| deo1 United States. April 23 2012 15:59. Posts 195 | Profile # |
Joint BW/SC2 proleague airing on OGN is almost upon us! And most fans are at least a little apprehensive (understandably so) about what the format holds for the future of competitive Starcraft. Rather than argue about which game is better, I want to bring the communities together over one thing we can all agree on: our dislike of mirror matchups! 
So I have a few questions I'd like to poll the community on regarding mirror matchups for both games, because we're going to be seeing our fair share. Everyone try to have fun with this -- there are other threads to discuss the format and the future of Starcraft.
(please only vote in the polls if you are familiar with both BW and SC2. I want the polls to be a true reflection of mirror matchup preference across the games)
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Poll 1 (least favorite mirror):
Poll: Which mirror matchup do you dislike the most?ZvZ (SC2) (346) 36% PvP (SC2) (335) 35% ZvZ (BW) (140) 15% TvT (SC2) (88) 9% TvT (BW) (31) 3% PvP (BW) (21) 2% 961 total votes Your vote: Which mirror matchup do you dislike the most? (Vote): PvP (SC2)
(Vote): PvP (BW)
(Vote): TvT (SC2)
(Vote): TvT (BW)
(Vote): ZvZ (SC2)
(Vote): ZvZ (BW)
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Poll 2 (favorite mirror):
Poll: Which mirror matchup is your favoriteTvT (SC2) (364) 43% PvP (SC2) (145) 17% TvT (BW) (117) 14% ZvZ (SC2) (115) 14% PvP (BW) (66) 8% ZvZ (BW) (40) 5% 847 total votes Your vote: Which mirror matchup is your favorite (Vote): PvP (SC2)
(Vote): PvP (BW)
(Vote): TvT (SC2)
(Vote): TvT (BW)
(Vote): ZvZ (SC2)
(Vote): ZvZ (BW)
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Race specific polls:
+ Show Spoiler +Poll: Which PvP do you enjoy the most?BW PvP (226) 85% SC2 PvP (40) 15% 266 total votes Your vote: Which PvP do you enjoy the most? (Vote): BW PvP
(Vote): SC2 PvP
Poll: Which TvT do you enjoy the most?SC2 TvT (152) 56% BW TvT (118) 44% 270 total votes Your vote: Which TvT do you enjoy the most? (Vote): BW TvT
(Vote): SC2 TvT
Poll: Which ZvZ do you enjoy the most?BW ZvZ (164) 60% SC2 ZvZ (108) 40% 272 total votes Your vote: Which ZvZ do you enjoy the most? (Vote): BW ZvZ
(Vote): SC2 ZvZ
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My answers:
+ Show Spoiler +I dislike SC2 PvP the most of any mirror matchup.
My favorite mirror is BW PvP.
I preferer BW PvP, BW TvT, and SC2 ZvZ
Please discuss your answers with civility. |
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| klibrt United States. April 23 2012 16:08. Posts 522 | Profile # |
I hate ZvZ in sc2 with a passion which making me transition into playing Terran atm. lol
Oh and.. you did post in the SC2 General forum section... so you'll most likely see more votes for sc2 because many won't even know what a PvP in BW was like. |
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| Testuser April 23 2012 16:09. Posts 2620 | Profile Blog # |
| I love PvP - don't really see how you can truly hate it. Most often the player with the better micro and the (smarter) smarts wins. Last edit: 2012-04-23 16:09:59 |
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| forsooth United States. April 23 2012 16:10. Posts 2684 | Profile # |
SC2 PvP is crap. Definitely the worst of the mirrors.
TvT in both games is definitely the best. BW PvP is pretty good too.
ZvZ in both games is meh. Don't hate it, don't love it. |
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| MCDayC United Kingdom. April 23 2012 16:13. Posts 11815 | Profile # |
A bit of a silly poll, alot of people have almost no experience with the BW mirror matchups. From the little I've seen, it goes SC2 PvP < BW ZvZ < SC2 ZvZ in terms spectator enjoyment. But I can't pretend to be an expert.
TvT in both is amazing, BW in terms of strategic depth, SC2 in terms of how many options a player has, and both again in entertainment. Last edit: 2012-04-23 16:14:14 |
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| SenorChang Australia. April 23 2012 16:13. Posts 4389 | Profile Blog # |
| Hmm, you're not going to get objective results asking about BW in a Sc2 forums because people won't have enough experience to answer it. |
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| Terranist United States. April 23 2012 16:15. Posts 2284 | Profile Blog # |
| anything was better than bw zvz. |
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| Viperbird United States. April 23 2012 16:16. Posts 90 | Profile # |
I think PvP in SC2 has evolved to a pretty interesting matchup not that its not 4gate vs 4gate all the time. Immortal play, archon/chargelot, dt's and even Phoenix play makes it pretty interesting to watch.
TvT in SC2 is only cool to watch when its bio vs. mech with lots of drop play. (MMA vs MVP anyone?) If its mech vs mech or marine/tank vs marine/tank its pretty boring. |
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| R3DT1D3 April 23 2012 16:16. Posts 204 | Profile # |
| I never minded any of the mirror matchups in BW unless it was like the 5th one in a row or something but I can't stand more than on PvP or ZvZ in SC2. The builds are just too similar most of the time and there's just so little positional back and forth that I don't find them as appealing as their BW counterparts. |
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| ticklishmusic United States. April 23 2012 16:18. Posts 3222 | Profile Blog # |
| I never thought about it... PvP is my fave mirror in BW, but least favorite in SC2. |
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 Aunvilgod April 23 2012 16:20. Posts 2031 | Profile # |
| SC2 PvP has evolved A LOT. Today it is rather who-gets-more-colossus. |
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| usethis2 April 23 2012 16:21. Posts 1716 | Profile # |
| After watching Nerchio v Monster today at DH I definitely can understand the "thrill" of ZvZ. It's almost heart-attack inducing. |
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| deo1 United States. April 23 2012 16:23. Posts 195 | Profile # |
On April 23 2012 16:13 SenorChang wrote:
Hmm, you're not going to get objective results asking about BW in a Sc2 forums because people won't have enough experience to answer it.
There is no joint subforum for both games, so it has to go somewhere. I don't expect truly objective results (it's the internet) but I thought it would get more visibility in SC2, and from there the most I can do is *ask* that you only vote if you're familiar with both. Hopefully the results will still be interesting. |
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| red4ce United States. April 23 2012 16:26. Posts 7301 | Profile Blog # |
BW:
TvT: Entertainment value entirely dependent on the quality of player. 10/10 when between elite players, 5/10 when between average players, 2/10 when played by low level players. If the game is mass wraith instead of mass dropship take away 2 points, I hate that new style.
ZvZ: 3/10 if it's not a BO win, 0/10 if it's a BO win. Either way still the worst matchup in all professionally played RTS games
PvP: 5/10. Interesting at first glance but it's very SC2-ish with too many BO wins, not much defenders advantage, first battle deciding the outcome of the entire game, and deathball fights.
SC2:
TvT: Has wavered quite a bit but right now I'd give it 6.5/10. Was a lot better back when pure mech was more viable. Not really a fan of all this marine tank business. Glad that mass air units endgame (think Boxer vs Rain) has been losing popularity at least. That was just awful, 40 minutes of boredom for a 10 second payoff so not worth it.
ZvZ and PvP: 3/10. Just meh matchups overall. Both are too volatile, not as much as commonly believed, but still too much for it to be considered a legitimate test of skill. Too many times it boils down to I have more roaches/colossus than you so I win.Last edit: 2012-04-23 16:38:02 |
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| FuRong New Zealand. April 23 2012 16:27. Posts 2683 | Profile # |
I think you should specific whether you mean to play or to watch. For example, SC2 PvP is my least favourite mirror to watch but it's my favourite to play, SC2 TvT is the opposite.
Nothing beats BW TvT played at the highest level though.Last edit: 2012-04-23 16:29:49 |
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| MapleLeafSirup Germany. April 23 2012 16:30. Posts 617 | Profile Blog # |
On April 23 2012 16:15 Terranist wrote:
anything was better than bw zvz.
In my opinion that depends a lot on if the poll means playing or watching. Playing ZvZ could be really stupid and watching ZvZ on anything else than korean progamer level was boring as well. However the ZvZs between korean progamers were the most intense matches overall. Usually these matches were pure back and forth micro battles and the matchup itself was extremely fragile which i found to be really interesting |
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| babylon April 23 2012 16:42. Posts 6231 | Profile Blog # |
On April 23 2012 16:26 red4ce wrote:
ZvZ and PvP: 3/10. Just meh matchups overall. Both are too volatile, not as much as commonly believed, but still too much for it to be considered a legitimate test of skill. Too many times it boils down to I have more roaches/colossus than you so I win.
Honestly, at least PvP has gotten past the 4-gate era. I remember the first time I saw a colossi in pro PvP. It was pretty amazing, ngl. Some funny shenanigans can happen in PvP too (remember Ace vs. Seed(?) where they both went 2-immortal speed-prism drops and passed by each other like ships in the night?), so I'd bump that up to 4/10. Agree with everything else though.Last edit: 2012-04-23 16:43:42 |
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| Shin_Gouki United States. April 23 2012 16:54. Posts 206 | Profile Blog # |
Although ZvZ can be extremely frustrating, I find ZvZ to be my favorite mirror match. The hyper aggressive players make it even more awesome (despite the fact I still lose a lot of them).
I don't care what anyone says, TvT can be soooooooooo boring to watch. Playing it is fun though  |
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| Eatme Switzerland. April 23 2012 17:03. Posts 3746 | Profile Blog # |
For BW: TvT was meh, interesting to play but sometimes boring to watch. The good games were really fucking jawdropingly awesome.
PvP was kinda bland, liked it more in the early days when it was lots of reaverplay. But when it came to tosswars on hunters (were korean clans that only played that, special rules and everything) it was as good as bw can be. Dragoon micro and oooh just so insanely enjoyable.
ZvZ is the mirror I enjoy the most out of all games. From gamebugs +1 ling to mutaplays and that tight feel. Cant really describe why I love this mu so much but I just do.
For SC2: TvT is better now, not as locked and more "ok" games. More like anyother mu in sc2.
PvP is really indefferent to me. Has not really fell for it but I dont dislike it.
ZvZ just sucks and I cant explain why, prolly the banelings and the roaches being slow to kill. ZvZ is just godawful and it sucks to be a zergplayer with this mu atleast 33% of your games. |
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| Censured Czech Republic. April 23 2012 17:09. Posts 527 | Profile Blog # |
Most disliked mirror: BW ZvZ
Most liked mirror: SC2 ZvZ
... is it only me?Last edit: 2012-04-23 17:12:53 |
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