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| windsupernova Mexico. May 30 2012 00:05. Posts 5272 | Profile # |
Wow 2 years in and people are still complaining about the Marine?
And Zealots and Zerglings are not used as much as marines?
Do you guys even play the game? |
| | "Its easy, just trust your CPU".-Boxer on being good at games |  |
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| Giggl3s May 30 2012 00:07. Posts 2 | Profile # |
On May 10 2012 12:04 TheAngelofDeath wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 12:03 -Exalt- wrote:
you mean those flying scouts, err overlords, that you make anyway for supply, are getting a movement speed boost? so now you can't hide ANYTHING early game vs zerg now? sweet..
Yes because hiding tech and making the zerg have to flip a coin is obviously how the game should be played!
Yes because having maphacks and knowing exactly what to do is obviously how Zerg should be played!
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 Boner55 Thailand. May 30 2012 00:09. Posts 31 | Profile # |
Bad game Design ever. You should look add-on Terran.
1.250mm Strike Cannons ? Crap skill
2.Caduceus Reactor > Speed Medivac is better
Compare to Protoss.
1.Blink
2.Hallucination
Terran can't make new Strategy because Bad game Design. Fix it Blizz
P.S. Sorry my english is so bad.
User was warned for this post |
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| ][Primarch][ Sweden. May 30 2012 00:14. Posts 302 | Profile # |
On May 27 2012 08:52 Flonomenalz wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 08:24 teamhozac wrote:
On May 27 2012 07:44 convention wrote:
On May 27 2012 06:53 teamhozac wrote:
On May 26 2012 05:31 Dalavita wrote:
On May 26 2012 02:45 Durp wrote:
I can guarantee any terran player posting complaints here that you will not improve, nor will the balance of the game, by you typing your grievances here. However, play more and practice more, and your TvP will stabilize.
Funny. This is exactly what terrans were telling zergs and protosses back in the day. You know what happened? Blizzard buffed them. They didn't learn to play at all. Based on Blizzards track record it's better to keep whining.
Yeah but they only listen to zerg and protoss whine, not terran
Yeah, they listened to the zerg and protoss, because when they were whining, the GSL was almost all terran. Every tournament was won by terran. The W/L ratios were massively in terran's favor. The reason they don't listen to terran whining right now is because W/L are about 50%, terrans win about 33% of the tournaments, and GSL has a very good racial distribution for the first time ever. In other words, the game is finally close to being statistically balanced... which I'm guessing is why you are whining now?
Yeah because we can all play as well as MKP and MVP, obviously terran needs more nerfs since these guys can consistently win, terran must be OP
This is literally the worst argument ever that is constantly proposed by low level players. "Only X players can play to the point that the game is balanced derp derp" Dude, if you're a T in diamond, your Z opponent in diamond isn't doing anything that much better than you. His unit control is probably about the same as yours. His macro probably about the same. If you're losing to any a-move deathball a la BL/infestor, learn to split. Really. Learn how to transition into Thor/Viking/Tank late game. It's not that hard, considering that your opponent WILL make just as many mistakes as you do. There's no imbalance at diamond level, or any level beyond high GM. There might be TvZ imbalance slightly in favor of Z late game, but I think it balances it with how strong Terran is before that. There most definitely is (imo) late game PvT/PvZ imbalance, but again, that doesn't affect anyone below a certain level. It's just disgusting to see TL flooded with perpetual balance whine when the whiners have so much room to still improve. We all have room to improve. Let the pros do the balance talk.
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| | Huge fan of Empire Kas, The Destroyer of Worlds, The Machine, The Second Terminator, The Supreme Robot! |  |
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| Berceno Spain. May 30 2012 00:14. Posts 391 | Profile # |
On May 30 2012 00:05 windsupernova wrote:
Wow 2 years in and people are still complaining about the Marine?
And Zealots and Zerglings are not used as much as marines?
Do you guys even play the game?
I dont support that marine cry but you must realise thta marines are units really cheap that counter everyhthing in this game, marines are way more useful than zealots or zerlings |
| | protoss living in da ghetto |  |
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| Shiori May 30 2012 00:16. Posts 2990 | Profile Blog # |
On May 30 2012 00:07 Giggl3s wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 12:04 TheAngelofDeath wrote:
On May 10 2012 12:03 -Exalt- wrote:
you mean those flying scouts, err overlords, that you make anyway for supply, are getting a movement speed boost? so now you can't hide ANYTHING early game vs zerg now? sweet..
Yes because hiding tech and making the zerg have to flip a coin is obviously how the game should be played!
Yes because having maphacks and knowing exactly what to do is obviously how Zerg should be played!
While this is obviously extreme, I think it brings up an important point: how much scouting do we really need? To some extent, a lot of Sc2 revolves around making educated guesses. I see that Zerg doesn't have a third and so I prepare for 2base Muta or a more immediate all-in. I have no real way of knowing which all-in it is, so I just play safer in general. Similarly, before the Overlord buff, Zergs used to be able to check my gas timings and infer that I was all-inning. They didn't know precisely which all-in I was doing. Now, they can very commonly actually scout my buildings and see if I have a Twilight, Robo, or Stargate. I question why Zerg needs this advantage when they were doing pretty good beforehand. |
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| Berceno Spain. May 30 2012 00:16. Posts 391 | Profile # |
On May 30 2012 00:14 ][Primarch][ wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 27 2012 08:52 Flonomenalz wrote:
On May 27 2012 08:24 teamhozac wrote:
On May 27 2012 07:44 convention wrote:
On May 27 2012 06:53 teamhozac wrote:
On May 26 2012 05:31 Dalavita wrote:
On May 26 2012 02:45 Durp wrote:
I can guarantee any terran player posting complaints here that you will not improve, nor will the balance of the game, by you typing your grievances here. However, play more and practice more, and your TvP will stabilize.
Funny. This is exactly what terrans were telling zergs and protosses back in the day. You know what happened? Blizzard buffed them. They didn't learn to play at all. Based on Blizzards track record it's better to keep whining.
Yeah but they only listen to zerg and protoss whine, not terran
Yeah, they listened to the zerg and protoss, because when they were whining, the GSL was almost all terran. Every tournament was won by terran. The W/L ratios were massively in terran's favor. The reason they don't listen to terran whining right now is because W/L are about 50%, terrans win about 33% of the tournaments, and GSL has a very good racial distribution for the first time ever. In other words, the game is finally close to being statistically balanced... which I'm guessing is why you are whining now?
Yeah because we can all play as well as MKP and MVP, obviously terran needs more nerfs since these guys can consistently win, terran must be OP
This is literally the worst argument ever that is constantly proposed by low level players. "Only X players can play to the point that the game is balanced derp derp" Dude, if you're a T in diamond, your Z opponent in diamond isn't doing anything that much better than you. His unit control is probably about the same as yours. His macro probably about the same. If you're losing to any a-move deathball a la BL/infestor, learn to split. Really. Learn how to transition into Thor/Viking/Tank late game. It's not that hard, considering that your opponent WILL make just as many mistakes as you do. There's no imbalance at diamond level, or any level beyond high GM. There might be TvZ imbalance slightly in favor of Z late game, but I think it balances it with how strong Terran is before that. There most definitely is (imo) late game PvT/PvZ imbalance, but again, that doesn't affect anyone below a certain level. It's just disgusting to see TL flooded with perpetual balance whine when the whiners have so much room to still improve. We all have room to improve. Let the pros do the balance talk.
Actually in some cases the lower you get the more imbalance you get to see. A Terran army requires massive micro while Zerg and Protoss in comparison does not. For players like MKP and MVP godlike micro can come naturally but for this diamond terran you are talking about it will not. This diamond terran will need to micro better than his Z or P opponent to win. It's the game design atm and EZ logic.
No this is not true at all, micro is almost useless in low leagues for all races, if you play with better macro you will win |
| | protoss living in da ghetto | |
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| DarkPlasmaBall United States. May 30 2012 00:21. Posts 20107 | Profile Blog # |
On May 30 2012 00:07 Giggl3s wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 10 2012 12:04 TheAngelofDeath wrote:
On May 10 2012 12:03 -Exalt- wrote:
you mean those flying scouts, err overlords, that you make anyway for supply, are getting a movement speed boost? so now you can't hide ANYTHING early game vs zerg now? sweet..
Yes because hiding tech and making the zerg have to flip a coin is obviously how the game should be played!
Yes because having maphacks and knowing exactly what to do is obviously how Zerg should be played!
You realize that maphacks work for the entire game, right? Assuming that Zerg can automatically get a scout in now at any point in the game is just plain false. The Zerg will have a better idea of what to do for the first few minutes of the game, and then he'll still have to try hard to scout later on, when there's more anti-air.
The Zerg overlord buff should only be relevant for the first few minutes of the game if his Terran or Protoss opponent has decent awareness of his own base, considering 3-4 marines or stalkers can still take out the buffed overlord.
The Zerg needed the increased speed for scouting before 8 minutes. Afterwards, it'd be pretty much irrelevant anyway (or, at least, the opponent's fault for letting the scout in).
Nice first post, by the way. |
| | "Those who can, teach. Those who can't, whine about teachers." ~Me |  |
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| Neurosis United States. May 30 2012 00:22. Posts 891 | Profile # |
On May 30 2012 00:14 Berceno wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 00:05 windsupernova wrote:
Wow 2 years in and people are still complaining about the Marine?
And Zealots and Zerglings are not used as much as marines?
Do you guys even play the game?
I dont support that marine cry but you must realise thta marines are units really cheap that counter everyhthing in this game, marines are way more useful than zealots or zerlings
chargelots and speedlings are pretty incredible units in their own rights, but I would agree that they aren't quite as powerful as marines (especially with great micro). That said, both zerg and protoss have infinitely better late game tech AND they benefit from playing on large maps whereas terran gains a disadvantage. I bring that up because maps just keep getting bigger and bigger which allows players to not only get late game tech out easier, but a zerg can abuse their incredible speed and a protoss can abuse the fact that warpgates literally don't care about distance whereas a terran still has to walk his slow ass army across the map. |
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| Salteador Neo Andorra. May 30 2012 00:28. Posts 3681 | Profile # |
On May 30 2012 00:05 windsupernova wrote:
Wow 2 years in and people are still complaining about the Marine?
And Zealots and Zerglings are not used as much as marines?
Do you guys even play the game?
Well I'm not personally complaining, just talking about stuff. Of course someone started with how the marine is the main core problem for all the terran lategame problems (that's all the QQ terran players we have had these past months) and how the game was balanced around them. Which I agree with.
Then some other guys said hey the marine is not OP, it's used as much as Zealots and Lings.
Finally we somehow finished talking about MC's PvZ 
And I don't play the game. I have more fun watching pros and playing other games. |
| | Revolutionist fan | |
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| Garmer May 30 2012 00:35. Posts 1126 | Profile # |
| blizzard does not care anymore about WOL this is why they throw random balances, that make the game more and more boring, they are already on HOTS, for them WOL is already dead |
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| Batch Sweden. May 30 2012 00:36. Posts 661 | Profile # |
On May 30 2012 00:09 Boner55 wrote:
Bad game Design ever. You should look add-on Terran.
1.250mm Strike Cannons ? Crap skill
2.Caduceus Reactor > Speed Medivac is better
Compare to Protoss.
1.Blink
2.Hallucination
Terran can't make new Strategy because Bad game Design. Fix it Blizz
P.S. Sorry my english is so bad.
Troll?
Why didn't you compare Blink and Hallucination with Stim and Concussive shells instead? |
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| lamiller United States. May 30 2012 00:38. Posts 66 | Profile # |
| Blizzard can fix all of this by trial and error. They will make a specific map with slight balances changes like they did with this past patch(except for the queen range buff(just stupid Blizzard)) but this will happen and they will see if there is any imbalances or if it fixes any imbalances. Blizzard can fix this but they are hyping up HoTS way to much and they want people to buy it so I find that they have little to no motivation to seriously look at balance changes. Because then you get ridiculous Buff's like the Queen Range |
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| tranmillitary May 30 2012 00:42. Posts 210 | Profile # |
Most of the people here that are crying... are crying because they can't get into a higher league. IT'S NOT THE RACE, IT'S YOU. If it's so easy to get to GM with Toss or Zerg, THAN DO IT. Why stick to Terran if they suck so bad??
People think they're better than they really are. I'm a masters player on NA and i know that's my skill set. I know i'm not good enough for GM. Some people are are delusional. Switch to another race if you think it's so imbalance. Chances are that you will be in the same division no matter what race you are.
Bad game design?? Show me one game with better game design. why don't you quit SC2 and play whatever game is so much better than SC2. No one is forcing anyone here to play SC2. So annoying with so many whiners on this forum. |
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| Garmer May 30 2012 00:55. Posts 1126 | Profile # |
On May 30 2012 00:42 tranmillitary wrote:
Most of the people here that are crying... are crying because they can't get into a higher league. IT'S NOT THE RACE, IT'S YOU. If it's so easy to get to GM with Toss or Zerg, THAN DO IT. Why stick to Terran if they suck so bad??
People think they're better than they really are. I'm a masters player on NA and i know that's my skill set. I know i'm not good enough for GM. Some people are are delusional. Switch to another race if you think it's so imbalance. Chances are that you will be in the same division no matter what race you are.
Bad game design?? Show me one game with better game design. why don't you quit SC2 and play whatever game is so much better than SC2. No one is forcing anyone here to play SC2. So annoying with so many whiners on this forum.
Show me one game with better game design
seriously? |
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| 00Zarathustra Bolivia. May 30 2012 01:14. Posts 330 | Profile Blog # |
On May 30 2012 00:55 Garmer wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 00:42 tranmillitary wrote:
Most of the people here that are crying... are crying because they can't get into a higher league. IT'S NOT THE RACE, IT'S YOU. If it's so easy to get to GM with Toss or Zerg, THAN DO IT. Why stick to Terran if they suck so bad??
People think they're better than they really are. I'm a masters player on NA and i know that's my skill set. I know i'm not good enough for GM. Some people are are delusional. Switch to another race if you think it's so imbalance. Chances are that you will be in the same division no matter what race you are.
Bad game design?? Show me one game with better game design. why don't you quit SC2 and play whatever game is so much better than SC2. No one is forcing anyone here to play SC2. So annoying with so many whiners on this forum.
seriously?
BROOD WAR!!!!
And yes I still play BW and I would like to keep watching BW but they are taking away my pro gamers. 
I also play SC2 but it is not as fun because of this bad game design. I can say the same about watching pro SC2. |
| | Zarathustra/eSpi.Cocky on Iccup || "You can't spell aNal_Rape without Nal_Ra" | |
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| FiWiFaKi Canada. May 30 2012 01:17. Posts 2463 | Profile Blog # |
On May 30 2012 01:14 00Zarathustra wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 00:55 Garmer wrote:
On May 30 2012 00:42 tranmillitary wrote:
Most of the people here that are crying... are crying because they can't get into a higher league. IT'S NOT THE RACE, IT'S YOU. If it's so easy to get to GM with Toss or Zerg, THAN DO IT. Why stick to Terran if they suck so bad??
People think they're better than they really are. I'm a masters player on NA and i know that's my skill set. I know i'm not good enough for GM. Some people are are delusional. Switch to another race if you think it's so imbalance. Chances are that you will be in the same division no matter what race you are.
Bad game design?? Show me one game with better game design. why don't you quit SC2 and play whatever game is so much better than SC2. No one is forcing anyone here to play SC2. So annoying with so many whiners on this forum.
Show me one game with better game designseriously?
BROOD WAR!!!! And yes I still play BW and I would like to keep watching BW but they are taking away my pro gamers. I also play SC2 but it is not as fun because of this bad game design. I can say the same about watching pro SC2.
Now name a game not made by Blizzard, lmao.
I prefer BW myself, but SC2 is a better suited eSport than BW, you need to keep a casual audience, BW doesn't do that. |
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| BeeNu May 30 2012 01:19. Posts 615 | Profile # |
On May 30 2012 00:16 Shiori wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 00:07 Giggl3s wrote:
On May 10 2012 12:04 TheAngelofDeath wrote:
On May 10 2012 12:03 -Exalt- wrote:
you mean those flying scouts, err overlords, that you make anyway for supply, are getting a movement speed boost? so now you can't hide ANYTHING early game vs zerg now? sweet..
Yes because hiding tech and making the zerg have to flip a coin is obviously how the game should be played!
Yes because having maphacks and knowing exactly what to do is obviously how Zerg should be played!
While this is obviously extreme, I think it brings up an important point: how much scouting do we really need? To some extent, a lot of Sc2 revolves around making educated guesses. I see that Zerg doesn't have a third and so I prepare for 2base Muta or a more immediate all-in. I have no real way of knowing which all-in it is, so I just play safer in general. Similarly, before the Overlord buff, Zergs used to be able to check my gas timings and infer that I was all-inning. They didn't know precisely which all-in I was doing. Now, they can very commonly actually scout my buildings and see if I have a Twilight, Robo, or Stargate. I question why Zerg needs this advantage when they were doing pretty good beforehand.
I just want to point out that Zerg typically *needs* to have very good scouting to not simply die. Playing Terran and Protoss a lot more generally safe is a lot easier than it is for Zerg, giving Zerg stronger overlord scouting is just necessary.
Let me try to put this into context for you, I play Zerg at like a mid-high masters level, but I'm absolutely horrible at playing Terran, like I play Terran at like a platinum level, like there is generally no way I should be able to beat anyone above Diamond with my Terran, I'm just god-awful. However, before the latest patch I could actually take down high Masters Zergs with Terran simply by using a few Marines to deny all overlord scouting, throw up a bunker at the front to feign an expansion and I just 2port Banshee and win. I beat a lot of high Masters Zergs with this and it was ridiculously easy to do. Nowadays I still might be able to pull it off but it would be a LOT harder and riskier to try and do that.
If you really want Zerg to have slower Overlords again then I dare you to try and play with them vs cheesy people who simply throw a couple marines at the edge of their base, you'd better enjoy being forced to completely flip coins over which all-in they may or may not be doing.Last edit: 2012-05-30 01:21:38 |
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| -Kira May 30 2012 01:24. Posts 352 | Profile Blog # |
| I've heard that new Fast & Furious movie is going to feature Overlords instead of cars. |
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| 00Zarathustra Bolivia. May 30 2012 01:25. Posts 330 | Profile Blog # |
On May 30 2012 01:17 FiWiFaKi wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 01:14 00Zarathustra wrote:
On May 30 2012 00:55 Garmer wrote:
On May 30 2012 00:42 tranmillitary wrote:
Most of the people here that are crying... are crying because they can't get into a higher league. IT'S NOT THE RACE, IT'S YOU. If it's so easy to get to GM with Toss or Zerg, THAN DO IT. Why stick to Terran if they suck so bad??
People think they're better than they really are. I'm a masters player on NA and i know that's my skill set. I know i'm not good enough for GM. Some people are are delusional. Switch to another race if you think it's so imbalance. Chances are that you will be in the same division no matter what race you are.
Bad game design?? Show me one game with better game design. why don't you quit SC2 and play whatever game is so much better than SC2. No one is forcing anyone here to play SC2. So annoying with so many whiners on this forum.
Show me one game with better game designseriously?
BROOD WAR!!!! And yes I still play BW and I would like to keep watching BW but they are taking away my pro gamers. I also play SC2 but it is not as fun because of this bad game design. I can say the same about watching pro SC2.
Now name a game not made by Blizzard, lmao. I prefer BW myself, but SC2 is a better suited eSport than BW, you need to keep a casual audience, BW doesn't do that.
What? BW made eSports!!!
This "in the name of eSports" mentality is starting to piss me off. I want a fun well designed competitive game!!! Not a game where I have to convince myself to play and support "in the name of eSports" |
| | Zarathustra/eSpi.Cocky on Iccup || "You can't spell aNal_Rape without Nal_Ra" | |
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