give you advice about gameplay.

Analyzing and preperation is very good, but the most important thing for people to gett better is to play alott!
Dnt spend houres pr day watching replays and analyze everything, ofc, do this once in a while, but most importantly you need to play alott!!

“Strength lies not in defense but in attack.”

aebriol Norway. April 17 2012 16:36. Posts 2064

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On April 17 2012 06:18 FoxTheDream wrote:
Week 1 Played 5, W = 4, L = 1, D = 0

First off, you had a very good post.

However, I want to draw your attention to this line.

Week 1 - 5 games.

I think that's our main problem ... you can't expect to improve rapidly while only playing 5 games a week, rather, you should play at least that much a day. Otherwise, you spend too much time in game thinking about your next step, instead of just doing it.

teamamerica United States. April 17 2012 17:23. Posts 660

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If you honestly want to improve, I'd change your builds into what some pro's are doing, so you have a good sense of how you're doing relative to them in terms of production and shit.

Thorzains TvT will just let you kill a lot of Terrans doing stupid openings. Also super safe vs anything but marine/tank/banshee allin but you can hold it still, it's just pretty hard. The build is actually so beautifully timed, I don't understand how Tzain came up with it.

Bombers TvZ fast 3OC with tanks lets you rofl at any roach push. And then go kill the Zerg at like 14 minutes.

For TvP I haven't found a good style to copy but 3rax drops are pretty good so keep at that I guess. I don't know a good timing for the addons/medivacs yet though.

But if you can not fuck up the timings on Tzains and Bombers openings they're amazing. They've already spent all the hours hammering the builds out, why not just use them.

Adonminus Israel. April 17 2012 17:27. Posts 488

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One guy said that you should either all in or get good all in defense to get into master.

I pretty much agree with that, you can't play your macro game without all in defense. I kinda think defending all ins is easier for terrans. But for me as a protoss, I really like the feeling of defending all ins. I got countless wins from the fact that I defended all those 4 gates, warp prism all ins, dt rushes, blink stalker all ins, 3 rax all ins, marine scv all ins, 111 all ins, all those zerg all ins like speedlings, roaches, banelings. It just gives a ton, really a ton of wins. Sometimes I don't know why people all in at ladder, some all ins will give you more losses than wins, except for example you're in a tournament bo3 against a greedy player, and only then you know for sure your all in gonna work, however for ladder all ins aren't that 100% win takers.

I would recommend improving your all in defense, you learn all the timings, how to analyse info, when to scout and how to properly defend. Then you simply move into the macro and army control practice to successfully win the macro game. But believe me, you need to play a lot of games per day to learn that.

Douillos France. April 17 2012 18:46. Posts 2224

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On April 17 2012 16:36 aebriol wrote:

Show nested quote +

Yeah thats definitily the main problem.

Dont get demoralized to the people telling you "getting into masters is easy". Of course they cheesed their way in 5 seasons ago, by using 4 gate or 3 rax, it was easy. But now they play a single 1V1 just to be able to brag to their friends. They shoudl definitily have a maximum bonus pool in masters like in GM, a lot of people would fall out and stop showing off their skilless performances.

Look a giraffe! Look a fist!!

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