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| Turbovolver Australia. May 31 2012 13:52. Posts 1637 | Profile Blog # |
I'd almost say Shine's ZvZ is the best that any player plays any matchup. So, I wouldn't mind him taking out an OSL.
Or Jangbi, obv. |
| | The original Bogus fan. |  |
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| smekz Portugal. May 31 2012 14:00. Posts 478 | Profile # |
On May 31 2012 12:40 setzer wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 31 2012 10:32 Caihead wrote:
Why are people saying fantasy is underrated? Protege of Boxer / iloveoov / SKT coaching. Early and consistent deep tournament results against TBLS. Just being the terran under boxer / iloveoov already got him more hype than flash ever did until flash won multiple golds. As far as people making fun of him goes, it's because he was overrated and made eccentric builds and refused to GG (which are characteristic of lesser players, which is why the comparison is funny). He hit a bump in 2011 but so do all players, fantasy fans (i'm one of them) should stop pretending they are cheering for an underdog when he's clearly got the most resources of any terran in the league teammate /practice partner wise, coaching wise, and resources wise.
Fantasy has never been put on the same level as Bisu or Stork, nor considered Code S, despite far better SL results than both and sometimes better PL results. Only recently did he get 1st rank on the power rank. He has NEVER lost a PL post-season game and has come up big in the biggest moments. He easily won against Stork but wasn't considered the favorite in the next season, maybe not even in the top 3. People, for whatever reason, have never looked at Fantasy in the same light as others like TBLS. Add in people saying his success is only because of Oov and Boxer and you get a lot of fans who do think he is underrated.
don't forget the fact that in TL probably most of skt1 fans are bisu fanboys in the first place. how can he get the recognition he truly deserves when even his team fans failed to acknowledge that?
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| Scarecrow Korea (South). May 31 2012 14:05. Posts 4579 | Profile Blog # |
On May 31 2012 13:34 Ryo wrote:
Nah, Shine can't beat Fantasy. Fantasy's only competitor is Jangbi, as long as Jangbi continues to think he's destined to win the last OSL.
You're grossly underestimating flash if you think Fantasy's just gonna walk over him in a Bo5. No way bogus is beating flash twice in a row and action has spent too long getting mauled in practice. |
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| Ryo May 31 2012 14:10. Posts 8409 | Profile Blog # |
On May 31 2012 14:05 Scarecrow wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 31 2012 13:34 Ryo wrote:
Nah, Shine can't beat Fantasy. Fantasy's only competitor is Jangbi, as long as Jangbi continues to think he's destined to win the last OSL.
You're grossly underestimating flash if you think Fantasy's just gonna walk over him in a Bo5. No way bogus is beating flash twice in a row and action has spent too long getting mauled in practice.
I never said Flash wouldn't get past the Ro16, or the Ro8 for that matter. Although if he does win the tiebreaker, he's going to face Zero in the Ro8.
Edit:
I'm assuming the winner of A plays the runner-up of group D, like the last 2 OSLs. Or have they released a different draw?Last edit: 2012-05-31 14:14:52 |
| | 영원히 엠비씨게임 히어로 팬. |  |
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| Caihead Canada. May 31 2012 14:14. Posts 5160 | Profile Blog # |
On May 31 2012 12:16 bowen888 wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 31 2012 09:59 Mortality wrote:
On May 31 2012 08:55 bowen888 wrote:
On May 30 2012 15:15 J1.au wrote:Anyone picking Bogus is scared Flash will beat their favourite players. 
Yo mean everyone picking Bogus is using their head to analysis the players rather than using their fanboyism doing their picking.
Exactly how is picking Bogus supposed to qualify as good analysis of the players? Bogus has been struggling HORRIBLY in the Terran vs Terran match-up. Prior to this match, Flash was 4-1 since the break against tough competition, 10-3 in the past 12 months, 56-17 in the past 24 months, highest ELO vs Terran and highest ELO peak vs Terran. Bogus is not even top 25 ELO vs Terran or top 25 ELO peak, HAD NOT WON A SINGLE GAME vs TERRAN SINCE THE BREAK (0-6), 5-7 past 12 months, 13-15 past 24 months. Head-to-head he was 0-3 against Flash. Even if we look at the map, Bogus had only a 2-4 record on Sniper Ridge compared to Flash's 4-1 record. There is absolutely nothing there to indicate that Bogus had a good chance of victory.
Your just sore that your favourite player lost...Grow up!
He's using statistics to predict something and statistics show that there was a much higher probability of it going one way. What shitty attitude is this trying to tell other people to grow up? These statistics are true regardless of rather he's a KT or STX or flash or bogus fan. |
| | Alex Garfield likes otters. |  |
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| Scarecrow Korea (South). May 31 2012 14:20. Posts 4579 | Profile Blog # |
On May 31 2012 14:10 Ryo wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 31 2012 14:05 Scarecrow wrote:
On May 31 2012 13:34 Ryo wrote:
Nah, Shine can't beat Fantasy. Fantasy's only competitor is Jangbi, as long as Jangbi continues to think he's destined to win the last OSL.
You're grossly underestimating flash if you think Fantasy's just gonna walk over him in a Bo5. No way bogus is beating flash twice in a row and action has spent too long getting mauled in practice.
I never said Flash wouldn't get past the Ro16, or the Ro8 for that matter. Although if he does win the tiebreaker, he's going to face Zero in the Ro8.Edit: I'm assuming the winner of A plays the runner-up of group D, like the last 2 OSLs. Or have they released a different draw?
I was more disagreeing with the 'jangbi is the only competitor' comment and preempting the counter argument that flash might not even make the ro8. Zero in the ro8 will be ugly, Flash TvZ looks unbeatable these days + it's bo5. A repeat of the MSL Flash vs Fantasy semi would be amazing although I'm not sure how the ro4/8 matchups are decided besides 1st place plays 2nd place.Last edit: 2012-05-31 14:21:25 |
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| Caihead Canada. May 31 2012 14:23. Posts 5160 | Profile Blog # |
On May 31 2012 12:40 setzer wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 31 2012 10:32 Caihead wrote:
Why are people saying fantasy is underrated? Protege of Boxer / iloveoov / SKT coaching. Early and consistent deep tournament results against TBLS. Just being the terran under boxer / iloveoov already got him more hype than flash ever did until flash won multiple golds. As far as people making fun of him goes, it's because he was overrated and made eccentric builds and refused to GG (which are characteristic of lesser players, which is why the comparison is funny). He hit a bump in 2011 but so do all players, fantasy fans (i'm one of them) should stop pretending they are cheering for an underdog when he's clearly got the most resources of any terran in the league teammate /practice partner wise, coaching wise, and resources wise.
Fantasy has never been put on the same level as Bisu or Stork, nor considered Code S, despite far better SL results than both and sometimes better PL results. Only recently did he get 1st rank on the power rank. He has NEVER lost a PL post-season game and has come up big in the biggest moments. He easily won against Stork but wasn't considered the favorite in the next season, maybe not even in the top 3. People, for whatever reason, have never looked at Fantasy in the same light as others like TBLS. Add in people saying his success is only because of Oov and Boxer and you get a lot of fans who do think he is underrated.
Someone ignorant of the facts of fantasy's performance can't possible have an evaluation thats worth any weight, and whether they pick an opinion that's underrated or overrated is entirely coincidental. If anything more people overrated him on the ignorant basis that he's boxer / oov's protege, not underrated. The points you made - not same level as bisu or stork (thats because he wasn't when people thought that, which isn't under rating), not considered code S (thats ridiculous, most people did), only recently get 1st rank (thats because he deserved it now, and flash deserved rank 1 most of the time he had it). Legitimate points about other things. Imo he wasn't considered TBLS level because he just couldn't match flash in the rivalry when TBLS was first thought up (2007-2008 Bisu / Stork was a very back and forth rivalry), just like how there isn't another zerg in the TBLS because no other zergs came close then. Last edit: 2012-05-31 14:30:36 |
| | Alex Garfield likes otters. | |
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| Caihead Canada. May 31 2012 14:26. Posts 5160 | Profile Blog # |
On May 31 2012 11:28 MountainDewJunkie wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 31 2012 09:59 Mortality wrote:
On May 31 2012 08:55 bowen888 wrote:
On May 30 2012 15:15 J1.au wrote:Anyone picking Bogus is scared Flash will beat their favourite players.
Yo mean everyone picking Bogus is using their head to analysis the players rather than using their fanboyism doing their picking.
Exactly how is picking Bogus supposed to qualify as good analysis of the players? Bogus has been struggling HORRIBLY in the Terran vs Terran match-up. Prior to this match, Flash was 4-1 since the break against tough competition, 10-3 in the past 12 months, 56-17 in the past 24 months, highest ELO vs Terran and highest ELO peak vs Terran. Bogus is not even top 25 ELO vs Terran or top 25 ELO peak, HAD NOT WON A SINGLE GAME vs TERRAN SINCE THE BREAK (0-6), 5-7 past 12 months, 13-15 past 24 months. Head-to-head he was 0-3 against Flash. Even if we look at the map, Bogus had only a 2-4 record on Sniper Ridge compared to Flash's 4-1 record. There is absolutely nothing there to indicate that Bogus had a good chance of victory.
Pretty sure he meant analyzing this one game itself, not whatever it is your doing. Also, you seem upset. In addition that's what makes brood war great. Games aren't played on paper, or by the fans, anything can happen, and much to the dismay of Flash and JD fans, things do happen occasionally. Remember when even at the (or one of) the peaks of Flash's career, he lost like 5,6, or 7 consecutive ace matches, most (all?) to terrans? He was still the best overall player, but players can practice and plan accordingly and outplay Flash. He's just human after all. What's the big deal? He's not even eliminated yet.
The big deal is this guy's attitude and saying it's blind fanboyism and that he should "grow up" because he pick flash as favorite over bogus in TvT right now, would be as stupid as someone picking some random zerg over Jaedong during JvZ and saying its blind fanboyism other wise. |
| | Alex Garfield likes otters. | |
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| BreakerD United States. May 31 2012 14:27. Posts 142 | Profile # |
Flash and Grape got raped so freaking bad. Hyvaa looked like he was a boss.............What can you say about Horang2 LOL.............
Bogus looked good.......He seemed like the the ace player that he's suppose to be. Contained Flash and was all over the place the commentator couldnt seem to keep up............I see Bogus upsetting out of the tie breaker if he can go back into his beast mode from 2 PL ago. |
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| Ryo May 31 2012 14:36. Posts 8409 | Profile Blog # |
On May 31 2012 14:20 Scarecrow wrote:
Show nested quote +On May 31 2012 14:10 Ryo wrote:
On May 31 2012 14:05 Scarecrow wrote:
On May 31 2012 13:34 Ryo wrote:
Nah, Shine can't beat Fantasy. Fantasy's only competitor is Jangbi, as long as Jangbi continues to think he's destined to win the last OSL.
You're grossly underestimating flash if you think Fantasy's just gonna walk over him in a Bo5. No way bogus is beating flash twice in a row and action has spent too long getting mauled in practice.
I never said Flash wouldn't get past the Ro16, or the Ro8 for that matter. Although if he does win the tiebreaker, he's going to face Zero in the Ro8.Edit: I'm assuming the winner of A plays the runner-up of group D, like the last 2 OSLs. Or have they released a different draw?
I was more disagreeing with the 'jangbi is the only competitor' comment and preempting the counter argument that flash might not even make the ro8. Zero in the ro8 will be ugly, Flash TvZ looks unbeatable these days + it's bo5. A repeat of the MSL Flash vs Fantasy semi would be amazing although I'm not sure how the ro4/8 matchups are decided besides 1st place plays 2nd place.
In his current state, I just don't think Flash will win 3 consecutive Bo5s, beating Fantasy along the way. |
| | 영원히 엠비씨게임 히어로 팬. | |
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| Ideas United States. May 31 2012 14:58. Posts 7428 | Profile Blog # |
| I feel bad for fantasy. he has been the best player in the world for the last 6+ months but never really has a shot to definitely prove it because of lack of venue. fewer PL matches (and no ACE match), seeded in finals so he couldn't rape up playoffs, and only 1 individual league. worst of all it all seems so much less important because of the fucking sc2 switch :\ |
| | BW is the only esport. gogo STX/Bogus/Calm/Jaedong/Kal/MINI |  |
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| Turbovolver Australia. May 31 2012 15:14. Posts 1637 | Profile Blog # |
On May 31 2012 14:58 Ideas wrote:
I feel bad for fantasy. he has been the best player in the world for the last 6+ months but never really has a shot to definitely prove it because of lack of venue. fewer PL matches (and no ACE match), seeded in finals so he couldn't rape up playoffs, and only 1 individual league. worst of all it all seems so much less important because of the fucking sc2 switch :\
Yeah, even as an anti-fan I agree whole-heartedly with this :/ |
| | The original Bogus fan. | |
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| J1.au Australia. May 31 2012 15:29. Posts 3534 | Profile Blog # |
| You guys act like Fantasy has already won this OSL. Sorry but Flash is not done yet. |
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| Aerisky United States. May 31 2012 16:04. Posts 9248 | Profile Blog # |
| Poor Flash v__v hope he's able to adjust in time >< |
| | "It has always been in my observation of human nature, that a man who has any good reason to believe in himself never flourishes himself before the faces of other people in order that they may believe in him." | |
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| SCnai May 31 2012 16:25. Posts 203 | Profile # |
I think when they talk about Fanta being under appreciated they mean the more casual, TV crowd. Fanta is a BW genius in a strict sense of the word: both flamboyant and efficient. He will destroy you and make it look subtle. (/fanboy mode off).
On May 31 2012 12:40 setzer wrote:
nor considered Code S
On May 31 2012 14:23 Caihead wrote:
not considered code S
Too much SC2 guys...
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| | The legend of the fall, which everyone thought was only a dream, is being revived! Carriers, the symbol of Protoss, the hope of a million Protoss fans, are reviving the legend! |  |
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| Hazzyboy Estonia. May 31 2012 19:28. Posts 512 | Profile # |
Fanta wasn't considered "Code-S" cuz that's a lame SC2 term for main league players.. Besides BW has a simple Bonjwa - God and others who try to take over. Fantasy can become God if he keeps his undefeated streak and wins OSL.
Fantasy is underrated by everyone. Bisu got an MVP from Kespa so no need to keep saying that all the time.
In other news soO is really "hyuking" everyone up. He was close to finals last OSL and now he proves he can get there again. I'm really pulling for this underdog to shock every1.Last edit: 2012-05-31 19:36:16 |
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| setzer United States. May 31 2012 20:10. Posts 3271 | Profile # |
On May 31 2012 16:25 SCnai wrote:I think when they talk about Fanta being under appreciated they mean the more casual, TV crowd. Fanta is a BW genius in a strict sense of the word: both flamboyant and efficient. He will destroy you and make it look subtle. (/fanboy mode off). Too much SC2 guys...
Woops, yeah I meant S-class. |
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| RowdierBob Australia. May 31 2012 21:51. Posts 9150 | Profile Blog # |
Gah, I hate how ZvP has become these days with the always hydra break.
I don't know what worse: the coin flippy nature of the games or the fact protosses are always dying to it. |
| | "Terrans are pretty much space-Australians" - H |
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| Grend May 31 2012 22:57. Posts 1542 | Profile Blog # |
So many tie-breakers...
Hope Flash advances, he usually does way better in BO5 than group playLast edit: 2012-05-31 22:59:09 |
| | ♞ Against the Wind - Bob Seger ♞ | |
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| RageCommodore Germany. May 31 2012 23:08. Posts 823 | Profile # |
| Bogus, I believe! |
| | BW: sGs.sTaRfaLL SC2: NN_Commodore | fan of: Darkforce, DBS, KrasS, Delphi, Last, BoguS | Mass BC/ Ghost ftw! | song of the week: Imagine Dragons - Radioactive |  |
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