 TheYango United States. May 29 2012 00:39. Posts 15762 | Profile # |
On May 29 2012 00:29 Shikyo wrote:
I prefer lifesteal because that way I can heal like 5k an attack from range against a lot of mobs and I also like how the crit splash from Wrath makes me almost invulnerable when against a huge clump of monsters. It will also scale later on.
Some brief math:
You have ~19000 DPS, with 1.68 attack speed. This means your average hit (averaged over crits) hits for about 11.3k damage. You have 5.9% lifesteal. Factoring in the Inferno 80% lifesteal reduction, this means you're only getting 133 HP back per hit on average DPS. There is NO way you're getting 5k an attack with lifesteal. A similar amount of life on hit is piss easy to get--even accounting for the %-modifiers for different skills on life-on-hit, you probably only like 250 life-on-hit to get more healing from it than your lifesteal is giving you right now.
The math has been done by many other people. You need an OBSCENE amount of damage for lifesteal to outdo comparable values' worth of life on hit. Even Kripparian, who is probably the most well-geared Barbarian in the game right now, is only doing about a quarter of the DPS necessary to make 12% lifesteal (the most possible lifesteal getting it in every possible slot and taking the 3% passive) equivalent to his life on hit.
On May 29 2012 00:29 Shikyo wrote:
My weapon is a normal 761.8 DPS axe with 42% crit, last time I checked those were like 50k.
If a 761 DPS axe is 50k, then I am officially jealous of the EU AH prices.Last edit: 2012-05-29 00:41:40 |
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| Shikyo Finland. May 29 2012 00:40. Posts 20142 | Profile Blog # |
On May 29 2012 00:39 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 00:29 Shikyo wrote:
I prefer lifesteal because that way I can heal like 5k an attack from range against a lot of mobs and I also like how the crit splash from Wrath makes me almost invulnerable when against a huge clump of monsters. It will also scale later on.
Some brief math: You have ~19000 DPS, with 1.68 attack speed. This means your average hit (averaged over crits) hits for about 11.3k damage. You have 5.9% lifesteal. Factoring in the Inferno 80% lifesteal reduction, this means you're only getting 133 HP back per hit on average DPS. There is NO way you're getting 5k an attack with lifesteal. A similar amount of life on hit is piss easy to get. The math has been done by many other people. You need an OBSCENE amount of damage for lifesteal to outdo comparable values' worth of life on hit. Even Kripparian, who is probably the most well-geared Barbarian in the game right now, is only doing about a quarter of the DPS necessary to make 12% lifesteal (the most possible lifesteal getting it in every possible slot and taking the 3% passive) equivalent to his life on hit.
Well when I use Seismic Slam on a huge mob it heals for thousands, I'm mostly a ranged barb anyway. |
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| TheYango United States. May 29 2012 00:43. Posts 15762 | Profile # |
On May 29 2012 00:40 Shikyo wrote:
Well when I use Seismic Slam on a huge mob it heals for thousands, I'm mostly a ranged barb anyway.
Even if that were the case, you'd still probably need less than 400 life on hit to make life on hit give you more healing than your lifesteal is currently giving (I'm not sure on the loh %-modifier for Seismic Slam, I'm assuming it's like 50%).
Realistically, any situation where you actually have enough mobs that you'd get that kind of insane healing, you could probably Revenge-tank them down anyway for similar amounts of healing. IMO life-on-hit feels like it makes the most difference when you're fighting a relatively small number of mobs and can't rely on Revenge healing.Last edit: 2012-05-29 00:46:08 |
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| Shikyo Finland. May 29 2012 00:48. Posts 20142 | Profile Blog # |
On May 29 2012 00:43 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 00:40 Shikyo wrote:
Well when I use Seismic Slam on a huge mob it heals for thousands, I'm mostly a ranged barb anyway.
Even if that were the case, you'd still probably need less than 400 life on hit to make life on hit give you more healing than your lifesteal is currently giving (I'm not sure on the loh %-modifier for Seismic Slam, I'm assuming it's like 50%).
Yeah but as I said, lifesteal scales better into the future. My weapon doesn't even have any lifesteal yet, I'm going to buy a better weapon with more DPS and lifesteal, and then it'll heal for a more significant amount. It also works incredibly well with Wrath against elites.
I don't use revenge.
Hmm maybe those weapons are a bit more than 50k, when I search for that amount all items in that range are sold <_> But at least you can get one like that if you hunt around a bit. Last edit: 2012-05-29 00:51:16 |
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| KalWarkov Germany. May 29 2012 00:50. Posts 2806 | Profile Blog # |
On May 29 2012 00:48 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 00:43 TheYango wrote:
On May 29 2012 00:40 Shikyo wrote:
Well when I use Seismic Slam on a huge mob it heals for thousands, I'm mostly a ranged barb anyway.
Even if that were the case, you'd still probably need less than 400 life on hit to make life on hit give you more healing than your lifesteal is currently giving (I'm not sure on the loh %-modifier for Seismic Slam, I'm assuming it's like 50%).
Yeah but as I said, lifesteal scales better into the future. My weapon doesn't even have any lifesteal yet, I'm going to buy a better weapon with more DPS and lifesteal, and then it'll heal for a more significant amount. It also works incredibly well with Wrath against elites. I don't use revenge.
you are a very, very strange barb :D and life on hit is still better... |
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| TheYango United States. May 29 2012 00:53. Posts 15762 | Profile # |
On May 29 2012 00:50 KalWarkov wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 00:48 Shikyo wrote:
On May 29 2012 00:43 TheYango wrote:
On May 29 2012 00:40 Shikyo wrote:
Well when I use Seismic Slam on a huge mob it heals for thousands, I'm mostly a ranged barb anyway.
Even if that were the case, you'd still probably need less than 400 life on hit to make life on hit give you more healing than your lifesteal is currently giving (I'm not sure on the loh %-modifier for Seismic Slam, I'm assuming it's like 50%).
Yeah but as I said, lifesteal scales better into the future. My weapon doesn't even have any lifesteal yet, I'm going to buy a better weapon with more DPS and lifesteal, and then it'll heal for a more significant amount. It also works incredibly well with Wrath against elites. I don't use revenge.
you are a very, very strange barb :D and life on hit is still better...
I mean, it sounds like he's doing something like this: http://www.reddit.com/r/Diablo/comments/u25re/barberian_inferno_solo_it_has_been_done/
But I maintain that setup isn't sustainable at lower gear levels because you need DPS numbers that high to make the lifesteal worthwhile. |
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| Shikyo Finland. May 29 2012 00:57. Posts 20142 | Profile Blog # |
Yeah of course it isn't, that's why I said that I need to get 5 more ite...
whatever -_- |
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| TheYango United States. May 29 2012 01:00. Posts 15762 | Profile # |
On May 29 2012 00:57 Shikyo wrote:
Yeah of course it isn't, that's why I said that I need to get 5 more ite...
whatever -_-
No you misunderstood me. I don't mean lower gear levels as in "I'll just replace these 5 pieces and I'll be set".
I meant lower gear levels as in "I can't possibly farm the gold for this myself, and can only get the gear necessary to make this work if I'm getting fed a lot of shit".
The guy I linked is pulling 50k DPS, and is still probably only getting the equivalent of like 800 life on hit. Find me another Barbarian that has the items to pull 50k DPS without gimping every other stat.Last edit: 2012-05-29 01:01:32 |
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| Dead9 United States. May 29 2012 01:06. Posts 2327 | Profile Blog # |
it's actually not that hard with thrower build cus u just stack crit%/critdmg/as and generally skimp on survivability a lot
my roommate's hit 35k dps (war cry up) with some pretty awful gear
edit: i think he might use a 2h tho, i'll have to check laterLast edit: 2012-05-29 01:07:23 |
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| Shikyo Finland. May 29 2012 01:24. Posts 20142 | Profile Blog # |
On May 29 2012 01:00 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 00:57 Shikyo wrote:
Yeah of course it isn't, that's why I said that I need to get 5 more ite...
whatever -_-
No you misunderstood me. I don't mean lower gear levels as in "I'll just replace these 5 pieces and I'll be set". I meant lower gear levels as in "I can't possibly farm the gold for this myself, and can only get the gear necessary to make this work if I'm getting fed a lot of shit". The guy I linked is pulling 50k DPS, and is still probably only getting the equivalent of like 800 life on hit. Find me another Barbarian that has the items to pull 50k DPS without gimping every other stat.
It's not for singletarget... for 1v1 you have ignore pain and wrath Last edit: 2012-05-29 01:24:23 |
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| heishe Germany. May 29 2012 01:24. Posts 2132 | Profile Blog # |
| Can anyone link a reasonable throwing build? Or perhaps, a guide? I want to try it out. Last edit: 2012-05-29 01:31:45 |
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| Shikyo Finland. May 29 2012 03:09. Posts 20142 | Profile Blog # |
Act 2 now... no changes in items
Although after killing the first 3 sets of rares I was confident I could farm act 2 decently, a Sand Wasp rare Illusion Knockback Reflects Damage Molten is doing a good job crushing my hopes and dreams |
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| Kyhol Canada. May 29 2012 03:15. Posts 2526 | Profile Blog # |
I beat act 2! Barbarian pride  |
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| Joblesso United States. May 29 2012 03:19. Posts 73 | Profile # |
I can get diablo to 2nd phase before image owns me ><
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| zZygote Canada. May 29 2012 03:49. Posts 860 | Profile Blog # |
I'm saving up my gear in act 1, and casually just farming.
1.7mil and counting... saving up to get a Stormshield (25%+ block) for around 3.5mil, then hoping to get some bargains/gear from friends haha...
I can finally have a life again! |
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| skyR Canada. May 29 2012 03:53. Posts 11181 | Profile # |
| 3.5mil for 25%+? good luck with that... I think most people have learned by now lol. I haven't seen a good Stormshield for under 10mil in the last 2 days. Thank god I bought mine for 5mil. |
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| R0YAL United States. May 29 2012 06:14. Posts 1762 | Profile Blog # |
| Any tips for beating Belial in inferno? |
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| ffreakk Singapore. May 29 2012 06:17. Posts 2036 | Profile # |
Hmm.. So i took the advice from this thread and tried out "Life on Hit" today.. We (Wiz friend and i) cleared act 2 yesterday and are looking to farm around act 2 and get some nice upgrades before moving on to act 3. I got a +356 Life on Hit Dagger (terrible DPS, something like 490+, but im tanking and DPS is all on the Wiz so that wouldn't matter.. didn't wanna invest into a build im just trying out, since im dirt poor at the moment.). Was rather underwhelming for me, didn't look like it made a difference at all.
Convinced that 356 wasn't enough, i got a +212 Life on Hit Kymbos' Gold (400k, a sizable investment considering the current state of my Gold account), and it was a little better. Not much though.
I read though that people are having pretty good success with this, anything i am missing? Or anything that function differently in 1-player vs 2-player mode that doesn't allow this to work for me? Thanks in advance for any input guys
If this work out well, i can actually invest into a real weapon (looking at a ~900 DPS one with decent Life on Hit, hope i can find an affordable one) and hopefully solo-ing act 2 well.
My old weapon : ~800DPS, 100 Str, 100 Vit. (Hammer)
New weapon (for testing): ~490 DPS, 100 Vit, +356 Life on Hit. (Dagger).
Maybe because i got used to the old one, doesn't feel like this Life on Hit made much of a difference to my tanking life.
For reference, i'm farming around act 2 with 5 NV buff, in group of 2, with some difficulties >.< (aka ~25%-30% of the mob packs == at least 3-5 repeated death, 1/3 of them == outright impossible (esp Invulnerable Minion)) |
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| skyR Canada. May 29 2012 06:18. Posts 11181 | Profile # |
On May 29 2012 06:14 R0YAL wrote:
Any tips for beating Belial in inferno?
What's your build and for what phase? Phase 3 is literally a joke, it's so easy that I feel like it was stealth nerfed =\Last edit: 2012-05-29 06:18:47 |
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| TheYango United States. May 29 2012 06:24. Posts 15762 | Profile # |
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/99FMA.jpg)
290k
Low Strength roll, but whoever put this up severely undervalued the high life-on-hit roll. |
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